Nextel Cup over; Busch wins the title

SunDancer · 11-21-2004, 04:33 PM

Good race. Kurt Busch takes the title. I wanted to see Gordon win it, but didn't.

JonInMiddleGA · 11-21-2004, 04:37 PM

I gotta give 'em that, it was a darned good race. I was hoping to see a miracle finish to give Martin a title, but of the three who had a realistic chance today, I would have hoped for Busch only because I'd rather see Roush get a title than any of the other options.

The_herd · 11-21-2004, 04:39 PM

Congrats to Busch, but I'm still not sold on the Chase for the Cup system. The scoring system is still in need of an overhaul. Busch won only 3 races this year and finished in the top 5 ten times. Jimmy Johnson dominated most of the season and Gordon was damn good as well. As far as dominance goes, Busch was probably the 4th best driver this season.

If they are going to make these last 10 races the most important, then actually winning those races should have a bigger impact in the points race than they do.

SunDancer · 11-21-2004, 04:39 PM

I was alittle pissed at Nemecheck (?). Kinda lost alittle respect for him. Gordon got a great start of that start, and might of had a shot.

The_herd · 11-21-2004, 04:41 PM

Gordon's pass of Nemecheck when was being an ass and trying to block him was one of the most impressive I've seen.

SunDancer · 11-21-2004, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_herd

Congrats to Busch, but I'm still not sold on the Chase for the Cup system. The scoring system is still in need of an overhaul. Busch won only 3 races this year and finished in the top 5 ten times. Jimmy Johnson dominated most of the season and Gordon was damn good as well. As far as dominance goes, Busch was probably the 4th best driver this season.

If they are going to make these last 10 races the most important, then actually winning those races should have a bigger impact in the points race than they do.

Yeah, I don't like the points system. Four drivers in it for the last race, I don't know. Busch won only three races, but Keneseth won only one last year.

JonInMiddleGA · 11-21-2004, 04:43 PM

Just piling on, I don't like the new points system either, but there sure doesn't seem to be much I can do about it, so I kinda had to judge today on what is was, knowwhutImean?

SunDancer · 11-21-2004, 04:51 PM

Just curious, under the old system, what would be the standings?

Draft Dodger · 11-21-2004, 05:17 PM

loved the race, loved the season, love the new scoring system.

JonInMiddleGA · 11-21-2004, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SunDancer

Just curious, under the old system, what would be the standings?

If the site (www.jayski.com) I'm looking at is updated (as it indicates) then:
1) Gordon
2) Johnson -47
3) Earnhardt, Jr. -173
4) Busch -247
5) Stewart - 341
6) Martin -445
7) McMurray -445

Eagle458 · 11-21-2004, 07:51 PM

I never thought the day would come when I would be cheering for
Gordon but I was cause I can't stand Kurt Dumbo Busch.

Does anyone like him? I mean really..Everone I've talked to hate him.

Franklinnoble · 11-21-2004, 08:03 PM

Bah. Rednecks driving around in a circle. I'd rather watch pro wrestling.

EagleFan · 11-21-2004, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franklinnoble

Bah. Rednecks driving around in a circle. I'd rather watch pro wrestling.

You knew this was due to come sooner or later. If you don't like it, then why the hell are you in the thread in the first place, other than to be an ass?

SunDancer · 11-21-2004, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EagleFan

You knew this was due to come sooner or later. If you don't like it, then why the hell are you in the thread in the first place, other than to be an ass?

Agree. Must explain why NASCAR is hotter then any other sport in ratings and fans. Must be why sponsors are hot over the series. Also, if anyone actually watch the race or took the time to check out the drivers before making remarks, they would see the whole culture and new drivers coming in are the "rock-and-roll" type drivers.

The_herd · 11-21-2004, 08:30 PM

NASCAR still doesn't have street cred. Gordon's going to have to jump in the stands and kick some Earnhardt fan's asses or go out and cap someone.

Franklinnoble · 11-21-2004, 08:33 PM

Maybe I did that because NASCAR fans are so darned sensitive about it...

I get about the same reaction every time I post how overtly homoerotic pro wrestling is...

I'm just trying to get a rise outta you guys.

TargetPractice6 · 11-21-2004, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franklinnoble

I'm just trying to get a rise outta you guys.

