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tarcone
06-30-2008, 10:49 PM
Our local mini-van Chrysler plant is going idle and the truck plant is going back to one shift in St. Louis. 2400 people are losing their jobs. It happens 9-2-08. This on the heels of speculation that AB brewing will cut back 2000 jobs. St Louis is hurting.
Interesting to note. The Chrysler plants in Canada will remain open and running 3 shifts.

Flasch186
06-30-2008, 10:51 PM
When the jobs numbers come out in the 3rd and 4th qtr I think the markets could be in big trouble. Sorry for your losses there.

DeToxRox
06-30-2008, 10:51 PM
I work for Chrysler Financial and big layoffs are coming our way as early as tomorrow. It doesn't effect me that much. I'll lose my job but seeing as I am a college student still living at home, I'll collect a nice "see you the fuck later" bonus and scadaddle off to finish school.

I've heard upwards of 1000 people coming soon on our end.

Balldog
06-30-2008, 10:53 PM
It all depends on what car is being made. There is no demand for trucks. I work in automotive, all of our programs for small cars are picking up in volumes. GM is going to start making 1330 Malibu's per day (3 shifts/6 days) in January. The Sebring and Avenger assembly line probably start working 2 shifts, instead of 1. Focus volumes are supposed to skyrocket too.

Fidatelo
07-01-2008, 01:55 AM
My dad pointed out a fun little trick the auto-makers have pulled. Since demand for trucks/SUV's is plummeting, the prices have started to drop drastically. But in turn demand for sedans is rising, so cars that were 22k in February are suddenly 24k+ now. I understand supply/demand etc, but that seems slimy. At least wait until the next model year to jack the price.

fantom1979
07-01-2008, 05:25 AM
Sorry for your loss.

Good luck with Bob Nardelli though. I got to see his "improvements" for five years at home depot. The guy is without a doubt the most overrated CEO alive today. I really have no idea how he managed to find another high profile CEO job after the job he did at HD.

Dutch
07-01-2008, 05:38 AM
My dad pointed out a fun little trick the auto-makers have pulled. Since demand for trucks/SUV's is plummeting, the prices have started to drop drastically. But in turn demand for sedans is rising, so cars that were 22k in February are suddenly 24k+ now. I understand supply/demand etc, but that seems slimy. At least wait until the next model year to jack the price.

Buy an SUV and stick it to 'em! :p

Lathum
07-01-2008, 07:39 AM
Saldana just got rid of his truck and traded it in for an avenger so I guess he is an examplae of whats going on.

Alan T
07-01-2008, 07:43 AM
My family has two SUVs, and I've gone to working from home 3 or 4 days a week myself, but we have been talking about trading in my wife's SUV for some kind of hybrid car as well.. Guess we're not alone in that thinking.

cougarfreak
07-01-2008, 07:58 AM
I traded in a truck and an SUV in May. Got a car that gets 30+ miles to the gallon, and the best mini mini van in the market on gas, the Mazda 5.

Honolulu_Blue
07-01-2008, 08:15 AM
There was an aritcle in the Detroit Free Press on Sunday about Chrysler. It's really in bad shape. Rumors are swirling that Cerebrus is getting itself in a position to eventually sell off the various Chrysler lines/products.

Here it is:

<TABLE cellSpacing=8 cellPadding=0 width="95%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD width="100%"><CENTER>A CHRYSLER SALE IS NEAR, SOME PREDICT
AS 2009 LINE DEBUTS, CERBERUS SAYS YEAR IS TOO SOON TO RECOVER
TIM HIGGINS
FREE PRESS BUSINESS WRITER </CENTER>
CHELSEA - While Chrysler LLC gathered journalists from around the world last week to its Chelsea Proving Grounds to show off its 2009 model year lineup, there are growing concerns about the future of the Auburn Hills automaker.
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=nb-storydetails-bodycopy>An influential annual study of the U.S. automotive product pipeline says Chrysler's lack of future product plans is an indication of a near-future breakup or sale by the automaker's majority-owner, Cerberus Capital Management.


"Chrysler's product pipeline severely lags the industry on a number of key metrics, which is an ominous sign for its market share," Merrill Lynch's recently issued Car Wars report said. "We believe that this is an active decision by new owners to rationalize the product portfolio in advance of a breakup/sale."

A Chrysler spokesman called the prediction of a sale ridiculous and a Cerberus spokesman said the private equity firm has "a model that is buy, fix and hold."
Industry analysts are predicting the next 18 months or so could be incredibly trying for the truck-heavy Chrysler, especially as $4-a-gallon gasoline leads more car shoppers to turn to fuel-efficient cars.

