Brand-Naming Your Kids

Ksyrup · 11-12-2003, 02:57 PM

We're getting to the point of talking about names for the bun in the oven (which we should know the sex of by mid-December), but since "ESPN" is already taken, I guess we'll have to come up with something more original.

A story about some f**cked up people...

Brand Names ... for Kids?
Updated: Wednesday, Nov. 12, 2003 - 4:44 AM

WASHINGTON - Baby, baby. What's in a name?

Years ago, it used to be people named their kids after religious figures and saints.

Or they named them after dad or grandma or mom's favorite aunt.

Forget Mike or John.

Today, the latest trend in baby names takes pop-culture to a new level, naming kids after consumer products.

Yes, parents are naming their children after cars, clothing, hair dye and even canned peas.

Infiniti. Celica. Armani. Timberland. Nautica. L'Oreal. Del Monte.

Those are some of the names that Cleveland Evans, a psychology professor at Nebraska's Bellevue University and a member of the American Name Society, found when he studied Social Security records for the year 2000.

According to a web article on World Magazine's site, Evans also found two separate parents, one in Texas and one in Michigan, who named their sons ESPN after the sports cable network.

If that's not bad enough.

One WTOP staffer has talked with teen girls named Nonchalant and Unnecessary.

Imagine introducing yourself at a job interview with those names.

And, no kidding, another staffer has even heard of one named Syphilis.

Boy, you can bet she'll have a hard time getting a date.

(Copyright 2003 by WTOP. All Rights Reserved.)

Franklin · 11-12-2003, 02:59 PM

What a stupid idea.

I mean, I'd at least want some money for naming my kid after a company or product.

Ksyrup · 11-12-2003, 03:01 PM

I know. Just think how much I could get for naming my son "Tommy."

mckerney · 11-12-2003, 03:03 PM

bigdawg2003 · 11-12-2003, 03:05 PM

Seven

Ksyrup · 11-12-2003, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mckerney
Soda

The wife and I would fight over that one. I'd want to call...uh...it...Pop.

QuikSand · 11-12-2003, 03:06 PM

This issue was going around my cirle of friendsa year or two ago, when one couple was expecting.

I offered to personally put up $5,000 if they really went with "Chips Ahoy" McCoy. It would have been money well spent.

Buzzbee · 11-12-2003, 03:07 PM

I think I'll name my next kid Trojan Buster.

Or perhaps Stayfree Maxipad if it's a girl. Of course we'll just call her Maxie, or Max for short.

QuikSand · 11-12-2003, 03:07 PM

I once had a student whose given name was Mary, but who went exclusively by L'Oreal. I guess she was worth it. ::rimshot::

sabotai · 11-12-2003, 03:11 PM

*shakes head*

*reads article again*

*sighs and shakes head*

Ksyrup · 11-12-2003, 03:12 PM

Seriously, though, who would name their kid Unnecessary? I mean, I have a cousin who was jokingly nicknamed Boo-boo (because he was a mistake), but that name kinda left him as a toddler. It's quite another thing to have to write "Unnecessary" on your college applications.

This one sounds like it is ripe for snopes material, but I had a friend in college who says a friend of his was a substitute teacher in the Orlando area and had a girl in one of his classess named Shithead - pronounced "shi - THADE." I've never quite believed it, but I wouldn't doubt it, either.

QuikSand · 11-12-2003, 03:23 PM

The urban legends in this regard usually have at least a trace of classism or racism involved... things like kids being named "fe-MAH-lee" (since it was already on the birth certificate, and to the mother this was a perfectly acceptable name) or twins being named "Lemonjello" and "Oranjello." Most dedicated followers of urban myths like to see some element of either mockery or moralism in their preferred pass-alongs, and making fun of other types of people's willingness to use unusual names fits the bill pretty well.

