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  • #1
    Mos1ted
    MVP
    • Sep 2002
    • 2267

    12 Minute Sliders


    These slider sets are for anyone looking to play full 12 minute quarter games. I've been getting ultra realistic stats and gameplay with these settings. I'm new to the whole posting slider thing so feedback is more than welcomed.

    Difficulty: Hall Of Fame or Superstar (depends on you)
    Quarters: 12 Min
    Speed: Normal
    Rules : All set to on
    Fouls: Each setting set to 30 (default is 20)
    Sliders : (Equal for both human and cpu - I always like for human and cpu to be even when I do sliders regardless of difficulty setting)

    Close Shot Success: - 9 from default
    Mid Shot Success: - 9 from default
    Layup Success: - 9 from default
    Close Shot Tendencies: + 8 from zero
    Mid Shot Tendencies: + 44 from zero
    3PT Shot Tendencies: + 44 from zero
    Drive Tendency: + 13 from zero
    Dunk Tendency: + 21 from zero
    Rip Success: - 10 from default
    Steal: - 9 from default
    Block: - 9 from default
    Ball Handling: - 9 from default
    Dunk: - 9 from default
    Offensive Awareness: - 9 from default
    Defensive Awareness: - 9 from default

    Slider Interpretations.....

    SHOT PERCENTAGES
    While playing this game for the past month or so, I've noticed that players will just make shots at will even when the shot is defended. It doesn't happen on every single shot, but I was frustrated with the computer throwing up turnarounds from the baseline while covered and sinking it 90 % of the time. The shot percentage adjustments should remedy this. It has for me in the games I've played. No longer will players make just any type of shot. Squared up shots still have a good chance of going in if timed right and not forced which is the way it should be. I had the same issue with layups. Even those these guys are professionals, I've seen a lot of botch layups in the NBA, mostly in traffic. I feel that the adjustments there should give more realistic results for contested layups. Of course higher rated guys will usually finish, but the lower rated ones will mostly miss if the layup is heavily contested.

    TENDENCIES
    The tendency sliders have been under a lot of debate here recently. Following Nolesfan and others tips, I played around with these sliders to see if I can notice a change. I did indeed. By lowering the CPU tendencies, the CPU will run the offense more with passes and actually running plays as oppose to just trying to drive to the lane all the time. Players that drive often in real life with still drive if open, but they won't "force" the drive at these settings. Also for the human, you will notice that your AI teammates, set up more on the perimeter spacing the floor out a bit. At default it seems that everyone just sets up around the paint which isn't the way most NBA offenses operate. This will in turn put the user in position to attempt for mid range shots.

    Attributes
    More times than not, I find myself getting ripped when posting up, by players with the likes of Adonal Foyle!!! I bumped down rip success to ensure that only the most skilled defensive players can pick pockets. The blocks this year are a lot better than previous years. I decided to bump down blocks only because of the 12 minute quarter factors. This was made to ensure NBA - esque stats for blocks at the end of the game. A lot of players have also complained about crossovers being too affective and being too easy to drive to the lane. Bumping down ball handling remedies but doesn't eliminate this problem. The defense will seem to react faster to crossovers though due the ball handling change. Dunks for me were way over the top. It seemed to be a nice balance in the beginning but after paying close attention, there were just too many fancy dunks in traffic. Your higher rating dunks like Vince, RJ, and Richardson will still have the ability to perform all the dunks from the shot stick. Lower rated players like those below 70 will less likely attempt dunks. Players around the 70 rating will be less likely to finish a dunk in heavy traffic.
    I only bumped down the offensive rating slider because I didn't want to give an advantage to one end of the floor over the other. I felt that VC did a good job balancing it already (at least for the cpu). So the adjustments were made evenly to both to keep the balance. Also, some may notice now that players will less likely be successful of intercepting passes that were thrown while their backs are too the ball. I've saw this way too often in replays of players intercepting passes they didn't even see get thrown. The lowering of the defensive awareness slider makes for more realistic reactions. Keep in mind though, players will still be just as successful in intercepting if the are facing the ball though. So you still gotta make smart passes.

