Jack Russell Requests Immunity

[JPhillips]

I just heard that Russell is asking for immunity in exchange for testifying in front of a grand jury. Like I said earlier, if Russell and Great White aren't guilty they sure as hell are doing a good job of pretending they are.

[HornsManiac]

I don't agree that this is a criminal matter. Hell, they have footage of other bands using pyro technics in the same club! Let the families sue if they want, but this is not criminal. It was a horrible ACCIDENT.

If they are going to arrest the band why don't they arrest the engineers who designed and built the space shuttle?

HornsManiac

[sachmo71]

Criminal negligance is still a crime, I believe.

[HornsManiac]

Originally posted by sachmo71
Criminal negligance is still a crime, I believe.

From Law.com's dictionary...

negligence
n. failure to exercise the care toward others which a reasonable or prudent person would do in the circumstances, or taking action which such a reasonable person would not.

The band was not negligent, IMO. They had been using pyro for roughly 20 years. So if they use pyro all the time without incident how can this be negligence? They are close to experts in this field and I am sure their guys know what is safe to use and what is not safe to use. Also, I am sure they know what they can safely use in certain building sizes.

This is NOT criminal negligence according to my interpretation of the definition above.

If anyone is negligent it would be the club for allowing it and for not having fire precautions in place before allowing bands to do it.

HornsManiac

[clintl]

I disagree, Horns. It was clearly not a structure of sufficent size and construction for pyrotechnics to be used safely, and everyone involved should have known that. I go to a club that's approximately the same size (maybe a little smaller) frequently, and I would be extremely concerned if pyrotechnics were used in it.

[PilotMan]

I all comes down to notification of the Pyro.

If the band uses it, then it is their resposibility to know if the place they are playing is allowed to use pyro. If they were told it was ok, then the onus is on the club owners.

If the owners didn't know they would use pyro, it falls back to the band, with the club taking a little more of the responsibilty.

If the owners said no, then its the bands fault.

If the owners said "ok", then it's their fault. For they did not have a permit to have pyro in the building.

[Ksyrup]

FWIW, I don't really think the band members, per se, are the ones in trouble here, even if it turns out that the club didn't give permission, unless they were specifically involved in seting up the pyro and dealing with the club. I think it's the band's management.

I seriously doubt these guys are personally calling clubs in advance of shows each day after staying up all night and getting drunk, or meeting with club technicians hours before the show. They're musicians - they act like musicians, which means they take very little responsibility and have others do that kind of stuff for them. Unless there is some "Law and Order" twist to this, where it turns out Jack Russell told someone, "Screw it, we're using pyro anyway," I just don't see how they could have criminal charges filed against them, politics aside of course.

They'll certainly be named in any civil suit, because that's what you do - sue everyone even remotely involved and let them fight their way out of the suit.

[rkmsuf]

Did someone say sue everyone?

[Ksyrup]

Yes, I did. For punitive damages that everyone is giving to me.

[rkmsuf]

As long as no one says mean awful things to you you're ok...

[SportsDino]

There is a case for negligence. It doesn't matter if you perform an unsafe act for 20 years and you only get burned now, it is still negligence for each and every time you light up pyrotechnics in a confined area with flammable material around. Since by definition most buildings are flammable I'm certain you need some sort of permit to run that type of show.

The only difference is now there is damages, entitling people to sue and get compensation.

That the band includes 'experts' in pyrotechnics makes no difference. Obviously they were negligence in exercising their skill if something caught fire. If you are trained to handle pyrotechnics than the case for negligence grows even easier to prosecute, obviously they were negligent in following their own safety routines.

If their safety protocols are designed in such a way that clubs normally catch fire and kill 100 people, then they are negligent in the creation of their rules.

It is impossible for there to be no negligence here, as no reasonable person would not be careful when handling fire.

