Alright Boyz, Let's Play Ball! The OOTP 12 Discussion/Impressions Thread:

[Markus Heinsohn]

Originally Posted by heybrad

I haven't played OOTP since 5.0 and I'm considering going for it this time, but as someone who is a total novice at this, is it really that difficult to start up a league? I've seen 2 hours mentioned. Also, it kind of sounds like I need to be a statistician with the league modifier stuff. Can I get up and running fairly quickly and easily?

I'm off work today so if I'm going to do, now is the time.

2 hours?? Nonsense. You click one button, wait for the files to copy (a few seconds), select a team and are good to go!

There are always people for whom creating leagues is a form of art, and they spend several hours setting rules, installing custom logos etc. But nobody forces you to do that.

You can get into OOTP very easily, and dig as deep into it as you like, it's your choice!

Hope that helps,
Markus

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by heybrad

I haven't played OOTP since 5.0 and I'm considering going for it this time, but as someone who is a total novice at this, is it really that difficult to start up a league? I've seen 2 hours mentioned. Also, it kind of sounds like I need to be a statistician with the league modifier stuff. Can I get up and running fairly quickly and easily?

I'm off work today so if I'm going to do, now is the time.

It all depends on what you want to do. I can set up any size league with the settings I like in about 10 minutes.

It gets really complicated because there are so many options and there were more added this year.

If you want to fire up a fictional league that starts in 2011, it isn't that hard to set up.

If you want to play a fictional league that starts in 1871 and you want every year to be like 1966, then it is a pain in the ass I am finding out, but doable.

[Drake]

To echo spleen...

A 24 team fictional league with 3 levels of minors (my preferred setup) usually takes less than ten minutes to get running. Longer if you want to do things like rename awards, franchises, etc.

[fantom1979]

Originally Posted by DanGarion

I did a 110 year sim.

I'm uploading the history right now. I didn't really change anything, I'll explain more later, the only thing I did was set the rosters and lineups to historical.

It will take a couple hours to get the whole upload but here it is to look at.

BNN Home Page

Looking through these stats I can already see that OOTP is a pass for me this year. Once again it appears that certain parts of the game are terribly flawed and it just ruins the experience for me.

Just a few examples:

1. Caught Stealing numbers are out of control. The single season leader was caught 69 times in one year. The real MLB leader, Rickey Henderson with 42, wouldn't even crack the top 100 list in this league.

2. The Mets benched Jose Reyes in 2009 to start Alex Cora and Anderson Hernandez.

3. Chipper Jones has batted under .230 for the last 5 years. In real life he led the MLB with a .364 average in 2008 (batted .158 in the sim).

4. The 43-119 2003 Detroit Tigers managed to pull out a 81-81 record in this sim. How did they manage this amazing 38 game improvement? Jeremy Bonderman's 2.86 era didn't hurt. (Real era in 2003: 5.56)

5. Pulling up a player like CC Sabathia brings several of issues. First, his birthyear is wrong. His career BB/9 is 1.87 (real life: 2.8). The sim has had him come out of the bullpen 28 times in his career, including an amazing 11 times in 2006 (In real life he has never come out of the bullpen). In the sim, the Yankees had him come out of the bullpen on October 2nd, 2010, which cost him his start on October 3rd.

6. Since 1919, one MLB player has put up an ERA under 1.50 (Bob Gibson 1968). In the sim, it happened 17 times, including an amazing 0.77 by Jose Rijo in 1994.

These might seem like nitpicking, but I found them with little effort. Just experience of knowing what to look for in OOTP sims. CS is always high. AI decisions regarding lineups and pitchers is questionable. Walks from top tier pitchers always seem to be in the Cliff Lee territory. When the game does try to create a player like Ubaldo (real life, sim), his stats are often incorrect because the game seems to have difficulty creating this type of starting pitcher. These pitchers have a tedenicy to keep their ERA relatively low by giving up less hits and striking out a fair share of batters. The game seems to replicate this by either not realizing that these guys give up less hits (which results in a higher WHIP and ERA than it should be) or by reducing the number of walks the pitcher allows (which results in a equal or lower ERA).

