Dale Earnhardt Jr. Loses Points Lead

[Bomber]

http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/news/story?id=1895384

" Earnhardt was docked 25 points and fined $10,000 for cursing during a TV interview after his victory at Talladega Superspeedway, NASCAR announced Tuesday."

I understand the fine part, but changing the rankings over swearing seems really ridiculous. I guess this proves racing isn't a sport.

[Pumpy Tudors]

I guess this proves racing isn't a sport.
Oh, come now, was that really necessary?

Anyway, what exactly did he say during the interview? I've read about the swearing since it happened, but I didn't hear it. I'm just curious.

[Bomber]

Asked Sunday by NASCAR broadcaster NBC about the significance of his fifth victory at Talladega, Earnhardt said, "It don't mean s--- right now. Daddy's won here 10 times."

[Bomber]

Dola

That's all the ESPN article says. It doesn't seem like he went crazy with a bunch of F bombs.

[Pumpy Tudors]

Thanks.

[DanGarion]

This is a big load of crap. NASCAR has been pissing me off with these stupid rule changes. Especially how they sometimes make up rules as they go, as they did last year with changing the Yellow Flag rules that first person 1 lap down gets to be put back on the lead lap. And now they fine a driver for saying a cuss word... what BS.

[SirFozzie]

Complete bullshit. Absolutely asinine.

[JeeberD]

***Bulletin***

Fozz has been fined 25 posts due to his inappropriate language.


***Bulletin***

[DanGarion]

***Bulletin***

Fozz has been fined 25 posts due to his inappropriate language.


***Bulletin***
Boo! Hiss! What a crock!

*beats up JeeberD*

[SirFozzie]

*Bulletin*

Foz doesn't give a flying fuck at a monkey's ass about bullshit NASCAR rules that prevent people from acting like fucking normal people instead of robots with a 25 foot stick up their ass. Nascar officials are a bunch of stupid motherfuckers. Assault with a car and deliberately wrecking folks=warning (Tony Stewart, Robby Gordon), but a careless s-bomb.. ooooo scary.... :rolleyes: :) )

*Bulletin*

(anyone want to total up the damage on that post?)

[Crapshoot]

Another reason why NASCAR is pointless and inane... :D

[Scarecrow]

*Bulletin*

Foz doesn't give a flying fuck at a monkey's ass about bullshit NASCAR rules that prevent people from acting like fucking normal people instead of robots with a 25 foot stick up their ass. Nascar officials are a bunch of stupid motherfuckers. Assault with a car and deliberately wrecking folks=warning (Tony Stewart, Robby Gordon), but a careless s-bomb.. ooooo scary.... :rolleyes: :) )

*Bulletin*

(anyone want to total up the damage on that post?)
That's about a 150 post deduction. Skygod, make it happen. http://dynamic2.gamespy.com/%7Efof/forums/images/smilies/wink.gif

[SirFozzie]

Laughs! I dunno, I think the review board would find various egregious circumstances and add on to my deduction :D

[Blackadar]

NASCAR....is....a....joke

[Buzzbee]

For those who care, it is consistent with fines that were issued last year to two Busch series drivers. NASCAR was caught between a rock and a hard place. Fine Junior and be consistent in your enforcement of the rules, OR don't fine Junior and be accused of playin' favorites.

As for fining drivers for cursing, I don't think NASCAR really cares, except for a couple of reasons:

1) To help reduce the image of NASCAR as being a redneck sport (while there is without question a huge redneck element, NASCAR is making a serious effort at overcoming that stereotype and attracting a newer, more sophisticated audience). Discouraging drivers from cursing is a small part of that, IMO.

2) To appease NBC. Like it or not, NASCAR has to keep it's TV affiliates happy. Getting fines from the FCC for foul language is not a way to do that. Without TV money NASCAR would cease to exist as it is today. NASCAR changed the rules in large part to make NBC happy. They'll certainly fine a driver to do the same.

[rkmsuf]

For those who care, it is consistent with fines that were issued last year to two Busch series drivers. NASCAR was caught between a rock and a hard place. Fine Junior and be consistent in your enforcement of the rules, OR don't fine Junior and be accused of playin' favorites.

