Can we finally get slider explanations?

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  • chia51
    Banned
    • Jul 2005
    • 1912

    #1

    Can we finally get slider explanations?

    Every year we are given a game with sliders to help us tweak the game as we see fit and I love that aspect of it.

    But I hate having to figure out what does what, every single year. Now granted, we can take knowledge gained from the previous installment, but that doesn't necessarily mean that the same 'tweaks' will carry through in the same way.

    Meaning that there could be 'under the hood' changes that effect the sliders 'affect' on the gameplay and without a clear explanation of what the slider actually does, we are left tweaking sliders to figure out what the sliders do (how they effect the gameplay).

    So with that said, 2k, please, I beg of you, to release some kind of 'explanation' document or post something to give us an insight of what does what, how much a slider affects the gameplay in that area. Or how much the slider changes the rating that the slider is designated for.

    I've gone into great detail on 2k11 into what the sliders do and their effects, but without knowing how much the slider actually changes the ratings (I have a good idea), we/I am only left to ponder onto what or how much we have actually effected the gameplay.

    Many, many theories are out there and all are solely based on the individuals idea of what the slider actually does and most are pretty obvious on what they (sliders) should do. But that goes back to my point, without actually knowing what they do and how they effect gameplay we are left guessing through trial and error to figure out how it effects the gameplay.

    For example, I know that the highest any ratings (player attribute or tendency) can go is 99/100. So with that, how does raising that attribute slider affect different rated players? Simple, we don't know and all of this could be easily answered with a 'simple' answer of how much the sliders affect the ratings/tendencies.
  • chia51
    Banned
    • Jul 2005
    • 1912

    #2
    Re: Can we finally get slider explanations?

    <iframe width="640" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Zn7rhhEVFKA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

    Some quick thoughts:

    -CPU v CPU
    -Tendencies are still jacked out of the box (2k11 w/ edits is better right now)
    (attack tendency is too low)
    (drive/kick tendency is too high in favor of kick)
    (collisions are too low)
    -Looks like low difficulty
    -Hope to god that's not Simulation sliders
    Posted this in the video thread, thought I'd bring it over here to show as prime example of why we need better descriptions of the sliders.

    With this video you can clearly see that either the roster needs to be edited, or sliders need to be altered. Either way its the same, some things need to be toned up or down in order to get the CPU playing better.

    Comment

    • Colts18
      MVP
      • Feb 2010
      • 1959

      #3
      Re: Can we finally get slider explanations?

      I would always assume that the roster tendencies are neglected by 2K. I don't even think the 2K Insider even looks at all of the tendencies.

      Chia, will you be working on rosters this year?

      Comment

      • chia51
        Banned
        • Jul 2005
        • 1912

        #4
        Re: Can we finally get slider explanations?

        Originally posted by Colts18
        I would always assume that the roster tendencies are neglected by 2K. I don't even think the 2K Insider even looks at all of the tendencies.

        Chia, will you be working on rosters this year?
        Depends, if we can get a clear explanation of the sliders, than no probably. Since I would be able to 'edit' the rosters without editing anyone through slider manipulation.

        If there are no explanations, than probably yes. Since we already know what to do from the start.

        Comment

        • Cynical
          Rookie
          • Dec 2007
          • 81

          #5
          Re: Can we finally get slider explanations?

          totally agree. this should be an insight. i wish sliders worked off of basic logic. ex. steals sliders at 100 = asteal dam near every time attepted. seeing how on ball steals were more animations i see why 2k sliders are confusing.

          it seems sometimes sliders are to abundent and some of them cancel each other out, or the cpu just ignors them.

          seems obvious that they should explain sliders.

          Comment

          • thugnificant
            Banned
            • Sep 2010
            • 520

            #6
            Re: Can we finally get slider explanations?

            every time i play custom matches online, each slider has explanation at bottom of screen. what are you referring to?

            Comment

            • chia51
              Banned
              • Jul 2005
              • 1912

              #7
              Re: Can we finally get slider explanations?

              Originally posted by thugnificant
              every time i play custom matches online, each slider has explanation at bottom of screen. what are you referring to?
              I am referring to what do the slider do exactly... so when you read it, you know exactly what the slider does? How much the slider affects ratings and tendencies? Please tell...

              Comment

              • gtm
                M*t*l F*r*v*r
                • Jul 2002
                • 3946

                #8
                Re: Can we finally get slider explanations?