Buzzbee · 11-12-2003, 03:27 PM

Yes, I think Shithead, Lemonjello, and Oranjello all attended several schools near where I live.

korme · 11-12-2003, 03:28 PM

What if you named your kid Mistake?

Ksyrup · 11-12-2003, 03:28 PM

"I'm sorry, but you must be sadly mistaken."

"Yes, I am!"

heybrad · 11-12-2003, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ksyrup
Shithead - pronounced "shi - THADE

Reminds me of the Saturday Night Live episode where Nicholas Cage is named Asswipe - pronounced Oz Wee Pay.

ice4277 · 11-12-2003, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ksyrup
This one sounds like it is ripe for snopes material, but I had a friend in college who says a friend of his was a substitute teacher in the Orlando area and had a girl in one of his classess named Shithead - pronounced "shi - THADE." I've never quite believed it, but I wouldn't doubt it, either.

Funny you mention this; a friend of mine's sister told me that she had a kid in class named 'Shithead' as well. Keep in mind, she said the person was in her class, and she is not the type of person who would make something like this up.

Qwikshot · 11-12-2003, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ksyrup
The wife and I would fight over that one. I'd want to call...uh...it...Pop.

Sodapop was a character name in S.E. Hinton's "Outsiders", his younger brother was Ponyboy.

Now if you called your kid, Coke or Pepsi...ick.

Ksyrup · 11-12-2003, 04:00 PM

Imagine the inferiority complex if you named him "Diet Rite."

Although Shasta is kinda cool...

cuervo72 · 11-12-2003, 04:06 PM

Shasta McNasty

(also sounds like a pirate name)

tucker342 · 11-12-2003, 04:11 PM

:Shakes head:

I feel sorry for these kids.... They must have very sick parents....

sooner333 · 11-12-2003, 04:24 PM

Lemonjello and Oranjello make an appearance in a Dan Jenkins novel. They are twin running backs, I believe. TCU recruited two twins also in the book Avis and Budget. It's all fiction though.

Neuqua · 11-12-2003, 04:46 PM

I actually like the name Armani

thesloppy · 11-12-2003, 04:52 PM

I have a couple of friends who claim to have gone to school with a boy named "Cocaine Johnson", but they have yet to offer up any evidence.

Franklin · 11-12-2003, 04:56 PM

I don't know about product endorsements, but I think it'd be funny if kids had names like Cornholio...

Not my kids, of course. Just someone else's kids.

VPI97 · 11-12-2003, 05:01 PM

I went to middle school with a kid named Nike. It was spelled like the shoe, but he wanted it pronounced like 'Mike'...but with an 'N', of course. I think that was a result from years of teasing.

Ksyrup · 11-12-2003, 05:02 PM

Did he sign his homework with a swoosh?

Airhog · 11-12-2003, 05:22 PM

I remember few years back the video game Turok was offering up some cash to anyone who would change their name

CamEdwards · 11-12-2003, 05:31 PM

I was a "principal for a day" today, and the school secretary's name was Chiquita.

Chiquita Johnson. Owner of the finest butt I've ever seen on a school secretary.

mckerney · 11-12-2003, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CamEdwards
I was a "principal for a day" today, and the school secretary's name was Chiquita.

Chiquita Johnson. Owner of the finest butt I've ever seen on a school secretary.

So, when shoudl be be able to hear the details of the sexual harrassment suit?

Franklin · 11-12-2003, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CamEdwards
I was a "principal for a day" today, and the school secretary's name was Chiquita.

Chiquita Johnson. Owner of the finest butt I've ever seen on a school secretary.

Chiquita Johnson... a phallic name if there ever was one...

Draft Dodger · 11-12-2003, 07:34 PM

they should force the parents to change their names to Fuckheaded Parent or something.

although, I did choose the name Graham with the thought that the people who make Graham Crackers might want to send a little dough our way

korme · 11-12-2003, 07:42 PM

One of my friend is Dave and he like's pale ale. He also happens to be the only indian-american that I am friends with as Milford is not too diverse.