"Chrysler's product pipeline over the near term is relatively modest, indicating that the company's lineup may remain misaligned with the market," a note by Fitch Ratings said last week. "Limited cash resources and capital constraints remain a distinct competitive disadvantage in a period of rapid product migration and technological change."

Although questions about Cerberus' long-term plans are not new, questions about Chrysler's ability to weather the ongoing collapse of the U.S. auto industry seem to be growing louder.

Credit agencies are further downgrading or warning about potential downgrades of Chrysler's credit rating. The automaker has tapped a $2-billion loan allowed under the original deal by Daimler AG to give majority control of Chrysler to Cerberus last August.

Concerns about Chrysler's future reached such a fevered pitch Thursday in Europe that Chrysler spokespeople issued statements saying the company was not considering bankruptcy.

Exec says goals being met
It's hard to say how exactly Chrysler will fare - or is faring.
Chrysler and Cerberus officials have been consistent in saying the automaker is meeting internal goals.

As recently as Tuesday evening, Chrysler Chief Financial Officer Ron Kolka sent an e-mail to employees echoing this message. "Despite the challenges, we are meeting or exceeding our financial targets," he wrote.

The list of bad news for Chrysler in recent weeks has mounted - from low quality rankings to dropping sales numbers (down 19.3% so far this year).

The automaker already has announced plans to eliminate as many as 25,000 jobs, to cut four models and to step up consolidation of its dealer network. But ChryslerChief Executive Officer Bob Nardelli has admitted that this year's plan was crafted for a better market than what's been seen over the past few months.

Part of the plan to reduce its number of dealers involves scaling back its product lineup: eliminating overlapping models between its three brands, Chrysler, Dodge and Jeep. Dealers have said they believe the automaker will slash a third or more of its lineup.

Meanwhile, Chrysler also is looking to get into new segments, such as small cars, without having to spend much money. It has deals with Chinese automaker Chery Automobile Co. and Japanese automaker Nissan Motor Co. to get small cars to sell under a Chrysler brand name. The Nissan-Chrysler small car is not expected until 2010.

Chrysler officials have said they have stepped up efforts to bring a new midsize car to market to replace the struggling Chrysler Sebring and Dodge Avenger, but that's still a few years off.

"The widely reported product cancellations combined with our forecast put the Chrysler replacement rate at the bottom end of the range for the next four model years," according to the study, whose lead author was research analyst John Murphy.

The study shows Chrysler replacing just 51% of its sales volume with new models over the next four years.

Other automakers are projected to replace from 66% to 80% of their lineups.
History shows that new models are closely tied to sales.

Chrysler's average replacement rate over the past decade was 15%. Its market share has decreased 2.3% in that time period.

General Motors Corp. and Ford Motor Co. had equal or lower replacement rates and lost more U.S. share than Chrysler. Toyota Motor Corp. and others had higher rates and gained market share.

Negative ratings
As a privately held company, Chrysler's finances are not public like a publicly traded company. But recent windows into the automaker's books look bleak.
On Wednesday, Fitch Rating said that if the industry's troubles carry into next year "negative cash flows could result in Chrysler's liquidity position reaching minimal required levels in late 2009."

Kolka's e-mail this week was to reassure employees about minority-owner Daimler AG's announcement Tuesday that Chrysler has drawn down a loan previously promised to the U.S. automaker.

"As part of the original terms of the transfer of majority interest in Chrysler to Cerberus, both Daimler and Cerberus agreed to fund a $2-billion second lien of debt for Chrysler. The contract also stipulates that Chrysler is required to draw the funding within 12 months of the closing date" of Aug. 3, 2007. Kolka wrote.
He also noted: "The drawdown ... is not related to current economic conditions."

Brands attractive globally
The Merrill Lynch study suggests that Chrysler's Jeep brand could be sold to an international automaker looking to enter the U.S. market.

The Renault-Nissan alliance might be interested in Chrysler's pickups and minivans, and the car business could be wound down, the report said.

"The most crucial part of this breakup/wind-down is that it is executed in a relatively orderly fashion, which will be a positive event for other automakers, especially for GM and Ford," the report said.

But the sale theory doesn't sit well with Rick Deneau, a Chrysler spokesman.
"This idea that ... we're not doing vehicles because we're selling off the company, that's just ridiculous," he said.

Tim Price, Cerberus managing director, said in a statement: "We have a model that is buy, fix and hold. We believe Chrysler's success story will play out over the next 5-10 years. You can't judge an investment like this after just a year."

Chrysler also questioned the notion that it lacks future product.

Chrysler says it is launching 20 all-new and 13 refreshed vehicles between 2007 and 2009.

