MLB Question , American League vs National League

dickysty · 06-18-2003, 03:41 PM

I've heard that there's different styles of play between the two leagues. I know about the DH rules and such, however what are the other difference? Please fill me in.

Maple Leafs · 06-18-2003, 03:44 PM

Quick answer: in the NL, you see more "small ball", i.e. bunting, stealing bases, moving the runner. The stereotype of AL strategy is to sit around and wait for the three-run homer.

And of course, NL fans will rush to tell you about the wonders of the double-switch, which they seem to think is really complicated and cool.

dickysty · 06-18-2003, 03:56 PM

One thing I've heard is that the National league Pitchers seem to be more aggressive, more fastballs etc. I'm thinking because of the "small ball" tactics, stealing bases and bunting.

Travis · 06-18-2003, 05:16 PM

Though in reality, even now, half of the NL is waiting for the 3 run HR. The way of the smallball seems to be less common nowadays, mostly amongst teams that just can't afford to have 2 or 3 40 HR guys on their teams.

Alan T · 06-18-2003, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Maple Leafs
Quick answer: in the NL, you see more "small ball", i.e. bunting, stealing bases, moving the runner. The stereotype of AL strategy is to sit around and wait for the three-run homer.

And of course, NL fans will rush to tell you about the wonders of the double-switch, which they seem to think is really complicated and cool.

But.... I love the double-switch

ISiddiqui · 06-18-2003, 05:40 PM

No, I love it more!

Noble_Platypus · 06-18-2003, 05:43 PM

I dont see how there can be any difference. With the way these greedy bastards switch teams and the way managers are hired and fired every player and manager has probably switched leagues 5 times, let alone teams in that league.

tucker342 · 06-18-2003, 06:05 PM

Every year, there is less and less difference between the two leagues, just for that reason... The only real difference now is the DH, besides that, there really aren't any anymore...

MrBug708 · 06-18-2003, 06:34 PM

Dodgers are the prototype NL team. All pitching and no offense

Franklinnoble · 06-18-2003, 06:37 PM

The DH rule sucks... but it will never go away. Too many old farts past their primes manage to stretch their careers after they're too out of shape to be effective in the field by sitting on the DH. The player's union would shit bricks if the AL got it together and actually abolished the DH.

Easy Mac · 06-18-2003, 06:39 PM

6 out of the past 10 years the AL leader has had more steals than the NL leader. The NL leader has led in Home Runs 4 out of the last 5 years.

Neuqua · 06-18-2003, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Easy Mac
6 out of the past 10 years the AL leader has had more steals than the NL leader. The NL leader has led in Home Runs 4 out of the last 5 years.

You can credit that to Sammy Sosa and Mark McGwire. I wonder what the numbers look like when the top 10 in each category are looked at.

Franklinnoble · 06-18-2003, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Neuqua
You can credit that to Sammy Sosa and Mark McGwire. I wonder what the numbers look like when the top 10 in each category are looked at.

Barry Bonds plays in the NL, too.

Easy Mac · 06-18-2003, 06:49 PM

Top 10 ever?

1. Hank Aaron 755
2. Babe Ruth 714
3. Willie Mays 660
4. Barry Bonds 613
5. Frank Robinson 586
6. Mark McGwire 583
7. Harmon Killebrew 573
8. Reggie Jackson 563
9. Mike Schmidt 548
10. Mickey Mantle 536

Aaron, Mays, Bonds and Schmidt are all NL guys (Aaron's 2 years don't count)

Ruth, Jackson and Mantle and Killebrew are AL guys (Ruth's year or 2 don't count)

Robinson and McGwire are even.

I'd say HR's are even.

ISiddiqui · 06-18-2003, 07:22 PM

Well, the thing to look at would be HRs per team to get a feel for which league has more Home Runs.

Easy Mac · 06-18-2003, 07:26 PM

The NL has led in home runs the past 5 years.

ISiddiqui · 06-18-2003, 07:28 PM

Per team?

Remember, the NL has 16 teams to the AL's 14.

ISiddiqui · 06-18-2003, 07:32 PM

I crunched the numbers.

2002:

NL: 162.1875 HR/Team
AL: 176 HR/Team

The AL has almost 15 more HR/Team than the NL. Now, that isn't a LOT, but the DH has to account for most of that, I'd think.

vtbub · 06-18-2003, 07:35 PM

NL pitching is better.

henry296 · 06-18-2003, 07:45 PM

Although the styles are similar, the National League manager has more strategic decisions to make because the pitcher hits. This leads to more pinch hitting and sacrifice bunts.

