New car shopping?

[Greyroofoo]

So right now I have a 1997 car that has a new problem prop up every other week or so (hole in break line, water leaks into trunk, engine will sometimes turn off while idling, bad air conditioner, etc..).

So I could get a new car? I've been looking at either a Ford Focus or Honda Civic. I'm leaning towards a Focus because its several thousand dollars cheaper unless there's some special that Honda isn't telling me about. A visit to the Ford dealership has a Focus at $13,830 after rebates and after taxes and fees are figured in. A visit to a local dealership's website says Civic would be about $18,000 with the same features, before taxes and fees.

Should I get a used car? Again I would like something like a Focus or Civic, but open to similiar cars.

Or should I just keep my car and do the best I can to fix it. I'm not a mechanic myself but I have a friend who says he would help me, however he has a very busy schedule and I'm not sure when he'll find time. It won't be for at least a couple weeks.

I would have about $8000 to put down on a new/used car.

Thoughts?

[JS19]

Going off of my own personal experiences, I would highly recommend a Honda (or Toyota or Nissan) over a Ford. Between me and my friends there are a lot of civics and such going around. Not one of them has ever had a problem and speak very highly of them. A few people I do know, including my parents, who had Fords eventually got rid of them because of major problems. Like I said, this is just based on situations I have come across, but I personaly think the extra $$ for the Honda is worth it in the long run.

[Flasch186]

i have only heard bad things about a focus but i have no proof just hearsay.

[FBPro]

Toyota, my wife drives a '97 Camry w/ 150K+ miles on it and you would never know it. Runs and looks great(we try hard to keep them maintained), but these cars(and similar) just seem to last longer. I debated a few months ago about getting a new pickup, I wanted an F150 in the worst way but after doing some research bought a 2002 Tundra and I'd say in the future will be hard pressed to not get another Toyota.

[Swaggs]

You should be able to get a comprable Civic for much less than $18K.

Consumer Reports lists the following:
Ford Focus ($13,450-$17,495) w/ average reliability and below average owner satisfaction and depreciation.
Honda Civic ($14,360-$21,850 ) w/ excellent reliability and satisfaction (Depreciation was unrated due to it being a new model, but Hondas routinely have the highest average resale because they do not routinely sell their vehicles to rental agencies, so there are less of them in used-car circulation).

Without doubt, go with the Honda, even if it costs a few thousand more.

[Fonzie]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

You should be able to get a comprable Civic for much less than $18K.

Consumer Reports lists the following:
Ford Focus ($13,450-$17,495) w/ average reliability and below average owner satisfaction and depreciation.
Honda Civic ($14,360-$21,850 ) w/ excellent reliability and satisfaction (Depreciation was unrated due to it being a new model, but Hondas routinely have the highest average resale because they do not routinely sell their vehicles to rental agencies, so there are less of them in used-car circulation).

Without doubt, go with the Honda, even if it costs a few thousand more.

You stole my post.

[Rizon]

hxxp://www.edmunds.com/
hxxp://www.kbb.com/
hxxp://www.consumerreports.org/cro/cars.htm

[wade moore]

On top of the recommendations for honda/toyota...

I learned this lesson the hardware, despite what others tried to tell me...

It's really in your best interest to buy used. You can find plenty of cars with less than 15k miles on them. They should be significantly cheaper than buying brand new, and basically the same quality. Especially if you get like "certified used" or whatever.... what they say is true, you lose $1,000's when you drive a brand new car off of the lot.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by wade moore

On top of the recommendations for honda/toyota...

I learned this lesson the hardware, despite what others tried to tell me...

It's really in your best interest to buy used. You can find plenty of cars with less than 15k miles on them. They should be significantly cheaper than buying brand new, and basically the same quality. Especially if you get like "certified used" or whatever.... what they say is true, you lose $1,000's when you drive a brand new car off of the lot.

I would agree with this only if you are buying used from another person and not a car lot. Believe me, you lose $1,000s when you drive a used car off the lot, too.

[Desnudo]

I still see tons of old civics driving around. Not too many old Fords of any type...

If you don't care about having a new car, then definitely buy a used one. If you want to save the most money, buy it from an individual and have a thorough mechanic's examination done before buying.

[Bee]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

I would agree with this only if you are buying used from another person and not a car lot. Believe me, you lose $1,000s when you drive a used car off the lot, too.

I don't know if I follow you here.

I understand how the value of a new car drops by thousands when you drive it off the lot (It's no longer a new car and a used car blue book value is thousands less even if it's the newest model and low miles). How does that apply to a used vehicle unless you are over paying for it?

[jeff061]

I'm guessing his point was that used car lots rip you off.

But unless you personally know someone, you are no safer person to person. In my opinion.

[dixieflatline]

Originally Posted by Greyroofoo

Should I get a used car? Again I would like something like a Focus or Civic, but open to similiar cars.

