Big 10 Expansion Thread -Big Ten ready for a playoff .. finally?

[MJ4H]

omg

facepalm

[Warhammer]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

They've got some competition!

Will RC retire already? The big thing he did for the university was hire Calipari as basketball coach. Other than that, he has been terrible. He has had 15(?) years to prep the program for a big time conference and has not done it.

Not only that, but look at the school's that have moved to Div-1A in his time, or started a football program from scratch, that have a better program then Memphis:

UCF (I may be thinking South Florida here)
Arkansas State
FIU
etc.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

They've got some competition!

I think Memphis wouldn't be a bad option for the B12 if they decide to go to 12. Good fit geographically and would provide a good basketball program. I would think the football program would benefit from the move as well.

[Swaggs]

A leak from the SEC meeting indicated that Missouri actually lost votes from the preliminary vote held a couple weeks ago and that they now only have votes from Auburn and Tennessee. Last week, it was reported that they had 8 votes in favor and only needed one more vote (thought to be Alabama, who was holding out b/c they didn't want to lose some of their rivalry games that depended on division alignments).

Mike Slive still wants them, so it is possible that he can wrangle up the votes somehow, but he and Missouri have some lobbying to do if they want an invitation (which is still unclear).

[Toddzilla]

Bbullshit - Missouri already HAS an SEC invitation - 4 or 5 of them. In fact, they're trying to get the SEC to agree to *their* terms in order for Missouri to grace the SEC with their presence. I hear they're looking for an equal revenue split - 50% for Missouri and 50% for the rest of the SEC. Oh, and free blowjobs for the coaching staffs.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Bbullshit - Missouri already HAS an SEC invitation - 4 or 5 of them. In fact, they're trying to get the SEC to agree to *their* terms in order for Missouri to grace the SEC with their presence. I hear they're looking for an equal revenue split - 50% for Missouri and 50% for the rest of the SEC. Oh, and free blowjobs for the coaching staffs.

Don't forget, the new divisions. Missouri Division and The Rest Division.

[General Mike]

On a teleconference earlier today, our Presidents and Chancellors authorized the BIG EAST Conference to engage in formal discussions with additional institutions and are considering moving to a model that includes 12 football playing schools.

Expect the worst

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by MJ4H

omg
facepalm

You're too kind. Seriously. WAAAAAY too kind.

Tiger High in the SEC? Bwahahahahaha.

Sewanee has a better claim.

[cartman]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

AP report detailing expected revenue increase for Mizzou in SEC. Small increase under current SEC contract, but new SEC deal currently being renegotiated could boost annual MU income by $12M.

APNewsBreak: Document outlines Mizzou SEC options

A renegotiated deal (with the addition of A&M and theoretical Mizzou) isn't going to increase by $1.5 billion over 10 years, which is what the increase would have to be to go from 'slight' to $12 million extra. $12 million X 14 teams = $168 million more per year.

That report has about as much credibility as the economic impact analysis Baylor released when A&M first mentioned they were leaving.

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by cartman

A renegotiated deal (with the addition of A&M and theoretical Mizzou) isn't going to increase by $1.5 billion over 10 years, which is what the increase would have to be to go from 'slight' to $12 million extra. $12 million X 14 teams = $168 million more per year.

That report has about as much credibility as the economic impact analysis Baylor released when A&M first mentioned they were leaving.

They're talking about MU's revenue, not everyone else's revenue.

Like if Rutgers joined the ACC, their revenue would increase $15M, but everyone else would probably stay the same or go down.

[cartman]

But he says:

Small increase under current SEC contract, but new SEC deal currently being renegotiated could boost annual MU income by $12M.

I take that to mean that the move at first would be basically a wash financially, but the renegotiated deal would get them an extra $12 million/year. Since the SEC distributes all revenue equally, than means that the renegotiation would have increase by $12 million times the number of teams. Since the current deal with ESPN is for 15 years/$2.2 billion, I don't see the renegotiation adding another $1.6 billion over 10 years for adding two (or even 4) more teams. The CBS deal was also for 15 years, but only $800 million, as CBS doesn't have as many outlets, so bought fewer game rights. I don't see that one increasing a whole lot more either for the addition of 2 or 4 teams.

