Sim or competitive mode?

[Aestis]

Quote: Originally Posted by rkocjay

feeling it won't be good day 1 as it could be at day 90 Sent from my A0001 using Operation Sports mobile app

This is a point worth remembering--separate modes allows for tuning updates (which Madden has been really great about the past 2-3 titles) geared specifically to improve that mode.

[Ampking101]

100% Simulation. I am a football fan and so football elements actually matter. Injuries, penalties, ratings, etc. They all matter when it comes to football the game we are supposed to be simulating. Stick skills should mean much less in a game, no way a QB like Andy Dalton should have the ability to look like an Aaron Rodgers and that works for every position.

You should be punished for having a weakness at a position and not be able to cover it up with stick skills. There is a reason that the Falcons were so bad in 2013 and 2014 with a ton of injuries and no offensive line yet after 2 years of building make it to the superbowl. A holding penalty pushing them out of field goal territory that would have sealed the Superbowl game. Devonta Freeman missing a huge block that results in a strip sack that set up the comeback. All of these things are a part of football and to omitt that takes away a huge part of the game, it would be like never having to sit your starters in basketball or completely remkving penalties which means you strip away free throws.

Sure stick skills are fun but when I can play on All-Madden and get pretty close to undefeated every season because of stick skills it takes away a big part of the fun for me. I don't enjoy when I have a subpar HB with a season 7.5 yard gain a carry average it takes away the immersiveness. Sometimes a long run gets called back, sometimes a pass interference puts a team from 3rd and 7 to 1st and goal, it just happens in football.

I don't play MUT but I do play Draft Champions and I do enjoy the mode and wish it wasn't so cut and dry as it is. There is a reason you can't draft 90 overall players in every position (and I hate that they garunteed an 85+ QB in every single draft). Competitive I'm sure is nice for if you only want to test stick skill and I know there are people out there that only want that so I'm glad they have that ability but I want my experience to mimick actual football as close as possible and I choose that over only having my stick skills matter. I want the randomness that comes with a football game, a big part of ability is tean building and the ability to overcome mistakes. Now will the simulation setting do that...who knows. However if it does what they are hyping it to be that is what I will be sticking with.

[sonofthedude777]

Quote: Originally Posted by Ampking101

100% Simulation. I am a football fan and so football elements actually matter. Injuries, penalties, ratings, etc. They all matter when it comes to football the game we are supposed to be simulating. Stick skills should mean much less in a game, no way a QB like Andy Dalton should have the ability to look like an Aaron Rodgers and that works for every position. You should be punished for having a weakness at a position and not be able to cover it up with stick skills. There is a reason that the Falcons were so bad in 2013 and 2014 with a ton of injuries and no offensive line yet after 2 years of building make it to the superbowl. A holding penalty pushing them out of field goal territory that would have sealed the Superbowl game. Devonta Freeman missing a huge block that results in a strip sack that set up the comeback. All of these things are a part of football and to omitt that takes away a huge part of the game, it would be like never having to sit your starters in basketball or completely remkving penalties which means you strip away free throws. Sure stick skills are fun but when I can play on All-Madden and get pretty close to undefeated every season because of stick skills it takes away a big part of the fun for me. I don't enjoy when I have a subpar HB with a season 7.5 yard gain a carry average it takes away the immersiveness. Sometimes a long run gets called back, sometimes a pass interference puts a team from 3rd and 7 to 1st and goal, it just happens in football. I don't play MUT but I do play Draft Champions and I do enjoy the mode and wish it wasn't so cut and dry as it is. There is a reason you can't draft 90 overall players in every position (and I hate that they garunteed an 85+ QB in every single draft). Competitive I'm sure is nice for if you only want to test stick skill and I know there are people out there that only want that so I'm glad they have that ability but I want my experience to mimick actual football as close as possible and I choose that over only having my stick skills matter. I want the randomness that comes with a football game, a big part of ability is tean building and the ability to overcome mistakes. Now will the simulation setting do that...who knows. However if it does what they are hyping it to be that is what I will be sticking with.

Well said dude. Been thinking. I guess I am more sim vs cpu. Maybe not head to head though. I just get annoyed and lose interest against friends when John Madden/the cpu decides his team is not gonna get picked in triple coverage or not and my team has fumbilitis. U can still win those games if u r superior to your opponent but if ur skill is close u pretty much cant. I guess that happens in the NFL but it is like simulated momentum. People have their own ups and downs. Maybe Im playing hungover so I am not as sharp. I guess I just really hate that aspect. Kind takes away from the competition. Why bother and practice when the games are kinda scripted? I put a lot of time in scouting. It just gets wasted on fumble day. Ya know what I mean.

