WW XXXV ( night phase ends friday 9:00 AM,) SAW!!!!

[Lorena]

Just some more food for thought - the wolves would not want a tie on day 1. They would want a villager lynched. A tie, and they are also a day behind.

Ties, are confusing and too much of a hassle to try and figure out sometimes. The only way I can see a tie working out in the villager's favor is to create some last minute moves by wolves towards the end of the day. You're right cronin, the wolves are also a day behind as a villager would most likely have been lynched last night, but on the other hand, we prisoners also lose a day in that we lost that one chance to find an assistant and cut his stomach open.

Ugh... Just call me Very Fucking Confused.

[Blade6119]

To explain: There are very few players who, as wolves, would have targeted SnDvls last night.

Exactly like i expected...i even addressed this on day one(explaining to LSG why i would kill her on night one this game if i was a wolf):

Because you are a fairly rescourceful player, but your not considered on the experience level of players like cronin and sndvls. You would make a solid kill that would generally be considered against what is expected of me as a wolf.

I highly doubt the wolves will kill you, no worries. I have 4 people i expect to be chosen from.

Everyone, including you right now expects me to make that move...why would i?

I didnt see any clues he was the seer by the way, so im not sure how anyone could have been that intuitive.

[Tyrith]

As much as I'd love for there to be a good reason to lynch blade, I have to agree with his logic, there would be no way to pick up a seer tell on Day One like that.

[st.cronin]

I didnt see any clues he was the seer by the way, so im not sure how anyone could have been that intuitive.

Well, neither did I, but I almost never see the same clues you do. I didn't read your post to LSG as making SnDvls a likely candidate at all.

[Blade6119]

Dola, my four people were myself, cronin, sndvls, and saldana...it all played out last night like i expected. Its also a cunning wolf, as sndvls was the only one of the four of us to not take a firm stance on yesterday or play a key role in the tie/lynch thing. It was the best kill i could see them making last night, in retrospect, and for that i applaude the wolves.

[Blade6119]

Well, neither did I, but I almost never see the same clues you do. I didn't read your post to LSG as making SnDvls a likely candidate at all.

My post meant that everyone(based on previous rants to this games GM) would assume i would kill off the vets first. I have trumpeted that...so as a wolf, expecting everyone to think that way, i would go after newer players. Maybe you dont think im smart enough to make that progression in my head, which either way matters little in the end. So far the argument i see you using is one i could use against you. Unfortunately, i still think we need to kill tyrith to gain knowledge of the day 1 lynch(especially now we lost the seer already). Information from lynches is our only path to victory now, we cant afford to screw around and have last second ties.

[Blade6119]

As much as I'd love for there to be a good reason to lynch blade

May i ask why?

[Tyrith]

I'm still jealous that Lathum got to explode you in the middle of the day during the Egypt game, I want my crack at you :)

[Blade6119]

When you prove I had selfish intent at heart -- other than objectively trying to win the game -- tell me. Until then, I will not stand for being insulted any further. Don't make it personal.

I believe he meant selfish in the sense you took your own personal game experience, and its continued existance, and put it before the groups need to find out info from the lynch, to search for keys(which you very well may have in you), and to allow people to make moves that could be incriminating/earning of trust.

I dont think the issue comes in the fact you tied it, the issue is that you waited until it would be impossible for anyone to react to it and decide either way. There is a difference between self-preservation and personal victory, and that of a team victory. Your actions yesterday were conducive to one and not to the latter. Thats as tactfully as i can put it tyrith, as to his reasoning. Now thats working under the assumption your a villager. If your evil, then other motives come to light. Your defense of nequa is also quite interesting now that i know for sure neither of you are the seer...

[Blade6119]

VOTE TYRITH

We need to learn about yesterdays lynch, and actions today have been quite interesting regarding his defense.

[LoneStarGirl]

Vote Tyrinth

I said I was going to do this, and I stick by my word. I would have voted earlier but I got distracted with my class.

[Tyrith]

I believe he meant selfish in the sense you took your own personal game experience, and its continued existance, and put it before the groups need to find out info from the lynch, to search for keys(which you very well may have in you), and to allow people to make moves that could be incriminating/earning of trust.

I dont think the issue comes in the fact you tied it, the issue is that you waited until it would be impossible for anyone to react to it and decide either way. There is a difference between self-preservation and personal victory, and that of a team victory. Your actions yesterday were conducive to one and not to the latter. Thats as tactfully as i can put it tyrith, as to his reasoning. Now thats working under the assumption your a villager. If your evil, then other motives come to light. Your defense of nequa is also quite interesting now that i know for sure neither of you are the seer...

It's not like there was some secret block on people changing their votes. Facts of public record: 1) My vote was uncast. 2) I was watching the thread the entire last hour. And I was referring to that act of selfishness, too. You would not have learned ANYTHING from that lynch, except that you probably would have gone apeshit on whichever poor soul decided to untie it to kill me. The odds of Neuqua receiving the tiebreaker vote were slim to none. Furthermore, I am the only person I know for certain is a good guy, so I have a vested interest in keeping myself alive and not throwing my life away so you can "learn" from a random vote, cronin's suspicion vote, self defense, and someone just trying to break a tie even though they could have done it anyway. So you'll see if I value extending the game another day by giving them another warm body they have to go through more important.

[Tyrith]

And for the love of all SPELL MY NAME RIGHT, or I'm going to start slandering the rest of your names just because.

[Tyrith]

I'm just tired of you all making sweeping generalizations about my character and why I did it without actually taking the time to thinking about the logical merit behind the situation, even if you disagreed with.

[Lorena]

At the rate this is going, it's gonna be a landslide and we would have learned nothing with another pile-on vote.

FWIW, I think Tyrith's (hey I spelled your name right ;)) last minute vote was a poor decision, but I don't believe him to be an assistant. He's guilty of creating a rukus but that's about it. Now it's gonna be a piece of cake for the assistants to cast a vote for what seems to be a for sure thing.

[Alan T]

I agree with Tryeth fully.

[Lorena]

and we would have learned nothing, yet again until a night action is performed.

[Lorena]

I agree with Tryeth fully.

lol

[Lorena]

and tryeth he is :p

[LoneStarGirl]

Okay, for those of y'all who don't think we should vote for Tyrth, who do you think we should vote for? Give us Tyrth voters reason to not vote for him and maybe we will change our vote

[oliegirl]

I'm with LSG...still holding off on casting my vote, but until I see some convincing evidence or theories on why we should lynch someone else, I'm going with tyrith.

[Lorena]

In the Animal Farm game, GE and Chubby were tied and I decided to vote for Chubby at the last minute and he ended up being a villager, GE was a wolf. All I'm saying is that sometimes people get caught up in the moment and don't think very clearly... I was lynched because of that decision. I'm not sure how much experience Tyrith has, but the last minute vote was a poor choice (like mine was in that game).

The games I've played, the wolves were fairly quiet. There are some wolves that have more experience that are more vocal, but I wouldn't doubt if one of the wolves is a noob.

[Neuqua]

With SnDvls being killed the first night I am pretty sure one of the wolves has got to be one with more veteran experience. I doubt a noob would be smart enough to pick off an ideal candidate (according to Blade atleast.)

Again, like Day 1, there seems to be no reason or rationalization to vote one way or another and it looks as if Tyrienth (jk) is going to be lynched regardless. I'll save my vote for later in case of some unforseen events.

[Lorena]

With SnDvls being killed the first night I am pretty sure one of the wolves has got to be one with more veteran experience. I doubt a noob would be smart enough to pick off an ideal candidate (according to Blade atleast.)

Again, like Day 1, there seems to be no reason or rationalization to vote one way or another and it looks as if Tyrienth (jk) is going to be lynched regardless. I'll save my vote for later in case of some unforseen events.

Or he/she got lucky.

[Blade6119]

Vote Tyrinth

I said I was going to do this, and I stick by my word. I would have voted earlier but I got distracted with my class.

LSG, please revote with the named spelled correctly just in case

[Blade6119]

I'm just tired of you all making sweeping generalizations about my character and why I did it without actually taking the time to thinking about the logical merit behind the situation, even if you disagreed with.

I have stated a couple times now i fully understand your move, and your reasons behind it. As i have stated, alone i wouldnt like it but it deal with it. But coupled with your in my mind defense of nequa and interesting player earlier in the day it looks a lot worse. Others have simplified it to simply the late move, but i have not. I have also not been misspelling your name, so i will ask you to stop making sweeping generalizations as well. Its frustrating to me just as much as it is you...

[Tyrith]

The lack of activity is more frustrating than anything else.

[Blade6119]

Then lets have a chat...what do you want to discuss? Maybe the night kill last night, st. cronin's play so far, what?

[Tyrith]

The night kill just seems like an ultra solid play...but...that said, there is the flash factor of killing someone out of the you/cronin/saldana trio. It's an experienced move to dodge the BG. It makes me suspect one of those three or Gram is a bad guy leading the way, or someone is playing really smart and going for the total UTR play. Which really says nothing.

Cronin...well, to be honest, when I die his play will become clearer. He doesn't seem wolfish right now, but he's usually out there with ideas. Today's move doesn't seem to make a lot of since, so that is a strike...actually, now that I think about it, it's actually rather disconcerting.

[Blade6119]

Who would you like to go after today?

To put all my cards on the table, im really only willing to vote for you, cronin, or swaggs right now.

[Lorena]

Maybe you guys can help me understand why was tonight's kill such a solid move because I don't see it. I mean, is it the "kill the vets" mentality?

[Lorena]

or, that should have read, last night's kill.

[Lorena]

or this morning. Goddamn, I'm so clueless.

[Blade6119]

Maybe you guys can help me understand why was tonight's kill such a solid move because I don't see it. I mean, is it the "kill the vets" mentality?
In my personal opinion they killed the a great player who didnt take a serious stance in the whole situation yesterday and one who had no heat on himself. They killed a player who was VERY unlikely to to be lynched, which is great for the wolves, they killed an intelligent player with a proven track record, they killed the seer(who may have hinted, not sure), and left us today in the exact situation we were in yesterday(which either means they have given up on tyrith or hes good). Basically, it was a maximum reward kill for the wolves that gave the villagers basically no information that in any way could be at all helpful.

[Tyrith]

Out of that group? My reasons for killing cronin are stupid crap reasons that got me into trouble - his reasoning today is REALLY weak. Swaggs forcing a tie doesn't make sense as a wolf move though because the wolves want dead bodies. He could have started a pile on me and gotten it over with. That said, he also voted randomly, which is the greatest innocent tie generator ever. If he was really busy he may have just dumped a vote and ran. This is highly perplexing, because I don't have any real clue on either of them.

[Tyrith]

In my personal opinion they killed the a great player who didnt take a serious stance in the whole situation yesterday and one who had no heat on himself. They killed a player who was VERY unlikely to to be lynched, which is great for the wolves, they killed an intelligent player with a proven track record, they killed the seer(who may have hinted, not sure), and left us today in the exact situation we were in yesterday(which either means they have given up on tyrith or hes good). Basically, it was a maximum reward kill for the wolves that gave the villagers basically no information that in any way could be at all helpful.

Oh, and the kill had almsot no chance of running into the BG.

[Grammaticus]

Of those with votes, I can go with Tyrith or Oliegirl.

Tyrith based on his conflicting posts and ensuring we could not react to his tie. I do tend to think it is very possible a case of personal survival over team value. I would feel a lot better about him if he would have laid out the tie early and let people react. Expecting others to proactively fix it for him was just not realistic. Then I wish he would have just come clean and stopped trying to support the tie as a good thing after the fact.

Oliegirl has been nonexistent which gives us nothing to consider later on in the game. I could see Izulde and Neuqua in that group as well. In fact I would pick Neuqua between Oliegirl, Izulde and Neuqua.

[Tyrith]

Of those with votes, I can go with Tyrith or Oliegirl.

Tyrith based on his conflicting posts and ensuring we could not react to his tie. I do tend to think it is very possible a case of personal survival over team value. I would feel a lot better about him if he would have laid out the tie early and let people react. Expecting others to proactively fix it for him was just not realistic. Then I wish he would have just come clean and stopped trying to support the tie as a good thing after the fact.

Oliegirl has been nonexistent which gives us nothing to consider later on in the game. I could see Izulde and Neuqua in that group as well. In fact I would pick Neuqua between Oliegirl, Izulde and Neuqua.

