Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

[NoFear]

I'm getting extremely frustrated when usering on the D-Line. Please let me know if there is a fix for this...

First of all, if u have a Edge Rusher who's less than 85 OVR, good luck ever winning the battle even against terrible tackles.

I win the timing battle with going at the tackle 8/10 times, but after that is the issue.

If you press X or Square too fast you automatically lose the battle which makes no sense, BC as soon as a Edge touches the OL he should be trying to win that battle (QUICKLY).

So you wait for Square or X to light up right? Press the corresponding button and wah-lah you "Win!" the battle... but what does that do half the time? Put you in a 2-3 second animation and by that time 90% of the time, the ball is out of the QB's hands, not even a chance to sack him or apply pressure.

On those rare occasions where you win the battle and u actually get a quick animation and get to run AT the QB - watch out you may get sucked into another fight with a RB or TE or Guard whom somehow are even better at fighting you off than the TACKLES!

Beyond frustrating. In old Maddens, I would win the battles and at least get 4-5 pressures a game - maybe 1-2 sacks or more if I had a great pass rusher like Khalil Mack etc.

Lately I've been playing on a 4-3 which I read on here that in a 4-3 the pass rushers almost never can win battles against OL but in a 3-4 it's much more realistic. Any idea on this? I don't normally run 3-4 but I'm willing to go back to it, if that's the case. I like playing with pass rushers when not playing usering an OLB or MLB but I really just don't understand why it seems to not work in M20.

Any tips or help would be appreciated!

[blackboard79]

Re: Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

Its tough but very realistic unless you expect to have 30 sacks with one player by the end of season. Also, once you get the abilities it gets way too easy and becomes a sack fest. I get what you saying from a video game perspective but sim wise its actually solid.

[TX.Leaguer]

Re: Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

I got frustrated at first. I really think they made it easier with the patch. I couldn’t get any pressure before and now I get about .5-.75 sacks and a hurry or two a game with a 78 ovr speed rusher.

I really think it has a lot to do with ratings and not just the animations. They dropped block shedding on pass rushers a ton. Some elite pass rushers have 50 block shedding, while run stoppers are in the 70’s. I really think it should be flipped IMO, especially when runners get nerfed into the line and get stopped by the big guys. You’d think strength and block shedding would compliment each other.

Overall though I’m happy with the changes. I use speed rushers. Just like in real life, if those guys don’t win on first contact, they’re rarely going to get the sack. It was much more frustrating in previous years when that same 78 ovr would have annual 20+ sack seasons.

As for hurries, I’m digging the new pressure inaccuracies of the quarterbacks. It adds to the game in the trenches. Seems like years past it was hit or miss. Mostly miss on affecting the QB.

I’ve also been using matt10’s sliders. You might try them out and see if it gets you more of what you’re looking for.

[truryder4life]

Re: Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

Block shed has nothing to do with pass rush

[stinkubus]

Re: Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

As stated block shed has nothing to do with pass rush moves. Only applies to beating run blocks.

The thing with user rushing is that you must quickly get away from the blocker you just disengaged with, or he's going to block you again. You must proactively run away from him, and probably need to start sprinting.

There is a delay penalty for missing an attempt, and there are now O-line abilities to thwart button mashing.

How many OL did EA give that ability to?

[Funkycorm]

Re: Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

As stated block shed has nothing to do with pass rush moves. Only applies to beating run blocks.

The thing with user rushing is that you must quickly get away from the blocker you just disengaged with, or he's going to block you again. You must proactively run away from him, and probably need to start sprinting.

There is a delay penalty for missing an attempt, and there are now O-line abilities to thwart button mashing.

How many OL did EA give that ability to?

I think there are only 12-13 superstar o lineman. LT has the most at 5 and LG only has 1 then it is 2-3 for each C, RG, RT. This is what I remember seeing the other night. My numbers may be off by a couple.

[burth179]

Re: Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

I don't know if usering it is broken or not (I don't user the D line) - but why user it when you can just play with a team that has Donald, Mack, Watt, or Miller (maybe missing a few others) and let the CPU sack the QB 8 times a game for you.