Examples:

Jonathan Sanchez (real -- sim) higher era
Randy Wolf (real -- sim) lower era thanks to a 2.3 bb/9 (vs 3.3 in real life)
Ryan Dempster (real -- sim) lower era thanks to a 1.26 whip (vs 1.45 in real life)
Clayton Kershaw (real -- sim) lower era thanks to a 2.3 bb/9 (vs 3.9 in real life)
Tim Lincecum (real -- sim) lowered walks, lowered hits, raised strikeouts vs real life
Bud Norris (real -- sim) The game seems to have gotten his bb/9 just right, but his in game era is lower than real life thanks to the game putting him in the bullpen.
CJ Wilson (real -- sim) I don't know what is going on here. His stats are way off for 2010 to even begin a comparison. His average start in the sim lasted less than 3 innings (in 33 starts).


Jon Lester (real -- sim) The game got Lester down almost perfect. Walks are a tad low, but definitely within the margin of error. Lester shows that the game is capable of creating a quality pitcher without a low amount of walks, but for some reason just has difficulty doing so.
David Price (real -- sim) Another good sim here.



I like Markus and the game he creates, I just wish he would focus on getting the little things right. I don't care about baseball cards or world league baseball. I would just like to know that in a fictional league a guy that is a team's #1 prospect isn't going to get waived. I just want to see a guy who won the MVP the year before isn't going to get demoted or released because his power rating dropped a point. I just don't want to see stuff like this (0-27 7.11 era last 2 seasons) or this or this anymore.

/rant

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by fantom1979

I like Markus and the game he creates, I just wish he would focus on getting the little things right. I don't care about baseball cards or world league baseball. I would just like to know that in a fictional league a guy that is a team's #1 prospect isn't going to get waived. I just want to see a guy who won the MVP the year before isn't going to get demoted or released because his power rating dropped a point. I just don't want to see stuff like this (0-27 7.11 era last 2 seasons) or this or this anymore.

/rant

It all depends on the settings when you run the sim. I did a 1921 to 2010 sim, and had none of the problems you listed. Now, all the players do exactly as they did in RL? No. And one of things I found, the fluctuation where a miss setting on my part (should have set a single season recalc on my players rating, instead of the past three seasons). But overall, the final leader boards where pretty solid. I'm going to try it again with that one change (maybe starting in 1901) and see what happens.

This game provides a lot of options, and those options give you flexibility on how rigid you want your replay. Some people don't want exact numbers, some people want them very close. You have those options as you choose. Exactly, how is that a bad thing?

[MrBug708]

It's a double-edged sword. If you have Todd Van Poppel rated as he was going into the draft and he develops into a possible HOF player, is that unrealistic? Or do you have him drafted with his actual ratings and blast the draft AI for not taking Todd as not being true to real life MLB?

[Peregrine]

Well I'm starting an OOTP 12 dynasty - we'll see how it goes.

Snakebit - OOTP 12 dynasty with the Atlanta Rattlesnakes - Front Office Football Central

[Markus Heinsohn]

Originally Posted by fantom1979

Looking through these stats I can already see that OOTP is a pass for me this year...

Really, it all depends on the settings you use for the sim. There are so many possible ways, there is no way to tell what this simulation used.

In our test simulations accuracy was incredible if used single-season replay mode, for example. OF course, when using other settings things may vary more, but this is intentional too.

And in fact, we do 'focus on the little things' every year. And to draw conclusions from one sim doesn't make a whole lot of sense in my opinion

Cheers,
Markus

[fantom1979]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

It all depends on the settings when you run the sim.

I don't think you read my post. There is no setting that will fix my SP examples above. A guy like Sanchez is broken because he gives up too many hits. Since he is already a high walk guy, this explodes his WHIP, which in turn explodes his ERA. If you turn down hits in the league settings, your leader board for batting hits will be out of whack and your top tier pitchers will have lower ERAs.

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

I did a 1921 to 2010 sim, and had none of the problems you listed.

Website link? I would love to take a look. I have ran over 100 long term sims in the last 4 years (part of being a previous beta tester and on the "dream team") and I always run into the same stat abnormalities. I do not own a copy of v12, but as I pointed out, I see the same abnormalities in DanGarion's league as I did in my previous testing.

