Advice on running the ball

[JMO]

Anyone have any advice on running the ball? I have no idea what formations are the best to run with for example.

I normally skimp on rbs which is a problem, but even ex rbs which didn't fare so well with me, excel on other teams. My o-line is pretty good on both MP teams.

Any tips on what % used in offensive settings or formations would be very welcome.

[Ben E Lou]

1. Get good offensive linemen.
2. Don't run too much.

Look at the game plan library for some guidelines as to how much is too much. I think the smashmouth, which has the most running of all them, is set at aorund 60% on first down. (I don't remember exactly.)

[Celeval]

I disagree, a bit. Running a lot can be fine as long as you mix up your formations and directions.

[Yoda]

Originally Posted by JMO

Anyone have any advice on running the ball? I have no idea what formations are the best to run with for example.

I normally skimp on rbs which is a problem, but even ex rbs which didn't fare so well with me, excel on other teams. My o-line is pretty good on both MP teams.

Any tips on what % used in offensive settings or formations would be very welcome.

It really depends on what your talent is.

Do you have a good FB?
Do you have a good TE? or 2?
What is the cohesion and Run Blocking of your offensive line?
How many and what formations does your QB know?

Also, it depends on the defense you are facing. You don't want to run to the side where the DE/LB each have 100 Run Defense...well, not much anyway.

[primelord]

Also, it depends on the defense you are facing. You don't want to run to the side where the DE/LB each have 100 Run Defense...well, not much anyway.

You have any data supporting that claim? I realize intuitively that makes sense, but I am not sure it makes as big of a difference as you think it does.

[Yoda]

Originally Posted by primelord

You have any data supporting that claim? I realize intuitively that makes sense, but I am not sure it makes as big of a difference as you think it does.

Just games where I tried it. I would run behind the strength of my line and get shut down, then I would run behind the weaker part of my line, which is where their weakness was and would preform much better.

Do I specifically remember which games those were? No, I just remember the result. Guess I could put together a test and run it.

Just from my game experience.

If I get time, I'll do it in the next couple of days.

[beargrowlz]

Originally Posted by JMO

Anyone have any advice on running the ball? I have no idea what formations are the best to run with for example.

I normally skimp on rbs which is a problem, but even ex rbs which didn't fare so well with me, excel on other teams. My o-line is pretty good on both MP teams.

Any tips on what % used in offensive settings or formations would be very welcome.

1) You can help yourself by situational running. If you can catch the defense in an Aggressive Pass Defense on a run play, all other things being equal you'll have more - though not total - success. Similarly, running against an Aggressive Run Defense will minimize - though not eliminate- your chances of success. You can find out your opponent's defensive tendencies by reading logs of their past games. Then decide whether you've got the hosses to pull this off - try it enough and you'll get the hang of what situations and what type of personnel you need to succeed.

2) Correllary to #1 - get a great QB (and a fine WR wouldn't help either). A running game becomes better the more a defense has to play the pass. It doesn't so much really matter if you throw the ball a lot, so long as the defense has to play pass defense a lot. If they have to worry about your passer having big red bars and worry about you throwing constantly on them, it'll improve any back's chances of success.

Much of this game - like football in real life I suppose - is about misdirection. You want to make your opponent be wrong and you want to be right. That holds true for your running game as well as anything.



Cheers,
-Bear

[Hoosierbuckeye]

I've led two or three leagues in rushing the past few sim seasons, and I think that Yoda and Bear have pretty much hit the nail on the head.

I like to have one very good running back that's agile, good hole recognition, stamina, and speed. That's the guy I count on as my feature back. I look for average to better strength. . I think that helps cut down on the fumbles.

Then you have to have a complimentary back. . .good hole recognition, stamina, and more of a power runner. . .

A third back in reserve isn't a bad idea either. . .

A good run blocking fullback with good strength and hole recognition are essential I think.

Build up your offensive line with good strong run blockers and complement with two good run blocking tight ends.