I agree that speed as a weapon is all but gone from both leagues.

Todd

Neuqua · 06-18-2003, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Franklinnoble
Barry Bonds plays in the NL, too.

Oops, someone had a brainfart.

VPI97 · 06-18-2003, 07:58 PM

NL = The National Pasttime
AL = Billy Bob's Softball Beer Bash

Blackadar · 06-18-2003, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by VPI97
NL = The National Pasttime
AL = Billy Bob's Softball Beer Bash

Baseball = dull.

NFL = The National Pastime.

ISiddiqui · 06-18-2003, 08:44 PM

Blackadar = dull

Baseball = The Great Game

Blackadar · 06-18-2003, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ISiddiqui
Blackadar = dull

Baseball = The Great Game

ISiddiqui = Can't prounce it.

NFL = Beats the panties off MLB

MLB players = wear panties

ISiddiqui · 06-18-2003, 08:56 PM

NFL = No Fun League (at least not as fun as baseball

)

MLB = Most Loved Brilliance

Blackadar · 06-18-2003, 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ISiddiqui
NFL = No Fun League (at least not as fun as baseball )

MLB = Most Loved Brilliance

I guess that's why the NFL is over twice as popular in surveys as baseball and ranks as the #1 sport in the USA.

Hell, baseball may slip below soccer in 10 years in popularity.

ISiddiqui · 06-18-2003, 09:03 PM

Wishful thinking on your part.

Who do more people know? Babe Ruth or Joe Montana?

Blackadar · 06-18-2003, 09:13 PM

Ummm...I don't think there's many people alive who could know Babe Ruth, so I'm sure more people know Joe Montana. He's living after all.

ISiddiqui · 06-18-2003, 09:37 PM

Know - To perceive as familiar; recognize

.

Dictionary.com, 6th definition of 'know'.

Alan T · 06-18-2003, 09:51 PM

Isiddiqui... goober. You left early!

ISiddiqui · 06-18-2003, 09:52 PM

Sorry, my AIM conked out!!

What was the final result?

Alan T · 06-18-2003, 10:05 PM

Well game 4 was perhaps the single worst managed game in baseball history for both teams...

Made me remember Russ Nixon fondly...

Other than that you missed a good series, tight the whole way.

ISiddiqui · 06-18-2003, 10:15 PM

Did you finish it tonight?

Blackadar · 06-18-2003, 10:19 PM

Actually, Isiddiqui, the reason why Baseball is so popular with purists and not as popular as the NFL with most is history.

Really, what baseball athlete in the past 25 years has really become an icon? MacGuire, that's about it. All baseball can really offer fans is history. Ruth - dead. Joe D - dead. Mantle - dead. Williams - dead. Great ghosts, but nothing more than ghosts.

The game itself has really been passed by. It's dull. The players whine. Strikes. Bug Selig. Corked bats. Juiced players. Juiced balls. Salaries. Expansion. Contraction. Poor TV ratings. Team inequities. And so on and so forth.

Do some of these problems exist in other sports? Yep. But baseball has clung so hard to its past it forgot the future. The NFL didn't and it's revenues, labor agreements, TV ratings, merchandise sales are all significantly higher.

In a Gallup poll conducted March 30-April 2, 2000, 33% of the public says that football is their favorite sport to watch. Basketball and baseball trail by considerable margins, favored by 16% and 13% of Americans, respectively. No other sport is favored by more than 5% of Americans: Ice hockey, golf and auto racing are each cited by 5% of the public, while figure skating is picked by 4%. Soccer, commonly known to be the most popular sport internationally, is favored by only 2% of Americans.

Cards4ever · 06-18-2003, 11:00 PM

Yep, gotta love the NFL, they changed their rules, so they could add more commercials to a game!

ISiddiqui · 06-19-2003, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Really, what baseball athlete in the past 25 years has really become an icon? MacGuire, that's about it.

Don't let the past week fool you, Sosa belongs on that list... and Bonds is also an icon (the best player since Mays, IMO).

It's still a great sport. Very fun to watch and get into. A game of great strategy. Of course, history plays a roll in it, but it just points to the greatness of the game, where you still have arguments over whether Bonds was better than Williams, but in any other sport, you really don't have that.