    WHY EVEN SLIDERS FOR HUMAN/CPU ON HALL OF FAME/SUPERSTAR? DOESN'T THE CPU ALREADY HAVE AN ADVANTAGE ON THIS LEVEL?

    The only real advantage I've seen from the CPU is that they are faster on the breaks, and are more successful in attempting passes. I felt it should be up to the user to modify the way they play and play smarter to counter attack this. I feel that the game is even as far as human and cpu on the other areas (just my opinion though). Others may feel differently but its all up to the individual. Anyhow, I'm done talking now. Try these sliders out if you get bored or just want an alternate to the other great sliders here (or want something optimized for 12 minute quarters). Like I mentioned earlier, I do want feedback. this is my first time contributing sliders on this board so I just want to see how others like or dislike them.

    SUPERSTAR VS HALL OF FAME

    You may notice that I started a thread identical to this one already. I decided to restart this thread to let those know that the game doesn't necessarily have to be on Hall of Fame to get a realistic, statistical game. On Hall of Fame you may notice excellent help D from the computer, but looking closer I felt that this made bad teams too good on D. I bumped down to Superstar and I'm seeing better team rating integrity. If you think you're up to the challenge though, by all means bump it up to HOF. I personally haven't gotten skilled enough to compete on this level. I always fall apart in the 2nd quarter.
    DISCLAIMER: In order to be successful on Hall Of Fame you have to play like you were the one on the court. Concentration and execution is the only tools you need to beat the CPU. Take advantage of your strengths and disguise your weaknesses. Be sure to give the CPU different looks on D and to share the ball on offense. Also take smart shots. Be sure to use ball movement to find the open shot. Also, capitalize on the aggressive defense. If they reach, then you teach. It's that simple. Enjoy fellas (and ladies if any). Good defense will force more missed shots from the computer as well. Lax defense will .... well play lax D and you'll see for your self.

    CAN A MOD CLOSE MY 12 MINUTE HOF SLIDERS THREAD BECAUSE ITS PRETTY POINTLESS NOW. THANKS!!!
    Last edited by Mos1ted; 10-25-2005, 09:45 PM.
    According to my old marketing professor, satisfaction is when product performance meets or exceeds consumer expectation.
  • #2
    neovsmatrix
    MVP
    • Jul 2002
    • 2878

    Re: 12 Minute Sliders


    Re: 12 Minute Sliders

    Just wondering one more thing, do players ALWAYS pass the ball around before taking a shot, or will they take the opportunities given to them? For instance, if you sag into the paint a lot, will a pg about to initiate the offense, who happens to be a good 3-point shooter and tends to shoot them, actually launch a 3 to punish the D for backing off him, instead of simply always running a play? Will they take the initiative from time to time (at least the PG's that you expect to) and just try to drive to the basket or shoot the 3-ball/midrange J if left open?

    Comment

    • #3
      SS MagicMark
      Rookie
      • Jun 2005
      • 295

      Re: 12 Minute Sliders


      Re: 12 Minute Sliders

      Originally posted by Mos1ted
      ... Of course higher rated guys will usually finish, but the lower rated ones will mostly miss if the layup is heavenly contested.
      If the Almighty is back on D, I should think they'd miss!

      Comment

      • #4
        neovsmatrix
        MVP
        • Jul 2002
        • 2878

        Re: 12 Minute Sliders


        Re: 12 Minute Sliders

        Originally posted by SS MagicMark
        If the Almighty is back on D, I should think they'd miss!

        Comment

        • #5
          Mos1ted
          MVP
          • Sep 2002
          • 2267

          Re: 12 Minute Sliders


          Re: 12 Minute Sliders

          To answer Neo's question: Depending on the individual player, they will take advantage of a wide open situation. I just finished a whole game of Bulls versus Hornets. Players like Nachbar did try to drive when left wide open, but I easily ran a man up to cut off the driving lane. Also Chris Paul, will usually capatilize if left wide open as well, although I did play a lot of on ball defense on him the entire game. Here are the stats on Superstar 12 min with the sliders I posted above.

