Survivor: Fiji (spoilers inside) [Archive] - Front Office Football Central

LloydLungs

02-09-2007, 01:27 PM

Seems like they are doing this more often. They are trying to keep the show fresh, but I think they are going to end up killing it.

They've said that recruiting is necessary to cast large numbers of minorities. I dunno. Personally I had trouble getting into last year's derby of whether the chick who guested on Sex and the City could beat out the guy who guested on Seinfeld and Arrested Development, and how their strategy might work against the former porn actor.

As for this season, the first boot is

* a former University of New Orleans student (go Privateers!), and

* the hottest chick on the show.

Way to go, Fiji cast.

Vinatieri for Prez

02-09-2007, 03:07 PM

Especially given that one immunity idol is at the bad beach.

How do we know this? Why not the good beach? The note said back from where you came, but the architect never made it to the bad beach to come back from. She got sent to exile island before the immunity challenge, no?

Maple Leafs

02-09-2007, 05:02 PM

Vinatieri for Prez

02-09-2007, 07:21 PM

Hmm, I must have missed it in the clue where it said there were two idols.

Landshark44

02-09-2007, 07:27 PM

jeff probst said there were two idols, when he had everyone gathered on the beach.

what do you guys mean by "recruiting"?

Lathum

02-09-2007, 10:49 PM

I was glad Rocky stood up to that moron and I think alot of other castaways were also. I am always amazed that people go on this show and act in a moronic way that annoys everyone. IT's like they never watched a prior season

EagleFan

02-10-2007, 12:34 AM

jeff probst said there were two idols, when he had everyone gathered on the beach.

what do you guys mean by "recruiting"?

I don't believe he did. I thought it was said during the introductions in a voice over but he has not said anything to the group about it yet.

Vinatieri for Prez

02-10-2007, 12:47 AM

I don't believe he did. I thought it was said during the introductions in a voice over but he has not said anything to the group about it yet.
That would make sense because I missed the first 5 minutes of the show and during the rest of the show (including on the beach), I swear I never heard him mention there were two idols.

Landshark44

02-10-2007, 01:45 AM

I don't believe he did. I thought it was said during the introductions in a voice over but he has not said anything to the group about it yet.

yes, that's possible. i just remember hearing him say it.

gstelmack

02-10-2007, 12:15 PM

How do we know this? Why not the good beach? The note said back from where you came, but the architect never made it to the bad beach to come back from. She got sent to exile island before the immunity challenge, no?

It said back at your home or somesuch. Since that's where she is headed back, I figured it would be the bad beach.

Of course, if there is one at each beach, it won't matter at all.

kingfc22

02-11-2007, 11:05 PM

Way to kick the hottest chick out of the show on the first vote. :(

LloydLungs

02-12-2007, 09:31 AM

what do you guys mean by "recruiting"?

Basically the casting people go around looking for people rather than taking applications from people all over the country. This results in a disproportionate number of Californians and/or wanna-be actors in Survivor casts.

TazFTW

02-16-2007, 12:05 AM

Yau Man needs to get off that loser team.

BrianD

02-16-2007, 10:17 AM

Yau Man needs to get off that loser team.

Seems like he might be the smartest guy on the island...though that may not get him very far.

Raiders Army

02-16-2007, 10:22 AM

Pretty tame episode last night. I don't like the one tribe living in luxury. I think it's too much of an advantage in the physical challenges. Last night the other tribe was competitive, but after a while I'd guess that it won't even be close if it comes to a physical challenge.

The guy who hurt himself, Boo, was pretty funny. I can't believe someone is that clumsy/stupid/stubborn.

rkmsuf

02-16-2007, 10:23 AM

great editing/timing when they showed him falling in the hammock

FrogMan

02-16-2007, 10:24 AM

The guy who hurt himself, Boo, was pretty funny. I can't believe someone is that clumsy/stupid/stubborn.

and it's even better when you can add "unlucky" to the list. The hammock falling apart bit was very, very funny. :D

FM

Lathum

03-01-2007, 08:06 PM

I can not believe a tribe would purposfully go to tribal council and I think it will be their undoing.

CraigSca

03-01-2007, 09:06 PM

I think Lisi has to go. She felt threatened by Lilliana, so forced the rest of the 5 to vote in that direction. I also didn't like what she was saying about Papa Smurf when he was sick. I'm suprised the other 4 include her in their exclusive club.

Thomkal

03-01-2007, 10:09 PM

Yeah I was liking Lisi until tonight and her comments about Gary and Lilliana. Hope Gary is ok. And it was incredibly stupid to vote someone out so they could stay at the luxury camp. They were winning all the challenges, why break the momentum by evening the odds with your competitors?

Looks like its going to cause a lot of bad feelings too by the preview for next week. Wouldn't surprise me if they lose challenges now because they kept Cassandra.

TazFTW

03-02-2007, 12:47 AM

I can not believe a tribe would purposfully go to tribal council and I think it will be their undoing.

I hope that happens. I really don't like the luxury tribe.

Vinatieri for Prez

03-02-2007, 02:22 AM

wade moore

03-02-2007, 06:39 AM

Dumb. Dumb. Dumb.

First you purposely go to tribal council and even up the numbers instead of being up 8-6. But, then you vote out the strongest woman on your team so you are weak and vulnerable in the next challenges because the ugly girl is jealous.

All for what? So you can sleep on a bed and use forks??

I am totally cheering for the other tribe now; even though that whole team is a bunch of losers.

How in the world that alliance of 5 has the useless frumpy-dump instead of the smokin' hot, uber-athletic latina makes no sense to me.

That being said, I don't really have much problem with going to tribal. Having that beach, imo, has been a HUGE advantage - even to the point that I'm almost not liking Survivor for the first time because it's just so unbalanced.

Toddzilla

03-02-2007, 07:13 AM

FrogMan

03-02-2007, 07:24 AM

How in the world that alliance of 5 has the useless frumpy-dump instead of the smokin' hot, uber-athletic latina makes no sense to me.

That being said, I don't really have much problem with going to tribal. Having that beach, imo, has been a HUGE advantage - even to the point that I'm almost not liking Survivor for the first time because it's just so unbalanced.

agree with all that's in here. To me, going to tribal council wasn't all that dumb, it was dumbing the athletic and strong girl instead of the smiley and happy black lady.

I don't see the number advantage as being that important, they have to play on equal terms in challenges anyway (sitting one person per).

What would you want on your team, 8 people who are weakened because they don't eat well, then start losing and get depressed and all, or 7 people who eat like kings and sleep well and are ready to kick the ass of the 7 people on the other side who are still not eating much and losing weight by the minute? Granted, the 7 people they decided to keep on their team is not the 7 that I would have picked, but that's another story...

FM

Vinatieri for Prez

03-02-2007, 01:15 PM

The more I think of this the dumber it gets. If they happen to lose the next challenge and then there is a merger, they're done for. Or even if the numbers stay even until a merge, they could be done for. What a bunch of morons.

Raiders Army

03-02-2007, 09:21 PM

Yep. Yep. Yep. Agree with all of the above. Did anyone else notice that despite all his words after the IC, Dreamz voted with the crew to get the Latina chick out?

Maple Leafs

03-03-2007, 09:10 AM

gstelmack

03-03-2007, 09:11 AM

I think this was the typical alliance ego kicking in. The group of 5 decide they want to keep the comfort, and they are in charge, so losing one won't matter, and they get to keep the camp. Every time an alliance decides to wield their power in anything but a tribal council, they fall apart. Looks like the same will happen here, especially given the gall to vote out the strong woman.

And doubly especially when the 2 girls in the alliance manage to overrule the 3 guys...

Vinatieri for Prez

03-03-2007, 11:48 AM

They probably made the right call... they're winning all the challenges because they're well-fed and rested. Especially with the other team so beaten down, why take your foot off their throat.

And for those who says they're rooting for the "poor" tribe... well, no kidding, the entire show has been designed to get you to do that.

Disagree. They've been well-fed and rested long enough to be good for awhile and certainly to win the next challenge or two on skill alone. Number superiority before a merge is critical, it must trump every other decision.

As for rooting for the poor tribe, I was actually rooting against them until now because they are simply terrible (both player and personality wise). But that dumb decision is what has changed my view.

wade moore

03-03-2007, 01:17 PM

Disagree. They've been well-fed and rested long enough to be good for awhile and certainly to win the next challenge or two on skill alone. Number superiority before a merge is critical, it must trump every other decision.

As for rooting for the poor tribe, I was actually rooting against them until now because they are simply terrible (both player and personality wise). But that dumb decision is what has changed my view.

I don't think you could be more wrong on this. We're long from a merge imo, I'm not sure that they've ever merged earlier than like 10 or 11... and the strength is FAR more important.. they're not winning because they are some way inherently superior, it's the setup they have... I'd rather be at 7-7 and win the next 3 than at 8-6 and go on a losing streak as the other tribe gets stronger. Before they made a decision, I said to my fiance that I'd go to tribal.

The only problem I have is who they voted out.

BrianD

03-03-2007, 04:49 PM

I don't remember the initial rules, but does the imunity-winning tribe get the good camp, or was the last episode the only time where they could have traded camps?

Choosing to vote someone off and retain the good camp was a good idea, but only if you are going to use the chance to drop a weak link. Lisi and Cassandra would have been good choices, and an argument could have been made to vote out Dreamz. A move like this only works if you can prevent your team from getting weaker...which didn't happen.

Raiders Army

03-03-2007, 05:23 PM

I don't remember the initial rules, but does the imunity-winning tribe get the good camp, or was the last episode the only time where they could have traded camps?
This was key. If they had given up the good camp, how long would it have taken for them to get back there? Until the merge? I think they made a good choice in going to tribal council. Like the others above, my problem would be the person they voted out.

Then again, we haven't seen all of the stuff that's been going on in that tribe. The only stuff we knew about was that Boo is an accident waiting to happen, Papa Smurf was hurting, and the Latina chick was a flirt. We know far more about the other tribe and their dynamics.

BrianD

03-03-2007, 11:20 PM

Then again, we haven't seen all of the stuff that's been going on in that tribe. The only stuff we knew about was that Boo is an accident waiting to happen, Papa Smurf was hurting, and the Latina chick was a flirt. We know far more about the other tribe and their dynamics.

The alliance pretty much said that the only reason she was being voted out was because they thought she could cause problems with their alliance. If that is really the worry, then the alliance is not that strong to begin with. The best way to keep the alliance together is to keep winning challenges. By voting out a strong member, they won't be able to do that as well.

I also think it was bad for the whole alliance to vote together. This basically announces the alliance and let's other people know about their position in the tribe. It sounds like Dreamz voted with the alliance, so he may not know his position, but everyone else must. They should have secured the vote the way they wanted and then thrown out some other random votes. Hide the alliance a bit and keep the outsiders from knowing that they have to break the alliance up. In games like this having the strength is much better than showing the strength.

TazFTW

03-09-2007, 12:01 AM

I guess that answers how bad someone would have to act to get me to feel sorry for Dreamz. Interesting idea to form an alliance to find the immunity idol. The poor tribe is jinxed.

EagleFan

03-09-2007, 12:13 AM

Treating the two members of your own tribe that are not in your "5 person alliance" like crap this early in the game has got to be one of the dumbest moves ever. It's not like they are the final 7 and those two have no power. If they merge before 10 remaining, they are out of luck once those two flip to the other side.

This has been one of the least intersting seasons yet. There are not any players that I am wanting to see win at this point. Maybe that guy from the winning team who seems to understand that they should not be acting like asses or maybe Yao Man.

EagleFan

03-09-2007, 12:14 AM

dola: oh, and what was the deal with the choice for the final pair in the reward challenge. The introduction sounded as if once all 7 member sent they could chose anyone to go and they went with the woman who got thrown off within seconds the first time against the same person who did that to her?

kingfc22

03-09-2007, 12:34 AM

I was so happy when Lisi fell face first during the immunity challenge. Too bad Alex is stuck with the two evil step sisters in his alliance.

LloydLungs

03-09-2007, 12:40 AM

I was so happy when Lisi fell face first during the immunity challenge. Too bad Alex is stuck with the two evil step sisters in his alliance.

