What's up with all the serialized dramas now?

[Butter]

Is this the legacy of TiVo? Seems like nearly every new drama is not just a one hour story, but part of a bigger whole. Makes it nearly impossible to jump into after missing an episode, but becomes a TiVo-ers dream.

[Izulde]

One think I like about NBC is that they provide an Internet feed of the last episode, so if you miss an episode, you can still catch it online.

[wade moore]

I don't think this has anything to do with TiVO at all.

This trend is to 24 what tons of reality shows are/were to Survivor. That's all this is. They saw something get good ratings, so they are trying to duplicate it. A VERY large majority of television is still watched live. Plus, I was just explaining this to my fiance yesterday, networks care MUCH less about their Tivo viewers than their live viewers.

[Bee]

Originally Posted by wade moore

networks care MUCH less about their Tivo viewers than their live viewers.

That explains my feelings of being unloved!

[lordscarlet]

I, for one, am glad TV has gone in this direction. I prefer an ongoing story.

[Ksyrup]

This probably explains why I rarely watch TV shows anymore. In fact, I can trace the point at which I stopped watching L&O to when they started carrying more storylines over from episode to episode. Especially SVU - the stuff about the lead male detective just got way too boring for me. The last episode of SVU I watched was the one that focused solely on him interrogating some pervert, and it was basically about his life story. Booooooooring.

[Anthony]

yeah, everyone knows perverts are the most uninteresting people to talk to. they also have shifty eyes, can't ever look you in the eye and carry a conversation.

[Bee]

Originally Posted by lordscarlet

I, for one, am glad TV has gone in this direction. I prefer an ongoing story.

I prefer that as well, although occasionally having a show that you can just tune into every once in a while without having followed it is nice as well.

[jbmagic]

Best serialized shows

1)Lost
2)24
3)Prision Break
4)Vanished
5)Kidnapped
6)Nine
7)Six Degrees
8)Runaway

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Bee

I prefer that as well, although occasionally having a show that you can just tune into every once in a while without having followed it is nice as well.

oh, Full House, where have you gone???

[Bee]

Originally Posted by Hell Atlantic

yeah, everyone knows perverts are the most uninteresting people to talk to. they also have shifty eyes, can't ever look you in the eye and carry a conversation.

Try it with pants on next time.

[ice4277]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

This probably explains why I rarely watch TV shows anymore.

For me, it is totally the opposite. Three or four years ago, I don't think there was a show I watched regularly. Now, of the 6 or 7 shows I consider must-see, probably all but one is episodic. To each his own.

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by Bee

I prefer that as well, although occasionally having a show that you can just tune into every once in a while without having followed it is nice as well.

Ironically, I find that I'm less likely to watch a "serialized" show if it is a drama, but the opposite is true for comedy. For instance, I love Curb Your Enthusiasm, which follows season-long story lines, but can't stand to watch dramas that do the same. Odd, I know.

[Mustang]

Originally Posted by Hell Atlantic

oh, Full House, where have you gone???

This a line in a Simon and Garfunkel song?

[Oilers9911]

Originally Posted by jbmagic

Best serialized shows

1)Lost
2)24
3)Prision Break
4)Vanished
5)Kidnapped
6)Nine
7)Six Degrees
8)Runaway

Lost is becoming a joke. How many more people are going to show up there? Are they going to suddenly stumble upon a city next? A whole city of lost people?

I think the best serialized comedy is the Oakland Raiders 2006 season.

[Maple Leafs]

This isn't really a new trend. Most dramas used to be serialized (think Dallas, Moonlighting, right through ER). Then came shows like Law and Order and CSI, with minimal storylines beyond an episode. That became the trend for a few years, and now you're seeing TV go back to where it was.

[rkmsuf]

Originally Posted by Oilers9911

I think the best serialized comedy is the Oakland Raiders 2006 season.

LOL

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by Hell Atlantic

oh, Full House, where have you gone???

Russia.

[Bee]

Originally Posted by Maple Leafs

This isn't really a new trend. Most dramas used to be serialized (think Dallas, Moonlighting, right through ER). Then came shows like Law and Order and CSI, with minimal storylines beyond an episode. That became the trend for a few years, and now you're seeing TV go back to where it was.

Dallas? Moonlighting? I didn't know Maple Leafs was a chick!

[Pumpy Tudors]

Wake me up when they bring "Matlock" back.

[wade moore]

I like serialized drama's in general (and ones that are not)..

What I'm growing quickly tired of are the serialized dramas that have an "end-game"... Prison Break (which i love), Vanished, Lost, etc, etc.. I don't like a show that has what should be a clear ending point.. because

a) it has a clear ending point
b) often when the show gets popular they drag out what it takes to get to the clear ending point
c) sometimes when they reach a they seem to create a new ending point and start the cycle over again (see: 24)

[timmynausea]

I definitely prefer the serialized dramas, though I think the HBO shows from 5 or 6 years ago like Sopranos, Oz and Six Feet Under deserve more credit for bringing it back than 24.

