3-Deep and 4-Deep Zones. Are they useful?

Ben E Lou · 04-16-2007, 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Help File

3-Deep Zone - This coverage places both safeties and a cornerback (often the nickel) in deep zones. It gives you a more effective pass defense, but leaves you vulnerable to the run.

4-Deep Zone - This coverage places both safeties and two extra defensive backs in deep zones. This is a prevent defense and should never be used when expecting a run. Even short passes are more likely completed against this defense, but it is very effective against deep passes.

OK. So, the help file seems to strongly indicate that the 4-Deep should only be used when there's little/no chance of the other team running, or on 3rd and 20 or so when even if they do run, it's extremely unlikely to pick up the first.

However, what about the 3-Deep. Is it really only good against Long passing, too? I ask because in my most recent IHOF game, Ardent used the 4-Deep 44 times, and the 3-Deep 31 times. My offensive play breakdown was as follows:

33 rushes for 236 yards (7.15 ypcarry)

Screen Passes: 1 for 1 for 5 yards (5.0 ypa, 5.0 ypc)
Short (0-8): 2 for 9 for 9 yards (4.5 ypa, 4.5 ypc)
Medium (9-18): 20 for 27 for 327 yards (12.1ypa, 16.35ypc)
Long (19+): 2 for 8 for 41 yards (5.1 ypa, 20.5 ypc)

So, it looks like this was only effective against the longer Long passes. (Note that the two "Long" passes that were completed were nearly the shortest "Long" passes possible.) We ate them up on 9-18 yard routes, though. It's probably worth noting that we had (as best as I can tell), 76 YAC on medium routes, 0 on Long routes, and 7 on Screens. Obviously this isn't an exhaustive study by any means, but any time a crazy defense is used and it results in the offense setting a league record in total yards, it's probably worth at least taking a look at what happened. Box score and log to follow...

Ben E Lou · 04-16-2007, 06:48 AM

Week 16, 2013

played in Tucker, GA

45 degrees, fair, calm

Knoxville Rebels	3	10	0	3	-	16
Tucker Tigers	14	7	14	7	-	42

Scoring Summary
1Q: 13:00 TUC - R.J. Ellard 5 pass from Shaun Duncan (Keith Horne extra point)
1Q: 09:57 KNX - Broderick Cox 31 field goal
1Q: 05:31 TUC - R.J. Ellard 4 pass from Shaun Duncan (Keith Horne extra point)
2Q: 12:18 KNX - Broderick Cox 39 field goal
2Q: 03:43 KNX - Donald Blades 5 run (Broderick Cox extra point)
2Q: 00:25 TUC - R.J. Ellard 5 run (Keith Horne extra point)
3Q: 09:34 TUC - Darrell Spears 13 pass from Shaun Duncan (Keith Horne extra point)
3Q: 07:35 TUC - Forrest Truett 11 pass from Shaun Duncan (Keith Horne extra point)
4Q: 13:18 TUC - Junior Banion 37 pass from Shaun Duncan (Keith Horne extra point)
4Q: 07:39 KNX - Broderick Cox 26 field goal

Team Statistics	KNX	TUC
Record	9-6	11-4
First Downs	12	36
- by Rushing	3	11
- by Passing	8	23
- by Penalty	1	2
Total Net Yards	283	618
- Offensive Plays	53	71
- Yards per Play	5.34	8.70
Net Rushing Yards	115	236
- Rushing Attempts	24	33
- Yards per Rush	4.79	7.15
Net Passing Yards	168	382
- Att./Comp./Intrcpt	25 - 14 - 0	38 - 25 - 1
- Gross Passing Yards	194	382
- Sacks/Yards Lost	4/26	0/0
- Yards per Pass Play	5.79	10.05
Fumbles/Lost	3/2	2/1
3rd Down Conversions	4/13	5/8
- Avg. YtG on 3rd Down	6.6	8.4
4th Down Conversions	0/0	0/0
Penalties/Yards	6/45	7/37
Punt Returns/Yards	0/0	2/12
Kick Returns/Yards	5/139	3/32
Interception Ret./Yards	1/22	0/0
2pt Conversions	0/0	0/0
Red Zone Visits	3	6
- Red Zone TDs/FGs	1/2	5/0
Avg. Drive Start	OWN 30	OWN 25
Time of Possession	26:35	33:25

Drive Charts

Knoxville Rebels
Quar	Began	Poss	From	Plays	Yards	Result
1	12:50	3:00	50	5	36	Field Goal
1	5:23	2:17	OWN 44	3	3	Punt
2	14:52	2:42	OPP 45	5	23	Field Goal
2	10:33	1:21	OWN 20	3	32	Fumble
2	8:03	4:26	OWN 3	10	97	Touchdown
2	0:19	0:19	OWN 22	1	-2	Half
3	15:00	1:40	OWN 20	3	9	Punt
3	9:25	1:05	OWN 20	3	1	Fumble
3	7:30	1:55	OWN 34	3	7	Punt
3	1:19	1:09	OWN 20	3	6	Punt
4	13:01	5:28	OWN 39	9	52	Field Goal
4	5:56	1:37	OWN 38	5	5	Punt

Tucker Tigers
Quar	Began	Poss	From	Plays	Yards	Result
1	15:00	2:10	OWN 20	6	80	Touchdown
1	9:50	4:27	OWN 17	8	83	Touchdown
1	3:06	3:14	OWN 6	8	37	Interception
2	12:10	1:37	OWN 33	4	53	Fumble
2	9:12	1:09	OWN 48	3	-7	Punt
2	3:37	3:18	OWN 19	9	81	Touchdown
3	13:20	3:55	OWN 13	7	87	Touchdown
3	8:20	0:50	OPP 15	2	15	Touchdown
3	5:35	4:16	OWN 15	10	76	Missed FG
3	0:10	2:09	OWN 23	5	77	Touchdown
4	7:33	1:37	OWN 7	3	2	Punt
4	4:19	4:19	OWN 20	7	34	Game

Game MVP: Shaun Duncan, Tucker Tigers

Rushing Statistics

Knoxville	Att	Yards	Avg	LG	10+	TD
Donald Blades	12	47	3.92	12	1	1
Cary Hudson	9	59	6.56	42	1	0
Michael Ramsey	3	9	3.00	9	0	0

Tucker	Att	Yards	Avg	LG	10+	TD
R.J. Ellard	32	230	7.19	38	7	1
Archie Trantham	1	6	6.00	6	0	0

Passing Statistics

Knoxville	Att	Comp	Yards	Sk/Yd	TD	LG	Int	Rate
Michael Ramsey	25	14	194	4/26	0	44	0	81.1

Tucker	Att	Comp	Yards	Sk/Yd	TD	LG	Int	Rate
Shaun Duncan	38	25	382	0/0	5	37	1	127.4

Receiving Statistics

Knoxville	Catch	Targ	Yards	Avg	YAC	LG
TE Gabe Rund	5	5	69	13.80	19	28
WR Donnie Maxwell	3	5	19	6.33	2	9
WR Everett Jeffries	3	5	81	27.00	2	44
WR Boyd Callaghan	1	4	4	4.00	1	4
WR Troy Goodwin	1	3	22	22.00	0	22
FB Cary Hudson	1	1	-1	-1.00	0	-1
WR Mack McLaren	0	1	0	0.00	0	0
RB Donald Blades	0	1	0	0.00	0	0

Tucker	Catch	Targ	Yards	Avg	YAC	LG	TD
WR Forrest Truett	10	13	159	15.90	24	21	1
TE Frank Pruett	5	5	72	14.40	10	21	0
WR Darrell Spears	4	10	69	17.25	26	31	1
RB R.J. Ellard	4	4	31	7.75	1	11	2
WR Jessie Jack	1	1	14	14.00	4	14	0
WR Junior Banion	1	5	37	37.00	18	37	1

Interception Statistics

Knoxville	Ints	Yards	Avg	TD
CB Alex Haroldson	1	22	22.00	0

Tucker	Ints	Yards	Avg	TD

Fumble Statistics

Knoxville	Fumb	Recov	Force
Michael Ramsey	2	0	0
Cary Hudson	1	0	0
Pete Lazier	0	1	0
Wayne Huang	0	1	0
Leon Bennett	0	0	1
Chad Terrell	0	0	1

Tucker	Fumb	Recov	Force
Jessie Jack	1	0	0
R.J. Ellard	1	0	0
Emile Perry	0	1	1
B.J. Schafer	0	1	0
Shaun Duncan	0	1	0
Thurman Donato	0	0	1
Joseph Varney	0	0	1

Punting Statistics

Knoxville	Punt	Yards	Avg	Net	LG	In20
Donny Gallier	5	269	53.8	47.4	62	4

Tucker	Punt	Yards	Avg	Net	LG	In20
Keith Horne	2	109	54.5	54.5	56	1

Kicking Statistics

Knoxville	FGs	40+Yd	50+Yd	LG	PAT
Broderick Cox	3/3	0/0	0/0	39	1/1

Tucker	FGs	40+Yd	50+Yd	LG	PAT
Keith Horne	0/1	0/0	0/0	0	6/6

Punt Return Statistics

Knoxville	Ret	Yards	Avg	TD

Tucker	Ret	Yards	Avg	TD
Forrest Truett	2	12	6.0	0

Kick Return Statistics

Knoxville	Ret	Yards	Avg	TD
Donnie Maxwell	4	108	27.0	0
Everett Jeffries	1	31	31.0	0

Tucker	Ret	Yards	Avg	TD
Jimmie Youssef	3	32	10.7	0

Defensive Statistics

Knoxville	Tack	Asst	Sack	RPlay	PPlay
OLB Foster Sokol	6	0	0.0	10	15
CB Alex Haroldson	6	0	0.0	27	34
S Wayne Huang	5	2	0.0	30	29
ILB Rex Hopkins	4	3	0.0	29	27
CB Chad Terrell	4	2	0.0	30	34
DT Preston Lee	4	1	0.0	22	36
CB Leon Bennett	4	0	0.0	33	38
OLB Lonnie Schneider	3	1	0.0	19	21
DE Glen Butler	3	0	0.0	31	37
OLB Roger Zimmerman	3	0	0.0	13	12
DT Ivan Sparks	2	1	0.0	6	2
S Issac Graham	2	1	0.0	10	14
OLB Fernando Reese	2	1	0.0	24	33
S Ellis Langdon	2	0	0.0	7	9
WR Troy Goodwin	1	0	---	---	---
DE K.C. Ramaswami	1	0	0.0	31	31
DT Donald Bonner	0	2	0.0	33	38

Tucker	Tack	Asst	Sack	RPlay	PPlay
OLB Leland Crabb	5	2	0.0	22	22
ILB Van Martyn	5	1	0.0	22	28
OLB Thurman Donato	4	0	1.0	14	24
DT B.J. Schafer	4	2	0.0	20	27
S Loren Goodman	4	1	0.0	19	27
CB Fred Reeder	4	1	0.0	22	26
DT Joseph Varney	3	1	2.0	17	25
CB Travis Faumuina	3	0	0.0	23	25
DE Emile Perry	2	1	1.0	23	26
CB Steven Randall	2	1	0.0	11	16
S Will Alcott	2	0	0.0	19	20
OLB James Schrock	1	2	0.0	11	9
DE Cecil Doney	1	0	0.0	14	10
TE Frank Pruett	1	0	---	---	---
WR Junior Banion	1	0	---	---	---

