Beat LA

[kingfc22]

Well, it looks like the Giants are now back on top of the NL West. After a rough start to the year: bad hitting, poor pitching, poor home record, it's starting to turn around. The Giants have found some offense in the bats of Cruz and Feliz and Alfonzo has been on fire. 16 RBI's this homestand alone including tonight. Schmidt is back to his 2003 form and has thrown two 1-hitters this year; gainst the Cubs and the Red Sox no less. They are now 14-1 in their last 15 at SBC as well.

[Sharpieman]

You beat me to it. Alfonzo was awesome tonight with 6 RBI's. How 'bout them Giants?

[Bad-example]

Nice to see the Giants back in first place. :D

[Driftwood]

I friggin hate Shaq and Kobe. I hope Kobe goes to prison and.....wait.....this is a different LA thread.

[mauchow]

Boy, that division is Pitiful.

[MrBug708]

*sigh*

We blew it twice in a row. I'm not worried though....

[Sharpieman]

I friggin hate Shaq and Kobe. I hope Kobe goes to prison and.....wait.....this is a different LA thread.
Why do you hate Shaq and Kobe? They're not going to be Lakers anymore.

[kingfc22]

A nice 4 game sweep of the bums and Gagne gets tossed. Outstanding stuff. :)

[MrBug708]

Why do you hate Shaq and Kobe? They're not going to be Lakers anymore.

KObe will resign and Shaq is a Laker still...


Way to make the Giants look like a good team actually guys *sigh*

[Lorena]

I learned a LONG time ago not to keep my hopes high regarding my poor Dodgers. Ho hum... another dissapointing year

For all you grieving Dodger fans: http://www.dodgerblues.com/index.html :(

[MrBug708]

I learned a LONG time ago not to keep my hopes high regarding my poor Dodgers. Ho hum... another dissapointing year

For all you grieving Dodger fans: http://www.dodgerblues.com/index.html :(

Give em hell!

[Sharpieman]

KObe will resign and Shaq is a Laker still...


Way to make the Giants look like a good team actually guys *sigh*
Well maybe its just the fact that the Dodgers SUCK and the Giants are a better team. SWWEEEEEP!!!

[Lorena]

Well maybe its just the fact that the Dodgers SUCK and the Giants are a better team. SWWEEEEEP!!!

Sniffle, sniffle...
:( you guys are killing me

[MrBug708]

Well maybe its just the fact that the Dodgers SUCK and the Giants are a better team. SWWEEEEEP!!!

Brett Tomko and his 5 and a half ERA vs Nomo with his 7.11 ERA

Yes Yes

[MrBug708]

Sniffle, sniffle...
:( you guys are killing me

3 and out baby!

[Lorena]

3 and out baby!

**sigh**
:(

[Vince]

Well maybe its just the fact that the Dodgers SUCK and the Giants are a better team. SWWEEEEEP!!!
Ugh...though we do have the upper hand now, do we need to stoop to that level?

As strange as it may sound, this winning streak scares me. Our team played so horribly early in the year, and now we're playing out of our mind good. Where will we end up? I'm left looking at a team that is nearly halfway through the season, and I have absolutely no idea how good they really are. With the clubhouse drama that started to rear its head near the end of the really horrible streak, I'm afraid that another bad stretch might be enough to wipe out the gains we've had from this run and we'll have a drama on our hands within the clubhouse.

[SackAttack]

Vince, it's one of those "Sell your soul to the devil" kinda things. The Bums beat the Burn, so the universe had to correct the imbalance by letting the Dodgers get swept. ;)

[Vince]

Heh...I probably deserved the IHOF loss...I was kind of already counting my chickens and imagining how nice it would be to match my win total in week 4 (doh).

[Franklinnoble]

Go Diamondbacks...err.. whatever.

[Bad-example]

Ugh...though we do have the upper hand now, do we need to stoop to that level?

As strange as it may sound, this winning streak scares me. Our team played so horribly early in the year, and now we're playing out of our mind good. Where will we end up? I'm left looking at a team that is nearly halfway through the season, and I have absolutely no idea how good they really are. With the clubhouse drama that started to rear its head near the end of the really horrible streak, I'm afraid that another bad stretch might be enough to wipe out the gains we've had from this run and we'll have a drama on our hands within the clubhouse.

