A's Close to Trading for Escobar!

[ISiddiqui]

http://www.tsn.ca/mlb/news_story.asp?id=48093

ESPN’s Peter Gammons reports the Blue Jays and Oakland A’s are close to completing a deal which would send Escobar to the Bay Area in return for pitchers Ted Lilly and prospect Joe Blanton.

Escobar, 27, is 5-6 with a 4.72 ERA. He opened the season as the Jays closer, but was moved to the starting rotation in May. The native of Venezuela has shown flashes of brilliance since moving into the starter’s role but has had trouble with consistency.

Lilly, 27, is 5-7 with a 4.95 ERA. The one time Yankee prospect was expected to be a solid fourth option behind the A’s ‘big 3’ pitchers, but he never really panned out the way the A’s expected this season. The left-hander has given up 110 hits in 105 innings with 80 strikeouts.

Blanton, 22, is 7-7 with a 2.71 ERA with single-A Kane County. The 6-3 right-hander who was taken in the first round of the 2002 draft has struck out 130 batters in 126 innings this season.

Looks like an interesting deal. The key looks to be Blanton for the Jays. It seems Oakland is gearing up for a run at the WC, while the Jays are continuing to trade stars for younger players.

[JeeberD]

I thought that he was in a room in hell with Hitler, Mussolini, and Stalin? :confused:

[JPhillips]

Jeeber: I agree. Pablo Escobar is most certainly dead. But even if he were alive I would doubt whether he could help the A's. Sure he'd be a terror on the mound(fastball,curve, slider, or bullet to the head?), but his game requires stealth and an ability to hide. Oakland has just too much publicity for Escobar to fit. Maybe this is the end of the Beane brilliance?

[Ksyrup]

Are Riccardi and Beane going to become the Randy Smith/Tal Smith of this decade? And I wonder if Riccardi will be Beane's bitch just like Randy was Tal's?

[bbor]

22 at single A?

that can't be good

[ISiddiqui]

Well I guess he'll soon be elevated to AA. He got good ERA and SO numbers at A.

[Alan T]

I am trying to figure out why the A's think Escobar is that much of an upgrade over Lilly...

[ISiddiqui]

Same here... maybe they think they can do something with that talent. The A's pitching coaches seem to be amazing (see Foulke and Koch last year and this).

[Iceberg]

Originally posted by bbor
22 at single A?

that can't be good

22 is not too old for A ball. Most college players would enter pro ball at this level or lower and if they went 4 years they would most likely be 22 at the time they are drafted.

[Alan T]

Originally posted by ISiddiqui
Same here... maybe they think they can do something with that talent. The A's pitching coaches seem to be amazing (see Foulke and Koch last year and this).

I actually thought that was a great deal for the A's. I thought Koch was way overrated because of the saves, and I thought the White Sox terribly mismanaged Foulke.. I just havent found what the thinking was in this one.. Escobar has been fairly mediocre in any role he has been in. (MR, Closer, Starter, whatever)

[ISiddiqui]

Escobar did do very well as a starter earlier this year. He has flashes of brilliance, no doubt. Maybe the A's can harness that.

[lynchjm24]

Originally posted by Ksyrup
Are Riccardi and Beane going to become the Randy Smith/Tal Smith of this decade? And I wonder if Riccardi will be Beane's bitch just like Randy was Tal's?

Yeah the way he got suckered into taking Eric Hinske was awful. Lilly and Escobar are pretty similar, except one of them is a lot cheaper.

Throwing around the word 'star' and talking about Kelvim Escobar. That's funny stuff.

Lilly is 27 and most importantly left-handed. Escobar is expensive and right handed, although he switch hits (at the plate that is).

[Maple Leafs]

Originally posted by Ksyrup
Are Riccardi and Beane going to become the Randy Smith/Tal Smith of this decade? And I wonder if Riccardi will be Beane's bitch just like Randy was Tal's? So far Ricciardi has more than held his own against his old master.

Besides, he may be the only GM left who'll trade with Beane after Moneyball.

[bbor]

Personally i like Escobar...i think most of his problems are above his neck.

