PING: Atlanta Sports Radio Fans

[CamEdwards]

Rumors are Arnie Spanier's on his way out, to be replaced by Christopher Rude, currently doing afternoons at 96 Rock.

Discuss.

[VPI97]

Rude is worse than Arnie.

Edit - Maybe I was too harsh...but Rude has a week long guest spot on one of the sports shows last month and he added nothing.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Big picture -- I can see it as a possibility. Rude's ratings have been trending flat to down over the past year & with the WKLS morning show posting it's best number in a year in the Sp03 book, they could be viewing him as a weak spot. Meanwhile, 680's morning show is pretty much a non-entity, even compared to the rest of the station's dayparts, much less compared to the rest of the market.

Little picture -- there's a reason Rude went from mornings to afternoons. His schtick is tired & he's not even a top 7 possibility for my own listening habits. He's a guy who may have been in one market too long & I don't think he'll prove worth much to 680 beyond a one book cume bump as some of his existing audience samples the station short-term.

[KWhit]

Arnie is God-awful. I don't know Rude, but he has to be better than Arnie.

I am typically a 790 listener, but GrantDawg and others talked me into giving 680 another try. The morning show is painful to listen to because of Arnie, IMO. I can't listen to that guy without wanting to drive into a telephone pole.

790 screwed up when they messed around with their midday lineup. I can't listen to them between 10-3 any more. So 680 is better. I like Max Howell pretty well, so I like that show. I'll refrain from discussing the Radio Factor right now, except to say that 680 loses major points for having that on.

Afternoons are a wash. I think it depends on what sports season you're in. If you want baseball talk, Chris Dimino cannot be beat. He may be the best host going in Atlanta. But if you want college football talk (especially Dawg talk), Buck and Kincade are the way to go (even though Chuck Oliver does a good job as well). So I always flip back and forth on my drive home between these two shows.

One other point that drives me crazy about 680 is all the stupid sound effects that they throw into the shows. 790 does it some too, but nowhere near as often as 680. Let the guys talk! We don't need the sound effects.

[Alan T]

I never cared for Arnie on his national show, but they are putting in Rude? You kidding me?

I don't know that this is a step in the right direction...

[VPI97]

I try listening to 790 every now and then, but Steak and the morning show rarely talk about sports and Chris Diminio is the most annoying radio host I've ever heard. It was worse when he was with Nick Cellini (whatever happened to him?), but now that Nick is gone, at least I don't avoid 790 like the plague. I do like the Stewart brothers, though.

Either way, Buck and Kincade is the best show on either station...with Fro and Ellinger coming a close second.

[Celeval]

I'm almost purely 790, simply because there's more Tech talk there usually - 2 Live Stews are pretty good, but I don't listen more than a half hour at a time in the middle of the day anyhow. I'll second Dimino and baseball - I'd tune in to his show just for the Hall of Fame interviews he does.

[Buzzbee]

Rude to 680? Say it ain't so! Arnie isn't the greatest, and can be downright annoying sometimes, but Christopher Rude has NO business on a Sports Radio station. Unless of course Mike Thompson is trying to move away from that. Hmmm. Add Bill O' Reily. Then remove Arnie and add Rude. Before long they'll replace Max Howell with Dr. Laura. What a waste.

As for listening to 790, I've tried listening to "Two Live Stew's" instead of O'Reily, but I'm too white to decipher it for more than 30 minutes, dog.

Fro and Ellinger are ok. Ellinger knows his stuff and talks with passion, but he can be loud and overbearing. Fro comes across to me as just fill-in type stuff with no real meat.

All in all, I HOPE they don't move Rude in on 680. I got tired of Boortz's pompous attitude, but would switch in a heartbeat over Rude.

[GrantDawg]

I don't know anything about Rude (I never listen to the music stations unless it is on the weekends), but Arny is just terrible. I'll be glad he is gone. I can't imagine anyone being as annoying as he is. If Rude knows nothing about sports, he'd still be better than Arny.

