Peyton Manning wins 3rd NFL MVP

[DeToxRox]

Not a surprise. Dude was on fire the last two months.

How many will he win before it's all said and done?

I'd say he'll get to five which may never be broken.

[Cringer]

He gets a 4th at least, along with breaking all of Favre's record except maybe the consecutive starts streak, even that is possible though if he hangs on long enough. I just don't see him hanging on as much as Favre is.

[Noop]

I think Pennington should have gotten MVP, but Peyton does deserve it.

[B & B]

CP had a better season playing in a tougher division, but didnt even make the Pro-Bowl.

One could also make a case for the FA pickup of the year, Michael Turner.
376 - 1,699 yards
4.5ypc 106.2/g
17 TDs

[larrymcg421]

I'm a big CP fan now, but I don't mind Peyton winning it. I'm still bitter about the Pro Bowl, though. It should have been Manning, Rivers, and Pennington for the AFC.

[DeToxRox]

If I had to vote for MVP I think I'd have gone

1. Peyton
2. Turner
3. Williams
4. AP
5. Pennington

[stevew]

Man. Fofc faves Rodgers and Jacobs didn't do so hot. I still think this wAs warner's to lose after week 9 or so. Obviously their shitty finish did him in


Good choice and I could just as easily have been happy with Turner or deangelo Williams takin it home

[wade moore]

Go Peyton!

[DeToxRox]

They just showed Peytons last 9 games, when they needed him most ..

72%, 17 TD - 3 INT

Had he been healthy the first half of the year, this is probably over by week 9.

I think Indy is going to be winning the SB because right now this guy is playing amazing, and conincidentally since he's gotten better, so has the Colts D.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by stevew

Man. Fofc faves Rodgers and Jacobs didn't do so hot. I still think this wAs warner's to lose after week 9 or so. Obviously their shitty finish did him in


Good choice and I could just as easily have been happy with Turner or deangelo Williams takin it home

Always next year.

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

They just showed Peytons last 9 games, when they needed him most ..

72%, 17 TD - 3 INT

Had he been healthy the first half of the year, this is probably over by week 9.

I think Indy is going to be winning the SB because right now this guy is playing amazing, and conincidentally since he's gotten better, so has the Colts D.

And coincidentally (or not), since he got better, so did my fantasy team.

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by stevew

Man. Fofc faves Rodgers and Jacobs didn't do so hot. I still think this wAs warner's to lose after week 9 or so. Obviously their shitty finish did him in


Good choice and I could just as easily have been happy with Turner or deangelo Williams takin it home

I thought Williams had a shot. 5.5 YPC, 1515 Yds, 18 TDs, 0 Fumbles. Probably his biggest negative was that he split carries with Stewart who also performed well.

[Icy]

He was the key of my FOFC Euro fantasy championship run, specially in the final game past week.

[MIJB#19]

Originally Posted by Icy

He was the key of my FOFC Euro fantasy championship run, specially in the final game past week.

I can acknowledge that. *sigh*

[larrymcg421]

The reason Pennington should have gotten more consideration is he finished 2nd in the league in QB rating and his starting WR's were Ted Ginn and Davone Bess.

[bhlloy]

And he was the major addition in a team that went from 1-15 to 11-5 and won one of the toughest divisions in football. Sentimentally I'd have liked to see him get it, but I understand the cold, hard figures are in Manning's favor.

[Kodos]

Glad to see Manning win again. He is the best QB of this generation.

[B & B]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

They just showed Peytons last 9 games, when they needed him most ..

72%, 17 TD - 3 INT

Had he been healthy the first half of the year, this is probably over by week 9.

I think Indy is going to be winning the SB because right now this guy is playing amazing, and conincidentally since he's gotten better, so has the Colts D.

Super Bowl?

Really?

I can understand how the Colts are the chic pick to win it, but its not realistic.

Infact, their season will be over in less than 36 hours.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by Cringer

He gets a 4th at least, along with breaking all of Favre's record except maybe the consecutive starts streak, even that is possible though if he hangs on long enough. I just don't see him hanging on as much as Favre is.

