OT: Football (Soccer) Question

[EagleFan]

I have no clue about the tactics of playing football (soccer). I can't seem to put together a winning team no matter how hard I try in CM. What I was wondering is how often so squads change their tactics? I have little patience with my tactics and am afrade that I have been changing too quickly.

I have no idea how often a team really changes what they do. Is it common for a team to play a 4-4-2 most all of the season, just vary from attacking to defensive, or will they chantged their formations several times a season, depending on who they are playing?

Sorry, just wanting to finally start to get a clue. I know I just left myself open with that statement, oh well.

[McSweeny]

i find that the 4-4-2 can be very successful in CM4. I just change my mentality and other team insturctions around depending on my opponent and where i'm playing. Also, i've had success playing a 3-5-2 and a little success with the 4-3-3(though i had 3 great strikers and a fairly strong midfield)

[EagleFan]

That could be my problem. I tend to use new tactics (overhaul, not minor player adjustments) every three matches or so (did I mention the lack of patience).

[McSweeny]

Originally posted by EagleFan
That could be my problem. I tend to use new tactics (overhaul, not minor player adjustments) every three matches or so (did I mention the lack of patience).

yeah that could be your problem... in my current game i used the stock 4-4-2A and promoted from the English First Division with Nottm Forest and then i switched to a 3-5-2 for my first season in the big leagues. I seem to be holding my own so far :::crosses fingers:::

[EagleFan]

Thanks for the quick replies. I'll have to try staying with the same basic strategy for a while. I'll get the feel for this sometime, I hope. It must be not growing up with socfer that is getting me. It seems so much simpler than American football but I just can;t get a grip on it yet.

[Ajaxab]

I second McSweeny's diagnosis. Marc Vaughan has posted in this forum about not deciding to change your tactics too quickly. Usually it takes about 10 games or so for your team to get used to the tactic you employ. He has also mentioned that if you're managing a lower league team, you don't want tactics that are too complex because your players' skills aren't up to the challenge of complexity.

You've probably heard this before, but organize your tactics around your best player(s). It seems obvious, but some people just chuck a 4-4-2 out there and expect to win. If you've got great DMR's or DML's you probably want to be playing a 3-5-2 or a 5-3-2 with these guys on the wings.

I generally try to run a 3-4-1-2 with three DC's at the back who can head the ball (because opponents will get down the flanks to open space against me without a DR or DL in place), a couple of solid DMC or MC's in the middle who can win the ball, playmaking AMR and AML's on the wings, my best FC in the hole and two finishers at the striker spots. I might have my wingers cross if my strikers are good at heading. Otherwise, we keep the ball on the ground.

[EagleFan]

One more question. I see some listed as forward and others as striker. What is the difference, as far as where you would play them?

I have a forward with exceptional passing skills that I have played at the top of the diamond in the midfield with a free roll. Is that an okay strategy or am I asking for trouble?

Sorry about all the questions, still trying to grasp outdoor tactics.

[Bee]

Originally posted by EagleFan
One more question. I see some listed as forward and others as striker. What is the difference, as far as where you would play them?

I have a forward with exceptional passing skills that I have played at the top of the diamond in the midfield with a free roll. Is that an okay strategy or am I asking for trouble?

Sorry about all the questions, still trying to grasp outdoor tactics.

I've always wondered what the difference was too.

It seems to me that strikers tend to be more pure scorers, while forwards are more well-rounded passers/scorers. I have no idea if that's how it really is or not, but that's my experience. Based on that, in the 4-4-2, I try to use 1 striker and 1 forward. It has worked well for me so far.

[ice4277]

Originally posted by EagleFan
One more question. I see some listed as forward and others as striker. What is the difference, as far as where you would play them?

I have a forward with exceptional passing skills that I have played at the top of the diamond in the midfield with a free roll. Is that an okay strategy or am I asking for trouble?

Sorry about all the questions, still trying to grasp outdoor tactics.

Yes, I would think the forward would be able to play pretty good there. 'Forward' in CM parlance is somebody who is more of a playmaker, whereas a 'striker' is more of an out-and-out goalscorer.

Tactics-wise, I am a big fan of the 4-4-2, but CM4 seems to be much more adaptable than previous versions in allowing you to use tactics customed for your team. One way I change tactics up is by going into a more defensive formation for tough away matches, such as trips to Old Trafford, etc. It's basically a 4-5-1 with a midfielder laying deep between 4 other mids and 4 defenders, with one attacking playing pushing up from midfield to assist the lone striker. It works fairly well, while I do give up a lot of shots and don't get many myself, I find most of the shots the other team gets tend to be very low-percentage, while I get one or two very good scoring chances on counterattacks. It helps to have a very skillful forward in this situation, as well.

[condors]

eaglefan

most important thing is to look at what your players do well and build that into the tactic

also if your guy has a 16 pace accerlation it makes a big difference if he is playing in div2 or the premier league

If you change formation give the players some time before rushing to judgement, you can and should tweak things based on your oppenent, I have had great success getting speed in the conferance and playing all but 1 guy behind the ball and putting a long thru ball for my fast player to run to, against teams with fast enough defenders though i normally will lose a low scoring game.

i am not saying to do this but look at your players and thier strengths make a little note about what they can do (i write it on a piece of paper) so if you bring in a sub you should tweak the tactic a little based on your players, if your playing a team that is way better than you (cup games for example) you may play for a 0-0 tie then bring on 3 rested forwards in the last 10 minutes to try to get a 1-0 win.

good luck

[Karim]

My understanding is that a Forward is like a hybrid between a Striker and Attacking Midfielder, being able to play both positions.

For lower league teams, I definitely second the idea of keeping your tactics very simple, and targetted toward your best players. So unfortunately, patience is a must...

[BigDPW]

If I have a solid forward with good passing skill like you mentioned I like to play him up front with a great finisher with good anticipation and acceleration... I then have the forward set to "Hold Up Ball" and "Through Passes"... That seems to work well in getting good shots...

My best combo using this tactic is with Teddy Sheringham and Robbie Keane with Tottenham Spurs... I actually have Sherinham as the passer and Keane as the finisher but it could also work in reverse for the two of them...

I suppose it would also work though maybe not as well with a forward playing an AMC role slotted behind a lone Striker...

I also tend to use "Counter Attacking - ON" with quality forwards who have great anticipation, acceleration, pace, and finishing... Though I would try to use it with your forwards never "Closing Down" so that they are down the field when the ball is played to them... I also tend to use "Mixed Passing" when employing this counter attacking formation as the defenders and midfielders are more likely to play the ball up to the forwards or in front of them than when short passing is on...

[EagleFan]

Thanks to all for their responses. I think I have a much better idea of how to approach it now. It takes us ignorant Americans a while to figure out this soccer thing. :D

[EagleFan]

Oh, one last thing. What is 'behind the ball'? If I choose that, does that mean that my entire team comes back to play defense? Or am I missing something there?

[ice4277]

Originally posted by EagleFan
Oh, one last thing. What is 'behind the ball'? If I choose that, does that mean that my entire team comes back to play defense? Or am I missing something there?

Basically, yes, your team will adapt a very defensive posture. I would only use this if your team is playing in defensive or ultra-defensive mode; and for that matter, I wouldn't plan on using it for the whole game. Basically the other team will keep posession for the vast majority of the game, and are bound to get a couple quality scoring chances sooner or later. It's good to use, for me, if I'm struggling to maintain a lead/tie at the end of a half or game against superior opposition, usually for about 15 mins. or so.