I'd have to believe a tie was a bad thing for that to be the case. And no, it's not unrealistic to expect people to move their votes to a dogpile to prevent people from screwing around, I've seen it done again and again in other games, probably by people play in here.

[Lorena]

In my personal opinion they killed the a great player who didnt take a serious stance in the whole situation yesterday and one who had no heat on himself. They killed a player who was VERY unlikely to to be lynched, which is great for the wolves, they killed an intelligent player with a proven track record, they killed the seer(who may have hinted, not sure), and left us today in the exact situation we were in yesterday(which either means they have given up on tyrith or hes good). Basically, it was a maximum reward kill for the wolves that gave the villagers basically no information that in any way could be at all helpful.

Well, the fact they got the seer is a real bummer. I'm a have to go back and check his posts to see if there was some sort of clue. If the wolves killed, say saldana or you or cronin (more experienced players) it would be the same kind of "smart" move no?

[Lorena]

The problem with the person breaking the tie is, if they chose a villager in error, then they would get the axe the following morning as it would be considered a wolfy move.

I can see why some might think twice about doing that.

[Tyrith]

Well, the fact they got the seer is a real bummer. I'm a have to go back and check his posts to see if there was some sort of clue. If the wolves killed, say saldana or you or cronin (more experienced players) it would be the same kind of "smart" move no?

No. Killing blade is too obvious, he's the most likely target for a BG because there are certain people that like to make him die. Cronin and saldana have bigger reputations than SnDvls does and thus are more likely to have BGs guarding them. Also, both of them had votes on me, which means they will look more suspicious if and when I'm dead. But SnDvls, he wasn't doign anything, yet he has a great capacity for doing things. Kill the person least likely to be lynched and least likely to be guarded.

[Blade6119]

Well, the fact they got the seer is a real bummer. I'm a have to go back and check his posts to see if there was some sort of clue. If the wolves killed, say saldana or you or cronin (more experienced players) it would be the same kind of "smart" move no?

No, because cronin, saldana, and i have all taken strong stances on this issue, cronin and i are both considered fairly solid lynch choices at this time, and if were wrong about our views the wolves want us alive to mislead the villager. Sndvls had none of these negatives.

[Tyrith]

The problem with the person breaking the tie is, if they chose a villager in error, then they would get the axe the following morning as it would be considered a wolfy move.

I can see why some might think twice about doing that.

Exactly. And there are lots of situations where I could see people breaking ties for the sake of breaking ties. there's a chance that you might catch a wolf that way, but a smarter wolf would just stay out of it and let the sweet-minded group worker good guy do the nasty job.

[Tyrith]

Cronin is also being quiet, by cronin standards, I think. That's usually a useless tell, but who knows.

[Grammaticus]

I'd have to believe a tie was a bad thing for that to be the case. And no, it's not unrealistic to expect people to move their votes to a dogpile to prevent people from screwing around, I've seen it done again and again in other games, probably by people play in here.

This post bothers me, because earlier in the game you said you reread the rules and realize a tie is no-lynch, did the math and it was not worth keeping the extra villager around (supporting lynch over no-lynch). You even said the downside would be ending up in the same place tomorrow.

So, what made you change your mind on that logic?

[Tyrith]

The fact that we couldn't actually get anyone talking about what the heck we were doing, and we were just doing crappy votes. Day One votes CAN mean something, if there's actual activity and not just random votes and self defense. I tried stirring activity and look where it got me.

[oliegirl]

Why am I being grouped in with possible wolves simply because I haven't been around much today? I explained where I was and what has been going on, why I haven't been around much. I have a ton going on right now, but just because I can't sit on the computer and check in every hour or so doesn't make me an assistant/wolf/whatever. If that is the only accusation/reason for suspecting me, then I've given you plenty of reasons/alibis/defenses...if there is something else, tell me so I can defend myself against that, but I swear to you, I'm a prisoner...

[Blade6119]

After doing some math about the numbers and some likely scenarios, I don't suppose it's really worth keeping the extra villager alive...my only problem is, who do we kill? And how do we manage to make any sense of the voting record after we decide to kill this person?

This post is the one gramat referenced, and is incredibly opposite of what tyrith claimed the second he got on the block...funny how that works out :p

[Lorena]

In my personal opinion they killed the a great player who didnt take a serious stance in the whole situation yesterday and one who had no heat on himself. They killed a player who was VERY unlikely to to be lynched, which is great for the wolves, they killed an intelligent player with a proven track record, they killed the seer(who may have hinted, not sure), and left us today in the exact situation we were in yesterday(which either means they have given up on tyrith or hes good). Basically, it was a maximum reward kill for the wolves that gave the villagers basically no information that in any way could be at all helpful.

I went back and noticed this little tidbit. I wonder if based on Blade's response, the wolves went after Sndvls.

I'm not blaming Blade at all, I'm saying that maybe LSG thought killing Sndvls would be solid move and reacted based on the response. She may or not be a wolf, but I find it interesting.

Blade, why would you have killed me if you were a wolf? Now the wolves are going to kill me tonight and try to frame you. Thanks for throwing me under the bus.

Because you are a fairly rescourceful player, but your not considered on the experience level of players like cronin and sndvls. You would make a solid kill that would generally be considered against what is expected of me as a wolf.

I highly doubt the wolves will kill you, no worries. I have 4 people i expect to be chosen from.

[LoneStarGirl]

The lack of activity is more frustrating than anything else.

Sorry that we have jobs :p

Vote tyrith

[Grammaticus]

Why am I being grouped in with possible wolves simply because I haven't been around much today? I explained where I was and what has been going on, why I haven't been around much. I have a ton going on right now, but just because I can't sit on the computer and check in every hour or so doesn't make me an assistant/wolf/whatever. If that is the only accusation/reason for suspecting me, then I've given you plenty of reasons/alibis/defenses...if there is something else, tell me so I can defend myself against that, but I swear to you, I'm a prisoner...

It is not just that you have not been around. It is that you have not really said anything. Like Blade said, if you are not saying anything and the wolves take you, it gives us nothing to glean from death. Yesterday you just popped in voted and thats it. We don't even know how you felt about the tie issue.

So, who do you think are likely assistants?

[Lorena]

Vote Tyrinth

I said I was going to do this, and I stick by my word. I would have voted earlier but I got distracted with my class.

Sorry that we have jobs :p

Vote tyrith

Just a note that a correction in spelling was made.

[saldana]

something occurred to me during the day today, i am not sure what to make of it, so for now

vote blade

[saldana]

dola, i didnt mean that...i typed the wrong name

unvote blade
vote cronin

[Neuqua]

something occurred to me during the day today, i am not sure what to make of it, so for now

vote blade

?

You seemed very tee'ed off and ready to vote for Tyrith last night. Care to share? I've still yet to vote so am trying to gather as much information as I can before I make a decision.

[Neuqua]

oh Ooops,

then I mean st. cronin too

[oliegirl]

It is not just that you have not been around. It is that you have not really said anything. Like Blade said, if you are not saying anything and the wolves take you, it gives us nothing to glean from death. Yesterday you just popped in voted and thats it. We don't even know how you felt about the tie issue.

So, who do you think are likely assistants?

If you read posts 237 and 240 your questions will be answered. This is only my second game so I don't feel that I know enough to really be active early on. I was the seer in the first game so it was easy for me, after the first day, to become very involved in the discussions.

I don't know what to think...DC pointing the finger at me is kind of odd, I don't feel that she had any reason to, so that arouses suspicion. As for the whole tie thing, again - I'm not 100% sure what to make of it, so rather than throwing out half assed ideas and having people jump on the bandwagon and then blame/lynch me when it turns out I'm wrong, I've been keeping my mouth shut until I feel I have more information or more to go on. Lynch me tonight if you want, but you'll see tomorrow that I'm a prisoner and you'll still be in the same place you are now...

[Tyrith]

This is gonna be my vote. Out until after my death--erm, I mean deadline. :)

VOTE CRONIN

[Lorena]

I don't know what to think...DC pointing the finger at me is kind of odd, I don't feel that she had any reason to, so that arouses suspicion. As for the whole tie thing, again - I'm not 100% sure what to make of it, so rather than throwing out half assed ideas and having people jump on the bandwagon and then blame/lynch me when it turns out I'm wrong, I've been keeping my mouth shut until I feel I have more information or more to go on. Lynch me tonight if you want, but you'll see tomorrow that I'm a prisoner and you'll still be in the same place you are now...

It was just a hunch, that is all. I mean it's day 2 and don't have much to go on and the lack of activity (as mentioned by others) kinda stood out at me.

On the same note, the same thing can be said of Izulde and Neuqua for both have been fairly quiet.

[Lorena]

something occurred to me during the day today, i am not sure what to make of it, so for now

vote blade

Yes, I would like to know as well.

[Grammaticus]

dola, i didnt mean that...i typed the wrong name

unvote blade
vote cronin

Okay, why? I want to place a vote, I have to drive home and may be a while before I get back on. I don't have anything substantial about anyone yet. Tyrith and the UTR players are where I think the we should go for the lynch. But if anyone has something worth analyzing, I'll consider.

[Neuqua]

As for the whole tie thing, again - I'm not 100% sure what to make of it, so rather than throwing out half assed ideas and having people jump on the bandwagon and then blame/lynch me when it turns out I'm wrong, I've been keeping my mouth shut until I feel I have more information or more to go on. Lynch me tonight if you want, but you'll see tomorrow that I'm a prisoner and you'll still be in the same place you are now...

fwiw, I'm in the exact same boat. Also my second game and I am afraid I may say things with one set of intentions, only to have it later turned into something else. That's the reason for me laying low, I've been reading most of the afternoon and plan on being around until the lynching tonight, and I plan on just trying to decide what is best for us villagers. It's only later in the game where I feel I am going to have no choice but to become more vocal or else even I would consider myself suspicious.

[Grammaticus]

If you read posts 237 and 240 your questions will be answered. This is only my second game so I don't feel that I know enough to really be active early on. I was the seer in the first game so it was easy for me, after the first day, to become very involved in the discussions.

I don't know what to think...DC pointing the finger at me is kind of odd, I don't feel that she had any reason to, so that arouses suspicion. As for the whole tie thing, again - I'm not 100% sure what to make of it, so rather than throwing out half assed ideas and having people jump on the bandwagon and then blame/lynch me when it turns out I'm wrong, I've been keeping my mouth shut until I feel I have more information or more to go on. Lynch me tonight if you want, but you'll see tomorrow that I'm a prisoner and you'll still be in the same place you are now...

Okay, that is something. Izulde said he voted for you for catching him in a prior game, so you must have given some analysis in that game. Your analysis may well help out in this game too.

[Lorena]

I'll be afk for about an hour or so to make dinner. I'll gladly remove my vote from oliegirl if someone provides compelling info.

[Neuqua]

She was the seer last game (I was played it in as well) and caught Izulde the first night.

[Blade6119]

Okay, that is something. Izulde said he voted for you for catching him in a prior game, so you must have given some analysis in that game. Your analysis may well help out in this game too.

She scanned izulde, a wolf, on night one i believe. But count me in the group that strongly encourages players to talk up...were all wrong soo many times it doesnt matter, just talk it up

[Blade6119]

hey sal, still waiting to hear your reasons for cronin..i have one, but id like to hear yours

[Grammaticus]

She was the seer last game (I was played it in as well) and caught Izulde the first night.

Was Izulde super quite in that game too?

[Neuqua]

It was early, but compared to his GD "persona" yes he was. And that's the reasoning Oliegirl used when she first pointed him out (when in retrospect she had scanned him the night before as well.)

[Grammaticus]

I gotta hit the road, I'll go with

VOTE IZULDE

as my UTR candidate. At least he is in the room to defend himself and will likely give some input.

[Izulde]

I've been in class all day. Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday are my bitch days as far as classes and schoolwork go.

[Izulde]

dola,

I'm basically just sitting back and weighing the evidence and arguments. Beyond Tyrith, who's a principled vote, I've no idea who's assistant and who isn't, which is why I've asked for people's reasonings on things.