Favre is still 9 games short of the consecutive starts streak.

[RainMaker]

I still think a case could be made for Williams or Turner. Particularly Turner who was really the reason the Falcons are in the playoffs. Peyton had a great run down the stretch, but didn't show up for the first few games of the season. His schedule has also been fairly easy of late with games against Cleveland, Cincinatti, Detroit, Jacksonville, and a Tennessee team with nothing to play for in the past 5 weeks.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I still think a case could be made for Williams or Turner. Particularly Turner who was really the reason the Falcons are in the playoffs. Peyton had a great run down the stretch, but didn't show up for the first few games of the season. His schedule has also been fairly easy of late with games against Cleveland, Cincinatti, Detroit, Jacksonville, and a Tennessee team with nothing to play for in the past 5 weeks.

Agreed. I do think Turner is the main reason Atlanta has this amazing run, but Indy, when they needed the wins most, beat NE, PIT and SD. Granted SD is a weak team but they're still a playoff team, and NE and PIT both had 11 wins.

I think it was obvious to many Peyton was hurt early and that is why he struggled. But even if it was against awful teams, he was huge when it was needed.

[MIJB#19]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

And he was the major addition in a team that went from 1-15 to 11-5 and won one of the toughest divisions in football. Sentimentally I'd have liked to see him get it, but I understand the cold, hard figures are in Manning's favor.

The AFC East was the 4th toughest division behind the NFC South, NFC East and AFC South. Actually, I think you have to say the NFL had three really weak divisions this season (AFC West, NFC West and NFC North), and five others that were kind of equal. Playing both the AFC West and the NFC West, it made the AFC East collectively look a bit better than it really was. For instance, Miami had the 5th easiest schedule in the league, the Jets and Bills also made the top6. I'm not saying the Dolphins were a 7-9, 8-8 team that lucked into the playoffs (like Denver would have been).

No idea what that has to do with MVP considerations, but for almost a week I had a feeling the Dolphins played an easy schedule, and it turns out to actually be that. At the same time I'm surprised to see how tough the schedule of the Steelers was, their 12-4 record (vs the 2nd toughest schedule) seems more impressive than the Titans' 13-3 record (vs the tied 7th-9th easiest).

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

They just showed Peytons last 9 games, when they needed him most ..

72%, 17 TD - 3 INT

Had he been healthy the first half of the year, this is probably over by week 9.

I think Indy is going to be winning the SB because right now this guy is playing amazing, and conincidentally since he's gotten better, so has the Colts D.

I think Jeff Saturday getting better had a lot to do with it as well although he didn't play in the Cleveland and Cincinnati games.

Originally Posted by Kodos

Glad to see Manning win again. He is the best QB of this generation.

Those New England fans might disagree, but Peyton Manning is definitely arguably the best QB of this generation.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

Agreed. I do think Turner is the main reason Atlanta has this amazing run, but Indy, when they needed the wins most, beat NE, PIT and SD. Granted SD is a weak team but they're still a playoff team, and NE and PIT both had 11 wins.

I think it was obvious to many Peyton was hurt early and that is why he struggled. But even if it was against awful teams, he was huge when it was needed.

BLASPHEMY!!! MATTY "ROY" RYAN was equally as huge as Michael Turner. One feeds off the other in terms of creating chances.

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

I think Jeff Saturday getting better had a lot to do with it as well although he didn't play in the Cleveland and Cincinnati games.

Those New England fans might disagree, but Peyton Manning is definitely arguably the best QB of this generation.

I disagree with Kodos about Peyton being the best, but he is definately arguably the best. It's him and Brady 1 & 2 and it just swings back and forth between them based on who's supporting cast was better in that particular year. In a vacumn I think they're essentially identical. I prefer Brady but that's some homerism and also I like the "rags to riches" story better than the "my dad was a NFL QB, I was born to be an NFL QB..I'm the clear frontrunner" story.

[ISiddiqui]

Well deserved MVP by Peyton Manning. Especially after reading about his knee injury in the early season, he willed his team to the playoffs.