Pass Rush Statistics

Knoxville	Block	Hurry	PPlay
DE Glen Butler	1	1	37
DT Donald Bonner	1	0	38
ILB Rex Hopkins	0	1	27

Tucker	Sack	Hurry	Knock	PPlay
DT Joseph Varney	2.0	1	1	25
DE Emile Perry	1.0	0	1	26
OLB Thurman Donato	1.0	0	0	24
DT B.J. Schafer	0.0	1	1	27
DE Burt Bailey	0.0	1	0	20
CB Travis Faumuina	0.0	1	0	25

Pass Defense Statistics

Knoxville	Caught	Defnsd	Intrcp	PPlay
CB Chad Terrell	5	1	0	34
CB Alex Haroldson	5	0	1	34
CB Leon Bennett	4	1	0	38
OLB Foster Sokol	2	0	0	15
S Issac Graham	2	0	0	14
OLB Roger Zimmerman	2	0	0	12
S Wayne Huang	2	0	0	29
S Ellis Langdon	1	1	0	9
OLB Lonnie Schneider	1	0	0	21
ILB Rex Hopkins	1	0	0	27

Tucker	Caught	Defnsd	PPlay
ILB Van Martyn	3	0	28
CB Fred Reeder	3	0	26
CB Travis Faumuina	2	1	25
CB Steven Randall	2	0	16
S Will Alcott	1	1	20
DE Emile Perry	1	0	26
S Loren Goodman	1	0	27
OLB Leland Crabb	1	0	22

Blocking Statistics

Knoxville	KeyBl	BlOpp	RPly	SckA	PPly
Tom Jeffries	2	3	14	0	23
Arnold Sanders	1	7	21	1	26
Al Joseph	1	4	24	1	29
Ray Costello	0	4	20	0	22
Glenn Schuman	0	1	22	1	26
Mitchell Arnold	0	1	9	0	17
Gabe Rund	0	1	15	0	19
Donovan Roberts	0	1	9	0	8
Pete Lazier	0	0	19	1	19

Tucker	KeyBl	BlOpp	Panc	RPly	PPly
Leon Propst	3	8	0	30	34
Brady Edwards	3	6	1	27	31
Andy Portillo	3	5	0	27	31
Stephen Lavender	2	5	0	27	34
Frank Pruett	2	2	1	32	32
K.C. Pardee	2	2	0	10	9
John Crouch	1	3	1	27	31
Ernest Browning	0	1	0	10	12
Damon Bell	0	1	0	6	7

Special Teams Statistics

Knoxville	Tackles	STPlays
Fernando Reese	2	11
Will Davidson	1	22
Ellis Langdon	1	13
Mitchell Arnold	1	11
Wes Hunter	0	20
Mack McLaren	0	15
Stan Hastings	0	14
Foster Sokol	0	12
Issac Graham	0	12
Chad Terrell	0	11
Ray Costello	0	8
Glenn Schuman	0	8
Al Joseph	0	8
Tom Jeffries	0	8
Lonnie Schneider	0	8
Broderick Cox	0	8
Donnie Maxwell	0	7
Everett Jeffries	0	7
Arnold Sanders	0	5
Donny Gallier	0	5
Wayne Huang	0	5
Donald Blades	0	5
Bart Thompson	0	5
Pete Lazier	0	3
Kris Kosderka	0	3
Roger Zimmerman	0	3
Alex Haroldson	0	3
Michael Ramsey	0	3
Preston Lee	0	2
Donald Bonner	0	1
Glen Butler	0	1
Troy Goodwin	0	1
Kelvin Waite	0	1
Leon Bennett	0	1
Gabe Rund	0	1
K.C. Ramaswami	0	1
Rex Hopkins	0	1

Tucker	Tackles	STPlays
Travis Faumuina	2	11
Jared Molloy	1	15
Thurman Donato	1	13
James Schrock	1	12
Irv Downs	0	25
Ernest Nixon	0	20
Junior Lee	0	17
Irv Wayne	0	15
Steven Randall	0	13
Jessie Jack	0	13
Leland Crabb	0	13
Loren Goodman	0	7
Rod Green	0	7
Curtis Stoffel	0	7
B.J. Schafer	0	6
Jackie Villagomez	0	5
Jimmie Youssef	0	5
Will Alcott	0	5
Winston Sprinkle	0	5
Carlos Henke	0	4
Emile Perry	0	3
Stephen Lavender	0	3
Ernest Browning	0	3
Keith Horne	0	3
Harold Prescott	0	3
Van Martyn	0	3
Joseph Varney	0	3
K.C. Pardee	0	3
Cecil Doney	0	2
Forrest Truett	0	2
John Crouch	0	2
Fred Reeder	0	2
Stephen Doyle	0	1
Burt Bailey	0	1
Damon Bell	0	1

Directional Rushing Statistics

Distance	Att	Yards	Avg
Left	4	26	6.5
Middle	15	88	5.9
Right	4	3	0.8
None	1	-2	-2.0

Distance	Att	Yards	Avg
Left	7	59	8.4
Middle	8	51	6.4
Right	18	126	7.0
None	0	0	0.0

Detailed Passing Statistics

Knoxville	Att	Cmp	20+	BdTh	Drop	Dfns	Hurr	Knck	Intc
Michael Ramsey	25	14	3	2	3	2	4	3	0

Tucker	Att	Cmp	20+	BdTh	Drop	Dfns	Hurr	Knck	Intc
Shaun Duncan	38	25	7	2	3	3	2	0	1

Directional Passing Statistics

Distance	Att	Comp	Yards	Avg
Screen	0	0	0	0.0
Short (0-8 Yds)	6	6	27	4.5
Medium (9-18 Yds)	11	4	64	5.8
Long (19+ Yds)	8	4	103	12.9

Distance	Att	Comp	Yards	Avg
Screen	1	1	5	5.0
Short (0-8 Yds)	2	2	9	4.5
Medium (9-18 Yds)	27	20	327	12.1
Long (19+ Yds)	8	2	41	5.1

Detailed Receiving Statistics

Knoxville	Targt	Caugt	Dropd	Yards	20+	PPlay
TE Gabe Rund	5	5	0	69	1	19
WR Donnie Maxwell	5	3	1	19	0	11
WR Everett Jeffries	5	3	0	81	1	24
WR Boyd Callaghan	4	1	1	4	0	14
WR Troy Goodwin	3	1	1	22	1	18
WR Mack McLaren	1	0	0	0	0	3
FB Cary Hudson	1	1	0	-1	0	10
RB Donald Blades	1	0	0	0	0	15

Tucker	Targt	Caugt	Dropd	Yards	20+	PPlay
WR Forrest Truett	13	10	2	159	3	29
WR Darrell Spears	10	4	0	69	2	35
TE Frank Pruett	5	5	0	72	1	32
WR Junior Banion	5	1	1	37	1	20
RB R.J. Ellard	4	4	0	31	0	33
WR Jessie Jack	1	1	0	14	0	7

Red-Zone Rushing Statistics

Knoxville	Att	Yards	Avg	Overall Avg
Cary Hudson	2	6	3.00	6.56
Michael Ramsey	1	2	2.00	3.00
Donald Blades	1	5	5.00	3.92

Tucker	Att	Yards	Avg	Overall Avg
R.J. Ellard	7	32	4.57	7.19

Red-Zone Passing Statistics

Knoxville	Att	Comp	Yards	Avg/Att	Overall Avg
Michael Ramsey	4	2	7	1.75	7.76

Tucker	Att	Comp	Yards	Avg/Att	Overall Avg
Shaun Duncan	8	7	63	7.88	10.05

Red-Zone Receiving Statistics

Knoxville	Target	Catch	Yards	Avg/Targ	Overall Avg
WR Donnie Maxwell	2	1	3	1.50	3.80
WR Boyd Callaghan	1	1	4	4.00	1.00
WR Mack McLaren	1	0	0	0.00	0.00

Tucker	Target	Catch	Yards	Avg/Targ	Overall Avg
WR Darrell Spears	2	1	13	6.50	6.90
WR Forrest Truett	2	2	22	11.00	12.23
TE Frank Pruett	2	2	19	9.50	14.40
RB R.J. Ellard	2	2	9	4.50	7.75

Third Down Rushing Statistics

Knoxville	Rushes	Conversions
Donald Blades	2	2
Michael Ramsey	1	0

Tucker	Rushes	Conversions
R.J. Ellard	2	2

Third Down Passing Statistics

Knoxville	Att	Comp	Conversions
Michael Ramsey	9	5	2

Tucker	Att	Comp	Conversions
Shaun Duncan	6	4	3

Third Down Receiving Statistics

Knoxville	Targ	Catch	Conversions
WR Donnie Maxwell	5	3	1
WR Boyd Callaghan	2	0	0
TE Gabe Rund	2	2	1

Tucker	Targ	Catch	Conversions
WR Darrell Spears	2	1	1
TE Frank Pruett	2	2	1
WR Forrest Truett	1	0	0
WR Junior Banion	1	1	1

Section	Attendance
Stadium	72,000 (80,000 capacity)
Upper Deck	21,800 (24,300)
End Zone	16,100 (17,600)
Mezzanine	9,200 (10,100)
Sideline Seats	13,900 (15,500)
Club Seats	4,600 (5,000)
Luxury Boxes	6,400 (7,500)

Ben E Lou · 04-16-2007, 06:50 AM

Week 16, 2013

Played in Tucker, GA, weather: 45 degrees, fair, calm.

Tucker won the toss and elected to receive.

Start of first quarter.

(1Q: 15:00) Broderick Cox kicked off 75 yards from the KNX30. Touchback.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass. Reese is blitzing.
1-10-TUC20 (1Q: 15:00) The Solution Duncan pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Forrest Truett. DE Glen Butler hurried the quarterback into a bad throw. The quarterback threw into double coverage.

Tucker: I formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
2-10-TUC20 (1Q: 14:51) The Solution Duncan pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Darrell Spears. CB Chad Terrell defended the pass. The quarterback threw into double coverage.

Tucker: Pro formation with two tight ends, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Huang is blitzing.
3-10-TUC20 (1Q: 14:42) R.J. Ellard ran around right end for 24 yards. Tackled by ILB Rex Hopkins. Key block delivered by Andy Portillo.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC44 (1Q: 14:09) R.J. Ellard ran around the left tackle for 38 yards. Tackled by S Ellis Langdon. Key block delivered by Brady Edwards.

Tucker: Pro formation with two tight ends, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
1-10-KNX18 (1Q: 13:33) The Solution Duncan pass completed to TE Frank Pruett for 13 yards. The receiver went out of bounds. Tackled by CB Leon Bennett. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Tucker: I formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-5-KNX05 (1Q: 13:00) The Solution Duncan pass completed to RB R.J. Ellard for 5 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! The quarterback threw away from the double coverage. Tucker 6, Knoxville 0

(1Q: 13:00) Extra point by Keith Horne was good. Tucker 7, Knoxville 0

(1Q: 12:50) Rod Green kicked off 56 yards from the TUC30. Donnie Maxwell returned the ball 36 yards to the TUC50. Tackled by Travis Faumuina.

Knoxville: Pro formation with two tight ends, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Martyn and Crabb are blitzing.
1-10-TUC50 (1Q: 12:23) Michael Ramsey pass completed to TE Gabe Rund for 12 yards. Tackled by CB Travis Faumuina.