As someone said, the best thing for a person to do would be to sue everyone, the band, and the club, as at least one will definately be found liable. Even if the club gave permisson to the band to use pyrotechnics it will not matter, they were negligent in allowing them to use the fireworks in the first place.

[sachmo71]

Horns, I must have misread you. What I took from your post was that you thought the entire incident was not a criminal matter. I was arguing that it was, if they can prove that someone did something to fit your definition above. Sorry about that!

[HornsManiac]

Originally posted by clintl
I disagree, Horns. It was clearly not a structure of sufficent size and construction for pyrotechnics to be used safely, and everyone involved should have known that. I go to a club that's approximately the same size (maybe a little smaller) frequently, and I would be extremely concerned if pyrotechnics were used in it.

See, it is obvious from video tapes that the club DOES allow the use of pyrotechnics. There is footage of other bands using them in the same club.

Like I said, if anyone is guilty of criminal negligence it is the club and not the band. Even if it wasn't the club it still would not be the band, it would be the company (or staff) they hire to set up the pyrotechnics and control them during the show. The band is there to sing and play their instruments. They are not there to supervise the effects used while performing.

Sachmo - No problem, my friend. We were on the same page all along. :)

HornsManiac

[Easy Mac]

"Jack Russell Requests Immunity"

For a second I thought there was a terrier who was going on trial.

[Qwikshot]

While I don't question the legality of it, I'd want immunity too just in case the state would throw the book at me, it doesn't look good for someone trying to proclaim innocence.

[CamEdwards]

Originally posted by Easy Mac
"Jack Russell Requests Immunity"

For a second I thought there was a terrier who was going on trial.

you too, huh?

[Lathum]

I think the unfortuanate thing here is 97 people are dead and that is the real tragedy. What pisses me off is someone, either the band or the club owners, is lying to cover their own asses and we probably will never know the real truth. I hope whoever is lying realizes that someday they will have to testify to a higher power that 97 families were torn apart because of them.

[HornsManiac]

Originally posted by Lathum
I think the unfortuanate thing here is 97 people are dead and that is the real tragedy. What pisses me off is someone, either the band or the club owners, is lying to cover their own asses and we probably will never know the real truth. I hope whoever is lying realizes that someday they will have to testify to a higher power that 97 families were torn apart because of them.

I agree.

When I was half asleep this morning I think I heard on the news that the club had illegal foam on the walls that was HIGHLY flammable.

I think we know who is to blame now. The band did not expect and probably never knew about this illegal surface on their walls.

HornsManiac

[Ksyrup]

Here's a, um, different take on who is to blame...


http://www.aztlan.org/96burn.htm

[sterlingice]

Did someone say sue everyone?

Scary thing is that I have a friend who is going to start law school next semester who thinks that way. He sees lawsuits everywhere.

I would like to take this opportunity to announce my class action lawsuit against stupid people. From the woman who spilled coffee on herself at Mickey D's to the woman who sued the Marlins for getting hit by a foul ball to the burlgar who fell through a roof and sued the homewoner, I am naming defendants for raising my insurance, medical, and, in general, costs of anything through their own neglegent stupidity.

I've been championing this idea for a while but I have yet to find a lawyer who will take it. You want punitive damages, get in line! You don't get to win the lottery because you were too stupid to know how to use a cup. You want to penalize the company so it doesn't happen again, great. But I want a piece of that pie- I shouldn't be penalized because I'm not the dolt who was burgling a home. So as soon as I can find a lawyer, I will get together a list of defendants and anyone interested, join with me in this class action suit.

EDIT: Actually, I believe the woman with the foul ball lost the suit but she should just be sued for thinking about it.

SI

[JeeberD]

Originally posted by Ksyrup
Here's a, um, different take on who is to blame...


http://www.aztlan.org/96burn.htm

There are some looney freakin people in this world...

[HornsManiac]

Originally posted by JeeberD
There are some looney freakin people in this world...

That is what I was thinking. That may have been the most asinine article EVER written.