[Ksyrup]

Originally posted by Maple Leafs
So far Ricciardi has more than held his own against his old master.

Besides, he may be the only GM left who'll trade with Beane after Moneyball.

The analogy was more for the amount of trades that have and probably will occur between them than anything else. The other was just for fun, since Randy got taken to the cleaners several times. Riccardi's probably too smart to allow that happen.

[daedalus]

Ricciardi probably also knows the players in the A's system better than anybody besides Billy Beane and Grady Fuson.

[Neuqua]

Originally posted by Alan T
I actually thought that was a great deal for the A's. I thought Koch was way overrated because of the saves, and I thought the White Sox terribly mismanaged Foulke.. I just havent found what the thinking was in this one.. Escobar has been fairly mediocre in any role he has been in. (MR, Closer, Starter, whatever)

You are right on about everything in that post. I said it then and I'll say it again, whenever Kenny Williams sees "Beane, Billy" on his caller ID, JUST LET THE ANSWERING MACHINE PICK IT UP! Nothing good can come from that conversation. I'm a diehard Cubbie fan but still happened to watch a couple White Sox games last year and the way the Sox handled Foulke was terrible mismanagement. He struggled early and then was never given the chance to prove himself again. What's worse is the White Sox apparently sent a very solid MR prospect with Foulke in the deal. Hell, Koch isn't even their closer anymore.

[neofied]

I don't like the idea of the above trade. But the following, as reported on Sportsline's Rumor Mill sounds scarier:

The San Francisco Chronicle reported the Athletics are talking to the Pirates about obtaining outfielder Brian Giles. The A's are unwilling to part with three untouchables -- shortstop Bobby Crosby, center fielder Nick Swisher or starting pitcher Rich Harden. The Beaver County (Pa.) Times reported second baseman Mark Ellis and outfielder Eric Byrnes along with some minor leaguers could be part of the package for Giles.

They can't give up Crosby, because of Tejada's eventual departure. Harden is another potential ace in the hole.

But Ellis and/or Byrnes? That's fucking crazy. Giles is good, but not worth giving up two of your better young players for.

Also, Sportsline still reports that the A's are still in the market for Juan Gone. Isn't he damaged goods?

I'll be the first to admit the A's need something to make winning the Wild Card easier and perhaps even climb in the race with the Mariners. But, giving up core players isn't the way to do it.

[daedalus]

As a pseudo-fan (not a diehard, I just like the way the franchise is run), I would be sad to see Ellis leave the club. On the other hand, Esteban German is suppose to also have the ability to be a major leaguer (I've never seen him play, only read about him). While I think Byrnes is a pretty good player, I don't think he'll ever become much more than a slightly above average outfielder (say, .270-15-70 with average centerfield defense). I don't think an outfield of Terrance Long-Eric Byrnes-Adam Piatt will take you very far. I think Giles would be a great pickup for them.

[andy m]

adding Giles would be outstanding, he is not merely 'good', he's better than that. i think if you are a fan, you want your team to actually make a push at winning - why not take a risk and acquire a difference maker like Giles?

[neofied]

Good points on both fronts there. German is supposedly a good 2Ber.

I've also heard some rumblings that if they could resign Tejada, they always could move Crosby to 2B or something like that. From my understanding the A's do have enough MI depth to avoid any trouble.

My thinking is that if you package Ellis, Byrnes and a player to be named prospect than you should get Giles and a player to be named prospect from the Pirates (Josh Higgins perhaps ... who is reportedly an impressive sleeper in Single A).

It'll be interesting to see what the A's do. You gotta figure Billy Beane is going to make at least one nutty move in the next few days.

[lynchjm24]

Originally posted by Neuqua
You are right on about everything in that post. I said it then and I'll say it again, whenever Kenny Williams sees "Beane, Billy" on his caller ID, JUST LET THE ANSWERING MACHINE PICK IT UP! Nothing good can come from that conversation. I'm a diehard Cubbie fan but still happened to watch a couple White Sox games last year and the way the Sox handled Foulke was terrible mismanagement. He struggled early and then was never given the chance to prove himself again. What's worse is the White Sox apparently sent a very solid MR prospect with Foulke in the deal. Hell, Koch isn't even their closer anymore.

