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Blackadar · 03-09-2003, 02:22 PM

Frankly, it's Wlad's manager that should be fired. Wlad wasn't prepared and hadn't warmed up, but who in their right minds puts a challenger in a warm up fight with a guy with one of the best punches in the division, who may be older but has a record of 39-2? Sanders isn't a tomato can by any stretch of the imagination. And who put them in a smaller-than-normal ring, to boot? Not only is the "big punch" the equalizer in boxing, but they made it easier to get hit with the small ring. Stupid, stupid, stupid.

As for Jones, he hasn't fought too many lesser fighters. I'm tired of the suggestion that Jones has ducked better fighters. It's just that he's embarassed pretty much everyone. He's also pretty damned smart in that he's not going to take major risks without major awards and many other fighters have ducked him. He's had a hard time getting some of the other top fighters to get into the ring. Let's look at the fights he's fought since beating James Tony in late 1994.

Nov. 18 James Toney (44-0-2) W -- 12 Las Vegas, Nev.
(Captured IBF super middleweight title). Toney is considered the best pound-for-pound boxer at the time and Jones embarassed him.

1995
Mar. 18 Antoine Byrd (30-6-1) W -- TKO 1 Pensacola, Fla.
(Retained IBF super middleweight title). An easier fight, but Byrd had already fought for the title once before, so he's not a total chump.
June 24 Vinny Paienza (40-4) W -- TKO 6 Atlantic City, N.J.
(Retained IBF super middleweight title). Paz had just defeated Roberto Duran and had won his last 9 fights.
Sept. 30 Tony Thornton (37-5-1) W -- TKO 2 Pensacola, Fla.
(Retained IBF super middleweight title). Thornton has fought twice before for the title and had never been KO'd. It's all over in 2 rounds.

1996
Jan. 12 Merqui Sosa (26-3-2) W -- TKO 2 New York. Another decent fighter who just was clearly overmatched in 2 rounds.
June 15 Eric Lucas (19-2-2) W -- KO 11 Jacksonville, Fla.
(Retained IBF super middleweight title). Lucas' only 2 losses came in Championship bouts and was ranked in the top 10 of all 3 governing bodies. Currently the 168 lb. WBA World Champ.
Oct. 4 Bryant Brannon (16-0) W -- KO 2 New York
(Retained IBF super middleweight title). This was a tune-up for the Nov 22 fight and it was a short night.
Nov. 22 Mike McCallum (48-3-1) W -- 12 Tampa, Fla.
(Won interim WBC light heavyweight title). Considered a great fighter at the time, a former 3 time World Champ. After the fight, McCallum said that Jones was the "best of all time".

1997
Mar. 21 Montell Griffin (26-0) L -- DQ 9 Atlantic City, N.J.
(Lost WBC light heavyweight title). Griffin wins while KO'd on the canvas. Jones hit him when Griffin went down because the ref didn't step in to start the count.
Aug. 21 Montell Griffin (27-0) W -- KO 1 Ledyard, Conn.
(Regained WBC light heavyweight title). This shows what Jones can do when focused. Griffin couldn't even get out of the first round.

1998
Apr. 25 Virgil Hill (43-2) W -- KO 4 Biloxi, Miss. Hill is ranked the 2nd best Light Heavy by Boxing mag. Lasts 4 rounds and gets KO'd by a body shot.
July 18 Lou Del Valle (31-1) W -- 12 New York. Holder of the WBA Lt. Heavy belt. (Unified WBC and WBA light heavyweight titles)
Nov. 14 Otis Grant (31-1-1) W -- TKO 10 Mashantucket, Conn.
(Retained WBC and WBA light heavyweight titles). Former WBO Lt. Heavy Champ. An easier fight.

1999
Jan. 9 Rick Frazier (18-2-1) W -- KO 2 Pensacola, Fla. Manditory WBC challenger. also ranked #3 by the WBA and #6 by the IBF. Retained WBC and WBA light heavyweight titles)
June 5 Reggie Johnson W -- 12 Biloxi, Miss. IBF Champion with two title defenses. (Unifies WBA-WBC-IBF light heavyweight titles)

2000
Jan. 15 David Telesco (23-2) W -- 12 New York. USBA Lt. Heavy champ. (Retained unified light heavyweight title)
May 13 Richard Hall (24-2, 23 KOs) W -- TKO 11 Indianapolis
Retained unified light heavyweight title). No comment.
Sept. 9 Eric Harding (19-0-1) W -- TKO 10 New Orleans. Good fighter, manditory IBF challenger who also beat Montel Griffin. Retained unified light heavyweight title)

2001
Feb. 24 Derrick Harmon (20-1) W -- TKO 10 Tampa, Fla. Ok, ok, he's a tomato can.
Jul. 28 Julio Caesar Gonzalez (27-0) W -- 12. Gonzalez is considered a very good fighter, who's won 9 of his last 10 by KO. Gonzales hits the carpet 3 times in this fight.