This Giants team is not really that different from the team that went wire-to-wire last year. RF, C and SS are different but the talent level at those spots is still roughly the same. The starting pitching is also very similar with Ponson and Foppert out and Hermanson and Tomko in. The biggest difference is in the bullpen, with Worrell and most notably Joe Nathan gone.

I think the early poor play by SF can be attributed to the new faces needing time to adjust and to the bullpen roles being unsettled in the first month. Adding a starting pitcher and a reliever or two looks like the best way for Sabian to bolster the club at this point.

I very much like the Giants' chances to win the division.

[clintl]

I am starting to think that this year's team has a good chance to win the division, also, but mostly because the division is so weak. I don't think this team measures up that well compared to last. Pierzinski is fine as a C, but I think they're weaker at both SS and RF, and Tomko and Hermanson are two guys I just have very little trust in. No way is either as good as Ponson was last year, and Foppert might not have been there yet, but he looked like he would develop into a good pitcher. Tomko and Hermanson are lucky to be in a starting rotation at this point in their careers.

[MrBug708]

Anyone else think Michael Tucker is an idiot? The Dodgers were out of the game by then and Gagne isn't exactly a wild pitcher. If he wanted to hit him, he'd be dead right now. I think the only guy more scary than Gagne is probably Farnsworth, but Gagne played hockey growing up and we all know that the Cubs are soft anyhow.

Of course, Barry could go on a roid rage :)

[rkmsuf]

that pitch wasn't even near Tucker. they should have let Gagne pull the guys shirt over his head and give him a whooping.

[Bad-example]

I am starting to think that this year's team has a good chance to win the division, also, but mostly because the division is so weak. I don't think this team measures up that well compared to last. Pierzinski is fine as a C, but I think they're weaker at both SS and RF, and Tomko and Hermanson are two guys I just have very little trust in. No way is either as good as Ponson was last year, and Foppert might not have been there yet, but he looked like he would develop into a good pitcher. Tomko and Hermanson are lucky to be in a starting rotation at this point in their careers.

I agree that the Giants are weaker at SS, but it isn't like Aurilia tore it up last year either. Same for Ponson...he was a failure as a deadline addition. Hermanson is fine as a 5th starter IMO but certainly nothing special. Tomko is the one guy I dread seeing out there, and if Sabean can find someone to slide into the 2 or 3 rotation spot, things will look even brighter. As far as RF goes, Cruz, Jr was just amazing with the glove but given his high K rate and streaky nature, he wasn't much better than the RF-by-committee we have going now.

Also, Foppert might be returning this september. Anything we get from him this season is a bonus.

[clintl]

As far as RF goes, Cruz, Jr was just amazing with the glove but given his high K rate and streaky nature, he wasn't much better than the RF-by-committee we have going now.

He walked a lot, and had a very high OBP as a result (much higher than you would think, considering his BA). And he was good for 20 HRs a year. Right now, Bonds and Grissom are the only two guys you can can on for that, and Grissom just barely. Feliz hasn't done it yet, so I don't think you can count him.

[Bad-example]

That's a good point.

So what do you think the Giants should look for first as far as deadline trade additions?

[MrBug708]

Aren't they close to their limit in terms of owner willingness to spend? The transplant Giant fans call in to the radio stations occasionally and the radio guys tend to think they';ll only acquire a rent a vet again

[clintl]

Starting pitching, so they get Tomko out of the rotation. I doubt that there's going to be a SS or OF available that can really improve them much and isn't a budget-buster. Tucker has been playing better than I expected, so it wouldn't be the end of the world to stick with him in RF. I'd go for a RF with power, though, if one could be had for the right price.

[Bad-example]

We are pretty much in agreement. The Giants have yet to fill the #2 rotation spot that Russ Ortiz used to occupy, and a solid #2 or 3 pitcher would help reduce the strain on the bullpen. Brower and Rodriguez could use some help as well, and I would rate relief help as our number 2 need.

A SS, CF or RF would also be nice though.

