Computer nightmare, need tech guru help

[JonInMiddleGA]

Okay, the worst possible computer thing appears to have happened to me -- hard disk failure with incredibly woefully inadequate backups.

Yes, you can lecture me about that later, but please, not now. You do NOT want to know how many work files are in there as the only existing copy, nor emails, never mind the volumes of games materials that are there.

Long story short, multiple system lockups today, several requiring hardboots (as in "the only way out was the power button"), and then suddenly "Non-system disk or disk error" msgs on startup. You know, that innocent looking message that you always get when stupidly leaving a floppy in the drive -- well, it doesn't look so innocent when a) there's nothing in the floppy drive and b) it doesn't like having a floppy boot disk in there either.

Everything I've been able to Google seems to indicate that a hard disk failure is the likely cause at this point, so I'm down to desparation here -- time to find a data recovery center in/around Atlanta hopefully & see if they can work some magic.

But ... how the heck to pick one? They all seem to claim the same things, all seem to start in the $500-$1000 range, all seem to suggest 3-5 day service avg. My contacts in the IT field around here are pretty slim pickings these days, so I'm kinda stuck but would love to have someone provide advice that is at least better than throwing darts at the phone book.

Help pls, this is about as bad a situation as I can think of that doesn't involve another person. Just me & the machine on this one guys, praying somebody can help me do more than tread water on this one, I'm pretty much panicking right now.

Thanks in advance.

[Antmeister]

Okay, the worst possible computer thing appears to have happened to me -- hard disk failure with incredibly woefully inadequate backups.

Yes, you can lecture me about that later, but please, not now. You do NOT want to know how many work files are in there as the only existing copy, nor emails, never mind the volumes of games materials that are there.

Long story short, multiple system lockups today, several requiring hardboots (as in "the only way out was the power button"), and then suddenly "Non-system disk or disk error" msgs on startup. You know, that innocent looking message that you always get when stupidly leaving a floppy in the drive -- well, it doesn't look so innocent when a) there's nothing in the floppy drive and b) it doesn't like having a floppy boot disk in there either.

Everything I've been able to Google seems to indicate that a hard disk failure is the likely cause at this point, so I'm down to desparation here -- time to find a data recovery center in/around Atlanta hopefully & see if they can work some magic.

But ... how the heck to pick one? They all seem to claim the same things, all seem to start in the $500-$1000 range, all seem to suggest 3-5 day service avg. My contacts in the IT field around here are pretty slim pickings these days, so I'm kinda stuck but would love to have someone provide advice that is at least better than throwing darts at the phone book.

Help pls, this is about as bad a situation as I can think of that doesn't involve another person. Just me & the machine on this one guys, praying somebody can help me do more than tread water on this one, I'm pretty much panicking right now.

Thanks in advance.


Now this may be a long shot, but this is what worked for me when I had a similar problem. Just because it says hard disk failure doesn't mean the hard drive is busted. Sometimes you can just have a damaged boot sector on the hard drive. If you are able to boot from your CD-ROM, you could attempt to repair Windows, but don't reformat the hard drive. I belive I also went into the recovery console and repaired that boot sector as well, but you can try windows first. I really hope that helps. Since I have done that a month ago, everything is working fine.

[dacman]

Is your computer making any new weird noises?

Do you have a bootable floppy disk? You need to get your hands on one and boot with that and see if your drive is accessable in that manner as a first step.

[flere-imsaho]

I don't have experience in the area, but I'd highly recommend asking here. (http://episteme.arstechnica.com/eve/ubb.x/a/frm/f/24609792)

There's even a sort of thread about it here. (http://episteme.arstechnica.com/eve/ubb.x/a/tpc/f/24609792/m/571004092731)

Good luck. :(

[Draft Dodger]

I don't have experience in the area, but I'd highly recommend asking here. (http://episteme.arstechnica.com/eve/ubb.x/a/frm/f/24609792)

There's even a sort of thread about it here. (http://episteme.arstechnica.com/eve/ubb.x/a/tpc/f/24609792/m/571004092731)

Good luck. :(

seconded.

[Ryan S]

Try putting the disk in a fridge for a few hours. If that does fix it, it won't fix it long term, but it might give you a chance to get some files from the disk.

[Ryan S]

Have you tried setting the disk up as a slave on another PC?

[Crapshoot]

Wish I could help more. Data Recovery Services can generally recover pretty much anything, short of you having gone over the Hard Drive with a polarized magnet.

These guys might be useful - but I admit I can't vouch for them.
http://www.ontrack.com/

[Franklinnoble]

Try putting the disk in a fridge for a few hours. If that does fix it, it won't fix it long term, but it might give you a chance to get some files from the disk.
Are you serious?

I've been working on computers for 15+ years and never heard this.

What about the freezer? Will that fix it faster?

Should I use the crisper drawer?

[Surtt]

It's a long shot too, but check your bios.
Sometimes they lose your settings.

[jeff061]

Freezer is serious. It may get it up and running for just a long enough time to get your data back.