I'm not sure I can remember anyone looking more pathetic/obnoxious than Lisi so far. I don't know whether it's an editing hatchet job or whether it's just her, but damn.

Interesting thing about this season -- I caught a youtube video made by someone in the cast of Survivor 13 (Cook Islands) and they were all taking a picture with Probst at the reunion, and Probst makes a comment kind of under his breath -- "I wish we'd had all you guys in Fiji.... that's all I'll say." Sounds like he wasn't a big fan of this season either.

wade moore

03-09-2007, 07:03 AM

I'm not sure I can remember anyone looking more pathetic/obnoxious than Lisi so far. I don't know whether it's an editing hatchet job or whether it's just her, but damn.

I actually hate Stacy much more than Lisi. I'm not sure that there's been a big bitch/asshole - I'll love it to see her shocked face whenever she is voted off.

I wish I hadn't seen scenes from the next as it totally ruins what's going to happen. Of course, I'm sure the commercials will be plastered all over the NCAA tournament anyways, so there was no avoiding it.

Galaril

03-09-2007, 08:15 AM

Yeah, me and my wife were also discussing that she is the biggest bitch on survivvor in along, long time.

Raiders Army

03-09-2007, 08:26 AM

Interesting thing about this season -- I caught a youtube video made by someone in the cast of Survivor 13 (Cook Islands) and they were all taking a picture with Probst at the reunion, and Probst makes a comment kind of under his breath -- "I wish we'd had all you guys in Fiji.... that's all I'll say." Sounds like he wasn't a big fan of this season either.

In a way, the players aren't too much different from other seasons. What makes this season horrible is how lopsided the game is. Their twist of luxury vs. nothing stinks as much here as it does The Apprentice. In physical challenges, there's no way a tribe that has nothing and has eaten nothing can compete with a tribe that is well-fed and well-rested. Even in the mental challenges, their mind is going because of lack of food and good sleep. The producers have no one to blame but themselves.

wade moore

03-09-2007, 08:45 AM

Maple Leafs

03-09-2007, 08:54 AM

In a way, the players aren't too much different from other seasons. What makes this season horrible is how lopsided the game is. Their twist of luxury vs. nothing stinks as much here as it does The Apprentice. In physical challenges, there's no way a tribe that has nothing and has eaten nothing can compete with a tribe that is well-fed and well-rested. Even in the mental challenges, their mind is going because of lack of food and good sleep. The producers have no one to blame but themselves.
My wife feels the same way. She actually feels so bad for the starving tribe that she's not enjoying the show.

I'm on the other side... after 14 seasons, I'm so tired of the contrived "let's rig the challenges to keep the sides even" approach.If the stronger tribe is getting an advantage, they go to a puzzle challenge. If the men are beating the women, break out the balance beam. Nothing interesting ever happens prior to the merge. At least this year we have a couple of group dynamics (starving and disintegrating vs. fat and cocky) that we haven't seen much of before.

gstelmack

03-09-2007, 09:00 AM

Treating the two members of your own tribe that are not in your "5 person alliance" like crap this early in the game has got to be one of the dumbest moves ever. It's not like they are the final 7 and those two have no power. If they merge before 10 remaining, they are out of luck once those two flip to the other side.

It's like I said earlier: when an alliance gets arrogant early, it always backfires on them, as they drive out their alleged "tribemates" who realise they aren't making the final 4 or 5.

wade moore

03-09-2007, 09:00 AM

My wife feels the same way. She actually feels so bad for the starving tribe that she's not enjoying the show.

I'm on the other side... after 14 seasons, I'm so tired of the contrived "let's rig the challenges to keep the sides even" approach.If the stronger tribe is getting an advantage, they go to a puzzle challenge. If the men are beating the women, break out the balance beam. Nothing interesting ever happens prior to the merge. At least this year we have a couple of group dynamics (starving and disintegrating vs. fat and cocky) that we haven't seen much of before.

I have no problem with not artificially evening the teams.. that bothers me too - but this is the opposite.. they are artificially enhancing one team.. I like on Stephanie's season when they just kept losing because they couldn't win... but this is just so artificially enhanced for one team...

gstelmack

03-09-2007, 09:08 AM

But the other team isn't even TRYING to better their situation. How long did they look before they found pineapple right next door? They've all been sitting around the whole time doing NOTHING to build a better shelter, find shellfish and cook them, etc. They're not any worse off than most other Survivor tribes have been, yet they are probably doing the absolute worst at the whole "Survive" thing.

Heck, Yao Man pointed out that he used to practically live like this. He did his best to show them what to do with coconuts, etc.

I know the one team has it easy, but the other team only has it this bad because they aren't even trying.

wade moore

03-09-2007, 09:27 AM

LloydLungs

03-09-2007, 09:32 AM

I actually hate Stacy much more than Lisi. I'm not sure that there's been a big bitch/asshole - I'll love it to see her shocked face whenever she is voted off.

Stacy may be a bigger bitch, but Lisi is also pathetic -- unathletic, uncoordinated, fat, which the show's editors tirelessly remind us of -- AND she's a bitch. The pathetic/obnoxious meter is off the charts.

And yes, the twist sucks for most of the reasons mentioned, but mostly because it's just not a very interesting twist. People had all kinds of objections, rightfully so, to the ghost tribe twist in Pearl Islands, but at the very least that twist made you go "WHOA!!!" This twist just makes you think they're running out of ideas.

gstelmack

03-09-2007, 09:56 AM

And yes, the twist sucks for most of the reasons mentioned, but mostly because it's just not a very interesting twist. People had all kinds of objections, rightfully so, to the ghost tribe twist in Pearl Islands, but at the very least that twist made you go "WHOA!!!" This twist just makes you think they're running out of ideas.

It helps to keep in mind that this is basically a big sociology and psychology experiment for the people running the show. They've hit a point where they can make a mistake or two, then correct it for the next season to keep interest going, so much of the time they're just messing with people to see what happens and hoping the results are enough fun for people to keep watching...

Galaril

03-09-2007, 03:05 PM

It helps to keep in mind that this is basically a big sociology and psychology experiment for the people running the show. They've hit a point where they can make a mistake or two, then correct it for the next season to keep interest going, so much of the time they're just messing with people to see what happens and hoping the results are enough fun for people to keep watching...

This is true. This show is a great big human dynamics sociolgy experiment. This is part of why I still watch the show and have learned some things myself about people and what motivates them. I bet the academia university Sociology/Pysch Professors love to analyze thsi show.

Ajaxab

03-09-2007, 04:11 PM

This is true. This show is a great big human dynamics sociolgy experiment. This is part of why I still watch the show and have learned some things myself about people and what motivates them. I bet the academia university Sociology/Pysch Professors love to analyze thsi show.

If you're interested in a sophisticated read about why people go on shows like Survivor, check out Mark Andrejevic's 'Reality TV: The Work of Being Watched'. It's definitely written for an academic audience, but a fascinating explanation of the reality tv phenomenon nonetheless.

BrianD

03-09-2007, 05:04 PM

In a way, the players aren't too much different from other seasons. What makes this season horrible is how lopsided the game is. Their twist of luxury vs. nothing stinks as much here as it does The Apprentice. In physical challenges, there's no way a tribe that has nothing and has eaten nothing can compete with a tribe that is well-fed and well-rested. Even in the mental challenges, their mind is going because of lack of food and good sleep. The producers have no one to blame but themselves.

This idea was pretty bad. The only way this works is if there is some amount of switching back and forth. Having the teams chosen by one player probably wasn't good, and letting things progress to the point where one team is so fatigued that they don't have a 30-second memory isn't going to help even things out. Even the contrived "give up your camp or go to tribal council" didn't work out. The producers took a big chance with this format and it seems to have backfired.

EagleFan

03-10-2007, 01:22 AM

It's like I said earlier: when an alliance gets arrogant early, it always backfires on them, as they drive out their alleged "tribemates" who realise they aren't making the final 4 or 5.

True. It just usually doesn't happen until at least after the merge. They (the bitchy women) are acting as if the final 5 is already set in stone and it's still far off. Have they not watched any of the previous seasons?

TazFTW

03-22-2007, 01:03 AM

Yes, Yau Man is on a winning tribe! Lisi and Rocky just keep on digging their Survivor graves.

Maple Leafs

03-22-2007, 08:34 AM

Lisi may be the worst player in the history of the game.

Rocky is a prick. Would have loved to see Anthony pull off the miracle and get Rocky booted. That episode was almost painful to watch from Anthony's perspective.

If Rocky's tribe keeps losing, can he break the record for "Most losses by a self-professed winner without it ever occuring to them that maybe they have something to do with it", previously held by Stephenie? That record was like Ty Cobb's hits record, you never though anyone could get close.

I'm warming up to this season... I think I can name about half the players by now. That one dude from the rich tribe who's now on the poor tribe seems like a good character now.

Lathum

03-22-2007, 09:08 AM

I really thought Rocky was gone. Now he has a good shot to make it to a merge and last alot longer.

Thomkal

03-22-2007, 10:02 AM

Yes that was one of the dumbest responses ever in Survivor history when Lisi reacted to not being picked. Sadly Rocky did not get voted off this week so now she will go to their tribe and they will have two loudmouthed obnoxious tribemates. I predict love at first sight between the two. :)

Have to say I loved loved loved the other tribe beating the all-men team. Not sure what the other tribe was thinking when they picked women over the stronger men.

Maple Leafs

03-22-2007, 10:05 AM

I love any Survivor episode where Probst visibly turns on one of the contestants.

BrianD

03-22-2007, 02:10 PM

I really kept hoping that Anthony would say he never had a chance to stand up for himself because Rocky never shut the hell up. Either that or claim that Rocky was just a reckless bull and it was much easier to side-step him as he goes crashing around mindlessly. He had the opportunity for a couple of good sharp come-backs, but I think he was unwilling to potentially alienate his tribe. Too bad he didn't know that had already happened.

BrianD

03-22-2007, 02:11 PM

I love any Survivor episode where Probst visibly turns on one of the contestants.

Then you must have loved this episode. He turned on two of them.

LloydLungs

03-22-2007, 02:18 PM

He had the opportunity for a couple of good sharp come-backs, but I think he was unwilling to potentially alienate his tribe.

I kept waiting for him to go, "Wait a minute, remind me again who has no social skills?" during Rocky's bizarre bull-in-a-china-shop diatribe, but the poor guy was flustered. I felt bad for him, but geez, even as someone who hates confrontation I thought he was pretty damn passive.

Maple Leafs

03-22-2007, 02:33 PM

Anthony's comeback should have been something along the lines of:
"You're calling me effeminate? You called out Dreamz in a challenge and got bitch-slapped in about three seconds. Way to get spanked like a girl on national television, tough guy."

BrianD

03-22-2007, 03:07 PM

TazFTW

03-30-2007, 01:05 AM

Yau-Man is awesome. I hope the fake idol gets found and is played.

saldana

03-30-2007, 06:16 AM

Yau-Man is awesome. I hope the fake idol gets found and is played.

if anyone finds that and tries to use it, it will instanly become the funniest moment in survivor history.

and i am sooooooooo glad that idiot got voted off...possibly my least favorite player ever, except for the annoying woman in the boy scout uniform.

and seeing as how that jackoff is the first member of the jury, looks like we have another 3 person final

Thomkal

03-30-2007, 06:31 AM

Yau-Man's planting of a fake idol may just be my favorite Survivor strategy move ever.

Very glad to see Rocky gone, wish he wasn't on the jury so we wouldn't have to see him till the reunion. Mookie can go next for making fun of Yau-Man during the reward challenge.

Galaril

03-30-2007, 08:35 AM

if anyone finds that and tries to use it, it will instanly become the funniest moment in survivor history.

and i am sooooooooo glad that idiot got voted off...possibly my least favorite player ever, except for the annoying woman in the boy scout uniform.

and seeing as how that jackoff is the first member of the jury, looks like we have another 3 person final

Yau-Man's planting of a fake idol may just be my favorite Survivor strategy move ever.

Very glad to see Rocky gone, wish he wasn't on the jury so we wouldn't have to see him till the reunion. Mookie can go next for making fun of Yau-Man during the reward challenge.

What is it with the producers of this show and always picking tools from Boston? Being from the Boston area it is pretty embarrassing to see Boston being represented by guys like "Boston Rob" and now Rocky.