          Hornets (cpu) stats listed first. Bulls(me) listed second.

          Timeouts remaining: 1 - 2
          Field Goals : 40/113 - 42/91
          FG Percentage: .353 - .461
          3 pt FGs: 3/13 - 6/17
          3 pt %: .230 - .352
          Free Throws: 10/13 - 10/22
          FT %: .769 - . 454
          Assists: 33 - 34
          Turnovers: 8 - 15
          Team Fouls: 13 - 11
          Total Rebounds: 58 - 57
          Off. Rebounds: 12 - 7
          Steals: 11 - 6
          Blocks : 1 - 10
          Points in Paint: 52 -54
          Bench Points : 24 - 56
          2nd Chance Pts: 2 - 11
          Fast Break Pts: 20 - 15

          Final Score : 93 - 100

          Box Score



          TOP SCORERS:

          Hornets:

          Paul - 18, Magloire - 17, Brown - 14, Smith - 13, Butler-7

          Bulls:

          Hinrich - 17, Thomas - 17, Piatkowski - 15, Chandler - 10, Gordon - 7

          TOP REBOUNDERS:

          Hornets:

          Magloire - 13, Nachbar - 9, Brown - 8

          Bulls:

          Chandler - 11, Hinrich - 10, Sweetney - 10


          STARTER MINUTES PLAYED:

          Hornets:

          Paul - 33, Smith - 31, Brown - 30, Magloire - 29, Butler - 21

          Bulls:

          Hinrich - 35, Duhon - 27, Chandler - 26, Songalia - 22, Deng - 3 ( was injured in first quarter; didn't return) Thomas in place of Deng played 25 minutes

          NOTES:

          - Magloire attempted 28 shots during the game
          - Paul had 7 assists with no turnovers
          - Hinrich had a triple double with 17 pts, 11 ast, 10 reb
          - Chandler had 3 ferocious blocks
          - Piatkowski nailed 3 3 ptrs
          - Hornets are a 56 Off., 68 Def., 62 Ovr
          - Bulls are a 65 Off., 72 Def., 68 Ovr
          According to my old marketing professor, satisfaction is when product performance meets or exceeds consumer expectation.

          Comment

          • #6
            Mos1ted
            MVP
            • Sep 2002
            • 2267

            Re: 12 Minute Sliders


            Re: 12 Minute Sliders

            Originally posted by SS MagicMark
            If the Almighty is back on D, I should think they'd miss!

            lol oops didnt even see that typo lol meant to say heavily. Good one Mag!!
            According to my old marketing professor, satisfaction is when product performance meets or exceeds consumer expectation.

            Comment

            • #7
              SS MagicMark
              Rookie
              • Jun 2005
              • 295

              Re: 12 Minute Sliders


              Re: 12 Minute Sliders

              I see that the CPU had an assist-to-turnover ratio better than 4:1, which seems to be a problem in most of the slider sets I've seen. It seems when I play that the computer doesn't go one-on-one enough, which leads to the higher assist totals since most baskets come as a result of a pass. Are turnovers just dependent on the skill of the user on defense? ]

              Most all of the CPU turnovers I see are as a result a steals, when there should be more in the way of bad passes out of bounds (not just on double teams) and offensive fouls/violations. For instance, I haven't seen the CPU called for traveling yet.

              Comment

              • #8
                Mos1ted
                MVP
                • Sep 2002
                • 2267

                Re: 12 Minute Sliders


                Re: 12 Minute Sliders

                It seemed when I was playing that the computer had more turnovers then what the stats mentioned. It said that I had 6 steals but the cpu only had 8 turnovers. I can recall the 2 shot clock violations by the computer but there were also more turnovers not accounted for in the stats. There was one play where Chris Paul shot an air ball 3 pointer that went out of bounds. I'm going to play another game and keep track of this in my head to make sure theres not another turnover bug.
                According to my old marketing professor, satisfaction is when product performance meets or exceeds consumer expectation.