[Lathum]

I re-read the tape recording messge. It says there are 3 keys. Two assistants have them in their stomachs and somebody has a third key "on them". We searched the body of SnDvls and found his wallet, but no key. Does it make sense to cut open his stomach to see if he has the third key. Makes sense that it would be in the same place as the assistants keys. Plus it says the assistants have the "correct" keys. So if SnDvls has a key, and he is not an assistant, then it should not be a "correct" key. I think we need to check everyone's stomack that dies.

Lathum, can we do this?

ther is no key in sndvls stomach

[Blade6119]

The bad guys know who has the third key...i HIGHLY doubt they will night kill that person....and im out for the lynch...hope you all chose wisely

[Lathum]

I'm still jealous that Lathum got to explode you in the middle of the day during the Egypt game, I want my crack at you :)

LMAO

[Lorena]

I think I'm going in a different direction. I think LSG is a smart cookie and has played in enough of these to kill someone like Sndlvs. She seems to be under the radar as well, a perfect situation for a wolf.

unvote oliegirl

VOTE LONESTARGIRL

[Neuqua]

Can we get an updated vote count? I'd hate to end up in another tie, LOL.

[Lorena]

Tyrith 3 - Blade (260), Izulde (230), LSG (261)
st.cronin 2 - saldana (304), Tyrith (308)
LSG 1 - Dodgerchick (326)
Izulde 1 - Grammaticus (320)
blade 1 - st.cronin (308)

not voted - neuqua, oligirl, swaggs

[Neuqua]

I do not want to vote for Cronin and get chastized for creating another tie. I won't vote for Tyrith because I do not necessarily think he is a wolf.

Vote Lonestargirl

Only because something about her makes me suspicious (aka pure hunch, still not any real information to go by.) I just did not want to be the first one to put in a vote or because that tends to get people in trouble.

[Raiders Army]

Awesome concept Lathum. Very interesting!

[oliegirl]

Great...I was thinking while I was out that I was going to vote for LSG, but now if I do it'll create a tie with Tyrith with only swaggs left to vote! Grrr....



VOTE TYRITH

[Lathum]

Awesome concept Lathum. Very interesting!

ty, if this one goes well i will do a more elaborate saw II

[Lorena]

ty, if this one goes well i will do a more elaborate saw II

Oh heck yeah!! I love these movies... they make you think.

[Lorena]

Great...I was thinking while I was out that I was going to vote for LSG, but now if I do it'll create a tie with Tyrith with only swaggs left to vote! Grrr....



VOTE TYRITH

oliegirl, go with your hunch, if you feel LSG deserves a vote, then vote for her. Don't vote for someone for the sake of voting.

Besides, we have an hour left before deadline so still plenty of time to change votes if need be.

[Swaggs]

I'm caught up now.

Looks like we are heading towards another tight vote. My thoughts on things so far are that I think the seer death was just lucky. No one could have taken anything he did or said yesterday and determined he was the seer, in my opinion.

I am going to vote for Tyrith today, basically as if it were a day 1 vote since we don't have anything to go off of and he is the player that made the biggest slip up, in my mind. No one deserves to die on day 1, but it has to be someone and we have to hope we get lucky. I know I got knocked out of a game on day 1 once because I voted and didn't give an explanation because I was busy with a phone call.

Vote Tyrith

[Lorena]

So Tyrith has 5, LSG has 2, cronin has 2, blade and izulde have 1. It's a shame Tyrith won't be here to defend himself.

[Swaggs]

Sal, care to elaborate on the cronin thing? Since my vote is basically a day 1-type for me, if you smell something rotten, I could certainly be swayed.

[saldana]

hey sal, still waiting to hear your reasons for cronin..i have one, but id like to hear yours

ok here goes....we know there is the potential for something shitty to happen to the person that votes first for the eventual lynch candidate...we dont know exactly what it is, but i would assume there is the chance that the unfortunate soul with the key could get killed....it occurred to me this afternoon that cronin's vote created a very good chance of me being that unfortunate soul....it would be an interesting tactic for the assistants in this game to try and manipulate who ends up trying the keys as a means of disposing of players they feel they want to get rid of without having to deal with the bodyguard.

hence, my thought was that cronin was trying to put me in a spot to have to try the key when he seconded my totally random vote with the hopes that i would get killed by whatever trap was awaiting me.

[oliegirl]

My gut is telling me two things - that Tyrith is a wolf and his slip up yesterday was just that, a slip up - and all his explaining was backpedaling to make himself look innocent. But LSG is shrewd and I am suspicious of her. I think I'm going to go with my first instinct tonight and hopefully we'll get a wolf...if not, tomorrow is another day and we should have some more information.

[Izulde]

I think in either case, LSG, Blade, or cronin should be our next targets. Right now LSG is tops on my list I'd say, though more information could change that.

[Swaggs]

What is the case against LSG? I haven't seen her do too much out of the ordinary. I ask because I think she kind of got thrown under the bus in the Tombstone game for playing too cautiously. That seems to be her style so far, but she is new to WW and probably feeling things out.

A few people have voted for and mentioned her, but to me she hasn't really stood out as under the radar or suspicious just yet.

[Lathum]

deadline

[Lathum]

After a long day of deliberation and drinkng water from the toilet you all toss accusations around. The loss of sndvls has rattled you and you are all determined to have a better outcome tonight. After some deliberation you decide tyrith's actions from last night are to suspicous. Someone runs up behind him and clubs his head with a chunk of concrete. Lying dead on the floor you look to Izulde, someone says" you started this, you cast the first vote" Izulde grabs the scalpel, hands trebling, tears pouring from his eyes and cuts into tyrith's stomach. His intestines spill onto the floor in a steaming pile, Izulde plunges his hands into tyriths abdomine hoping to find a key but his hands grip at nothing, tyrith was a prisoner.

night 2 has begun. PM's due by 9:00 AM

[Lathum]

final vote

tyrith 5 ( izulde, blade, lsg, oliegirl, swaggs)
St.Cronin 2 ( saldana, tyrith)
LSG 2 ( dodgerchick, neuqua)
blade 1( St. Cronin)
Izulde 1 ( gramm)


btw, YAY me, I won a poker tournament at the casino today!!!!

[Alan T]

After a long day of deliberation and drinkng water from the toilet you all toss accusations around. The loss of sndvls has rattled you and you are all determined to have a better outcome tonight. After some deliberation you decide tyrith's actions from last night are to suspicous. Someone runs up behind him and clubs his head with a chunk of concrete. Lying dead on the floor you look to Izulde, someone says" you started this, you cast the first vote" Izulde grabs the scalpel, hands trebling, tears pouring from his eyes and cuts into tyrith's stomach. His intestines spill onto the floor in a steaming pile, Izulde plunges his hands into tyriths abdomine hoping to find a key but his hands grip at nothing, tyrith was a prisoner.

night 2 has begun. PM's due by 9:00 AM

Mental note.. don't read lynch results for this game right after eating dinner

[Lorena]

Well that was pretty gruesome.

[Lorena]

dola,

grats on the win Lathum!!

[Lorena]

What is the case against LSG? I haven't seen her do too much out of the ordinary. I ask because I think she kind of got thrown under the bus in the Tombstone game for playing too cautiously. That seems to be her style so far, but she is new to WW and probably feeling things out.

A few people have voted for and mentioned her, but to me she hasn't really stood out as under the radar or suspicious just yet.

I think this is my first game playing with her, so I don't know what her style is. I wouldn't put it past her to make a move to kill someone like Sndlvs though. She seems like the kind of person that would be cool under pressure and that's what I wanted to do, but unfortunately, I didn't get enough people to vote for her to get a reaction.

Just because she was thrown under the bus last game shouldn't cloud your judgement as to what her role might be here.

[Blade6119]

Alright, im home for the night i believe...somewhat figured tyrith was good after the tactic the wolves used. To be honest, i think it was just important to get two days worth of lynch info with this. Now we have our answers about yesterday, and more importantly, some very interesting info about today. Today wasnt a good day for us lynch wise, but i think in the long run some moves made today will be quite interesting in retrospect.

[LoneStarGirl]

I think I'm going in a different direction. I think LSG is a smart cookie and has played in enough of these to kill someone like Sndlvs. She seems to be under the radar as well, a perfect situation for a wolf.

unvote oliegirl

VOTE LONESTARGIRL

Hah, this is my third game, and my second game was the beginner game, so it didn't really count. Thanks for thinking so highly of me.

Also, what is with you voting for girls? Shouldn't we stick together? ;)

[Neuqua]

Today wasnt a good day for us lynch wise, but i think in the long run some moves made today will be quite interesting in retrospect.

I'm looking forward to finding out which actions have gotten you in such an optimistic mood, might want to get them out now in case of lynching tonight :)

[LoneStarGirl]

Also, Lathum, I voted for Tyrith.... so he should have 6 votes.

[Blade6119]

I'm looking forward to finding out which actions have gotten you in such an optimistic mood, might want to get them out now in case of lynching tonight :)

If they take me tonight, so be it. It will only give the bodyguard more time to work his magic...but ive learned one thing, and its never give out info between lynch and night actions unless it will help the seer choose or something. Thats no longer an option, so any information revealed now will only aid the wolves in picking their victim. If i die, i shall go quietly into the night!



P.S.:Please protect me mr. bodyguard, i dont want to die! :D

[LoneStarGirl]

I do play very cautiously. I am learning a lot from watching the pros like Blade, St. Cronin and hoops play, so hopefully I will get more outgoing.

[Blade6119]

I am learning a lot from watching the pros like Blade

Well that was your first mistake if you ever want to be taken seriously around here, everyone thinks im crazy and/or an asshole. :p

I laugh, but its true...:(

[Lathum]

Also, Lathum, I voted for Tyrith.... so he should have 6 votes.

fixed, i had st.cronin in 2 spots

[Alan T]

Well that was your first mistake if you ever want to be taken seriously around here, everyone thinks im crazy and/or an asshole. :p

I laugh, but its true...:(

I don't think anyone is crazy. :) Well maybe Qwik is a little crazy.. but in a good, fun way that makes me enjoy when he plays :)

[Lorena]

Hah, this is my third game, and my second game was the beginner game, so it didn't really count. Thanks for thinking so highly of me.

Also, what is with you voting for girls? Shouldn't we stick together? ;)

I noticed that I voted for girls today but I had no information and was basically going by instinct. I'm shooting in the dark man, I've no clue where to go next. I hope the assistants and bodyguard choose the same person so we find more info, but again, that's very unlikely... but one can only hope.

The Animal Farm game where hoops guarded Swaggs (I think) and GE tried to kill him and successfully blocked him was awesome; I'm so hoping for the same thing tonight.

[Lorena]

If they take me tonight, so be it. It will only give the bodyguard more time to work his magic...but ive learned one thing, and its never give out info between lynch and night actions unless it will help the seer choose or something. Thats no longer an option, so any information revealed now will only aid the wolves in picking their victim. If i die, i shall go quietly into the night!



P.S.:Please protect me mr. bodyguard, i dont want to die! :D

But blade, shouldn't we throw stuff out there in case something like this happens? I mean I would HATE to die holding information that will help the village.

[st.cronin]

ok here goes....we know there is the potential for something shitty to happen to the person that votes first for the eventual lynch candidate...we dont know exactly what it is, but i would assume there is the chance that the unfortunate soul with the key could get killed....it occurred to me this afternoon that cronin's vote created a very good chance of me being that unfortunate soul....it would be an interesting tactic for the assistants in this game to try and manipulate who ends up trying the keys as a means of disposing of players they feel they want to get rid of without having to deal with the bodyguard.

hence, my thought was that cronin was trying to put me in a spot to have to try the key when he seconded my totally random vote with the hopes that i would get killed by whatever trap was awaiting me.

I'm sorry, I don't understand the premise here. To get a key, don't you need to lynch a wolf? And you voted for Tyrith, who I correctly didn't believe to be a wolf. I'm not sure I see the logic.

[oliegirl]

I was thinking the same thing about the 3 girls banding together, but I'm guessing that one of us is a wolf, it makes sense that he would foresee us "uniting" and do something about that...I know I'm a prisoner so that means either DC or LSG is a wolf...

[st.cronin]

Anyway, I feel pretty much like I did in that game where BrianD got his head cut off on day 1. Some plays, regardless of how strange, just can't possibly be wolf plays because they virtually ALWAYS get the wolf lynched.