Kodos

03-30-2007, 10:56 AM

At least Boston Rob had some redeeming qualities and was a good player. Rocky is just plain a jackass.

I also loved Yau-man's fake idol. I really hope somebody tries to use it. That would be hilarious.

Right now, I am rooting for

Yau-man
The guy he is allied with
The lawyer from the other tribe (I am horrible with names)

Toddzilla

03-30-2007, 11:00 AM

Yau-Man is awesome. I hope the fake idol gets found and is played.Instantly my favorite Survivor moment of all time.

LloydLungs

03-30-2007, 01:50 PM

You-Man is the greatest Survivor contestant in a long time. Some pure Jonny Fairplay deviousness on a sweet-natured old Asian guy. Damn.

EagleFan

03-30-2007, 08:32 PM

The only problem keeping the fake idol from coming into play is that only Yao Man and Earl know about the idol being on the island and they are the only two likely to continue to be sent to the island. Unless they put the merged tribe on the good island.

That being said, it is still my favorite move of all time. Go Yao Man and Earl.

FrogMan

03-30-2007, 08:55 PM

can't believe nobody commented on the spill that Michelle took down the platform. Man I had to replay it some 8 or 10 times in a row it was so funny. :D

FM

Lathum

03-30-2007, 08:58 PM

rocky has to be the dumbest contestant ever on this show.

kingfc22

03-31-2007, 01:50 AM

can't believe nobody commented on the spill that Michelle took down the platform. Man I had to replay it some 8 or 10 times in a row it was so funny. :D

FM

Yea, it was in the preview for the show all week and every time I saw it I was rolling.:D

Fake idol = pure comedy gold.

Dutch

03-31-2007, 02:10 AM

A fantastic episode all around.

I'm gonna miss Survivor if it goes away. Any word on it's future?

Lorena

03-31-2007, 08:45 AM

Yau-Man is awesome. I hope the fake idol gets found and is played.

I know Ant and I were rolling! In the event one is actually found and used, how will Yau and the other guy keep a straight face?

can't believe nobody commented on the spill that Michelle took down the platform. Man I had to replay it some 8 or 10 times in a row it was so funny. :D

FM

Oh god that was funny! "Slide left slide...." *splat*. She did a good job giving direction though.

I'm so glad Rocky's off, is he really in the jury? Damn, that sucks I'm so not looking forward to his little speech in the end. *ugh*

Maple Leafs

04-03-2007, 09:04 AM

I suggested the "fake idol" strategy to my wife during last season and she looked at me like I was an idiot. Thank you, yau-man, for helping me retroactively win an argument from six months ago!

TazFTW

04-06-2007, 12:55 AM

Yau Man owned their asses. :D

EagleFan

04-06-2007, 03:56 AM

Yau Man owned their asses. :D

Go Yau Man. He is quickly becoming one of my favorite Survivors ever.

Kodos

04-06-2007, 07:37 AM

I love how they cut to a shot of the guy who was mocking Yau Man every time he kicks their ass. Very satisfying. :)

wade moore

04-06-2007, 08:05 AM

Yau Man rules... At this point if it came down to Yau/Earl for the final 2 I would be ecstatic.

Mizzou B-ball fan

04-06-2007, 08:11 AM

I love how they cut to a shot of the guy who was mocking Yau Man every time he kicks their ass. Very satisfying. :)

My wife yelled, "Who's laughing now, you punk?!?!?!" at the TV when they showed that shot. :)

TazFTW

04-13-2007, 01:04 AM

I liked the team immunity challenge and sending the losers straight to tribal but I hate the end result.

gstelmack

04-13-2007, 09:40 AM

Dreamz is officially a moron. Seriously, you talk about how much you hate Stacy, how she'll be used against you in the final 5, you know Alex will screw you in the end, but yet you take Alex's hint and screw yourself by voting Michelle off? You had a shot for you and Mookie to become equal partners with Alex and Edgardo, and instead you drive Mookie back over to Earl's side (if Mookie is smart).

And the next episode should be interesting, with Dreamz fulfilling the prophecy...

kingfc22

04-13-2007, 05:10 PM

Dreamz and Mookie = A bunch of morons.

Mookie is an idiot for informing Dreamz of the idol and Mookie is just as bad for not voting out Stacy after he even mentioned how it would benefit him to vote her off.:rolleyes:

Maple Leafs

04-13-2007, 06:05 PM

I see where Dreamz is coming from... your "leader" has just told you to who to vote for. If you vote wrong and Mookie doesn't come along for the ride, you're done. He played it safe. It will probably turn out to be the wrong move but it's not like the decision was obvious.

Dreamz is kind of a neat character. It seems like he's never watched the show before, yet he has a gift for instantly reading people and understanding the basic concept of backstabbing.

TazFTW

04-13-2007, 06:43 PM

Mookie is just as bad for not voting out Stacy after he even mentioned how it would benefit him to vote her off.:rolleyes:

Mookie voted for Stacy.

Sublime 2

04-13-2007, 07:34 PM

Dreamz is kind of a neat character. It seems like he's never watched the show before, yet he has a gift for instantly reading people and understanding the basic concept of backstabbing.

I agree, I'm not exactly sure what I like about him, but I definitely liked the calling out of Lisi last week.

Atocep

04-13-2007, 07:44 PM

I agree, I'm not exactly sure what I like about him, but I definitely liked the calling out of Lisi last week.

I hadn't been checking this thread because I was a week behind watching the show, but now I'm caught up.

I've been amazed at how many people don't seem to care for him. He doesn't play the game very well, but he's an interesting character and is a lot smarter than he's given credit for being. He picks up details well and he reads the other players very well.

Lisi is my least favorite person on the show ever. I don't know why she was on the show, she wasn't there to even attempt to win. Everything she said annoyed the hell out of me.

Galaril

04-13-2007, 08:17 PM

Michelle was the only girl that was slightly interesting in the looks department left, a real cutie;)

kingfc22

04-13-2007, 09:56 PM

Mookie voted for Stacy.

I meant to write Dreamz. Ooops.

LloydLungs

04-13-2007, 10:12 PM

Michelle was the only girl that was slightly interesting in the looks department left, a real cutie;)

Yep. Michelle had the highest degree of adorable-osity since Elisabeth, although her persona was so girlish at times that I found myself being alternately attracted to her and suffering hallucinations of a grim-faced Chris Hansen standing in front of me.

Of course, Jessica (from my alma mater, UNO!) was the hottest and was out first. Stupid survivors. They need to consider these things...

wade moore

04-14-2007, 04:50 PM

I really hated Dreamz for the first few episodes, but every episode I like him more and more... a very intrigueing character that seems the least "fake" we've seen on the show in a long time...

mauchow

04-19-2007, 08:02 PM

That was the best tribal council EVAR.

I do feel bad for Edguardo though.. a little.

EagleFan

04-19-2007, 08:15 PM

I agree, that was about the best episode I have seen in a long time. I guess they could have trusted Dreamz after all, but who knew? I just hope Yau Man doesn;t start getting too cocky, he seemed a little bit cocky after the immunity win.

mauchow

04-19-2007, 08:37 PM

Rather than having to re-hide the immunity idol, I would hope they actually had an immunity idol out there hidden already... for this situation. although, I am surprised they're putting it back out into play anyways..

I wanted someone to find Yau-man's immunity.

Galaril

04-19-2007, 09:02 PM

I loved the look on Alex/Eduardo's faces when the first vote for Eduardo was read. Fucking priceless. It was the definiton of wiping a smile off someones face. Next week looks interesting but not really sure how Mookie and Alex can be much threat at this point.

Kodos

04-19-2007, 10:27 PM

I loved the look on Alex/Eduardo's faces when the first vote for Eduardo was read. Fucking priceless. It was the definiton of wiping a smile off someones face.

Agreed. Ever since they showed Mookie mocking Yau-man, I've been waiting for him to get his. Tonight was good.

TazFTW

04-20-2007, 01:18 AM

That was a great tribal council.

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/4039/survivor1el8.gif

Fouts

04-20-2007, 01:29 AM

saldana

04-20-2007, 04:17 AM

First episode I've caught in a few weeks and it was great. Dreamz has got to be one of the worst players I've ever seen, and he is doomed in this game.

Edit: I am refering to strategy regarding Dreamz. He has screwed himself with his alliance, and there is no room for him in the other alliance. He is doomed.

he is an utter idiot....there is absolutely zero chance for him to win this game....he fought with lisi, screwed alex, eduardo and mookie, and rocky never liked him to begin with...who exactly does he think is going to vote for him from the jury.

Maple Leafs

04-20-2007, 08:58 AM

Dreamz kicks ass. We've been waiting for how many seasons for somebody to come along and actually play the game, instead of hiding in an alliance like everyone else always does. I hope he goes far.

And as for "he can't win, the jury doesn't like him", we all know that all that goes out the window at vote time. The jury always works themselves into a later of self-pity and faux outrage, and whoever can soothe their egos the best will win. If Dreamz is up against soembody like Earl who'll call the losers on their hyprocisy, he could definitely win.

Edit: Every year there's somebody we're supposed to really like, and I always resist because it seems so contrived. But I can't fight it any more. Yau Man kicks ass. There, I said it.

Thomkal

04-20-2007, 09:02 AM

That was a great tribal council-the reactions from Alex, Edguardo, and Mookie when their plans went down the tube was one of the best moments in this and other Survivor. I only hope their plans next week concerning Yau-Man having the immunity idol work out equally as well. Loved Jeff rubbing it in by saying that Alex turned in the idol for nothing.

Dreamz certainly is screwed in this game, but that's the perfect reason to bring him along to the Final with you. So it wouldn't surprise me to see him last a lot longer. Though given how idiotic these guys have been (why vote out Cassandra when you can vote out their leader Earl?) it wouldn't surprise me if he goes next week. He should be good with the Earl alliance because he went and voted Mookie like they originally planned.

Always love the challenges where they force the players to reveal their thoughts about the other Survivors. Stacy must be feeling pretty low right now...and that was pretty awesome that Cassandra got them all right.

Thomkal

04-20-2007, 09:04 AM

Oh I heard on the radio that the next Survivor will be filmed in...China

FrogMan

04-20-2007, 09:25 AM

Oh I heard on the radio that the next Survivor will be filmed in...China

yes, they're leaving the island setup for the mainland...

FM

Galaril

04-20-2007, 12:37 PM

Atocep

04-20-2007, 01:29 PM

I just don't see what Dreamz was thinking, but he had screwed himself by staying inbetween the 2 alliances rather than side with one. I don't think what he did matters much in the long run. No one trusts him because they don't know what the hell he's thinking.

Earl has played it safe so far and I don't see that changing. He doesn't trust Dreamz at all (like everyone else), he's gone next episode. He has to be hoping for an incredible run of individual immunities.

Earl has played well so far. He has an alliance full of weaker players that he knows aren't a real threat to him and he can trust. Unless something really strange happens, Earl will at least make it down to the final 3. He's chosen his allies carefully.

Yau-man has been amazing. Just by looking at him you'd figure he'd have been gone in one of the first episodes, but he's kept attention away from himself while showing he has value in ways other than physical strength. He has the immunity idol and isn't seen as a threat to anyone right now. I could easily see him winning this.

Maple Leafs

04-20-2007, 01:43 PM

Totally disagree Dreamz has jumped the shark this week and has zero F@#$ing chance of getting to the final two.
He only needs to survive one or two more tribals before the game reaches the point where having no friends is actually a great way to get to the final two.

kingfc22

04-20-2007, 05:07 PM

That whole episode was one of the best I've ever seen on Survivor. I agree with most of the posts that Dreamz is pretty much screwed, but he could definately be dragged along as the others with power think they can get more votes than him in the end.

The reaction of the "4 Horseman" was priceless. Especially Mookie. HAHAHA

Now it will be interesting if the re-hidden idol comes back into play.