2002
Feb. 2 Glen Kelly (26-0-1) W -- KO 7 Miami. Manditory IBF challenger. (Retained unified light heavyweight title)
Sept. 7 Clinton Woods (32-1) W -- TKO 7 Portland, Ore. Who else is he going to fight at this point? (Retained WBC, WBA & IBF World Light Heavyweight Titles)

2003
Mar. 1 John Ruiz (38-4-1) W -- 12 Las Vegas, Nev. 'Ruiz had beaten Holyfield and outweighted Jones by 30 pounds. (Captures WBA Heavyweight Title)

Who else is Jones going to fight? Look at the rankings. The WBA has a bunch of Jones' victims in the top 5 of the Lt. Heavy and Cruiserweight divisions, including DeValle, Hill, Griffin, Toney and Gonzalez. So does the WBC and IBF. It's pitiful except for a couple of boxers.

Hopkins? He's already beaten him. Hopkins wants Jones to drop 10 pounds and wants even money for the fight. If Hopkins is serious, let him gain some weight and challenge Jones in his own division. It's easier to gain weight than to lose it.

Vassily Jirov (31-0) wouldn't be a bad opponent, but nobody knows who he is outside of strict boxing circles. If he beats James Toney, then we'll talk. I think this may be the best matchup of the bunch.

Tyson? Good match, but he's focused on Lewis. I'd love to see this one, because everyone knows Tyson can still punch.

Lewis? The guy is 50 lbs. bigger than Jones. I doubt Lewis would do it either. At this point in his career, Lewis has nothing to gain by fighting Jones.

One of the Klitschko brothers? Wlad is now damaged goods and Vitaly will be fighting Lewis soon. After that, who knows? These guys are huge compared to Jones - I think the size differential is waaaay too much to ask.

Chris Byrd? He is the IBF Heavyweight champ who's a lighter puncher. At 35-2, he has a decent record. But if I'm Jones, unless I want to make an "investment" in the Heavyweight division, Byrd is damaged goods. If he beats Byrd, pundits will say that Byrd is another Ruiz, a paper champion.

Holyfield? A good draw, but Holyfield couldn't keep up with Jones now. Please, Evander, retire. You're slurring your words already. Too many more punches and you could have some serious damage done.

James Toney? If he beats Jirov, this would be an attractive fight.