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Now, all the players do exactly as they did in RL? No. And one of things I found, the fluctuation where a miss setting on my part (should have set a single season recalc on my players rating, instead of the past three seasons). But overall, the final leader boards where pretty solid. I'm going to try it again with that one change (maybe starting in 1901) and see what happens.
This game provides a lot of options, and those options give you flexibility on how rigid you want your replay. Some people don't want exact numbers, some people want them very close. You have those options as you choose.

I am not asking for it to be exact. I pointed that out explicitly with my Jon Lester explanation. It should be in the same ballpark, with the players reflecting the same traits that they show in real life.

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Exactly, how is that a bad thing?

Its a bad thing that the players are not who they should be. Take my Tim Lincecum example. His W/L record and ERA are pretty close between the sim and real life. But the game had to reduce his WHIP by 10% and Increase his K/9 by 20% to accomplish that. At what point can you change the mechanics of who a player is, and still call him the same player? Lincecum was just one of nine pitchers I listed who's underlying stats are different from their real life stats for 2010. I am sure I could find more if I wanted to look deeper.

I have no problem if the game decides that a player will have a hot or cold year. I have a problem when a player is a fundamentally different player than they are in real life.

[GrantDawg]

Sorry, already erased the old saves with the new patch, and that is one the reasons I am re-running the game. But with the new options (real lineups and rosters) you should see much better results than in previous years. It is easy to see why a 3 year recalc versus a one year recalc would scew the results more (injury seasons and rookie seasons are going to weigh players down a lot longer), so we will see the numbers here. i have no way to host the results on the web, unless you have a suggestion.

[GrantDawg]

I'll add another variable, and that is with coaching active. I turned it off this time, but imagine coaching tendency would also skew results.

[GrantDawg]

Ok, so far into 1921, and I can already see that you are right about the caught stealing stat. That is still completely broken. 30 players already that have 50+ caught stealing numbers.

[sovereignstar v2]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

It's a double-edged sword. If you have Todd Van Poppel rated as he was going into the draft and he develops into a possible HOF player, is that unrealistic? Or do you have him drafted with his actual ratings and blast he draft AI for not taking Todd as not being true to real life MLB?

How would OOTP/Lahman ever know that Van Poppel was a good High School pithcer? Not a good example.

[fantom1979]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Really, it all depends on the settings you use for the sim. There are so many possible ways, there is no way to tell what this simulation used.

In our test simulations accuracy was incredible if used single-season replay mode, for example. OF course, when using other settings things may vary more, but this is intentional too.

And in fact, we do 'focus on the little things' every year. And to draw conclusions from one sim doesn't make a whole lot of sense in my opinion

Cheers,
Markus

Come on Markus, I've been around for years. Do you really think I based a multiple paragraph rant on 1 sim? Granted, I have only seen 1 sim from OOTP 12, but when those results match up with results that I have seen dating back to OOTP 2006, it is worrisome.

There is no way I can look at the starting pitching issues I see, combined with problems like the AI sitting Jose Reyes for 2/3 of the season and Chipper Jones batting under .230 for 5 straight years (who won a batting title in real life during that time) and not think something is wrong. There is no setting I know of that you can change that would result in that.

I've been in the beta. I know all of the hard work that goes into that. I also know that there is not a ton of time for the beta testers to research and get into the stuff that makes this game tick.

Markus, this is a very good game, but its not a must buy for me. If you want it to be a must buy, then the game needs to be polished up.

[fantom1979]

dola


I will just end on this and be on my way. If someone has never played OOTP before, its is amazing. The amount of options and stats that are in the game is incredible. If you are huge into detail and little things bug you, there are things in this game that might make you bang your head into your keyboard. I see problems where apparently others have not, so please don't let my ranting here dissuade you from picking up this game. I've been playing since 2003, so maybe the little things have just gotten under my skin.

[GrantDawg]

BTW, unless you just stopped reading, the Jose Reyes thing was right. If you are using the historical lineups and transactions, Reyes only played 36 games in 2009. So, he wasn't benched, he was injured and that is correct.

[fantom1979]

The sim had Reyes play 142 games with 259 at bats with no injury in his log. They benched him in the sim. If the sim is trying to replicate Reyes' MLB season, I am not a fan on how it was done. It looks like a benching.