I recall somebody getting thrown in the box for saying something eerily similar.

Blackadar · 11-21-2004, 08:36 PM

This "chase" was a joke. Clearly NASCAR got what it wanted, but Busch wasn't even one of the best the top 3 drivers this year.

Franklinnoble · 11-21-2004, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TargetPractice6

I recall somebody getting thrown in the box for saying something eerily similar.

Bah. I don't fear the box.

SunDancer · 11-21-2004, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franklinnoble

Bah. I don't fear the box.

But do you fear the Dog and his underwear of US pride?

SunDancer · 11-21-2004, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackadar

This "chase" was a joke. Clearly NASCAR got what it wanted, but Busch wasn't even one of the best the top 3 drivers this year.

I agree. The sponsors of the non-top ten teams weren't too happy with the airtime and coverage within those last ten races. Today's race was 99% focus on those drivers (even in the back of the pack). This move could cause alot of problems.

The_herd · 11-21-2004, 08:48 PM

I also thought the warning NASCAR sent out to the driver that wouldn't let Busch pass him was a joke. You have to let the drivers race. It may have been an asshole move, but it isn't NASCAR's job to jump in and basically tell the team to let Busch pass.

ctmason · 11-21-2004, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackadar

This "chase" was a joke. Clearly NASCAR got what it wanted, but Busch wasn't even one of the best the top 3 drivers this year.

Last time I checked everyone else was aware of the new system and had the same chances that Busch had. Busch's team performed better in the closing weeks of the season. End of story. I liked the old system better too, but its a new day.

And to the comments about "too much attention" does anyone remember the 1992 season that came down to Atlanta? Hell, the last three races you didn't even know where anyone else beside Kulwicki, Elliot and Allison qualified.

Granted I've only been a fan for 15 years or so (shorter than many on here, I'm sure) but this race coverage was as fair as any other "end of the season" race.

I do think the new system is a lot more exciting than having the championship wrapped up with three races left...

SunDancer · 11-21-2004, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ctmason

Last time I checked everyone else was aware of the new system and had the same chances that Busch had. Busch's team performed better in the closing weeks of the season. End of story. I liked the old system better too, but its a new day.

And to the comments about "too much attention" does anyone remember the 1992 season that came down to Atlanta? Hell, the last three races you didn't even know where anyone else beside Kulwicki, Elliot and Allison qualified.

Granted I've only been a fan for 15 years or so (shorter than many on here, I'm sure) but this race coverage was as fair as any other "end of the season" race.

I do think the new system is a lot more exciting than having the championship wrapped up with three races left...

Oh, yeah Busch won it. That's fair. But this season's new system is like allowing the NBA the eight team, who is just average or barely average, in the playoffs. I want a driver to perform the best over the season, not in the last weeks. To me, a champion should be the best all year. This is where NASCAR looks differnet from the Big Four sports, where you actually have to be the best all year, not just average and get hot in the playoffs.

Franklinnoble · 11-22-2004, 12:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SunDancer

But do you fear the Dog and his underwear of US pride?

Only if he's posing on my front porch...

Blackadar · 11-22-2004, 06:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SunDancer

Oh, yeah Busch won it. That's fair. But this season's new system is like allowing the NBA the eight team, who is just average or barely average, in the playoffs. I want a driver to perform the best over the season, not in the last weeks. To me, a champion should be the best all year. This is where NASCAR looks differnet from the Big Four sports, where you actually have to be the best all year, not just average and get hot in the playoffs.

I don't think that's quite accurate. It's like the NBA allowing those poor teams in the playoffs, allow them to play the better teams on a neutral court and have other teams playing on the same floor at the same time. And then adding up which team scored the most points in the chaos and awarding them the championship.

Buzzbee · 11-22-2004, 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SunDancer

Oh, yeah Busch won it. That's fair. But this season's new system is like allowing the NBA the eight team, who is just average or barely average, in the playoffs. I want a driver to perform the best over the season, not in the last weeks. To me, a champion should be the best all year. This is where NASCAR looks differnet from the Big Four sports, where you actually have to be the best all year, not just average and get hot in the playoffs.

Yeah, kinda like the Marlins winning the World Series, twice. They were obviously the best all season since they won the Wild Card. Kinda like Seattle ammassing the best regular season record ever in baseball, and then not winning the World Series. Oh, and it's probably a lot like Oklahoma going undefeated in the regular season and then winning the Big 12 championsh...oh, wait. Never mind.

