DVD-RAM question (+ new DVD-RW question)

[FrogMan]

I'm not too sure if anybody knows much about the DVD-RAM format but I figured there's gotta be someone on FOFC who can help me :)

We bought a DVD recorder with our new TV right after Christmas. It's a JVC brand that can record on DVD-R, DVD-RW and DVD-RAM. The DVD-RAM option is what sold me on it, even though I didn't know much about it. We got the recorder basically to be used as a replacement to our VCR. Basically, the DVD -RAM it works as a hard drive in a sense that you can record stuff on it, delete part of it and your regain whatever is the space of what you deleted (if that makes any sense), as opposed to a DVD-RW where you have to delete everything to regain space on the disc (from what I understand anyway)...

Anyway, the owner's manual of the recorder says I can write on DVD-RAMs of 4.7GB and on ones of 9.4GB. I've found a place where I could buy 9.4GB DVD-RAMs for about 7.5$cdn per disc compared to about 5.25$cdn for a 4.7GB so I'm thinking I should get the 9.4 one seeing how I would get twice the recording length for about 40% increase in cost (and would be able to record longer shows without sacrificing on quality). Here's my question, and it may be a complete newbie question, but there it is: When they describe a 9.4GB DVD-RAM, they call it "double sided", does that actually mean I will have to flip the disc over to write on both side of it?

For what it's worth the DVD-RAM we can write to are the types without a cartridge (if you know about DVD-RAM, you should know what I'm talking about).

Thanks in advance.
FM

[PackerFanatic]

No, you don't have to flip it over :)

[FrogMan]

No, you don't have to flip it over :)okay, thanks, I knew it was a newbie stupidistic question. :)

Any opinion on the Optodisc brand of DVD-RAM blanks?

FM

[Glengoyne]

Hmm My DVR writes to a DVD-RAM in a cartridge...so I can't help.

[PackerFanatic]

Naw, sometimes though terms and shit can get people really confused.

I have never actually used those types of DVDs, so I couldn't tell ya.

[Glengoyne]

okay, thanks, I knew it was a newbie stupidistic question. :)

Any opinion on the Optidisc brand of DVD-RAM blanks?

FMThe owners manual of mine said right up front that certain brands will not work, and gave a reccomendation of a specific brand...some no-name company actually. So I'm guessing it is very player dependant.

[FrogMan]

The owners manual of mine said right up front that certain brands will not work, and gave a reccomendation of a specific brand...some no-name company actually. So I'm guessing it is very player dependant.
hrm, I'll look more closely about this. I know they do recommend the JVC brand of discs, but who wouldn't recommend their own brand, huh? :)

Thanks for the input.

FM

[DanGarion]

The owners manual of mine said right up front that certain brands will not work, and gave a reccomendation of a specific brand...some no-name company actually. So I'm guessing it is very player dependant.
This site might help, not sure what model you got and I can't remember if they list TV only DVD players but it's worth a look.

http://www.videohelp.com/dvdplayers

Also I've always heard great things about RiData DVDs.

[FrogMan]

This site might help, not sure what model you got and I can't remember if they list TV only DVD players but it's worth a look.

http://www.videohelp.com/dvdplayers

Also I've always heard great things about RiData DVDs.
Thanks for the link but I'd already stumbled upon that site in my quest for information. They don't list our recorder in there though...

This is our recorder:
http://www.jvc.ca/en/consumer/product-detail.asp?model=DR-M100S

I've also read good things about RiData DVDs although I'm unsure if they make any DVD-RAM discs. Optodisc is supposedly one of the big player in the DVD-RAM field. www.optodisc.com (http://www.optodisc.com)

FM

[sterlingice]

The DVD burner on my PC can do DVD-RAM but I've never used it before so I'm curious how this works out for you.

SI

[FrogMan]

The DVD burner on my PC can do DVD-RAM but I've never used it before so I'm curious how this works out for you.

SI
I believe it's a bit different between a PC (under windows) and a standalone DVD recorder, something to do with the formating of the disc. This is only from what little I've read about it. As I said, we're using the recorder to do our daily recording of whatever we wanna watch later from the TV. My PC doesn't even have a DVD writer, so that one bit is out of the question...