Yeah I'd hate to pick up Miguel Olivo for Chad Bradford. Beane is a great GM, but Oakland has given up players in deals over the years as well.

[lynchjm24]

Originally posted by neofied

But Ellis and/or Byrnes? That's fucking crazy. Giles is good, but not worth giving up two of your better young players for.



Giles is worth 10 Mark Ellis and Eric Byrnes. There is no way in the world that these 2 guys alone could get Giles, it would have to be these 2, plus 2 A-/B+ prospects.

[Ksyrup]

Originally, the Pirates were offered 4 of the following:

Eric Byrnes, Mark Ellis, OF Nick Swisher, RHP Aaron Harang, RHP Shane Komine, LF John Rheinecker and INF Freddie Bynum.

Now, they are apparently asking for one of the "untouchables." And, with the trade of Ramirez, they might not be willing to deal Giles at all.

Oakland has got to do something offensively. Terrence Long, Jermaine Dye, and Durazo all suck. Durazo's been the biggest disappointment. He's on pace to put up the same numbers in 500+ ABs that he put up with Arizona in 300 ABs.

[Alan T]

Originally posted by lynchjm24
Yeah I'd hate to pick up Miguel Olivo for Chad Bradford. Beane is a great GM, but Oakland has given up players in deals over the years as well.

That is why teams will still end up dealing with Beane despite the moneyball book supposedly hurting his ability to trade. This entire run where Beane has done an outstanding job has not necessarily been conning other teams to give him something for nothing. He has given some pretty decent players back.

Originally posted by Ksyrup
Durazo's been the biggest disappointment. He's on pace to put up the same numbers in 500+ ABs that he put up with Arizona in 300 ABs.

Well it is not all park factors, but you have to say something for going from one of the best hitters parks to one of the worst hitters parks I suppose. Still.. I thought Durazo would at least be a little better than that.

[Ksyrup]

Rotoworld is reporting that Giles may be moved to San Diego:



The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette says that the Pirates are not done purging payroll, and that Brian Giles could be dealt in the next week, perhaps to the Padres.

The Padres are one of the teams listed as acceptable in Giles' limited no-trade clause. San Diego is obviously not trying to win this year, but to put an attractive, competitive product on the field for the opening of Petco Park in 2004. No word on what the Padres would have to give up, but it would have to be an impressive package involving prospects such as shortstop Khalil Greene, second baseman Josh Barfield, or first baseman Tagg Bozied.

[Alan T]

Petco park.. how appropriate for a team that is going to play like a dog..

[cuervo72]

Originally posted by Alan T
Petco park.. how appropriate for a team that is going to play like a dog..

Are the players going to be allowed to relieve themselves on the field? They could dub the park the "Litter Box".

[ISiddiqui]

If Oakland can make the deal for Giles with Ellis and Byrnes, I say go for it. Giles is a great player, which they'll sorely need when Tejada leaves... even if he doesn't.

[Ksyrup]

Petco Park - of all the luck, to have it in San Diego, the only place in America where there are no "Dog Days of Summer."

[Anrhydeddu]

Originally posted by Alan T
Petco park.. how appropriate for a team that is going to play like a dog..

Hey. :(

[cuervo72]

Originally posted by lynchjm24
Yeah I'd hate to pick up Miguel Olivo for Chad Bradford. Beane is a great GM, but Oakland has given up players in deals over the years as well.

You mean the Miguel Olivo who currently has a BA of .221 and an OBP of .269???

[daedalus]

Ksyrup . . . I can't see Swisher being one of the names offered since he's supposedly one of their three 'untouchables'.

I definitely agree with Alan T about Beane's dealing. Most of his deals haven't been where he's fleeced the other team (think, say, of when Lasorda had his brief run as the Dodgers GM and gave away anyone resembling good young players the Dodgers had).

[Ksyrup]

I got that info off of Rotoworld.com. Sometimes their info comes straight from newspapers, other times they make an educated guess. Not sure which applies in this case.