[RainMaker]

I still think there is still a bit of a bias toward the white QB when it comes to MVP voting. Manning had a real good year, but he still played a soft schedule and didn't even win his division.

Running backs seem to get no respect in the league. Adrian Peterson is the most dominating player in the league. Williams was the best player on the best team in the NFC. Turner had a phenomenal year in a tough division against tough defenses. I don't see how any of them are not more deserving than Manning.

Manning wasn't even the best QB in the league this year (I'd give that to Rivers). He was 5th in QB rating and touchdowns, and 6th in total yards. The Colts didn't even have a top 10 offense. It's one thing if his team was the best in the AFC, but they're a wild card who played a real easy schedule.

That's not a knock on Manning or his career, he is probably the greatest QB of our generation. But this year wasn't an MVP season. There are much more deserving players. But since Manning is a media darling, he wins.

[DaddyTorgo]

I agree RainMaker.

Same thing could be said about Pro Bowl voting too. Bottom line is that voting in these situations is inherently biased.

[JediKooter]

There were better deserving players that should have gotten it. DeAngello Williams comes to mind and Michael Turner.

Rivers played under more pressure and had more on the line than Peyton did and threw less interceptions and threw for more touchdowns and more yardage (7 more yards) in addition to having a higher QB rating. Oh and Rivers had offseason knee surgery as well.

I'd take Manning any day of the year to be my starting quarterback, however, as far as MVP this year...no.

They must have factored in his commericials compared to the other players.

[gstelmack]

The issue I have with Manning's MVP is he had an Elway-like year, with his team getting down (especially early and mid season) then their opponents collapsing in the fourth quarter and him racking up the stats. Where would Manning be if Rosenfels doesn't decide to pull a Chris Chandler, for example?

I think guys like Michael Turner and Chad Pennington were far more critical additions to their team.

[Kodos]

Actually, I think Manning has a pretty nice argument for why he is the MVP:

Early in the season, when his knee was not healed, the Colts lost a lot and looked bad. Down the stretch, when his knee was mostly back to normval, the Colts rattle off a long streak of wins. No Manning = a Colts team that is average at best.

[Raiders Army]

Now that I think about it, Albert Haynesworth wouldn't have been a bad choice for MVP.

[INDalltheway]

I want all the naysayers to answer one question. How many games do the Colts win without Manning? At best I say 5 games.

[stevew]

DPOY comes out soon too? There are so many good players that deserve to win. Harrison got some MVP votes so maybe that bodes well. But you also have Ware and Reed who could easily win. Amongst others.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Actually, I think Manning has a pretty nice argument for why he is the MVP:

Early in the season, when his knee was not healed, the Colts lost a lot and looked bad. Down the stretch, when his knee was mostly back to normval, the Colts rattle off a long streak of wins. No Manning = a Colts team that is average at best.

I don't have a problem with Manning as the MVP choice, and as I said in the superbowl pick thread, Indy is the team I see most likely winning it all at this point. Your reason listed above though I don't necessarily think is the end all answer though. You can say the same thing about Warner and Turner as well most likely.

[larrymcg421]

How many games do the Dolphins win without Chad Pennington?

Look, I'm a Manning fan. I don't think he's a bad pick. It's just that Pennington was a better one (along with some of the other names mentioned). I don't think someone who had the same exact season but wasn't named Peyton Manning would have got the MVP. OTOH, if Manning had gone to the Dolphins and led them from 1-15 to 11-5, he would have been a unanimous pick.

[st.cronin]

I would've voted for All Day.

[MrDNA]

I just posted about this on the Browns board and got jumped on for supporting Pennington, but I come here and see my pimping was already done for me

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Actually, I think Manning has a pretty nice argument for why he is the MVP:

Early in the season, when his knee was not healed, the Colts lost a lot and looked bad. Down the stretch, when his knee was mostly back to normval, the Colts rattle off a long streak of wins. No Manning = a Colts team that is average at best.

Early in the season they were playing good teams with good defenses.

[Cringer]

Originally Posted by mckerney

Favre is still 9 games short of the consecutive starts streak.