EDIT - Sorry for the mini-rant, but when I run the ball 5-6 ypc for 5 carries, then break an 80 yard TD run on the next carry, have not passed all game. Line up in big set again (1 RB, 3 TE, 1 WR), play action deep and send 3 guys out on passes - and Aaron Donald completely disregards the threat of the run to insta-sack my QB - then CPU pass rush for these dudes is just ridiculously overpowered..

If I'm playing against somebody, then they should at least have to user Aaron Donald himself to get 6.5 sacks in one game (By the way this is a game I still ended up winning but jesus).

But the way Madden is - I don't know why anyone would voluntarily user the D line when the CPU pass rush is completely bonkers (at least for these elite players it is)

[Rhudey]

Re: Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

I don't know if usering it is broken or not (I don't user the D line) - but why user it when you can just play with a team that has Donald, Mack, Watt, or Miller (maybe missing a few others) and let the CPU sack the QB 8 times a game for you.


EDIT - Sorry for the mini-rant, but when I run the ball 5-6 ypc for 5 carries, then break an 80 yard TD run on the next carry, have not passed all game. Line up in big set again (1 RB, 3 TE, 1 WR), play action deep and send 3 guys out on passes - and Aaron Donald completely disregards the threat of the run to insta-sack my QB - then CPU pass rush for these dudes is just ridiculously overpowered..

If I'm playing against somebody, then they should at least have to user Aaron Donald himself to get 6.5 sacks in one game (By the way this is a game I still ended up winning but jesus).

But the way Madden is - I don't know why anyone would voluntarily user the D line when the CPU pass rush is completely bonkers (at least for these elite players it is)

I like to control a pass rusher, mainly because I'm terrible at controlling other positions on defence. I'm not sure why you would even say something like that to be honest, with that line of thinking why play as any position on the field if the computer can do it instead?

[burth179]

Re: Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

I like to control a pass rusher, mainly because I'm terrible at controlling other positions on defence. I'm not sure why you would even say something like that to be honest, with that line of thinking why play as any position on the field if the computer can do it instead?

I agree with your last point.. I play as an MLB (or sometimes a safety if I'm playing man Defense ) because I can play it better than the CPU can.. There is no way I could rush the passer better than the CPU can so I let them do it..

I wasn't trying to have a go at the subject of the thread either so I apologize for that and not being constructive to the thread - I was just using this as a way to moan about how broken elite pass rushers are in this game where the user does not have to do anything to get them to sack you.

Like there is one guy I play that I can beat 9 times out of 10 unless he has one of these pass rushers then it's like I'm barely a favorite now.. He doesn't even user anyone really on defense he just lets the CPU play defense for him (he'll take a DT and "user" him in short pass coverage- so it makes me even more upset that he only has to rush 2 guys and get heat on my QB)

As for the actual question I don't know, maybe go into the training mode and practice pass rush moves timing. I would suggest using one of those elite guys if you can as well, they are stupidly broken and OP.

This was more of a rant at the actual game itself than the thread - so I apologize for that. But I feel like sometimes this game actually does benefit people for letting the CPU play for them. Like same buddy was messing around with his phone and had the best kick return he has had in Madden 20 and didn't even pick up the controller.. He don't user (or barely) users anyone on defense and benefits from the CPU playing for him basically and it is kind of upsetting because I know I'm way better at this game than him and the only real chance he has is when he plays with a team that has Aaron Donald, etc

[Funkycorm]

Re: Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

I don't know if usering it is broken or not (I don't user the D line) - but why user it when you can just play with a team that has Donald, Mack, Watt, or Miller (maybe missing a few others) and let the CPU sack the QB 8 times a game for you.


EDIT - Sorry for the mini-rant, but when I run the ball 5-6 ypc for 5 carries, then break an 80 yard TD run on the next carry, have not passed all game. Line up in big set again (1 RB, 3 TE, 1 WR), play action deep and send 3 guys out on passes - and Aaron Donald completely disregards the threat of the run to insta-sack my QB - then CPU pass rush for these dudes is just ridiculously overpowered..

If I'm playing against somebody, then they should at least have to user Aaron Donald himself to get 6.5 sacks in one game (By the way this is a game I still ended up winning but jesus).