Maple Leafs

04-20-2007, 06:25 PM

Now it will be interesting if the re-hidden idol comes back into play.
Is it too much to ask that Mookie goes back and looks in the same spot, and finds Yao Man's fake idol?

mauchow

04-20-2007, 07:43 PM

Is it too much to ask that Mookie goes back and looks in the same spot, and finds Yao Man's fake idol?

considering they showed that alex finds yau man's real idol in the preview for next week, i doubt they'll be searching for anything.

saldana

04-20-2007, 07:46 PM

considering they showed that alex finds yau man's real idol in the preview for next week, i doubt they'll be searching for anything.

need a little work with that spoiler tag, doncha;)

Lathum

04-21-2007, 02:33 PM

I agree with all the things said about dreamz, he is a dumbass. It was greta to see those cocky morons get bitch slapped, easily one of the best episodes I have ever seen.

One thing I thought of. I think it would have been better for Yau to throw the immunity challenge. He was in no danger of being voted off and up until them everyone had under estimated him, he instantly became a threat when he won that so easily and he made himself a target IMO.

saldana

04-21-2007, 03:13 PM

Lathum

04-21-2007, 03:47 PM

he doesnt need to worry for at least 4 councils...they will vote off alex, mookie, and dreamz before they start fighting amongst themselves.

I understand that but you also know that there are certain challenges where you choose an opponent to knock out of the challenge like in this weeks reward challenge. Up until this point people would have left yau alone, now I am not so sure.

saldana

04-21-2007, 04:23 PM

I understand that but you also know that there are certain challenges where you choose an opponent to knock out of the challenge like in this weeks reward challenge. Up until this point people would have left yau alone, now I am not so sure.

good point...didnt think of that...i still dont think he needs to worry for a while...boo is easily the odd man out once the "four horseman" are all gone, then probably the oriental girl

Lathum

04-21-2007, 04:52 PM

good point...didnt think of that...i still dont think he needs to worry for a while...boo is easily the odd man out once the "four horseman" are all gone, then probably the oriental girl

true but when does the show ever seem to work out the way it should

BrianD

04-27-2007, 09:49 AM

This episode was a predictable letdown after the last one. Anybody have any thoughts about what happened to Boo's knee? From screaming in pain to running in 2 minutes seems odd.

Next episode could be interesting. Nice of Jeff to make sure everybody knows Alex is a swing-vote.

Lathum

04-27-2007, 10:02 AM

I agree, a very anti climatic episode.

Maple Leafs

04-27-2007, 10:26 AM

These are always the weakest episodes... once one alliance has established the numbers and starts picking guys off. This year they got lucky because the alliances were in flux until this week, so hopefully we only get one episode of obvious pickoffs.

Still, not really sure that Alex will be able to do much next week. The Earl/Yau/Cassandra alliance seems rock solid, so Alex would need to get Dreamz, Boo and that other chick to all unite and I don't see that working. First of all, Dreamz might not vote against Cassandra at all. And even if he was willing to, which alliance would you rather be in: the one with the elderly asian man and the overweight woman, or one with all the young athletic guys?

gstelmack

04-27-2007, 10:55 AM

I thought it was priceless to see Mookie and Alex have a plan all worked out and smiling, only to have it all come crashing down again when they discovered that Cassandra and Stacy were eavesdropping. You could have substituted their face shots for the one from last week's tribal council and not have been able to tell the difference.

On Boo's knee, it sounded like something popped out, then back in when he tested it. It kept bugging him for a while.

Joe

04-27-2007, 07:47 PM

Mookie is a dumbass for not voting Alex. Idiot.

EagleFan

04-27-2007, 10:16 PM

I loved how they seemed to honestly think they could try to play the "trust" card when they were the ones that went through someone else's stuff.

Overall this episode did suck though, very predictable.

BrianD

04-28-2007, 12:53 AM

I've never been a fan of the "I'm going to cause as much trouble as possible on the way out" plan. It never seems to do much other than provide some annoying TV. If these guys were at all smart, they would have started laying some foundation for becoming the swing vote. They could even have tried each approaching opposite sides of the big alliance offering to help them get ahead. Having a plan to get down to the final 6 isn't terribly helpful because you know there will be people working on getting down to a smaller final group.

Atocep

04-30-2007, 12:53 AM

As long as Earl is in power and calling the shots its going to be him, Yau-man, and Cassandra in the final 3. If Dreamz, Boo, and Stacy are smart they'll realize they're next if Alex goes and try to grab him as a swing vote.

I don't see them using that logic, though. I hope I'm wrong, but this looks like it could be a boring last few episodes unless someone gets immunity at the right time or something of that nature.

Toddzilla

04-30-2007, 07:16 AM

You gotta think that if Earl really is calling the shots, he's gonna get rid of YaoMan as soon as he can, since that guy is a lock to sweep the jury vote.

Tyrith

04-30-2007, 09:23 AM

You gotta think that if Earl really is calling the shots, he's gonna get rid of YaoMan as soon as he can, since that guy is a lock to sweep the jury vote.

Depends on how Earl has decided to play the game. He might be willing to stick with his buddy until the end.

Also, there's always the risk that Yau catches wind of the incoming attack and uses the idol to cause trickery -- and he seems much more likely to be able to use his idol effectively than the Bozo trio did.

Maple Leafs

04-30-2007, 01:24 PM

I think Earl probably sticks with his alliance of three until the end. He has to assume he can beat Cassandra and Earl in an endurance challenge*, at which point he can vote of Yau Man and set up the typical "alpha dog vs. coat-tail rider" final two. Ka-ching!

*Of course, this assumes the producers don't cheat like in past years and come up with some BS challenge to get their favorite into the final two.

Jeff: "For today's challenge, you will cook noodles in a wok."
Earl: "WTF?"

LloydLungs

04-30-2007, 01:51 PM

I'm assuming it's going to be a final three again, since the jury started forming at the same time as the Cook Islands jury. An Earl-YauMan-Cassandra final three would probably end up just like the CI finale, with Earl and Yau-Man battling out a 5-4 vote with the tagalong female getting shut out again. Yau-Man is awesome but I don't think he would sweep a vote against Earl by any means.

That said, it seems like a Dre-Stacy-Boo-Alex teamup this week should be a foregone conclusion. It's so obvious even Probst pretty much told them so.

BrianD

04-30-2007, 01:54 PM

That said, it seems like a Dre-Stacy-Boo-Alex teamup this week should be a foregone conclusion. It's so obvious even Probst pretty much told them so.

I would agree with this though, but it assumes that Dreamz understands that he is only going to be carried so far before he is cut loose. I don't think he gets that. He just isn't that smart.

Atocep

04-30-2007, 02:06 PM

Like I said earlier, Earl has surrounded himself very well. He has Yau-man, who is trying to just lay low into the final 3, and Cassandra, who really hasn't done much of anything, as his primary supporters. Alex is the only possible threat to him and he isn't much of one. Boo, Stacy, and Dreamz really don't seem to get that they're on the outside of the alliance and need to make a move now.

I think Earl wins a final vote against anyone thats still in the game. He's more or less controlled the game from the start without being overbearing about it.

gstelmack

04-30-2007, 02:12 PM

The great part is that most of the people who are out who were backstabbed to get out weren't backstabbed by Earl and Yau-Man. Seriously, who is going to get up there and scream at Earl, Yau-Man, and Cassandra that they screwed them over? We could have the most congenial Final Council yet, barring Dreamz getting a burr up his butt. Maybe Stacy if she isn't in the final 3?

Maple Leafs

04-30-2007, 04:31 PM

Why are we assuming that, if Alex is the swing vote, he won't side with Earl/Yau Man/Cassandra?

Antmeister

04-30-2007, 04:41 PM

I think it is still up in the air who will make the final 3. Although I think Earl and Yau-man will make it there, we can't forget that there will still be immunity challenges up to that point.

Atocep

04-30-2007, 05:03 PM

Why are we assuming that, if Alex is the swing vote, he won't side with Earl/Yau Man/Cassandra?

He could very well do that for the sake of self-preservation. However, if Stacy, Boo, or Dreamz want any shot at all at winning this, they need to grab Alex and knock Earl out now. I doubt Dreamz will vote for Cassandra and Yau-man has the idol.

The next episode will be interesting in the sense of we'll see if people are actually playing the game or if they're just going with the flow. If Alex is simply voted off it'll be a very boring last few episodes.

Antmeister

04-30-2007, 05:13 PM

He could very well do that for the sake of self-preservation. However, if Stacy, Boo, or Dreamz want any shot at all at winning this, they need to grab Alex and knock Earl out now. I doubt Dreamz will vote for Cassandra and Yau-man has the idol.

The next episode will be interesting in the sense of we'll see if people are actually playing the game or if they're just going with the flow. If Alex is simply voted off it'll be a very boring last few episodes.

Yeah, but let's assume that Earl and Yau-Man are sharing the idol. Heck, even if Earl pretends that the idol was handed to him, Alex, Boo, Dreamz and Stacy would still be screwed because they can't split the vote. They will have to know for sure who would be carrying that idol.

So to me, it would make sense for Alex to try to ally himself with Earl and the gang by trying to root Stacy out. He can definitely give example of how she played the game earlier and would have both Cassandra and Dreamz to vouch for him.

LloydLungs

04-30-2007, 07:46 PM

I would agree with this though, but it assumes that Dreamz understands that he is only going to be carried so far before he is cut loose. I don't think he gets that. He just isn't that smart.

He's not, although he's been talking about trying to work the jury and seems to be thinking several steps ahead to the endgame. At the same time, he's obviously inexperienced with this whole Survivor stuff and is still strategically erratic. Plus as someone else mentioned, the idol kind of complicates things, but I still think that has to be the play at this point. Seven is your last real chance to break up a virtually unbreakable power alliance of three.

BrianD

04-30-2007, 08:00 PM

He's not, although he's been talking about trying to work the jury and seems to be thinking several steps ahead to the endgame. At the same time, he's obviously inexperienced with this whole Survivor stuff and is still strategically erratic. Plus as someone else mentioned, the idol kind of complicates things, but I still think that has to be the play at this point. Seven is your last real chance to break up a virtually unbreakable power alliance of three.

He is thinking ahead, I'm just not sure he is thinking in the present. He absolutely needs to grab Alex and take down Earl and Yau-Man right now, but I'm not sure he sees that. I think he believes he has numbers somewhere, but he doesn't. I guess this next episode will tell us if he is worthy of the money.

Atocep

05-05-2007, 11:53 AM

Rather boring episode, as I expected. They drummed up more suspense than there actually was for Tribal Counsel. One thing Alex may have done is make Yau-man paranoid and he may make a move on his own now.

Stacy had a pathetic attempt to smooth things over with Alex in case she makes it to the final 2. Her and Boo had a chance to make a move and blew it. It shows that the only people playing the game right now are Earl and Yau-man, while Dreamz is trying but he's screwed so many people over for no real reason that he has zero chance of winning no matter who he's in the final 2 with.

wade moore

05-05-2007, 02:48 PM

I wasn't a huge Alex fan, but if he pulled off that maneuver I would have been rooting for him...

Too bad the other people are too stupid to realize there's no way they prevent Yau from the final 3 at this point.

Joe

05-05-2007, 03:38 PM

dont forget the finale is next sunday

Maple Leafs

05-06-2007, 08:41 PM

Dreamz is trying but he's screwed so many people over for no real reason that he has zero chance of winning no matter who he's in the final 2 with.
Not completely true... remember, no matter how many people you screw over you can still beat the woman who didn't do anything the entire game. I think he could beat Stacey, and maybe also Boo. Nobody else, though.

Edit: Even though he's played an almost perfect game so far, is anyone else getting that "he's going to find a way to blow it" vibe about Earl?

Glengoyne

05-06-2007, 09:33 PM

EagleFan

05-06-2007, 10:36 PM

Can somebody give a brief synopsis of a couple of shows I missed. Apparently the best episodes in some time.

The last episode I saw ended with a preview of Dreamz spilling the beans about the immunity idol. By the way Mookie was a moron.

Then I tuned in last week to see that Mookie and Edguardo were out with Alex on the hot seat.

Wha happened? Did Dreamz set them up to think that one of the idoled few was targetted, only to reverse psychology them? Who mastermided that move? If that was the play that is.

Not sure where to start with that episode. At least from the editing it was hard to see where Dreamz was aligning himself. He told the Earl / Yau Man alliance about Mookie having the idol. Later Earl stumbled upon him talking strategy with Alex (I believe it was Alex and not Mookie) so that cast a bit of doubt about him.

