OLB as Pass Rushing DE

[beargrowlz]

Has anyone had any success (sacks, hurries, passes blocked) playing an OLB at DE in nickel or dime defenses?

[Tormaz]

I have never had much success doing that.

I have had great success playing a DE at WLB in the 3-4 setting.

[Chubby]

Used to, not so much anymore with recent patches.

[MartinD]

I used SLB Marcus Washington as a DE in my dime set for a few games in the Real Deal league a couple of seasons back with a fair bit of success - I suspect that this may have had quite a lot to do with the Colts' defensive line being probably the weakest unit in the league that season, though (so that Washington was probably the best DE by a distance as well as a decent linebacker)...

This was a while ago, though, so can't remember exact details.

Martin

[perez24]

I have had some success putting a WLB at DE on nickel/dime packages. A lot of times my DE's only play about 50-55% of the time on depth chart and the fata--es get tired, so I sit them down...unless they're great pass rushers...on passing situations.

[Subby]

Yup - I have success in GEFL.

Jack Del Rio

Del Rio plays WLB and has 16.5 sacks and 31 hurries with two games left.

We play a 3-4 and our DE are beyond awful. They might have 7 sacks between the two of them (of course one of them is playing on the interior in the 3-4, so I am not sure how much of a difference that makes.)

[beargrowlz]

Subby,

In your depth chart for the nickel and dime packages, does Del Rio line up at DE or at WLB?

[Subby]

WLB

[QuikSand]

I had a MP team perfectly suited to trying this -- we were terribly weak at DE, really deep at LB, and had one particular LB who has a great candidate to slide in at DE on the depth chart (PR Tech of 72, PR Str of 65, also very high Run D). From a DE with ratings of that nature, I would have expected maybe 8-12 sacks a year and perhaps a PR% or around 7-8. My LB, in three full seasons starting in the DE slot (44 starts, about 1400 pass plays), in various combinations of the 3-4 and 4-3 defensive fronts, managed a total of 9.5 sacks in those three seasons, and a PR% of about 2.5.

I realize a few seasons with one guy is a weak sample size, but I was sufficiently persuaded by these awful returns that this simply was not working, and on that team I traded a lot to land a serious player to slot at DE, and basically relegate this clown to reserve LB duty.

It may be that the recent Q&A indicating that ratings are relative to position, rather than absolute, is the real key here. Perhaps my linebacker with a rating of 72 for PR Technique is equivalent to a DE with a rating of something like 30 or 40, meaning that despite the big bars I was actually putting a really poor player out there by slotting him at DE. That's my best guess, at least.

[QuikSand]

Originally Posted by Subby

Del Rio plays WLB and has 16.5 sacks and 31 hurries with two games left.

Without a doubt, a pass-rushing LB can put up good PR% stats playing from the always-rushing WLB slot in a 3-4 defense. I don't know how much of this tends to come as an offset from the other pass rushers (i.e. do the DEs in a 3-4 do less damage) but that's definitely possible.

Playing a true LB in a DE slot on the depth chart seems like another matter entirely.

[QuikSand]

The 0-100 bars are approximations. And they differ based on position. For instance, a running back with "50" route running is not as good a route-runner as a wide receiver with "50" route running.

Quote from the most recent developer Q&A that I think might be relevant here. That guy might be a good pass rusher *for a linebacker* but that might not mean he will be effective playing as a defensive end.

And I have almost no way of guessing how one might go about doing a fair long-term controlled test for something like this, nor do I have the inclination to try to do so.

[Suburban Rhythm]

This may be addressed somewhere...I wasn't sure on how to even begin searching (what terms to use).

I run a 3-4 in my MP with the Steelers. So I am nearly always towards the top in rush defense. And in my nickel and dime packages, I bench Casey Hampton, move a DE (Smith or Keisel inside) and play my OLB's as DE's.

My question is why in those sub packages, are there still only 3 DL positions? I realize I am playing a 3-4 as my base. But typically, especially in the dime, I'd expect to see 4 DL, 1 LB and 6 DBs.

Has this ever been covered before?

[Nogram]

In Dime you only rush the three DL, unless a blitz is called.

Nogram

[Suburban Rhythm]

I get that, running a 3-4 I'll only rush 3 DL. My question was in a normal dime alignment, wouldn't you expect 4 DL, 1 LB and 6 DB? Why is the dime alignment predicated on which defense (4-3 or 3-4) you are running as your base.

Maybe the answer is "it just is". Curious if this has ever come up with Jim.

[Daimyo]

Originally Posted by Suburban Rhythm

I get that, running a 3-4 I'll only rush 3 DL. My question was in a normal dime alignment, wouldn't you expect 4 DL, 1 LB and 6 DB? Why is the dime alignment predicated on which defense (4-3 or 3-4) you are running as your base.

Maybe the answer is "it just is". Curious if this has ever come up with Jim.

The 3-4 in FOF doesn't seem to bear much resemblance to the 3-4 in real life. Seems to me it functions exactly like the 4-3 except you get to play a LB at DE without penalty.