But the way Madden is - I don't know why anyone would voluntarily user the D line when the CPU pass rush is completely bonkers (at least for these elite players it is)

To be fair, you did forget Bosa. He is one of the most OP edge rushers when he gets in the zone.

[burth179]

Re: Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

To be fair, you did forget Bosa. He is one of the most OP edge rushers when he gets in the zone.

Oh yeah that is one of his other favorite teams LMAO.. Bosa… Yeah he's ridiculous too..


To be fair - I do need to run more short passes and just run the crap out of the ball to try and off set this, which I will adjust accordingly.. But still they even get in anytime you Play action under center it's an auto sack (even if I'm running at will 10 times in a row before that).. So even with my adjustments it will probably knock it down to 3-4 sacks a game instead of 6-7 from one guy

[Rhudey]

Re: Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

I agree with your last point.. I play as an MLB (or sometimes a safety if I'm playing man Defense ) because I can play it better than the CPU can.. There is no way I could rush the passer better than the CPU can so I let them do it..

I wasn't trying to have a go at the subject of the thread either so I apologize for that and not being constructive to the thread - I was just using this as a way to moan about how broken elite pass rushers are in this game where the user does not have to do anything to get them to sack you.

Like there is one guy I play that I can beat 9 times out of 10 unless he has one of these pass rushers then it's like I'm barely a favorite now.. He doesn't even user anyone really on defense he just lets the CPU play defense for him (he'll take a DT and "user" him in short pass coverage- so it makes me even more upset that he only has to rush 2 guys and get heat on my QB)

As for the actual question I don't know, maybe go into the training mode and practice pass rush moves timing. I would suggest using one of those elite guys if you can as well, they are stupidly broken and OP.

This was more of a rant at the actual game itself than the thread - so I apologize for that. But I feel like sometimes this game actually does benefit people for letting the CPU play for them. Like same buddy was messing around with his phone and had the best kick return he has had in Madden 20 and didn't even pick up the controller.. He don't user (or barely) users anyone on defense and benefits from the CPU playing for him basically and it is kind of upsetting because I know I'm way better at this game than him and the only real chance he has is when he plays with a team that has Aaron Donald, etc

Thanks for the reply, I misunderstood your post. It's interesting how everyone is different, I only play offline CFM by myself so the x-factor d-linemen run by the CPU was a great addition for me. Previously there was no fear going against superstars or reason to game plan, now I have to plan my play calling carefully against teams with these players.

I am also experiencing what the original poster has said as well. When the CPU controls a DE they rush in a loop where there is handfighting/arm rips, etc. which looks realistic and forms a pocket. In 20 when I control the end I either get an instashed or I am stood up at the line, I can't seem to re-create the edge pressure like I could on previous versions and like the CPU can on most plays. It's like the animations the CPU uses on edge rushes aren't available under user control.

[edgevoice]

Re: Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

I'm getting extremely frustrated when usering on the D-Line. Please let me know if there is a fix for this...

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Any tips or help would be appreciated!

I've always controlled my RE and then switch to DB or LB to play ball. This year, I feel like I'm not sucked into a "patty-cake" animation as much. As you and others have mentioned, timing is important. Also, you certainly can't expect to win the majority of the time. From either a sim or competitive perspective that wouldn't make any sense.

What I usually do is get right up in the face of the tackle and push-push and then spin while engaged. If you try to spin too soon, just like IRL you will just get knocked backwards.

When it situationally makes sense, try spreading your line out and call for them to slant outwards. At the snap, run a stunt inside around your tackle and see if you can get pressure that way. It's tricky, but I've pulled it off a few times.

Sure, this mechanic is tough, but in no way do I think it's broken. I do think it was toned down a bit from the BETA. Just my opinion on it.

[TX.Leaguer]

Re: Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

Block shed has nothing to do with pass rush

Wow. Guess I’ve been in left field on this. Thanks for correcting me.

[webbjay82]

Re: Is USERing the D-Line Broken?

I normally play as the weak side DE but this year I've been playing as a DT. I've really enjoyed that. I don't get many sacks but with a 78 DT I've been able to disrupt the pocket more often.