The Ultimate in Formulaic Songs...

[Ksyrup]

A few days ago the "most overrated song of all time" thread turned to a discussion of Pearl Jam, and I mentioned how I felt that they had applied the Jeremy Formula to Don't Call Me Daughter, and that it had basically turned me off of the band. A number of bands do it, either purposely or just because that's the way they write their music, but overall, I tend to believe it is somewhat related to the band's (or writer's ) creativity (or lack thereof).

Well, even given my feelings on that subject, nothing quite prepared me for what I heard here:

hxxp://tinyurl.com/29ql7

In the left speaker is Nickelback's new single, and in the right ear is How You Remind Me, a song I'm sure many of you have heard 1,001 too many times. Well, if you hear their new single, you'll be hearing it again. :o

Hey, at least they had the decency to rip themselves off, instead of someone else...

[rkmsuf]

Go with what you know...

[Alf]

Ksyrup : Could you develop the "Jeremy Formula" ?

[sachmo71]

Originally Posted by Alf

Ksyrup : Could you develop the "Jeremy Formula" ?

There is a cup of suck in there somewhere.

[Ksyrup]

Since I'm running out the door, I'll just cut-and-paste what I posted in the original thread:


It's not so much the music that is similar, but the overall feel of the song and particularly, the manner in which the lyrics are written - the same short phrasing to describe the "action" - that bothers me. It's written precisely like Jeremy. It usually takes bands years to lose the creative drive to do something new, before they resort to that (see Metallica, King Nothing = Enter Sandman, and Queensryche, nearly every song on Empire = I Don't Believe In Love).

[Fidatelo]

The combo sounds better than either of the originals... sounds 'fuller'

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

In the left speaker is Nickelback's new single, and in the right ear is How You Remind Me, a song I'm sure many of you have heard 1,001 too many times. Well, if you hear their new single, you'll be hearing it again. :o

Hey, at least they had the decency to rip themselves off, instead of someone else...

I was thinking this as soon as I heard their song on the radio, too.

[cody8200]

Wow, I cant imagine insulting Jeremy. I absolutely love the song. Dont call me daughter isnt too bad either. I would have to say I totally disagree with you about how the words sound similiar. Not if it was the music I could understand your argument but I'm just not feeling anything at all when I listen to the songs lyrics. I really like Pearl Jam and compared to stuff made now days by people their music is golden.

[Hurst2112]

That is some funny sounding shit! It actually sounded kinda cool. You are right though, talk about opeing up the "hit package".

I am sad to say that I have an autographed Nickelback CD. They came to our studio and did an accoustic thing. I got to engineer it. They were nice guys but I lost respect for them after they said that even though they were from Canada, they weren't real big Rush fans. Bastards.

How many creed songs can you do this with? Hehe.

One things for sure, both NBack and creed have pretty damn good sounding albums. They spend a lot of money on production...and for the most part, their albums sound full, thick and clear.

That doesn't always matter though. If that was the case, the beatles albums wouldn't sell a lick.

[clintl]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Hey, at least they had the decency to rip themselves off, instead of someone else...

KC and the Sunshine Band made a whole career out of ripping themselves off.

[zums]

Is ripping yourself off such a bad thing?? I mean, they were creative enough to come up with the original hit in the first place, it was a huge huge song, so why not go back to the well? Eventually the fans will get sick of it or they will feel the need to be more creative, but in the meantime why mess with success? If they were a business (and a band in a way IS a business) they would be doing all they could to maintain success and keep making money. This is the same concept just in another area.

-zums

Edit: Forgot to mention..... who's to say these bands dont create some of the most original stuff ever and just dont put it on a cd? They put the songs on a cd that will sell the best, and if they want create whatever else in the meantime they can satisfy their creative interests that way.

[Axxon]

Originally Posted by clintl

KC and the Sunshine Band made a whole career out of ripping themselves off.

Yep, and that's the way, uh huh, uh huh, they liked it.

[zums]

Dola -

by the way i found tha link very funny

-zums

[Ksyrup]

That's fine. They can consider themselves great businessmen, and I can consider them a crappy band.

[Axxon]

Originally Posted by zums

Dola -

by the way i found tha link very funny

-zums

Hah! Dola attempt foiled by crappy joke.

[zums]

Hah! Dola attempt foiled by crappy joke.

Not funny I think that was my first attempt EVER at a dola.........

-zums

[Axxon]

Originally Posted by zums

Not funny I think that was my first attempt EVER at a dola.........

-zums

Well I didn't know. A little hint though, when going for the dola it's better to cut your response time to under 4 minutes.

[zums]

Originally posted by Axxon

Well I didn't know. A little hint though, when going for the dola it's better to cut your response time to under 4 minutes.

lol yeah i know just a sign of how my day has been going....

Originally posted by Ksyrup

That's fine. They can consider themselves great businessmen, and I can consider them a crappy band.

I dont care whether you think they are a great band or a crappy band, I'm just saying you shouldnt dismiss them automatically just because a few of their songs sound alike or use the same "formula."

-zums

[Ksyrup]

I can dismiss them for precisely that reason, since I believe that shows a lack of creativity, and I like to listen to creative music. Selling records and being creative don't have to be mutually exclusive.

[zums]

So none of the "creative" bands that you like have songs that sound alike, or use the same tempo, harmonies, etc. ? I find that hard to believe.

-zums

[Hurst2112]

I told myself in highschool that I wasn't going to be in music for the money. I wanted a career in it for the love of music and the joy I got from it.

Anybody want to borrow me a few dollars?

[Hurst2112]

Originally Posted by zums

So none of the "creative" bands that you like have songs that sound alike, or use the same tempo, harmonies, etc. ? I find that hard to believe.

-zums

There are only so many scales, notes, rests and tempos.

I think with bands like the ones we are talking about, there is a lack of drive and potential. That is what pisses me off.

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by zums

So none of the "creative" bands that you like have songs that sound alike, or use the same tempo, harmonies, etc. ? I find that hard to believe.

-zums

Of course every band has their own "sound." But that's different from writing two different songs that are essentially the same song, with the same structure and tempo.

Look, I'll admit that it's easier to dismiss a band like Nickelback for something like this because there's nothing else about them that interests me. I've noticed some tendencies in the bands I like and I'm not suggesting that there's something wrong with a band having a clearly recognizable sound or trademark riff or something along those lines, but to me, this goes beyond those kinds of things.

[skrath]

The song in the left channel has clearly been edited and sped up (it's most noticeable in the verse), most likely with some sort of time-stretching pitch program. So, even though they're nearly similar, they're not exactly the same.

Even so, Nickelback sucks.

[JAG]

Meet the new song...

Same as the old song...

[MikeVic]

When I first heard a couple of Nickelback songs, I liked them. Then I listed to their entire album, and each song somehow seemed to sound the same. I guess this is proof that they do, and it's not just me.