marcmoustache
03-04-2008, 02:32 AM
Jim/Ethan,
I'm hoping you can help / change / look into the late drive logic in FOF2007. It seems that when trailing late in a game, the AI playcalling logic instantly switches to deep passes only? This is particularly obvious when only down by 1 score and a more conservative drive would still be effective.
For example, a recent MP game when trailing by 2 with 1m 51s remaining (more than enough time to get into FG range), our drive went like this (from the Solevision text):
SEA 16 >SFO 14 1st & 10, Own 17 4Q 1:51
San Francisco comes out in the Pro formation, the right side is strong.
The defense comes out in a 43 alignment and dime personnel and 2-deep man-to-man coverage.
They are aggressively expecting a pass.
Tom Brady takes the snap and heads back.
Brady throws a long bomb intended for Wide Receiver Quincy Morgan.
He's throwing into double coverage.
The pass isn't completed.
SEA 16 >SFO 14 2nd & 10, Own 17 4Q 1:42
The offense is in the Single-Back formation with trips receivers, strength on the left side.
Seattle is in a 43 alignment with dime personnel with 4-deep zone coverage.
They are looking only for a pass play.
Tom Brady takes the snap from center.
Brady rears back, and fires a long bomb to Wide Receiver Quincy Morgan.
Chris Kelsay put a lot of pressure on the passer.
That's an incomplete pass.
SEA 16 >SFO 14 3rd & 10, Own 17 4Q 1:32
San Francisco is in a Single-Back formation with two tight ends, strength is right.
The defense shows the 43 look with nickel personnel with 3-deep zone coverage.
Seattle is gambling on a pass play.
Tom Brady takes the snap from center.
Brady hurls a long bomb to Wide Receiver Quincy Morgan.
Thurman Monroe knocked the pass down.
SEA 16 >SFO 14 4th & 10, Own 17 4Q 1:20
San Francisco is in a Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right.
The defense shows the 43 look with dime personnel with 4-deep zone coverage.
Seattle is gambling on a pass play. Burnett is blitzing.
Tom Brady drops back in the pocket.
Brady fires a medium length pass to Wide Receiver Chad Johnson.
He's throwing away from the double coverage.
Johnson made the reception.
The play goes for 10 yards before the receiver went out of bounds
It seems in each of the first 3 downs, the QB has gone for a hail mary, but when they have failed, the AI logic says that it needs 10 yards for the 1st down to keep the drive alive, so goes for a medium range pass.
The next set of downs was the same:
SEA 16 >SFO 14 1st & 10, Own 27 4Q 1:10
The offense is in the I formation with two tight ends, with strength on the right side.
Seattle is in a 43 alignment with nickel personnel with 3-deep zone coverage.
They are looking only for a pass play.
Tom Brady drops back in the pocket.
Brady rears back, and fires a long bomb to Running Back Alfred Bradford.
He's throwing away from the double coverage.
The pass falls incomplete.
Safety Roy Williams kept the receiver away from the ball.
SEA 16 >SFO 14 2nd & 10, Own 27 4Q 0:59
The offense is in the Weak formation, strength on the left side.
Seattle is in a 43 alignment with nickel personnel with 3-deep zone coverage.
They are looking only for a pass play.
Tom Brady drops back in the pocket.
Brady moves around in the pocket, and propels a deep pass to Wide Receiver Quincy Morgan.
Dwan Edwards put a lot of pressure on the passer.
That's an incomplete pass.
SEA 16 >SFO 14 3rd & 10, Own 27 4Q 0:50
San Francisco is lined up in a Pro formation, aligned to the right.
The defense is in a 43 and dime personnel and 3-deep zone coverage.
They are keying heavily on a pass.
Tom Brady takes the snap and heads back.
Brady flings a long bomb intended for Wide Receiver Chad Johnson.
Andra Davis put a lot of pressure on the passer.
That's an incomplete pass.
SEA 16 >SFO 14 4th & 10, Own 27 4Q 0:38
San Francisco is lined up in a Pro formation, aligned to the right.
The defense is in a 43 and dime personnel and 2-deep man-to-man coverage.
They are keying heavily on a pass.
Tom Brady fields the snap and drops back to pass.
Brady chucks a medium distance pass intended for Wide Receiver Terrence Murphy.
He's throwing away from the double coverage.
Murphy caught the pass.
That's good for 12 yards before the receiver went out of bounds.
He was brought down by Safety Brian Russell, with the assist to Safety Roy Williams.
The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field.
That will go for a first down.
Again, the sequence is 3 long bombs which went incomplete, followed by a medium length pass which was completed but only on 4th down when the logic seems to necessitate a first down gaining pass?
My main concern is that we could have attempted medium length passes instead of long bombs and effectively got into FG range to kick the winning points.
I've only given this one example, but it's a common situation across many games. Is it possibel that the late drive AI playcalling logic can be looked at to make sure it is more sensible when you are down by 1 score of less? If you're down by 21 pts then what the hell, but games that are winnable are being thrown away literally!
I can supply solevision files, etc if necessary
Thanks
Marc.