You should at least also take a look at the hyundai accent which is in the same class as the focus and civic. It compares well to the focus and is cheaper than the civic. Nice warrenty too depending on how new you are looking.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by Bee

I don't know if I follow you here.

I understand how the value of a new car drops by thousands when you drive it off the lot (It's no longer a new car and a used car blue book value is thousands less even if it's the newest model and low miles). How does that apply to a used vehicle unless you are over paying for it?

Well, the analogy I always heard was that if you drive a new car off the lot and then turn around a day later and try to trade it back in, it is worth much less.

The same would be true of a used car, because when a dealership brings in a used car on a trade or from auction, they pay substantially less than the price you would pay for it. So, if you bought a used car from a dealer for, say, $15K and then decided the next day that you wanted to trade it back in, you would get nowhere near $15K for it--you might get like $13K. But, they would take that car and stick it right back on the lot the next day and try to sell it again for $15K.

[jeff061]

All you guys are so much more responsible than me.

I've been looking at a new car as well. But going the fast, fun, unreliable and gas guzzling route.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by jeff061

All you guys are so much more responsible than me.

I've been looking at a new car as well. But going the fast, fun, unreliable and gas guzzling route.

For what it is worth, after working for one miserable year at a car lot, I don't believe I would ever buy a used car from a dealer and probably would not buy a used car at all, unless it was under $3-5K and I was not expecting much out of it or I knew the owner well enough to see how he treated the car. As a whole, dealerships treat used cars and used car customers worse than new car buyers, because new car buyers receive dealer surveys that need to have high scores for the dealership to get bonuses and/or keep its affiliation.

[jeff061]

I bought my Wrangler used at a lot. Service wasn't the best post sale, but the price was good and it's lasted me well so far.

I'm buying my next car new, a "Want to own at least one new car in my life" mistake .

[Bee]

I've bought a few used cars over the years and I've never had problems. I think you need to do a little more research with them so you don't get ripped off and you need to have a good idea of the quality of the dealership. Many years ago I had a Cadillac that I bought used (it was a year old when I bought it). The service I got from the dealership on it was better than the service I've gotten from the Toyota dealership on the Camry we bought new.

Edit: I've also bought a new Cadillac from the same dealership that I bought the used one and I was treated the same with both vehicles.

[Bee]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

Well, the analogy I always heard was that if you drive a new car off the lot and then turn around a day later and try to trade it back in, it is worth much less.

The same would be true of a used car, because when a dealership brings in a used car on a trade or from auction, they pay substantially less than the price you would pay for it. So, if you bought a used car from a dealer for, say, $15K and then decided the next day that you wanted to trade it back in, you would get nowhere near $15K for it--you might get like $13K. But, they would take that car and stick it right back on the lot the next day and try to sell it again for $15K.

But you're not going to get your $15K back from a private party either. It doesn't matter who you bought it from originally, the value of the car remains the same. The main thing to me would be not to overpay, and that would be the case with either a dealer or a private party.

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by jeff061

All you guys are so much more responsible than me.

I've been looking at a new car as well. But going the fast, fun, unreliable and gas guzzling route.

I bought an SUV recently. I wanted to know what it was like to pay $50 a fill-up.

[Greyroofoo]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

You should be able to get a comprable Civic for much less than $18K.

Consumer Reports lists the following:
Ford Focus ($13,450-$17,495) w/ average reliability and below average owner satisfaction and depreciation.
Honda Civic ($14,360-$21,850 ) w/ excellent reliability and satisfaction (Depreciation was unrated due to it being a new model, but Hondas routinely have the highest average resale because they do not routinely sell their vehicles to rental agencies, so there are less of them in used-car circulation).

Without doubt, go with the Honda, even if it costs a few thousand more.

The price of the Focus was direct from the dealer.
The car had about a $17,750 sticker price. Minus a $2500 rebate, $500 down payment match, $500 military discount, and a $800 discount by the dealer. So I'd have to pay about $13,830 after taxes and fees.

I haven't had a chance to get over to the Honda dealership yet. However configuring a Honda online at honda.com with approximately the same options ran me $18,000. I could not find any incentive information on the local dealership's or Honda's website.

I also saw the Focus only recieved a 77 Consumer Reports test score to the Civics 81. Both were way ahead than any car I looked at in that class.

Right now I'm kind of leaning towards trying to keep my car until the 2007s come out, by then I should be able to pay for the entire car in cash. However a new car would be REALLY nice compared to what I'm driving right now.

[Swaggs]

Here is a page that usually keeps the rebates up to date: http://autos.msn.com/home/rebates_all.aspx

Right now, it does not look real stocked, so I'm wondering if something is up with the page. Usually there are several rebates from each manufacturer.