Buzzbee · 11-22-2004, 06:48 AM

My thoughts:

- I like the old system better.
- The new system achieved what was intended, this time.
- As mentioned, I NEVER thought I would actually want Gordon to do well. I don't like Kurt Busch at all.
- TV is king. NBC got what they wanted - better ratings for the late part of the season.
- Leading up to the last 10 races, those teams battling for the last spot got more air time than they EVER would have under the old format, so those sponsors shouldn't bitch.
- It sucks that Busch will be the "first" Nextel Cup Champion.
- I was wrong. I thought it would only take Blackie 5 posts before he tossed in his negativity.
- I was wrong. I thought it would take somebody 20 post before the good ole "rednecks driving in circles" comment would come out.
- I was right that the very next post after the aforementioned redneck dig would be a "then why are you here" response.
- I expect them to tweak the system, just like the BCS and end up creating bigger problems than they had before, just like the BCS.
- I'm curious to see how things shake out fan-wise as many of the aged veterans are starting to retire, or getting to the point where they are thinking about it (Bill Elliott, Terry Labonte, Rusty Wallace, Mark Martin, Ricky Rudd, Dale Jarrett)

Blackadar · 11-22-2004, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buzzbee

My thoughts:
- I was wrong. I thought it would only take Blackie 5 posts before he tossed in his negativity.

Yes, and your point is?

moriarty · 11-22-2004, 08:43 AM

Say what you will about the new point system, but as a non-Nascar fan, I found myself switching back and forth between football and the race. Something about seeing the championship change hands back and forth by the lap I found to be exciting.

Bonegavel · 11-22-2004, 08:58 AM

I'm not totally sure I like the new scoring system or not, but something needed to be done.

As for those saying "but Kurt only won 3 races and Johnson was better through the year" remember that a team in the NFL can go undefeated to the SB and still not be champion. I think it is just out of habit that we think NASCAR must be a "best over the year" type of deal.

I would love for a system that came down to the last race EVERY YEAR and had at least 5 or so drivers having the possiblity of winning the cup at the end of the day.

Sure racing is vastly different than football (you have 43 teams playing in the same game every week as opposed to 1 on 1) but they need way to make it come down to the last race to make it exciting.

11-21-2004, 04:37 PM	#2
JonInMiddleGA Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Behind Enemy Lines in Athens, GA	I gotta give 'em that, it was a darned good race. I was hoping to see a miracle finish to give Martin a title, but of the three who had a realistic chance today, I would have hoped for Busch only because I'd rather see Roush get a title than any of the other options. __________________ "I lit another cigarette. Unless I specifically inform you to the contrary, I am always lighting another cigarette." - from a novel by Martin Amis

11-21-2004, 04:39 PM	#3
The_herd College Starter Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Fort Lackland, Texas (San Antonio)	Congrats to Busch, but I'm still not sold on the Chase for the Cup system. The scoring system is still in need of an overhaul. Busch won only 3 races this year and finished in the top 5 ten times. Jimmy Johnson dominated most of the season and Gordon was damn good as well. As far as dominance goes, Busch was probably the 4th best driver this season. If they are going to make these last 10 races the most important, then actually winning those races should have a bigger impact in the points race than they do. __________________ Oakland Raiders: HFL's 1970 AC West Champs

11-21-2004, 04:41 PM	#5
The_herd College Starter Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Fort Lackland, Texas (San Antonio)	Gordon's pass of Nemecheck when was being an ass and trying to block him was one of the most impressive I've seen. __________________ Oakland Raiders: HFL's 1970 AC West Champs

11-21-2004, 04:43 PM	#7
JonInMiddleGA Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Behind Enemy Lines in Athens, GA	Just piling on, I don't like the new points system either, but there sure doesn't seem to be much I can do about it, so I kinda had to judge today on what is was, knowwhutImean? __________________ "I lit another cigarette. Unless I specifically inform you to the contrary, I am always lighting another cigarette." - from a novel by Martin Amis

11-21-2004, 05:17 PM	#9
Draft Dodger Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Keene, NH	loved the race, loved the season, love the new scoring system. __________________ Mile High Hockey

11-21-2004, 04:39 PM	#4
SunDancer College Benchwarmer Join Date: Sep 2002	I was alittle pissed at Nemecheck (?). Kinda lost alittle respect for him. Gordon got a great start of that start, and might of had a shot.