I'm hoping you can help / change / look into the late drive logic in FOF2007. It seems that when trailing late in a game, the AI playcalling logic instantly switches to deep passes only? This is particularly obvious when only down by 1 score and a more conservative drive would still be effective.
For example, a recent MP game when trailing by 2 with 1m 51s remaining (more than enough time to get into FG range), our drive went like this (from the Solevision text):
SEA 16 >SFO 14 1st & 10, Own 17 4Q 1:51
San Francisco comes out in the Pro formation, the right side is strong.
The defense comes out in a 43 alignment and dime personnel and 2-deep man-to-man coverage.
They are aggressively expecting a pass.
Tom Brady takes the snap and heads back.
Brady throws a long bomb intended for Wide Receiver Quincy Morgan.
He's throwing into double coverage.
The pass isn't completed.
SEA 16 >SFO 14 2nd & 10, Own 17 4Q 1:42
The offense is in the Single-Back formation with trips receivers, strength on the left side.
Seattle is in a 43 alignment with dime personnel with 4-deep zone coverage.
They are looking only for a pass play.
Tom Brady takes the snap from center.
Brady rears back, and fires a long bomb to Wide Receiver Quincy Morgan.
Chris Kelsay put a lot of pressure on the passer.
That's an incomplete pass.
SEA 16 >SFO 14 3rd & 10, Own 17 4Q 1:32
San Francisco is in a Single-Back formation with two tight ends, strength is right.
The defense shows the 43 look with nickel personnel with 3-deep zone coverage.
Seattle is gambling on a pass play.
Tom Brady takes the snap from center.
Brady hurls a long bomb to Wide Receiver Quincy Morgan.
Thurman Monroe knocked the pass down.
SEA 16 >SFO 14 4th & 10, Own 17 4Q 1:20
San Francisco is in a Single-Back formation with four receivers, strength is right.
The defense shows the 43 look with dime personnel with 4-deep zone coverage.
Seattle is gambling on a pass play. Burnett is blitzing.
Tom Brady drops back in the pocket.
Brady fires a medium length pass to Wide Receiver Chad Johnson.
He's throwing away from the double coverage.
Johnson made the reception.
The play goes for 10 yards before the receiver went out of bounds
It seems in each of the first 3 downs, the QB has gone for a hail mary, but when they have failed, the AI logic says that it needs 10 yards for the 1st down to keep the drive alive, so goes for a medium range pass.
The next set of downs was the same:
SEA 16 >SFO 14 1st & 10, Own 27 4Q 1:10
The offense is in the I formation with two tight ends, with strength on the right side.
Seattle is in a 43 alignment with nickel personnel with 3-deep zone coverage.
They are looking only for a pass play.
Tom Brady drops back in the pocket.
Brady rears back, and fires a long bomb to Running Back Alfred Bradford.
He's throwing away from the double coverage.
The pass falls incomplete.
Safety Roy Williams kept the receiver away from the ball.
SEA 16 >SFO 14 2nd & 10, Own 27 4Q 0:59
The offense is in the Weak formation, strength on the left side.
Seattle is in a 43 alignment with nickel personnel with 3-deep zone coverage.
They are looking only for a pass play.
Tom Brady drops back in the pocket.
Brady moves around in the pocket, and propels a deep pass to Wide Receiver Quincy Morgan.
Dwan Edwards put a lot of pressure on the passer.
That's an incomplete pass.
SEA 16 >SFO 14 3rd & 10, Own 27 4Q 0:50
San Francisco is lined up in a Pro formation, aligned to the right.
The defense is in a 43 and dime personnel and 3-deep zone coverage.
They are keying heavily on a pass.
Tom Brady takes the snap and heads back.
Brady flings a long bomb intended for Wide Receiver Chad Johnson.
Andra Davis put a lot of pressure on the passer.
That's an incomplete pass.
SEA 16 >SFO 14 4th & 10, Own 27 4Q 0:38
San Francisco is lined up in a Pro formation, aligned to the right.
The defense is in a 43 and dime personnel and 2-deep man-to-man coverage.
They are keying heavily on a pass.
Tom Brady fields the snap and drops back to pass.
Brady chucks a medium distance pass intended for Wide Receiver Terrence Murphy.
He's throwing away from the double coverage.
Murphy caught the pass.
That's good for 12 yards before the receiver went out of bounds.
He was brought down by Safety Brian Russell, with the assist to Safety Roy Williams.
The receiver ran his route right over the middle of the field.
That will go for a first down.
Again, the sequence is 3 long bombs which went incomplete, followed by a medium length pass which was completed but only on 4th down when the logic seems to necessitate a first down gaining pass?
My main concern is that we could have attempted medium length passes instead of long bombs and effectively got into FG range to kick the winning points.
I've only given this one example, but it's a common situation across many games. Is it possibel that the late drive AI playcalling logic can be looked at to make sure it is more sensible when you are down by 1 score of less? If you're down by 21 pts then what the hell, but games that are winnable are being thrown away literally!
I can supply solevision files, etc if necessary
Thanks
Marc.