Anyway, we were looking at some beer online and there is a beer called Indian Dave's Pale Ale. Our jaws all dropped and we all laughed.

Interesting, no?

Easy Mac · 11-12-2003, 07:51 PM

I used to know a kid in my middle school named Cocaine Cante. He used to play against me in little league baseball. Hell of an athlete, but you really don't have to wonder why he never made it out of middle school (rumor had it that his sister was named marijuana, but we never tried to confirm it)

There was also a kid named Bone in my school, it was his real name.

Easy Mac · 11-12-2003, 07:53 PM

dola, we also had ROTC officers that were Colonel Wood and Major Knox (I guess Wood had to be a major at some point... Know Wood... laugh.)

oykib · 11-12-2003, 07:54 PM

In Japan, it's illegal to give your kids jackass names. The government just won't let you do it. I read an article about it in the Japan Times about it a year or so ago.

Some damn knuckleheads wanted to name their son Akuma-- I guess after the SF character. But that means 'demon' in Japan. They went to register the name at their city office and were told no dice.

Bonegavel · 11-12-2003, 08:37 PM

I went to register Fritz and they wrote down Anal Warts. I was relieved, as Fritz would have caused severe beatings for junior in school.

Craptacular · 11-12-2003, 09:53 PM

I think I've relayed this story to the board before, but it fits well. A friend of mine had a temp job adding the names of newborns to insurance databases, etc. One day, he told me about a great one he had gotten that day.

"Congratulations Mrs. Jones on your new baby girl. Have you got a name picked out?"

"Yeah Doc, I'm naming her after my two favorite things in life."

Marijuana.

Pepsi.

Jones.

Buccaneer · 11-12-2003, 10:01 PM

I still prefer the names within my generation: Starshine, Windstar, Sun, Moon, etc.

Buzzbee · 11-12-2003, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Buccaneer
I still prefer the names within my generation: Starshine, Windstar, Sun, Moon, etc.

Bucc - But in YOUR generation God was still naming his creations.

CamEdwards · 11-12-2003, 10:57 PM

ouch. I was going to make a cro-magnon joke, but you went back even further.

wbonnell · 11-12-2003, 11:01 PM

I wish our culture valued meaningful names. My wife and I are actually considering waiting a few weeks to name our 3rd boy (due in February). Well, okay. *I* am considering it.

Chief Rum · 11-12-2003, 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CamEdwards
ouch. I was going to make a cro-magnon joke, but you went back even further.

Technically, you would have gone back further than he did. The Bible seems pretty set the world began 7000 years ago or so, when God would have been naming things. Cro-Magnons were around some 10,000 years before that.

CR

bionicgrov03 · 11-12-2003, 11:44 PM

couldn't hesitate any longer.

by the way, these guys are hilarious.

http://www.rock103.com/drakeandzeke/_bbn/

Raven Hawk · 11-13-2003, 12:33 AM

Priceless:

"The Bad Baby Name for 10/16/02 is: Kalamatitty Hamilton"

sterlingice · 11-13-2003, 12:54 AM

If I ran the country with an iron fist like I really want to, these are the types of people who would be drug out into the street and hung for all to see. Then their children would be renamed and the whole incident never spoken of again. Hmmm... it's probably good I don't rule this country with an iron fist.

I can almost understand "Infiniti. Celica. Armani. Timberland. Nautica. L'Oreal. Del Monte. " Well, those last two are suspect, but if you name your kid Syphilis, you deserve to be infected with it. Nonchalant and Unnecessary? We deem your life as such and claim it as our own. Did I mention that if I ran this country with an iron fist, we'd have a giant salt mine or some sort of mine where these parents would be forced to work. Both parents. I mean, if you can't keep your spouse from naming your progeny things like this, then you, too, deserve punishment. Only, you get the equivalent of minimum security giant slave mine while they are forced to work in federal pound-me-in-the-ass salt mine.