[bronconick]

Mandel on the likely end of the Big East AQ bid.

Big East Conference struggling to*retain its BCS*AQ status - Stewart Mandel - SI.com

"You're telling me you're going to put 9-3 East Carolina in the Fiesta Bowl?" said one college football administrator. "Are you kidding me?"

[Ksyrup]

Then that's the end of the conference - WVU and Louisville (and whoever else can find a suitable landing spot) leave and they become the northeast version of Conference USA.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by bronconick

Mandel on the likely end of the Big East AQ bid.

Big East Conference struggling to*retain its BCS*AQ status - Stewart Mandel - SI.com

Is it much worse than an 8-5 UConn team?

[timmynausea]

Tentative Big East division split has Rutgers with UConn, USF, Central Florida and maybe Navy | NJ.com

Assuming nobody else leaves, here's the tentative new Big East:

Division 1:
Rutgers
Uconn
UCF
USF
Temple
Navy

Division 2:
Louisville
WVU
Cincinnati
Air Force
Houston
SMU

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by timmynausea

Tentative Big East division split has Rutgers with UConn, USF, Central Florida and maybe Navy | NJ.com

Assuming nobody else leaves, here's the tentative new Big East:

Division 1:
Rutgers
Uconn
UCF
USF
Temple
Navy

Division 2:
Louisville
WVU
Cincinnati
Air Force
Houston
SMU

At least they are going with double down in Florida and Texas idea. I'm not real crazy about WVU having no permanent Florida rival, so if they go cross-divisional rival, I hope we get USF so we can have at least one game in Florida every other year. I'd also rather have Memphis instead of Air Force, unless adding the two academies somehow secures a BCS spot (which seems like a longshot). I'd feel bad for ECU in this scenario, too. They have done all the right things, but cannot catch a break due to their market.

[Ksyrup]

Just read two things: Neinas says even if Mizzou leaves, it won't be until 2013. Apparently 2012 is already locked in. Not sure if Mizzou agrees with that or not. Other is that according to sources, Louisville is #2 behind TCU on the expansion depth chart. Maybe WVU is just too far away?

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Just read two things: Neinas says even if Mizzou leaves, it won't be until 2013. Apparently 2012 is already locked in. Not sure if Mizzou agrees with that or not. Other is that according to sources, Louisville is #2 behind TCU on the expansion depth chart. Maybe WVU is just too far away?

Yeah, that Neinas comment was pretty surprising to the Mizzou folks given that December 1st, 2011 is the late withdrawal date. They just have to pay a higher fee than if they gave two years notice.

Article about the need for Mizzou to decide soon.......

http://www.insidestl.com/insideSTLco...come-soon.aspx

[Izulde]

Maybe I missed it in this thread, but on SI, TCU already said they're going to the Big 12.

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by Izulde

Maybe I missed it in this thread, but on SI, TCU already said they're going to the Big 12.

Right, they will replace Texas A&M. That gives the B12 10 teams.

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by timmynausea

Tentative Big East division split has Rutgers with UConn, USF, Central Florida and maybe Navy | NJ.com

Assuming nobody else leaves, here's the tentative new Big East:

Division 1:
Rutgers
Uconn
UCF
USF
Temple
Navy

Division 2:
Louisville
WVU
Cincinnati
Air Force
Houston
SMU

I wouldn't have split the divisions that way. I mean it makes some sense to do it that way, but I like the idea of a zipper or whatever you want to call it, so that every team can get a game in Texas and a game in Florida every other year.

[Wolfpack]

I'm pathetic. I time-wasted a bit today by figuring out how to set up ACC football schedules after Pitt and Syracuse join. I spend too much time thinking about all this stuff....