[hoopsguy]

Well that was your first mistake if you ever want to be taken seriously around here, everyone thinks im crazy and/or an asshole. :p

I laugh, but its true...:(

But usually not both in the same game :p

[SnDvls]

Well that was your first mistake if you ever want to be taken seriously around here, everyone thinks im crazy and/or an asshole. :p

I laugh, but its true...:(

I'd say you're crazy...and you get under people's skin, but far from an asshole...it is a game after all.

[Lorena]

I was thinking the same thing about the 3 girls banding together, but I'm guessing that one of us is a wolf, it makes sense that he would foresee us "uniting" and do something about that...I know I'm a prisoner so that means either DC or LSG is a wolf...

http://forums.photobucket.com/images/smilies/giggle.gif

Heh, sorry, that was funny. So you wanted the girls to unite but at one point you wanted to vote for LSG eh?

If there's one thing I'm 100% positive about is that I'm a prisoner, no ands if or buts about it. I just wanna get that scalpel and start cutting the right people up!

[Lorena]

Well that was your first mistake if you ever want to be taken seriously around here, everyone thinks im crazy and/or an asshole. :p

I laugh, but its true...:(

You an asshole? Oh, come on... you just let the passion for the game get in the way of your emotions, that's all.

But you're no asshole.

[oliegirl]

http://forums.photobucket.com/images/smilies/giggle.gif

Heh, sorry, that was funny. So you wanted the girls to unite but at one point you wanted to vote for LSG eh?

If there's one thing I'm 100% positive about is that I'm a prisoner, no ands if or buts about it. I just wanna get that scalpel and start cutting the right people up!

I didn't say I wanted us to unite...I said I thought about the possibility but then discounted it b/c of my belief that 1 of the 3 girls is a wolf...

[Blade6119]

I'm sorry, I don't understand the premise here. To get a key, don't you need to lynch a wolf? And you voted for Tyrith, who I correctly didn't believe to be a wolf. I'm not sure I see the logic.

3 keys, 2 assistants...you do the math...one random good person has a key in them. it could have been tyrith, could be me or you. The bad guys know who, we dont. It was a major reason im for lynching every day...we have to find those keys, and 1 is not in a bad guy.

[Blade6119]

But blade, shouldn't we throw stuff out there in case something like this happens? I mean I would HATE to die holding information that will help the village.

My hunches are not likely to help the village do anything but add more discussion. I have hunches about almost every player in the game...revealing those will help us little, and help them a lot...talking about them tomorrow, its reversed. Right now, im just passing the time until the assistants come for me tonight. Like i said yesterday, you should be pretty damn safe(or was it LSG, you girls and your uniting together are throwing me off :p )

[saldana]

ok, i will be out the entire day today...the project i have been developing becomes active tomorrow morning, so i have about 2000 things to do and cant leave work til they are all done, so i dont know if i will be home in time to vote, so hopefully lathum will count this.

vote cronin

[saldana]

and blade, in case you do meet your suspected death, you never told me what you thought of my theory about cronin

[saldana]

I do play very cautiously. I am learning a lot from watching the pros like Blade, St. Cronin and hoops play, so hopefully I will get more outgoing.

*rubs side of face where slap impacted cheek*

[Lathum]

You awake happy to still be alive but devestated that you are in this situation. As the group gathers you notice one person is missing.Everyone hears screaming from one of the rooms, they rush to look. The first person opens the door. Just as they push on the door and overwhelming smell of gasoline assaults their nostrils. As the door is opened a small piece of flint attached to the edge of the door brushes across the steel door molding along the floor generating a healthy spark. This ignites a pool of gasoline on the floor, which trails to Izulde’s bed, where he is strapped tightly to the mattress. A deep “whoof” is heard and Izulde is alight in a bright blaze of fire! You notice a fire extinguisher propped against the door and quickly put out the blaze. Too late, Izulde cannot speak as his entire body is covered in lethal burns. His body is a misshapen mass of charred twitching flesh. You hear faint wheezing gasps from his seared lungs as he slowly fades from the living. You flip him off the mattress hoping to find a key among the charred mess but discover nothing. Izulde was a prisoner.

[st.cronin]

I am NOT a wolf, guys. You're totally barking up the wrong tree.

[Lathum]

due to real life constraints saldana's vote will count

[Swaggs]

I don't have much to go off of right now, unfortunately, and I will be out for most of today. I should be back in plenty of time to make a vote and have a little bit of conversation, though.

Losing the lynch on Day 1 AND losing the seer on Night 1 was really unfortunate for us, I'm afriad. I have no feel on anyone right now, other than maybe one suspected good role, but that is even a stretch. I think we are going to have to do some good old fashioned detective work to get anywhere in this game. Hopefully there will be some good info to read over when I get back.

[Grammaticus]

Okay Blade, since you did not want to discuss last night I held off.

What are your reasons for suspecting the people you mentioned yesterday?

[st.cronin]

Just spent a few minutes analyzing day 1 and 2 votes. There's not much there. Day 1 vote is probably more interesting than day 2. Here it is:

Neuqua 3 ( swaggs, gramm, tyrith)
Tyrith 3 ( saldana, St. Cronin, Neuqua)
Sndvls 1( dodgerchick)
Izulde 1 ( oliegirl)
Oliegirl 1 ( Izulde)
Swaggs 1 (blade)
Dodgerchick 1 ( sndvls)
Blade 1 ( LSG)

The players NOT involved in the tie include both our night kills, which is interesting, but not neccesarily something the wolves planned. I believe there will be at least one wolf in that group - Blade, Swaggs, oliegirl. It's possible both wolves are in that group, but somewhat unlikely.

vote Blade

[Grammaticus]

Just spent a few minutes analyzing day 1 and 2 votes. There's not much there. Day 1 vote is probably more interesting than day 2. Here it is:

Neuqua 3 ( swaggs, gramm, tyrith)
Tyrith 3 ( saldana, St. Cronin, Neuqua)
Sndvls 1( dodgerchick)
Izulde 1 ( oliegirl)
Oliegirl 1 ( Izulde)
Swaggs 1 (blade)
Dodgerchick 1 ( sndvls)
Blade 1 ( LSG)

The players NOT involved in the tie include both our night kills, which is interesting, but not neccesarily something the wolves planned. I believe there will be at least one wolf in that group - Blade, Swaggs, oliegirl. It's possible both wolves are in that group, but somewhat unlikely.

vote Blade

In which group?

Blade and Oliegirl were not involved in the tie vote, Swaggs was. I guess I'm saying the three people you mentioned are not in the same group?

[st.cronin]

In which group?

Blade and Oliegirl were not involved in the tie vote, Swaggs was. I guess I'm saying the three people you mentioned are not in the same group?

You're right, I mistyped.

The players not involved in the tie were: Izulde, SnDvls, Blade, oliegirl, DC, and LSG. Izulde and SnDvls are dead. Dodgerchick was the only one NOT to vote for Tyrith yesterday - instead she voted for LSG.

[oliegirl]

It sucks that we lost another prisoner and still have not found any keys or have any concrete information that will help us. Cleary my read on Tyrith was wrong...I don't have any gut feelings right now, I'll be in and out during the day and will check in when I can. Dr's appointment to have my bite checked, unfortunately it looks infected so I have no idea how long, or how painful that will be :(

[LoneStarGirl]

I voted blade because he was my favorite number (10) But if i would have been online at 7:45 and saw that Tyrnth had not voted, I promise I would have changed my vote from blade to him to avoid a tie.

[Lorena]

cronin, I think you're looking at the wrong people. I have a strong, very strong suspicion on 2 people. I think there's a lot to be said when certain people are in the thread at the same time; especially towards the end of the day when the wolves I feel have the most interest in how the voting goes.

In the Animal Farm game, GE and LSG were on at the same time and I accused GE of being a wolf and laughing it up with LSG. GE WAS a wolf.

Passacaglia and lurker were on at the same time. I accused Passacaglia of being a wolf for the same reason GE was on at the same time as LSG. Passacaglia WAS a wolf.

There were 2 people that were on at the same time on nights 1 and 2. Both times right before lynch. Who has the most interest in any last minute change of votes than wolves? Am I right? Wolves want to make sure no one changes the votes at the last minute and wanna stick around to make sure things swing their way.

Vote Grammaticus

If my wild theory is correct, I saw him and another person on at the same time towards the end of the day.

I urge you all to vote for him and get him lynched. If my suspicion is wrong, then you can lynch me for mistakenly accusing an innocent; but I feel very, VERY strong about this.

I am not mentioning who the other person is because I want to see who exactly will come to his rescue.

[Grammaticus]

cronin, I think you're looking at the wrong people. I have a strong, very strong suspicion on 2 people. I think there's a lot to be said when certain people are in the thread at the same time; especially towards the end of the day when the wolves I feel have the most interest in how the voting goes.

In the Animal Farm game, GE and LSG were on at the same time and I accused GE of being a wolf and laughing it up with LSG. GE WAS a wolf.

Passacaglia and lurker were on at the same time. I accused Passacaglia of being a wolf for the same reason GE was on at the same time as LSG. Passacaglia WAS a wolf.

There were 2 people that were on at the same time on nights 1 and 2. Both times right before lynch. Who has the most interest in any last minute change of votes than wolves? Am I right? Wolves want to make sure no one changes the votes at the last minute and wanna stick around to make sure things swing their way.

Vote Grammaticus

If my wild theory is correct, I saw him and another person on at the same time towards the end of the day.

I urge you all to vote for him and get him lynched. If my suspicion is wrong, then you can lynch me for mistakenly accusing an innocent; but I feel very, VERY strong about this.

I am not mentioning who the other person is because I want to see who exactly will come to his rescue.

Dodgerchick, I will try to be on at lynch time whenever I can. I want to see what is happening. I flip in and out to check on posts as frequently as I can through the day and read prior posts for clues. Being on at lynch is a thing everyone should try to do. For example, you are online for lynch as often as I can recall. In my prior games at lynch time I have been online at lynch almost everyday except Friday's when I have card night.

Regarding wolves being online at the same time, I'm not sure I put much stock in that as they can communicate outside of the thread. I do think wolves, players with power roles and generally involved players will try to be on at lynch out of interest in the game.

[Grammaticus]

Dola,

Forgot to point out I was out 10 minutes prior to lynch last night in order to watch Lost, just one of the times I could not be there at the wire.

[Lorena]

Dodgerchick, I will try to be on at lynch time whenever I can. I want to see what is happening. I flip in and out to check on posts as frequently as I can through the day and read prior posts for clues. Being on at lynch is a thing everyone should try to do. For example, you are online for lynch as often as I can recall. In my prior games at lynch time I have been online at lynch almost everyday except Friday's when I have card night.

Regarding wolves being online at the same time, I'm not sure I put much stock in that as they can communicate outside of the thread. I do think wolves, players with power roles and generally involved players will try to be on at lynch out of interest in the game.

There have been so many times when I have theories and feel so sure about something and I read posts like yours and I start doubting my initial suspicion. The Frankenstein game (which was my first) when tanglewood came out with his fake role reveal against you, made me doubt my PM. You and I were masons in that game and tanglewood said he KNEW you were evil because he was a seer or something like that. I swear I checked my PM to make sure it said Grammatics and I were masons. There are a lot of very convincing players out there that make me doubt my own suspicions and I get easily swayed... but not this time.

You bring some valid points, everyone should be here during lynch to see what goes down, but as far as roled players being there, I don't think they have more of a vested interest than wolves do. Let's say that you and LSG are tied towards the end of lynch and 1 person is left to vote. I doubt the bodyguard would wanna be there to see what happens. The only thing he/she should worry about is sending a PM before deadline. A wolf, on the other hand, would vote for LSG to keep you in the game.

If I am wrong, than I apologize, but what do we have to go on? Not a thing so I'm throwing what could be a possiblity to see what happens.

[Grammaticus]

There have been so many times when I have theories and feel so sure about something and I read posts like yours and I start doubting my initial suspicion. The Frankenstein game (which was my first) when tanglewood came out with his fake role reveal against you, made me doubt my PM. You and I were masons in that game and tanglewood said he KNEW you were evil because he was a seer or something like that. I swear I checked my PM to make sure it said Grammatics and I were masons. There are a lot of very convincing players out there that make me doubt my own suspicions and I get easily swayed... but not this time.