Sent from my SM-A710K using Operation Sports mobile app

[Ampking101]

Quote: Originally Posted by sonofthedude777

Well said dude. Been thinking. I guess I am more sim vs cpu. Maybe not head to head though. I just get annoyed and lose interest against friends when John Madden/the cpu decides his team is not gonna get picked in triple coverage or not and my team has fumbilitis. U can still win those games if u r superior to your opponent but if ur skill is close u pretty much cant. I guess that happens in the NFL but it is like simulated momentum. People have their own ups and downs. Maybe Im playing hungover so I am not as sharp. I guess I just really hate that aspect. Kind takes away from the competition. Why bother and practice when the games are kinda scripted? I put a lot of time in scouting. It just gets wasted on fumble day. Ya know what I mean. Sent from my SM-A710K using Operation Sports mobile app

I get where you are coming from, yes it can be frustrating and infuriating to lose on a fumble or to not get an interception when it seems like it should have been automatic and yes occurances like that can make you feel like it is scripted. That said let me take you back to the superbowl a 28-3 lead going into the half. That is basically a death sentence I remember everyone congratulating me on my team winning at halftime...yeah we know how that went.

So say something like, Robert Alford a like 78 overall CB getting a huge pick six on Tom Brady a guy most would argue should be the most accurate in madden, he made a bad read. I will point out though that leading up to that int we had like 4 defensive holding calls that drive that placed the Patriots in our territory. Also what about when Tom Brady was inaccurate yet again and the ball was tipped by Robert Alford but he couldn't quite get his hands on it, not only was it nit intercepted Julian Edleman somehow circus caught it in an unbelieveable fashion. Then what about when Tom Brady made another terrible throw on the goalline and instead of running the ball ran play action lobbed it into the corner of the endzone and Vic Beasley was in perfect position to intercept it but couldn't quite get possession of the ball. Sometimes those gimme ints aren't ints in real life. Fumblitis can get annoying too sure but they are a huge part of the game. Without the strip sack on Matt Ryan due to the missed block by Freeman the Patriots comeback never begins.

Things like that can certainly be frusterating for sure but as EA used to put it "It's in the game". Granted I think a lot of people forget that it is a game where 22 people are on the field at all times and those 22 people all have an assignment and if one of them makes a huge mistake it can make a big impact. It's easy to lose sight of that when you are one person controlling 11 guys on offense, defense, and special teams. I can't tell you how often I want to throw my controller when a punt return for a TD gets called back, I want to bust my tv when it happens in real life too but it is a part of the game.

I guess playing my fair share of Dark Souls and games of that difficulty calibre it did a lot to show me that sometimes it isn't fair, sometimes you get caught by a hook that you feel you should have dodged but there is always another game. I'm also not the type who plays in tournaments for money either though because I don't enjoy calling the same type of plays over and over and I don't like facing the same plays over and over, it just isn't fun to me and I would never get good at it because I don't enjoy it, so I'm okay with getting punched in the mouth once in awhile in a game because there is always another game. So in saying that I understand the appeal of competitive but I'm not the audience that they are trying to appeal to with the competitive setting. I enjoy trying to beat cheesy guys with sim like tactics and I enjoy the bragging rights of being able to overcome a handicap like a holding or a pass interference, so while like I said I understand the appeal it just doesn't appeal to me, I know what I'm getting when I face randos and if I want a straight up game I will usually face a friend, for everything else I either like doing a solo franchise or a franchise with a few close friends who are like minded, if I were a MUT guy maybe I wouldn't want factors out of my control butI just don't relate.

Edit: Also keep in mind the NFL is a place where even the worst team can win against a good team. Even the Browns won a game so sometimes hapoenstance trumps skill. So yeah sometimes equal skill can still result in a loss but like I have said that is just football. No one expected the Falcons to go to the Superbowl after just having an 8-8 season, no one expected them to lead 28-3 by the half. Weird unexpected things always happen in football, that is why it is my favorite sport by far.

