CHPP

[Nyarlahotep]

I can't decide if this is a good thing or a bad thing. I know Loke said that HAM would be screwed if he went CHPP with it. He said he has some questions for the Devs, so maybe they can work something out.

[Franklinnoble]

What is CHPP?

[Franklinnoble]

dola... nevermind... I figured it out.

[FrogMan]

yeah, I read this over in teh conferences. In terms of server load, this can only be a good thing, but for us, paying users of HAM it can only mean that the crap has it the fan...

One of the thing about the CHPP is that all the softwares out there will have to use only one file from now on and that's the HRF file. They also said they were developping an XML file for the match viewers to use, so maybe there's a chance HAM might be able to hook up to this, but it's unsure.

One example of possible problems to come woud be no more automatic match reports/ratings retrieval. It's unknown how Loke will address this, as NYar said, but this could mean some sort of copy/paste needed to be done by teh user, or some manual entering of player ratings...

FM

[Franklinnoble]

In the long run, this is a good development. Of course, that's easy for me to say, as I haven't bought HAM or any other third-party tool. However, having organized standards and resources for developers will eventually lead to better utilities, IMO.

[vex]

Originally posted by FrogMan
yeah, I read this over in teh conferences. In terms of server load, this can only be a good thing, but for us, paying users of HAM it can only mean that the crap has it the fan...

One of the thing about the CHPP is that all the softwares out there will have to use only one file from now on and that's the HRF file. They also said they were developping an XML file for the match viewers to use, so maybe there's a chance HAM might be able to hook up to this, but it's unsure.

One example of possible problems to come woud be no more automatic match reports/ratings retrieval. It's unknown how Loke will address this, as NYar said, but this could mean some sort of copy/paste needed to be done by teh user, or some manual entering of player ratings...

FM


What makes me mad is this is why I just paid for HAM.:mad: That and series spy.

[Nyarlahotep]

Loke said he will have to work on a somewhat user friendly way of entering the match information manually. But it was also suggested that he add a match viewer so we can get them that way. I think transfer evaluation and series spy are gone though. Maybe Loke will be able to work something out with the devs.

Another interesting note on CHPP is that the devs will at some point require third party software to add features for people with supporter. Not sure if that is a definate or possibly type of thing though.

[daedalus]

If they're developing an XML file for match viewers to use, there's no reason why HAM can't eventually process the XML files for those relevant information instead. It's more work for the HAM people but if it helps the server be a bit more stable then it may be a positive for all in the end.

[Nyarlahotep]

The reason HAM might not be able to use it is that the devs have to approve that kind of thing for CHPP programs.

[lytic]

poop

[daedalus]

Originally posted by Nyarlahotep
The reason HAM might not be able to use it is that the devs have to approve that kind of thing for CHPP programs.Yeah, I know there are three programs (manager assistant, match viewers and statistics sites). But since many of the manager assistant programs have a built in viewer, couldn't they apply for certification for being a match viewer as well? Then they'd be able to keep the match viewer function and be able to use those match files for statistics like they do now.

[Raven Hawk]

Anybody notice that the HAM Users Federation is the largest federation in hattrick?

I think Loke will be able to work something out . . .

[Nyarlahotep]

Originally posted by daedalus
Yeah, I know there are three programs (manager assistant, match viewers and statistics sites). But since many of the manager assistant programs have a built in viewer, couldn't they apply for certification for being a match viewer as well? Then they'd be able to keep the match viewer function and be able to use those match files for statistics like they do now.

I don't know that I would say many of the programs have viewers built in. And if they are doing this to reduce the server load, wouldn't all the manager programs adding a viewer function defeat the purpose.

[Eilim]

Check out the HTPoli v4.0 thread in the global conference for some more insight into all of this, and possibly why the wording of the announcement was changed and made a bit more stern than when it was first put up.

Oh, you'll also get insight into why I think goran (developer of HTPoli) is a turd.


-Eilim

[daedalus]

Originally posted by Nyarlahotep
I don't know that I would say many of the programs have viewers built in.My bad. I've only tinkered with Poli lately and was under the impression that HAM had one as well so I thought the others also had it.And if they are doing this to reduce the server load, wouldn't all the manager programs adding a viewer function defeat the purpose.Not so much. For one, if any assistant manager wants to add this functionality, they would also have to be certified. Secondly, if their reason for switching to an XML file for game file is to save server hits, then I can only assume that it'll become a single download instead of an incremental adding of comments. IF that's the case, that would mean is that they now have one server hit for a game file instead of a server hit every 30 seconds-to-1 minute (depending on your refresh rate). In that scenario, even if the manager assistant add that functionality, then it should not hurt the server as much. But that's just a guess from my end without knowing more of their plan.

[daedalus]

Originally posted by Eilim
Check out the HTPoli v4.0 thread in the global conference for some more insight into all of this, and possibly why the wording of the announcement was changed and made a bit more stern than when it was first put up.

Oh, you'll also get insight into why I think goran (developer of HTPoli) is a turd.I can't find the thread. :(

What's the thread title?

[Eilim]

The title was "HTPoli v4.0" , I believe it was locked at 220+ replies. Will go doublecheck on the title now and edit this post if need be.

[Nyarlahotep]

Originally posted by daedalus
My bad. I've only tinkered with Poli lately and was under the impression that HAM had one as well so I thought the others also had it.Not so much. For one, if any assistant manager wants to add this functionality, they would also have to be certified. Secondly, if their reason for switching to an XML file for game file is to save server hits, then I can only assume that it'll become a single download instead of an incremental adding of comments. IF that's the case, that would mean is that they now have one server hit for a game file instead of a server hit every 30 seconds-to-1 minute (depending on your refresh rate). In that scenario, even if the manager assistant add that functionality, then it should not hurt the server as much. But that's just a guess from my end without knowing more of their plan.