Oh, and heybrad, I actually thought of that SNL reference when I saw the article but couldn't think of the context. Thx

SI

JeeberD · 11-13-2003, 01:10 AM

Didn't there used to be a major league pitcher (in the seventies I think) whose last name was Lemengello or something like that? I think it was Mark Lemengello. Name was pronounced just like the dessert...

yabanci · 11-13-2003, 01:23 AM

Talking about brand naming your kids, how about Paris Hilton. She's lucky her father didn't own Motel 6.

sterlingice · 11-13-2003, 03:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JeeberD
Didn't there used to be a major league pitcher (in the seventies I think) whose last name was Lemengello or something like that? I think it was Mark Lemengello. Name was pronounced just like the dessert...

Mark Lemongello

Got his spelling right on the first try even. The name sounded familiar but I can't remember from where- did he do some announcing or something because he would have been before my time and while I could spout of all kinds of utility player and nobody names from the late 80s through now, I was born in his last year in the majors so I would have had to know him from somewhere else.

SI

Marc Vaughan · 11-13-2003, 04:01 AM

Hmmm I can't speak - my youngest son is named 'Keegan' after Kevin Keegan (my wifes choice of name I might add, I just ok'd it .... she's a huge Man City fan).

11-12-2003, 03:01 PM	#3
Ksyrup This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off. Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: In Absentia	I know. Just think how much I could get for naming my son "Tommy." __________________ M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete."

11-12-2003, 03:05 PM	#5
bigdawg2003 High School Varsity Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Austin, Texas, USA	Seven __________________ I didn't even know Elvis was from Memphis. I thought he was from Tennessee.

11-12-2003, 03:07 PM	#8
Buzzbee College Starter Join Date: Jun 2002	I think I'll name my next kid Trojan Buster. Or perhaps Stayfree Maxipad if it's a girl. Of course we'll just call her Maxie, or Max for short. __________________ Ability is what you're capable of doing. Motivation determines what you do. Attitude determines how well you do it. - Lou Holtz

11-12-2003, 03:12 PM	#11
Ksyrup This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off. Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: In Absentia	Seriously, though, who would name their kid Unnecessary? I mean, I have a cousin who was jokingly nicknamed Boo-boo (because he was a mistake), but that name kinda left him as a toddler. It's quite another thing to have to write "Unnecessary" on your college applications. This one sounds like it is ripe for snopes material, but I had a friend in college who says a friend of his was a substitute teacher in the Orlando area and had a girl in one of his classess named Shithead - pronounced "shi - THADE." I've never quite believed it, but I wouldn't doubt it, either. __________________ M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete." Last edited by Ksyrup : 11-12-2003 at 03:13 PM.

11-12-2003, 03:27 PM	#13
Buzzbee College Starter Join Date: Jun 2002	Yes, I think Shithead, Lemonjello, and Oranjello all attended several schools near where I live. __________________ Ability is what you're capable of doing. Motivation determines what you do. Attitude determines how well you do it. - Lou Holtz

11-12-2003, 02:59 PM	#2
Franklin Banned Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Placerville, CA	What a stupid idea. I mean, I'd at least want some money for naming my kid after a company or product.

11-12-2003, 03:03 PM	#4
mckerney Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000	Soda

11-12-2003, 03:06 PM	#7
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	This issue was going around my cirle of friendsa year or two ago, when one couple was expecting. I offered to personally put up $5,000 if they really went with "Chips Ahoy" McCoy. It would have been money well spent.

11-12-2003, 03:11 PM	#10
sabotai General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: The Satellite of Love	shakes head reads article again sighs and shakes head

11-12-2003, 03:23 PM	#12
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	The urban legends in this regard usually have at least a trace of classism or racism involved... things like kids being named "fe-MAH-lee" (since it was already on the birth certificate, and to the mother this was a perfectly acceptable name) or twins being named "Lemonjello" and "Oranjello." Most dedicated followers of urban myths like to see some element of either mockery or moralism in their preferred pass-alongs, and making fun of other types of people's willingness to use unusual names fits the bill pretty well.