[sonofthedude777]

Quote: Originally Posted by Ampking101

I get where you are coming from, yes it can be frustrating and infuriating to lose on a fumble or to not get an interception when it seems like it should have been automatic and yes occurances like that can make you feel like it is scripted. That said let me take you back to the superbowl a 28-3 lead going into the half. That is basically a death sentence I remember everyone congratulating me on my team winning at halftime...yeah we know how that went. So say something like, Robert Alford a like 78 overall CB getting a huge pick six on Tom Brady a guy most would argue should be the most accurate in madden, he made a bad read. I will point out though that leading up to that int we had like 4 defensive holding calls that drive that placed the Patriots in our territory. Also what about when Tom Brady was inaccurate yet again and the ball was tipped by Robert Alford but he couldn't quite get his hands on it, not only was it nit intercepted Julian Edleman somehow circus caught it in an unbelieveable fashion. Then what about when Tom Brady made another terrible throw on the goalline and instead of running the ball ran play action lobbed it into the corner of the endzone and Vic Beasley was in perfect position to intercept it but couldn't quite get possession of the ball. Sometimes those gimme ints aren't ints in real life. Fumblitis can get annoying too sure but they are a huge part of the game. Without the strip sack on Matt Ryan due to the missed block by Freeman the Patriots comeback never begins. Things like that can certainly be frusterating for sure but as EA used to put it "It's in the game". Granted I think a lot of people forget that it is a game where 22 people are on the field at all times and those 22 people all have an assignment and if one of them makes a huge mistake it can make a big impact. It's easy to lose sight of that when you are one person controlling 11 guys on offense, defense, and special teams. I can't tell you how often I want to throw my controller when a punt return for a TD gets called back, I want to bust my tv when it happens in real life too but it is a part of the game. I guess playing my fair share of Dark Souls and games of that difficulty calibre it did a lot to show me that sometimes it isn't fair, sometimes you get caught by a hook that you feel you should have dodged but there is always another game. I'm also not the type who plays in tournaments for money either though because I don't enjoy calling the same type of plays over and over and I don't like facing the same plays over and over, it just isn't fun to me and I would never get good at it because I don't enjoy it, so I'm okay with getting punched in the mouth once in awhile in a game because there is always another game. So in saying that I understand the appeal of competitive but I'm not the audience that they are trying to appeal to with the competitive setting. I enjoy trying to beat cheesy guys with sim like tactics and I enjoy the bragging rights of being able to overcome a handicap like a holding or a pass interference, so while like I said I understand the appeal it just doesn't appeal to me, I know what I'm getting when I face randos and if I want a straight up game I will usually face a friend, for everything else I either like doing a solo franchise or a franchise with a few close friends who are like minded, if I were a MUT guy maybe I wouldn't want factors out of my control butI just don't relate. Edit: Also keep in mind the NFL is a place where even the worst team can win against a good team. Even the Browns won a game so sometimes hapoenstance trumps skill. So yeah sometimes equal skill can still result in a loss but like I have said that is just football. No one expected the Falcons to go to the Superbowl after just having an 8-8 season, no one expected them to lead 28-3 by the half. Weird unexpected things always happen in football, that is why it is my favorite sport by far.

Good points all man. Thanks!

Sent from my SM-A710K using Operation Sports mobile app

[Aestis]

Quote: Originally Posted by sonofthedude777

Good points all man. Thanks!

Quote: Originally Posted by Ampking101

When I stopped getting frustrated in Madden for the most part is when I decided to stop viewing each H2H game as truly a contest of skill. Over 10 games, the better player/team will generally win. But if you want a simulation experience, there are going to be factors out of your control. Maybe you are good enough to win anyway, but the deck will usually be slightly stacked against one player. Occasionally it will be heavily stacked (though not NEARLY as often as guys believe--human nature, we tend to notice all the bad breaks and ignore all the good ones when we play, I've found).

And no this wasn't some rationalization for being bad. I've won a SB in our very competitive 32-man league in M15, M16, and M17. But it's an 'any given Sunday' situation. This may be frustrating, but it's realistic.

If you want each H2H game in your league to be a true contest of skill, where user skill is by FAR the key factor and everything else is just a slight modifier...play competitive mode and be happy with it. If that were what I wanted out of Madden, I'd play competitive mode. That pure competition IS what I get out of other games I've played. Just not Madden.

[sonofthedude777]

I tip my cap. You guys are really giving me some things to mull over. Cheers.

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[adriano]

SIM with sliders. There has to be some randomness to the game.

Jerry Rice had 99 hands. Still he dropped passes. I am looking forward
to playing the game.

I wonder if there will be botched snaps on FG's?