But if this data is so important you'd pay 500-1000 I wouldn't touch it again. Don't turn on your computer, don't touch the drive, let a professional handle it. Unfortunately I don't have any recommendations. But everything you do to it from here on out decreases the success rate of a recovery.

[Farrah Whitworth-Rahn]

Have you tried setting the disk up as a slave on another PC?
I had a hard drive crash on me about a month ago, and this worked. It gave me about ten minutes to recover everything I could before the thing just died.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Sorry, I did a shitty job of explaining what I've done/not done or what's happening, I'm truly freaked out here. {takes deep breath}

Okay, from powered down, standing start,
1)turn power on -- there's no noise from the HD at all, the Compaq splash screen appears on the monitor, you see the DVD drive light flash briefly, then the floppy drive light flashes, and you get the "Non-System Disk, etc." message. You get the same message whether there's anything in the floppy drive or not.

2) I've tried a floppy boot disk (I really thought that was going to work too) but same results.

And, just now, trying to see if I was missing anything, I notice that I have a different message on powerup. Now it reads "Invalid system disk. Please replace and try again."

Not sure what the heck that means, or how it's different, but that's what it said.

Now, as far as what I've tried and why I'm fearing the worst, this is the most common sort of result I've gotten from various Googles on the error messages I'm getting

http://www.computerhope.com/issues/ch000229.htm
Issue:

Invalid / Non System Disk error.

Cause:

This error can be caused by one or more of the following possibilities:

1. Floppy or CD that is not bootable is currently in the computer.
2. BIOS or CMOS setup is not setup properly.
3. Hard disk drive does not have bootable files on it.
4. The hard disk drive is bad or not connected properly.

Solution:

Floppy or CD that is not bootable is currently in the computer

Verify that no floppy diskette or CD is currently in the computer. Okay, all my portable media drives are emptyIf a diskette or CD is in the computer that is not bootable your computer may attempt to boot from that diskette or CD causing this error message.

BIOS is not setup properly

Additional information and help with getting into BIOS or CMOS setup can be found on document CH000192

1. Verify that your hard disk drive is setup and detected properly in BIOS. I'm totally out of my league here, no idea how to even beginYou're computer should list a hard disk drive installed either under the main page or the drives page in BIOS. If BIOS indicates the drive is not installed or not detected skip to Hard Disk drive is bad or not connected properly.
2. Verify the boot options are properly set in BIOS, almost all BIOS setups should contain options specifying how your computer boots. For example most computers should have their boot options setup similar to the below example.

- Floppy drive
- CD drive
- Hard drive

3. Rest your BIOS to default values. Many BIOS will enable users to reset the values to the default settings. If you've tried the above options without success try resetting the BIOS.

Hard disk drive does not have bootable files on it

It is possible that command.com or another bootable file may be missing from the hard disk drive. Follow the below steps to possible resolve your issue.

Windows 95, Windows 98, and Windows ME users

1. Boot from a bootable floppy diskette.
I fail right here, it won't boot from bootable floppy
2. At the A:\> type fdisk <press enter>
3. If you receive a message no fixed disk present, read Hard Disk drive is bad or not connected properly.
4. If you are able to get into fdisk, choose option 4 to display the partition information. In the partition information, if the System is listed as FAT16 or FAT32 then continue to step 5. If you have a message indicating no partitions defined, no information is on your hard disk drive and you will need to create a new partition. See our fdisk page for additional information.
5. If you see FAT16 or FAT32 in fdisk press the ESC key until back at the A:\>
6. Once at the A:\> type, sys c: <press enter> (only do this command if you are using the same operating system that this diskette was created on).
7. This should return a message 'System Transferred', if you receive bad command or file name and have verified you have typed the command properly, you will need to obtain a bootable diskette with the file sys.com on it.
8. If system was transferred successfully, reboot the computer and issue should be resolved.

[JonInMiddleGA]

But if this data is so important you'd pay 500-1000 I wouldn't touch it again.

Sad to admit it, but I'd probably pay 2x-3x that for this stuff (hopefully that won't be neccessary)

[/quote] Don't turn on your computer, don't touch the drive, let a professional handle it. ... But everything you do to it from here on out decreases the success rate of a recovery.[/quote]

That "one more try" instance notwithstanding, this is kinda where my head is at right now. I'm hoping to focus my attentions tomorrow morning to "okay, who are my best options for this" and go from there.

[JonInMiddleGA]

My sincere thanks to everybody -- there's nobody here tonight but me & my 7 y/o (wife out of town), so it helps just to have somewhere/somebody to vent all this fear to.
This isn't "go bankrupt" sort of trouble, but it is "have major problems just doing my job properly" trouble.

[Glengoyne]

When you say you fail to boot to floppy, do you get a message saying something about an invalid system disk?

If you do, then you have a bad floppy....or your system isn't setup to boot to floppy. If you go into the BIOS...usually hitting DEL or ESC soon after powering on to bring up your BIOS menu, there will be an option for boot drive sequence. Make sure the floppy is in that sequence, and before your hard disks.