Bah, anyone that says the game is dull doesn't really know what they are talking about

.

korme · 06-19-2003, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by vtbub
NL pitching is better.

If you take out Cincinnati's staff.

Travis · 06-19-2003, 04:34 PM

Icons in the past 25 years?

Nolan Ryan, Randy Johnson, Pedro, Vlady in the making to name a few.

ISiddiqui · 06-19-2003, 04:37 PM

Travis, don't forget about Piazza, who could go down as the greatest hitting catcher in history... A-Rod, who could be the 2nd greatest shortstop... Clemens, who while a jerk, is a first ballot HOFer easily....

I see many icons, don't you?

clintl · 06-19-2003, 04:47 PM

Other icons of the past 25 years - George Brett, Mike Schmidt, Steve Carlton, Rod Carew, Tony Gwynn, Dennis Eckersley, Greg Maddux.

Franklinnoble · 06-19-2003, 04:52 PM

Can't believe two people listed about a dozen icons of the last 25 years and left Cal Ripken Jr. off the list.

For shame...

Alan T · 06-20-2003, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Franklinnoble
Can't believe two people listed about a dozen icons of the last 25 years and left Cal Ripken Jr. off the list.

For shame...

Cal Ripken Jr.... He had a famous brother named Billy.. right?

ISiddiqui · 06-20-2003, 10:53 AM

ALL ICON TEAM SINCE 1978!

C - Bench/Piazza
1B - McGwire
2B - Morgan/Biggio (?)
SS - A-Rod/Ripken/Ozzie
3B - Schmidt/Brett
RF - Sosa
CF - (early) Griffey, jr.
LF - "Bonds, Barry Bonds"

SP - Maddux
SP - Randy Johnson
SP - Pedro Martinez

RP - Eckersley
RP - Rivera

clintl · 06-20-2003, 11:00 AM

For relievers, I'd put Rollie Fingers on the list before Rivera. Fingers is in the HOF, and had the most recognizable mustache of the modern era as well. And Ryne Sandberg should go on the list at 2B before Biggio does.

ISiddiqui · 06-20-2003, 11:14 AM

Yeah, I guess Ryan was more popular, but Biggio is just better

. I know, I know... I shouldn't insert my own biases into an icon list, but if I didn't, then it wouldn't as fun

.

And I think Fingers and Rivera are tied. Riviera used to be known as 'untouchable' so that is why he got the nod.

Alan T · 06-20-2003, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ISiddiqui
ALL ICON TEAM SINCE 1978!

C - Bench/Piazza
1B - McGwire
2B - Morgan/Biggio (?)
SS - A-Rod/Ripken/Ozzie
3B - Schmidt/Brett
RF - Sosa
CF - (early) Griffey, jr.
LF - "Bonds, Barry Bonds"

SP - Maddux
SP - Randy Johnson
SP - Pedro Martinez

RP - Eckersley
RP - Rivera

I would have probably added Ivan Rodriguez to the catchers.. He has constantly been compared to great catchers throughout history.

at 2B, Sandberg is a must!

SP you probably have to include Clemens too. Even if you dont like him

ISiddiqui · 06-20-2003, 11:32 AM

I don't have to do anything!

Travis · 06-20-2003, 11:41 AM

At 2B, don't forget Alomar. He may have pulled a pretty disgusting stunt, but his ability and numbers are among the top at the position.

ISiddiqui · 06-20-2003, 11:47 AM

Yeah, but I think the 'stunt' was what prevents him from being an 'icon'. That's why I eliminated him actually.

06-18-2003, 05:16 PM	#4
Travis Pro Rookie Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Canada eh	Though in reality, even now, half of the NL is waiting for the 3 run HR. The way of the smallball seems to be less common nowadays, mostly amongst teams that just can't afford to have 2 or 3 40 HR guys on their teams. __________________ "I don't want to play golf. When I hit a ball, I want someone else to go chase it." - Rogers Hornsby

06-18-2003, 05:40 PM	#6
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	No, I love it more! __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams

06-18-2003, 05:43 PM	#7
Noble_Platypus College Prospect Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: York, Pa	I dont see how there can be any difference. With the way these greedy bastards switch teams and the way managers are hired and fired every player and manager has probably switched leagues 5 times, let alone teams in that league. __________________ We had the $240, we had to have the puddin'

06-18-2003, 07:22 PM	#15
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	Well, the thing to look at would be HRs per team to get a feel for which league has more Home Runs. __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams

06-18-2003, 07:28 PM	#17
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	Per team? Remember, the NL has 16 teams to the AL's 14. __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams

06-18-2003, 03:44 PM	#2
Maple Leafs Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2002	Quick answer: in the NL, you see more "small ball", i.e. bunting, stealing bases, moving the runner. The stereotype of AL strategy is to sit around and wait for the three-run homer. And of course, NL fans will rush to tell you about the wonders of the double-switch, which they seem to think is really complicated and cool.