Are you talking about the browser on Poli? Otherwise I couldn't find the viewer, I couldn't even retrieve matches with it. So with the new files it would download the results of your match at the start then just reveal the text over the course of 105 minutes (or however long a mtach takes)?

[daedalus]

Originally posted by Nyarlahotep
Are you talking about the browser on Poli? Otherwise I couldn't find the viewer, I couldn't even retrieve matches with it. So with the new files it would download the results of your match at the start then just reveal the text over the course of 105 minutes (or however long a mtach takes)?Yeah, I thought the browser was for viewing games. Is it not? (I haven't tinkered with it at all.) If it isn't, my apologies.

But, yeah, that's one way (initial downloading) they'd be able to handle games as an XML. That'd reduce the amount of hits the server gets.

[Nyarlahotep]

Originally posted by daedalus
Yeah, I thought the browser was for viewing games. Is it not? (I haven't tinkered with it at all.) If it isn't, my apologies.

But, yeah, that's one way (initial downloading) they'd be able to handle games as an XML. That'd reduce the amount of hits the server gets.

Does it automatically refresh for you? If not it really isn't a viewer, it is just like you watching the match on your browser.

If that is how they would do it, then yes it would reduce hits from current levels due to match viewers. But HAM only scans your match once after it is over to get your ratings, so if it had an added viewer to serve the same function, it would still be the same server load wouldn't it?

[daedalus]

Originally posted by Nyarlahotep
Does it automatically refresh for you? If not it really isn't a viewer, it is just like you watching the match on your browser.Good point. It probably isn't (I haven't tinkered with it at all).If that is how they would do it, then yes it would reduce hits from current levels due to match viewers. But HAM only scans your match once after it is over to get your ratings, so if it had an added viewer to serve the same function, it would still be the same server load wouldn't it?Yeah. Assuming the new XML match report is a download once thing, then they should just be able to yank the game one time (in the role of a Match Viewer) then use the information for statistics and not add anymore stress to the server. Hopefully, that's a possibility so that HAM users can keep their functionalities.

[NAIWF]

I agree with whoever thinks Goran is a "turd". I wanted to repeatedly backhand slap him across the mouth until my hand got sore after reading that thread :mad:

[daedalus]

Originally posted by Eilim
The title was "HTPoli v4.0" , I believe it was locked at 220+ replies. Will go doublecheck on the title now and edit this post if need be.222. Finally found it. Since the thread was old (and locked) and I was only looking at "New Messages", it was hidden.

Danke. :)

And, ick, dude's a jerk. I don't think Poli is staying on my computer. :(

[NAIWF]

I just deleted mine after having it for almost 6 months. I'd really like to see him lose a lot of his faitfhul users over this.

His whole "the time I spent while doing something I didn't ever havepermission to do" schpiel is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard, just nipping out his idea that "I should be allowed to improve your game, whether you like it or not". Ugh.

[MacroGuru]

See, the point is, I think they did CHPP because of HTPoli.

The transfer market and match browsers were not approved, and thus putting a drain on the server.

He has a piss and moan match with Loke about Transfer Price Eval, saying that scans additional pages consistently, and Loke tried to tell him it wasn't so.

I became thoroughly unimpressed with Goran. Loke, I have dealt with in a professional manner continuosly.

Anyways, CHPP will hurt for a bit, but it will cause everything to be better.

[Nyarlahotep]

Originally posted by daedalus
Good point. It probably isn't (I haven't tinkered with it at all).Yeah. Assuming the new XML match report is a download once thing, then they should just be able to yank the game one time (in the role of a Match Viewer) then use the information for statistics and not add anymore stress to the server. Hopefully, that's a possibility so that HAM users can keep their functionalities.

My point was they could keep it the exact same and the number of hits would be the same as it would if they made them be a match viewer.

[Nyarlahotep]

From what I saw on the Poli site when I was checking for that viewer, people who haven't paid to lose Poli may not have a choice on using it for much longer. People are using a hacked copy and Goran is throwing fits over it and threatening to publish team numbers and discontinue the free version.

[TargetPractice6]

Yeah, I've always liked Loke. I chatted with him on mIRC once, and he seemed like a down to earth guy. Seeing that I don't really care all that much about series spy or the transfer price thing (I use them, but don't really feel that strongly for them) I don't think this will hurt my enjoyment of HAM much. However I'll be a bit disappointed if it loses the ability to retrive matches.

[Nyarlahotep]

Looks like it will have to be put in manually.


*and it looks like that may just be temporary.

[daedalus]

Originally posted by Nyarlahotep
My point was they could keep it the exact same and the number of hits would be the same as it would if they made them be a match viewer.Oh, I agree. I was just under the impression that they wouldn't be allowed to grab game information from the site anymore and was thinking of that as an alternative for gathering game information.

[FrogMan]

Originally posted by TargetPractice6
Yeah, I've always liked Loke. I chatted with him on mIRC once, and he seemed like a down to earth guy. Seeing that I don't really care all that much about series spy or the transfer price thing (I use them, but don't really feel that strongly for them) I don't think this will hurt my enjoyment of HAM much. However I'll be a bit disappointed if it loses the ability to retrive matches.

You've just echoed my sentiment toward all this. I like series spy and the transfer market price thingy, but could very well live without them. I use HAM to keep track of the movements in my players' value, skills and game ratings over time. Losing the ability to automatically retrieve match wuold be more of a bugger than anything, as I've read that Loke will have a manual retrieving method in place before the deadline for being a CHPP approved program arrives...

FM