I do think a qb that has the ability to go long and knows a bunch of formations, say more than ten, is essential.

I set my run percentages to about sixty percent on the outside of the tackles and forty inside the guards.

When it comes to tendencies, I've always had the run percnetages near the 80% mark on first and ten, then decreasing the value in obvious passing situations. (although on third and one, setting it about fifty fifty will get you the long ball every now and then, which is cool.)

So, for what it's worth, that's how I set up my run game. . .smashmouth all the way now.

[johnnyshaka]

We led the FOWL in rushing this season with just under 3000 yards. By no means do we have a "stud" RB as he's rated as about the 10th best back...same goes if I were to sort by HR. Nor did we have any depth there as our backups were of the 30/40 types of players yet they were able to average around 4.5 YPC. One thing I wasn't pleased with was all the fumbling...ugh.

However, we did have a great blocking FB as well as one of the top TEs to help him out. But, the strength of our offense was the offensive line and the depth we had there.

We ran the ball a bit over 62% of the time and managed to make it to the Conference Title game sticking to that formula. To take it to the next level we need to gameplan better as our QB does have some deep ball skills but weren't able to levrage that successfully...probably due to the lack of any deep threat to throw to.

[RedKingGold]

Originally Posted by Hoosierbuckeye

I've led two or three leagues in rushing the past few sim seasons, and I think that Yoda and Bear have pretty much hit the nail on the head.

I like to have one very good running back that's agile, good hole recognition, stamina, and speed. That's the guy I count on as my feature back. I look for average to better strength. . I think that helps cut down on the fumbles.

Then you have to have a complimentary back. . .good hole recognition, stamina, and more of a power runner. . .

A third back in reserve isn't a bad idea either. . .

A good run blocking fullback with good strength and hole recognition are essential I think.

Build up your offensive line with good strong run blockers and complement with two good run blocking tight ends.

I do think a qb that has the ability to go long and knows a bunch of formations, say more than ten, is essential.

I set my run percentages to about sixty percent on the outside of the tackles and forty inside the guards.

When it comes to tendencies, I've always had the run percnetages near the 80% mark on first and ten, then decreasing the value in obvious passing situations. (although on third and one, setting it about fifty fifty will get you the long ball every now and then, which is cool.)

So, for what it's worth, that's how I set up my run game. . .smashmouth all the way now.

So, collect red bars, and profit.

I'm agree.

[JMO]

Some great answers guys...I think I see the problem.

Yoda said

Do you have a good FB?
Do you have a good TE? or 2?
What is the cohesion and Run Blocking of your offensive line?
How many and what formations does your QB know?

This is probably the crux of the problem..

I spend very little on FB and TE and the priority is on pass blocking and recieving.My RBs are in the 40s, high elusiveness and blitz pickup. My QB whilst knowing loads of formations is not good against pass rush so i have a studly line to keep him protected. The line is good at blocking but not i still have very low ypc. of course some of this could come from protecting leads. I have i great wr and a great qb.

Bear said

1) You can help yourself by situational running. If you can catch the defense in an Aggressive Pass Defense on a run play, all other things being equal you'll have more - though not total - success. Similarly, running against an Aggressive Run Defense will minimize - though not eliminate- your chances of success. You can find out your opponent's defensive tendencies by reading logs of their past games. Then decide whether you've got the hosses to pull this off - try it enough and you'll get the hang of what situations and what type of personnel you need to succeed.

This is interesting, and definitly something I have to try.

Thanks for the other tips. I'll probably not get diff TEs and FBs because the priority with my aging/old QB is to keep him upright. I'll try to run it more intelligently and maybe upgrade at RB if I can make myself spend a high pick on one.

[Hoosierbuckeye]

One other thing the running game does is eat up the clock. . .and that helps your defense since the opponent seems to want to pass more to play catch up. . .

and if you have a strong defensive line that can stop the run and de's that can pressure the qb, it creates more sack opportunities and interceptions for the db's. Your d knows what's coming.