(Oh, and the ideas I settled on went with dropping the divisions and just having a set of permanent rivals for each team that would allow all teams to see each other at least twice over four years...having no divisions really frees up the scheduling options.... Either three permanent opponents with two rotating sets of five, or five permanent ones with two rotating sets of four. Obviously, this will mean a CCG that pairs the top two overall instead of two division winners, but until the Pac-16-without-divisions idea came along, I didn't think it a possibility.)

[CU Tiger]

North
BC
Pitt
Cuse
VT
Va
Md
Dook

South
Clemson
GT
FSU
Miami
UNC
NCSU
WFU

Gets rid of the natural rival bullshat.
Play your 6 conference foes, and 3 rotates.
But Holy Smokes the South Division looks tough.

[Logan]

A Rutgers guy is telling people on the boards that we have the infamous "offer in hand" to join the ACC. I will now light myself on fire at the realization that we now have no shot at the ACC.

[britrock88]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

North
BC
Pitt
Cuse
VT
Va
Md
Dook

South
Clemson
GT
FSU
Miami
UNC
NCSU
WFU

Gets rid of the natural rival bullshat.
Play your 6 conference foes, and 3 rotates.
But Holy Smokes the South Division looks tough.

Hmm. Miss UNC/Duke much?

I think 14 lends itself well to two things:

1. The zipper. 6 games in division, 1 permanent rival, 2/6 otherwise. I think that playing 2 out of 6 is too few to be in keeping with the close ties a conference is supposed to represent. Plus, there's a good bit of arbitrariness involved in deciding on which side of the zipper a team falls, and I'm resistant to consider competitive balance for schedule-setting purposes in college. Leave that for the pros.

2. A division-less approach. Lends itself perfectly to this set-up: 3 permanent rivals, 5/10 others. (It could also support 5 permanent rivals and 4/8 others, or 1 permanent rival and 8/12 others.) This would allow everyone in NC to play each other every year, everyone south of NC to play each other every year, and the North could sort itself out. The only perceived drawback (though I don't see it that way) is that the conference championship game ends up simply pitting #1 against #2. I think that's fine, since there's still a decent chance (without doing any probabilistic math, about 40-45%) that the top 2 won't have played during the regular season.

[Ksyrup]

I read that they'd stick Miami with the NE teams to even things up somewhat and rekindle Big East rivalries. Also, there's no way they will go divisionless, since I thought I read this was going to end up forcing divisions in basketball now.

[Toddzilla]

I'd also fathom a guess that they'd push for putting all NC teams in the same division plus 3 other "original" teams. Basically the old blood and the new blood:

Duke
NC State
UNC
Wake
Clemson
UVA
(Maryland or GT)

BC
Florida State
Miami
Pittsburgh
Syracuse
Virginia Tech
[Maryland or GT]

This way, except for VT/UVA, there are no compelling cross-division rivalries. None at all, actually, so scheduling becomes a snap.

[yacovfb]

As a Pitt alumnus living in Cville I'm just selfishly hoping we end up in the same division as UVa (and preferably Tech and/or Maryland). Can't wait to add some away games to the 1-2 games I still go up to Pitt for.

[Butter]

As long as Clemson ends up playing in Pitt every so often so I can head over for a game, I'm fine.

[Ksyrup]

I really wish this was from Kyle in Austin, but it's still good for this thread:

Hey Stew. At what point does Missouri become the crazy-stalker girl who is sure you made eye contact with her and have always desired her? Is it time for the conferences to take out restraining orders? (But don't worry Mizzou, your old loser boyfriend will still take you back).
-- Johnny, Austin

This may come as a shock, but I didn't run into a great deal of crazy-stalker admirers during my bachelor days -- but yes, that's pretty much the perfect analogy.

Missouri is a fine school, one that's produced some very good journalists -- and Jon Hamm. Gary Pinkel has done a remarkable job with the football program, winning at least 10 games in three of the past four seasons. But Missouri fits the SEC about as well as Stephen Garcia would a dry county. The SEC is about 90,000 seat stadiums and rabid fan bases. A ranked Mizzou team had 13,000 empty seats at its opener. The SEC is about fourth-generation Alabama and Ole Miss alums in khakis and sun dresses. Mizzou is in the Midwest, where the folks like their hoodies. The SEC is about parking your RV at the other team's stadium five days before the game. Columbia is a 16-hour drive from Gainesville. And no disrespect to Pinkel, but those 10-win seasons came in part thanks to being a member of the now-defunct Big 12 North. In the SEC Missouri would likely join the West, with Alabama, Arkansas, Auburn and LSU. Hello, Shreveport.