It seemed to be quite clear that the Earl alliance was targeting Alex so the idea came up to give Alex the idol. Somehow Mookie felt the best way to achieve this was to try to hand him the idol while in camp, instead of walking away for a bit (not sure how that brilliant move was formulated). Dremz saw the exchange and told Earl.

Stacey somehow ended up joining the Earl alliance as she seemed to not trust Alex and Mookie. After there was a decision to vote for Mookie to there was some concern that Dreamz was playing them and if Mookie still had the idol they would be screwed. Because of this Stavey actually came up with a good idea to vote Edguardo and they didn't tell Dreamz to be safe.

The best tribal council then followed. Between the cocky look from Alex when he stood up and played the idol (thinking they had just pulled off a major shift) to the concerned look on Mookie's face when his name was read early (Dreamz vote) to the complete shock with the quick chain of Edguardo votes. The Alex alliance was completely blown away at that point.

Some interesting "story twisting" happened the following episode with Dreamz trying to tell Alex and Mookie that he didn't betray them.

Atocep

05-07-2007, 12:06 AM

Edit: Even though he's played an almost perfect game so far, is anyone else getting that "he's going to find a way to blow it" vibe about Earl?

The only way I see Earl losing at this point is if Yau-man backstabs him, which could very well happen since he made it clear last episode that his priority is winning the game (not friendships) and he has to think Earl could pretty much beat anyone in the final 2.

I'm amazed at the lack of people playing the game this late in the season. Cassandra hasn't done anything, yet there's a chance she could win because she's riding Earl's coattails. Stacy has done just as little, is aligned poorly, yet the only attempt she's made at playing the game was her piss poor attempt to smooth things over with Alex. Boo, I don't what the hell he's doing.

This season is set up to have such a boring ending that I keep thinking in the back of my mind that something big HAS to happen. It can't be as simple as Earl, Cassandra, Yau-man in the final three.

SteelerFan448

05-07-2007, 03:56 PM

EagleFan

05-07-2007, 05:55 PM

I am getting rather bored with the past few seasons having a couple of strong players, then some women ride their coattails right to the end and then have no shot. It is a great strategy that has somewhat worked, but I would like to see some sort of change in the game to bring more strategy and backstabbing into the game.

I would like to see them go with everyone on the same beach, no tribes. Then randomly pick different teams (2 or 3) for each and every challenge. This way the players have no idea in advance who they will need to allign with if they get to a tribal council.

Another idea may be the immediate tribal council after the challenge but this time make them vote first and then ask the questions before reading the votes.

Maple Leafs

05-07-2007, 07:14 PM

I'm amazed at the lack of people playing the game this late in the season. Cassandra hasn't done anything, yet there's a chance she could win because she's riding Earl's coattails.
I don't know, I feel like Cassandra is playing more than you think. She's very good at listening to someone's plan, nodding seriously, and then backstabbing them (with the rest of her alliance). She's even done OK in challenges, given her physical abilities. She's not playing all out, but she's better than Stacey.

SteelerFan448

05-07-2007, 07:37 PM

I would like to see them go with everyone on the same beach, no tribes. Then randomly pick different teams (2 or 3) for each and every challenge. This way the players have no idea in advance who they will need to allign with if they get to a tribal council.

Another idea may be the immediate tribal council after the challenge but this time make them vote first and then ask the questions before reading the votes.

Pretty good ideas. They need to add another major twist to change how the game needs to be played. Your ideas could work, even if they only did it a couple of times throughout the game.

Sublime 2

05-10-2007, 07:18 PM

Yau-man is the shit!

EagleFan

05-10-2007, 08:11 PM

Stacy got what she deserved. If she doesn;t go on talking like that at council he may not play the idol.

Of course Dreamz planted the initial seed when he told Yau Man that he was on to his strategy.

Jas_lov

05-10-2007, 08:12 PM

Yau is brilliant. He made all the right moves in this episodes making the deal with Dreams and using his immunity idol when he would have been voted out 4-2. He just needs to get past the next tribal council and it will be impossible not to vote for him in the finals because he's played the best game by far. Now that Earl has the other immunity he can give it to Yau at the next tribal council because he'll be the target again with Dreams wanting Yau out so he doesn't have to live up to the deal. Boo and Cassandra obviously want Yau out because he'll be hard to beat in the final. The final 4 might be interesting because Cassandra turned on the alliance tonight and she might convince Earl to turn on Yau because Earl would easily beat any of the remaining players other than Yau in the final.

Bisbo

05-10-2007, 10:27 PM

This has turned out to be one of the most interesting seasons in the history of the show, and Yau-man is one of the savviest players the game has ever seen. And Eagle Fan, you are right - if dumbass Stacey didn't flap her gums, Yau might not have played the idol (although I think he knew he had too anyway).

Kodos

05-10-2007, 10:56 PM

I like how they likely showed footage of Yau listening to Jeff talk without the audio on so it looked like he was pondering for a long time.

Yau-Man rocks.

Atocep

05-10-2007, 11:47 PM

I don't think what Stacy said affected anything. I'm fairly sure the 'reactions' we saw after she said that were some creative editing and I think there was more to that episode than what we saw. There was a noticable lack of footage of Cassandra and Dreamz talking with Earl, which if it was because they were avoiding him, then that would have been a much bigger tipoff than what Stacy said.

Dreamz and Yau both did well in their deal. Dreamz has very little chance of winning if he makes it to the final two anway. He makes sure he walks away with something.

TazFTW

05-11-2007, 12:58 AM

Yau-man is the shit!

Indeed.

I'm still waiting for the fake idol to be played. :(

Fouts

05-11-2007, 06:51 AM

Yau is one of the greatest Survivor players ever. I just watched the episode on Innertube and kept egging him on to use it, and wham there it is. He deserves to win it all, and I hope he does.

I wonder what Cassandra will do now. Will she go back with Earl and Yau or will she make a new alliance with Dreamz and Boo? Problem is that she can't really trust Boo and Dreamz is flakey.

I'm pretty sure Earl will give Yau the idol since Yau gave him the clue to find it and they've been allied all this way.

Going to be an interesting finale.

BrianD

05-11-2007, 07:51 AM

gstelmack

05-11-2007, 08:33 AM

I'm pretty sure Earl will give Yau the idol since Yau gave him the clue to find it and they've been allied all this way.

Earl won't just give it to him, Earl wants in to the final four as well. So the play is either:

Earl takes this shot to get rid of Yau-Man, his biggest competition for winning the million, or

Earl gives Yau-Man the idol, but the two of them play up that Earl still has it, with Yau-Man maneuvering and digging and doing his best to act scared, or

One of the two wins immunity so they both have immunity. If Earl wins immunity, he hands Yau-Man the necklace and plays his idol. If Yau-Man wins, they are set.

I don't think option 1 is a good one for Earl, as he's got a target as well and is actually a likely vote-out at the four. I think his best bet is working with Yau-Man all the way to the final three (and I think it is Yau-Man's as well, since they have the biggest targets) and then taking his chances with the jury.

Fouts

05-11-2007, 08:34 AM

It sure seemed like both Dreamz and Stacey gave that one away. Dreamz telling Yau that he knew his strategy was dumb, and Stacey saying that she didn't want to go home but just couldn't find the numbers was also dumb. They got Yau nervous at camp and then totally scared him at tribal. The person I feel worst for is Cassandra. I haven't been impressed with the way she has played so far, but she made a necessary move last night...but her partners were too dumb to pull it off.

Yep. Stacey saying she thought the vote would be split gave it all away. Pretty dumb, but I think Yau was onto something by then.

I think Cassandra knows she can't really beat Earl or Yau in the jury vote. I'm not sure how any of the jury members can have anything against Earl or Yau at this point (besides getting beat by them).

gstelmack

05-11-2007, 08:37 AM

I think Cassandra knows she can't really beat Earl or Yau in the jury vote. I'm not sure how any of the jury members can have anything against Earl or Yau at this point (besides getting beat by them).

I think this is what makes Earl and Yau so brilliant. They haven't had to backstab ANYBODY at this point (even Stacy knew she was next, and was beat by the idol). They kept making the plays they needed to with now two correct idol plays while getting everyone else to screw over each other. And now that the other four all voted for Yau-Man, no one can scream that they got backstabbed, as they tried it first. Even if they vote out Cassandra next, she has no leg to stand on after this episode.

This seriously could be the most boring final tribal ever except for the always-present insane jury member...

LloydLungs

05-11-2007, 09:38 AM

This seriously could be the most boring final tribal ever except for the always-present insane jury member...

I'm sure several of them will find some catty stuff to say. Basically my least favorite part of Survivor has become the jury questions. I had really hoped that with 10+ seasons having aired, the show would have matured beyond "Ahh! You backstabbed me! Honesty! Integrity! Lies! Waaaah!" and more to an appreciation of game strategy/performance. Unfortunately, everyone is still hung up on the honesty/integrity crap spurred on by Richard Hatch's win (I always wonder how much the course of the show would have changed if Kelly Wiglesworth had won that first season).

There have been several jury segments where people just lash out at the finalists and I've wondered where the hell that came from, but it seems like something jurists feel obligated to do now even if the finalists haven't done anything particularly egregious. Sue Hawk's speech was great, but everyone who has tried to imitate her for 13 seasons have not been.

Glengoyne

05-11-2007, 11:47 AM

Yau is a Survivor All Star without a doubt. He has been fantastic, and last night he made all the right moves.

He does have a target on his back, and I'm not sure Earl will help him out. If Earl does help Yau get through this next coucil, and both he and Yau are sitting before the jury, then I think it shapes up to be the best pairing in a final to date. These two will essentially both be deserving of the win.

Maple Leafs

05-11-2007, 08:53 PM

Should be a great final episode.

My thoughts below aren't actually spoilers, but may trigger an "oh yeah, forgot about that" moment that some would like to avoid.

Remember in the preview for this season, which was shown at the end of last season, they mentioned a player making "a decision that will have all of America talking"? We haven't seen that yet, at least that I can remember. Anyone else think it may be Dreamz winning the final four immunity and then refusing to give it to Yau?

Richard Weed

05-11-2007, 09:12 PM

I read about a month ago that the final three are Earl, Cassandra, and Dreamz, with the final four being Yao Man as well. Seems as if that's going to happen.

Joe

05-11-2007, 09:31 PM

Maple Leafs

05-12-2007, 11:31 AM

I thought that might have been what happened last night.
It's possible... although now that I think about it...

... maybe it makes more sense that the "decision" is actually Dreamz giving up the immunity even though he knows he'll be voted out. We assume the decision will be a negative one but maybe it's him choosing to honor his word over a chance to win a million dollars.

Joe

05-12-2007, 11:34 AM

well in one of the previews it looked like

Dreamz had the immunity necklace.. at one point anyway. Unknown if that is in the tribal council for the 5 or the 4. Or the 3 if it is only a final 2 this year.

mauchow

05-13-2007, 08:35 PM

Nice move.. I won't say anything for now.

Jas_lov

05-13-2007, 08:39 PM

Nice move.. I won't say anything for now.

Could be, if he wins. If not then he went back on his word and didn't win the million. I hope Earl wins, he deserves it. Cassandra just tagged along and she said in her opening statement she never wavered from the alliance. What about the final 6 vote? I hope Yau Man mentions that.

mauchow

05-13-2007, 08:41 PM

Cassandra may have been the worst challenge player I've ever seen before. I can't think of previous seasons, but her play during the challenges baffled me at how unathletic, unsmart, un anything and everything she was... and she'll be this year's 'no vote' person.

Jas_lov

05-13-2007, 08:56 PM

Not looking good for Dreamz. He betrayed the 4 horsemen and they let him know it so I don't see him getting any of their votes or Yau's or Boo's. Earl seemed to come off the best of the 3.

mauchow

05-13-2007, 09:00 PM

I will laugh if Cassandra gets a vote.

mauchow

05-13-2007, 09:06 PM

As it probably should be.

Jas_lov

05-13-2007, 09:10 PM

Good. Dreamz should have known he had no chance in the finals with 4 people he backstabbed in the jury. I hope Jeff asks how many jury members would have voted for Yau Man over Earl. Would have been interesting to see if it was split since they played the same game, except Yau won immunities and found 1 hidden one and gave 1 to Earl.

