I really hope we won't be able to see ANY opponent HUD in UFC 3

[Pappy Knuckles]

Quote: Originally Posted by Solid_Altair

I'm in favor of full HUD showing for both you and the opponent, except grappling HUD, of course. Some of the subtleties can matter a lot for stamina and damage. And the players have no way to viably make accurate estimations. Think of fakes that get denied (cooking)... how they affect stamina. Think of strikes that deal much more damage than usual, for whatever reason.

So you're saying you want a HUD for striking and none for grappling? That's what I got from your first paragraph, but I kind of got lost in the second.

I just find it interesting how many want to see both characters HUD. Being able to properly manage your own stamina makes sense to me, but fighting someone is such a mind game. Being given so much information takes a bit of that away in my opinion. I'm no BJJ guy, but I seriously doubt in real life they think to themselves, "Oh, I denied his transition twice, his stamina should be low. Time to make my move." It's just silly to me.

[Trillz]

I would love to see no HUD for the opponents for ranked and UT. It can stay for Quick match and other modes. This will make the game much deeper and make you think about how much they have been transistioning or striking throughout the match, etc.

If EA does this im sure it would be a success, plus EA can always put it back in within a patch if people cant adjust.

[Solid_Altair]

Quote: Originally Posted by Pappy Knuckles

So you're saying you want a HUD for striking and none for grappling? That's what I got from your first paragraph, but I kind of got lost in the second. I just find it interesting how many want to see both characters HUD. Being able to properly manage your own stamina makes sense to me, but fighting someone is such a mind game. Being given so much information takes a bit of that away in my opinion. I'm no BJJ guy, but I seriously doubt in real life they think to themselves, "Oh, I denied his transition twice, his stamina should be low. Time to make my move." It's just silly to me.

It does take something away. It takes the estimation away. You are right in missing something.

But, imo, the estimation steals the thunder of the tactics that you can perform when you are given the information. When you remove the need for the estimation, you make it so the estiimation can't define the outcomes and leave more to the tactics. That is not to say that with estimation you have zero tactics. It does mean that you effectively have less weight on tactics, because if your estimation is off, your tactics will be doomed.

Also, to clarify that confusing paragraph of mine, my point is that there are somethings that happen that make estimation non-viable. And that means that your estimation will be mroe often wrong. And that will doom the tactics quite often, too.

I simply think that making the informed decisions is a more noble kind of player skill.

[Kasel]

Quote: Originally Posted by Solid_Altair

I'm in favor of full HUD showing for both you and the opponent, except grappling HUD, of course. Some of the subtleties can matter a lot for stamina and damage. And the players have no way to viably make accurate estimations. Think of fakes that get denied (cooking)... how they affect stamina. Think of strikes that deal much more damage than usual, for whatever reason.

No offense but I have no idea what you're saying and why you're saying it as usual. But I do understand that you're aiming for balance and clarity, correct? Is it for ease of access for new players to populate the community? You sound like a smart guy so I'm curious to know your line of thought because I always disagree with your input

I'm obviously in favor of realism, because there are already so many well balanced unrealistic fighting games out there that are cool and all but have nothing to do with actual human fighting/martial arts. Do you have any martial arts experience or are you just a fan?

[Solid_Altair]

I have 5 years of Traditional Northern Shao Lin Kung Fu... not that it relates much to MMA. It's just enough to give me a sense of motion.

As to my points, I blame myself for not being able to express them more clearly. And they are indeed complicated. It's not a matter of being accessible to casuals.

It's about a view where estimation and tactics don't just add up as relevant player skills. They compete for relevance. If estimation is made a big deal, it will remove some relevance from tactics. And to make matters worse, estimation is not even viable.

I understand that some players might enjoy not quite knowing where their opponent's health is. The way I see it is that they are making a decision. The decision might be good based on their sense of tactics, but that will only matter if their estimation is correct. A big role of estimation means more weight for guessing and less for thinking.

I also understand that some players want to hide the HUD as an indirect way to address other problems with the game (such as the kind of stamina pressure that plagued EA MMA and EA UFC 1). But I'd rather not take such shortcuts; and adress the problems directly, instead.

[Yaari]

When the game is good enough so that you can get the important situations by just looking at the characters, I think they should absolutely remove your opponents' stamina bar.

Fight Night showed us it is possible in the striking atleast. I think grappling will be difficult.

Still hope they will reach that point though.

[smokeface]

I think what Solid is trying to say is it's easier to think ahead and be the best you can be with the HUD displayed. Without the HUD it is all guess work, in grappling especially. It's so hard to portray someone who's tired on the ground so you know what move you need to make. With effective grappling being so dependent on the stamina value, we need that information.

[Pappy Knuckles]

I'm curious what some the EA UFC BJJ guru's like Big Cee are capable of with no HUD on. I'd love to see some video, just to help aid this conversation.