And yet, there are apparently a bunch of powerful people in the state of Missouri who think this is a wonderful idea. Or, as one anonymous school official told the AP: "That's what's left," now that it's abundantly clear the Big Ten isn't interested. That was a regrettable thing to say without being guaranteed the votes from the SEC. And while many at the school are surely loving the attention Missouri is getting right now from making the Big 12 wait indefinitely on a decision, the Big 12 won't prosper or suffer either way. Its future was ensured the day Texas and Oklahoma agreed to sign over their grants of rights.

I don't think we've reached restraining-order territory yet, but I wonder how many times Missouri has had to ask, "So you'll call me, right?"

[Toddzilla]

I love that post so much

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Rutgers going to look around......

Big East continues to explore conference expansion options | NJ.com

[Radii]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I really wish this was from Kyle in Austin, but it's still good for this thread:

Missouri needs to control who they let post a little better, they've clearly allowed some meddling Texas propaganda machine access.

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I really wish this was from Kyle in Austin, but it's still good for this thread:

Hey Stew. At what point does Missouri become the crazy-stalker girl who is sure you made eye contact with her and have always desired her? Is it time for the conferences to take out restraining orders? (But don't worry Mizzou, your old loser boyfriend will still take you back).
-- Johnny, Austin

This may come as a shock, but I didn't run into a great deal of crazy-stalker admirers during my bachelor days -- but yes, that's pretty much the perfect analogy.

Missouri is a fine school, one that's produced some very good journalists -- and Jon Hamm. Gary Pinkel has done a remarkable job with the football program, winning at least 10 games in three of the past four seasons. But Missouri fits the SEC about as well as Stephen Garcia would a dry county. The SEC is about 90,000 seat stadiums and rabid fan bases. A ranked Mizzou team had 13,000 empty seats at its opener. The SEC is about fourth-generation Alabama and Ole Miss alums in khakis and sun dresses. Mizzou is in the Midwest, where the folks like their hoodies. The SEC is about parking your RV at the other team's stadium five days before the game. Columbia is a 16-hour drive from Gainesville. And no disrespect to Pinkel, but those 10-win seasons came in part thanks to being a member of the now-defunct Big 12 North. In the SEC Missouri would likely join the West, with Alabama, Arkansas, Auburn and LSU. Hello, Shreveport.

And yet, there are apparently a bunch of powerful people in the state of Missouri who think this is a wonderful idea. Or, as one anonymous school official told the AP: "That's what's left," now that it's abundantly clear the Big Ten isn't interested. That was a regrettable thing to say without being guaranteed the votes from the SEC. And while many at the school are surely loving the attention Missouri is getting right now from making the Big 12 wait indefinitely on a decision, the Big 12 won't prosper or suffer either way. Its future was ensured the day Texas and Oklahoma agreed to sign over their grants of rights.

I don't think we've reached restraining-order territory yet, but I wonder how many times Missouri has had to ask, "So you'll call me, right?"

Great regional analysis.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Clay Travis discusses why 13 teams isn't likely in the SEC......

NCAA Rule Makes SEC's 13 Team Schedule A Virtual Impossibility : Outkick The Coverage

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

dola

Interesting discussion on a Rutgers board regarding expansion study that Big Ten conducted......

ScarletNation.com - Message Boards

[General Mike]

Big East =

[panerd]

Originally Posted by General Mike

Big East =

.

[timmynausea]

Shocker of the decade: The Big East basketball schools are against any football expansion.

The basketball factions were adamant about not adding anyone, while the football faction argued that if the Big East is going to survive as a BCS conference, whose champion gained automatic entry to a BCS bowl it is imperative for Boise State, with its high national ranking was a necessity for survival.