HornsManiac

[Arbitrary Aardvark]

When I first saw this thread, I thought it was about a Terrier for some reason...

[HornsManiac]

As a little tribute to my boys I was honored to take four shots of Crown before singing "Rock Me" at a karaoke bar last weekend. I did not think I could sing, but everyone applauded and said I sounded really good.

God, I love that song. Maybe, someday I can hear Jack Russell sing it one more time.

*starts singing to self*

If you stay the night.
We'll make the wrong seem right
So come on now...

Rock me
Rock me
Roll me through the night

*remembers hangover and tries to get back to work*

HornsManiac

[Ksyrup]

I know you've all been waiting to hear what this guy has to say about the tragedy - well, wait no more! Who knew Rhode Island was a secret haven for ninjas? Certainly not I!

And no, I did not run this through Snoop's Shizzolator!



INSANE CLOWN POSSE's VIOLENT J Comments On GREAT WHITE Concert Tragedy - Mar. 7, 2003

INSANE CLOWN POSSE's Violent J (a.k.a. Joseph Bruce) recently offered his thoughts on the GREAT WHITE concert tragedy that claimed the lives of nearly 100 rock fans.

The following is Violent J's commentary on the incident:

"Man, what the f'k happened? That was some f'n' unbelievably stale shit that happened in Rhode Island. What the f'k man? 100 ninjas dead? Holy f'k y'all. f'n' GREAT WHITE and there f'n' wolf rock sparklers. Wolf rock bands always gotta have the f'n' Goldberg Sparks goin' off during their f'n' shows. What the f'k's up with them f'n' fags? They just came to town and torched their f'n' fans and bolted. What the f'k went wrong over there? Man, if that happened to us, I'd be flat out destroyed… as a musician, an entertainer, and as a man. I would emotionally shut down. I wouldn't even be able to walk. I'd be a vegetable. Just in shock with staleness. Brain dead. Why even talk about this staleness your wondering? Because them dead people didn't deserve it. An explanation? What the f'k. The Rude Boy, my homie loves 80's wolf rock. Every time, POISON, RATT, f'n' WARRANT, or any of them f'n bands comes to Detroit, Rudy and his cousin Andrew are always there drunk screamin' Whooooo! It's just what he likes to do. Same thing with them 100 dead ninjas in Rhode Island. Shaggy put it to me like this, 'Man that was prolly like 100 dead Rudys.' That's when it hit me. Man that shit really, really f'n sucks. Because it was like 100 Rudys. Each one of them dead people was somebody mad special to somebody else just like Rudy is to us. Them were just people that liked 80's wolf rock Rudy style and wanted to go out after work one night, have a few beers and check out one of there old favorite wolf bands, GREAT STALE. Now they're all dead because of it. Them 100 people were all, no doubt, other peoples mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters and homies. All dead now because of some f'n retarded f'n' pyro call that was prolly made by some burnt out, old, rock dude drunk off his anus. Man that was just fucked. That shit really hit home when we heard about that. That news damn near knocked the wind outta me. Then when I seen the footage on the news I was f'n' in amazement. Them f'n' cheap ass sparklers.

"I also heard a rumor. I heard that GREAT WHITE went right back on the road and they're out finishing their tour right now. I truly, really, seriously find this rumor hard to believe, but if I find out that that's actually true, I personally will be attending one of them shows… with a sock with a big ass rock in it. And I'm gonna have a long hair wolf wig on, as well as one of Rudy's size medium (for some reason), WARRANT t-shirts, and a pair of tight ass Spandex. Once I get in undetected, and all unsuspicious looking, I will then jump on stage like I'm gonna f'n' stage dive or something and swing that sock like a samurai in battle. Knockin' each one of them bitches out cold with a fat chance of brain damage."

[rkmsuf]

Them 100 people were all, no doubt, other peoples mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters and homies.

I'm glad he cleared this up for us...other than that I don't know if I'll ever be the same after reading that...