"Even if you have a year that isn't 10 vehicles ... it could be that it's not the time for the redo," Deneau said.

In fact, Chrysler showrooms will have among the newest lineups, according to the Merrill Lynch study, largely thanks to product cancellations and major recent launches, such as the Dodge Ram this summer and last year's Dodge and Chrysler minivans.

But those vehicles are in shrinking segments.

Erich Merkle of IRN Inc. agreed that Chrysler's product lineup is thin over the next few years. "It's my belief we'll start to see some improvement in '09, but they don't have any product coming into the marketplace, which is going to make things difficult for them in '09 as well. That's a long time for them to have to gut this thing out," Merkle said.

Looking to future small cars and the next Jeep Grand Cherokee - likely for the 2011 model year - he added that, "2010 can't come fast enough."

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Flasch186
07-01-2008, 08:19 AM
should the oil trade crack and gas prices drop below $3 over the next 8 months all of those SUV's and trucks will pick right back up.

Lathum
07-01-2008, 08:30 AM
should the oil trade crack and gas prices drop below $3 over the next 8 months all of those SUV's and trucks will pick right back up.

doubtfull that scenerio will even be plausible

flere-imsaho
07-01-2008, 09:07 AM
Our local mini-van Chrysler plant is going idle and the truck plant is going back to one shift in St. Louis. 2400 people are losing their jobs. It happens 9-2-08.

Heard about this on NPR this morning - you have my sympathies. The NPR story mentioned, however, that this closing (or slowdown) was a bit of a surprise as the factory was retooled last year to produce vehicles other than minivans.

I traded in a truck and an SUV in May. Got a car that gets 30+ miles to the gallon, and the best mini mini van in the market on gas, the Mazda 5.

We looked at the 5 a couple of years back and ended up just taking the Subaru Forester over it, but the 5 is definitely a great little van. Even more awesome that you can get it with a stick.

Looking to future small cars and the next Jeep Grand Cherokee - likely for the 2011 model year - he added that, "2010 can't come fast enough."

No offense to anyone here, but this is just another example of U.S. automakers deluding themselves. The Jeep Grand Cherokee is a piece of shit. Recently I sold an IKEA desk and a 7 foot bookshelf on Craigslist. The buyer comes to my house with their Jeep Grand Cherokee. We can barely fit the disassembled pieces of the desk in the Jeep, after first determining that there's no way to fit the bookshelf in there. So the bookshelf goes in the Subaru, where it fits nicely (and where the desk could have fit as well). On top of that the Subaru has better gas mileage, better reliability, and similar good ground clearance (sometimes better, depending on the specific model).

Maybe it's just me, but it boggles the mind.

flere-imsaho
07-01-2008, 09:09 AM
should the oil trade crack and gas prices drop below $3 over the next 8 months all of those SUV's and trucks will pick right back up.

Barring the use of subsidies, I don't think we'll ever see gas under $3 (national average) again.

Flasch186
07-01-2008, 09:11 AM
it depends on how much of a premium you believe speculators have added to the price. Im in the camp that 30% is speculation...

However, since Im usually wrong it probably means that there is 30% more to go :)

albionmoonlight
07-01-2008, 09:19 AM
I'm more interested in the Anheiser-Busch job cuts. Is that company hurting?

Warhammer
07-01-2008, 10:01 AM
I'm more interested in the Anheiser-Busch job cuts. Is that company hurting?

They shouldn't be after my Friday night.

M GO BLUE!!!
07-01-2008, 10:02 AM
I'm just wondering how many people will complain about loss of jobs, then climb into their Honda.

Warhammer
07-01-2008, 10:10 AM
I'm just wondering how many people will complain about loss of jobs, then climb into their Honda.

Honda employs plenty of people here. Chrysler has no one to blame for their problems but themselves. They tend to make crappy cars whose only selling point is their style, if you like it.

Desnudo
07-01-2008, 10:12 AM
Which contributes to jobs in Alabama? If US car makers were competitive in the market, then people wouldn't buy Hondas or Toyotas.

cubboyroy1826
07-01-2008, 11:10 AM
Yeah this jobs arguement comes down to the issue i have with the american automakers just not putting out a quality product other than their trucks. Now i know there are some American cars that are good i am not saying that all of their models are crap so lets not go there. I have owned Mitsubishis and Toyotas for the last 10 years at least and can't see changing that. My Mitstubishis have lasted a minimum 150k miles and at least a year or two past the payments (i would still have one of them if the mother in law didn't borrow it shortly after i had gotten new tires, brakes and a detailing. Yes this was already a year and a half with no payments.). The Toyotas have been just as or more reliable. I have owned American cars and just have had no luck. I think the American automakers for the most part have been a step behind for a long time. Okay now flame away.:popcorn:

Coder
07-01-2008, 12:19 PM
Not to car-jack, but Volvo is cutting 2000 jobs in Gothenburg, Sweden, out of a 17000 total.. people are busy blaming everything, weak dollar, Ford, you name it.