[Drake]

Heh. This is one of the big reasons I play with fake players. I don't want to be bugged by fake versions of real players not behaving the way I think they should (even with numbers to back it up). Takes all of the fun/immersion out of it if I'm comparing a fake universe to the real one and niggling over the discrepancies.

(Note: I get that lots of people really dig historical re-sim. Good for them. I'm not one of them.)

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by fantom1979

The sim had Reyes play 142 games with 259 at bats with no injury in his log. They benched him in the sim. If the sim is trying to replicate Reyes' MLB season, I am not a fan on how it was done. It looks like a benching.

That is one of things they are still working on fixing. They have most the historical transactions, but there are something the game doesn't recognize (suspensions and the like), and if the injury isn't program in the database, then it will use the historica lineups and limit other players ab's. Still, he had the right at-bats, and wasn't the AI, but his player history that limited them.

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Really, it all depends on the settings you use for the sim. There are so many possible ways, there is no way to tell what this simulation used.

In our test simulations accuracy was incredible if used single-season replay mode, for example. OF course, when using other settings things may vary more, but this is intentional too.

And in fact, we do 'focus on the little things' every year. And to draw conclusions from one sim doesn't make a whole lot of sense in my opinion

Cheers,
Markus

I agree with you completely Markus. But just an FYI, I changed no settings beyond Historical Rosters and Historical Lineups. All other settings remained default. So I'm taking the settings as they are out of the box. Which I would think most people expect should produce a reasonable representation of what really happened in baseball.

[GrantDawg]

I am now in the 1940's, and I can see where the problem lies in cs stat. it is all the early 1900's. There is not a single player on the leader board after 1916. They didn't keep the stat back then, so the game just isn't figuring it quite right (unless some historian is saying that they threw stealers out way more than later back then).

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

I am now in the 1940's, and I can see where the problem lies in cs stat. it is all the early 1900's. There is not a single player on the leader board after 1916. They didn't keep the stat back then, so the game just isn't figuring it quite right (unless some historian is saying that they threw stealers out way more than later back then).

I was going to point this out, it is primarily in the early 1900's but Brett Butler did get a TON of CS in the 80's in my sim as well.

There are some anomalies.

24 Rodney Scott 52 1980
40 Frankie Frisch* 49 1927
40 Rodney Scott 49 1979
46 Mookie Wilson 48 1982
46 Brett Butler 48 1983
74 Garry Templeton 44 1977

Rodney Scott only had a total of 62 CS in 267 attempts in about 5 full seasons of play.

In real life Butler was caught 23 times in 1983.

[DanGarion]

Sorry I can't put all the player cards on the server, if anyone wants to see a specific player I can take a screenshot.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by fantom1979

Lo
3. Chipper Jones has batted under .230 for the last 5 years. In real life he led the MLB with a .364 average in 2008 (batted .158 in the sim).

I understand frustration with this, but it's much more complex than I think we give credit for. The game has Chipper Jones in it with his current ratings. It also has his previous stats. But he's likely going to be thrown into the development curve of your typical 39 year old baseball player. It doesn't see a savvy veteran hitter with years of experience, it sees a 39 year old with these ratings and then does what it does to 39 year old players. I'm sure there are models built in to the game that would have a 39 year old keep his abilities for a few more years, but perhaps the Chipper Jones created player didn't fall into that slot.

It's why you can't go into the MLB roster sets with preconceived notions. It's a unique universe with MLB players and teams skinned over it. The same players won't always excel.

There are still some issues with career arcs I'd like to see fixed. I still think the game doesn't give enough credit to experience and tends to have too many players fall off a cliff as they get older. Players aging should be more gradual and would help avoid issues where a high rated 39 year old player suddenly turns into a Single A player in 6 months.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by DanGarion

I was going to point this out, it is primarily in the early 1900's but Brett Butler did get a TON of CS in the 80's in my sim as well.

There are some anomalies.

24 Rodney Scott 52 1980
40 Frankie Frisch* 49 1927
40 Rodney Scott 49 1979
46 Mookie Wilson 48 1982
46 Brett Butler 48 1983
74 Garry Templeton 44 1977

Rodney Scott only had a total of 62 CS in 267 attempts in about 5 full seasons of play.