Knoxville: I formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the run. Donato, Martyn and Crabb are blitzing.
1-10-TUC38 (1Q: 11:36) Michael Ramsey pass completed to WR Troy Goodwin for 22 yards. The receiver went out of bounds. Tackled by CB Steven Randall.

Knoxville: Pro formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass. Crabb and Goodman are blitzing.
1-10-TUC16 (1Q: 10:58) Michael Ramsey kept the ball, running around right end for 2 yards. Tackled by CB Travis Faumuina.

Knoxville: Five-Receiver Spread formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, keying aggressively on the run. Donato, Randall and Faumuina are blitzing.
2-8-TUC14 (1Q: 10:13) Michael Ramsey pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Mack McLaren. CB Travis Faumuina hurried the quarterback into a bad throw.

Knoxville: Five-Receiver Spread formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 2-deep man-to-man coverage, expecting the pass. Donato, Randall and Alcott are blitzing.
3-8-TUC14 (1Q: 10:06) St. Louis Ramsey pass was dropped by WR Donnie Maxwell.

4-8-TUC14 (1Q: 09:57) Broderick Cox attempted a 31 yard field goal and succeeded. Tucker 7, Knoxville 3

(1Q: 09:50) Broderick Cox kicked off 65 yards from the KNX30. Jimmie Youssef returned the ball 12 yards to the TUC17. Tackled by Fernando Reese.

Tucker: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
1-10-TUC17 (1Q: 09:24) The Solution Duncan pass completed to WR Forrest Truett for 20 yards. Tackled by OLB Roger Zimmerman, assisted by CB Chad Terrell. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. Truett gained 6 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC37 (1Q: 08:49) R.J. Ellard ran around the left tackle for 3 yards. Tackled by DE Glen Butler.

Tucker: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
2-7-TUC40 (1Q: 08:15) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Forrest Truett for 16 yards. Tackled by S Issac Graham. Truett gained 4 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Tucker: Pro formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-KNX44 (1Q: 07:45) The Solution Duncan pass completed to RB R.J. Ellard for 11 yards. Tackled by OLB Lonnie Schneider. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Tucker: I formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-KNX33 (1Q: 07:16) The Solution Duncan pass completed to WR Forrest Truett for 13 yards. Tackled by CB Leon Bennett. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. Truett gained 3 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw into double coverage.

Tucker: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Schneider is blitzing.
1-10-KNX20 (1Q: 06:43) R.J. Ellard ran around right end for 5 yards. Tackled by CB Leon Bennett, assisted by ILB Rex Hopkins. Key block delivered by K.C. Pardee.

Tucker: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Reese is blitzing.
2-5-KNX15 (1Q: 06:05) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Forrest Truett for 11 yards. Tackled by CB Alex Haroldson. The quarterback threw into double coverage.

Tucker: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the run.
1-4-KNX04 (1Q: 05:31) The Solution Duncan pass completed to RB R.J. Ellard for 4 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Tucker 13, Knoxville 3

(1Q: 05:31) Extra point by Keith Horne was good. Tucker 14, Knoxville 3

(1Q: 05:23) Rod Green kicked off 57 yards from the TUC30. Everett Jeffries returned the ball 31 yards to the KNX44. Tackled by Travis Faumuina.

Knoxville: Pro formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Martyn and Crabb are blitzing.
1-10-KNX44 (1Q: 04:57) PENALTY: Knoxville was called for a False Start.

Knoxville: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Henke and Crabb are blitzing.
1-15-KNX39 (1Q: 04:49) St. Louis Ramsey pass was thrown incomplete, intended for WR Everett Jeffries.

Knoxville: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the run. Crabb is blitzing.
2-15-KNX39 (1Q: 04:40) Michael Ramsey pass completed to FB Cary Hudson for -1 yards. Tackled by DE Emile Perry, assisted by CB Fred Reeder.

Knoxville: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass. Donato, Martyn and Crabb are blitzing.
3-16-KNX38 (1Q: 03:54) Michael Ramsey scrambled for 9 yards. Tackled by CB Fred Reeder.

4-7-KNX47 (1Q: 03:17) Donny Gallier punted 47 yards. The ball was marked out of bounds at the TUC06.

Tucker: Pro formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC06 (1Q: 03:06) The Solution Duncan pass was blocked at the line, intended for WR Darrell Spears. DT Donald Bonner blocked the pass. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Tucker: Strong formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
2-10-TUC06 (1Q: 02:56) R.J. Ellard ran around right end for 14 yards. Tackled by DT Ivan Sparks. Key block delivered by Leon Propst.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
1-10-TUC20 (1Q: 02:10) R.J. Ellard ran around right end for 5 yards. Tackled by ILB Rex Hopkins. Key block delivered by Frank Pruett.

Tucker: I formation with two tight ends, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
2-5-TUC25 (1Q: 01:35) R.J. Ellard ran around right end for 5 yards. Tackled by DE Glen Butler. Key block delivered by John Crouch. Crouch ran over K.C. Ramaswami to open the hole.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC30 (1Q: 01:11) R.J. Ellard ran inside the right guard for 3 yards. Tackled by DT Preston Lee, assisted by OLB Lonnie Schneider.

Tucker: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Reese is blitzing.
2-7-TUC33 (1Q: 00:47) R.J. Ellard ran outside the right tackle for 5 yards. Tackled by DT Preston Lee, assisted by S Wayne Huang.

Tucker: I formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
3-2-TUC38 (1Q: 00:14) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Darrell Spears for 5 yards. Tackled by CB Chad Terrell. Spears gained 7 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Start of second quarter.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC43 (2Q: 15:00) Shaun Duncan pass was intended for WR Darrell Spears and was intercepted by CB Alex Haroldson at the KNX33. The interception was returned 22 yards. Tackled by Frank Pruett.

Knoxville: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and strong-side man, otherwise cover-7 zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Crabb, Martyn and Schrock are blitzing.
1-10-TUC45 (2Q: 14:52) Cary Hudson ran inside the left tackle for 4 yards. Tackled by DT B.J. Schafer, assisted by OLB James Schrock.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Crabb and Goodman are blitzing.
2-6-TUC41 (2Q: 14:20) PENALTY: Knoxville was called for a False Start.

Knoxville: Pro formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass. Martyn and Crabb are blitzing.
2-11-TUC46 (2Q: 14:07) St. Louis Ramsey pass completed to TE Gabe Rund for 15 yards. Tackled by CB Fred Reeder. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. Rund gained 5 yards after the catch.

Knoxville: I formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep man-to-man coverage, expecting the pass. Donato, Crabb and Goodman are blitzing.
1-10-TUC31 (2Q: 13:46) St. Louis Ramsey sacked by OLB Thurman Donato for a loss of 5 yards. Sack allowed by Pete Lazier.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation with trips receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Crabb, Schrock and Reeder are blitzing.
2-15-TUC36 (2Q: 13:21) Donald Blades ran inside the left guard for 7 yards. Tackled by DT B.J. Schafer.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and strong-side man, otherwise cover-7 zone coverage, expecting the pass. Martyn and Schrock are blitzing.
3-8-TUC29 (2Q: 12:47) St. Louis Ramsey pass completed to TE Gabe Rund for 7 yards. Tackled by OLB Leland Crabb, assisted by S Loren Goodman.

4-1-TUC22 (2Q: 12:18) Broderick Cox attempted a 39 yard field goal and succeeded. Tucker 14, Knoxville 6

(2Q: 12:10) Broderick Cox kicked off 50 yards from the KNX30. Jimmie Youssef returned the ball 13 yards to the TUC33. Tackled by Will Davidson.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC33 (2Q: 11:49) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Forrest Truett for 19 yards. Tackled by CB Alex Haroldson. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. Truett gained 5 yards after the catch.

Tucker: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-KNX48 (2Q: 11:24) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Forrest Truett for 20 yards. Tackled by CB Leon Bennett. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. The quarterback threw into double coverage.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
1-10-KNX28 (2Q: 10:45) Shaun Duncan pass was thrown incomplete, intended for WR Darrell Spears. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with trips receivers, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
2-10-KNX28 (2Q: 10:38) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Jessie Jack for 14 yards. Tackled by CB Leon Bennett. Jack gained 4 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage. The ball was fumbled and recovered by KNX Wayne Huang for 6 yards to the KNX20.

Knoxville: Strong formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass. Martyn, Crabb and Faumuina are blitzing.
1-10-KNX20 (2Q: 10:33) Cary Hudson ran inside the left tackle for 42 yards. Tackled by OLB Thurman Donato. The ball was fumbled and recovered by KNX Pete Lazier to the TUC38.

Knoxville: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Crabb, Martyn and Schrock are blitzing.
1-10-TUC38 (2Q: 09:55) Donald Blades ran outside the right tackle for -1 yards. Tackled by ILB Van Martyn.

Knoxville: I formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, expecting the pass. Crabb, Schrock and Alcott are blitzing.
2-11-TUC39 (2Q: 09:23) St. Louis Ramsey sacked by DE Emile Perry for a loss of 9 yards. Sack allowed by Glenn Schuman. The ball was fumbled and recovered by TUC Emile Perry on the TUC48.

Tucker: I formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC48 (2Q: 09:12) R.J. Ellard ran around right end for -2 yards. Tackled by OLB Foster Sokol, assisted by DT Donald Bonner.

Tucker: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the run.
2-12-TUC46 (2Q: 08:40) PENALTY: Tucker was called for a False Start.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Hopkins is blitzing.
2-17-TUC41 (2Q: 08:34) Shaun Duncan pass was dropped by WR Junior Banion.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
3-17-TUC41 (2Q: 08:25) Shaun Duncan pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Darrell Spears. S Ellis Langdon defended the pass.

4-17-TUC41 (2Q: 08:13) Keith Horne punted 56 yards. The ball was downed at the KNX03.

Knoxville: Pro formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, expecting the pass. Donato, Crabb and Alcott are blitzing.
1-10-KNX03 (2Q: 08:03) Donald Blades ran inside the left tackle for 3 yards. Tackled by S Loren Goodman.

Knoxville: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and strong-side man, otherwise cover-7 zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Martyn, Crabb and Goodman are blitzing.
2-7-KNX06 (2Q: 07:16) Michael Ramsey pass completed to TE Gabe Rund for 7 yards. Tackled by CB Fred Reeder. Rund gained 1 yard after the catch.

Knoxville: Strong formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep man-to-man coverage, expecting the pass. Donato and Crabb are blitzing.
1-10-KNX13 (2Q: 06:47) St. Louis Ramsey pass completed to WR Everett Jeffries for 19 yards. Tackled by ILB Van Martyn.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and strong-side man, otherwise cover-7 zone coverage, keying aggressively on the run. Crabb, Martyn and Schrock are blitzing.
1-10-KNX32 (2Q: 06:13) Donald Blades ran around the left tackle for 1 yard. Tackled by DE Cecil Doney, assisted by OLB James Schrock.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the run. Crabb is blitzing.
2-9-KNX33 (2Q: 05:40) Cary Hudson ran outside the right tackle for 0 yards. Tackled by OLB Leland Crabb, assisted by DT Joseph Varney. DT Joseph Varney knocked down Al Joseph to break up the play.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the run. Donato, Martyn and Crabb are blitzing.
3-9-KNX33 (2Q: 05:16) Michael Ramsey sacked by DE Emile Perry for a loss of 6 yards. Sack allowed by Pete Lazier. PENALTY: Tucker was called for Offsides.