Mota

05-13-2007, 09:23 PM

This was a pathetic final 3. It's a travesty that 2 of the 3 people made it anywhere near the final 3, I think that Cassandra and Dreamz are 2 of the least intelligent people ever to be on Survivor.

Cassandra did absolutely nothing the entire game. I guess she played with "integrity", because she didn't betray anybody, or make any decisions for that matter.

Dreamz proved to the entire world exactly why he was homeless in the first place. His word is no good, and this "strategy" move was so poor that he virtually guaranteed himself to not get any votes in the end. What is better, to end up in 4th and have integrity, or be in 3rd and be hated by everyone? If you screw people over you have to make sure you're in a position to win.

Earl deserved the win, he was a strong player all along and really did guide Yau-Man through a lot of things during the game. He really did make things happen throughout the game.

Do I blame Yau-Man for setting himself up for betrayal? No, but I think he made a key mistake in the end. It was because he let Dreamz feel that if he gave up the idol, that he would be voted out. A seperate deal should have been made that if he kept his word, then Yau-Man would not vote for him. But Dreamz had his back against the wall and make a wrong decision. As it was said so many times during the season, he would get the sympathy vote, but by making such a public betrayal (and the enormity of this decision was played up tremendously by Jeff), that any of these votes would be lost.

wade moore

05-13-2007, 09:43 PM

Dreamz was one of the best survivor players at reading people ever imo. And he is one of the few to actually grab the game by the balls and make several moves and make it to the finals.

Going back on his word against Yau was the only thing that made sense. To not do that is just stupid. He at least had a CHANCE at a million that way, if he gives it to Yau he has no chance at a million.

And yes, it is Yau's fault he wasn't in the finals. He could have not made it so painfully obvious that he was voting of Dreamz, or hell - take Dreamz with him.

Yau has no one to blame but himself.

Jas_lov

05-13-2007, 09:59 PM

I'm not sure if Yau says he'll take Dreamz with him that he'd give immunity to him. Yau was perceived to have been the best player and Dreamz best shot to win was to vote him out. Yau should have tried to make a backup plan if Dreamz kept the idol and went to Earl to ask him to vote Cassandra. Earl still probably doesn't in his own self interest, but Yau should have tried bringing up their friendship, him telling Earl where the hidden idol was, etc. But Yau admitted he made a mistake in trusting Dreamz to keep his word on the reunion show.

General Mike

05-13-2007, 10:06 PM

Dreamz sold his soul for less than 20K.

Yau was the best player this season, but as we have seen many times before, the best player rarely wins.

Mota

05-13-2007, 10:14 PM

Dreamz sold his soul for less than 20K.

Yau was the best player this season, but as we have seen many times before, the best player rarely wins.

That's the biggest problem with Survivor, IMO. The best player rarely wins. The game was designed to go that way. Although I do believe that the top 3 making the final tribal council does help, as you don't get that final vote where they always bring along the weakest person to go up against.

It's the required strategic move for the player, but the producers of the show had to realize this, how it creates a disapointing final and often a disapointing winner, and they had to change things up.

wade moore

05-13-2007, 10:17 PM

Dreamz sold his soul for less than 20K.

Yau was the best player this season, but as we have seen many times before, the best player rarely wins.

Sold his soul? A bit of hyperbole, eh?

And umm... doesn't 2nd place get 100k? So even if they split it, that's 50k.

LloydLungs

05-13-2007, 10:18 PM

Going back on his word against Yau was the only thing that made sense. To not do that is just stupid. He at least had a CHANCE at a million that way, if he gives it to Yau he has no chance at a million.

Not really -- he had absolutely no shot at the million getting to the final 3 in that manner.

I would've taken Yau aside and said "I'll keep my word IF you agree to vote Cassandra and not me." You force a 2-2 tie with a complete incompetent to whom you couldn't lose a fire challenge if you tried... you get into the finals with Earl and Yau, hope that maybe they split the "best player" votes enough to where maybe you can scrounge up enough sympathy votes to win.

It's an extreme long shot, but it's better than the fantasy that you can find five people who would vote for you over Earl after that sorry display.

One other thing... I KNEW the jury would have a couple of idiots that would be all angry for no reason. Always my least favorite part of Survivor, the jury members that aren't really that mad but have the whole "this is the last time I'll ever be on TV and I'm gonna make it count" thing going on. Jesus, give it a rest already. Everybody lies, that's the fucking game. How many seasons in are we? They know that.

EagleFan

05-13-2007, 10:26 PM

Going back on his word against Yau was the only thing that made sense. To not do that is just stupid. He at least had a CHANCE at a million that way, if he gives it to Yau he has no chance at a million.

As it showed, he had no chance by making that move (with anything short of Earl going haywire in the final tribal counsil and saying F U to the entire jury.

The only chance he would have is if he kept his word and talked his way into not being voted off. That would have given him some very good karma in the final vote and maybe swayed a few votes his way.

Dreamz was also pretty much for of crap when he kept saying that he was playing the game the entire time with the truck deal. As we saw, he didn't realize until later after the deal just what Yau Man was up to with the deal and his constant references to his son seeing him keep his word also showed that (most of those references were in the "confessional" portions or when it was just him and Cassandra (the person who was supposed to be "in on it" with him about the move).

I must say it was a rather entertaining round of jury questions. I predicted an Earl sweep once Dreamz made "the move" and the line of jury questions pretty much solidified my opinion on that.

mauchow

05-13-2007, 10:27 PM

Not really -- he had absolutely no shot at the million getting to the final 3 in that manner.

I would've taken Yau aside and said "I'll keep my word IF you agree to vote Cassandra and not me." You force a 2-2 tie with a complete incompetent to whom you couldn't lose a fire challenge if you tried... you get into the finals with Earl and Yau, hope that maybe they split the "best player" votes enough to where maybe you can scrounge up enough sympathy votes to win.

It's an extreme long shot, but it's better than the fantasy that you can find five people who would vote for you over Earl after that sorry display.

One other thing... I KNEW the jury would have a couple of idiots that would be all angry for no reason. Always my least favorite part of Survivor, the jury members that aren't really that mad but have the whole "this is the last time I'll ever be on TV and I'm gonna make it count" thing going on. Jesus, give it a rest already. Everybody lies, that's the fucking game. How many seasons in are we? They know that.

Stop! Stop talking! Stop it! STOP!

LloydLungs

05-13-2007, 10:29 PM

Stop! Stop talking! Stop it! STOP!

:D

Lathum

05-13-2007, 10:29 PM

Dreamz handed Earl a million dollars the second he screwed Yau. It was kind of crappy, a yau-Earl showdown would have been better then the foregone conclusion.

Thomkal

05-13-2007, 10:44 PM

Dreamz really did blow it there at the end. He could have honored the deal with Yau-Man like he said would but made another deal to keep himself in the game like Lloyd said. I think Yau-Man would have gone for it since Dreamz was going to live up to his part of the deal.

That would have made him look good in the eyes of the jury, getting a truck and a spot in the Final 3 out of the deal he made with Yau-Man. He could have pointed out how his betrayal of his original alliance with the other "Horsemen" was because he was the low Horsemen on the totem pole because they never really involved him in their strategies and needed to make a move. He could have mentioned he was the architect of the plan that nearly got Yau-Man voted out and probably would have got respect for that.

But instead he made some incredibly bad decisions and statements over the deal and it cost him more than just the million dollars he lost. Sadly I think we'll hear in a year or two some bad story concerning him instead of a positive good story it could have been had he lived up to the deal.

Cassandra was perhaps the most worthless Survivor ever. From her abysmal performance in challenges to her never making strategies on her own, to her incessant, "hmmm" in response to any question or thoughts on strategy people asked her of. The fact that she was nearly completely ignored on the reunion show when she was one of the Final 3 shows what little affect she had on the game.

And I hate the reunion show a little bit more and more each season because they try to cram about 30 minutes of questions into a hour. Drives me crazy when they go to commercial, come back 3 minutes later with that little blurb that they will be right back and go to more commercials. I would have liked to heard much more from some people, and some big events like when Edguardo was eliminated was mostly ignored other than to say Dreamz betrayed them. They really should have replayed that so we could have laughed at their facial expressions again. :)

johnnyshaka

05-13-2007, 10:50 PM

Alex = Lisi = Jackass

Lathum

05-13-2007, 10:50 PM

Lisi is really unattractive

mauchow

05-13-2007, 10:53 PM

Lisi is really unattractive

Shut up, stop it. I said stop talking. Stop it! STOP!

General Mike

05-13-2007, 11:05 PM

Sold his soul? A bit of hyperbole, eh?

And umm... doesn't 2nd place get 100k? So even if they split it, that's 50k.

2nd place gets $100K, 3rd place gets either $85K or $90K. 4th place has to be getting somewhere in the 75K neighborhood. Is it worth looking like a jackass for $20K more? Dreams can't be that big of an idiot to think he had any shot of a million after already screwing 3 members of the jury.

wade moore

05-13-2007, 11:15 PM

2nd place gets $100K, 3rd place gets either $85K or $90K. 4th place has to be getting somewhere in the 75K neighborhood. Is it worth looking like a jackass for $20K more? Dreams can't be that big of an idiot to think he had any shot of a million after already screwing 3 members of the jury.

Are you sure on those numbers?

And again - I don't think he looked like a jackass. And even if he did, yes, it's worth $20k more.

Atocep

05-14-2007, 12:20 AM

I can't believe anyone is ripping Dreamz for his decision. Its a damn game and the point is to get as far as you can. Simple as that. Dreamz would have been an idiot to hand the immunity over when Yau-man is working on getting him voted off as soon as he gives it to him.

I was all over dreamz for being a bad player earlier in this thread, but I'm going to give him a lot of credit for getting further in the game than anyone imagined. He was a very memorable character in an otherwise boring season.

Lisi, wtf? She asked about water shoes? Thats the best question she could come up with? Also, how in the hell could she call Cassandra unprepared when she quit?

And yes, holding onto immunity is well worth $20k. Yau-man played well for the most part, but making that deal with Dreamz was one of the stupidest moves I can remember. In a game about deception you can't bank on someone holding up their word.

TazFTW

05-14-2007, 02:18 AM

Wow, Alex was a bigger bitch than Lisi. I'm disappointed that Yau didn't win or even make the final. I would have been extremely happy if there would have been a Yau vs Earl final. It didn't happen, so I guess I can be happy with Earl sweeping the votes.

Fouts

05-14-2007, 02:19 AM

Wow. People are defending Dreamz and badmouthing Yau for Dreamz screwing him over. Just amazing.

My integrity wouldn't be worth it. I wouldn't care what anyone else thought, it would be what I thought of myself. That said, Earl had the best answer - I wouldn't have gotten myself into the situation.

Either way, Dreamz had no shot at the million. I hope he doesn't think less of himself while he's driving the new truck. Earl was the second best player this season, and he deserved the money.

Vinatieri for Prez

05-14-2007, 02:33 AM

My thoughts for what their worth.

I actually love the angry jury questions. It's hilarioius watching those guys make fools of themselves (this year we got the triple bill with Lisi, Alex and Boo). Did anyone else find Lisi's eeny meeny miny mo gig to three African Americans to be racist or was I reading way too much into that? It had to at least been poor judgment. And then the direct stab at Dreamz's intelligence? I found Lisi to be the stupidest player on the show this season by far.

I love how some of you claim the best player rarely wins Survivor and that Yau was the best this year. Hello? The best player is the one who wins. I mean that is the goal here. Yau was good, not the best. You do know that Earl never had his name written down, never won an immunity, and skated to a 9-0 vote in the final.

wade moore

05-14-2007, 05:19 AM

My integrity wouldn't be worth it.

game1 http://cache.lexico.com/g/d/premium.gif http://cache.lexico.com/dictionary/graphics/luna/thinsp.pnghttp://cache.lexico.com/g/d/speaker.gif (https://secure.reference.com/premium/login.html?rd=2&u=http%3A%2F%2Fdictionary.reference.com%2Fbrowse%2Fgame) /geɪm/ Pronunciation Key (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/) - Show Spelled Pronunciation (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/)[geym] Pronunciation Key (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/) - Show IPA Pronunciation (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/) noun, adjective, gam·er, gam·est, verb, gamed, gam·ing. –noun <table class="luna-Ent"><tbody><tr><td class="dn" valign="top">1.</td><td valign="top">an amusement or pastime</td></tr></tbody></table>

Pumpy Tudors

05-14-2007, 07:24 AM

I didn't watch any of Survivor this season except for the finale. Even though I'm sure there's a lot of stuff I don't know about, I think they did a good job of recapping the "big" stories to a new person like me. I felt like I had a good idea of what had gone on just by watching the two hours before the reunion show.