You bring some valid points, everyone should be here during lynch to see what goes down, but as far as roled players being there, I don't think they have more of a vested interest than wolves do. Let's say that you and LSG are tied towards the end of lynch and 1 person is left to vote. I doubt the bodyguard would wanna be there to see what happens. The only thing he/she should worry about is sending a PM before deadline. A wolf, on the other hand, would vote for LSG to keep you in the game.

If I am wrong, than I apologize, but what do we have to go on? Not a thing so I'm throwing what could be a possiblity to see what happens.

DC, are you kidding, the bodyguard would want to be there in case they start getting heat and if about to get lynched they can role reveal, that is a key tenet of the game. In fact I just had to do it last week in the cowboy game (as the BG). That would save the BG for one more day and give others the chance to react (assuming they are online, like they should be).

But if you really feel that way, why are you on everyday right up to lynch?

[Blade6119]

ok here goes....we know there is the potential for something shitty to happen to the person that votes first for the eventual lynch candidate...we dont know exactly what it is, but i would assume there is the chance that the unfortunate soul with the key could get killed....it occurred to me this afternoon that cronin's vote created a very good chance of me being that unfortunate soul....it would be an interesting tactic for the assistants in this game to try and manipulate who ends up trying the keys as a means of disposing of players they feel they want to get rid of without having to deal with the bodyguard.

hence, my thought was that cronin was trying to put me in a spot to have to try the key when he seconded my totally random vote with the hopes that i would get killed by whatever trap was awaiting me.
You asked me to comment, so i shall....Firstly, he voted for me first, before you ever voted. He only swapped to tyrith after tyrith created a bandwagon on me. So i didnt see it as him trying to screw you unless tyrith had a key in him(the assistants know which prisoner has the 3rd key). Tyrith didnt, so i fell more like cronin saw a bandwagon forming on me and didnt want to be apart of it. So since tyrith didnt have a key, and the bad guys would have known that, i dont really agree with your theory.

Now, dont get me wrong, cronin is very high up my suspect list...but not for that reason.

[Blade6119]

VOTE ST. CRONIN

There are a lot reasons, besides the fact he has voted for me everyday for a new reason(getting that out of the way as i can see him making the defense its a vote back).

I think he needs to die, today, and i hope you all allow me to see this road through

[Lorena]

DC, are you kidding, the bodyguard would want to be there in case they start getting heat and if about to get lynched they can role reveal, that is a key tenet of the game. In fact I just had to do it last week in the cowboy game (as the BG). That would save the BG for one more day and give others the chance to react (assuming they are online, like they should be).


Okay, I didn't think about that.

But if you really feel that way, why are you on everyday right up to lynch?

I'm there so I can see who changes their vote at the last minute, and more importantly to see who else is in the thread. In my very short experience in this game, I have seen wolves be there in the end more often than not.

Trying to get the tables turned against me eh? Nice try.

[Blade6119]

DC, are you kidding, the bodyguard would want to be there in case they start getting heat and if about to get lynched they can role reveal, that is a key tenet of the game. In fact I just had to do it last week in the cowboy game (as the BG). That would save the BG for one more day and give others the chance to react (assuming they are online, like they should be).
Im really not trying to push anything here, so you can choose not to answer, but are you trying to hint at something here?

[Grammaticus]

Im really not trying to push anything here, so you can choose not to answer, but are you trying to hint at something here?


No not what I think you are asking

I am trying to point out that being in the thread at lynch is not strong evidence of being a wolf. Roled players have a high chance of being in the thread at lynch, just like active villagers do too. Trying to push a lynch based on who is in thread and when is not solid.

For example Blade, you got accused of being a wolf in that Frankenstein game because you were out of thread and popped in with just enough time to mount a defense. Somebody accused your wolf buddy of advising you of you danger via IM and you rushed in. Well, you turned out good.

[Blade6119]

No not what I think you are asking

I am trying to point out that being in the thread at lynch is not strong evidence of being a wolf. Roled players have a high chance of being in the thread at lynch, just like active villagers do too. Trying to push a lynch based on who is in thread and when is not solid.

For example Blade, you got accused of being a wolf in that Frankenstein game because you were out of thread and popped in with just enough time to mount a defense. Somebody accused your wolf buddy of advising you of you danger via IM and you rushed in. Well, you turned out good.

I dont disagree with this point at all. I personally think its against the non-written rules of the game to use things like that for lynches. I classify it with using whose online or seeing who is on AIM.

I was merely wondering if you were trying to tell us something, ill let it go.

What do you think of cronin? Saldana obviously thinks hes evil, and for different reasons i do as well. Do you have an opinion?

[Grammaticus]

Trying to get the tables turned against me eh? Nice try.

Not trying to turn the tables on you because I have not pegged you as bad in my mind. I have seen some suspicious posts, but the general feel has been good, so far. I just want you to think it through. I would have felt better if you had said that made you suspicious and opened the topic up for discussion.

But you asked everyone to lynch and that does not feel right. You are basically asking people to follow you and take a leap of faith on what you call a wild theory and you actually meet the profile you are identifying. That does not make me feel good. Especially when I am your target.

[oliegirl]

I like DC's theory alot - it makes sense that the wolves would be on to see the voting at the last minute and make any changes to their votes if needed...since I don't have any better theories myself at this point,

VOTE GRAMMATICUS

[Blade6119]

Okay Blade, since you did not want to discuss last night I held off.

What are your reasons for suspecting the people you mentioned yesterday?
Which ones do you want to hear about?

[Neuqua]

Which ones do you want to hear about?

Do your suspects remain unchanged from yesterday?

[Lorena]

Well shit, that proves how fucking clueless I am. If it's an unwritten rule, then fuck it.

unvote grammaticus
vote dogerchick

I'm out.

[st.cronin]

I've yet to see any good reason why I might be bad. Saldana and Blade should both know that players who are vocal, and provide analysis, are much more likely to be villagers than wolves. Saldana's theory didn't make any sense to me, and apparently doesn't make any sense to Blade, either.

I voted FOR Tyrith on day 1, but AGAINST him on day 2 - realizing that his play, while foolish, was decidedly un-wolfish. I have been accused of being quiet, which is ludicrous. I've been one of the more active players in this game, as is usual for me.

I might be wrong in going after Blade, but at least there's theory there, which NOBODY has commented on, except for one dismissive reply. I would like to have a discussion about who may or not be a wolf, not about who was online at a certain time and whether that means they are a bodyguard or a wolf. Most of us come online when we can. If we can log on around lynch time, we do.

[Grammaticus]

Which ones do you want to hear about?

You mentioned st.cronin and swaggs, but Neuqua's question is a good one, has anything changed about your assessment from yesterday?

[Blade6119]

You mentioned st.cronin and swaggs, but Neuqua's question is a good one, has anything changed about your assessment from yesterday?

St. cronin vastly elevated himself from the crowd since yesterdays lynch, dodgerchick has in the short run gained a little more trust then most others gave. Swaggs hasnt done anything to sway me either way. Hes a suspect, but hes still just marginal suspect like he was yesterday while cronin has elevated himself.

LSG has gone up my supect list since yesterday, while nequa has gone down it...right now i strongly support a lynch of st. cronin, while if that fails id be content, but not happy, with a lynch of LSG or swaggs.

[Blade6119]

I've yet to see any good reason why I might be bad. Saldana and Blade should both know that players who are vocal, and provide analysis, are much more likely to be villagers than wolves. Saldana's theory didn't make any sense to me, and apparently doesn't make any sense to Blade, either.

I voted FOR Tyrith on day 1, but AGAINST him on day 2 - realizing that his play, while foolish, was decidedly un-wolfish. I have been accused of being quiet, which is ludicrous. I've been one of the more active players in this game, as is usual for me.

I might be wrong in going after Blade, but at least there's theory there, which NOBODY has commented on, except for one dismissive reply. I would like to have a discussion about who may or not be a wolf, not about who was online at a certain time and whether that means they are a bodyguard or a wolf. Most of us come online when we can. If we can log on around lynch time, we do.

Alright, ill play with ya a bit here...first you state im much more likely to be good then bad, but have then voted for me each of the last three days(on day one you swapped to tyrith). Then on day 2, when you can no longer reason your tyrith vote as oh, its day one, you avoid a villager who is going to be lynched. The wolves know who the good guys are, and knowing tyrith was good, would likely have tried to avoid it. That 180 very much worries me.

Saldana theory doesnt quite work for me, but neither does yours. You make an assumption that the wolves would want to avoid that day one lynch, but when the "winners" had three votes i dont think they can be too spread out and feel safe. I actually find it far more likely one or both was involved in the tie. Day 2 i think they prob. did spread out as the outcome was a given(suprise, you did that). On day one they can play it off as a random day one vote. In this regard, i think your theory would be far better if applied to day 2 then day 1.

You have been active, i havent questioned that...you are wrong in going after me, and the fact you have done so 3 days in a row for 3 different reasons(stated reasons) is quite odd. You have not really addressed directly saldana's theory that i have seen, so saying your getting dismissive replies is a tad bit hypocritical(corrent me if im mistaken here).

In my mind, this all adds up to you being a wolf. You might see things differently, we usually dont agree on points. But considering were voting for eachother that matters little. All that matters is what everyone else thinks. And your early theories, while nice attempts to start bandwagons, are hopefully not enough to hide your suspicious activity.

[Blade6119]

Well shit, that proves how fucking clueless I am. If it's an unwritten rule, then fuck it.

unvote grammaticus
vote dogerchick

I'm out.
Its not necessarily a rule, and dont go self-defeatist...i think people just tend to keep to the idea lets play only with whats in the thread(or PM if your role dictates as much). Come back, discuss the current debate between cronin and I.

Besides, if you leave who will be on my trust list...right now it reads:

Dodgerchick

Would be a lonely list without you :p

[saldana]

blade, what has DC done to earn a spot on your list...i only ask becasue i dont have a list right now except for myself....you are in the grey area right now because i find myself agreeing with you, but i also know you are more than capable of deceiving me

as for the grammaticus thing...the other person in the thread at lynch last night was me, and to elaborate on what blade was explaining and what gram was saying as well...i draw nothing from that....once you have played in more of the larger games on days when there are tight lynch races, you will realize it isnt uncommon for there to be over a dozen of us in the thread at lynch time...in some of the more popular games, we have even had handfuls of people that werent even playing in the thread at lynch deadline because they just wanted to see who was getting it that day.

[oliegirl]

I don't know what to think...everytime I think I have my mind made up someone else comes up with a plausable theory. I definitley see Blades point, cronin has been very wishy washy, inconsistent in his reasons for distrusting someone.

I don't understand what all the fuss about DC is...I don't see why taking knowdge from a previous game and using it here is a bad thing...isn't that one of the plusses of being an experienced player? that you have played with the others before andknow their style? Considering there are quite a few newcomers in this game, I thought what she said was very helpful. DC, please come back!!!

And blade, I'm wondering why I am not on your trust list? What has DC done/not done to get on there and convince you she is a prisoner? Or are you both wolves and that is why you trust her???

[saldana]

dola, to make it official

vote cronin

thanks for counting it anyway lathum

[LoneStarGirl]

Well shit, that proves how fucking clueless I am. If it's an unwritten rule, then fuck it.

unvote grammaticus
vote dogerchick

I'm out.


What is that about? I think I missed something

[saldana]

double dola, i may not be back in before the lynch...i managed to get home from work, but now my parents are coming over for dinner.

[LoneStarGirl]

Blade, what have I done to put me at the bottom of your list?


I think you are just throwing your weight around as an experienced player and hoping everybody believes you.

[Neuqua]

I am a bit curious as to what Blade's intentions may be. He could very well be trying to "throw his weight around" as LSG says but for now I am going to trust his word. I'm going to make my lynch in case I can't be around the rest of the night.

Vote St Cronin

[Blade6119]

And blade, I'm wondering why I am not on your trust list? What has DC done/not done to get on there and convince you she is a prisoner? Or are you both wolves and that is why you trust her???

Blade, what have I done to put me at the bottom of your list?


I think you are just throwing your weight around as an experienced player and hoping everybody believes you.
Olie, its not that your distrusted...i just dont have anyway to clear people in this game. Therefore, i will only start trusting someone after i see them making moves i believe are to find wolves in earnest. I think so far DC has been doing that, while cronin's moves have been a smokescreen to cover his night activities.