[KWhit]

Originally posted by Buzzbee
As for listening to 790, I've tried listening to "Two Live Stew's" instead of O'Reily, but I'm too white to decipher it for more than 30 minutes, dog.

I agree. I can't take all of that gangsta slang.

From 1:00-3:00 there is simply nothing decent on Atlanta Radio, IMO.

[Buzzbee]

Originally posted by KWhit
I agree. I can't take all of that gangsta slang.

From 1:00-3:00 there is simply nothing decent on Atlanta Radio, IMO.

Seconded.

[GrantDawg]

Originally posted by Buzzbee
Seconded.

Thirdeded. :)

Why didn't you put in for the position, Cam?

[Buzzbee]

What makes you think he didn't. After all, he IS the one who posted a thread about Atlanta radio even though he lives in Oklahoma City.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Fourthed.

And furthermore, Atlanta doesn't particularly show great interest in one sports station, two is definitely more than the market will support to any success. I keep hoping against hope that both stations will eventually realize that & one side will fold in with the other. Between them, there might be enough to make one decent station.

[Buzzbee]

We want Cam! We want Cam! We want Cam!!!

[CamEdwards]

Funny, but I think I'm done with sports talk. Honestly, it's so much easier to do straight talk radio. You only have to keep up with 50-100 people, as opposed to all the area sports teams.

Now I do have an Atlanta connection that might help me in the future... but I better stay mum about it for now. Don't want to jinx anything.

[GrantDawg]

Originally posted by CamEdwards
Funny, but I think I'm done with sports talk. Honestly, it's so much easier to do straight talk radio. You only have to keep up with 50-100 people, as opposed to all the area sports teams.

Now I do have an Atlanta connection that might help me in the future... but I better stay mum about it for now. Don't want to jinx anything.


I hope your going for the fore-mentioned 1-3 somewhere. Really need something (but I would prefer sports talk. I have grown weary of political talk-radio shows).

[Buzzbee]

Boortz is what drove me to sports talk radio. I like the political aspects of his show, but can't take the aggrandizing egotist that Boortz has become.

[CamEdwards]

Originally posted by Buzzbee
Boortz is what drove me to sports talk radio. I like the political aspects of his show, but can't take the aggrandizing egotist that Boortz has become.

If that's the case, you'd hate me. :)

There's nothing specific in Atlanta for me right now... but you never know what might happen in the future.

[Buzzbee]

Well shit. They made the announcement today at 9am. Starting October 1st Christopher Rude will be doing the morning show on 680 the fan.

After the announcement they had a segment called "ask the program director". He basically got slammed for making the change.

Main comments were along the lines of:

"It's only been a year and your making a change?"
"It took a while, but Arnie kinda grew on me and now your yanking him away."
"I've listened for a long time, but don't know if I'll listen anymore."

In MY opinion, they are making a mistake. Short term they MIGHT get a boost from Rude fans from 96 Rock. However, I don't see that lasting. FM listeners don't tend to switch to AM because of a DJ. I think long term this will hurt.

On a slightly positive side, there is at least SOMETHING to listen to between 2 & 3. Dan Patrick will be on the air from 2-5 on 680's sister station, 1340.

What a shitty start to the day.

[GrantDawg]

Did they say he was straight up replacing Arny and keeping the other two? Is it going to be a sports show?

[GrantDawg]

dola: I heard Buck and Kincade say there would be announcement this morning followed by "Ask the Program Manager" and I knew what it was. Thanks for the heads-up Cam.

[Buzzbee]

Originally posted by GrantDawg
Did they say he was straight up replacing Arny and keeping the other two? Is it going to be a sports show?

Nope. Not a straight up replace. Whole new show. Martina is no longer on the station. :( Rob Tribble is moving to the Buck & Kincade show.

I think Jeff Taves is supposed to have some sort of role with Rude, but I think it is basically sports updates.