06-18-2003, 03:56 PM	#3
dickysty n00b Join Date: Oct 2000	One thing I've heard is that the National league Pitchers seem to be more aggressive, more fastballs etc. I'm thinking because of the "small ball" tactics, stealing bases and bunting.

06-18-2003, 06:05 PM	#8
tucker342 Pro Starter Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Iowa City, IA	Every year, there is less and less difference between the two leagues, just for that reason... The only real difference now is the DH, besides that, there really aren't any anymore...

06-18-2003, 06:34 PM	#9
MrBug708 Head Coach Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Whittier	Dodgers are the prototype NL team. All pitching and no offense

06-18-2003, 06:37 PM	#10
Franklinnoble Banned Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Placerville, CA	The DH rule sucks... but it will never go away. Too many old farts past their primes manage to stretch their careers after they're too out of shape to be effective in the field by sitting on the DH. The player's union would shit bricks if the AL got it together and actually abolished the DH.

06-18-2003, 06:39 PM	#11
Easy Mac Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Here	6 out of the past 10 years the AL leader has had more steals than the NL leader. The NL leader has led in Home Runs 4 out of the last 5 years.

06-18-2003, 06:49 PM	#14
Easy Mac Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Here	Top 10 ever? 1. Hank Aaron 755 2. Babe Ruth 714 3. Willie Mays 660 4. Barry Bonds 613 5. Frank Robinson 586 6. Mark McGwire 583 7. Harmon Killebrew 573 8. Reggie Jackson 563 9. Mike Schmidt 548 10. Mickey Mantle 536 Aaron, Mays, Bonds and Schmidt are all NL guys (Aaron's 2 years don't count) Ruth, Jackson and Mantle and Killebrew are AL guys (Ruth's year or 2 don't count) Robinson and McGwire are even. I'd say HR's are even.

06-18-2003, 07:26 PM	#16
Easy Mac Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Here	The NL has led in home runs the past 5 years.

06-18-2003, 07:32 PM	#18
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	I crunched the numbers. 2002: NL: 162.1875 HR/Team AL: 176 HR/Team The AL has almost 15 more HR/Team than the NL. Now, that isn't a LOT, but the DH has to account for most of that, I'd think. __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams

06-18-2003, 07:35 PM	#19
vtbub College Starter Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Burlington, VT USA	NL pitching is better. __________________

06-18-2003, 07:45 PM	#20
henry296 College Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Pittsburgh, PA	Although the styles are similar, the National League manager has more strategic decisions to make because the pitcher hits. This leads to more pinch hitting and sacrifice bunts. I agree that speed as a weapon is all but gone from both leagues. Todd __________________ "It's a great day for hockey" - "Badger" Bob Johnson

06-18-2003, 07:58 PM	#22
VPI97 Hokie, Hokie, Hokie, Hi Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Kennesaw, GA	NL = The National Pasttime AL = Billy Bob's Softball Beer Bash __________________ CT & Jivin - "Surprisingly Entertaining"

06-18-2003, 08:44 PM	#24
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	Blackadar = dull Baseball = The Great Game __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams

06-18-2003, 08:56 PM	#26
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	NFL = No Fun League (at least not as fun as baseball ) MLB = Most Loved Brilliance __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams

06-18-2003, 09:03 PM	#28
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	Wishful thinking on your part. Who do more people know? Babe Ruth or Joe Montana? __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams

06-18-2003, 09:13 PM	#29
Blackadar Retired Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fantasyland	Ummm...I don't think there's many people alive who could know Babe Ruth, so I'm sure more people know Joe Montana. He's living after all.

06-18-2003, 09:37 PM	#30
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	Know - To perceive as familiar; recognize . Dictionary.com, 6th definition of 'know'. __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams

06-18-2003, 09:51 PM	#31
Alan T Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mass.	Isiddiqui... goober. You left early! __________________ Couch to ??k - From the couch to a Marathon in roughly 18 months.