In real life Butler was caught 23 times in 1983.

Yeah, haven't made it that far in this new set, but it is just an early 1900's problem for the most part. Not something that would bother me, but I can see if you are as anal some, then it is a real problem.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I understand frustration with this, but it's much more complex than I think we give credit for. The game has Chipper Jones in it with his current ratings. It also has his previous stats. But he's likely going to be thrown into the development curve of your typical 39 year old baseball player. It doesn't see a savvy veteran hitter with years of experience, it sees a 39 year old with these ratings and then does what it does to 39 year old players. I'm sure there are models built in to the game that would have a 39 year old keep his abilities for a few more years, but perhaps the Chipper Jones created player didn't fall into that slot.

It's why you can't go into the MLB roster sets with preconceived notions. It's a unique universe with MLB players and teams skinned over it. The same players won't always excel.

There are still some issues with career arcs I'd like to see fixed. I still think the game doesn't give enough credit to experience and tends to have too many players fall off a cliff as they get older. Players aging should be more gradual and would help avoid issues where a high rated 39 year old player suddenly turns into a Single A player in 6 months.

But then, sometimes they do. Chipper's (and I also noticed Dale Murphy's) career end up pretty bad overall in my replays because of the recalc on last three setting. Bad years/injury years sucked their ratings down too long. Going to see how it changes in this new replay. But Chipper in a regular player development game doesn't really drop off a cliff as bad in this version or last. Chipper in 2011 version of the game usually had about the same year he is having irl now in the sim season. Same with the one year I simmed out in 2012. Now, the computer definitely wanted to replace him in the lineup for Prado, but i can see that.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

But then, sometimes they do. Chipper's (and I also noticed Dale Murphy's) career end up pretty bad overall in my replays because of the recalc on last three setting. Bad years/injury years sucked their ratings down too long. Going to see how it changes in this new replay. But Chipper in a regular player development game doesn't really drop off a cliff as bad in this version or last. Chipper in 2011 version of the game usually had about the same year he is having irl now in the sim season. Same with the one year I simmed out in 2012. Now, the computer definitely wanted to replace him in the lineup for Prado, but i can see that.

I think that's just him being skinned on a 39 year old who is destined to drop off quickly at that age while in previous years he wasn't.

Had the same problem a couple years ago with Alfonso Soriano. No matter what I did, he fell into a .150 hitter within a year. So I edited another player on the team with his exact ratings and vice versa. Soriano went on to have a normal career arc. You are just skinning a random player model with a real world player. Try picking another player (free agent perhaps) and editing all his stuff to be Chipper Jones, then swapping the two and seeing if that fixes the problem with him.

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Yeah, haven't made it that far in this new set, but it is just an early 1900's problem for the most part. Not something that would bother me, but I can see if you are as anal some, then it is a real problem.

Although it could be that there is a larger number of CS in the game which would be an issue. There are not as many SBs as there were in the past which could be why there aren't as many guys on the CS list.

I just looked this up and this isn't the case. It does appear that something needs to be fixed with the SB/CS numbers in the early 1900's though, which regardless of someone being anal or not is an issue when teams are only getting 55% SB percentage.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I think that's just him being skinned on a 39 year old who is destined to drop off quickly at that age while in previous years he wasn't.

Had the same problem a couple years ago with Alfonso Soriano. No matter what I did, he fell into a .150 hitter within a year. So I edited another player on the team with his exact ratings and vice versa. Soriano went on to have a normal career arc. You are just skinning a random player model with a real world player. Try picking another player (free agent perhaps) and editing all his stuff to be Chipper Jones, then swapping the two and seeing if that fixes the problem with him.

What? We may be speaking different references. What is being discussed here is a historic league with no player development, so his "39 year old skin" doesn't matter, because he is not aging in game. Then I referred to the fact he did have decent years in the current season simming in 2011 and 2012 for me. So, no need for your suggestion that I can find.

[RainMaker]

Sorry, I was confused. Thought you were talking about this happening with the MLB quickstart.

[Arles]

Originally Posted by fantom1979

this anymore.