03-09-2003, 02:22 PM	#12
Blackadar Retired Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fantasyland	Frankly, it's Wlad's manager that should be fired. Wlad wasn't prepared and hadn't warmed up, but who in their right minds puts a challenger in a warm up fight with a guy with one of the best punches in the division, who may be older but has a record of 39-2? Sanders isn't a tomato can by any stretch of the imagination. And who put them in a smaller-than-normal ring, to boot? Not only is the "big punch" the equalizer in boxing, but they made it easier to get hit with the small ring. Stupid, stupid, stupid. As for Jones, he hasn't fought too many lesser fighters. I'm tired of the suggestion that Jones has ducked better fighters. It's just that he's embarassed pretty much everyone. He's also pretty damned smart in that he's not going to take major risks without major awards and many other fighters have ducked him. He's had a hard time getting some of the other top fighters to get into the ring. Let's look at the fights he's fought since beating James Tony in late 1994. Nov. 18 James Toney (44-0-2) W -- 12 Las Vegas, Nev. (Captured IBF super middleweight title). Toney is considered the best pound-for-pound boxer at the time and Jones embarassed him. 1995 Mar. 18 Antoine Byrd (30-6-1) W -- TKO 1 Pensacola, Fla. (Retained IBF super middleweight title). An easier fight, but Byrd had already fought for the title once before, so he's not a total chump. June 24 Vinny Paienza (40-4) W -- TKO 6 Atlantic City, N.J. (Retained IBF super middleweight title). Paz had just defeated Roberto Duran and had won his last 9 fights. Sept. 30 Tony Thornton (37-5-1) W -- TKO 2 Pensacola, Fla. (Retained IBF super middleweight title). Thornton has fought twice before for the title and had never been KO'd. It's all over in 2 rounds. 1996 Jan. 12 Merqui Sosa (26-3-2) W -- TKO 2 New York. Another decent fighter who just was clearly overmatched in 2 rounds. June 15 Eric Lucas (19-2-2) W -- KO 11 Jacksonville, Fla. (Retained IBF super middleweight title). Lucas' only 2 losses came in Championship bouts and was ranked in the top 10 of all 3 governing bodies. Currently the 168 lb. WBA World Champ. Oct. 4 Bryant Brannon (16-0) W -- KO 2 New York (Retained IBF super middleweight title). This was a tune-up for the Nov 22 fight and it was a short night. Nov. 22 Mike McCallum (48-3-1) W -- 12 Tampa, Fla. (Won interim WBC light heavyweight title). Considered a great fighter at the time, a former 3 time World Champ. After the fight, McCallum said that Jones was the "best of all time". 1997 Mar. 21 Montell Griffin (26-0) L -- DQ 9 Atlantic City, N.J. (Lost WBC light heavyweight title). Griffin wins while KO'd on the canvas. Jones hit him when Griffin went down because the ref didn't step in to start the count. Aug. 21 Montell Griffin (27-0) W -- KO 1 Ledyard, Conn. (Regained WBC light heavyweight title). This shows what Jones can do when focused. Griffin couldn't even get out of the first round. 1998 Apr. 25 Virgil Hill (43-2) W -- KO 4 Biloxi, Miss. Hill is ranked the 2nd best Light Heavy by Boxing mag. Lasts 4 rounds and gets KO'd by a body shot. July 18 Lou Del Valle (31-1) W -- 12 New York. Holder of the WBA Lt. Heavy belt. (Unified WBC and WBA light heavyweight titles) Nov. 14 Otis Grant (31-1-1) W -- TKO 10 Mashantucket, Conn. (Retained WBC and WBA light heavyweight titles). Former WBO Lt. Heavy Champ. An easier fight. 1999 Jan. 9 Rick Frazier (18-2-1) W -- KO 2 Pensacola, Fla. Manditory WBC challenger. also ranked #3 by the WBA and #6 by the IBF. Retained WBC and WBA light heavyweight titles) June 5 Reggie Johnson W -- 12 Biloxi, Miss. IBF Champion with two title defenses. (Unifies WBA-WBC-IBF light heavyweight titles) 2000 Jan. 15 David Telesco (23-2) W -- 12 New York. USBA Lt. Heavy champ. (Retained unified light heavyweight title) May 13 Richard Hall (24-2, 23 KOs) W -- TKO 11 Indianapolis Retained unified light heavyweight title). No comment. Sept. 9 Eric Harding (19-0-1) W -- TKO 10 New Orleans. Good fighter, manditory IBF challenger who also beat Montel Griffin. Retained unified light heavyweight title) 2001 Feb. 24 Derrick Harmon (20-1) W -- TKO 10 Tampa, Fla. Ok, ok, he's a tomato can. Jul. 28 Julio Caesar Gonzalez (27-0) W -- 12. Gonzalez is considered a very good fighter, who's won 9 of his last 10 by KO. Gonzales hits the carpet 3 times in this fight. 2002 Feb. 2 Glen Kelly (26-0-1) W -- KO 7 Miami. Manditory IBF challenger. (Retained unified light heavyweight title) Sept. 7 Clinton Woods (32-1) W -- TKO 7 Portland, Ore. Who else is he going to fight at this point? (Retained WBC, WBA & IBF World Light Heavyweight Titles) 2003 Mar. 1 John Ruiz (38-4-1) W -- 12 Las Vegas, Nev. 'Ruiz had beaten Holyfield and outweighted Jones by 30 pounds. (Captures WBA Heavyweight Title) Who else is Jones going to fight? Look at the rankings. The WBA has a bunch of Jones' victims in the top 5 of the Lt. Heavy and Cruiserweight divisions, including DeValle, Hill, Griffin, Toney and Gonzalez. So does the WBC and IBF. It's pitiful except for a couple of boxers. Hopkins? He's already beaten him. Hopkins wants Jones to drop 10 pounds and wants even money for the fight. If Hopkins is serious, let him gain some weight and challenge Jones in his own division. It's easier to gain weight than to lose it. Vassily Jirov (31-0) wouldn't be a bad opponent, but nobody knows who he is outside of strict boxing circles. If he beats James Toney, then we'll talk. I think this may be the best matchup of the bunch. Tyson? Good match, but he's focused on Lewis. I'd love to see this one, because everyone knows Tyson can still punch. Lewis? The guy is 50 lbs. bigger than Jones. I doubt Lewis would do it either. At this point in his career, Lewis has nothing to gain by fighting Jones. One of the Klitschko brothers? Wlad is now damaged goods and Vitaly will be fighting Lewis soon. After that, who knows? These guys are huge compared to Jones - I think the size differential is waaaay too much to ask. Chris Byrd? He is the IBF Heavyweight champ who's a lighter puncher. At 35-2, he has a decent record. But if I'm Jones, unless I want to make an "investment" in the Heavyweight division, Byrd is damaged goods. If he beats Byrd, pundits will say that Byrd is another Ruiz, a paper champion. Holyfield? A good draw, but Holyfield couldn't keep up with Jones now. Please, Evander, retire. You're slurring your words already. Too many more punches and you could have some serious damage done. James Toney? If he beats Jirov, this would be an attractive fight. Last edited by Blackadar : 03-09-2003 at 02:34 PM.