LSG, your not at the bottom, your just below some other players. Like i said on day one, i think your a solid player who doesnt yet have the reputation you deserve. From what ive seen from you in past games you are opinionated and helpful. So far, to me at least, you have tried to play up the whole im still new card and that could be becuase your a wolf.

DC is not fully trusted, just more so then others...LGS, your not at all a confirmed wolf in my eyes, just a little more suspicious then some others right now. Dont miscontrue what i said, as really the only person i think warrants a lynch today is cronin. But other parties will see it other ways.


Olie, side note about your experience and past games question:

I think whats meant by play styles and what not is how saldana played when he was a bad guy, or how gramat hinted when he was a seer. Knowing those kinds of things from past games can help you indentify roles this game. Knowing that last game the wolves were always around at the deadline isnt really the same thing. I think the argument about past games is fine, but i believe the accepted rule-of-thumb is try to stick to what is said, more then whos around FOFC when.

[Blade6119]

Dola, to address LSG's argument about me throwing my weight around:

If i wanted just somebody lynched i would go after a quieter player who would put up less of a fight. As a bad guy, i would want to avoid controversy(controversy is why i always get lynched). I am actively campaigning for the lynch of one of the most active, experienced players in the game. The only reasons to do that are becuase i honestly believe him to be a wolf or am afraid his going to reveal me(which his 3 votes might indicate). But like i said, someone like cronin would be easier to take at night, and during the day to take a player who will be easier to, as you say, throw my weight around and get lynched.

[Blade6119]

As i see it now, its

St. Cronin 3
Dodgerchick 1
Grammaticus - 1

Is that right?

[oliegirl]

UNVOTE GRAMMATICUS


VOTE ST.CRONIN


Please count this even though its not bold...I hope to be able to check in again before deadline but I'm not sure if I will...I'm on my phone right now and it won't let me bold :( If I can get back on before deadline I will revote in bold if need be.

[Blade6119]

just use brackets when you type, with being before you text, and after the part you wish to bold.

Its going to bold that part, but you get the idea.

[Blade6119]

grrr, that didnt work...ignored the periods in these, its so the code shows:

[B.] LIKE THIS [/B.]

[Grammaticus]

I think st.cronin sounded a lot like a wolf on day one regarding the tie, but do not have any damning posts. Although I don't mind seeing where this one takes us as my other experienced candidate has no votes.

VOTE ST.CRONIN

I also think the UTR crowd still offers a strong lynch choice as it takes away the low profile players from the wolves night kill choices. This makes them kill someone with a post history and something to glean from that.

[Blade6119]

blade, what has DC done to earn a spot on your list...i only ask becasue i dont have a list right now except for myself....

Her theories have seemed very in line with what i expect from her as a villager. I dont believe, as a wolf, she would try to the around at the deadline argument which she commented on yesterday before she posted her big thing today. Yesterday, she presented ideas and arguments that just seemed like earnest attempts to aid the village. I may be badly mis-led, but her comments so far have just oozed not-wolfy to me.

[Grammaticus]

Dola, to address LSG's argument about me throwing my weight around:

If i wanted just somebody lynched i would go after a quieter player who would put up less of a fight. As a bad guy, i would want to avoid controversy(controversy is why i always get lynched). I am actively campaigning for the lynch of one of the most active, experienced players in the game. The only reasons to do that are becuase i honestly believe him to be a wolf or am afraid his going to reveal me(which his 3 votes might indicate). But like i said, someone like cronin would be easier to take at night, and during the day to take a player who will be easier to, as you say, throw my weight around and get lynched.

I differ on this strategy. Although I am in agreement that if you have anything decent to go off post wise, then do it.

But if you don't have anyting decent to go on, then eliminating the quieter players helps depending on the wolves strategy. If the wolves are taking contributing posters, you make sure you don't end up with an end game full of people without post history to choose from. If the wolves are taking quite players, you remove their options and force them to take someone with history and hopefully you can get something from that.

Possibly the most important thing it does though, is inspire participation which is ALWAYS good for the villagers.

[Blade6119]

So, is that 5 votes on cronin, 1 vote on me(from cronin), and 1 self-vote on DC?

[LoneStarGirl]

Dc needs to unvote herself cuz that is just silly.

I feel that the rest of us are in a predicament. Either we vote for St. Cronin because there are some good theories about him, and risk being called wolves because we 'jumped on a bandwagon' or we start throwing accusations at a totally different person and if cronin dies and is a wolf, we get accused of being on his side. I dont know what to do.

[LoneStarGirl]

And for some reason my gut is saying Blade, but if Cronin dies and is an assistant then i am next to die because he too voted Blade.

Choices Choices

[Neuqua]

We'll see what happens to cronin tonight, if he's an assistant then it is safe to say Blade is trustworthy.

If he's a prisoner then attention has to shift towards Blade.

[Blade6119]

We'll see what happens to cronin tonight, if he's an assistant then it is safe to say Blade is trustworthy.

If he's a prisoner then attention has to shift towards Blade.
Im ready to accept this trade-off. If cronin is good, tomorrow ill follow the group decision.

[LoneStarGirl]

I really have nothing solid to go on. so

vote st. cronin

Also, I think the theory about one of the girls being bad because lathum suspected we would get together is bullshit because I am pretty sure he used random.org

[oliegirl]

Unvote Grammaticus

Vote St. Cronin


Now it's official and bold and everything :)

[Swaggs]

I hate to pile on and I hate to have such a runaway vote since it won't tell us anything, but I don't want to be the outlier if cronin does end up an assistant.

Vote St. Cronin

[Blade6119]

LSG, and to some extent swaggs...if you guys suspect someone else more, vote them. I really dont approve of you guys voting just to not look bad if hes bad...vote for you who you suspect most, which LSG stated was me.

[Swaggs]

LSG, and to some extent swaggs...if you guys suspect someone else more, vote them. I really dont approve of you guys voting just to not look bad if hes bad...vote for you who you suspect most, which LSG stated was me.

Unfortunately, I really don't have anything better to go on. Today still feels like day 1 to me, where we are just trying to get some type of evidence established.

The only good thing I can potentially see is that I feel like I might know who one of folks with a role is, so there is kind of someone to align with. Obviously cronin is not that person, so I have no problem voting against him today.

[Blade6119]

Hey cronin, sorry you had to come back so late...im sure you dont approve of the current situation, so lets hear what you got.

[st.cronin]

Alright, ill play with ya a bit here...first you state im much more likely to be good then bad, but have then voted for me each of the last three days(on day one you swapped to tyrith). Then on day 2, when you can no longer reason your tyrith vote as oh, its day one, you avoid a villager who is going to be lynched. The wolves know who the good guys are, and knowing tyrith was good, would likely have tried to avoid it. That 180 very much worries me.

Saldana theory doesnt quite work for me, but neither does yours. You make an assumption that the wolves would want to avoid that day one lynch, but when the "winners" had three votes i dont think they can be too spread out and feel safe. I actually find it far more likely one or both was involved in the tie. Day 2 i think they prob. did spread out as the outcome was a given(suprise, you did that). On day one they can play it off as a random day one vote. In this regard, i think your theory would be far better if applied to day 2 then day 1.

You have been active, i havent questioned that...you are wrong in going after me, and the fact you have done so 3 days in a row for 3 different reasons(stated reasons) is quite odd. You have not really addressed directly saldana's theory that i have seen, so saying your getting dismissive replies is a tad bit hypocritical(corrent me if im mistaken here).

In my mind, this all adds up to you being a wolf. You might see things differently, we usually dont agree on points. But considering were voting for eachother that matters little. All that matters is what everyone else thinks. And your early theories, while nice attempts to start bandwagons, are hopefully not enough to hide your suspicious activity.


I asked saldana to explain his theory to me, a post he ignored. You then explained it to me, while discrediting it. So, basically, I'm getting lynched because I have voted for you on three different days for three different reasons which is NOT TRUE! ON DAY 1 I VOTED FOR TYRITH!!!!!

I don't know if you're a wolf, but I know you're full of shit.

[Blade6119]

I asked saldana to explain his theory to me, a post he ignored. You then explained it to me, while discrediting it. So, basically, I'm getting lynched because I have voted for you on three different days for three different reasons which is NOT TRUE! ON DAY 1 I VOTED FOR TYRITH!!!!!

I don't know if you're a wolf, but I know you're full of shit.

I addressed this in the post you quoted!!!!! You voted for me and then swapped to tyrith later in the day!! Read my posts before you tear it apart. What about the other 5-6 ideas i posted there? If this is all you have, im happy your going down

[st.cronin]

point: Any player who provides analysis as I'm doing is vastly more likely to be villager than wolf. Game after game proves this, that the wolves don't put out theories, they just go along. Blade, saldana, Swaggs, should all know better. As I said, it's entirely probable that a wolf was involved in the day 1 tie. But those throwaway random votes, that didn't get changed when a 2 horse race emerged, those were damaging to us, and that's how a wolf stays hidden. You guys should know that. A game like this, vote analysis matters. Day 2, it should have been just as obvious to you that Tyrith was VASTLY more likely to be a villager than a wolf. Those votes (for Tyrith) were all bad votes, imo.

I'm not a wolf, but ... haven't you guys learned to go after the ones who are just going along, not putting theories out there????

[Blade6119]

point: Any player who provides analysis as I'm doing is vastly more likely to be villager than wolf. Game after game proves this, that the wolves don't put out theories, they just go along. Blade, saldana, Swaggs, should all know better. As I said, it's entirely probable that a wolf was involved in the day 1 tie. But those throwaway random votes, that didn't get changed when a 2 horse race emerged, those were damaging to us, and that's how a wolf stays hidden. You guys should know that. A game like this, vote analysis matters. Day 2, it should have been just as obvious to you that Tyrith was VASTLY more likely to be a villager than a wolf. Those votes (for Tyrith) were all bad votes, imo.

I'm not a wolf, but ... haven't you guys learned to go after the ones who are just going along, not putting theories out there????
Then why are you voting for me..your actions contradict what you are stating as your beliefs

[st.cronin]

I addressed this in the post you quoted!!!!! You voted for me and then swapped to tyrith later in the day!! Read my posts before you tear it apart. What about the other 5-6 ideas i posted there? If this is all you have, im happy your going down

I didn't notice any other points that were worth mentioning. You disagree with me on my analysis of the votes, but your own voting has not been based on any analysis that I have been able to understand (not that that's unusual for you). I have no idea who is or is not an assistant. I am trying to find patterns in the sand.

[Blade6119]

I didn't notice any other points that were worth mentioning. You disagree with me on my analysis of the votes, but your own voting has not been based on any analysis that I have been able to understand (not that that's unusual for you). I have no idea who is or is not an assistant. I am trying to find patterns in the sand.

On day 1 i voted swaggs for his idea about going for a tie, on day 2 i voted tyrith for his sketch play on day 1, and today im voting for you all the reasons i stated. What more would you like to know about my voting?

[st.cronin]

Then why are you voting for me..your actions contradict what you are stating as your beliefs

Not true. I voted for you today because of my vote analysis. Go read my vote post again. Yesterday I voted for you for a different reason, because my vote analysis only pointed at somebody as being potentially cleared (that was whoever voted for SnDvls, I forget who.)

[st.cronin]

On day 1 i voted swaggs for his idea about going for a tie, on day 2 i voted tyrith for his sketch play on day 1, and today im voting for you all the reasons i stated. What more would you like to know about my voting?

Your day 2 vote was a bad vote, as I said on that day, and as I've pointed out today. After the BrianD thing a few games back, I can't believe I have to point this out to people. Wolves don't make plays like that on day 1. But still, even though it's perfectly obvious that a wolf wouldn't play that way, villagers still get lynched. It's tiring to watch, it really is.

[Blade6119]

Not true. I voted for you today because of my vote analysis. Go read my vote post again. Yesterday I voted for you for a different reason, because my vote analysis only pointed at somebody as being potentially cleared (that was whoever voted for SnDvls, I forget who.)

Your comment suggests we should go after people going along, not putting out theories. Yet all 3 days(at one time, hows that) you have voted for me. Do you not consider me putting ideas forward. Im just having a breakdown in understanding your logic in your argument translating to your actions. Even with your analysis, coupled with your stated idea would someone like LSg in your group be a better vote?