Anyway, I thought it was fun, although I don't have much opinion on any of the contestants because I wasn't watching all season. I don't understand Lisi's question about the water shoes, but it looks like other people don't understand that either.

Richard Weed

05-14-2007, 07:28 AM

Dreamz was one of the best survivor players at reading people ever imo. And he is one of the few to actually grab the game by the balls and make several moves and make it to the finals.
Agreed; however, Yau-Man was spot on when he said at the reunion show that Dreamz was undisciplined in his thinking. Dreamz did not play the final tribal council well and he would not admit that he changed his mind...even at the reunion show. What's funny is that nobody called him out for crying when he kept the immunity necklace.
This was a pathetic final 3. It's a travesty that 2 of the 3 people made it anywhere near the final 3, I think that Cassandra and Dreamz are 2 of the least intelligent people ever to be on Survivor.
I disagree. They were intelligent, but perhaps not deserving.

All in all, Earl made the right moves and played almost a perfect game of Survivor.

Fouts

05-14-2007, 07:45 AM

game1 http://cache.lexico.com/g/d/premium.gif http://cache.lexico.com/dictionary/graphics/luna/thinsp.pnghttp://cache.lexico.com/g/d/speaker.gif (https://secure.reference.com/premium/login.html?rd=2&u=http%3A%2F%2Fdictionary.reference.com%2Fbrowse%2Fgame) /geɪm/ Pronunciation Key (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/) - Show Spelled Pronunciation (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/)[geym] Pronunciation Key (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/) - Show IPA Pronunciation (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/) noun, adjective, gam·er, gam·est, verb, gamed, gam·ing. –noun <table class="luna-Ent"><tbody><tr><td class="dn" valign="top">1.</td><td valign="top">an amusement or pastime</td></tr></tbody></table>

Ok. So how is giving your word in a game any different? It isn't for me.

Mizzou B-ball fan

05-14-2007, 08:05 AM

Questions for the group:

I feel there's little doubt that Dreamz fell victim to greed in the end and had no intent originally to betray Yau-man from the start.

1. Should Yau-man have stated that it was an either/or situation where if Dreamz won the immunity and decided not to give it back, that Dreamz had to give back the truck? If Yau-man did that, would he have looked greedy and lost some clout that would have lost him votes?

2. Would Yau-man have made it to the final 3 if he would have never made the deal and just played out the game?

FWIW......I would have gifted the truck much as Yau-man did. Also, I'm not sure there's ever been a more likable person than Yau-man on the series. He likely is going to give the series a good boost as well as people really were attracted to his personality and how he played the game.

Fouts

05-14-2007, 08:44 AM

My thoughts:

1. No. I don't think Yau wanted to give Dreamz a way to get out of the deal.

2. No. I know the deal put a target on him, but I don't think Earl and Cassandra wanted to go up against him before that happened.

Where Yau made a mistake was not having a backup plan in case Dreamz backed out. I might have gone to Dreamz and said if you vote for Cassandra, you can keep the necklace and your integrity.

Mizzou B-ball fan

05-14-2007, 08:47 AM

Where Yau made a mistake was not having a backup plan in case Dreamz backed out. I might have gone to Dreamz and said if you vote for Cassandra, you can keep the necklace and your integrity.

Yeah, Yau-man kind of hinted at that in the wrap-up show. He said that he was a bit hard-headed in the end and should have allowed himself to think that things weren't going to work out in order to make alternate plans. He allowed a bit too much trust to creep in at the most inopportune time.

I agree with your responses. I think Yau-man's strategy was doomed to come up one move short either way.

Kodos

05-14-2007, 09:09 AM

Yep. I really couldn't understand why Yau didn't team up with Dreamz to vote for Cassandra.

Maple Leafs

05-14-2007, 09:24 AM

Great final episode. I enjoyed the season.

People are taking the Dreamz/Yau thing way to personally. I was surprised he didn't keep his word, but it's a game of deception and he was playing it hard. And the fact that there was a final three instead of two was important new information that he didn't have initially.

Folks, Yau seemed like a cool guy but remember that you're watching a show that is going to present the characters however it wants. If you're really upset that Yau didn't win, it's because Mark Burnett wanted you to be. In hindsight the whole season was building towards getting you to feel that way.

And I'd argue that Earl was actually a better play than Yau, if you don't factor in some sort of bonus points for Yau being old... In any event I'm happy to see the recent streak of deserving players continue.

Atocep

05-14-2007, 11:15 AM

I also think Earl outplayed Yau. Earl controlled the alliance Yau-man was in from the begining and played flawlessly. I didn't see Earl make a single mistake while Yau-man made the biggest mistake of the season when he made the deal with Dreamz. Dreamz had already turned on Mookie, Edgardo, and Alex and you're going to make that deal with him?

You can't bring up integrity in a game like this. No one goes into survivor thinking they're going to be the first person to win without having to screw people over to get there. IMO, Earl screwed Yau-man over worse than Dreamz and no one has really mentioned that. Earl did what he had to in order to win, just like everyone else did.

This is a gameshow that is based on lying and deception. Its not a reflection of real life so I just don't see how integrity or any personal values come into play.

johnnyshaka

05-14-2007, 11:40 AM

If Dreamz was so smart and playing the game from the get-go, like he claims, then how in the hell did he expect to get one single vote during the finale regardless of his opponent playing the way he did?

As for Yau being portrayed as a "nice guy"...I hardly doubt it...most of the cast, especially Earl, seemed to genuinely like him during the finale.

Vinatieri for Prez

05-14-2007, 11:57 AM

Ok. So how is giving your word in a game any different? It isn't for me.

Um, have you ever played a game like Risk? People backstab all the time on deals. I did it to my friends about a half a million times. Amazingly, we're still friends.

As to your direct question. Because it's a game. I don't know how to say it any simpler than that. Every single complainer on that jury was a hypocrite because they all backstabbed. In fact, I believe jokers like Alex lost a lot more integrity with the high and mighty approach at the interviews than Dreamz ever will. Please note that when the Yau truck deal was made. Yau knew from day one of the deal it was not binding.

As smart as he was up until final 4, he was very dumb at that point not making a deal or making Dreamz feel he was not on the chopping block. As a result, he did not deserve to win. Earl was by far the better player.

johnnyshaka

05-14-2007, 12:04 PM

IMO, Earl screwed Yau-man over worse than Dreamz and no one has really mentioned that. Earl did what he had to in order to win, just like everyone else did.

Earl never said he'd bring Yau to the final two. He always maintained that it was every man for himself once the final four hit but everybody knew that Yau would be the odd man out by that time because you'd be silly to keep him around instead of Dreamz and Cassandra...Yau knew that too and that's why he made the deal with Dreamz. Who knew that being given a brand new truck wasn't enough to keep your word...especially when Dreamz didn't have a chance in hell to win...wow!!

It's funny, a lot of people are saying that Dreamz was just playing the game and that integrity shouldn't come into play...well, so is Bonds...he's just playing a game, too.

rkmsuf

05-14-2007, 12:08 PM

Why does cheerleanding guy get to keep the truck anyway? He didn't fulfil his part of the contract. Can't Yau Ming Man say f u I'm keeping it?

Maybe they explained this somewhere...I missed it.

Vinatieri for Prez

05-14-2007, 12:12 PM

Why does cheerleanding guy get to keep the truck anyway? He didn't fulfil his part of the contract. Can't Yau Ming Man say f u I'm keeping it?

Maybe they explained this somewhere...I missed it.

Yau-man didn't want it back.

Vinatieri for Prez

05-14-2007, 12:12 PM

It's funny, a lot of people are saying that Dreamz was just playing the game and that integrity shouldn't come into play...well, so is Bonds...he's just playing a game, too.

I'm astounded you don't know the difference.

rkmsuf

05-14-2007, 12:14 PM

Yau-man didn't want it back.

ah. thanks. they should split the truck right down the middle, each man getting half.

johnnyshaka

05-14-2007, 12:19 PM

Um, have you ever played a game like Risk? People backstab all the time on deals. I did it to my friends about a half a million times. Amazingly, we're still friends.

To me, when you involve something like a new car into the equation, I think that raises the stakes quite a bit. It's one thing to lie playing risk with nothing on the line but if one of your buddies had offered you a new car in exchange for not attacking China and you knew you had no chance to win the game...are you telling me you'd still take China AND the car and leave your buddy high and dry?

Yeah, it's a game...but when Yau gave him a truck that brought real life into it. It's not like Yau promised him a sandwich or something...it's a friggin' truck that he'll be able to use in REAL LIFE.

Atocep

05-14-2007, 12:26 PM

Earl never said he'd bring Yau to the final two. He always maintained that it was every man for himself once the final four hit but everybody knew that Yau would be the odd man out by that time because you'd be silly to keep him around instead of Dreamz and Cassandra...Yau knew that too and that's why he made the deal with Dreamz. Who knew that being given a brand new truck wasn't enough to keep your word...especially when Dreamz didn't have a chance in hell to win...wow!!

It's funny, a lot of people are saying that Dreamz was just playing the game and that integrity shouldn't come into play...well, so is Bonds...he's just playing a game, too.

So every man for himself is ok for Earl but not Dreamz? Yau-man made a stupid move in a game that is based on backstabbing. He admitted himself last night that his own stubborness got to him. Dreamz didn't have a chance to win, but I don't see why he should roll over to make everyone sitting at home happy.

Yau-man was this season's Rudy. The guy Mark Burnett wanted you to like and the guy they wanted to win. He didn't and complaining that he was screwed over by someone misses the entire point of the game.

Comparing Bonds to Dreamz is one of the most ridiculous statements I've ever seen on these forums.

Survivor's new slogan should be "Outwit, outplay, outlast. Unless someone has a better chance of winning than you."

Mizzou B-ball fan

05-14-2007, 12:29 PM

I think the debate over the moves in this game shows just how good this season was. It's interesting because, at the start of the season, I wasn't all that into the game. By the end, it was a great one.

Atocep

05-14-2007, 12:30 PM

Yeah, it's a game...but when Yau gave him a truck that brought real life into it. It's not like Yau promised him a sandwich or something...it's a friggin' truck that he'll be able to use in REAL LIFE.

No, it didn't bring real life into it. It was a reward from a challenge in a game. If Yau-man needed the truck he would have kept the damn thing. Yau-man tried to use the car as leverage to manipulate someone that needed it more than he did. Omg, Yau-man is a jerk!

SURVIVOR IS A GAME.

Jas_lov

05-14-2007, 12:32 PM

So every man for himself is ok for Earl but not Dreamz? Yau-man made a stupid move in a game that is based on backstabbing. He admitted himself last night that his own stubborness got to him. Dreamz didn't have a chance to win, but I don't see why he should roll over to make everyone sitting at home happy.

I think the thing is Dreamz made the promise to Yau for the car and Earl made no such promise that he'd take Yau past the final 4 so it was perceived to be ok for Earl to vote Yau out of the game in his own self interest because he didn't go against his word.

Atocep

05-14-2007, 12:36 PM

I think the thing is Dreamz made the promise to Yau for the car and Earl made no such promise that he'd take Yau past the final 4 so it was perceived to be ok for Earl to vote Yau out of the game in his own self interest because he didn't go against his word.

Yes, but remember that Earl said last night that they didn't start talking about every man for himself until it got down to the final 5. Up until then Earl and Yau-man had a deal to go to the end together. The deal Yau-man made with Dreamz was before the final 5. As soon as the every man for himself talk started Yau-man should have went to Dreamz and made a deal that takes the decision out of Dreamz' hands.