[pennywisesb]

I'm afraid that another bad stretch might be enough to wipe out the gains we've had from this run and we'll have a drama on our hands within the clubhouse.

I can only hope...... :D

[kingfc22]

...No way is either as good as Ponson was last year...
I agree with you on Tomko, but Hermanson I have a little more faith in. I did say "little". Ponson sucked. The guy was over-rated and was one of the worst moves Sabean has made in who knows how long. He is showing his putting up some solid numbers this year:

<table width="772" border="0" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="0"> <tbody><tr bgcolor="#aaaaa4" align="right"><td align="left">YEAR</td> <td>G</td> <td>GS</td> <td>CG</td> <td>IP</td> <td>H</td> <td>R</td> <td>HR</td> <td>BB</td> <td>SO</td> <td>K/9</td> <td>W</td> <td>L</td> <td>Sv</td> <td>P/GS</td> <td>WHIP</td> <td>BAA</td> <td>ERA</td> </tr> <tr bgcolor="#ccccc4" align="right"> <td align="left">2004</td> <td>16</td> <td>16</td> <td>3</td> <td>101.1</td> <td>135</td> <td>77</td> <td>10</td> <td>32</td> <td>51</td> <td>4.53</td> <td>3</td> <td>10</td> <td>0</td> <td>98.2</td> <td>1.65</td> <td>.315</td> <td>6.22</td></tr></tbody> </table>

Last year with the Giants:

<table width="772" border="0" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="0"> <tbody><tr bgcolor="#aaaaa4"><td align="left"> Season</td><td align="right"> TM</td><td align="right"> G</td><td align="right"> GS</td><td align="right"> CG</td><td align="right"> SHO</td><td align="right"> IP</td><td align="right"> H</td><td align="right"> R</td><td align="right"> ER</td><td align="right"> HR</td><td align="right"> BB</td><td align="right"> SO</td><td align="right"> W</td><td align="right"> L</td><td align="right"> SV</td><td align="right">HLD</td><td align="right">BLSV</td><td align="right"> ERA</td></tr></tbody> </table> <table width="772" border="0" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="0"> <tbody><tr bgcolor="#ccccc4"><td align="left">2003</td><td align="right">SF</td><td align="right">10</td><td align="right">10</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">68.0</td><td align="right">64</td><td align="right">29</td><td align="right">28</td><td align="right">6</td><td align="right">18</td><td align="right">34</td><td align="right">3</td><td align="right">6</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">--</td><td align="right">3.71</td></tr></tbody> </table>


Playoffs - what he was brought over to do. Become a 1-2 combo with Schmidt:



Year Round Tm Opp WLser G GS ERA W-L SV CG SHO IP H ER BB SO
+------------------+-----+--+--+------+-----+--+--+---+-----+---+---+---+---+
2003 NLDS (http://www.baseball-reference.com/postseason/2003_NLDS1.shtml) SFG (http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/SFG/2003.shtml) FLA (http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/FLA/2003.shtml) L 1 1 7.20 0-0 0 0 0 5.0 7 4 0 3</pre>

[Neuqua]

we all know that the Cubs are soft anyhow.


You cannot just ever leave me alone can you?

[MrBug708]

You cannot just ever leave me alone can you?


I can say the same :p

[clintl]

I agree with you on Tomko, but Hermanson I have a little more faith in. I did say "little". Ponson sucked. The guy was over-rated and was one of the worst moves Sabean has made in who knows how long. He is showing his putting up some solid numbers this year:

<table width="772" border="0" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="0"> <tbody><tr bgcolor="#aaaaa4" align="right"><td align="left">YEAR</td> <td>G</td> <td>GS</td> <td>CG</td> <td>IP</td> <td>H</td> <td>R</td> <td>HR</td> <td>BB</td> <td>SO</td> <td>K/9</td> <td>W</td> <td>L</td> <td>Sv</td> <td>P/GS</td> <td>WHIP</td> <td>BAA</td> <td>ERA</td> </tr> <tr bgcolor="#ccccc4" align="right"> <td align="left">2004</td> <td>16</td> <td>16</td> <td>3</td> <td>101.1</td> <td>135</td> <td>77</td> <td>10</td> <td>32</td> <td>51</td> <td>4.53</td> <td>3</td> <td>10</td> <td>0</td> <td>98.2</td> <td>1.65</td> <td>.315</td> <td>6.22</td></tr></tbody> </table>