For QBs he is #1, to be honest I thought he was a long ways away from the overall NFL record. I had not checked up on that for a long time.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by INDalltheway

I want all the naysayers to answer one question. How many games do the Colts win without Manning? At best I say 5 games.

How many do the Vikings win without AP? Or the Falcons without Turner?

I just don't get how a guy who was 5th in most passing statistics and ran an offense that is statistically in the middle of the pack in the league is MVP worthy. It's a media thing and the media like Peyton Manning.

[Cringer]

Manning is more important to his team, the league, and is just plain better, then Chad Pennington, he wins MVP over him easily. I like Chad, and glad he had a career year to win his 2nd Comeback Player award. MVP of the NFL he is not.

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by Cringer

Manning is more important to his team, the league, and is just plain better, then Chad Pennington, he wins MVP over him easily. I like Chad, and glad he had a career year to win his 2nd Comeback Player award. MVP of the NFL he is not.

So we should just ignore how they actually played and just say Peyton Manning automatically defeats Chad Pennington? I mean, based on this year, I just don't see how you can claim Peyton is more deserving than Pennington.

Chad had a better year statistically, and took a 1-15 team to 11-5, and came up huge for his team in the 4th quarter on numerous occassions, and had Ted ginn and Davone Bess as his WR's. Manning struggled early on, but eventually healed and took a very talented team to the playoffs.

Sure, he was injured, but injuries are part of the game. So yes, part of the reason he doesn't deserve the MVP is because he was injured and thus his team played worse as a result. A healthier player is more valuable.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

Chad had a better year statistically

Depends on the stats you look at. Peyton ranked 1st in DVOA, Pennington was 5th. Peyton was 2nd in DYAR, Pennington was 7th.

[larrymcg421]

I haven't really had the chance to study the sabremetric football stats too much to figure out everything they compile, but I'd still argue my point about the talent surrounding each player.

And really, if you switch the accomplishments of the two QB's this season - Peyton goes to Miami and puts up Pennington's numbers while Pennington goes to Indy and puts up Pennington numbers - we all know Peyton would still have won the MVP.

[st.cronin]

There is no way that Chad Pennington can be considered as valuable as Peyton Manning.

My ballot would have been:

1. Adrian Peterson
2. John Abraham
3. Peyton Manning

[RainMaker]

If the vote is purely based on value, it has to be Peterson. He is the most dangerous player in the league. That Vikings squad is nothing without him. They maybe win 4 or 5 games without him. If I was a defensive coordinator, I'd be more scared of AP than Manning.

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Actually, I think Manning has a pretty nice argument for why he is the MVP:

Early in the season, when his knee was not healed, the Colts lost a lot and looked bad. Down the stretch, when his knee was mostly back to normval, the Colts rattle off a long streak of wins. No Manning = a Colts team that is average at best.

How many of those wins were thanks to Manning? One reason I think the Colts have a decent shot at winning it all this year is they have as much luck going for them as the 2001 Pats. They were a hair away from losing at least 3 or 4 of those games.

Week 17: Mostly Jim Sorgi beating the nothing-to-play-for Titans
Week 16: Losing 24-14 after 3 to the JAGUARS, with the winning points coming off an INT return for a TD
Week 15: 10 point win over the Lions, a game which was tied at 21 early in the fourth quarter
Week 14: Okay, they just blasted the Bengals off the field.
Week 13: 10-6 victory over the BROWNS, with the winning points coming on a Robert Mathis 37-yard fumble return for a TD
Week 12: 23-20 victory over the Chargers, with a 51-yard FG from Vinatieri winning it
Week 11: 33-27 over the Texans, the infamous "Sage Rosenfels implodes" game
Week 10: 24-20 over the Steelers, where Manning goes 21-40 for only 240 yards but 3 TDs, a game mostly won because Big Ben throws 3 picks
Week 9: 18-15 over the Patriots, where Jabar Gaffney dropped a sure TD and David Thomas made a bone-headed 15-yard dead-ball penalty that took them out of FG range at the end of the game

I think you could make a strong case that Manning kept them in position to win those games, but he wasn't the one making the key plays in most of them. The defense was responsible for 3 (Steelers, Browns, Jaguars) and the opponent imploding handed them 2 (Patriots, Texans). So talk of the winning streak doesn't sway me, especially given how critical some of the other mentioned players were for other playoff-bound teams. And as pointed out, over the final 7 weeks the only winning record team they played was the already-locked-up-top-seed Titans in week 17 in which both teams rested a lot of players.

[Cringer]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

So we should just ignore how they actually played and just say Peyton Manning automatically defeats Chad Pennington? I mean, based on this year, I just don't see how you can claim Peyton is more deserving than Pennington.

Chad had a better year statistically, and took a 1-15 team to 11-5, and came up huge for his team in the 4th quarter on numerous occassions, and had Ted ginn and Davone Bess as his WR's. Manning struggled early on, but eventually healed and took a very talented team to the playoffs.

Sure, he was injured, but injuries are part of the game. So yes, part of the reason he doesn't deserve the MVP is because he was injured and thus his team played worse as a result. A healthier player is more valuable.

I do account for how they play, but to me the award is about value. Take Chad off that team and I bet they still do OK, the drop off is not as much as Peyton off the Colts. You want to focus on the Miami WRs, yet you skipped over the fact that offense had A LOT of two RBs involved in it. The Colts ranked 31st in rushing. Heck, Manning had over 4000 yards passing with a Marvin Harrison who only had 636 yards receiving. The guy has roughly 75 more pass attempts and gets sacked half the time.

Pennington was pretty damn good this year, but I still go with Manning over him. AD might be my overall winner though, which I haven't said. I have no problem with Manning winning it though.

[INDalltheway]

Originally Posted by gstelmack

How many of those wins were thanks to Manning? One reason I think the Colts have a decent shot at winning it all this year is they have as much luck going for them as the 2001 Pats. They were a hair away from losing at least 3 or 4 of those games.

Week 17: Mostly Jim Sorgi beating the nothing-to-play-for Titans
Week 16: Losing 24-14 after 3 to the JAGUARS, with the winning points coming off an INT return for a TD
Week 15: 10 point win over the Lions, a game which was tied at 21 early in the fourth quarter
Week 14: Okay, they just blasted the Bengals off the field.
Week 13: 10-6 victory over the BROWNS, with the winning points coming on a Robert Mathis 37-yard fumble return for a TD
Week 12: 23-20 victory over the Chargers, with a 51-yard FG from Vinatieri winning it
Week 11: 33-27 over the Texans, the infamous "Sage Rosenfels implodes" game
Week 10: 24-20 over the Steelers, where Manning goes 21-40 for only 240 yards but 3 TDs, a game mostly won because Big Ben throws 3 picks
Week 9: 18-15 over the Patriots, where Jabar Gaffney dropped a sure TD and David Thomas made a bone-headed 15-yard dead-ball penalty that took them out of FG range at the end of the game

I think you could make a strong case that Manning kept them in position to win those games, but he wasn't the one making the key plays in most of them. The defense was responsible for 3 (Steelers, Browns, Jaguars) and the opponent imploding handed them 2 (Patriots, Texans). So talk of the winning streak doesn't sway me, especially given how critical some of the other mentioned players were for other playoff-bound teams. And as pointed out, over the final 7 weeks the only winning record team they played was the already-locked-up-top-seed Titans in week 17 in which both teams rested a lot of players.

PEYTON MANNING SUCKS!!!!!!!! TOM BRADY IS STILL BETTER.....

That's what I got out of that post..typical.

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by INDalltheway

PEYTON MANNING SUCKS!!!!!!!! TOM BRADY IS STILL BETTER.....

That's what I got out of that post..typical.

Sigh. Don't let anything like facts get in the way of the discussion. Heck, I even compared this Colts season to the 2001 Pats season...

I gave up on that whole debate when Manning won his Super Bowl. That was his big hump for me. I just don't think he was MVP this season, and looking at how they actually won games, and the level of competition they won them against, I don't see Manning being the reason they won very many of them. I do see plenty of games where Michael Turner, Adrian Peterson, and guys like them were a key reason their team pulled it out.