/rant

In this example, I'm not sure he was actually released. It looks like he got "released" from the draft and then signed with the Padres and then got "released" from the DL and signed back with the Padres. Maybe I'm missing something, but it looks like the "released" transaction in history might also apply to DL and draft transactions.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Arles

In this example, I'm not sure he was actually released. It looks like he got "released" from the draft and then signed with the Padres and then got "released" from the DL and signed back with the Padres. Maybe I'm missing something, but it looks like the "released" transaction in history might also apply to DL and draft transactions.

I've been doing a bunch of testing, and I'm seeing prospects getting released for no good reason in a fictional league. I actually opened a support ticket and supplied a league file that I can replicate this in every single time. So far haven't seen any response to the ticket, but I assume they've been busy with a bunch of issues.

SGW-789384

So you're not the only one seeing that happen unfortunately.

[Arles]

OK, it was confusing, but since the same team re-signed him in that example for both releases, I thought maybe it was just a reclassification transaction and not an actual release. If it's an actual release that goes to the FA pool then I agree it should be fixed.

[spleen1015]

I can't remember all of the details, but I think there was an issue in the past where prospects were getting released because of the roster size limit on the Rookie League teams.

I don't know if you guys are using Rookie Leagues or what. Just throwing it out there.

[heybrad]

Alright... I'm in!

[GrantDawg]

It is funny, both times I played this out, the 1993 NL West (where the Braves and the Giants fought neck and neck till the last weekend of the year, and both teams won over 100 games) was won by the Houston Astros.

[Passacaglia]

Sorry if this is not quite the right thread to ask this, but can anyone give me some tips for the best settings to choose to create a historical league in OOTP X? I'd like to start it as early as possible, but I also don't want to lose out on the fun factor. Other than that, I don't have any specifications.

[Balldog]

Just spent 2 hours setting up a Nippon Baseball League

[CrimsonFox]

my impression is that it still won't let me activate the game no matter when I try to do it, nor how often.
refund please?

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

my impression is that it still won't let me activate the game no matter when I try to do it, nor how often.
refund please?

Do you have some firewall software running or something like that? Maybe it is getting in you way some how?

Have you opened a ticket with OOTP Devs?

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

my impression is that it still won't let me activate the game no matter when I try to do it, nor how often.
refund please?

Offline Activation

How can I install the license for my OOTP Developments' game without an Internet connection? - Kayako eSupport Help Desk Software

[BigPapi]

Originally Posted by fantom1979

I don't think you read my post. There is no setting that will fix my SP examples above. A guy like Sanchez is broken because he gives up too many hits. Since he is already a high walk guy, this explodes his WHIP, which in turn explodes his ERA. If you turn down hits in the league settings, your leader board for batting hits will be out of whack and your top tier pitchers will have lower ERAs.


Website link? I would love to take a look. I have ran over 100 long term sims in the last 4 years (part of being a previous beta tester and on the "dream team") and I always run into the same stat abnormalities. I do not own a copy of v12, but as I pointed out, I see the same abnormalities in DanGarion's league as I did in my previous testing.






I am not asking for it to be exact. I pointed that out explicitly with my Jon Lester explanation. It should be in the same ballpark, with the players reflecting the same traits that they show in real life.




Its a bad thing that the players are not who they should be. Take my Tim Lincecum example. His W/L record and ERA are pretty close between the sim and real life. But the game had to reduce his WHIP by 10% and Increase his K/9 by 20% to accomplish that. At what point can you change the mechanics of who a player is, and still call him the same player? Lincecum was just one of nine pitchers I listed who's underlying stats are different from their real life stats for 2010. I am sure I could find more if I wanted to look deeper.

I have no problem if the game decides that a player will have a hot or cold year. I have a problem when a player is a fundamentally different player than they are in real life.

Well I read your post- and you are spot on. I would LOVE to love this game- but things you referenced- first round picks being released before they even get a chance to reach short season ball is ludicrous- and has been around for at least the last 5 years....If it's ok with others- more power to ya- but this is the kind of thing- the details, that OOTP has really NEVER gotten right- and I haven't played in 2 years....

I don't know why I keep checking threads like this; I guess every year I check back to see if it's been addressed- but it never has- or perhaps Markus has no idea how to fix it. What I find so ironic is, details like the Rule 5 draft are absolutely worthless in an environment where roster building is completely pointless to the AI. It's all just window dressing.

