NBA 2011-2012 MVP Thread

[Nathan_OS]

Quote: Originally Posted by BringTheHeat

Funny. But MVP doesn't involve Playoffs, sadly.

Finals MVP does. LOL.

Back on topic tho, KD is playing ball.

Lebron just looks sluggish out there.

[BringTheHeat]

Quote: Originally Posted by Nathan_OS

Finals MVP does. LOL. Back on topic tho, KD is playing ball. Lebron just looks sluggish out there.

I think the MVP voting should wait until after the playoffs at least. Before the Finals start.

Yeah but you can't deny what LeBron has done before 2 weeks ago. The past 2 weeks shouldn't overshadow the entire season

[ballsohard]

Before I even reply, I'm going to say that I see this as a neck and neck race. Which ever player's team ends up with the better record should end up MVP. That said...

Quote: Originally Posted by BringTheHeat

and he leads Durant in every statistical category except FT%, 3pt%, PPG, and Minutes Played.

Don't forget BPG.

Quote: Originally Posted by BringTheHeat

LeBron is not known as a 3 point shooter so can you truly chalk this up as an advantage to KD?

Oh, most definitely. Durant doesn't handle the ball anywhere near as much as LeBron, but you're going to count his assist totals as an advantage right?

Quote: Originally Posted by BringTheHeat

Talking about Miami's game has nothing to do with the MVP discussion.

Why wouldn't it?

Quote: Originally Posted by BringTheHeat

As far as clutch goes, clutch has never been , nor will ever be a factor in the MVP race.

That's news to me.

[BringTheHeat]

Quote: Originally Posted by ballsohard

Before I even reply, I'm going to say that I see this as a neck and neck race. Which ever player's team ends up with the better record should end up MVP. That said... Don't forget BPG. Oh, most definitely. Durant doesn't handle the ball anywhere near as much as LeBron, but you're going to count his assist totals as an advantage right? Why wouldn't it? That's news to me.

1. Agree that it'll be close. One of the closest in recent years actually.

2. I did forget blocks, thank you for correcting me.

3. Guess I should've said it better. Like for example..Putting Dirk against Tim Duncan, Dirk is a MUCH better shooter but Tim is a much better post player. You wouldn't say Duncan is better because he has a better post game. They play the game differently and while the difference between Bron and KD isn't that drastic, I don't think KD's shooting should necessarily be an advantage because you could say the same thing about LeBron's post game compared to Durants.

4. They handle the ball about the same amount. Both usage % are 31%. Durant does a ton of top of the key iso's while LeBron usually brings the ball up in the 4th quarter kind of like Carmelo did as a point-forward.

5. Different teams play different ways, there is no one successful way to play. If the Heat and LeBron got "easy" baskets all the time why doesn't every team in the league play like the Heat? Granted they don't have the talent that Wade and LeBron do but those two certainly aren't the only two who can explode into a fast break.

6. After doing a bit more research I admit I am wrong. Over the past 5 years, the MVP has been either 1 or 2 in clutch points/48 minutes. Durant leads the league this year.

7. One point that nobody has commented on, what about defense? LeBron has an overwhelming advantage there that nobody seems to care about. Players LeBron is guarding are averaging a PER of 9.4. Over 5 point below league average. He is third in this category behind Iguodala and Battier.

[Bumi]

Quote: Originally Posted by BringTheHeat

3. Guess I should've said it better. Like for example..Putting Dirk against Tim Duncan, Dirk is a MUCH better shooter but Tim is a much better post player. You wouldn't say Duncan is better because he has a better post game. They play the game differently and while the difference between Bron and KD isn't that drastic, I don't think KD's shooting should necessarily be an advantage because you could say the same thing about LeBron's post game compared to Durants.

Durant has a very good post game though? And Durant is a significantly better shooter than LeBron. He's shooting nearly 10% better from 16-23 feet, and is a much better 3pt shooter. And before you quote percentages and point to the fact that LeBron is a 36% 3pt shooter this year, keep in mind that Durant has made around 60 more three's and averages 3 more attempts per game.

Quote:

4. They handle the ball about the same amount. Both usage % are 31%. Durant does a ton of top of the key iso's while LeBron usually brings the ball up in the 4th quarter kind of like Carmelo did as a point-forward.