[Blade6119]

Your day 2 vote was a bad vote, as I said on that day, and as I've pointed out today. After the BrianD thing a few games back, I can't believe I have to point this out to people. Wolves don't make plays like that on day 1. But still, even though it's perfectly obvious that a wolf wouldn't play that way, villagers still get lynched. It's tiring to watch, it really is.
Your day 2 vote was a bad vote as well, as i said on that day...we can go around and around all day long with this..if your good, ive come to terms with the fact im a goner tomorrow...if your bad, were that much close to victory. Come what may

[st.cronin]

Your comment suggests we should go after people going along, not putting out theories. Yet all 3 days(at one time, hows that) you have voted for me. Do you not consider me putting ideas forward. Im just having a breakdown in understanding your logic in your argument translating to your actions. Even with your analysis, coupled with your stated idea would someone like LSg in your group be a better vote?

You went along with the bandwagon yesterday.

[Blade6119]

You went along with the bandwagon yesterday.

I actually was the major proponent of it, and the second vote behind izule. What does that have to do with the differences between your comments and actions?

[st.cronin]

I thought about LSG, but I decided it was either Blade or LSG that was likely a wolf. I went with Blade. If somehow I avoid lynching today, and Blade ends up cleared, I will move on to LSG (unless somebody better comes along).

[st.cronin]

Your day 2 vote was a bad vote as well, as i said on that day...we can go around and around all day long with this..if your good, ive come to terms with the fact im a goner tomorrow...if your bad, were that much close to victory. Come what may

My day 2 vote was a bad vote???? Not voting for the obvious villager that you all couldn't wait to dissect is a bad vote? :confused: :confused:

[st.cronin]

I actually was the major proponent of it, and the second vote behind izule. What does that have to do with the differences between your comments and actions?

My point is that for somebody as insightful and experienced as you, that was an extremely sinister play. You should have known better.

[Blade6119]

I thought about LSG, but I decided it was either Blade or LSG that was likely a wolf. I went with Blade. If somehow I avoid lynching today, and Blade ends up cleared, I will move on to LSG (unless somebody better comes along).

How can i be cleared, the seer is dead. If you come up bad, i think LSG needs to go tomorrow as you have both done a lot of positioning around the other. If your good, then im dead and LSG just got both of her top suspectors off her back.

[Blade6119]

My point is that for somebody as insightful and experienced as you, that was an extremely sinister play. You should have known better.
And you should know better then to think im a bad guy, which you obviously do with your voting record.

[st.cronin]

And you should know better then to think im a bad guy, which you obviously do with your voting record.

Your reason for voting for me boils down to "I'm good, and he's voting for me, therefore he's bad." C'mon, you know better than that. What's shocking is that people are buying it.

unvote Blade

vote LoneStarGirl

shot in the dark

[Blade6119]

Your reason for voting for me boils down to "I'm good, and he's voting for me, therefore he's bad." C'mon, you know better than that. What's shocking is that people are buying it.

unvote Blade

vote LoneStarGirl

shot in the dark

I stated i think 5-6 reasons, saldana stated his reasons, gramat said he thought you were bad on day 1. Its not just me and my one little reason. The arguments against you are exponentially greater then anyone else. Its not even close.

Honestly, just for fair play id swap my vote off of you because i respect you and you have done that for me. If i do that though,and you turn up good, im even further damnig myself. I think i have to stick to my guns. If your good, im sorry and ill sit out the next game. I hope that tells you how much i respect you here.

[LoneStarGirl]

What the hell? I am just getting thrown under the bus left and right. I have done nothing anybody else here hasn't done and yet other than st. cronin and blade I am the only name getting mentioned. This doesn't seem right.

[LoneStarGirl]

Damn I kind of hope Cronin is good so we can lynch you blade and get you off of my back.

[st.cronin]

I stated i think 5-6 reasons, saldana stated his reasons, gramat said he thought you were bad on day 1. Its not just me and my one little reason. The arguments against you are exponentially greater then anyone else. Its not even close.

Honestly, just for fair play id swap my vote off of you because i respect you and you have done that for me. If i do that though,and you turn up good, im even further damnig myself. I think i have to stick to my guns. If your good, im sorry and ill sit out the next game. I hope that tells you how much i respect you here.

I like how you keep pointing out that "saldana had his reasons" even after you've blown up those reasons. And what could Gram possibly know on day 1? If arguing for a tie is damning, then Swaggs is more wolf than I am. He had the idea first, and then Tyrith agreed as well (iirc).

And I assure you I am good.

VILLAGERS: AFTER I GET LYNCHED, YOU ALL NEED TO START LOOKING AT VOTING RECORDS. IN A GAME LIKE THIS, WITHOUT A LOT OF CRAZY ROLES, VOTING RECORDS ARE MORE TELLING THAN POSTS.

[Blade6119]

What the hell? I am just getting thrown under the bus left and right. I have done nothing anybody else here hasn't done and yet other than st. cronin and blade I am the only name getting mentioned. This doesn't seem right.

Maybe becuase only st.cronin and i are talking right now...DC and olie were on gramat, i know gramat said his canidate didnt have any votes. Your not as "thrown under the bus" as you think.

Cronin is, but in about 10 minutes we should find out whether im going under or someone else is tomorrow.

[Blade6119]

Damn I kind of hope Cronin is good so we can lynch you blade and get you off of my back.

You realize cronin is voting for you too, right? And he said its between me and you for suspects. Both he and i associate you with the other.

Im sorry you dont like having people not think your totally cleared, but self-survival is not the name of the game.Its prisoners vs. wolves, and im trying to help the villagers win. Im not voting for you, and i have openly said i suspect others. People really just look for a reason to kill me i think, heck tyrith said as much.

[Blade6119]

I like how you keep pointing out that "saldana had his reasons" even after you've blown up those reasons. And what could Gram possibly know on day 1? If arguing for a tie is damning, then Swaggs is more wolf than I am. He had the idea first, and then Tyrith agreed as well (iirc).
Day one i ended up voting for swaggs, day 2 i got tyrith lynched. Your argument against me actually explains my action. The three people who (i believe it was gramat who posted it) were listed as for the tie are the only 3 people ive voted for this game...

Saldanas reasons may be right..i dont think they are, but im usually wrong. Shortly i might be proven wrong about you as well.

[st.cronin]

You realize cronin is voting for you too, right? And he said its between me and you for suspects. Both he and i associate you with the other.

Im sorry you dont like having people not think your totally cleared, but self-survival is not the name of the game.Its prisoners vs. wolves, and im trying to help the villagers win. Im not voting for you, and i have openly said i suspect others. People really just look for a reason to kill me i think, heck tyrith said as much.

Well, it's not like you go out of your way to play it safe in these games. It wouldn't surprise me if both you and LSG were wolves, but I don't THINK you're a wolf - I think you're more likely to be a wolf than anybody else. You should have known better than anybody that Tyrith was a villager. I am very surprised that's not perfectly obvious to you. But then, iirc, you were on the wrong side of the BrianD lynch, too, so maybe I shouldn't be surprised.

[Blade6119]

Well, it's not like you go out of your way to play it safe in these games. It wouldn't surprise me if both you and LSG were wolves, but I don't THINK you're a wolf - I think you're more likely to be a wolf than anybody else. You should have known better than anybody that Tyrith was a villager. I am very surprised that's not perfectly obvious to you. But then, iirc, you were on the wrong side of the BrianD lynch, too, so maybe I shouldn't be surprised.
Zing, theres the cronin wit i know and love:p

[st.cronin]

Day one i ended up voting for swaggs, day 2 i got tyrith lynched. Your argument against me actually explains my action. The three people who (i believe it was gramat who posted it) were listed as for the tie are the only 3 people ive voted for this game...

Saldanas reasons may be right..i dont think they are, but im usually wrong. Shortly i might be proven wrong about you as well.

Note that tyrith was not an assistant. So, I would say that strategy is not working well. Unless YOU'RE an assistant - then you're about to be 2 for 2.

[Lathum]

deadline

[Blade6119]

Note that tyrith was not an assistant. So, I would say that strategy is not working well. Unless YOU'RE an assistant - then you're about to be 2 for 2.

If your good, im dead tomorrow...if your bad, im great...i told you, ive come to terms with it. You were by far my top suspect, and i made sure you got lynched. Moves like this have reprocussions, and im ok with that. Its deadline, so like i said, im sorry if i was wrong.

[st.cronin]

good luck village, I'll be following along

remember everything I have said

[Lathum]

Izulde's grusome death still lingers in your mind much the way the smell of his charred flesh lingers in your nostrils. After some deliberation most of you feel something isn't right about St.Cronin. The small seed of a doubt mounts during the day as it turns into a tidal wave, St.Cronin must die. As he backs down the hallway the group turns into an angry bob, grabbing old pipes and pieces of plywood as you back St.Cronin into a corner. You savegly beat him to death as blood stains his allready dirty cloths. Saldana grabs the scalper, rips cronins shirt off and plunges it into St.Cronins stomach. He reachs in ans grabs a shiny metal object. Saldana scream in triumph as he rushs down the hall way. He hold the bloodstained key up to the light and see's a small number 3 on it. He jams it into the third lock and you all hear the mechanism turn in place. As the lock releases from each side of the hallway buzzsaws shoot out from a hidden compartment. Saldana's hand that was holding the key drops to the floor as blood spurts from his wrist. Saldna turns to the group with a mixed look of confusion and horror, he takes one look at the bloody stup then passes out and dies in a pool of his own blood. YOu all look around at each other horrified that St.Cronin was used as a human booby trap.

final vote count

St Cronin 7( saldana, blade, neuqua, oliegirl, gramm, lsg, swaggs)
dodgerchick 1( dodgerchick)
lsg 1 (st.cronin)

[st.cronin]

Well, I didn't see that one coming.

[Blade6119]

So was he bad, or the prisoner with the key?

We just lost saldana with him, so i hope he was bad as saldana was a great good guy to have.

[Blade6119]

Either way i suppose its good we just got rid of the bad key...now both keys open the door.

[Alan T]

Izulde's grusome death still lingers in your mind much the way the smell of his charred flesh lingers in your nostrils. After some deliberation most of you feel something isn't right about St.Cronin. The small seed of a doubt mounts during the day as it turns into a tidal wave, St.Cronin must die. As he backs down the hallway the group turns into an angry bob, grabbing old pipes and pieces of plywood as you back St.Cronin into a corner. You savegly beat him to death as blood stains his allready dirty cloths. Saldana grabs the scalper, rips cronins shirt off and plunges it into St.Cronins stomach. He reachs in ans grabs a shiny metal object. Saldana scream in triumph as he rushs down the hall way. He hold the bloodstained key up to the light and see's a small number 3 on it. He jams it into the third lock and you all hear the mechanism turn in place. As the lock releases from each side of the hallway buzzsaws shoot out from a hidden compartment. Saldana's hand that was holding the key drops to the floor as blood spurts from his wrist. Saldna turns to the group with a mixed look of confusion and horror, he takes one look at the bloody stup then passes out and dies in a pool of his own blood. YOu all look around at each other horrified that St.Cronin was used as a human booby trap.

final vote count

St Cronin 7( saldana, blade, neuqua, oliegirl, gramm, lsg, swaggs)
dodgerchick 1( dodgerchick)
lsg 1 (st.cronin)


ew!

[oliegirl]

daaaammmmmnnnnnn!

So cronin was a prisoner, but likely would have had to die at some point b/c he had a key, right? I was really really hoping we were getting an assistant tonight!!!! :( Guess we'll see who gets lynched tonight and start all over again tomorrow, but at least now we have some information to go on...

[LoneStarGirl]

That is so gross. Lathum you are too good at this. That sucks for Saldana, but I guess we dont have to be hesitant about being the first to vote anymore do we?

[saldana]

i'm sorry, but thats pretty weak lathum...i died from losing my hand??!!!!! do you have any idea how long it would take to bleed out from that kind of wound?

[Lathum]

i'm sorry, but thats pretty weak lathum...i died from losing my hand??!!!!! do you have any idea how long it would take to bleed out from that kind of wound?

no I don't but keep that shit up and I'll gladly find out

[Grammaticus]

Oh man, I really thought there was a chance Saldana was the fast talker and was going to make somebody else open the door.