11-12-2003, 03:28 PM	#14
korme Go Reds Join Date: May 2001 Location: Bloodbuzz Ohio	What if you named your kid Mistake?

11-12-2003, 04:00 PM	#19
Ksyrup This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off. Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: In Absentia	Imagine the inferiority complex if you named him "Diet Rite." Although Shasta is kinda cool... __________________ M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete."

11-12-2003, 04:06 PM	#20
cuervo72 Head Coach Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Maryland	Shasta McNasty (also sounds like a pirate name) __________________ null

11-12-2003, 04:11 PM	#21
tucker342 Pro Starter Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Iowa City, IA	:Shakes head: I feel sorry for these kids.... They must have very sick parents....

11-12-2003, 04:24 PM	#22
sooner333 College Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Norman, OK	Lemonjello and Oranjello make an appearance in a Dan Jenkins novel. They are twin running backs, I believe. TCU recruited two twins also in the book Avis and Budget. It's all fiction though.

11-12-2003, 04:46 PM	#23
Neuqua Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago, Ill	I actually like the name Armani __________________ Our Deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourselves, 'Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous?' Actually, who are you not to be?

11-12-2003, 04:52 PM	#24
thesloppy Pro Starter Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: PDX	I have a couple of friends who claim to have gone to school with a boy named "Cocaine Johnson", but they have yet to offer up any evidence. __________________ Last edited by thesloppy : Today at 05:35 PM.

11-12-2003, 04:56 PM	#25
Franklin Banned Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Placerville, CA	I don't know about product endorsements, but I think it'd be funny if kids had names like Cornholio... Not my kids, of course. Just someone else's kids.

11-12-2003, 05:01 PM	#26
VPI97 Hokie, Hokie, Hokie, Hi Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Kennesaw, GA	I went to middle school with a kid named Nike. It was spelled like the shoe, but he wanted it pronounced like 'Mike'...but with an 'N', of course. I think that was a result from years of teasing. __________________ CT & Jivin - "Surprisingly Entertaining"

11-12-2003, 05:02 PM	#27
Ksyrup This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off. Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: In Absentia	Did he sign his homework with a swoosh? __________________ M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete."

11-12-2003, 05:22 PM	#28
Airhog Captain Obvious Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Norman, Oklahoma	I remember few years back the video game Turok was offering up some cash to anyone who would change their name __________________ Thread Killer extraordinaire Yay! its football season once again!

11-12-2003, 05:31 PM	#29
CamEdwards Stadium Announcer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Burke, VA	I was a "principal for a day" today, and the school secretary's name was Chiquita. Chiquita Johnson. Owner of the finest butt I've ever seen on a school secretary. __________________ I don't want the world. I just want your half.

11-12-2003, 07:34 PM	#32
Draft Dodger Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Keene, NH	they should force the parents to change their names to Fuckheaded Parent or something. although, I did choose the name Graham with the thought that the people who make Graham Crackers might want to send a little dough our way __________________ Mile High Hockey

11-12-2003, 07:42 PM	#33
korme Go Reds Join Date: May 2001 Location: Bloodbuzz Ohio	One of my friend is Dave and he like's pale ale. He also happens to be the only indian-american that I am friends with as Milford is not too diverse. Anyway, we were looking at some beer online and there is a beer called Indian Dave's Pale Ale. Our jaws all dropped and we all laughed. Interesting, no?

11-12-2003, 07:51 PM	#34
Easy Mac Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Here	I used to know a kid in my middle school named Cocaine Cante. He used to play against me in little league baseball. Hell of an athlete, but you really don't have to wonder why he never made it out of middle school (rumor had it that his sister was named marijuana, but we never tried to confirm it) There was also a kid named Bone in my school, it was his real name.