I will one day get a few disk and I'll report back in here :)


FM

[FrogMan]

I have not bought any of these DVD-RAM disks yet but I got another question for you guys, this time regarding DVD-RW. I've been shopping online to find some cheap DVD-RW to go with my set-top DVD recorder. Just found some ridiculously cheap ones at tigerdirect.ca, something like $9.99 for a bundle of 25. Thing I just saw is that they are said to be 1X speed.

Here's my question: does the burning speed matter for a DVD recorder when you use the recorder simply as a VCR substitute? Note, it's not a burner which is inside my PC so I'm not using it to write huge chunks of data at once, I'm simply recording TV shows/movies that I wanna watch later.

Thanks in advance.

FM

[FrogMan]

okay, I have just about answered my own question...

From this page:
http://www.videohelp.com/dvd

I found these DVD writes speeds with some time next to them:
Single Layer(4.7GB) write speeds
1x (CLV) = about 58 minutes
2x (CLV) = about 29 minutes
2.4x (CLV) = about 24 minutes
4x (CLV) = about 14.5 minutes
6x (CLV/ZCLV) = about 10-12 minutes
8x (PCAV/ZCLV) = about 8-10 minutes
12x (PCAV/ZCLV) = about 6.5-7.5 minutes
16x (CAV/ZCLV) = about 6-7 minutes

I assume that this means that at 1X, it would take 58 minutes to write the whole 4.7GB. This would mean that it makes no difference whatever speed I take if I'm simply recording TV shows, since I'll be recording 4 hours of stuff on a 4.7GB DVD and I record it in real time anyway... Anybody wanna confirm this?

FM

[FrogMan]

so, nobody can confirm?

FM

[M GO BLUE!!!]

Recording 4 hours to the disc will result in a low image quality. I recommend only two hours. I have a panasonic HDD/DVD unit and love it. I use RAM discs to store things temporarily and DVD-R to store them permanently. I can get up to around 2:20 on a -R before I start to notice a degrading of quality. The RAM discs I have only burned with the high-speed dubbing. It takes about 30 minutes to burn a full disc, which I can get about 2:08 on in perfect quality.

[FrogMan]

yeah, I know about the image quality. I've tried to stretch it to 5 hours but couldn't swallow it. But this is only for my everyday record and watch kind of things, sort of same way you'd use a DVR for. Whenever I wanna record a movie off of the premium movie channels, I set the recorder to use what they call "free rate" and use about the exact same time as the movie lasts.

So, from the chart in my previous post, if it takes about 30 minutes to burn a disk of yours, you must be using 2X speed disks, correct?

You got an idea as to the disk I wanted to get, the DVD-RW at 1X speed, will they be all right with the DVD recorder?

Thanks again.

FM

[Butter]

I have a DVD recorder on my TV and a DVD burner on my computer.

I have erased things off of a DVD+RW and kept other things on the same disk... and gotten the space back immediately. I don't know the other advantages of a DVD-RAM, but I thought you'd at least like to know that in my experience with the DVD+RW (different format than the DVD-RW) that you can regain space by deleting individual items off the disk rather than the entire thing.

Good luck.

[FrogMan]

I have a DVD recorder on my TV and a DVD burner on my computer.

I have erased things off of a DVD+RW and kept other things on the same disk... and gotten the space back immediately. I don't know the other advantages of a DVD-RAM, but I thought you'd at least like to know that in my experience with the DVD+RW (different format than the DVD-RW) that you can regain space by deleting individual items off the disk rather than the entire thing.

Good luck.
yeah, that's what I figured out this week. If I format my disk in "VR mode", I get my space back for whatever I either delete or simply edit out. I could go in and edit out 5 minutes of one recording and would get 5 minutes back on the whole disk. I've tried this and it worked perfectly. That's one of the reason why I've sort of waited to get any DVD-RAM so far, the price difference between a -RAM and a -RW is enormous at about $1 per RW and $5 per RAM...

The one advantage of the RAM disk would be the ability to watch something on the disk while it is recording...

FM

[FrogMan]

I have a DVD recorder on my TV and a DVD burner on my computer.
forgot to comment that this setup would be the one I'd like to get but my computer is about 3 years old and has the very basic CD burner in it. With a burner in the PC, you can then play with whatever you record and rearrange it, thus compensating for the lack of a HD in the recorder that's hooked to the TV...

FM