Knoxville: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Crabb and Randall are blitzing.
3-4-KNX38 (2Q: 05:01) Michael Ramsey pass completed to WR Donnie Maxwell for 7 yards. Tackled by CB Travis Faumuina. Maxwell gained 2 yards after the catch.

Knoxville: I formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the run. Crabb, Schrock and Goodman are blitzing.
1-10-KNX45 (2Q: 04:41) St. Louis Ramsey pass completed to WR Everett Jeffries for 44 yards. Tackled by CB Fred Reeder. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. Jeffries gained 2 yards after the catch.

Knoxville: I formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, expecting the pass. Donato, Crabb and Reeder are blitzing.
1-10-TUC11 (2Q: 04:23) Cary Hudson ran around right end for 2 yards. Tackled by DT Joseph Varney, assisted by CB Steven Randall.

Knoxville: Pro formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the run. Crabb, Martyn and Schrock are blitzing.
2-8-TUC09 (2Q: 04:04) Cary Hudson ran inside the right tackle for 4 yards. Tackled by S Will Alcott, assisted by ILB Van Martyn.

Knoxville: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Crabb, Martyn and Schrock are blitzing.
3-4-TUC05 (2Q: 03:43) Donald Blades ran inside the right tackle for 5 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Key block delivered by Al Joseph. Tucker 14, Knoxville 12

(2Q: 03:43) Extra point by Broderick Cox was good. Tucker 14, Knoxville 13

(2Q: 03:37) Broderick Cox kicked off 58 yards from the KNX30. Jimmie Youssef returned the ball 7 yards to the TUC19. Tackled by Ellis Langdon.

Tucker: Strong formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC19 (2Q: 03:15) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Forrest Truett for 15 yards. Tackled by S Issac Graham, assisted by ILB Rex Hopkins. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. Truett gained 6 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw into double coverage.

Tucker: I formation with two tight ends, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC34 (2Q: 02:47) The Solution Duncan pass completed to RB R.J. Ellard for 11 yards. Tackled by S Wayne Huang. Ellard gained 1 yard after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Tucker: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass. Zimmerman and Huang are blitzing.
1-10-TUC45 (2Q: 02:10) R.J. Ellard ran around right end for 1 yard. Tackled by S Wayne Huang.

Official time out for the two-minute warning.

Tucker: Pro formation with two tight ends, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
2-9-TUC46 (2Q: 02:00) R.J. Ellard ran outside the right tackle for 19 yards. Tackled by CB Chad Terrell, assisted by ILB Rex Hopkins. The ball was fumbled and recovered by TUC Shaun Duncan to the KNX35.

Tucker: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-KNX35 (2Q: 01:15) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Darrell Spears for 20 yards. Tackled by CB Alex Haroldson. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. Spears gained 1 yard after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-KNX15 (2Q: 00:46) R.J. Ellard ran around left end for 3 yards. Tackled by ILB Rex Hopkins.

(2Q: 00:46) Tucker called a time out.

Tucker: Strong formation with three wideouts, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
2-7-KNX12 (2Q: 00:36) R.J. Ellard ran inside the left tackle for 7 yards. Tackled by ILB Rex Hopkins. Key block delivered by Leon Propst. PENALTY: Knoxville was called for Offsides. The penalty was declined.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with trips receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Sokol is blitzing.
1-5-KNX05 (2Q: 00:36) R.J. Ellard ran around right end for 0 yards. Tackled by CB Alex Haroldson, assisted by DT Preston Lee.

(2Q: 00:36) Tucker called a time out.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with dime personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
2-5-KNX05 (2Q: 00:25) R.J. Ellard ran around left end for 5 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Key block delivered by Stephen Lavender. Tucker 20, Knoxville 13

(2Q: 00:25) Extra point by Keith Horne was good. Tucker 21, Knoxville 13

(2Q: 00:19) Rod Green kicked off 67 yards from the TUC30. Donnie Maxwell returned the ball 19 yards to the KNX22. Tackled by Jared Molloy.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 with dime personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Downs and Goodman are blitzing.
1-10-KNX22 (2Q: 00:10) Michael Ramsey dropped to one knee for -2 yards.

Start of third quarter.

(3Q: 15:00) Rod Green kicked off 72 yards from the TUC30. Touchback.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, expecting the pass. Donato, Henke and Crabb are blitzing.
1-10-KNX20 (3Q: 15:00) Donald Blades ran inside the right guard for -3 yards. Tackled by OLB Leland Crabb.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, expecting the run. Crabb and Schrock are blitzing.
2-13-KNX17 (3Q: 14:34) Donald Blades ran inside the right tackle for 3 yards. Tackled by S Loren Goodman, assisted by DT B.J. Schafer.

Knoxville: Five-Receiver Spread formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, expecting the run. Donato, Martyn and Randall are blitzing.
3-10-KNX20 (3Q: 13:48) St. Louis Ramsey pass completed to WR Donnie Maxwell for 9 yards. Tackled by S Will Alcott. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field.

4-1-KNX29 (3Q: 13:27) Donny Gallier punted 59 yards. Forrest Truett returned the kick 1 yard to the TUC13. Tackled by Mitchell Arnold.

Tucker: I formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC13 (3Q: 13:20) R.J. Ellard ran outside the right tackle for 9 yards. Tackled by DE K.C. Ramaswami. Key block delivered by Stephen Lavender.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the run.
2-1-TUC22 (3Q: 12:42) R.J. Ellard ran inside the left guard for 17 yards. Tackled by OLB Roger Zimmerman. Key block delivered by K.C. Pardee.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with trips receivers, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
1-10-TUC39 (3Q: 12:06) R.J. Ellard ran around left end for 3 yards. Tackled by DE Glen Butler.

Tucker: I formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
2-7-TUC42 (3Q: 11:29) R.J. Ellard ran around left end for 3 yards. Tackled by OLB Lonnie Schneider.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with trips receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
3-4-TUC45 (3Q: 10:53) Shaun Duncan pass completed to TE Frank Pruett for 21 yards. Tackled by OLB Foster Sokol. Pruett gained 8 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Tucker: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-KNX34 (3Q: 10:10) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Forrest Truett for 21 yards. Tackled by CB Alex Haroldson. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
1-10-KNX13 (3Q: 09:34) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Darrell Spears for 13 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Spears gained 4 yards after the catch. Tucker 27, Knoxville 13

(3Q: 09:34) Extra point by Keith Horne was good. Tucker 28, Knoxville 13

(3Q: 09:25) Rod Green kicked off 74 yards from the TUC30. Touchback.

Knoxville: Strong formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the run. Crabb, Martyn and Schrock are blitzing.
1-10-KNX20 (3Q: 09:25) Donald Blades ran around the left tackle for 4 yards. Tackled by OLB Leland Crabb.

Knoxville: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, expecting the run. Donato, Crabb and Randall are blitzing.
2-6-KNX24 (3Q: 08:52) Cary Hudson ran inside the right tackle for 3 yards. Tackled by OLB Thurman Donato.

Knoxville: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the run. Donato, Crabb and Faumuina are blitzing.
3-3-KNX27 (3Q: 08:31) Michael Ramsey sacked by DT Joseph Varney for a loss of 6 yards. Varney simply blew through Arnold Sanders to reach the quarterback and knock him down. The ball was fumbled and recovered by TUC B.J. Schafer for 6 yards to the KNX15.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Zimmerman is blitzing.
1-10-KNX15 (3Q: 08:20) R.J. Ellard ran around left end for 4 yards. Tackled by OLB Lonnie Schneider, assisted by S Wayne Huang.

Tucker: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
2-6-KNX11 (3Q: 07:35) The Solution Duncan pass completed to WR Forrest Truett for 11 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! The quarterback threw into double coverage. Tucker 34, Knoxville 13

(3Q: 07:35) Extra point by Keith Horne was good. Tucker 35, Knoxville 13

(3Q: 07:30) Rod Green kicked off 61 yards from the TUC30. Donnie Maxwell returned the ball 25 yards to the KNX34. Tackled by James Schrock.

Knoxville: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Crabb, Schrock and Randall are blitzing.
1-10-KNX34 (3Q: 07:06) Donald Blades ran outside the right tackle for 3 yards. Tackled by OLB Leland Crabb, assisted by OLB James Schrock. PENALTY: Knoxville was called for Offensive Holding.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation with trips receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass. Donato, Crabb and Goodman are blitzing.
1-20-KNX24 (3Q: 06:58) Cary Hudson ran inside the right tackle for -1 yards. Tackled by S Loren Goodman.

Knoxville: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass. Crabb, Schrock and Faumuina are blitzing.
2-21-KNX23 (3Q: 06:29) St. Louis Ramsey pass completed to WR Everett Jeffries for 18 yards. Tackled by CB Steven Randall.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass. Martyn, Crabb and Alcott are blitzing.
3-3-KNX41 (3Q: 05:51) Michael Ramsey pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Donnie Maxwell. CB Travis Faumuina defended the pass.

4-3-KNX41 (3Q: 05:45) Donny Gallier punted 44 yards. Irv Downs called for a fair catch at the TUC15.

Tucker: Weak formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Hopkins is blitzing.
1-10-TUC15 (3Q: 05:35) Shaun Duncan pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Junior Banion. ILB Rex Hopkins hurried the quarterback into a bad throw. The quarterback threw into double coverage. PENALTY: Knoxville was called for Unnecessary Roughness.

Tucker: I formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
1-10-TUC30 (3Q: 05:26) Archie Trantham ran inside the right tackle for 6 yards. Tackled by OLB Foster Sokol. Key block delivered by Brady Edwards.

Tucker: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
2-4-TUC36 (3Q: 04:46) R.J. Ellard ran outside the right tackle for 10 yards. Tackled by DT Preston Lee, assisted by OLB Fernando Reese. Key block delivered by Leon Propst.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
1-10-TUC46 (3Q: 04:06) Shaun Duncan pass was blocked at the line, intended for WR Junior Banion. DE Glen Butler blocked the pass.

Tucker: Strong formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
2-10-TUC46 (3Q: 03:57) The Solution Duncan pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Forrest Truett. S Wayne Huang defended the pass. The quarterback threw into double coverage. PENALTY: Knoxville was called for Defensive Holding.

Tucker: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
1-10-KNX49 (3Q: 03:47) Shaun Duncan pass was dropped by WR Forrest Truett. The quarterback threw into double coverage.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the run.
2-10-KNX49 (3Q: 03:41) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Darrell Spears for 31 yards. Tackled by OLB Foster Sokol. Spears gained 14 yards after the catch.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-KNX18 (3Q: 02:59) The Solution Duncan pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Darrell Spears. CB Leon Bennett knocked the ball out of his grasp. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
2-10-KNX18 (3Q: 02:53) R.J. Ellard ran around right end for 8 yards. Tackled by OLB Fernando Reese. Key block delivered by Frank Pruett. Pruett ran over Rex Hopkins to open the hole.

Tucker: I formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Schneider is blitzing.
3-2-KNX10 (3Q: 02:19) PENALTY: Tucker was called for a False Start.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
3-7-KNX15 (3Q: 02:09) Shaun Duncan pass completed to TE Frank Pruett for 6 yards. Tackled by CB Alex Haroldson. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field.