Big East's fate depends on Missouri - The Boston Globe College Sports Blog - Boston.com

[Ksyrup]

I'm not exactly sure where this goes, but damn it's brilliant:

Occupy Herbstreit

[Ksyrup]

Oh geez, I just laughed way too loud again:

[Swaggs]

Tomorrow could be an interesting day for the Big East. For the third time since the Pitt/Cuse news, the conference is going to try and raise exit fees. There is some indication that the basketball schools, along with a few of the football schools, will muscle it through this time so that some of the expansion targets will consider joining, but it sounds like UConn, Louisville, and WVU might leave the conference if it goes through (Louisville is reportedly not even planning on participating.

[MacroGuru]

I don't know how I feel about this...

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/cougars...tball.html.csp

I understand the no sunday play being an issue, I knew that it might be going in...but the fact of wanting to be guaranteed on tv a specific amount of times and other issues...that honestly frustrates me and makes me dislike the admin that much more.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by MacroGuru

I don't know how I feel about this...

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/cougars...tball.html.csp

I understand the no sunday play being an issue, I knew that it might be going in...but the fact of wanting to be guaranteed on tv a specific amount of times and other issues...that honestly frustrates me and makes me dislike the admin that much more.

No idea if true, but if it is, congrats, we'd have two Texases (Texaii?) in the conference instead of just one. Pass. They're definitely an attractive add if they don't have strings attached but if they want to overplay their hand, enjoy ESPN and the WCC.

SI

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

Tomorrow could be an interesting day for the Big East. For the third time since the Pitt/Cuse news, the conference is going to try and raise exit fees. There is some indication that the basketball schools, along with a few of the football schools, will muscle it through this time so that some of the expansion targets will consider joining, but it sounds like UConn, Louisville, and WVU might leave the conference if it goes through (Louisville is reportedly not even planning on participating.

I wonder if they will have Pitino bound and gagged somewhere? Other than an Italian restaurant, I mean.

[timmynausea]

The NY Post is reporting that BE BB and FB schools are now "on the same chapter if not the same page" and plan to add 6 teams soon.

Once the exit fee is increased, which would send a message of commitment and solidarity, the league will invite Air Force, Navy and Boise State, followed by Central Florida, possibly as soon as this weekend.

The last two spots, as the league seeks to get to 12 FBS members, is up for grabs among three programs -- Houston, SMU and Temple.

Big East plans to invite six - NYPOST.com

[timmynausea]

Ivan Maisel writes that the SEC "sours" on Missouri because of the travel distance:

1. The SEC presidents will decide which school to invite as the league’s 14th member. Athletic administrators, I am told, don’t want Missouri because of the travel to Columbia. For instance, it’s 1,000 miles from there to Gainesville, Fla. Add the remote nature of so many SEC campuses, and travel of non-revenue teams will incur a sharp increase in either time (commercial travel through Atlanta) or money ($30,000 charter flights).

3-point stance: Mizzou's distance sours SEC - College Football Nation Blog - ESPN

[Ksyrup]

So I guess the positives of aTm outweigh those same negatives? Ever try to get from Gainesville to Colege Station?

[timmynausea]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

So I guess the positives of aTm outweigh those same negatives? Ever try to get from Gainesville to Colege Station?

I was thinking the same thing. I wonder if the SEC is throwing out stuff like this to save face in case Missouri decides to stay in the Big 12. I would've assumed they'd just pretend they were never really interested in Missouri as most people would have bought that and the travel distance excuse seems pretty lame.

[Matthean]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

So I guess the positives of aTm outweigh those same negatives? Ever try to get from Gainesville to Colege Station?

A&M was deemed a SEC like college as were Missouri has been deemed Big Ten like, but they got shot down by the Big Ten. It also might be adding one of those type teams is ok, but adding more and more is overkill. If Missouri doesn't get into the SEC, then they look worse than A&M. At least A&M got out after all of the hijinx they went through. Missouri being stuck after acting like they had invites from every major conference is just going to be funny as hell.