[GrantDawg]

Originally posted by Buzzbee
Nope. Not a straight up replace. Whole new show. Martina is no longer on the station. :( Rob Tribble is moving to the Buck & Kincade show.

I think Jeff Taves is supposed to have some sort of role with Rude, but I think it is basically sports updates.

No more Martina! That is sad. So this is just going to be his old morning show? That stinks. I guess 680 is moving away from sports.

[Alan T]

I have not seen every station Mike THompson has gone to, but he seems to be big into Guy talk radio moreso than sports talk radio. I have seen him do that a few places now where he has taken a sports radio station and changed the format a little bit where its more like a Man show on radio with sports mixed in. It has been real successful some places, and not quite as successful other places...

Sounds like he is doing that here too.

[Buzzbee]

Originally posted by GrantDawg
No more Martina! That is sad. So this is just going to be his old morning show? That stinks. I guess 680 is moving away from sports.

I think they are just moving away from having listeners.

I understand from JonIMG that the ratings for O'Reily have been quite good for 680, but I know I don't listen anymore. I'm hoping this flops and they quickly can Rude.

[VPI97]

I don't understand the decision because the people that I know who like Rude are FM radio listeners, not AM talk/sports radio people. If that's the new listeners that 680 is trying to attract, I doubt they'll be able to find the AM button on their radio, much less navigate to 680.

[CamEdwards]

Originally posted by VPI97
I don't understand the decision because the people that I know who like Rude are FM radio listeners, not AM talk/sports radio people. If that's the new listeners that 680 is trying to attract, I doubt they'll be able to find the AM button on their radio, much less navigate to 680.

Funny you should mention that. One of the news/talk startups here in town hired a former #1 FM jock as their "big gun". 9 months after going on the air, he's already been moved once, and the station has yet to crack a .9 in the ratings.

Sometimes bringing in an FM guy can work (look at Glenn Beck's success)... sometimes not.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Buzzbee -- I don't know if there's much of anything that can be done to make the sports format into a major player in Atlanta. But I'll agree wholeheartedly that "guy talk" will simply drive the numbers down even further.

Without going into way too much detail:

There's a simply a limited amount of interest in the genre, at least if the numbers are any indication. On the whole (Mon-Sun 6a-12m), the cume for the two stations in the past six months (which includes duplicates who listened to both at any time) ranks no higher than 19th in the market with M25-54. Put another way, more men 25-54 have listened to "The Fish" than have listened to either sports talker. And if you make the audience younger (M18-44), the gap between sports talk & the rest of the pack gets worse.

Meanwhile, Arnie simply wasn't holding up his end of the collective bargain. Unless you believe that "Mayhem In the A.M." is just too good to be beaten :rolls eyes:

In the last six months, 790 soundly clobbered 680 from 6a-10a. From that point foward, 680 beats 790 by varying degrees every single hour of the day up to 6 p.m (when signal strength comes into play).

Meanwhile, O'Reilly's numbers in an average quarter hour are higher than the morning numbers of the two stations combined

Looking at the numbers in more detail, I think what may 680 may be looking for is not to make any major gain overall, but rather to gain just enough to beat 790 in the early morning. That's at least possible although I don't believe "guy talk" is going to do it.

[Buzzbee]

JIMG - Since you brought up ratings, I've been curious about how they work and have wanted to ask you and/or Cam about them.

My household was selected by Arbitron a few months ago to record our radio listening habits. In the booklet you would write down the times of the day that you heard a particular station, even if it was while you were in the doctor's office or Wal-Mart.

So if I drive to work and listen to 680 from 8:35 to 9:10 I would write that down. Clark Howard from 3:20 to 4:00, likewise.

What I'm curious about is how they assimilate all that data. Do they take the total number of people that listened to a station between 9:00 and 9:15? Is it an average of how many listened in a particular period?