Keep in mind that big rebates mean big depreciation (if trade-in value is something you are interested in). If they are marking the car down $4,300 right now, it was not selling at $16K-$18K and it will start depreciating from the $13,830 figure, rather than its sticker price (since it appears that it is pretty easy to just go out and get a new Focus for around $14K, regardless of the sticker).

[rewissick]

I had been looking at the Civic...that is until I saw what it would cost to insure it. Almost 30% more than the Jetta, Corolla or Focus (all of which are on my list)!

Needless to say, I'm looking at the Corolla, used...from about '04 or so. My bank considers any car from '04 or later to be new, and I get the better rate because of that.

[RPI-Fan]

I was in almost exactly the same situation as you.

I ended up going with a maxxed-out Civic, which ran me ~$18.5k when all was said in done. Who knows how the Ford would be doing right now, but I do know that I can't find anything wrong with my Civic even if I nitpick. Everything has been absolutely A-ok so far.

Good luck!

[RPI-Fan]

Oh, also, do you plan on having this (next car) for a while?

If not, Civic is probably a better idea. After 3 years and ~50k miles you will still get ~$10k for your Civic. You'd be lucky to get 5 for the Ford.

[Greyroofoo]

Ok, so my car is on its death bed right now, the people I've had look at said that since there's so must rust on the bottem of the car there's little hope of fixing it.

I've called several dealerships and here's the out the door prices I've found (with no haggling, yet)

Ford Focus SE Zx4 $15110
Toyota Corolla LE $17000
Mazda Mazda3 S $18440
Honda Civic LX $18420

any other car suggestions? Thoughts?

[terpkristin]

I have a Mazda Protege5 (what became the 3), and I love it.
He's my little baby.

Can't say I know much about any of the others, though the Focus and the 3 are very similar cars. I sometimes jokingly call my car the Mazda Focus or the Ford Protege5. I assume the Focus you listed is the 4 door, not the hatchback, but you get the gist.

FWIW, my Protege5 is about 3.5 years old now, and still going beautifully.
Of course, with gas prices being what they are now, if I were in the market, I might strongly consider a Prius...

/tk

[Wasabiak]

Do yourself a favor, and stop thinking about buying a Focus. This is a Ford master technician telling you that. Just buy an import and be done with it.

[RPI-Fan]

Originally Posted by Greyroofoo

Ok, so my car is on its death bed right now, the people I've had look at said that since there's so must rust on the bottem of the car there's little hope of fixing it.

I've called several dealerships and here's the out the door prices I've found (with no haggling, yet)

Ford Focus SE Zx4 $15110
Toyota Corolla LE $17000
Mazda Mazda3 S $18440
Honda Civic LX $18420

any other car suggestions? Thoughts?

That Civic price doesn't make sense to me. I thought the '06 was going to be the same price as the '05.

My Civic EX Special Edition ('05) was like $18.5k out the door (got a couple hundred dollars for my clunker I traded in).

Nevertheless, if you can swing it, I recommend anything but the Focus. Mazda is nice because it is a little bit different.

[Greyroofoo]

I am kind of leaning towards the focus because of its low price, but however I don't really want a car that everybody has.

The Civic has good gas milage, however it also has the highest insurance rates ($600/year above the Corrolla or Mazda3) as quoted to me by Geico. And like the Focus, everyone seems to have one. Just at my military dorms, there's 3-4 Focus's and 3-4 Civics parked.

Corrolla has good gas milage and toyota has an excellent reputation for reliability plus low insurance, however I've heard its pretty bland to drive.

The Mazda3, from the reviews I've read, is fun to drive however it has average gas milage but low insurance. Edmunds.com has it as its Editor's pick in its class.

Call me crazy (and in the military), but I would like to buy American (Civics and Corrola's are mostly built in American according to levelfieldinstitute.org but the Mazda3 is strictly Japanese).

I plan on having the car for about 5 years. I am strongly leaning towards the Focus or Mazda3 depending on how much money I want to spend.

[Greyroofoo]

Originally Posted by RPI-Fan

That Civic price doesn't make sense to me. I thought the '06 was going to be the same price as the '05.

My Civic EX Special Edition ('05) was like $18.5k out the door (got a couple hundred dollars for my clunker I traded in).

Just to note that all the prices I listed was for automatic transmissions

[RPI-Fan]

Originally Posted by Greyroofoo

Just to note that all the prices I listed was for automatic transmissions

I have Auto (and EX SE is as fully loaded as you can get). I guess the '06 is just a lot more than the '05s.

[RPI-Fan]

Originally Posted by Greyroofoo

I am kind of leaning towards the focus because of its low price, but however I don't really want a car that everybody has.

The Civic has good gas milage, however it also has the highest insurance rates ($600/year above the Corrolla or Mazda3) as quoted to me by Geico. And like the Focus, everyone seems to have one. Just at my military dorms, there's 3-4 Focus's and 3-4 Civics parked.