11-21-2004, 04:51 PM	#8
SunDancer College Benchwarmer Join Date: Sep 2002	Just curious, under the old system, what would be the standings?

11-21-2004, 07:51 PM	#11
Eagle458 n00b Join Date: Mar 2004	I never thought the day would come when I would be cheering for Gordon but I was cause I can't stand Kurt Dumbo Busch. Does anyone like him? I mean really..Everone I've talked to hate him.

11-21-2004, 08:03 PM	#12
Franklinnoble Banned Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Placerville, CA	Bah. Rednecks driving around in a circle. I'd rather watch pro wrestling.

11-21-2004, 08:30 PM	#15
The_herd College Starter Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Fort Lackland, Texas (San Antonio)	NASCAR still doesn't have street cred. Gordon's going to have to jump in the stands and kick some Earnhardt fan's asses or go out and cap someone. __________________ Oakland Raiders: HFL's 1970 AC West Champs

11-21-2004, 08:33 PM	#16
Franklinnoble Banned Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Placerville, CA	Maybe I did that because NASCAR fans are so darned sensitive about it... I get about the same reaction every time I post how overtly homoerotic pro wrestling is... I'm just trying to get a rise outta you guys.

11-21-2004, 08:36 PM	#18
Blackadar Retired Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fantasyland	This "chase" was a joke. Clearly NASCAR got what it wanted, but Busch wasn't even one of the best the top 3 drivers this year.

11-21-2004, 08:48 PM	#22
The_herd College Starter Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Fort Lackland, Texas (San Antonio)	I also thought the warning NASCAR sent out to the driver that wouldn't let Busch pass him was a joke. You have to let the drivers race. It may have been an asshole move, but it isn't NASCAR's job to jump in and basically tell the team to let Busch pass. __________________ Oakland Raiders: HFL's 1970 AC West Champs

11-22-2004, 06:48 AM	#28
Buzzbee College Starter Join Date: Jun 2002	My thoughts: - I like the old system better. - The new system achieved what was intended, this time. - As mentioned, I NEVER thought I would actually want Gordon to do well. I don't like Kurt Busch at all. - TV is king. NBC got what they wanted - better ratings for the late part of the season. - Leading up to the last 10 races, those teams battling for the last spot got more air time than they EVER would have under the old format, so those sponsors shouldn't bitch. - It sucks that Busch will be the "first" Nextel Cup Champion. - I was wrong. I thought it would only take Blackie 5 posts before he tossed in his negativity. - I was wrong. I thought it would take somebody 20 post before the good ole "rednecks driving in circles" comment would come out. - I was right that the very next post after the aforementioned redneck dig would be a "then why are you here" response. - I expect them to tweak the system, just like the BCS and end up creating bigger problems than they had before, just like the BCS. - I'm curious to see how things shake out fan-wise as many of the aged veterans are starting to retire, or getting to the point where they are thinking about it (Bill Elliott, Terry Labonte, Rusty Wallace, Mark Martin, Ricky Rudd, Dale Jarrett) __________________ Ability is what you're capable of doing. Motivation determines what you do. Attitude determines how well you do it. - Lou Holtz

11-22-2004, 08:43 AM	#30
moriarty College Starter Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: A negative place	Say what you will about the new point system, but as a non-Nascar fan, I found myself switching back and forth between football and the race. Something about seeing the championship change hands back and forth by the lap I found to be exciting.

11-22-2004, 08:58 AM	#31
Bonegavel Awaiting Further Instructions... Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Macungie, PA	I'm not totally sure I like the new scoring system or not, but something needed to be done. As for those saying "but Kurt only won 3 races and Johnson was better through the year" remember that a team in the NFL can go undefeated to the SB and still not be champion. I think it is just out of habit that we think NASCAR must be a "best over the year" type of deal. I would love for a system that came down to the last race EVERY YEAR and had at least 5 or so drivers having the possiblity of winning the cup at the end of the day. Sure racing is vastly different than football (you have 43 teams playing in the same game every week as opposed to 1 on 1) but they need way to make it come down to the last race to make it exciting.

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