Also, in the instructions for recording our time it said that once we had been selected it was likely that we would never be selected again, or if we were it would be a very long time. How big is the sample size? I imagine it would depend on the total size of the market, but am curious if a relatively small number of people determine the ratings.

One last subject - internet listeners. I imagine the station can determine the number of listeners based on the number of connections, but can they determine demographics? Age? Gender? Location? Or do they care? How do internet listeners affect the advertising and such?

[CamEdwards]

Buzzbee,

Jon would probably know more about the ins and outs of Arbitron than I would, but I'll comment on the sample size.

In Oklahoma City, there are approximagely 900,000 households. I think the last ratings period relied on 2400 diaries.

This leads to what we here in Oklahoma City call "Arbitron Voodoo".

[Buzzbee]

I figured as much. For some reason the number 3500 sticks in my mind for Atlanta.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Buzzbee -- 3728 diaries "in-tab" for Atlanta Spring '03
(Persons 12+)

As you might suspect, I've got a variety of thoughts about Arbitron & the numbers, pro & con. But I'm short on time at the moment (daddy-duties call). I'll try to get back to this thread on Friday but in the meantime ...

A short version of the survey process is here:
http://arbitron.com/ad_agencies/survprocess.htm

There's not a lot of depth there but it's a decent little overview for anyone who doesn't have much background with Arbitron.

I was surprised to discover that there wasn't something similar to this at Arbitron.com or acnielsen.com but I've always thought the Gallup FAQ about "how polls are conducted" does a good job of explaining how small samples provide surprisingly accurate results.
http://gallup.com/help/FAQs/poll1.asp

Without getting deeper into it tonight, I certainly agree with Cam about the really of "Arbitron voodoo". The trick (or dare I say, "the art" :) ) is figuring out what's voodoo & what's real.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Dola ...

Buzzbee -- I don't think there's much in that Arbitron link you haven't already seen (your comment about it being unlikely to ever be chosen again is straight from their website, you've probably seen the stuff on the link in your respondent kit). I just thought it might be of interest to anybody else still following along the thread.

As for the internet, there's a link to that specific genre at arbitron.com
I'm almost certain they break it out by demographic but I'm not sure what the methodology is. Yes, the information would be of interest to both station & advertiser alike, although I have to admit that I've never had a client who gave a damn about internet listeners & it's rare that a station even mentions them to us. And on the rare occasions it's been mentioned to me, it's only come from stations that really don't have much else to hang their hat on.
Not saying there aren't stations who market that tool effectively, just saying I've never run across one.

[CamEdwards]

Jon, tell me if my thoughts are all that different from yours.

I think Arbitron is a good general barometer of how various stations are trending (more listenership, less time spent listening, etc.) but I'm always fairly doubtful of big gains or losses for a particular station, and I take the actual ratings with a fairly large grain of salt. It seems in every ratings book there's a station that you can look at say "there's the voodoo at work" in either a good way or a bad way.

[GrantDawg]

Just as a follow-up on this: Rude's sidekick has been chosen and it is Jamie Dukes. That suggests the show will focus on sports, but will go a little bit of everywhere (as does most of the programming). That's good news. I like Dukes, and hopefully Rude will not be the juvenile idiot I heard he was on 96 Rock.

[Celeval]

To toss onto the end of it - Nick Cellini is coming back to 790 as well (he used to be one of the drive-home guys) to 790's morning show (Mayhem). Heh, that might talk me into moving away from 790 during my rush hour drive in; and moving towards music.

Kevin

[Buzzbee]

Originally posted by GrantDawg
Just as a follow-up on this: Rude's sidekick has been chosen and it is Jamie Dukes. That suggests the show will focus on sports, but will go a little bit of everywhere (as does most of the programming). That's good news. I like Dukes, and hopefully Rude will not be the juvenile idiot I heard he was on 96 Rock.

Christopher Rude and Jamie Dukes. What an ODD mix. Guess it's back to Boortz for me.