[JonInMiddleGA]

When you say you fail to boot to floppy, do you get a message saying something about an invalid system disk?

Either that one or the other one "Non-system disk error"

If you do, then you have a bad floppy....or your system isn't setup to boot to floppy. If you go into the BIOS...usually hitting DEL or ESC soon after powering on to bring up your BIOS menu, there will be an option for boot drive sequence. Make sure the floppy is in that sequence, and before your hard disks.

Okay, from that description there, I actually do know how to get to the BIOS. Hitting {escape} gives me an old-fashioned DOS-looking screen(the old blue & gray one), first one with language choices, and then with three options in this order -- CD, Floppy, and Hard Disk #suchandsuch (I'm doing this from memory, but that's the gist of it & I'm very sure all three are in there.

While we're on the subject, any ideas how/why the heck am I getting a message about "Non-System disk..." when there's nothing in the floppy drive?

[Rizon]

Either that one or the other one "Non-system disk error"



Okay, from that description there, I actually do know how to get to the BIOS. Hitting {escape} gives me an old-fashioned DOS-looking screen(the old blue & gray one), first one with language choices, and then with three options in this order -- CD, Floppy, and Hard Disk #suchandsuch (I'm doing this from memory, but that's the gist of it & I'm very sure all three are in there.

While we're on the subject, any ideas how/why the heck am I getting a message about "Non-System disk..." when there's nothing in the floppy drive?

Your hard drive is a disk.

[Rizon]

One of the first things I would do is take the case off my computer, and look for loose cables.

[jeff061]

It most likely sees that there is a hard drive connected, but the boot sector is wrecked and is no longer bootable.

A non bootable hard drive and a non bootable floppy disk will both give you the same non-system disk error.

[JonInMiddleGA]

but the boot sector is wrecked and is no longer bootable.

Well, it's at least a tiny bit of comfort to see someone who seems to know what they're talking about who is thinking what I'm thinking.

Now, if that were to be the case, may I at least retain some realistic hopes that pros might be able to recover the data on there? I mean, that wouldn't be a case of absolutely hopeless or anything, right?

[jeff061]

I'd say there is defintly a realistic chance they can recover your data.

Should add my last post is misleading. Should have said it can't read your boot sector, which can really mean anything :). However recovery places can work some magic with some pretty messed up drives.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Thanks Jeff (and everybody), at least I can try to sleep knowing that all is not lost quite yet.

Meanwhile, I've already started reaching out for advice, including looking for a recommendation from the IT guru for the Turner Broadcast networks (once & a while, it comes in handy to know somebody that knows somebody).

[Wolfpack]

If the hard drive can spin, then it's possible to recover data from it. I had hard drive problems last year and had to go pick up a new drive. However, since the old one could still read data, I could slave it to the new one and get data off it. The strange irony is that the new drive suddenly started throwing blue screens of death every time it booted, so I had to go back to the old one and for whatever reason that drive works fine now.

However, if you've got a mechanical failure that's preventing the drive from spinning, you are probably looking at data recovery specialists (this may be the case since you seem to indicate in one of your posts that the drive isn't making any noise at all).

I would say that your data is fine, though. Short of physically damaging the platter, or as someone pointed out, running a nice-sized magnet over the drive, whatever's been written to the drive should stay there indefinitely while you get the situation resolved.

[MizzouRah]

We use Ontrack at work. www.ontrack.com (http://www.ontrack.com/)

Have you tried start -> run -> cmd -> chkdsk /f ??

Reboot your pc and if you can get it be recognized, it will run and fix any dsk errors you have and my help for a short period of time. I would definitly get my data backed up ASAP and get a new HD before it goes out completely.

Sounds like bad sectors, specifically in the boot sector and sometimes after saving your data you can do a low level format and still re-use the drive.. BUT I would get a new one.


Todd

[JonInMiddleGA]

Okay, there is much more hope now than there was last night.

You know how it goes, you just can't resist one more try sometimes -- no matter how much you know you shouldn't do it, you just have to ...

Well, I figured if I'm gonna try one more time before boxing this up & heading to somebody's shop somewhere, I should do it right. In my mind, that meant going back to scratch on the floppy bootdisk, make a brand new one & give it a try.

Sure enough, she'll now boot to floppy.
And I can see the contents of the C:
And I can get a C: prompt

This, after talking to my best old IT buddy, is a very good sign that I'm not perma-fucked, just tempa-screwed instead.

Bottom line goal for me now is to get this data -- if there's a way to salvage everything with a reformat or whatever, even better, but at least I'm not FUBAR if I get the data. Seems to be a case that calls for making this drive a slave to another machine, copy en masse, and then we'll go from there.

Still not out of the woods yet, and there's probably 1,000 things that can go wrong even from this point, but at least there seems to be more reason for hope than there was last night.

And the minute this is completed, I promise -- tape drives for regular backups.
I will NOT endure this again.

[MizzouRah]

Yes, slaving it is a great way to get your data - it still sounds like the boot sector is screwed up - usually a chkdks or a Windows repair can fix it. .but I'd do what you plan on doing.


Todd