11-12-2003, 07:53 PM	#35
Easy Mac Registered User Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Here	dola, we also had ROTC officers that were Colonel Wood and Major Knox (I guess Wood had to be a major at some point... Know Wood... laugh.)

11-12-2003, 07:54 PM	#36
oykib College Starter Join Date: Oct 2000	In Japan, it's illegal to give your kids jackass names. The government just won't let you do it. I read an article about it in the Japan Times about it a year or so ago. Some damn knuckleheads wanted to name their son Akuma-- I guess after the SF character. But that means 'demon' in Japan. They went to register the name at their city office and were told no dice.

11-12-2003, 08:37 PM	#37
Bonegavel Awaiting Further Instructions... Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Macungie, PA	I went to register Fritz and they wrote down Anal Warts. I was relieved, as Fritz would have caused severe beatings for junior in school. __________________

11-12-2003, 09:53 PM	#38
Craptacular College Starter Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: The Mad City, WI	I think I've relayed this story to the board before, but it fits well. A friend of mine had a temp job adding the names of newborns to insurance databases, etc. One day, he told me about a great one he had gotten that day. "Congratulations Mrs. Jones on your new baby girl. Have you got a name picked out?" "Yeah Doc, I'm naming her after my two favorite things in life." Marijuana. Pepsi. Jones.

11-12-2003, 10:01 PM	#39
Buccaneer Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Colorado	I still prefer the names within my generation: Starshine, Windstar, Sun, Moon, etc.

11-12-2003, 10:57 PM	#41
CamEdwards Stadium Announcer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Burke, VA	ouch. I was going to make a cro-magnon joke, but you went back even further. __________________ I don't want the world. I just want your half.

11-12-2003, 11:01 PM	#42
wbonnell College Prospect Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Round Rock TX	I wish our culture valued meaningful names. My wife and I are actually considering waiting a few weeks to name our 3rd boy (due in February). Well, okay. I am considering it. Last edited by wbonnell : 11-12-2003 at 11:02 PM.

11-12-2003, 11:44 PM	#44
bionicgrov03 n00b Join Date: Dec 2001	couldn't hesitate any longer. by the way, these guys are hilarious. http://www.rock103.com/drakeandzeke/_bbn/

11-13-2003, 12:33 AM	#45
Raven Hawk College Starter Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Thunderdome	Priceless: "The Bad Baby Name for 10/16/02 is: Kalamatitty Hamilton" __________________ Owner of The Shreveport Pride in The CFL

11-13-2003, 12:54 AM	#46
sterlingice Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Back in Houston!	If I ran the country with an iron fist like I really want to, these are the types of people who would be drug out into the street and hung for all to see. Then their children would be renamed and the whole incident never spoken of again. Hmmm... it's probably good I don't rule this country with an iron fist. I can almost understand "Infiniti. Celica. Armani. Timberland. Nautica. L'Oreal. Del Monte. " Well, those last two are suspect, but if you name your kid Syphilis, you deserve to be infected with it. Nonchalant and Unnecessary? We deem your life as such and claim it as our own. Did I mention that if I ran this country with an iron fist, we'd have a giant salt mine or some sort of mine where these parents would be forced to work. Both parents. I mean, if you can't keep your spouse from naming your progeny things like this, then you, too, deserve punishment. Only, you get the equivalent of minimum security giant slave mine while they are forced to work in federal pound-me-in-the-ass salt mine. Oh, and heybrad, I actually thought of that SNL reference when I saw the article but couldn't think of the context. Thx SI __________________ Houston Hippopotami, III.3: 20th Anniversary Thread - All former HT players are encouraged to check it out! Janos: "Only America could produce an imbecile of your caliber!" Freakazoid: "That's because we make lots of things better than other people!" Last edited by sterlingice : 11-13-2003 at 01:00 AM.