4-1-KNX09 (3Q: 01:26) Keith Horne attempted a 26 yard field goal and missed wide to the right.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep man-to-man coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Crabb, Schrock and Randall are blitzing.
1-10-KNX20 (3Q: 01:19) Donald Blades ran inside the left guard for 6 yards. Tackled by DT B.J. Schafer, assisted by DE Emile Perry. Key block delivered by Tom Jeffries.

Knoxville: I formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Crabb and Goodman are blitzing.
2-4-KNX26 (3Q: 00:39) St. Louis Ramsey pass was thrown incomplete, intended for RB Donald Blades.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and strong-side man, otherwise cover-7 zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Faumuina and Goodman are blitzing.
3-4-KNX26 (3Q: 00:27) St. Louis Ramsey pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Boyd Callaghan. DE Burt Bailey hurried the quarterback into a bad throw.

4-4-KNX26 (3Q: 00:20) Donny Gallier punted 62 yards. Forrest Truett returned the kick 11 yards to the TUC23. Tackled by Fernando Reese.

Tucker: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Sokol is blitzing.
1-10-TUC23 (3Q: 00:10) Shaun Duncan pass completed to TE Frank Pruett for 14 yards. Tackled by CB Chad Terrell, assisted by S Issac Graham. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. Pruett gained 2 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Start of fourth quarter.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC37 (4Q: 15:00) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Forrest Truett for 13 yards. Tackled by S Ellis Langdon, assisted by CB Chad Terrell. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC50 (4Q: 14:34) The Solution Duncan pass completed to TE Frank Pruett for 18 yards. Tackled by CB Chad Terrell.

Tucker: I formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
1-10-KNX32 (4Q: 14:06) Shaun Duncan pass fell incomplete, intended for TE Frank Pruett. DE Glen Butler hurried the quarterback into a bad throw. PENALTY: Tucker was called for Intentional Grounding.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with trips receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
2-20-KNX42 (4Q: 14:00) R.J. Ellard ran inside the right guard for 5 yards. Tackled by DT Preston Lee.

Tucker: Strong formation with three wideouts, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
3-15-KNX37 (4Q: 13:18) The Solution Duncan pass completed to WR Junior Banion for 37 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Banion gained 18 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage. Tucker 41, Knoxville 13

(4Q: 13:18) Extra point by Keith Horne was good. Tucker 42, Knoxville 13

(4Q: 13:01) Rod Green kicked off 59 yards from the TUC30. Donnie Maxwell returned the ball 28 yards to the KNX39. Tackled by Thurman Donato.

Knoxville: Strong formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Crabb and Reeder are blitzing.
1-10-KNX39 (4Q: 12:27) Michael Ramsey pass was dropped by WR Troy Goodwin.

Knoxville: I formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep man-to-man coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Crabb, Schrock and Alcott are blitzing.
2-10-KNX39 (4Q: 12:20) Cary Hudson ran inside the left guard for 1 yard. Tackled by OLB James Schrock, assisted by OLB Leland Crabb.

Knoxville: Pro formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and weak-side man, otherwise cover-7 zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Crabb, Schrock and Randall are blitzing.
3-9-KNX40 (4Q: 11:44) St. Louis Ramsey pass completed to TE Gabe Rund for 28 yards. Tackled by ILB Van Martyn. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. Rund gained 13 yards after the catch.

Knoxville: Pro formation, with the second receiver in the slot, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Martyn, Crabb and Goodman are blitzing.
1-10-TUC32 (4Q: 11:10) St. Louis Ramsey pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Everett Jeffries. DT Joseph Varney hurried the quarterback into a bad throw.

Knoxville: I formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep man-to-man coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Crabb and Goodman are blitzing.
2-10-TUC32 (4Q: 11:02) Donald Blades ran around the left tackle for 9 yards. Tackled by DT B.J. Schafer. Key block delivered by Arnold Sanders.

Knoxville: Pro formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Schrock and Reeder are blitzing.
3-1-TUC23 (4Q: 10:24) Donald Blades ran around the left tackle for 12 yards. Tackled by ILB Van Martyn, assisted by DT B.J. Schafer. Key block delivered by Tom Jeffries. Knoxville's Pete Lazier was hurt on the play.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation with trips receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Schrock, Faumuina and Reeder are blitzing.
1-10-TUC11 (4Q: 09:40) Michael Ramsey sacked by DT Joseph Varney for a loss of 6 yards. Sack allowed by Al Joseph.

Knoxville: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep man-to-man coverage, expecting the pass. Donato, Martyn and Schrock are blitzing.
2-16-TUC17 (4Q: 09:16) St. Louis Ramsey pass completed to WR Boyd Callaghan for 4 yards. The receiver went out of bounds. Tackled by S Loren Goodman. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. Callaghan gained 1 yard after the catch.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Crabb and Alcott are blitzing.
3-12-TUC13 (4Q: 08:29) St. Louis Ramsey pass completed to WR Boyd Callaghan for 10 yards. Tackled by CB Fred Reeder. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. PENALTY: Tucker was called for Offsides.

Knoxville: Pro formation, with the second receiver in the slot, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep man-to-man coverage, expecting the pass. Donato, Crabb and Alcott are blitzing.
3-11-TUC12 (4Q: 08:22) Michael Ramsey pass completed to WR Donnie Maxwell for 3 yards. Tackled by ILB Van Martyn.

4-8-TUC09 (4Q: 07:39) Broderick Cox attempted a 26 yard field goal and succeeded. Tucker 42, Knoxville 16

(4Q: 07:33) Broderick Cox kicked off 74 yards from the KNX30. Jimmie Youssef returned the ball 23 yards to the TUC19. Tackled by Donald Blades. PENALTY: Tucker was called for Holding on the Kick Return.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
1-10-TUC07 (4Q: 07:06) R.J. Ellard ran outside the right tackle for 2 yards. Tackled by S Wayne Huang.

Tucker: I formation, with the second wideout in the slot, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
2-8-TUC09 (4Q: 06:22) The Solution Duncan pass was thrown incomplete, intended for WR Junior Banion. The quarterback threw into double coverage.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Huang is blitzing.
3-8-TUC09 (4Q: 06:16) The Solution Duncan pass was dropped by WR Forrest Truett. The quarterback threw into double coverage.

4-8-TUC09 (4Q: 06:06) Keith Horne punted 53 yards. The ball was marked out of bounds at the KNX38.

Knoxville: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Martyn and Alcott are blitzing.
1-10-KNX38 (4Q: 05:56) St. Louis Ramsey pass was dropped by WR Boyd Callaghan.

Knoxville: I formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep man-to-man coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Martyn and Schrock are blitzing.
2-10-KNX38 (4Q: 05:50) Michael Ramsey pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Troy Goodwin. DT B.J. Schafer hurried the quarterback into a bad throw.

Knoxville: I formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep man-to-man coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Crabb, Goodman and Randall are blitzing.
3-10-KNX38 (4Q: 05:40) PENALTY: Knoxville was called for a False Start.

Knoxville: Five-Receiver Spread formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, expecting the pass. Donato and Randall are blitzing.
3-15-KNX33 (4Q: 05:33) St. Louis Ramsey sacked by DE Big Butt Bailey for a loss of 5 yards. Sack allowed by Ray Costello. PENALTY: Tucker was called for Defensive Holding.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep man-to-man coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Crabb and Faumuina are blitzing.
1-10-KNX38 (4Q: 05:23) Cary Hudson ran inside the left tackle for 4 yards. Tackled by OLB Leland Crabb.

Knoxville: Strong formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep man-to-man coverage, expecting the pass. Donato, Martyn and Crabb are blitzing.
2-6-KNX42 (4Q: 04:57) Donald Blades ran inside the right tackle for 1 yard. Tackled by OLB Thurman Donato, assisted by OLB Leland Crabb.

Knoxville: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Donato, Schrock and Reeder are blitzing.
3-5-KNX43 (4Q: 04:32) Michael Ramsey pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Boyd Callaghan. S Will Alcott defended the pass.

4-5-KNX43 (4Q: 04:26) Donny Gallier punted 57 yards. Touchback.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC20 (4Q: 04:19) R.J. Ellard ran inside the left guard for 1 yard. Tackled by DT Ivan Sparks, assisted by DT Donald Bonner.

Tucker: Pro formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass. Sokol is blitzing.
2-9-TUC21 (4Q: 03:33) R.J. Ellard ran outside the right tackle for 12 yards. Tackled by OLB Foster Sokol. Key block delivered by Andy Portillo.

Tucker: I formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC33 (4Q: 02:50) R.J. Ellard ran around right end for 3 yards. Tackled by OLB Fernando Reese.

Tucker: I formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
2-7-TUC36 (4Q: 02:06) R.J. Ellard ran inside the right guard for 3 yards. Tackled by OLB Roger Zimmerman.

Official time out for the two-minute warning.

Tucker: Strong formation with three wideouts, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
3-4-TUC39 (4Q: 01:59) R.J. Ellard ran outside the right tackle for 7 yards. Tackled by S Wayne Huang. Key block delivered by Brady Edwards.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with two tight ends, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC46 (4Q: 01:16) R.J. Ellard ran inside the left guard for 9 yards. Tackled by OLB Foster Sokol, assisted by DT Ivan Sparks. Key block delivered by Andy Portillo.

Tucker: Single-Back formation, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the run.
2-1-KNX45 (4Q: 00:30) R.J. Ellard ran around right end for -1 yards. Tackled by S Wayne Huang. The defense looked very familiar with that play.

Final Score: Tucker Tigers 42, Knoxville Rebels 16

RedKingGold · 04-16-2007, 07:14 AM

What about the importance of packages while calling 3-deep and 4-deep zones. It seems to me that a team running a 4-3 4-deep zone would not be very effective as all linebackers would be dropping into coverage. Then, the player's individual zone coverage ratings would likely come into play. Two of Knoxville's starting linebackers a rating of 20 or lower in zone coverage. Also, the highest zone rating of any of Knoxville's secondary members is a 60.

However, I'll also admit that I'm not quite sure who would actually be dropping back into coverage based on the help file. What does "two extra defensive backs" mean when applied to a base 4-3 package? Does it mean both starting corners are dropping into a deep zone? Does it mean that the linebackers who would normally be subbed out in a nickel or dime package are dropping into a deep zone? Is it possible that players with higher ratings in zone would be more effective against medium-long passing than Knoxville's starters?

Lots of questions, and I got no answers.

QuikSand · 04-16-2007, 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedKingGold

What does "two extra defensive backs" mean when applied to a base 4-3 package? Does it mean both starting corners are dropping into a deep zone? Does it mean that the linebackers who would normally be subbed out in a nickel or dime package are dropping into a deep zone? Is it possible that players with higher ratings in zone would be more effective against medium-long passing than Knoxville's starters?

Hmmm... at first, my inclination was that this was a no-brainer... that "two extra defensive backs" simply meant the team used the dime personnel as dictated by that page of your depath chart.

But on further reflection, I guess that's not necessarily true -- since we have a separate page to dictate how frequently the nickel and dime packages are used based on the playcalling type. So, it's perfectly sensible that even in agg pass defensivve mindset, you might only have dime personnel on the field 60% of the time... and perhaps just a base packake in there something like 20% of the time. (A Rex defense seems to use percentages like this sometimes)

So, it's certainly possible that the partial answer for this small sample lies with some of the specicifcs of the Knoxville roster, who might just be a poor fit for playing lots of zone. And, add in the lack of perfect control over what players are on the field for such setups, forcing poorly skilled LBs into coverage, and that might make things worse.

