Fire Wannstedt now, or later?

[Leonidas]

Seems the only drama left in the Dolphins season is whether they fire Dave Wannstedt during or after the season. I think if they are gonna do it, now's the time. The team can't get any lower than today's game. That was a team that looked like it would rather have been anywhere else than playing a game.

I bet they won't can him now, but barring something really, really dramatic happening, he's a lame duck head coach.

[bosshogg23]

I cant imagine he is fired now. Unless he is in the AFC championship game I think he will be fired after the season though.

Gotta love the offense they displayed today...

[Cringer]

I don't know.....you should base it on wether or not he finds that boob cartoon from Mizz funny or not.........

[Robbiero67]

I also highly doubt that Wanny will be fired before the season ends. I've even heard rumors that Huizenga is so loyal to him that a first round playoff victory would likely save his job. However, the way the 'Fins are playing lately its doubtful they'll even get close to the wild card.

As for the offense, it was truly horrid to watch. The coaches knew the O-line was a great weakness heading into the offseason yet the only moves they made were through late round draft picks and undrafted free agents. They flirted briefly with OT Wayne Gandy (who eventually signed with the Saints), and former OT Richmond Webb, but aside from those they made no real effort at signing a veteran lineman. LT Wade Smith (2003, 3rd rounder)might eventually pan out and played well early in the year, but over the past two weeks Dwight Freeney (IND) and Jevon Kearse have given him fits. It would also be nice to have a real NFL #2 receiver behind Chambers.

Oh well, at least the Bills lost...

[Cringer]

Originally posted by Cringer
I don't know.....you should base it on wether or not he finds that boob cartoon from Mizz funny or not.........

sorry, i meant from Maximus.....:p

[tucker342]

I doubt that they would fire him now. But damn, he's a crappy coach...

[DolphinFan1]

I couldn't believe that the coaching staff didn't put either a second TE or another back on that LT side to help. It was painful to watch my Dolphins like that. But all of us Dolphin Fans have to stick together. We may pull this season out yet. Have faith.


DF

[Robbiero67]

I believe the Dolphins can still pull out a great year, past precedent has shown us that it can be done. A couple of the most recent AFC representatives in the Super Bowl have begun their seasons at 4-4, similar to Miami's 5-4 mark. They definitely have the talent on defense and at least some potential on the other side of the ball. Still I don't see Wannestedt being the Coach to lead this team through the turmoil. Reading recent quotes on the Miami Herald's webpage make it appear as if some of the players (notably Jason Taylor...) have begun to point fingers at Wanny. It looks like he has lost much, if not all of their confidence.
[http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/sports/football/7222466.htm[/URL]

Further the article states that Huizenga will meet with Wanny on Tues., not to get rid of the coach, but to talk to him about the disappointing year thus far.

[pjstp20]

In the article Wannstedt metions that the offense is one dimensional. I wonder what one dimension he's refering to. As a Dolphin fan I'm sad to say this season is over. I hope to be proven wrong but I doubt I will be. Get rid of Wannstedt, bring in Brunell and some O-Line help in the offseason and lets have high hopes for next year, that will probably be dashed, again.

[Tekneek]

I don't know what to think anymore. All the moves since running Shula out have not taken the team any further. Nothing is served by firing the coach right now. Ride it out. Give the players a chance to play for their jobs. Who knows, things could turn around (but then we'd be stuck with the same head coach again).

I suppose, if you really have a desire for the coach to go you'd rather it be done today than give him a chance to save his job. If you just want to see the Dolphins do well, then I think you have to let the guy ride out the season. I don't know the numbers, but what usually happens to a team when their coach is fired during the season? My gut tells me they don't usually go on a winning streak, but I honestly don't know what the historical record is on those things.

[lytic]

Dave is a pretty bad coach... but it really is the O-lines fault that they are losing that bad.

[miami_fan]

I think you have to stay with Wanny until the end of the season. The only thing firing him would bring is Norv Turner as the head coach....Not too sure I want that either!

[Leonidas]

No, they won't can him in midseason. It just doesn't happen that way in the NFL. But my point is I think they'd be justified in doing it. The team clearly doesn't buy into his system anymore. Yesterday, that was a team that clearly didn't give a damn what happened. Junior Seau was the only guy I saw playing with any passion.

As for saying "Well other 5-4 teams have come back," yeah, other 5-4 teams that aren't playing this badly. They have yet to beat a team with a winning record and have a losing record at home. This team is simply not capable of pulling it together to challenge for any titles.