The root problem is that Volvo has left it's values behind and tried to become something it's not. How much of this is because of Ford will never be known, but they put Volvo in their Premier Auto Group, trying to market the brand as a "Luxurious" car model to compete with Mercedes and BMW, when in fact, everyone thinks of Volvo as a safe family car.

I recently talked to a business analyst within Volvo who said that "10 years ago, people from Toyota came to visit Volvo to watch and learn how to work efficiently. Since then, Volvo hasn't developed at all, they're about as modern as you can be in 1998, while other car companies have adapted with time.

However, Volvo has been busy trying achieve quarterly objectives and totally ignored the future during the last 8 years at least (which is how long I've been working there). Their modelplan is hopelessly outdated and instead of looking at more efficient engines etc, they're looking at LARGER cars. The best selling model for the past 5 years has been the XC90.. and this is without anything but small facelifts.. now the car is starting to sell less and they're asking "WHY?".. why?!!?? There's no turnaround plan.. we're sinking quickly.

tarcone
07-01-2008, 12:28 PM
A-B was given an offer by !nBev. A Belgium company. !nbev offered $65 a share when it was trading at $62. A-B Turned down the offer. Now a hostile takeover is possible and A-B is scrambling to make the company look better to shareholders.

As for the auto industry. Im not real sure if this happens in all car companies. But Chrysler sub-contracts out a lot of their work. Dashboards come from here, steerring wheels from there. Im not a business guy. But this seems like poor management.

Cringer
07-01-2008, 12:33 PM
Honda employs plenty of people here. Chrysler has no one to blame for their problems but themselves. They tend to make crappy cars whose only selling point is their style, if you like it.

Our last two cars have been Chrysler, or I guess the two we have now I should say. One is a Dodge Ram Van, and the other is a 300. Both have been very good to us. The only problem real problem with our 300 is the miles we are piling up on it.

Warhammer
07-01-2008, 01:31 PM
Our last two cars have been Chrysler, or I guess the two we have now I should say. One is a Dodge Ram Van, and the other is a 300. Both have been very good to us. The only problem real problem with our 300 is the miles we are piling up on it.

I've had two Chrysler-Dodge products. The Concorde I had had a radiator fan go out at 36,500 miles and fried the engine, and the Dodge Ram I had had the transmission go out at 27,000 miles.

EDIT: This is just my experience. Not saying they haven't improved, but I am not going to give them a chance based upon their past performance.

Cringer
07-01-2008, 02:07 PM
I've had two Chrysler-Dodge products. The Concorde I had had a radiator fan go out at 36,500 miles and fried the engine, and the Dodge Ram I had had the transmission go out at 27,000 miles.

EDIT: This is just my experience. Not saying they haven't improved, but I am not going to give them a chance based upon their past performance.

Personal experience is hard to talk someone out of. I by Dodge/Chrysler because of a good history with them, you don't because of a bad one. It happens. I don't like Chevy because of that reason. I love International Harvester more then anything. They need to bring back the Scout II.

I should also point out I have one other problem with my 300. If we leave this area and head up north you will mostly see 300's driven by gangstas or wanna be gangstas. It is an odd thing to be driving the same car as 15% of the guys in the ghetto.

Tekneek
07-01-2008, 05:11 PM
Sorry for your loss.

Good luck with Bob Nardelli though. I got to see his "improvements" for five years at home depot. The guy is without a doubt the most overrated CEO alive today. I really have no idea how he managed to find another high profile CEO job after the job he did at HD.

For most "big business" corporations, CEOs are plucked from the good ol' boys club and few are held responsible for the disasters in their past. As long as you don't actually go down in a ball of flames with criminal charges, you're good as gold.

Tekneek
07-01-2008, 05:15 PM
I've read that the top executives at Toyota and Honda have compensation packages similar to junior executives at the US makers. Perhaps that also has something to do with the predicament they are in.

Balldog
07-01-2008, 05:32 PM
I've had two Chrysler-Dodge products. The Concorde I had had a radiator fan go out at 36,500 miles and fried the engine, and the Dodge Ram I had had the transmission go out at 27,000 miles.

EDIT: This is just my experience. Not saying they haven't improved, but I am not going to give them a chance based upon their past performance.

More than likely that radiator fan is a common radiator fan amongst other OEMs.

Every part on every car is different, I'm sure people have had similar experiences with Ford, GM, Toyota, Honda, etc.