I also set the end game settings on eating the clock as high as I can get it. . if I'm running the ball, the stronger back and backs with good endurance run much better late in the game. The same with the two minute drill. . .I've had running backs go berserk when the other team's d is in the prevent defense. . .

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by RedKingGold

So, collect red bars, and profit.

I'm agree.

+2

[DrAFTjunkie]

Edge running. Someone (skydog probably, though I can't say for certain) suggested a 20-20-5-5-5-5-20-20 run direction split and that idea has worked wonders for me. I currently have a 46/46 all-league 2-time 1st teamer averaging 4.5 ypc for me in MP.

[Hammer]

Originally Posted by DrAFTjunkie

Edge running. Someone (skydog probably, though I can't say for certain) suggested a 20-20-5-5-5-5-20-20 run direction split and that idea has worked wonders for me. I currently have a 46/46 all-league 2-time 1st teamer averaging 4.5 ypc for me in MP.

While I'm sure this can work, if your winning a lot of games/run the ball a lot/have a low formation QB, you will tend to hit a brick wall in the 2nd half. The defense will become familiar with the outside runs. Perhaps offensive play calling from the OC also comes into it.

I have to run 12.5 accross the board on a number of my teams to avoid this issue. Our average per rush is generally quite competitive.

[Tormaz]

Originally Posted by DrAFTjunkie

Edge running. Someone (skydog probably, though I can't say for certain) suggested a 20-20-5-5-5-5-20-20 run direction split and that idea has worked wonders for me. I currently have a 46/46 all-league 2-time 1st teamer averaging 4.5 ypc for me in MP.

That would be Subby that suggested that.

[DrAFTjunkie]

Originally Posted by Hammer

While I'm sure this can work, if your winning a lot of games/run the ball a lot/have a low formation QB, you will tend to hit a brick wall in the 2nd half. The defense will become familiar with the outside runs. Perhaps offensive play calling from the OC also comes into it.

I have to run 12.5 accross the board on a number of my teams to avoid this issue. Our average per rush is generally quite competitive.

Thanks for the info, if I ever do start winning games I'll take the advice.

[cuervo72]

I'm down with the edge running too. BEL first mentioned this I believe, that an apparently "even" distribution really isn't, it skews to the middle.

I don't quite have things as low as 5s in the middle, but I do lean to the outside, and put an emphasis on outside running, elusiveness, and breakaway speed. Football Outsiders *hates* us, but we usually have a very good YPC (2019 FOFL we were 4.03 ALY, led the league with a 5.20 YPC, but were last with a -29% differential).

I also have a goofy tendency to share time between two backs rather than having one workhorse.

[beargrowlz]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

I also have a goofy tendency to share time between two backs rather than having one workhorse.

I don't think that's goofy. You can pay a very good back $6-7 million and his sub chump change or pay two decent backs $1.5 million apiece and get nearly the same production - unless the $7 million back is so outlandishly superior - and save a bunch of cap room.

Makes good sense.



Cheers,
-Bear

[DrAFTjunkie]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

I'm down with the edge running too. BEL first mentioned this I believe, that an apparently "even" distribution really isn't, it skews to the middle.

I don't quite have things as low as 5s in the middle, but I do lean to the outside, and put an emphasis on outside running, elusiveness, and breakaway speed. Football Outsiders *hates* us, but we usually have a very good YPC (2019 FOFL we were 4.03 ALY, led the league with a 5.20 YPC, but were last with a -29% differential).

I also have a goofy tendency to share time between two backs rather than having one workhorse.

Yeah, 5 is way too low for me as well. I don't like to go lower than 7 even behind total schmucks.

[Yoda]

I look at it like this.

I look at it like every 5% was a run. If you run the ball 20 times, how many runs in those areas do you want a game?

If I want 60% of my runs to go behind the left side of my line, I set it up like:

10 20 20 10 10 10 10 10