[KWhit]

I really prefer the serial dramas to any other type of show. The Law and Order or CSI type of shows are just too repetitive to me. There is a formula to them that just repeats ad nauseum. I like the cliffhangers that a serial provides.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by wade moore

I don't think this has anything to do with TiVO at all.

This trend is to 24 what tons of reality shows are/were to Survivor. That's all this is. They saw something get good ratings, so they are trying to duplicate it. A VERY large majority of television is still watched live. Plus, I was just explaining this to my fiance yesterday, networks care MUCH less about their Tivo viewers than their live viewers.

I think TiVO/DVRs has plaid a role in the success of some of these shows. It's effect on TV viewership cannot be ignored. "24" kicked things off a few years ago.

But the trend really kicked into high gear last year following the success of "Lost" and "Desparate Housewives" the year prior. I think this new emphasis on serial dramas is thing single best things to happen to primetime network T.V. in years. Before these shows sort of hit it big, primetime TV had become a wasteland for the most part. There were some good shows around for certain, but most of what was on TV was reality show after reality show and an endless procedural dramas likes the CSIs and the Law & Orders. The success of "Lost" proved that a show could be smart, complex, have interesting characters, and progress week-to-week and be successful. Those are all good things in my view.

Last year there were a flurry of copy-cats like "Invasion" and those other two alien invasion shows. All three failed. This year you have "Jericho", "Heroes", "Kidnapped" and some others. Hopefully at least one of these shows will catch on and help re-inforce the notion that T.V. can be smart, complex, and interesting.

Law & Order, CSI, and those type of shows make for great syndication TV. It's nice to sit down and watch an episode on TNT or what have you, but as first run shows they are not nearly as compelling or exciting as the serial dramas.

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

I think TiVO/DVRs has plaid a role in the success of some of these shows. It's effect on TV viewership cannot be ignored. "24" kicked things off a few years ago.

I think it can easily be ignored.

as of november 2005 there were about 3.5 million TiVO subscribers. With a regular increase of around 250k per quarter. So let's even say they had a good year and there are 5 million subscribers now (plus that would theoretically account for some of the other brand names, but TiVO is a high % of the DVR's out there).

Nielson Figures for Sep 25-Oct.1

TiVO Ratings for the same period:

Unfortunately Tivo doesn't give raw numbers. However, it used to give % watched and even then the HIGHEST percent I saw was 50%. But let's go crazy. Let's say 50% of Tivo owners record their top show - Grey's Anatomy. So, 2.5 Million of 23.5 Million Grey's Anatomy Viewers were TiVO watchers.. Big impact? I'm thinking now, especially since from the old data I could find (in 2004 they listed %'s) it's more likely athat about 1.25M watched Grey's.

If you argue Grey's is not serial (although it is to an extent), then Housewives is and it has very similar numbers.

If you go to http://clickz.com/showPage.html?page=3623007 it shows that 12% of US households even own DVRs.

Then if you go to http://www.productplacement.biz/prod...skip-70-of-ads it shows that 70% of TiVO viewers skip commercials. So of your theoretical 2.5M above, only 750k catch the commercials, where a MUCH higher percent see the commercials on live TV.


Like I said earlier, I had to explain to my g/f how Networks don't care about those of us that skip commercials. You almost might as well throw those out of the ratings since we make them ZERO money (besides some ad placement in shows which is on the rise).

I'm sorry, but 12% of households, whom 70% skip the commercials, do not fuel any TV trends.

[bulletsponge]

wow, theres only 1 show on that list that i watch, and thats Sunday night football

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by bulletsponge

wow, theres only 1 show on that list that i watch, and thats Sunday night football

I did find it interesting that Lost did not even make the Nielsen list but is #3 on the TiVO list.

To me that's bad news for Lost.

[lordscarlet]

Originally Posted by wade moore

I did find it interesting that Lost did not even make the Nielsen list but is #3 on the TiVO list.

To me that's bad news for Lost.

Maybe that's because there was not a new episode of Lost during that time period?

[wade moore]

Dola:

It's been pointed out to me that the season premier of Lost (I don't watch it, watch it on DVD after it comes out) was after Oct. 1. But that during this week there was a "restropsective" episode that TiVO would have picked up.

So that explains that discrepency.

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by wade moore

I did find it interesting that Lost did not even make the Nielsen list but is #3 on the TiVO list.

To me that's bad news for Lost.

Well that list is total viewers which is kind of meaningless really. The advertisers care much more about viewers 18-49, where Lost does considerably better.

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

Well that list is total viewers which is kind of meaningless really. The advertisers care much more about viewers 18-49, where Lost does considerably better.

Well, that and me beign stupid ...

I don't think the 18-49 factor effects the TV vs. total viewers much though.