Usg% doesn't measure how often a player is on the ball, it measures possessions used. For example; Per their respective teams 100 possessions, each of them use around 31% of those possessions.

Quote:

5. Different teams play different ways, there is no one successful way to play. If the Heat and LeBron got "easy" baskets all the time why doesn't every team in the league play like the Heat? Granted they don't have the talent that Wade and LeBron do but those two certainly aren't the only two who can explode into a fast break.

You just answered your own question. Every team doesn't rack up easy buckets ala the Heat because few if any teams are privy to the luxuries granted by having two of the best fast break players in the league.

Quote:

7. One point that nobody has commented on, what about defense? LeBron has an overwhelming advantage there that nobody seems to care about. Players LeBron is guarding are averaging a PER of 9.4. Over 5 point below league average. He is third in this category behind Iguodala and Battier.

People say this, but it contradicts what's actually happening on the court. Durant has quietly become a very good defender. Not as good as LeBron, but the gap isn't large enough that comments such of the above are warranted. He's allowing .78 points per possession to LeBron's .85. Defenders are shooting 32.7% while being guarded by Durant, and 38.9% while being guarded by LeBron.

Stats gathered per synergy sports.

[BringTheHeat]

Quote: Originally Posted by Bumi

Durant has a very good post game though? And Durant is a significantly better shooter than LeBron. He's shooting nearly 10% better from 16-23 feet, and is a much better 3pt shooter. And before you quote percentages and point to the fact that LeBron is a 36% 3pt shooter this year, keep in mind that Durant has made around 60 more three's and averages 3 more attempts per game. Usg% doesn't measure how often a player is on the ball, it measures possessions used. For example; Per their respective teams 100 possessions, each of them use around 31% of those possessions. You just answered your own question. Every team doesn't rack up easy buckets ala the Heat because few if any teams are privy to the luxuries granted by having two of the best fast break players in the league. People say this, but it contradicts what's actually happening on the court. Durant has quietly become a very good defender. Not as good as LeBron, but the gap isn't large enough that comments such of the above are warranted. He's allowing .78 points per possession to LeBron's .85. Defenders are shooting 32.7% while being guarded by Durant, and 38.9% while being guarded by LeBron. Stats gathered per synergy sports.

1. I wasn't going to bring up LeBron's 3 pointers because again I don't feel how the player plays in that regard is that important. DWade is better player overall, but Ray Allen is a better shooter. Night and day. I know Durant is a better shooter than LeBron, and I also know that LeBron is a much better post player than Durant. Durant doesn't have the same post moves LeBron has nor does he have the power to really play in the post. Granted, LeBron's new "post game" isn't quite Tim Duncan level but it's much better than Kevin's.

2. Yes I know what it is, but if a player is using a possession isn't he going to have a chance to make an assist? They have the ball equal amounts. Aside from when Westbrook goes Mamba mode.

3. I don't know where you got the original stats on feasting on fast break points and how they aren't doing that anymore at but.. Since the All Star break, they are forcing the same amount of turnovers, allowing 3 less points per game, and getting 2 more steals per game. I'd say if anything their game hasn't changed much. LeBron is in a funk, plain and simple, he's not failing to execute in the halfcourt or can't beat people off the drive (seriously? LeBron James can't drive?), he is just in a funk and people need to wait before crowning Durant. Durant has only outplayed LeBron for 2 weeks now.

4. I don't have access to Synergy so I'll have to take your word for those stats. And me personally would rather look at the overall effect, the fact that LeBron is shutting down players' completely is more impressive to me than a player lowering their PPG. Lowering someones PER means lowering assist, rebound, and point numbers.

[Vni]

Lebron has a post game really?

[Sam Marlowe]

LBJ's complete body of work this year would be enough if the season ended today. Since it doesnt he really has to finish the season strong and at the very least match KD's output in their next match-up. That being said I do believe that LBJ's defensive play puts him in a class above KD this year. KD has improved but he isnt being asked to take on and perform well in multiple roles on that side of the ball like LBJ has been. You couldnt ask KD to handle Paul Gasol in the post and then move him onto the opposing teams PG when the matchups change. He's that that kind of player yet.