06-18-2003, 09:52 PM	#32
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	Sorry, my AIM conked out!! What was the final result? __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams

06-18-2003, 10:05 PM	#33
Alan T Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mass.	Well game 4 was perhaps the single worst managed game in baseball history for both teams... Made me remember Russ Nixon fondly... Other than that you missed a good series, tight the whole way. __________________ Couch to ??k - From the couch to a Marathon in roughly 18 months.

06-18-2003, 10:15 PM	#34
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	Did you finish it tonight? __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams

06-18-2003, 10:19 PM	#35
Blackadar Retired Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fantasyland	Actually, Isiddiqui, the reason why Baseball is so popular with purists and not as popular as the NFL with most is history. Really, what baseball athlete in the past 25 years has really become an icon? MacGuire, that's about it. All baseball can really offer fans is history. Ruth - dead. Joe D - dead. Mantle - dead. Williams - dead. Great ghosts, but nothing more than ghosts. The game itself has really been passed by. It's dull. The players whine. Strikes. Bug Selig. Corked bats. Juiced players. Juiced balls. Salaries. Expansion. Contraction. Poor TV ratings. Team inequities. And so on and so forth. Do some of these problems exist in other sports? Yep. But baseball has clung so hard to its past it forgot the future. The NFL didn't and it's revenues, labor agreements, TV ratings, merchandise sales are all significantly higher. In a Gallup poll conducted March 30-April 2, 2000, 33% of the public says that football is their favorite sport to watch. Basketball and baseball trail by considerable margins, favored by 16% and 13% of Americans, respectively. No other sport is favored by more than 5% of Americans: Ice hockey, golf and auto racing are each cited by 5% of the public, while figure skating is picked by 4%. Soccer, commonly known to be the most popular sport internationally, is favored by only 2% of Americans.

06-18-2003, 11:00 PM	#36
Cards4ever College Benchwarmer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Eagan, MN	Yep, gotta love the NFL, they changed their rules, so they could add more commercials to a game! __________________ Cardinal Baseball & Gopher Hockey, what else do you need?

06-19-2003, 04:34 PM	#39
Travis Pro Rookie Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Canada eh	Icons in the past 25 years? Nolan Ryan, Randy Johnson, Pedro, Vlady in the making to name a few. __________________ "I don't want to play golf. When I hit a ball, I want someone else to go chase it." - Rogers Hornsby

06-19-2003, 04:37 PM	#40
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	Travis, don't forget about Piazza, who could go down as the greatest hitting catcher in history... A-Rod, who could be the 2nd greatest shortstop... Clemens, who while a jerk, is a first ballot HOFer easily.... I see many icons, don't you? __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams

06-19-2003, 04:47 PM	#41
clintl College Starter Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Davis, CA	Other icons of the past 25 years - George Brett, Mike Schmidt, Steve Carlton, Rod Carew, Tony Gwynn, Dennis Eckersley, Greg Maddux.

06-19-2003, 04:52 PM	#42
Franklinnoble Banned Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Placerville, CA	Can't believe two people listed about a dozen icons of the last 25 years and left Cal Ripken Jr. off the list. For shame...

06-20-2003, 10:53 AM	#44
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	ALL ICON TEAM SINCE 1978! C - Bench/Piazza 1B - McGwire 2B - Morgan/Biggio (?) SS - A-Rod/Ripken/Ozzie 3B - Schmidt/Brett RF - Sosa CF - (early) Griffey, jr. LF - "Bonds, Barry Bonds" SP - Maddux SP - Randy Johnson SP - Pedro Martinez RP - Eckersley RP - Rivera __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams

06-20-2003, 11:00 AM	#45
clintl College Starter Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Davis, CA	For relievers, I'd put Rollie Fingers on the list before Rivera. Fingers is in the HOF, and had the most recognizable mustache of the modern era as well. And Ryne Sandberg should go on the list at 2B before Biggio does.

06-20-2003, 11:14 AM	#46
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	Yeah, I guess Ryan was more popular, but Biggio is just better . I know, I know... I shouldn't insert my own biases into an icon list, but if I didn't, then it wouldn't as fun . And I think Fingers and Rivera are tied. Riviera used to be known as 'untouchable' so that is why he got the nod. __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams