If he had only owned a gun...

[GrantDawg]

Operator of popular YouTube channel found shot to death in... | www.ajc.com

[molson]

I'm not sure that anyone's ever guaranteed that if you shoot guns as a hobby you'll never be murdered.

So I do wonder what your point is. Is this "proof" that all guns should be banned or something?

[BillJasper]

Originally Posted by molson

I'm not sure that anyone's ever guaranteed that if you shoot guns as a hobby you'll never be murdered.

So I do wonder what your point is. Is this "proof" that all guns should be banned or something?

Just backlash on towards the "only if there were more guns" crowd that gathers everytime there's a mass shooting.

[molson]

Originally Posted by BillJasper

Just backlash on towards the "only if there were more guns" crowd that gathers everytime there's a mass shooting.

But who is claiming that if you own guns you'll never be murdered? That's the only "point" being refuted here, and it's a pretty bizarre one.

Edit: I'm just tired of this era of little smarmy opportunistic nonsense in the comments section underneath every news article that in anyway has to do with violence, so it sucks when it comes to FOFC too (a place where we've actually capable of having reasonable gun control debates at times).

[PilotMan]

I think that argument goes, "If everyone has a firearm there will be fewer murders." Hence...

[Subby]

Alanis Morissette said that it might be ironic.

[molson]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

I think that argument goes, "If everyone has a firearm there will be fewer murders." Hence...

Yup, it's making a point by going after only the most extreme views on the other side that barely anyone actually has.

Well, I'm convinced. I believe that firearms should not be possessed by everyone in America. I'm not sure what this guy's murder has to do with that, but whatever, I've thought that forever, and fortunately, it's also the case in reality and will almost certainly always be so.

[mauchow]

Originally Posted by Subby

Alanis Morissette said that it might be ironic.

There has got to be a good non ironic lyric that she'd come up with here.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by molson

Yup, it's making a point by going after only the most extreme views on the other side that barely anyone actually has.

Well when the president of the NRA makes a statement that the only thing that can stop bad guys with guns are good guys with guns, then a gun nut gets capped, it makes their stance look pretty silly.

I mean, if this guy, who made such fine items as a type 10 destructive device, can't protect himself from the bad guys how will a bunch of schoolteachers and lunch ladies?

[molson]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Well when the president of the NRA makes a statement that the only thing that can stop bad guys with guns are good guys with guns, then a gun nut gets capped, it makes their stance look pretty silly.

I mean, if this guy, who made such fine items as a type 10 destructive device, can't protect himself from the bad guys how will a bunch of schoolteachers and lunch ladies?

I think its just a smug reaction to the violent murder of a guy who happened to have a hobby that people don't approve of. It doesn't have any practical relevance to the real gun control debate. Having guns as a hobby doesn't guarantee your eternal safety any more than locking your door at night or not flashing money in public. I'm sure there's a few extremists who literally believe that every American should be armed, and that nobody will ever harm them because they're armed, but that's not a relevant view in the modern gun control debate. (and I don't know anything about this guy but from the one article - he sounds more like a "guns and explosions are are fun!" kind of guy than a "I'm armed 24/7 to protect the world from an oppressive government" kind of of guy. So what's the point - to have a little glee over this guy's death, that's all.

[stevew]

I like the FPSRussia channel. This is not the on screen talent.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by molson

Yup, it's making a point by going after only the most extreme views on the other side that barely anyone actually has.

Well, I'm convinced. I believe that firearms should not be possessed by everyone in America. I'm not sure what this guy's murder has to do with that, but whatever, I've thought that forever, and fortunately, it's also the case in reality and will almost certainly always be so.

In your neck of the woods maybe. In my neck of the woods, and unfortunately among a lot of my friends it is as law as the Bible. As someone of an opposing view to them, it's very hard not to be equally as jaded in my view towards it as you are to the other.

[molson]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

In your neck of the woods maybe. In my neck of the woods, and unfortunately among a lot of my friends it is as law as the Bible. As someone of an opposing view to them, it's very hard not to be equally as jaded in my view towards it as you are to the other.

Your friends literally believe that every single American should be armed (including those that don't want to be, violent criminals, and the mentally ill?) If so, they're far to the right of the stated positions of even the NRA, and, their views are no more relevant to modern policy-making than the people who think 9/11 was an inside job.

If they instead just think that self-protection is important and that the 2nd amendment is a vital part of that, and that they liberally exercise those rights, I doubt their minds are changed by this guy getting murdered - they probably think he's an idiot for not being armed and on alert when he was taken down.

[Fidatelo]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Well when the president of the NRA makes a statement that the only thing that can stop bad guys with guns are good guys with guns, then a gun nut gets capped, it makes their stance look pretty silly.

I mean, if this guy, who made such fine items as a type 10 destructive device, can't protect himself from the bad guys how will a bunch of schoolteachers and lunch ladies?

I'm by no means pro-gun, but just because a gun nut is killed by a gun doesn't invalidate the argument the NRA was attempting to make. It would be like attacking health organizations for their stance on exercise if Richard Simmons were to have a heart attack on a treadmill.

There are likely far better ways to argue against the NRA's position than propping up an isolated incident such as this.

[Glengoyne]

So does this make GrantDawg a troll?

'cause he just started this ball rolling, and then walked away from the thread?

[stevew]

Im curious as to if FPSKyle will be charged with this murder. It doesn't seem like this being a dispute over money is that much of a stretch. They were doing pretty well as a channel

[NorvTurnerOverdrive]

america sure is murder-y lately

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by molson

Your friends literally believe that every single American should be armed (including those that don't want to be, violent criminals, and the mentally ill?) If so, they're far to the right of the stated positions of even the NRA, and, their views are no more relevant to modern policy-making than the *people who think 9/11 was an inside job.*

If they instead just think that self-protection is important and that the 2nd amendment is a vital part of that, and that they liberally exercise those rights, I doubt their minds are changed by this guy getting murdered - they probably think he's an idiot for not being armed and on alert when he was taken down.

They exemplify the term "right-wing nut-job," and are proud of it. And yes, there is a certain geographical area that believes all of the above. Proud supporters of conspiracy theories and supporters of this guy. And yes, we agree they shouldn't be relevant to modern policy making, however, they never shut up, never listen, and refuse to think, like the tea partiers like Rand Paul that my state continues to elect. It all goes hand in hand.

This week my locally elected State Rep, Thomas Massie, who was funded by Rand Paul, supported a bill to put guns in each and every school. This is what I deal with constantly.

[molson]

Originally Posted by NorvTurnerOverdrive

america sure is murder-y lately

2011 had the lowest national murder rate since 1963. I haven't seen a 2012 national rate yet but I know murders are down again in in NYC and Boston (though up some in Detroit and Chicago - which might keep us from setting another historic low, but we'll be close to 2011 numbers overall).

It's just that now, so many more murders are front page news just because the gun control debate is hot, so those articles attract page views and comments. Any act can be seen as "proof" of something or other if you have the right mindset going in, and in a country this big, you can kind find that kind of "proof" of just about any idea, including distasteful and offensive ideas, if you look at what you want to.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by molson

2011 had the lowest national murder rate since 1963. I haven't seen a 2012 national rate yet but I know murders are down again in in NYC and Boston (though up some in Detroit and Chicago - which might keep us from setting another historic low, but we'll be close to 2011 numbers overall).

It's just that now, so many more murders are front page news just because the gun control debate is hot, so those articles attract page views and comments. Any act can be seen as "proof" of something or other if you have the right mindset going in, and in a country this big, you can kind find that kind of "proof" of just about any idea, including distasteful and offensive ideas, if you look at what you want to.

Couldn't agree more.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

I'm by no means pro-gun, but just because a gun nut is killed by a gun doesn't invalidate the argument the NRA was attempting to make. It would be like attacking health organizations for their stance on exercise if Richard Simmons were to have a heart attack on a treadmill.

There are likely far better ways to argue against the NRA's position than propping up an isolated incident such as this.

I agree, but it does prove that just because someone is armed doesn't make them any safer in a situation where they are being attacked, so what is the benefit of more people being armed?

[molson]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I agree, but it does prove that just because someone is armed doesn't make them any safer in a situation where they are being attacked, so what is the benefit of more people being armed?

It doesn't prove the being armed doesn't make you any safer, it just proved that this guy's gun hobby didn't save him in this instance (we don't even know that he was armed). If a guy breaks into your house it doesn't prove that there's no reason to lock your door at night. If he wasn't armed at the time, the incident does more to "prove" that you should carry at all times and that your guns do you no good locked up (I don't think it proves that either, but that's a more logical conclusion if we're going to look at this incident for proof of anything).

[RainMaker]

He was quite outspoken about what he would do in situations. He did tweet that he prayed someone would start shooting up the theater he was in so he could kill the person with a gun. Posted videos talking about how he would kill people who pulled a gun on him, bragged about how prepared he was at all times to defend himself. So it's a bit ironic that someone that boisterous about his abilities goes out like that.

That's not a political statement or anything. It's like having Ali brag for months leading up to a fight and then get knocked out 10 seconds in. Sort of the last person you'd think would go out like that.