Finally, just who should they get to replace Wannstedt? Certainly nobody who is available right now. I tend to think of coaches as either builders or caretakers.

A caretaker is a guy who comes in to an already pretty good situation and doesn't screw it up and applies the proper tweaks and adjustments to keep things going. George Seifert replacing Bill Walsh is the best example of a caretaker I can think of.

A builder is a guy who rebuilds a team in trouble and delivers results. Bill Parcells and Bill Belichick are excellent examples.

Miami has been in caretaker status since 1985. It's time for a builder. Wannstedt tried all kinds of tweaks and adjustments and got nowhere. This team needs a new direction. Unfortunately they are already some $16M over the cap for next year. First challenge, how do you rebuild with that?

And who are some potential builders out there to take over? The only name coming to my mind is Nick Saban, and that's assuming he'd even want the job or wouldn't get hired by someone else first. Other than that my fear is they go after another of the "good ole boys" that routinely get hired and fired in the league, another worthless caretaker. They need to take a chance and find a future Belichick or Parcells.

I know there are some African-American coaches who got left out last year in the Mariucci/Erickson circus. Maybe one of those guys could be the one. Regardless, if they hire another Norv Turner/Dennis Erickson/Dick Jauron kind of retread, pardon me for being a bit less than enthused.

[pjstp20]

There's a rumor at Finheaven.com, a Dolphin message board, that Wannstedt is gonna resign today. The source is some radio station out of Miami. As for how credible this source is; they were able to predict who would be the starting QB for the Fins the past three weeks. Take it for what it's worth, I would be shocked if this happens. You can hear the weekly press conference at miamidolphins.com if you're interested.

[Robbiero67]

I agree Leonidas, the team has been playing poorly and are certainly deficient in terms of wideout and offensive line. Still before yesterday's debacle the margin of their previous three losses were by a combined point total of something like 13. Now while a loss is still a loss, they have been able to be in every single game with the exception of yesterday (and I do believe that in all the previous games they also led at certain points late in the game). Take a look at the losses before Tenn.:

Vs. Houston (Week 1): Dolphins lead late into the game until a Fiedler interception gave the Texans great field position to pull out the huge upset, final score 21-20.

Vs. N.E. (Week 7): Olindo Mare misses two mid-range, very makeable field goals (albeit both were attempted on dirt b/c of the Marlins). These misses force OT where the D gives up an 80+ yard TD pass to Brady. The Dolphins led this game 13-3 until late in the third and could not muster any further points.

Vs. Indy (Week 9): Fins pick off Manning with just a minute or so left and retain possession on the Colts 11. After one futile running play to Ricky Williams, Wade Smith allows Dwight Freeney to make his 800th hit on Griese that day causing yet another fumble and sealing another devastating loss. Final Indy 23 Miami 17.

Granted the Fins should have won all the aforementioned games, but either couldn't seem to hang on or come through in the last minutes. To me, it just appeared as if they were uninspired, totally devoid of any emotion, and just held a general carelessness. Sure, certain players made mistakes they should not have, but most of their lack of emotion and the lack of just "finishing" an opponent stems from a conservative, unemotional coaching staff. They were so conservative that in the Indy game they either refused or ignored the fact that the young rookie LT Wade needed some serious help containing/chipping Freeney. Yet what was their answer on their final offensive play: Send Ricky to help, why not an extra tight end (Lee???) or Konrad? It just did not make sense. Tough coaches may not always be the answer, but for this gutless team it is.

This team has the talent and potential to bounce back and make the playoffs. Will this happen in reality? Even though I am trying to remain optimistic it is doubtful. They probably will not turn it around, especially with their penchant for dropping 3-4 games in December.

As for Wannestedt being fired or resigning, I don't think it matters. The interim coach would likely be Norv Turner and he has shown throughout his years with the Redskins that he also lacks a certain charisma and emotion (like Dave W.). That is what the Dolphins need, a fiery coach, who they respect and fear.

[pjstp20]

Well doesn't look like Dave is calling it quits yet. The one thing that stood out to me in the press conference was his comments about Wade Smith. According to Wannstedt if you take out one play Smith had a good day yesterday. What????? I don't claim to know as much as Dave but I think I could see that the guy was constantly being beaten all day.