[CrimsonFox]

finally got it working. Took computer to a different network/apartment. It worked. I've seen programs like that before...that if the network or connection is a little slow, it just dies.
Maybe it needs to wait longer before it gives an error and keep trying.

[TigerFan1]

Originally Posted by BigPapi

Well I read your post- and you are spot on. I would LOVE to love this game- but things you referenced- first round picks being released before they even get a chance to reach short season ball is ludicrous- and has been around for at least the last 5 years....If it's ok with others- more power to ya- but this is the kind of thing- the details, that OOTP has really NEVER gotten right- and I haven't played in 2 years....

I don't know why I keep checking threads like this; I guess every year I check back to see if it's been addressed- but it never has- or perhaps Markus has no idea how to fix it. What I find so ironic is, details like the Rule 5 draft are absolutely worthless in an environment where roster building is completely pointless to the AI. It's all just window dressing.

My thoughts exactly. I dont post much here and I haven't posted on the OOTP board in a long time but I used to love the game and devoted a lot of time to dynasty reports.

The thing that soured me on it was the roster management and that was 3 or 4 versions ago. I was hoping this would be corrected in this version but it appears once again to not be.

Having cpu controlled teams releasing first round picks a month after the draft just destroys the game for me.

Markus, fixing those issues will make the game much better than any combination of facegen and player cards ever could.

[Schmidty]

Well, things aren't sounding so good here. I was going to buy it and try to get the RWBL going again with Dan, but if this 12 is as buggy as it sounds, I'm not buying it yet.

[JonInMiddleGA]

[Rizon]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Thanks, he doesn't seem all in my face now.

[TroyF]

A lot of the things said here are things that have ticked me off for years, but I've found that I like the rest of the sim enough, I do some things to get around it.

1) I use fictional players. It's just not worth getting pissed off if Tulo is rated correctly. I run a fictional universe.

2) I make teams flush with cash. It makes FA harder and teams also seem to make less stupid decisions.

3) I turn off scouting and coaching.

4) I use modern day settings. I've found using other types of settings just screw me up.

When I want better accuracy, I use PureSim.

All of that said, I ran my 100 year league last night. It uses fictional players, starts in 1900 and uses the standard major league set up. I do not allow the league to evolve in anything other than hitting/pitching variances so the league stays exactly the same for the 100 year sim. I also set all markets to equal.

Here are the results:

1) I looked over the Rockies team (the team I'll take over) and over the 100 years they didn't release a first round pick once before they started out.

2) The Angels won the most WS with 7. The Rays, Cubs, Royals and Dodgers never won a title. (The Dodgers was interesting because they actually had the 3rd highest win percentage in league history and made the playoffs 32 times)

3) The career leader for HR had 845 (remember this used modern day settings througout)

4) I guess in honor of FOFC, the best player of all time was a guy by the name of Jeffrey Troughton. He finished his career with 4,230 hits, 791 HR, 9 MVP awards, 15 all star games, won a triple crown (hitting .413 with 59 HR and 148 RBI), and has the longest hitting streak in league history at 46 games.

He was picked by Boston with the 19th pick in round one. He played out his arbitration years and was signed by the Angels. He played his career out with the Angels.

5) One of the top pitchers was a guy by the name of Pedro Martinez. The best pitcher of all time was picked by the Mets and stayed with them his entire career. He racked up 338 wins (165 losses) and struck out over 4,700 batters to go with a career 2.85 ERA. He had the most dominant statistical line of any single year for a pitcher: 25-6, 1.66 ERA, 281 innings, 193 hits, 56 walks, 303k. Pedro Martinez did have a 25-2 year, but his other numbers were not as good.

6) The best reliever of all time was a Yankee who came up at 20 and pitched in the playoffs as a set up guy and stayed with the Yankees his entire career before retiring in his mid 40's.

7) There were 9 triple crown winners, none in the last 40 years.

8) League leader in caught stealing for a season was 28. For a career it was 176.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Rizon

Thanks, he doesn't seem all in my face now.

Yeah, I found a more reasonably sized version the minute I saw the other one posted. Could see the dude's pores for cryin' out loud.

[lighthousekeeper]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

thank you for this gem. this applies to pretty much every developer i work with