As for fining drivers for cursing, I don't think NASCAR really cares, except for a couple of reasons:

1) To help reduce the image of NASCAR as being a redneck sport (while there is without question a huge redneck element, NASCAR is making a serious effort at overcoming that stereotype and attracting a newer, more sophisticated audience). Discouraging drivers from cursing is a small part of that, IMO.

2) To appease NBC. Like it or not, NASCAR has to keep it's TV affiliates happy. Getting fines from the FCC for foul language is not a way to do that. Without TV money NASCAR would cease to exist as it is today. NASCAR changed the rules in large part to make NBC happy. They'll certainly fine a driver to do the same.

So why can't they just fine driver and be done with it. Should the NFL dock Randy Moss 100 receiving yards for his fine he just got?

[Buzzbee]

So why can't they just fine driver and be done with it. Should the NFL dock Randy Moss 100 receiving yards for his fine he just got?

Because the fine wouldn't fit the crime if they made it large enough to matter. $25,000 to Jr. is like him dropping the change at the drive through window. Reducing points is the only way to get a driver's attention.

If Moss could win a Super Bowl based on receiving yards, then perhaps that might be appropriate. However, since he can't it would be a little bit ludicrous.

[Bomber]

I'm fine with the fine, but changing the standings is just dumb.

[rkmsuf]

Because the fine wouldn't fit the crime if they made it large enough to matter. $25,000 to Jr. is like him dropping the change at the drive through window. Reducing points is the only way to get a driver's attention.

If Moss could win a Super Bowl based on receiving yards, then perhaps that might be appropriate. However, since he can't it would be a little bit ludicrous.

Yet somehow every other sport survives by using fines and suspensions.

They should take away a Viking win then by that logic.

[Bomber]

So if Vijay starting swearing after a round do you think the PGA would move Ernie up to the number 1 spot. This is a joke.

[Radii]

If you want to do something that equates to a suspension like in baseball, why not black flag him for the first 3 laps of the race or something. Changing existing standings seems downright fraudulant. If I was a NASCAR fan that would seriously make me question the integrity of.. well, most everything in the sport. Penalize future starts in some way, don't take away what's already been earned.

[Buzzbee]

So if Vijay starting swearing after a round do you think the PGA would move Ernie up to the number 1 spot. This is a joke.

Hmmm...if Vijay swore after winning the PGA championship and the television network risked getting hit with fines from the FCC, and the PGA fined Vijay as a result of the network pressure and according to the PGA's own rules, and that reduction in earnings resulted in him being moved down on the winnings list, then yes.

It isn't that NASCAR moved anyone UP to the #1 spot, which you don't seem to grasp. It is that someone was punished for their actions and as a result no longer has more points than the 2nd place guy. Were the consequences commensurate with the crime? Perhaps not, but they were consistent with what NASCAR had levied in the past.

[Kevin]

I agree that they shouldn't have taken away the points. Perhaps a mandatory extra stop and go at the next race would have been more appropriate.

[Buzzbee]

If you want to do something that equates to a suspension like in baseball, why not black flag him for the first 3 laps of the race or something. Changing existing standings seems downright fraudulant. If I was a NASCAR fan that would seriously make me question the integrity of.. well, most everything in the sport. Penalize future starts in some way, don't take away what's already been earned.

Penalizing future starts seems like a good idea until you analyze it. Starting 3 laps down could very possible lead to a driver being penalized by significantly more than 25 points. On the other hand, it is possible with the way things fall that a driver could potentially win, even after being handicapped. As a result, their isn't really a connection with the punishment and the crime.

[Buzzbee]

I agree that they shouldn't have taken away the points. Perhaps a mandatory extra stop and go at the next race would have been more appropriate.

Which could very possibly (and most likely would) lead to losing significantly MORE than 25 points.

[rkmsuf]

So I guess after the trophy is awarded for leading driver he can just let the expletives fly.

Heck if I'm out of the points race I'm opening a can of vulgarity whoop ass on y'all.

[Radii]

Penalizing future starts seems like a good idea until you analyze it. Starting 3 laps down could very possible lead to a driver being penalized by significantly more than 25 points. On the other hand, it is possible with the way things fall that a driver could potentially win, even after being handicapped. As a result, their isn't really a connection with the punishment and the crime.