Ben E Lou · 04-16-2007, 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedKingGold

What about the importance of packages while calling 3-deep and 4-deep zones. It seems to me that a team running a 4-3 4-deep zone would not be very effective as all linebackers would be dropping into coverage. Then, the player's individual zone coverage ratings would likely come into play. Two of Knoxville's starting linebackers a rating of 20 or lower in zone coverage. Also, the highest zone rating of any of Knoxville's secondary members is a 60.

However, I'll also admit that I'm not quite sure who would actually be dropping back into coverage based on the help file. What does "two extra defensive backs" mean when applied to a base 4-3 package? Does it mean both starting corners are dropping into a deep zone? Does it mean that the linebackers who would normally be subbed out in a nickel or dime package are dropping into a deep zone? Is it possible that players with higher ratings in zone would be more effective against medium-long passing than Knoxville's starters?

Lots of questions, and I got no answers.

Good points about the personnel involved here. I would imagine that the success calculation is weighted more heavily toward the coverage skills of the LBs when in the 3-Deep and 4-Deep and facing Short/Medium routes, and more heavily toward the DBs against Long routes. However, look at this...

Knoxville	Caught	Defnsd	Intrcp	PPlay
CB Chad Terrell	5	1	0	34
CB Alex Haroldson	5	0	1	34
CB Leon Bennett	4	1	0	38
OLB Foster Sokol	2	0	0	15
S Issac Graham	2	0	0	14
OLB Roger Zimmerman	2	0	0	12
S Wayne Huang	2	0	0	29
S Ellis Langdon	1	1	0	9
OLB Lonnie Schneider	1	0	0	21
ILB Rex Hopkins	1	0	0	27

23 passes thrown at DBs, and only 6 at LBs. The DBs were heavily held responsible for this debacle.

On another note, there were 3 drops, 2 bad passes, and 2 passes blocked. What happened to the other two passes?

QuikSand · 04-16-2007, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SkyDog

On another note, there were 3 drops, 2 bad passes, and 2 passes blocked. What happened to the other two passes?

Hurries? I seem to recall that hurries lead to a bad pass (incomplete), but don't get tallied that way against the QB in the stats.

edit - duh, just checked, and there were indeed two KNX hurries.

Ben E Lou · 04-16-2007, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuikSand

Hurries? I seem to recall that hurries lead to a bad pass (incomplete), but don't get tallied that way against the QB in the stats.

edit - duh, just checked, and there were indeed two KNX hurries.

Ah. Forgot hurries.

RedKingGold · 04-16-2007, 07:53 AM

Are we assuming that pass coverages are an individual-to-individual skill? B/c something here seems to tell me that the way this works is very similar to offensive line play: A result is determined, and then credit is awarded based on the result.

Ben E Lou · 04-16-2007, 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedKingGold

Are we assuming that pass coverages are an individual-to-individual skill? B/c something here seems to tell me that the way this works is very similar to offensive line play: A result is determined, and then credit is awarded based on the result.

Based on looking at some CHE and TUC box scores this year and comparing them to those of some other teams, it's very clear that if it is a team calculation, the responsibilities are still weighted by pass distance. The DBs get a significantly higher percentage of (catches allowed+passes defensed+interceptions) than the LBs against teams that throw downfield more than against teams that don't.

Subby · 04-16-2007, 08:06 AM

Okay - so a few things I noticed...

- Knoxville is often in 3 and 4 deep zone using their base coverage package (not nickel or dime). What defense coverage does the spare cornerback play in that situation (b&r, man, more zone)? When they are in a 4 deep zone using their base coverage, who is covering the wideouts? Or does that mean there is just a shitton of cushion.

- Knoxville only went nickel coverage nine times. Dime coverage once (on second and five at their five, incidentally). That means that for 65 plays they were running these zones from their base coverages. And the game log references double coverage close to 30 times. They blitzed 14 times.

Just thinking from a football perspective, it seems like there aren't enough defensive backs in the game to even run the zone effectively. You have four defensive backs on the field for most plays and almost half of the plays are seeing some type of double coverage - and that is in 3 and 4 deep zones.

Just seems like you are leaving a lot of maneuver room for a team that ran 3 and 4 wr sets 35 times in that game.

Subby · 04-16-2007, 08:18 AM

So, consider this sequence:

Tucker: Strong formation with three wideouts, strength is right.

So you have 3 WR, a FB and a RB as possible receivers.

The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.

You have four defensive backs, all sitting back in zone coverage. There are three linebackers. The team is gambling pass. Does that give them a bonus on their play diagnosis? Not sure exactly what it means for the linebackers, but someone has to have responsibility for the FB and RB.

3-15-KNX37 (4Q: 13:18) The Solution Duncan pass completed to WR Junior Banion for 37 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Banion gained 18 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

At least two of the defensive backs are double covering one of the receivers. At best, you have a prevent defense in place - but it looks like there isn't the proper personnel in place to execute it.

Poli · 04-16-2007, 08:26 AM

I love that I'm able to contribute.

Subby · 04-16-2007, 08:33 AM

Here are the plays where they did have the proper personnel in place:

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC44 (1Q: 14:09) R.J. Ellard ran around the left tackle for 38 yards. Tackled by S Ellis Langdon. Key block delivered by Brady Edwards.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
3-17-TUC41 (2Q: 08:25) Shaun Duncan pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Darrell Spears. S Ellis Langdon defended the pass.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the run.
2-1-TUC22 (3Q: 12:42) R.J. Ellard ran inside the left guard for 17 yards. Tackled by OLB Roger Zimmerman. Key block delivered by K.C. Pardee.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
1-10-KNX13 (3Q: 09:34) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Darrell Spears for 13 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Spears gained 4 yards after the catch. Tucker 27, Knoxville 13

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-KNX18 (3Q: 02:59) The Solution Duncan pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Darrell Spears. CB Leon Bennett knocked the ball out of his grasp. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass.
3-7-KNX15 (3Q: 02:09) Shaun Duncan pass completed to TE Frank Pruett for 6 yards. Tackled by CB Alex Haroldson. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC37 (4Q: 15:00) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Forrest Truett for 13 yards. Tackled by S Ellis Langdon, assisted by CB Chad Terrell. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Huang is blitzing.
3-8-TUC09 (4Q: 06:16) The Solution Duncan pass was dropped by WR Forrest Truett. The quarterback threw into double coverage.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-TUC20 (4Q: 04:19) R.J. Ellard ran inside the left guard for 1 yard. Tackled by DT Ivan Sparks, assisted by DT Donald Bonner.

Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with dime personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
2-5-KNX05 (2Q: 00:25) R.J. Ellard ran around left end for 5 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Key block delivered by Stephen Lavender. Tucker 20, Knoxville 13

So we are getting a REALLY small sample size here, admittedly. Still interesting to look at these plays in isolation.

Warhammer · 04-16-2007, 08:57 AM

First, I think this heavily depends upon the player's ratings in zone coverages for the DBs. Second, I think to properly run a 4-Deep zone, you have to have a ton of DBs in the game, therefore, your dime defense % should be way up there.

Regarding where the DBs are going to be:

4 - Deep zone typically sees the FS, SS, and either the nickel and dime backs deep, or the starting DBs deep. The other DBs and LBs play short zones.

3 - Deep zone has the CBs and FS in the deep zones with LBs and the SS playing the underneath zones.

Another thing to consider, was ardent sending a lot of blitzes against Duncan? If he was, he is using his underneath guys to blitz which opens up the middle routes.

I run a lot of 3 Deep zone, but I really try to stay away from a 4 Deep zone as it gives up way too many underneath routes.

Warhammer · 04-16-2007, 09:00 AM

Another thing, when playing a 4 Deep, that is essentially a prevent defense, so you can be picked apart accordingly.

Subby · 04-16-2007, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warhammer

First, I think this heavily depends upon the player's ratings in zone coverages for the DBs.

Yeah but that's just a hunch, right? Jim seems to allude to it being more complex than that. Not saying you aren't right...just that there isn't any definitive word in this area.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warhammer

Second, I think to properly run a 4-Deep zone, you have to have a ton of DBs in the game, therefore, your dime defense % should be way up there.

That's what I was saying, essentially. Three and four deep zones pull your d-backs way off the ball - and it isn't clear what effect blitzing and double coverages have.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warhammer

Regarding where the DBs are going to be:

4 - Deep zone typically sees the FS, SS, and either the nickel and dime backs deep, or the starting DBs deep. The other DBs and LBs play short zones.

3 - Deep zone has the CBs and FS in the deep zones with LBs and the SS playing the underneath zones.

This isn't what the help file says at all.

QuikSand · 04-16-2007, 09:12 AM

Just thought that perhaps the entire help file might shed some light.

Quote:

Originally Posted by help

Defensive Pass Coverage Screen

The Defensive Pass Coverage Screen allows you to set part of the game plan your team uses when simulating games. The settings on this screen determine how your team chooses its pass coverages under the specified conditions.

This chart is triggered by the pass expectation percentages you assigned to the current situation in the game plan. For example, if it's third and 8 and your game plan indicates you will expect the pass (normal plus aggressive) 96 percent of the time in that situation, then the coverage choice will be determined by the extreme pass situation coverages screen.

To use this screen, enter values for each coverage. The game will automatically adjust these values to add up to 100 percent when you exit the screen, so don't worry about doing the math yourself.

The following basic defensive coverage schemes are available:

1-Deep, Loose Man - This is a basic man-to-man coverage with only the free safety in a deep zone. This is generally called when a run is expected, as it is very vulnerable to any kind of passing attack, particularly to short passes.

1-Deep, Bump and Run - This is the traditional "46" defense, and like the 1-Deep, Loose Man, gets eight men in the box, possibly nine when playing the run aggressively. It is a man-to-man coverage with only the free safety in a deep zone. Pass defenders play much closer to the receivers, trying to keep them from breaking free. This is also vulnerable to a passing attack, particularly to deep passes.

2-Deep, Loose Man - This is one of the most basic coverages. Both safeties drop into deep zones, and the other defenders play a man-to-man defense. It has no major strengths or weaknesses.

2-Deep, Bump and Run - This is the "Cover-2" defense that so many teams use today. Both safeties drop into deep zones, and the other pass defenders play much closer to the receivers, often bumping them within the legal five-yard limit. This defense has no major weaknesses, and is a little stronger against a short passing attack.

Strong-Side Man Cover - This is a combination zone/man-to-man defense with the safeties in two deep zones. On the strong side of the field, defenders are in a man-to-man coverage scheme. On the weak side, the cornerback plays in a short zone along with linebackers, if necessary. This coverage gives you a little variety and is slightly worse against teams with a good receiving tight end.

Weak-Side Man Cover - This is a combination zone/man-to-man defense with the safeties in two deep zones. On the weak side of the field, defenders are in a man-to-man coverage scheme. On the strong side, the cornerback plays in a short zone along with linebackers, if necessary. This coverage gives you a little variety and is slightly better against teams with a good receiving tight end.

3-Deep Zone - This coverage places both safeties and a cornerback (often the nickel) in deep zones. It gives you a more effective pass defense, but leaves you vulnerable to the run.

4-Deep Zone - This coverage places both safeties and two extra defensive backs in deep zones. This is a prevent defense and should never be used when expecting a run. Even short passes are more likely completed against this defense, but it is very effective against deep passes.

