Nagging Question

[dberner30]

I know Jim reads these forums and there are a lot of readers/posters with a vast amount of experience. There is this series of nagging questions that keep popping up for me and thought maybe this group could provide some answers.

1. Are the stats created by the game engine and then the play by play is generated to fill in the results to those stats?

One thing I see far too often is the old school madden AI seeming damper or accelerator. For example, one teams rolls in the 1st half and the other stinks up the joint. Then in the second half its a complete role reversal. Stats look okay but the play by play is poor.

2. Are penalties used to stop key plays? It seems like penalties show up at key times to either extend or stop drives while the result I refer to in question 1 is being played out. And are the penalties randomized somehow because some of the penalty outcomes are silly. In other words, the penalties dont fit the situation very well. Is it because the game says penalty and then the penalty is pulled from a second list. Or is it designed with certain penalties in certain situations. If so, the situation to penalty list needs some work. There also seem to be too many roughing the kicker calls from my game watching experience. This is a rare penalty but not so much in my FOF watching. It seems like its used to extend drives per no. 1 and in situations in which the kicking needs big time help to get a first down.

3. The end of game and end of half mechanics seem bad. Am I missing something or is there a way to make the game smarter about just taking the shorter to medium routes and marching up the field as opposed to needing 40 yards and going 4 downs straight of incomplete long bombs. I either need some guidance on the setting to tweak or the engine needs some work on this stuff.

I have some more but in the interests of hopefully keeping this focused a bit I will wait to hear the collective thoughts. I think FOF is a great game with great promise but it seems to fall short in the output.

[Ben E Lou]

1. Are the stats created by the game engine and then the play by play is generated to fill in the results to those stats?I'm certain that plays are resolved one play at a time. There are a few places where an individual play result is generated, and then stats are assigned after the fact, but that's on a one-play-a-time basis.As an aside, people have noticed that YAC does not correlate well with NFL totals. It's one of the few stats in FOF that's calculated after the play is resolved (slightly different from KRB, which is part of the play, but not counted unless the run is a "success"). That really should be on the list of things to improve in the engine.

2. Are penalties used to stop key plays? It seems like penalties show up at key times to either extend or stop drives while the result I refer to in question 1 is being played out. And are the penalties randomized somehow because some of the penalty outcomes are silly. In other words, the penalties dont fit the situation very well. Is it because the game says penalty and then the penalty is pulled from a second list.I'm pretty sure Jim indicated that your last sentence is the case. I seem to recall an issue at one point where intentional grounding was occurring on running plays (or something like that), and Jim saying something along the lines of needing to remove that penalty from the options on running plays.

3. The end of game and end of half mechanics seem bad. Am I missing something or is there a way to make the game smarter about just taking the shorter to medium routes and marching up the field as opposed to needing 40 yards and going 4 downs straight of incomplete long bombs. I either need some guidance on the setting to tweak or the engine needs some work on this stuff.Unfortunately, the only way I've found to keep this from happening in a close game is to turn off the two-minute offense entirely (zero), and that's not perfect either, because it can result in what happened in my WOOF game yesterday--punting on 4th and 8 from near midfield with under a minute to go and down by 3:

<table bgcolor="#ffcc00" border="0" cellspacing="1" width="98%"><tbody><tr><td align="left" bgcolor="#aba441">Lowcountry: Single-Back formation with trips receivers, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-LWC31 (4Q: 02:02) Jamal Stinnett ran around the left tackle for 3 yards. Tackled by S Craig Chin, assisted by ILB Anthony Swift. </td></tr> <tr><td align="left" bgcolor="#000066">Official time out for the two-minute warning.</td></tr> <tr><td align="left" bgcolor="#aba441">Lowcountry: I formation, with the second wideout in the slot, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
2-7-LWC34 (4Q: 01:55) Pat Rodriguez pass completed to RB Jamal Stinnett for 12 yards. Tackled by CB Clarence Kientzy, assisted by CB Rick Lautenberg. The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field. Stinnett gained 4 yards after the catch.</td></tr> <tr><td align="left" bgcolor="#aba441">Lowcountry: I formation, with the second wideout in the slot, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 2-deep man-to-man coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
1-10-LWC46 (4Q: 01:25) Jamal Stinnett ran inside the left tackle for 1 yard. Tackled by OLB Rickey Randle, assisted by DT Colin Buchanan. Stinnett slipped a little on the wet field. </td></tr> <tr><td align="left" bgcolor="#aba441">Lowcountry: I formation, with the second wideout in the slot, strength is right. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
2-9-LWC47 (4Q: 01:02) Corwin Bumpers ran inside the right guard for 1 yard. Tackled by DE Dwayne Horner, assisted by ILB Anthony Swift. </td></tr> <tr><td align="left" bgcolor="#000066"> (4Q: 01:02) Lowcountry called a time out.</td></tr> <tr><td align="left" bgcolor="#aba441">Lowcountry: Single-Back formation with trips receivers, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, keying aggressively on the pass.
3-8-LWC48 (4Q: 00:53) Pat Rodriguez pass fell incomplete, intended for WR Dusty Ford. ILB Anthony Swift defended the pass. The quarterback threw into double coverage.</td></tr> <tr><td align="left" bgcolor="#aba441">4-8-LWC48 (4Q: 00:47) J.C. Toney punted 45 yards. The ball was downed at the RUS07.</td></tr> <tr><td align="left" bgcolor="#eee8d2">Rusholme: Strong formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 3-deep zone coverage, keying aggressively on the run.
1-10-RUS07 (4Q: 00:37) Jimmie Switch Blades dropped to one knee for -1 yards. </td></tr> <tr><td align="left" bgcolor="#000066"> (4Q: 00:37) Lowcountry called a time out.</td></tr> <tr><td align="left" bgcolor="#eee8d2">Rusholme: Five-Receiver Spread formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 with nickel personnel and 2-deep bump-and-run coverage, expecting the pass.
2-11-RUS06 (4Q: 00:26) Jimmie Blades dropped to one knee for -1 yards. </td></tr> <tr><td align="left" bgcolor="#000066"> (4Q: 00:26) Lowcountry called a time out.</td></tr> <tr><td align="left" bgcolor="#eee8d2">Rusholme: Single-Back formation, strength is left. The defense is in a 43 and 1-deep, bump-and-run coverage, keying aggressively on the run. Lyle is blitzing.
3-12-RUS05 (4Q: 00:14) Jimmie Blades dropped to one knee for -1 yards. </td></tr> <tr><td align="left" bgcolor="#ffcc00">Final Score: Rusholme Ruffians 20, Lowcountry Gators 17</td></tr></tbody></table>


Maybe the best option would be to use 1 minute per score, instead of zero. I suppose if I'd done that in the above situation, my team would have at least gone for it on fourth down, although you're dead right that the odds of it selecting a bomb in those situations are entirely too high. I've seen it happen again and again: 3-point or less difference, ball at the 30 or so, 2 minutes left, all 3 time outs--in other words, only 40 yards or so to get into FG range and plenty of time, but it just goes "bombs away" there.