[albionmoonlight]

30% of people with TiVo watch commercials?

[Bee]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

30% of people with TiVo watch commercials?

I think 3 out of 10 don't know how to use their remotes.

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

30% of people with TiVo watch commercials?

I can't believe it is that high. That is a huge part of the appeal of my DVR box. We routinely watch "4 hours of TV" in about 3 hours just by skipping over commericals.

[SFL Cat]

Just glad to see the big decline in "Reality" Shows.

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

30% of people with TiVo watch commercials?

My reaction as well . I've heard people, i think people here even, say before that they watch commercials with TiVO.

Baffles the hell out of me.

The only time I ever watch commercials is on sporting events when I dont' give myself enough cushion before I start and I catch-up before it is over.

One thing I do wonder is if the slot fo rhte last commercial before the show start has gone up in price.. I imagine i'm not the only one that only sees that commercial.

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

I can't believe it is that high. That is a huge part of the appeal of my DVR box. We routinely watch "4 hours of TV" in about 3 hours just by skipping over commericals.

FWIW, I just realized that article is from April 2005, so it may be even less now that people have used them more.

[gottimd]

I am glad they are finally getting away from pumping out the crappy reality shows they flooded the market with.

So you think you can iron a shirt with lions chasing after you might have been the next show coming up.

Although I still eagerly await another CSI location, like a small market city where there isn't much exciting crime going on like CSI: Boise. Or maybe another Law and Order, but L&O: Meter Maids.

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by gottimd

I am glad they are finally getting away from pumping out the crappy reality shows they flooded the market with.

So you think you can iron a shirt with lions chasing after you might have been the next show coming up.

Although I still eagerly await another CSI location, like a small market city where there isn't much exciting crime going on like CSI: Boise. Or maybe another Law and Order, but L&O: Meter Maids.

Your post is just more evidence of what I'm saying. TV takes one thing that succeeds and makes 10 copy-cats hoping a couple latch on. That's the case here, nothing to do with TiVO.

[gottimd]

Originally Posted by wade moore

Your post is just more evidence of what I'm saying. TV takes one thing that succeeds and makes 10 copy-cats hoping a couple latch on. That's the case here, nothing to do with TiVO.

Oh, just to clarify, I wasn't trying to give evidence in that argument, just stating that fact that in my opinion, I am glad the execs stopped greenlighting every possible scenario of a reality show.

Unless they were deciding to come out with "gottimd bangs any female he chooses and his wife can either join or watch and invite more women". I am awaiting the network executives to call me.

[Brillig]

Originally Posted by Oilers9911

I think the best serialized comedy is the Oakland Raiders 2006 season.

Too bad there's no chance of the network cancelling the show.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

30% of people with TiVo watch commercials?

Actually, a recent study in the UK suggests that more than twice that many watch the commercials.

That's one of the touchier push/pull situations in advertising right now, figuring out how many do/don't zap (and then how to count them).

[ISiddiqui]

I enjoy serialized drama's myself. Good stories should take more than one hour episode to tell. Though there also are a lot of hybrid shows out as well, like Boston Legal, which will wrap up the trial in one hour long show, but have the personal lives of the lawyers as a serial. So you can jump in and watch the trial bits and not usually need previous information, but a lot of stuff concerning the personal lives of the attorneys, you may be left wondering what is going on.

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Actually, a recent study in the UK suggests that more than twice that many watch the commercials.

That's one of the touchier push/pull situations in advertising right now, figuring out how many do/don't zap (and then how to count them).

All that being said - do you agree (since you'd know better than any of us) that TiVO viewers do not have sway in what goes on TV? That they are a virtual non-factor right now in the TV world?

[lordscarlet]

Originally Posted by gottimd

I am glad they are finally getting away from pumping out the crappy reality shows they flooded the market with.

So you think you can iron a shirt with lions chasing after you might have been the next show coming up.

Although I still eagerly await another CSI location, like a small market city where there isn't much exciting crime going on like CSI: Boise. Or maybe another Law and Order, but L&O: Meter Maids.

Personally, I wish Tiny House was a real reality show.

[Joe Canadian]

Originally Posted by wade moore

I did find it interesting that Lost did not even make the Nielsen list but is #3 on the TiVO list.

To me that's bad news for Lost.

Lost premiered October 4th, those ratings end October 1st... that probably has something to do with it.

[Daimyo]

This has made TV watchable to me. I hate shows where each episode is a self-contained plot where everything is resolved by the end of the episode. I think Serialized dramas with plots and characters that develop over a season (or multiple seasons) have allowed television to surpass movies.

[Ksyrup]

Kidnapped has been canceled. Apparently they are going to wrap it up in the 13th episode.

[Joe Canadian]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Kidnapped has been canceled. Apparently they are going to wrap it up in the 13th episode.

They ordered 13 episodes of a new show?

[Ksyrup]

They told them to wrap up production with the 13th episode.