Double Coverage:

You may assign double coverage based on the cornerbacks. One cornerback is always assigned to the flanker, and one to the split end. Your choice affects which side each cornerback covers. If you choose to orient the cornerbacks left and right, then they stay on the left or right side regardless of which sides the flanker and split ends choose. If you choose to orient the cornerbacks based on their abilities, then your top cornerback will always cover the opposing team's best wide receiver.

In double-coverage, a safety (usually the free safety first) automatically joins one of the cornerbacks. This doesn't mean there won't be double coverage elsewhere, just that it's automatic in this case. This is also what the game reports in the play-by-play. When the cornerbacks stay on one side or the other, your choices are to double-cover either the split end or the flanker. When they cover based on ability, your choices are to double-cover either the top or the second-best receiver.

Double-coverage percentages indicate what percentage of all plays a safety is in automatic double coverage.

Select the Recommend button to have your coach set the values on the screen.

Poli · 04-16-2007, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by help

Select the Recommend button to have your coach set the values on the screen.

QFT.

Subby · 04-16-2007, 09:21 AM

One of my theories is that Coach Rex is runing too much 3 and 4 deep zones with blitzing and double coverages thrown in and that is part of why medium passing can be so successful and seemingly hard to stop.

Just a hunch though...

QuikSand · 04-16-2007, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warhammer

First, I think this heavily depends upon the player's ratings in zone coverages for the DBs. Second, I think to properly run a 4-Deep zone, you have to have a ton of DBs in the game, therefore, your dime defense % should be way up there.

Regarding where the DBs are going to be:

4 - Deep zone typically sees the FS, SS, and either the nickel and dime backs deep, or the starting DBs deep. The other DBs and LBs play short zones.

3 - Deep zone has the CBs and FS in the deep zones with LBs and the SS playing the underneath zones.

Another thing to consider, was ardent sending a lot of blitzes against Duncan? If he was, he is using his underneath guys to blitz which opens up the middle routes.

I run a lot of 3 Deep zone, but I really try to stay away from a 4 Deep zone as it gives up way too many underneath routes.

I'm just assuming that most of this is thinking based on real football rather than anything from analyzing or testing.

wade moore · 04-16-2007, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Subby

One of my theories is that Coach Rex is runing too much 3 and 4 deep zones with blitzing and double coverages thrown in and that is part of why medium passing can be so successful and seemingly hard to stop.

Just a hunch though...

So what do we think the "ideal" coverage against medium passes is?

Seems like it wouldn't be that hard to test this theory by maximizing that coverage and running a few seasons and seeing if there is a noticeable difference in what comp % you allow for medium passes.

Edit: Because I'm willing to entertain the fact that medium passing is so successful at least partially because of what defenses are doing, but of course we need to test it to be sure.

Warhammer · 04-16-2007, 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuikSand

I'm just assuming that most of this is thinking based on real football rather than anything from analyzing or testing.

Yeah, it seemed to hold true for FOF2k4 too. Heck, the great advantage of the 3 Deep over the 2 Deep in run defense is that you have your SS up to cover the run! ARGH!

I understand in the 3 Deep playing a nickel back deep instead of one of the CBs, I can see that, but both safeties back there? If you are playing a nickel I guess it makes sense.

Maybe, the sim expects you to play a 3 Deep zone with a nickel package and a 4 Deep with a dime package?

Warhammer · 04-16-2007, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wade moore

So what do we think the "ideal" coverage against medium passes is?

Seems like it wouldn't be that hard to test this theory by maximizing that coverage and running a few seasons and seeing if there is a noticeable difference in what comp % you allow for medium passes.

Edit: Because I'm willing to entertain the fact that medium passing is so successful at least partially because of what defenses are doing, but of course we need to test it to be sure.

2 Deep zone with BnR would be my first guess, followed by 2 Deep zone M2M...

The whole premise for this is that you have more players in an underneath zone.

wade moore · 04-16-2007, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warhammer

Maybe, the sim expects you to play a 3 Deep zone with a nickel package and a 4 Deep with a dime package?

But unless I'm mixed up, there's no way to force this - right?

Warhammer · 04-16-2007, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wade moore

But unless I'm mixed up, there's no way to force this - right?

You could, but you would need to tweak your pass agg and pass personnel %s. What you would need to do, is figure out when you want to play a 3 Deep Zone. If you are playing it on 3rd down and long, you jack your pass agg up, change your personnel package to say 95% nickel or dime. There is another setting to set, but I can't remember what it is off the top of my head. I ran this style of defense in the WAFL NC Conference Finals with some success. As I mentioned elsewhere, we gave up one huge play, but held them in check the rest of the day.

RedKingGold · 04-16-2007, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Subby

One of my theories is that Coach Rex is runing too much 3 and 4 deep zones with blitzing and double coverages thrown in and that is part of why medium passing can be so successful and seemingly hard to stop.

Just a hunch though...

I definitely think you're on to something there. My hunch is that multiple blitzes can be easily exposed when done from a purely zone defense.

Warhammer · 04-16-2007, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedKingGold

I definitely think you're on to something there. My hunch is that multiple blitzes can be easily exposed when done from a purely zone defense.

I beg to differ, much of it depends on what your blitz rating is on the guys you send, and what the sense rush is on the guy that you are blitzing.

Subby · 04-16-2007, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warhammer

I beg to differ, much of it depends on what your blitz rating is on the guys you send, and what the sense rush is on the guy that you are blitzing.

I think you are missing his/my point. Sending multiple players on the blitz leaves less guys in coverage and makes you more susceptible to completed passes.

RedKingGold · 04-16-2007, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Subby

I think you are missing his/my point. Sending multiple players on the blitz leaves less guys in coverage and makes you more susceptible to completed passes.

And it makes sense from a football/common sense aspect as well. How many teams run a prevent defense while sending extra players out on a blitz? (well, other than Buddy Ryan,

)

wade moore · 04-16-2007, 10:46 AM

With some brief testing where I set stuff to 100% pass agg or 100% pass along with setting it to 100% dime and then turning off blitzing...

So far I see nothing to show that it performs any better against the med pass (based on comp %) than a recommend gameplan. They all fluctuated between 53-57% comp % with a 65% outlier on one season of recommend.

Subby · 04-16-2007, 10:51 AM

I don't think the game likes 100% anything...

wade moore · 04-16-2007, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Subby

I don't think the game likes 100% anything...

Fair point..

Warhammer · 04-16-2007, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Subby

I think you are missing his/my point. Sending multiple players on the blitz leaves less guys in coverage and makes you more susceptible to completed passes.

No argument, my counter is that if you have guys that are great at blitzing against a QB that is terrible at sensing the rush, you'll get to him before the lack of guys in coverage hurts you.

Someone like Duncan would eat you alive with that sort of defense though.

Warhammer · 04-16-2007, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wade moore

With some brief testing where I set stuff to 100% pass agg or 100% pass along with setting it to 100% dime and then turning off blitzing...

So far I see nothing to show that it performs any better against the med pass (based on comp %) than a recommend gameplan. They all fluctuated between 53-57% comp % with a 65% outlier on one season of recommend.

Did you tweak coverage schemes? For the record, that is why I recommended 95% because I know wierd things happen at 100% or 0% of anything.

EDIT: What coverage scheme was this using?

Poli · 04-16-2007, 11:04 AM

Personally, I'm a little surprised there isn't a cover 2 zone option in the game.

Warhammer · 04-16-2007, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardent enthusiast

Personally, I'm a little surprised there isn't a cover 2 zone option in the game.

That is the 2 Deep zone. The Tampa variety is the BnR 2 Deep zone (I believe).

EDIT: The Bellicheck version isn't in the game, that would be the Mug and Run 2 Deep zone.

Poli · 04-16-2007, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warhammer

That is the 2 Deep zone. The Tampa variety is the BnR 2 Deep zone (I believe).

EDIT: The Bellicheck version isn't in the game, that would be the Mug and Run 2 Deep zone.

Right, but as I recall it's BnR man coverages for 1 and 2 deep, loose man coverages for both, and then you get that mixed coverage stuff and then the 3 and 4 deep.

Am I wrong?

wade moore · 04-16-2007, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warhammer

Did you tweak coverage schemes? For the record, that is why I recommended 95% because I know wierd things happen at 100% or 0% of anything.

EDIT: What coverage scheme was this using?

er.. duh..

i forgot to change the coverages

...

Warhammer · 04-16-2007, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardent enthusiast

Right, but as I recall it's BnR man coverages for 1 and 2 deep, loose man coverages for both, and then you get that mixed coverage stuff and then the 3 and 4 deep.

Am I wrong?

There is a thread on that regarding FOF2k4... The straight 2 Deep zone (Cover 2) is not in the game. Most NFL teams apparently don't play a straight 2 Deep zone. Most play the Tampa 2 or a M2M 2Deep zone.

Poli · 04-16-2007, 01:36 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tampa_2

"The Tampa 2 is a variation of the Cover 2 formation in which all pass responsibilities are zone coverage (instead of Man-to-man). "

That's the what I always understood the Tampa 2 to be. That's why I'm a little curious as to why we don't see it in the game.

Granted, that MLB drops deeper as the play goes on, making it a cover 3.

sabotai · 04-16-2007, 02:24 PM

Didn't SkyDog right up a little tutorial about how to set up a MP game to use as a 'testbed' to help test game plans?

sabotai · 04-16-2007, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardent enthusiast

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tampa_2

"The Tampa 2 is a variation of the Cover 2 formation in which all pass responsibilities are zone coverage (instead of Man-to-man). "

That's the what I always understood the Tampa 2 to be. That's why I'm a little curious as to why we don't see it in the game.

Granted, that MLB drops deeper as the play goes on, making it a cover 3.

I've been thinking of trying to find a way to run a Tampa 2 in FOF. If you ran Cover 3 from the Nickel, and made your MLB the Nickel back, that would almost do it. The problem is, does the nickel back in FOF's Cover 3 cover a side deep zone, or the middle deep zone? I don't think anyone but Jim knows. (Edit: One roadblock is that only DBs are available to set at the nickel back position...)

sabotai · 04-16-2007, 02:31 PM

dola,

Considering it is the WLB that is taken out of the defense and replaced by the nickel back in the Nickel defense, is it unreasonable to assume that it is the WLB that is dropped into the deep zone when you run a Cover 3 from a base (43 or 34) defense?

Warhammer · 04-16-2007, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sabotai

dola,

Considering it is the WLB that is taken out of the defense and replaced by the nickel back in the Nickel defense, is it unreasonable to assume that it is the WLB that is dropped into the deep zone when you run a Cover 3 from a base (43 or 34) defense?

That is a good point, I really hope that isn't happening.

QuikSand · 04-16-2007, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sabotai

dola,

Considering it is the WLB that is taken out of the defense and replaced by the nickel back in the Nickel defense, is it unreasonable to assume that it is the WLB that is dropped into the deep zone when you run a Cover 3 from a base (43 or 34) defense?

I think all we have to go on are indirect indications of this -- but I fear it might be true.

Harken back to FOF 2004, where the WLB just got pulled out automatically when the team went to nickel, and was replaced by the 3rd CB. Many of us found it to be very frustrating to see that nickel back being sent on quite a number of blitzes -- as the game seemingly just kept considering that player (CB3) to be the WLB, and to just pick up the share of blitzes designed for that position in the one-size-fits-all gameplan screen governing blitzing.