                Originally posted by Cynical
                totally agree. this should be an insight. i wish sliders worked off of basic logic. ex. steals sliders at 100 = asteal dam near every time attepted. seeing how on ball steals were more animations i see why 2k sliders are confusing.

                it seems sometimes sliders are to abundent and some of them cancel each other out, or the cpu just ignors them.

                seems obvious that they should explain sliders.
                Exactly, if you adjust a specific slider like mentioned by Cynical, that and only that attribute should be better or worse depending if you adjust higher or lower. I'm tired of the when you change one then you'll have to change another and the story goes on and on.
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                Comment

                • Zastrin
                  Banned
                  • Dec 2010
                  • 437

                  #9
                  Re: Can we finally get slider explanations?

                  Do what I do - Use the Simulation sliders and have a good day!

                  Comment

                  • Ken North
                    Rookie
                    • Sep 2009
                    • 372

                    #10
                    Re: Can we finally get slider explanations?

                    Originally posted by Colts18
                    I would always assume that the roster tendencies are neglected by 2K. I don't even think the 2K Insider even looks at all of the tendencies.
                    I don't think the 2K Insider even watches basketball.

                    Comment

                    • ffaacc03
                      MVP
                      • Oct 2008
                      • 3487

                      #11
                      Re: Can we finally get slider explanations?

                      Originally posted by Ken North
                      I don't think the 2K Insider even watches basketball.
                      Worse, I think he doesnt even know 2ks own formulas and scales ... smh.

                      Comment

                      • Knickerbocker
                        Pro
                        • Apr 2011
                        • 508

                        #12
                        Re: Can we finally get slider explanations?

                        Originally posted by ffaacc03
                        Worse, I think he doesnt even know 2ks own formulas and scales ... smh.
                        You are all exagerating. The out of the box rosters are not that bad, and each year their tendencies and ratings get closer to their RL counterparts. I've tried allmost all of the custom rosters and each had problems of their own as well, so in the end I just went with 2Ks. A good slider set though, that was a different story, but hopefully as Wang said the out of the box sim sliders should play good this year.
                        “If you meet the Buddha in the lane, feed him the ball.”-Phil Jackson

                        “I never thought I’d lead the NBA in rebounding, but I got a lot of help from my team-mates – they did a lot of missing.”-Moses Malone

                        Comment

                        • Colts18
                          MVP
                          • Feb 2010
                          • 1959

                          #13
                          Re: Can we finally get slider explanations?

                          If the tendencies are on point we would be using less slider edits.

                          The rosters and tendencies get better each year? That is a lie. Pop open 2K11's default rosters, hell even look at the last roster update. Look at the tendencies and notice that Dwight and Shaq have high shot tendencies with reverse pivots and fadeaways. Nobody is exaggerating at all. Dude doesn't know what the hell he is doing.

                          I don't understand why 2K allows their rosters to not be on point. I don't get it.

                          Comment

                          • SIZEqueen
                            Banned
                            • Sep 2011
                            • 234

                            #14
                            Re: Can we finally get slider explanations?

                            Originally posted by Knickerbocker
                            You are all exagerating. The out of the box rosters are not that bad, and each year their tendencies and ratings get closer to their RL counterparts. I've tried allmost all of the custom rosters and each had problems of their own as well, so in the end I just went with 2Ks. A good slider set though, that was a different story, but hopefully as Wang said the out of the box sim sliders should play good this year.
                            I understand people thinking that some slider and roster adjustments are unnecessary, but I've gotta disagree, respectfully. The tendencies are just a mess. Some players seem as though their values were arbitrarily selected.

                            Comment

                            • ffaacc03
                              MVP
                              • Oct 2008
                              • 3487

                              #15
                              Re: Can we finally get slider explanations?

                              Originally posted by Knickerbocker
                              You are all exagerating. The out of the box rosters are not that bad, and each year their tendencies and ratings get closer to their RL counterparts. I've tried allmost all of the custom rosters and each had problems of their own as well, so in the end I just went with 2Ks. A good slider set though, that was a different story, but hopefully as Wang said the out of the box sim sliders should play good this year.
                              No exageration at all. Then again, not all people embark on doing roster edits, "worthy" roster edits, therefor some things may go unnoticed to all but hardcore fans ... even if they are great 2k sim players, hehe.

                              Go and check post 203 http://www.operationsports.com/forum...nsider-21.html and also post 99 http://www.operationsports.com/forum...nsider-10.html, a couple of specific examples of what plagues 2k default rosters ... which gets even worse due to the clueless ongoing season edits of the 2kinsider.

                              Solely comparing the default (or even last) 2k roster with the one endorsed by that thread, the custom one, while far from perfect, was more scaled and offered a more unbiased approach to reflect real life stats as well as better representation of players and teams behavior.

                              In sum, while they have made improvements from itineration to itineration (I concede that), there is still a huge golf course to be overcome by 2k ... this will only be possible once ratings and tendencies are made not to have a player get a dessired overall rating and once 2k strictly sticks to their own set of formulas and scales, even for ongoing season updates.

                              Comment

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