LloydLungs

05-14-2007, 12:42 PM

To me, when you involve something like a new car into the equation, I think that raises the stakes quite a bit.

Thank you. There is no greater advocate of lying/backstabbing on Survivor than I am. I think people should do anything in their power to advance in the game, and furthermore I think the jury should shut the eff up and reward them for it if they're able to maneuver their way to the endgame that way.

I have zero problem with Dreamz keeping the idol and reneging on the deal, but ethics (and GAME STRATEGY!) dictates that you must then return the $60,000 gift that was contingent on your fulfilling your end of the deal. I don't care what Yao-man told him, you have to return the truck. Keeping the truck does not get you further in the game, and in fact arguably reduces your chances of winning. Dreamz really had no shot either way, but returning the truck might have elevated him in the eyes of the jury, making it the correct game strategy at that point if he was really trying to do anything in his power to win. Obviously his status with the jury was as low as it could possibly be (criminey, even KATIE got a vote against Tom back in Palau).

johnnyshaka

05-14-2007, 12:59 PM

So every man for himself is ok for Earl but not Dreamz?

Difference is Earl was upfront about it...everybody knew where they stood with him.

Yau-man made a stupid move in a game that is based on backstabbing. He admitted himself last night that his own stubborness got to him.

You're right, Yau made an assumption that giving a guy a truck was enough to make him stick to his word...and I would think in most cases, he'd be right.

Dreamz didn't have a chance to win, but I don't see why he should roll over to make everyone sitting at home happy.

He doesn't have to make me happy...heck, I could give two bits about him...but he'll have to endure the constant character bashing that he's going to face over the next little while and something tells me he isn't mentally equipped to handle it.

Comparing Bonds to Dreamz is one of the most ridiculous statements I've ever seen on these forums.

It was a "tongue-in-cheek" comment...take it easy. I suppose I should've put a ":rolleyes:" next to it...my bad.

Maple Leafs

05-14-2007, 01:06 PM

As much as Yau seems like a great guy and was far better at challenges then you'd ever expect him to be, he made a huge error by being too obvious in his strategizing. Earl stayed behind the scenes, Yau was very open about what he was doing. That's a huge mistake even if he's a friendly old man.

Vinatieri for Prez

05-14-2007, 01:23 PM

Thank you. There is no greater advocate of lying/backstabbing on Survivor than I am. I think people should do anything in their power to advance in the game, and furthermore I think the jury should shut the eff up and reward them for it if they're able to maneuver their way to the endgame that way.

I have zero problem with Dreamz keeping the idol and reneging on the deal, but ethics (and GAME STRATEGY!) dictates that you must then return the $60,000 gift that was contingent on your fulfilling your end of the deal. I don't care what Yao-man told him, you have to return the truck. Keeping the truck does not get you further in the game, and in fact arguably reduces your chances of winning. Dreamz really had no shot either way, but returning the truck might have elevated him in the eyes of the jury, making it the correct game strategy at that point if he was really trying to do anything in his power to win. Obviously his status with the jury was as low as it could possibly be (criminey, even KATIE got a vote against Tom back in Palau).

This I agree with. Again, no loss of integrity for Dreamz because it's a game. But it was a faulty strategy. He should have played it one of two ways. Give the truck back and claim he was duping Yau-man as part of his strategy (i.e. I never intended to keep the deal, but I never intended to keep the truck). Or claim he had a change of heart once the million was on the line and then give the truck back. Either way, by keeping the truck, he doomed himself to losing for sure. It didn't matter anyway, Earl was winning this thing no ifs and or buts. I thought it was obvious early on he was a powerful player, and picked him as the probable winner early on. He was looking like more and more like Yul as each week went by.

Atocep

05-14-2007, 01:24 PM

Difference is Earl was upfront about it...everybody knew where they stood with him.

If everyone played the game the way Earl did Survivor wouldn't last more than a couple seasons. There's more than one way to play the game and there's more than one way to win it. Richard Hatch is the last villian that will win the game because people think everyone should play a clean game.

IMO, you could make a very strong arguement that Dreamz was just as deserving as Earl. Dreamz should have been gone a long time ago, yet he made some moves that kept him in the game and walked out with a truck that was given to him. I'd say he played the game pretty well.

Each season its becoming more clear that we're going to see essentially the same winner each time. Its going to come down to who can align themselves the best early on and ride that to the end.

You're right, Yau made an assumption that giving a guy a truck was enough to make him stick to his word...and I would think in most cases, he'd be right.

Yau-man played the truck like a poker chip. He lost his bet and the funny thing is he has accepted it much better than a lot of the show's fans have. I don't feel sorry for people that lose at poker, I don't feel sorry for Yau-man. Yau-man tried to manipulate Dreamz by using the truck. He tried to take advantage of a situation and it backfired. Its part of the game.

He doesn't have to make me happy...heck, I could give two bits about him...but he'll have to endure the constant character bashing that he's going to face over the next little while and something tells me he isn't mentally equipped to handle it.

Anyone that bashes his character over decisions made on survivor needs a lesson on the difference between real life and TV.

It was a "tongue-in-cheek" comment...take it easy. I suppose I should've put a ":rolleyes:" next to it...my bad.

k.....

johnnyshaka

05-14-2007, 01:24 PM

No, it didn't bring real life into it. It was a reward from a challenge in a game. If Yau-man needed the truck he would have kept the damn thing. Yau-man tried to use the car as leverage to manipulate someone that needed it more than he did. Omg, Yau-man is a jerk!

SURVIVOR IS A GAME.

Driving his truck around town a couple of months after the game is over sure sounds like real life to me. Like I said before...if the reward would've been a buffet or something like that where Dreamz would take Yau's place for the day...then, I'm sure folks wouldn't have been as down on Dreamz but because it's a new car and could be life changing for some, it's a big deal.

rkmsuf

05-14-2007, 01:27 PM

Richard Hatch will be the last naked gay man on the show as well.

I think they must have outlawed nudity or something. Nobody has played the nude card in some time.

Vinatieri for Prez

05-14-2007, 01:28 PM

Did anyone miss the part when Jeff says to Yau-man when the deal is being made "it's not binding." And Yau-man says I know that.

Anyways, as for the real life thing and driving the truck around, I don't get it. In other Survivors, the winners outright lie about voting and get a million bucks for it. Here, Dreamz gets a truck. Let's see -- a truck or a million dollars, which do you think is more real life.

johnnyshaka

05-14-2007, 02:13 PM

This I agree with. Again, no loss of integrity for Dreamz because it's a game. But it was a faulty strategy. He should have played it one of two ways. Give the truck back and claim he was duping Yau-man as part of his strategy (i.e. I never intended to keep the deal, but I never intended to keep the truck). Or claim he had a change of heart once the million was on the line and then give the truck back. Either way, by keeping the truck, he doomed himself to losing for sure. It didn't matter anyway, Earl was winning this thing no ifs and or buts. I thought it was obvious early on he was a powerful player, and picked him as the probable winner early on. He was looking like more and more like Yul as each week went by.

Funny how the ethical thing to do and the correct strategy involved giving the truck back.

Vinatieri for Prez

05-14-2007, 03:21 PM

Funny how the ethical thing to do and the correct strategy involved giving the truck back.

Actually, I would say that I was arguing that Dreamz should "appear" as if he was ethical. The most ethical thing of course would be to keep the deal intact. If that makes any sense. That's what everybody does in the game. However, throughout it, they are always doing unethical things. Promising and then reneging on a vote is the classic example.

Maple Leafs

05-14-2007, 03:36 PM

Incidentally, there's a forum that spends a lot of time analyzing each episode for clues in the editing. Basically the theory is that the editors tell very specific stories for certain types of characters, including the winner. They've been able to pick the winner very early for recent seasons, and this year they had Earl pegged as the definite winner after the first episode.

Karlifornia

05-14-2007, 06:44 PM

Maple Leafs

05-14-2007, 07:31 PM

link?
http://p085.ezboard.com:80/S14-Edgic-editing-and-logic/fsurvivorsucksfrm9.showMessage?topicID=9523.topic

Warning, the thread is massive -- they do the whole season in one thread. But scroll down the first post to the guy's links to his own episode summaries and you'll see how he nailed it right away.

saldana

05-14-2007, 08:03 PM

classic moments in last nights finale:

1. Lisi to Dreamz - "Do you know how many zeros there are in a million"

Dreamz thinks for about 3 seconds before answering

2. Eduardo to Earl - "How did you find out about the idol from the other island"

Earl - "Dreamz"

TRO

05-14-2007, 10:01 PM

Found out that Earl is the nephew of my Godfather.

Can I go back and spend some time getting to know him? :)

Karlifornia

05-15-2007, 03:25 AM

http://p085.ezboard.com:80/S14-Edgic-editing-and-logic/fsurvivorsucksfrm9.showMessage?topicID=9523.topic

Warning, the thread is massive -- they do the whole season in one thread. But scroll down the first post to the guy's links to his own episode summaries and you'll see how he nailed it right away.

That's quite impressive.

BrianD

05-15-2007, 10:19 AM

I'm not sure what to think of Dreamz anymore. I still think he was one of the worst players strategy-wise, but maybe he was working things a bit more in the background. I think Yau's comments were right that Dreamz had flashes of brilliance and moments of idiocy. Ballsy move to keep the truck and not hold the deal, but at least it showed that he was trying to play the game.

I have never watched a Survivor finale live, and I don't think I ever will. The final questions are a giant waste of time and I am happy to be able to fast forward through them. I very much respect the people that take losing well and don't use the last question as their last chance to be in the spotlight.

Maple Leafs

05-15-2007, 10:38 AM

I'm not sure what to think of Dreamz anymore. I still think he was one of the worst players strategy-wise, but maybe he was working things a bit more in the background.
Remember Cassandra's comment about him: that he was very smart, but good at making people think he was dumb. That seems like a decent assessment based on what we saw.

BrianD

05-15-2007, 10:51 AM

Remember Cassandra's comment about him: that he was very smart, but good at making people think he was dumb. That seems like a decent assessment based on what we saw.

It is possible. It is also possible that the editing was bad, but I never saw any indication that Dreamz knew what he was doing. Even in the confessional segments he was the same way. If it was all an act, I would have expected a glimpse of the real him somewhere.

rkmsuf

05-15-2007, 10:52 AM

When you meet someone and they say "Hi my name is Dreamz" you have to consider them somewhat shady or loony.

Maple Leafs

05-15-2007, 10:53 AM

It is possible. It is also possible that the editing was bad, but I never saw any indication that Dreamz knew what he was doing. Even in the confessional segments he was the same way. If it was all an act, I would have expected a glimpse of the real him somewhere.
What about how quickly he understood Yau's strategy and how he was the driving force behind voting him off? (And unlike most strategic moves, his actually worked -- except for Yau playing the idol. But he was able to convince Cassandra to turn against her alliance.)

Ajaxab

05-15-2007, 10:56 AM

Given Dreamz's background, it would seem that his entire life has been about getting by in the moment. To say he had any inkling about planning ahead takes him out of his life context. I can't see his life situation giving him the luxury of planning ahead. In this game, he did exactly what he seems to have done all his life in simply surviving through to the next situation. To be unable to plan ahead might be dumb, but I don't see it as an act. I could be way off, but to me it seems he was just doing what he's always done.

BrianD

05-15-2007, 11:00 AM

What about how quickly he understood Yau's strategy and how he was the driving force behind voting him off? (And unlike most strategic moves, his actually worked -- except for Yau playing the idol. But he was able to convince Cassandra to turn against her alliance.)

He did catch Yau's strategy and got people to vote for him. I guess that was one glimpse of him knowing what was going on. If he really meant to go back on his word from the start, he did a good job of hiding that as well. I didn't really think he would keep the idol.

Maple Leafs

05-15-2007, 11:04 AM

He did catch Yau's strategy and got people to vote for him. I guess that was one glimpse of him knowing what was going on. If he really meant to go back on his word from the start, he did a good job of hiding that as well. I didn't really think he would keep the idol.
He was also the one who outplayed the "four horsemen" alliance (twice actually, once by turning on them initially and then again by figuring out who had the idol). He made that move because he figured out that he was #4 in the pecking order and felt he'd have a better chance in the other alliance.