I certainly don't claim to know what a good punishment would be, that was just an example. My point is that if you want to be taken seriously as a legitimate sport, you absolutely cannot be altering existing standings. I don't like NASCAR, but i'm not on the 'its not a sport' bandwagon, I'm pretty indifferent... but this is up there with corrupt and subjective judging in figure skating and gymnastics in terms of legitimizing a competition in my mind.

[Buzzbee]

I certainly don't claim to know what a good punishment would be, that was just an example. My point is that if you want to be taken seriously as a legitimate sport, you absolutely cannot be altering existing standings. I don't like NASCAR, but i'm not on the 'its not a sport' bandwagon, I'm pretty indifferent... but this is up there with corrupt and subjective judging in figure skating and gymnastics in terms of legitimizing a competition in my mind.

In skating and gymnastics don't they deduct points if you don't execute certain moves according to the rules? If you have certain required jumps or tumbles you are required to make and you don't, they reduce your score.

If a college uses an ineligible player, that team forfeits any victories, thus altering existing standings.

I understand your point that altering standings based on behavior and not something related to performance on the track is a little wacky, and I agree with you. My only point is that the reduction in points was consistent with past actions and is in accordance with the rules that the drivers are well aware of. The reduction in points was justified based on that. However, that doesn't mean that I don't think the rules should be modified.

[DanGarion]

Maybe we should just take him out back and shoot him, that's what we did in the good ol days!

YEEEEEE HAAAAAAAW!

[rkmsuf]

Maybe we should just take him out back and shoot him, that's what we did in the good ol days!

YEEEEEE HAAAAAAAW!

now that is funny!:)

[DanGarion]

now that is funny!:)

Glad to be of service.

[SunDancer]

In skating and gymnastics don't they deduct points if you don't execute certain moves according to the rules? If you have certain required jumps or tumbles you are required to make and you don't, they reduce your score.

If a college uses an ineligible player, that team forfeits any victories, thus altering existing standings.

I understand your point that altering standings based on behavior and not something related to performance on the track is a little wacky, and I agree with you. My only point is that the reduction in points was consistent with past actions and is in accordance with the rules that the drivers are well aware of. The reduction in points was justified based on that. However, that doesn't mean that I don't think the rules should be modified.

Consistent? It seems Little E gets a heavier fined and penalize for saying "shit", which is just absurd, then the guys that get pissed off, throw helmets and try to go after other drivers. If Little E doesn't win a championship and he is within 25 points of it, I think NASCAR will be really screwed, with the drivers/owners, and the fans (which E is the most popular driver). Also, he said "Shit?".

[Glengoyne]

So why can't they just fine driver and be done with it. Should the NFL dock Randy Moss 100 receiving yards for his fine he just got?
My take is the 25 points is MUCH more painful, and memorable than the $10,000. It is just like disciplining children, you take away what matters the most to them at a given time as punishment.

In the EPL soccer thread there was some discussion of the disciplinary action taken against a team whose fans had injured a referee by throwing an object from the stands. The game was called immediately with the visiting team ahead. It was apparently not their first offense, and the visiting team was awarded a 3-nil win, and the home team was directed to play their next two home dates in an empty stadium. Now that is a punishment.

[EagleFan]

I think it's about time they actually make that over-rated driver play by some of the same rules as everyone else. The way they stroke him off every week you would swear he's a 5 time defending champion.

[CHEMICAL SOLDIER]

I disagree with docking 25 pts. A fine would have been sufficient. I mean it seemed like a spur of the moment thing and when I saw the interview didint even hear it until the replays yesterday. This could very well determine the champion if the race is tight.

[DanGarion]

I think it's about time they actually make that over-rated driver play by some of the same rules as everyone else. The way they stroke him off every week you would swear he's a 5 time defending champion.
Well he has won at Talladega 5 times...

[rkmsuf]

Stroker Ace would never stand for such a penalty.

[gstelmack]

The whole bit about having a "race for the championship" but then putting other drivers in the field that aren't in that race is just ridiculous. See the recent Robby Gordon incident.

[DanGarion]

I think they should just throw all the guys names in a bowl and pick a winner each week, that way there are no questions as to the validity of the winner. I mean you throw out any actual competition then everyone is on a fair playing field...

[clintl]

Kind of funny that NASCAR docks drivers points for something like this, but doesn't do much of anything when one driver intentionally wrecks another.