                Comment

                • #9
                  neovsmatrix
                  MVP
                  • Jul 2002
                  • 2878

                  Re: 12 Minute Sliders


                  Re: 12 Minute Sliders

                  Originally posted by SS MagicMark
                  I see that the CPU had an assist-to-turnover ratio better than 4:1, which seems to be a problem in most of the slider sets I've seen. It seems when I play that the computer doesn't go one-on-one enough, which leads to the higher assist totals since most baskets come as a result of a pass. Are turnovers just dependent on the skill of the user on defense? ]

                  Most all of the CPU turnovers I see are as a result a steals, when there should be more in the way of bad passes out of bounds (not just on double teams) and offensive fouls/violations. For instance, I haven't seen the CPU called for traveling yet.

                  I have seen the AI travel. Once. I got Sprewell to travel when I was playing aggressive D on him.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    neovsmatrix
                    MVP
                    • Jul 2002
                    • 2878

                    Re: 12 Minute Sliders


                    Re: 12 Minute Sliders

                    Originally posted by Mos1ted
                    It seemed when I was playing that the computer had more turnovers then what the stats mentioned. It said that I had 6 steals but the cpu only had 8 turnovers. I can recall the 2 shot clock violations by the computer but there were also more turnovers not accounted for in the stats. There was one play where Chris Paul shot an air ball 3 pointer that went out of bounds. I'm going to play another game and keep track of this in my head to make sure theres not another turnover bug.
                    Shouldn't a shot that went out of bounds just result in a failed FGA? How is it a turnover if you shot it?

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      Mos1ted
                      MVP
                      • Sep 2002
                      • 2267

                      Re: 12 Minute Sliders


                      Re: 12 Minute Sliders

                      I'm figuring since the ball went out of bounds it should be a turnover anyhow. I don't know if it counts as one though.
                      According to my old marketing professor, satisfaction is when product performance meets or exceeds consumer expectation.

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        SS MagicMark
                        Rookie
                        • Jun 2005
                        • 295

                        Re: 12 Minute Sliders


                        Re: 12 Minute Sliders

                        No, it should be a missed shot attempt & a team rebound. I don't think the game tracks (or even has) team rebounds, though. Every missed shot is claimed by a player.

                        Comment

                        • #13
                          Mos1ted
                          MVP
                          • Sep 2002
                          • 2267

                          Re: 12 Minute Sliders


                          Re: 12 Minute Sliders

                          What do you mean by team rebounds? YOu're not talking about totals are you? The game keeps track of team total rebounds, but you're probably referring to uncredited rebounds which I don't think the game does track.
                          According to my old marketing professor, satisfaction is when product performance meets or exceeds consumer expectation.

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            SS MagicMark
                            Rookie
                            • Jun 2005
                            • 295

                            Re: 12 Minute Sliders


                            Re: 12 Minute Sliders

                            A "team rebound" is the result of a missed shot attempt that can't be credited to an individual player. So, if a ball bounces over the backboard or out of bounds, it's a team rebound for whichever team gets possession. If there's a loose ball foul during the shot (not a shooting foul, since that would result in FTs), that's one, also. Missed FTs [when another FTA is forthcoming] and missed last-second buzzer beaters result in a team rebound for the offense.

                            Comment

                            • #15
                              neovsmatrix
                              MVP
                              • Jul 2002
                              • 2878

                              Re: 12 Minute Sliders


                              Re: 12 Minute Sliders

                              These are great sliders.

                              Problem is... 12 minute quarters seems too much for accurate FGA's. I'm seeing too many attempts by both sides.

                              It's a slower, more deliberately paced game, but I think the rip success might need to be increased a bit to allow for the AI to actually pressure the ball on you, and for defensive awareness to possibly be increased.

                              But I'm really liking what I'm seeing as far as missed layups, double-teamed players often making the right play and passing it out (not always, but often), players still drive to the basket if that's their forte, players shoot the midrange and 3-ball enough it seems, and they actually seem to get the star players involved properly including PF's!

                              My first half against the Wizards, Jamison was very active on the offensive end, at times driving to the basket, or posting up or rebounding the ball.

                              Still, these are just my preliminary impressions.

                              Comment

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