Last year with the Giants:

<table width="772" border="0" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="0"> <tbody><tr bgcolor="#aaaaa4"><td align="left"> Season</td><td align="right"> TM</td><td align="right"> G</td><td align="right"> GS</td><td align="right"> CG</td><td align="right"> SHO</td><td align="right"> IP</td><td align="right"> H</td><td align="right"> R</td><td align="right"> ER</td><td align="right"> HR</td><td align="right"> BB</td><td align="right"> SO</td><td align="right"> W</td><td align="right"> L</td><td align="right"> SV</td><td align="right">HLD</td><td align="right">BLSV</td><td align="right"> ERA</td></tr></tbody> </table> <table width="772" border="0" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="0"> <tbody><tr bgcolor="#ccccc4"><td align="left">2003</td><td align="right">SF</td><td align="right">10</td><td align="right">10</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">68.0</td><td align="right">64</td><td align="right">29</td><td align="right">28</td><td align="right">6</td><td align="right">18</td><td align="right">34</td><td align="right">3</td><td align="right">6</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">0</td><td align="right">--</td><td align="right">3.71</td></tr></tbody> </table>


Playoffs - what he was brought over to do. Become a 1-2 combo with Schmidt:



Year Round Tm Opp WLser G GS ERA W-L SV CG SHO IP H ER BB SO
+------------------+-----+--+--+------+-----+--+--+---+-----+---+---+---+---+
2003 NLDS (http://www.baseball-reference.com/postseason/2003_NLDS1.shtml) SFG (http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/SFG/2003.shtml) FLA (http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/FLA/2003.shtml) L 1 1 7.20 0-0 0 0 0 5.0 7 4 0 3</pre>


I didn't like the Ponson trade when it was made because they gave up too much, but he was unlucky rather than bad last year with the Giants. He certainly did not make the kind of difference they were looking for, but he was at least middle of the rotation quality. He is horrible this year, so I'm glad he's not back. I agree, right now, I'd rather have Hermanson. Hell, right now, I'd rather have the 2004 Tomko over the 2004 Ponson, too.

[Vince]

Hey, at the time, the Ponson trade looked a lot like the Schmidt trade. Young, up-and-coming pitcher, pretty decent potential. He didn't pan out, sure...but in the same position, I'd be happy with the move as it happened every time.

[Sharpieman]

Ugh...though we do have the upper hand now, do we need to stoop to that level?
Oh come man, that was a huge 4 game series. My hatred for the dodgers runs deep. Sometimes I just need to vent.


The Giants have a good team, but hopefully Sabean doesnt make a stupid trade like he did for Ponson. Even though he looked like he was going to be good, we gave up Ainsworth a few other young guys to rent a player. Word around here is they probably will make a move, but its going to be a move thats for the short and long term and we wont give up any great young guys like Cain, Valdez etc. So it will probably be a small move, I'm guessing they get a bullpen guy, they need some serious help there.

[Bad-example]

Hey, at the time, the Ponson trade looked a lot like the Schmidt trade. Young, up-and-coming pitcher, pretty decent potential. He didn't pan out, sure...but in the same position, I'd be happy with the move as it happened every time.

Hindsight is 20/20. The trade looked great at the time and it is hard for me to fault Sabean too much. The trade that really sucked was dumping Russ Ortiz, leaving a hole in the rotation behind Schmidt that they still haven't filled.

I also was upset when Nathan got traded. The Giants would look much better with him closing.

[clintl]

I don't agree that the Ponson trade looked much like the Schmidt trade. Vogelsong was never the prospect that Ainsworth was, Rios had pretty much peaked, and they got Vanderwal along with Schmidt. And Schmidt was a lot better than Ponson to start with. Ponson was a guy you had the feeling was in the middle of his career year. Schmidt was a guy with awesome tools that hadn't put it together yet (and now has).

[Sharpieman]

I think Sabean knew that Ponson wasnt going to be another Schimdt, but he did think he could be a good #2 guy in there who could bring in 10-15 wins a year.