[saldana]

no I don't but keep that shit up and I'll gladly find out

next time we are drunk in my basement, i believe i have the necessary equipment for the experiment

[LoneStarGirl]

I forgot you two were friends. That is pretty funny.

[hoopsguy]

Saldana, congrats on living past Night 1.

[Grammaticus]

next time we are drunk in my basement, i believe i have the necessary equipment for the experiment

I do not want to see Saldana use his equipment on Lathum, while they are drunk and experimenting in his basement. :eek:

[Lorena]

I had to really cool off after my last post... but I get frustrated at times as I'm not very good at reading clues in these posts so I take whatever I can and go with it.

As far as these "unwritten rules" is concerned, it's hard for me to know what I can and can't look at... this is my... 4th game I think? Maybe 3rd, I can't remember, so I'm still fairly new at this. I know about looking at AIM or Yahoo Messanger, etc. to see whose online is a no-no. I thought about looking at players' profiles to see if they were writing a PM... lots of stuff goes through my mind but as someone who isn't familiar with the game, it's hard to figure out what is or is not allowed.

It's like unwritten rules in sports. "Always take a knee when the game is pretty much over." A person that doesn't follow football wouldn't know why that should be done. I mean why not hand off the ball to the RB right? WRONG! You run the clock out by taking a knee in case there's a botched snap and ends up in a turnover which would help the opposing team.

Anyway, I guess what I'm trying to say is, if we're not familiar with these "rules", how can we keep the integrity of the game if we don't know?

That's all.

/rant over

BTW, my supposed theory sucked because the other person that was in the thread was saldana and he proved to be good. So much for that theory... sorry about that Gramm. :o

[saldana]

dc, i dont think anyone was reprimanding you...those of us that have been around awhile realize that you and some others havent....thats why blade and gram were explaining to you about that particular WW ethic......its because we had full blow, knock down, drag em' out brawls over people doing all the things you mentioned in you post above this one....basically, meta-gaming, as its been called, is against the spirit of the game...you are supposed to base your game on what is happening in the game, not based upon a possible logisitical "tell", like who is in the thread, sending a pm, on aim, or even (i know i particularly HATE this one, but the verdict is still out) trying to match words in your PM's to clear one another...the game is supposed to be based on the posts....and i and everyone else here are sure that now that you know that, you will be perfectly fine continuting this and any future games.

vote on voter :)

[saldana]

dola, oh yeah, your theory did suck....i was a prisoner....:D

[oliegirl]

Welcome back DC! Glad you took time to cool off and decided to rejoin the game...though I have to say that you voting for yourself is one of the funniest things I've ever seen! :)

Here is my theory for the day:

Blade is a wolf. He knew St. Cronin had a key, or had a very good idea that he did...thus he knew that by killing St. Cronin, he had a good chance of wiping out 2 prisoners in one night, further weakening us. And since there hasn't been much unity among us so far, he figured it would be easy to start picking us off one by one after this.

I have a few other theories about other players that I am mulling over...but if I had to vote right now, I'd vote for Blade. If he can convince me I'm wrong, I'll gladly shift my focus elsewhere.

Let's talk prisoners! Everyone throw out a theory today!!!! :)

[Lorena]

dc, i dont think anyone was reprimanding you...those of us that have been around awhile realize that you and some others havent....thats why blade and gram were explaining to you about that particular WW ethic......its because we had full blow, knock down, drag em' out brawls over people doing all the things you mentioned in you post above this one....basically, meta-gaming, as its been called, is against the spirit of the game...you are supposed to base your game on what is happening in the game, not based upon a possible logisitical "tell", like who is in the thread, sending a pm, on aim, or even (i know i particularly HATE this one, but the verdict is still out) trying to match words in your PM's to clear one another...the game is supposed to be based on the posts....and i and everyone else here are sure that now that you know that, you will be perfectly fine continuting this and any future games.

vote on voter :)

I read the last couple pages of one of the first games (maybe it was the first, I don't remember) and someone said that they checked user profiles to see when someone could have possibly sent a PM. Others chimed in giving suggestions as to what to do to cover it up.

Well, I'm super tired as I had like 2 hour of sleep. By the time I come back, someone's gonna be dead and I sure as hell hope it ain't me.

[Lorena]

Well, before I leave, I'm gonna have to read over cronin's last posts before death, I think we can find some valuable info there.

Also, Blade pretty much dared us to vote him out in case cronin ended up being good. I'm not entirely sure what to think of that either. Part of me thinks okay, if he's a wolf, that's a pretty daring thing to say. Which leads me to think he's a villager. I mean what wolf could possibly put himself in the spotlight like that? It's like committing suicide.

[Lathum]

You stir awake and have another day of horror and deliberation ahead of you. The group slowely starts to gather in the hallway.Everyone notices Oliegirl missing and they rush to her room. You check the door carefully and then open it peaking in. Oliegirl is sprawled across the floor as if she were attempting to crawl to the door. Around her neck is a metal contraption. A river of blood trails behind her to the bed. Upon closer inspection the contraption is a large metal ring frame that extends around her neck locking in place. A straight razor was projected from the side of the frame half way through her neck. There is a note by her bed. It says “If you make any noise, scream, shout or even whimper, there is a vibration controlled trigger that will slice a metal blade through your jugular vein, killing you rather quickly (does that bleed out fast enough for you Saldana?). If you can make it quietly to the main room and find the key Saldana used yesterday, you can open the lock on the neck brace.” Oliegirl made too much noise.

[LoneStarGirl]

Nice.

So this brings out two theories.

This morning Oliegirl was hot on Blade's trail, thinking we should kill him. And now she is killed. Coincidence?

Or the assistants knew Olie was suspicious of Blade so they killed her in hopes that we would go after Blade, even though he isn't an assistant.

[Swaggs]

I'll be around a little more today, after 2:00 to get some discussion going.

[oliegirl]

What a crappy way to die...

Good luck prisoners - I'll be reading along to see how it goes :)

[Grammaticus]

Hey DC no problem, its all good. I witnessed a few of the blowouts that Saldana explained and even people continuing to argue about that stuff 10 games later. Prior to this game I’ve been PMing Thomkal and GE about the Tombstone game. We were the first 3 people that died and after we died, we were sharing our thoughts as the game progressed. When this game started, I have tried to stay away from my PM inbox so as not to make someone think I was a wolf sending PMs.

Anyway, I hope your not po’d or anything. And I hope you finally got some rest. I stayed up pretty late watching the rest of SAW II. One particular scene was a STICKY situation and made me absolutely cringe.

The above “STICKY” is not any kind of game hint, just a movie hint. I don’t want to spoil the experience for anyone who may watch the movie. If that movie scene does not make you go completely rigid from head to toe, then nothing will. Its worse than a trip to the dentist.

[Grammaticus]

LSG, at first I didn’t understand what you meant about oliegirl accusing blade as I did not recall her accusing him yesterday at all. But then I noticed that you meant this morning, but prior to the lynch. That may be a possibility, but that means the wolves would have waited until last minute to send in a night order or read oliegirls post at 7:30am and changed their night action. Definitely possible, but I doubt it was retaliation from Blade or a Blade setup. Just seems too obvious, especially when Oliegirl has not said much until that post. I wish she would have put our all of her concerns on the other players. Looks like she was getting fired up and ready to start posting.

DC, I don’t take Blade’s post about “you can come after me if cronin is good” as anything obvious one way or the other. It just seems like Blade’s style in general. If it is a hint of any kind, I think it means something else and that Blade may be good.

[Blade6119]

What do yall want me to say today...i screwed up yesterday, saldana is dead as well, and a person accusing me last night is now dead. Im good, and would rather see someone else get lynched, but like i said yesterday i know the reprocussions of my actions and am willing to accept them if need be.

[Grammaticus]

My confidence level for Blade just went up a few notches.

[Blade6119]

We have 6 people left, 2 of them being bad guys, 2 of them being roled good guys(bodyguard, fast talker). If we miss on the lynch today, and the bodyguard misses tonight, thats end game...no? If im not couting wrong, that would leave us at 2-2 and a loss.

If so, The value of role reveals might be a lot higher today then normal for a day 4...what do you think gramat?

[Blade6119]

Dola, and the last 2 in that group of six should be normal villagers.

[Grammaticus]

We have 6 people left, 2 of them being bad guys, 2 of them being roled good guys(bodyguard, fast talker). If we miss on the lynch today, and the bodyguard misses tonight, thats end game...no? If im not couting wrong, that would leave us at 2-2 and a loss.

If so, The value of role reveals might be a lot higher today then normal for a day 4...what do you think gramat?

Yep, this is possibly the end game vote. A risk with reveals are the wolves will likely claim roles too and we have no seer insight. The BG reveal lets the wolves know who the BG is and we of course have no way of testing that role. The fast talker can be confirmed, but then we would have to lynch that person to do that.

How does that risk weigh with trying to hit a wolf today (our highest percentage chance so far) and having the BG role still in the dark. Meaning the block attempt tonight probably has better success? I’ve never been in an endgame situation So I’m not sure.

[LoneStarGirl]

Well I wish I could come out and say I had a special roll. I have been in three games and I have been nothing but an average villager in each of them.

I trust Dodgerchick right now because only a dumb villager or a genius werewolf would vote for themselves and say 'im out' and since this is DC's third game I dont think she has hit that genius level yet.

[LoneStarGirl]

And I agree with blade that the bodyguard and fast talker need to come out

[Grammaticus]

dola,

I feel pretty strong about two people. If the reveals don't pan out as I would guess, then I'm still in the dark, but now the wolves KNOW everything. Does that make sense?

[Lorena]

Just a reminder as I look through voting records.

VILLAGERS: AFTER I GET LYNCHED, YOU ALL NEED TO START LOOKING AT VOTING RECORDS. IN A GAME LIKE THIS, WITHOUT A LOT OF CRAZY ROLES, VOTING RECORDS ARE MORE TELLING THAN POSTS.

[Lorena]

Well, I just looked at voting records and Swaggs has voted for Neuqua on Night 1 (created the tie), Tyrith on Night 2 (who ended up getting lynched), and st.cronin on night 3 (got lynched).

If voting records mean something, this seems pretty damning evidence.

[Blade6119]

Yep, this is possibly the end game vote. A risk with reveals are the wolves will likely claim roles too and we have no seer insight. The BG reveal lets the wolves know who the BG is and we of course have no way of testing that role. The fast talker can be confirmed, but then we would have to lynch that person to do that.

How does that risk weigh with trying to hit a wolf today (our highest percentage chance so far) and having the BG role still in the dark. Meaning the block attempt tonight probably has better success? I’ve never been in an endgame situation So I’m not sure.
I think it is more important to kill a bad guy now then to try and stop the death of one tonight. We kill one now, the ratio victory is pushed back a few days until 1-1 and our chances go wayyyy up. We block tonight, which is less likely then hitting a wolf in the lynch, and tomorrow were still 3-2 without much more to go on then today.

Ive made up my mind.

I am the bodybuilder. Ill do my best to stop them tonight.

Now, id like the fast talker to come forward. If he/she does, or multiple people do, i will then reveal who i protected each night. My thinking here is if multiple people claim the role we can actually test it by setting up the two claimers. The winner will either die, or be the fast talker and lynch the other. Secondly, i have guarded 3 people, all of which are still alive right now. I asked lathum, and he said he couldnt tell me what would happen if i guarded an assistant. All 3 of my nights have been very similar though, so my thinking is i have guarded all good guys. I dont want to reveal who until people claim the fast talker, as i dont want the wolves to know if their the ones who are not cleared in my semi-seer system until after they try to pull a fast one. If no one does, we have 2 cleared roles, and of the 4 others we have potentially 2 of them cleared by my guarding. That could hand us the victory, if im right here.

Thoughts?

[Grammaticus]

Just a reminder as I look through voting records.

I think we are showing our personalities, Blade and LSG are aggressive and want to just do something. DC and I are more reserved, I know I don’t want to make a decision that screws us.

Is there any value in saying who we think the wolves are first and does anyone have any vote analysis to offer. I know where I fall on that.

[Neuqua]

I guess this is as good a time as any to let you all know that I am the fast talker.

I won't be able to discuss much until about 4pm central due to classes but since you are all involved in discussions already, it's best you have as much information available to you. And when I return, I will try to catch up and see where we are all at.