If the same sort of logic applies here, then it certainly would seem like the "nickel back" is dropped back into deep coverage often, independent of whather there's really a DB in that slot or a linebacker. *sigh*

Dutch · 04-16-2007, 05:10 PM

I just try to supply enough zone 3 and 4 coverage to counter how much deep passing I suspect my opponent will do.

Noop · 04-18-2007, 10:44 AM

Cover 2
M2M: 40%
BnR: 40%
C3: 10%
C4: 10%

Blitz will your best blitz LB and never bring more then one blitz'er

Celeval · 04-18-2007, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sabotai

dola,

Considering it is the WLB that is taken out of the defense and replaced by the nickel back in the Nickel defense, is it unreasonable to assume that it is the WLB that is dropped into the deep zone when you run a Cover 3 from a base (43 or 34) defense?

Shouldn't be the case in the 3-4 - isn't it stated that in a 3-4, the WLB is part of the standard pass rush package (i.e. you can't blitz him anyway)?

beargrowlz · 04-18-2007, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celeval

Shouldn't be the case in the 3-4 - isn't it stated that in a 3-4, the WLB is part of the standard pass rush package (i.e. you can't blitz him anyway)?

In a 3-4, the WILB is removed for the nickel.

04-16-2007, 07:14 AM	#4
RedKingGold College Starter Join Date: Oct 2002	What about the importance of packages while calling 3-deep and 4-deep zones. It seems to me that a team running a 4-3 4-deep zone would not be very effective as all linebackers would be dropping into coverage. Then, the player's individual zone coverage ratings would likely come into play. Two of Knoxville's starting linebackers a rating of 20 or lower in zone coverage. Also, the highest zone rating of any of Knoxville's secondary members is a 60. However, I'll also admit that I'm not quite sure who would actually be dropping back into coverage based on the help file. What does "two extra defensive backs" mean when applied to a base 4-3 package? Does it mean both starting corners are dropping into a deep zone? Does it mean that the linebackers who would normally be subbed out in a nickel or dime package are dropping into a deep zone? Is it possible that players with higher ratings in zone would be more effective against medium-long passing than Knoxville's starters? Lots of questions, and I got no answers. Last edited by RedKingGold : 04-16-2007 at 07:16 AM.

04-16-2007, 08:06 AM	#11
Subby lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: sans pants	Okay - so a few things I noticed... - Knoxville is often in 3 and 4 deep zone using their base coverage package (not nickel or dime). What defense coverage does the spare cornerback play in that situation (b&r, man, more zone)? When they are in a 4 deep zone using their base coverage, who is covering the wideouts? Or does that mean there is just a shitton of cushion. - Knoxville only went nickel coverage nine times. Dime coverage once (on second and five at their five, incidentally). That means that for 65 plays they were running these zones from their base coverages. And the game log references double coverage close to 30 times. They blitzed 14 times. Just thinking from a football perspective, it seems like there aren't enough defensive backs in the game to even run the zone effectively. You have four defensive backs on the field for most plays and almost half of the plays are seeing some type of double coverage - and that is in 3 and 4 deep zones. Just seems like you are leaving a lot of maneuver room for a team that ran 3 and 4 wr sets 35 times in that game. __________________ Superman was flying around and saw Wonder Woman getting a tan in the nude on her balcony. Superman said I going to hit that real fast. So he flys down toward Wonder Woman to hit it and their is a loud scream. The Invincible Man scream what just hit me in the ass!!!!! I do shit, I take pictures, I write about it: chrisshue.com Last edited by Subby : 04-16-2007 at 08:12 AM.

04-16-2007, 08:18 AM	#12
Subby lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: sans pants	So, consider this sequence: Tucker: Strong formation with three wideouts, strength is right. So you have 3 WR, a FB and a RB as possible receivers. The defense is in a 43 and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. You have four defensive backs, all sitting back in zone coverage. There are three linebackers. The team is gambling pass. Does that give them a bonus on their play diagnosis? Not sure exactly what it means for the linebackers, but someone has to have responsibility for the FB and RB. 3-15-KNX37 (4Q: 13:18) The Solution Duncan pass completed to WR Junior Banion for 37 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Banion gained 18 yards after the catch. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage. At least two of the defensive backs are double covering one of the receivers. At best, you have a prevent defense in place - but it looks like there isn't the proper personnel in place to execute it. __________________ Superman was flying around and saw Wonder Woman getting a tan in the nude on her balcony. Superman said I going to hit that real fast. So he flys down toward Wonder Woman to hit it and their is a loud scream. The Invincible Man scream what just hit me in the ass!!!!! I do shit, I take pictures, I write about it: chrisshue.com

04-16-2007, 08:26 AM	#13
Poli FOFC Survivor Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Wentzville, MO	I love that I'm able to contribute. __________________ Cheer for a walk on quarterback! Ardent leads the Vols in the dynasty forum.

04-16-2007, 08:33 AM	#14
Subby lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: sans pants	Here are the plays where they did have the proper personnel in place: Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. 1-10-TUC44 (1Q: 14:09) R.J. Ellard ran around the left tackle for 38 yards. Tackled by S Ellis Langdon. Key block delivered by Brady Edwards. Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. 3-17-TUC41 (2Q: 08:25) Shaun Duncan pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Darrell Spears. S Ellis Langdon defended the pass. Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the run. 2-1-TUC22 (3Q: 12:42) R.J. Ellard ran inside the left guard for 17 yards. Tackled by OLB Roger Zimmerman. Key block delivered by K.C. Pardee. Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass. 1-10-KNX13 (3Q: 09:34) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Darrell Spears for 13 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Spears gained 4 yards after the catch. Tucker 27, Knoxville 13 Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. 1-10-KNX18 (3Q: 02:59) The Solution Duncan pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Darrell Spears. CB Leon Bennett knocked the ball out of his grasp. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage. Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, expecting the pass. 3-7-KNX15 (3Q: 02:09) Shaun Duncan pass completed to TE Frank Pruett for 6 yards. Tackled by CB Alex Haroldson. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. 1-10-TUC37 (4Q: 15:00) Shaun Duncan pass completed to WR Forrest Truett for 13 yards. Tackled by S Ellis Langdon, assisted by CB Chad Terrell. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. The quarterback threw away from the double coverage. Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. Huang is blitzing. 3-8-TUC09 (4Q: 06:16) The Solution Duncan pass was dropped by WR Forrest Truett. The quarterback threw into double coverage. Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. 1-10-TUC20 (4Q: 04:19) R.J. Ellard ran inside the left guard for 1 yard. Tackled by DT Ivan Sparks, assisted by DT Donald Bonner. Tucker: Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with dime personnel and 4-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass. 2-5-KNX05 (2Q: 00:25) R.J. Ellard ran around left end for 5 yards and a TOUCHDOWN! Key block delivered by Stephen Lavender. Tucker 20, Knoxville 13 So we are getting a REALLY small sample size here, admittedly. Still interesting to look at these plays in isolation. __________________ Superman was flying around and saw Wonder Woman getting a tan in the nude on her balcony. Superman said I going to hit that real fast. So he flys down toward Wonder Woman to hit it and their is a loud scream. The Invincible Man scream what just hit me in the ass!!!!! I do shit, I take pictures, I write about it: chrisshue.com Last edited by Subby : 04-16-2007 at 08:35 AM.

04-16-2007, 07:53 AM	#9
RedKingGold College Starter Join Date: Oct 2002	Are we assuming that pass coverages are an individual-to-individual skill? B/c something here seems to tell me that the way this works is very similar to offensive line play: A result is determined, and then credit is awarded based on the result.

04-16-2007, 08:57 AM	#15
Warhammer Pro Starter Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Dayton, OH	First, I think this heavily depends upon the player's ratings in zone coverages for the DBs. Second, I think to properly run a 4-Deep zone, you have to have a ton of DBs in the game, therefore, your dime defense % should be way up there. Regarding where the DBs are going to be: 4 - Deep zone typically sees the FS, SS, and either the nickel and dime backs deep, or the starting DBs deep. The other DBs and LBs play short zones. 3 - Deep zone has the CBs and FS in the deep zones with LBs and the SS playing the underneath zones. Another thing to consider, was ardent sending a lot of blitzes against Duncan? If he was, he is using his underneath guys to blitz which opens up the middle routes. I run a lot of 3 Deep zone, but I really try to stay away from a 4 Deep zone as it gives up way too many underneath routes.

04-16-2007, 09:00 AM	#16
Warhammer Pro Starter Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Dayton, OH	Another thing, when playing a 4 Deep, that is essentially a prevent defense, so you can be picked apart accordingly.

04-16-2007, 09:21 AM	#20
Subby lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: sans pants	One of my theories is that Coach Rex is runing too much 3 and 4 deep zones with blitzing and double coverages thrown in and that is part of why medium passing can be so successful and seemingly hard to stop. Just a hunch though... __________________ Superman was flying around and saw Wonder Woman getting a tan in the nude on her balcony. Superman said I going to hit that real fast. So he flys down toward Wonder Woman to hit it and their is a loud scream. The Invincible Man scream what just hit me in the ass!!!!! I do shit, I take pictures, I write about it: chrisshue.com Last edited by Subby : 04-16-2007 at 09:21 AM.

04-16-2007, 10:51 AM	#32
Subby lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: sans pants	I don't think the game likes 100% anything... __________________ Superman was flying around and saw Wonder Woman getting a tan in the nude on her balcony. Superman said I going to hit that real fast. So he flys down toward Wonder Woman to hit it and their is a loud scream. The Invincible Man scream what just hit me in the ass!!!!! I do shit, I take pictures, I write about it: chrisshue.com

04-16-2007, 11:04 AM	#36
Poli FOFC Survivor Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Wentzville, MO	Personally, I'm a little surprised there isn't a cover 2 zone option in the game. __________________ Cheer for a walk on quarterback! Ardent leads the Vols in the dynasty forum.

04-16-2007, 01:36 PM	#41
Poli FOFC Survivor Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Wentzville, MO	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tampa_2 "The Tampa 2 is a variation of the Cover 2 formation in which all pass responsibilities are zone coverage (instead of Man-to-man). " That's the what I always understood the Tampa 2 to be. That's why I'm a little curious as to why we don't see it in the game. Granted, that MLB drops deeper as the play goes on, making it a cover 3. __________________ Cheer for a walk on quarterback! Ardent leads the Vols in the dynasty forum.

04-16-2007, 02:24 PM	#42
sabotai General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: The Satellite of Love	Didn't SkyDog right up a little tutorial about how to set up a MP game to use as a 'testbed' to help test game plans? Last edited by sabotai : 04-16-2007 at 02:24 PM.

04-16-2007, 02:31 PM	#44
sabotai General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: The Satellite of Love	dola, Considering it is the WLB that is taken out of the defense and replaced by the nickel back in the Nickel defense, is it unreasonable to assume that it is the WLB that is dropped into the deep zone when you run a Cover 3 from a base (43 or 34) defense?

04-16-2007, 05:10 PM	#47
Dutch "Dutch" Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Tampa, FL	I just try to supply enough zone 3 and 4 coverage to counter how much deep passing I suspect my opponent will do.

04-18-2007, 10:44 AM	#48
Noop Bonafide Seminole Fan Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Florida	Cover 2 M2M: 40% BnR: 40% C3: 10% C4: 10% Blitz will your best blitz LB and never bring more then one blitz'er __________________ Living in an Oligarchy.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)