Corrolla has good gas milage and toyota has an excellent reputation for reliability plus low insurance, however I've heard its pretty bland to drive.

The Mazda3, from the reviews I've read, is fun to drive however it has average gas milage but low insurance. Edmunds.com has it as its Editor's pick in its class.

Call me crazy (and in the military), but I would like to buy American (Civics and Corrola's are mostly built in American according to levelfieldinstitute.org but the Mazda3 is strictly Japanese).

I plan on having the car for about 5 years. I am strongly leaning towards the Focus or Mazda3 depending on how much money I want to spend.

You'll regret it if you get the Focus, I think. Don't shortchange yourself.

[Greyroofoo]

Was your price after your trade-in? Because mine isn't.

[yabanci]

Originally Posted by Greyroofoo

I would have about $8000 to put down on a new/used car.

Thoughts?

Buy a car for $8000 or less.

I know, it sounds crazy.

[RPI-Fan]

Originally Posted by Greyroofoo

Was your price after your trade-in? Because mine isn't.

Yes, but as mentioned it was a clunker which got, I think, $250.

Incidentally the car literally died while I was parking in their lot to make the official swap. The papers had already been signed though.

[Greyroofoo]

Originally Posted by yabanci

Buy a car for $8000 or less.

I know, it sounds crazy.

Right now thought, I have $15000 to put down

[terpkristin]

Originally Posted by Greyroofoo

Right now thought, I have $15000 to put down

Holy canoli!

When I bought my car, my trade-in was worth approx $850. Apparently when I'm done paying it off, I'll have paid 17982.60. I had 0% financing.

/tk

[yabanci]

Originally Posted by Greyroofoo

Right now thought, I have $15000 to put down

ah, didn't notice that the first post was 2 mos old.

Buy a car for $15000 or less.

[Wasabiak]

Originally Posted by yabanci

ah, didn't notice that the first post was 2 mos old.

Buy a car for $15000 or less.

Great advise. And get an import.

[RPI-Fan]

Originally Posted by yabanci

ah, didn't notice that the first post was 2 mos old.

Buy a car for $15000 or less.

You can get a certified barely-used Corolla with features for cash with that amount of money.

[Coder]

Buy a Volvo S40 through the Overseas delivery program

Oh.. it'll be 8 weeks before you get the car, but hey, you get a free trip to the Factory Delivery Center for two people..

oh yeah.. this is a plug.. not shameless, but it's a plug ;-)

[JS19]

Just dont buy a Ford.

[FrogMan]

Originally Posted by Coder

Buy a Volvo S40 through the Overseas delivery program

Oh.. it'll be 8 weeks before you get the car, but hey, you get a free trip to the Factory Delivery Center for two people..

oh yeah.. this is a plug.. not shameless, but it's a plug ;-)

Coder, you work for Volvo? If so, in what kind of branch?

As for visiting a Factory Delivery Center, well, I work in a Volvo plant of sorts, so...

FM

[FrogMan]

Originally Posted by Greyroofoo

Right now thought, I have $15000 to put down

soooo, in two months or so, you put aside some $7,000, that's pretty good... I assume you don't have kids, right

FM

[Anthony]

i don't care about gas-guzzlers, what is the general consensus on the Hummer H3?

[Coder]

Originally Posted by FrogMan

Coder, you work for Volvo? If so, in what kind of branch?

As for visiting a Factory Delivery Center, well, I work in a Volvo plant of sorts, so...

FM

I work in Gothenburg at Volvo Cars International Customer Sales... Diplomats, Expatriates, US Military sales and American Tourist sales.. part of our deal is to invite customers to come over here and pick up the car at the factory, let them ride the factory tour (see how the cars are built etc), experience Gothenburg and maybe take a driving vacation in Europe with their new car, before dropping it off at one of our agents.

http://vcic.volvocars.com/

End of promotion

[FrogMan]

Originally Posted by Coder

I work in Gothenburg at Volvo Cars International Customer Sales... Diplomats, Expatriates, US Military sales and American Tourist sales.. part of our deal is to invite customers to come over here and pick up the car at the factory, let them ride the factory tour (see how the cars are built etc), experience Gothenburg and maybe take a driving vacation in Europe with their new car, before dropping it off at one of our agents.

http://vcic.volvocars.com/

End of promotion

that's pretty cool.

Maybe you know, maybe you don't, but I work for a coach manufacturer called Prevost Car and we're now owned 100% by Volvo. We're part of Volvo Bus North America.

FM

[Ryan S]

Originally Posted by RPI-Fan

You'll regret it if you get the Focus, I think. Don't shortchange yourself.

Is the US Focus really that much worse than the European version? In Europe the Ford Focus has a good reputation for reliability.

[Craptacular]

Mazda 3