This is the kind of thing that pisses Dolphin fans off. It seems that sometimes Wannstedt is oblivious to the problems the Fins are having. Maybe he's singing another tune in the locker room but I doubt it. Thats why Dolphin fans want a guy like Parcells. Someone who will call a spade a spade, not someone whos trying to win a humanitarian award. Daves a nice guy but this team needs an asshole coach.

[lytic]

Charlie Wies, Dennis Green, Ray Rhodes & Lovie Smith are also some names of future Coaches that could rebuild

[Robbiero67]

I'm not sure about some of those guys and would hope they look elsewhere.

Weiss has had some health problems recently, and although it looks like he has fully recovered I'm not sure this team would be the best thing for his heart problems.

Green is a power monger and while that is not always bad, it usually sours (i.e., Holmgren in Seattle) as one man has trouble handling both coach and GM. I think this is what I heard Green wanted last year with the 49ers. I could be wrong, but even if I am Green could not handle the Vikings a few years back and I'd doubt his ability to handle the ego's with the Fins either.

Ray Rhodes is simply not head coach material as he has shown in both G.B. and Philly.

Lovie Smith is interesting and has helped to assemble a young and talented D in St. Louis. Had previous experience putting together Tampa Bay's vaunted D and is a good young coach. Former High School coach in Texas that has had a meteoric rise in the past decade.

Here are some names I'd be interested in seeing interviewed:

Al Saunders (Offensive Coordinator/Asst. Head Coach with the K.C. Chiefs): Is Vermeil's right hand man and has helped to rebuild KC and start them off 9-0. He has coached under Vermeil for the last three seasons, and coached under Marty Schottenheimer during some of his glory years when the Chiefs won 3 AFC West titles. He has also been a head coach, serving as the interim HC for San Diego 1986-88. He actually went 8-7 in 1987, winning eight straight with a team that had not seen a winning season in five years.

Bob Stoops (HC Oklahoma Sooners): If you are a fan of the Dolphins, then you have heard this name a lot recently. The likelihood of him coming to Miami is slim, but if he were to leave the college ranks I think this job would entice him. Of course, if I were him and looked at the successes (or lack thereof) of former college guys Butch Davis and Steve Spurrier I would probably stay put. Still this would be a good challenge for him and if he wins the Title this year that would already give him two with little left to prove in college.

Tyrone Willingham (HC Notre Dame): Good, solid coach and has done well with a talent-poor ND team. Again, I think he will stay with the Irish at this point.

Other possible choices: Mike Mularkey (OC -- Pittsburgh Steeler), Frank Beamer (HC-- Virginia Tech), Ted Cottrell (DC), Jim Mora Jr. (DC-- 49ers), Gary Kubiak (OC--Denver Broncos), and Nick Saban (HC--LSU, although he likely his headed to Chicago).

[Noop]

Wow there are sure alot of Dolphin fans in here.

[lytic]

<--- not a Dolphin fan, but I follow the AFC East closely...

[Kodos]

I say let Wanny stick around and completely sink the Dolphins this year. Then, tear the team apart next season, keeping a few key players like Zach Thomas, Chambers, Taylor, in place. Rebuild. Do not hire Dennis Green or some other retread. Certainly don't promote Norv Turner. Get some promising younger, hungry guy who is strong on discipline.

In Madden, I hired Mike Mularkey to replace Wanny. So that must be the way to go. :)

[lytic]

No Ricky Williams?

[Fritz]

Wanny will be around next season.

[miami_fan]

Originally posted by Fritz
Wanny will be around next season.
On what pregame show?:D

[pjstp20]

Originally posted by Fritz
Wanny will be around next season.

You wanna bet?

[Kodos]

Originally posted by lytic
No Ricky Williams?

Sure, include Ricky. Although he is not one of my personal favorites.

[Robbiero67]

Huizenga is as loyal as they come as far as owners these days, but there is no way he has Wanny stay. He'll probably issue an ultimatum in tommorrow's meeting to at least qualify for the wild-card round or Dave can forget about next year. As we've examined the Dolphins play so far this year...well, its not looking good for Wannestedt.

[Kodos]

It IS looking good for Kodos, though. :D

Oh, what a beautiful day it will be when he is officially removed as coach... It makes a boy's heart go all aflutter.

[illinifan999]

Fire him, and get Marvin Lewis. That's what I do in my Madden game. :p

Bring back Dan! Bring back Dan! ;)

[Tasan]

Oh course, they could always fire him and decide JJ needs another shot at it......



*runs from Kodos*

[pjstp20]

How about Tom Coughlin? He's a 180 degree change and he's a hard ass, just what this team needs