The Passion of the Christ(spoilers)

[stevew]

The main character(Jesus of Nazareth) dies.

[Franklinnoble]

Crap. So much for the sequel. What are they gonna do, bring him back to life or something?

[stevew]

Early word on the sequel is that it will be set 3 days after his death, and he will in fact, reveal himself to not be dead anymore.

[AgPete]

ROFL! :D But seriously, it looks like a great movie. I read that theaters already had to increase the showings from 2,000 to 3,000 because it's getting a lot of great reviews and hype.

[Franklinnoble]

Great. And they'll probably do a series of prequels, during which it'll turn out he was conceived without a human father or something like that.

[AgPete]

Great. And they'll probably do a series of prequels, during which it'll turn out he was conceived without a human father or something like that.

Just don't let George Lucas touch the original film! :eek: All we need is a CGI Jesus.

[JeeberD]

What, are they going to make him able to walk on water or something? Talk about exageration....

[Franklinnoble]

They're already cashing in on the merchandising. The Book is a best seller, and there's already people driving around with logos on their cars and such. Wait until kids start screaming for the Jesus Christ Happy Meal and asking for Pontius Pilate action figures for Christmas. Do you think EA will do a video game?

[stevew]

Lucas would probably have him do something like turning water into Wine

[JeeberD]

Wendy's is in the lead to have the kid's meal based on the movie. Kids will be able to choose between the Blood of Christ or the Body of Christ in their meal...

[stevew]

Out of the box, the Action Figure of Pilate has blood all over his hands. But if you dip them into cool water, suddenly they become clean.

[JeeberD]

Dola-

How much you wanna bet this thread sends us staight to hell...

[Franklinnoble]

Dola-

How much you wanna bet this thread sends us staight to hell...

Well, if you believe God is the Almighty Creator of all things on Heaven and Earth - including the people on this forum - then you've got to assume he has a sense of humor.

[JeeberD]

I wish I could spell when I was drunk... :(

[stevew]

Well, if you believe God is the Almighty Creator of all things on Heaven and Earth - including the people on this forum - then you've got to assume he has a sense of humor.

Plus they do make Jesus Christ action figures.

[JeeberD]

Plus they do make Jesus Christ action figures.

Word.

Artist: Podunk
Song Title: Dashboard Mary
Album: Throwin' Bones


Dashboard mary sing to me
Get me down this road
My feet are tired and I am hungry
I've got nowhere to go
And I've been driving for a while

Dashboard mary speak to me
I need to hear your voice
The road is winding and my time is flying
I need to feel this whole
And I've been driving for a while
Just give me something to get me through another mile

Give me love, give me love
I'll keep on driving while your spirit watches over me
Give me love, give me love
I'll keep on driving till tomorrow brings another day

Dashboard mary bless my soul
I'm all torn up inside
I've been riding to keep from crying
Help me find the light
Just give me something to get me through another mile

Give me love, give me love
I'll keep on driving while your spirit watches over me
Give me love, give me love
I'll keep on driving till tomorrow brings another day

Dashboard mary sing to me
Get me down this road
Just give me something to get me through this

Give me love, give me love
I'll keep on driving while your spirit watches over me
Give me love, give me love
I'll keep on driving till tomorrow brings another day

Give me love, give me love
I'll keep on driving while your spirit watches over me
Give me love, give me love
I'll keep on driving till tomorrow brings another day

[Franklinnoble]

I wish I could spell when I was drunk... :(


Dude... seriously... you gotta stop sitting around getting drunk by yourself on the weekends and sitting in front of the computer. Find a woman to spend the booze on, man.

[AgPete]

Plus they do make Jesus Christ action figures.

:D

http://store2.yimg.com/I/jsbstash_1771_6871171

[JeeberD]

Dude... seriously... you gotta stop sitting around getting drunk by yourself on the weekends and sitting in front of the computer. Find a woman to spend the booze on, man.

Actually, I was out with four gals tonight, and none of them were my girlfriend. I had quite the enjoyable evening... :)

[Chief Rum]

Lucas would probably have him do something like turning water into Wine

Why would Lucas have him do that when Lucas believes he can do it himself?

CR

[Chief Rum]

Do you think EA will do a video game?

This could be gold. Think about it.

[deep movie announcer voice]"...What role will you play? Can you deliver Jesus to the masses faster than Pilate? Can you deny Jesus more than the three times Peter did? Can you, foolish Roman soldier, avoid getting your ear cut off? Can you make Thomas believe without the whole disgusting 'touch my open wounds and believe' bit? Come into the seedy world of Israel circa 2000 years ago and see if you can Break Bread With The Man!"

I am going to hell. :)

CR

[mckerney]

I wish I could spell when I was drunk... :(

Lightweight.


EDIT: You're still better than Shorty though.

[JeeberD]

How many double vodka sours and Shiner Bocks have you had to drink tonight?

[JeeberD]

Dola-

My three year old neice is better than Shorty... :)

[mckerney]

How many double vodka sours and Shiner Bocks have you had to drink tonight?

Only had 3 beers left, which I drank one of, and I'm on my way though come Vodka and Lemonade and Captain and Cokes.

[JeeberD]

And you still weren't able to spell properly in the other thread. Lightweight... :p

Edit: Or this thread either. :D

[mckerney]

And you still weren't able to spell properly in the other thread. Lightweight... :p

Edit: Or this thread either. :D

When have I been able to spell properly?

[tucker342]

They're already cashing in on the merchandising. The Book is a best seller, and there's already people driving around with logos on their cars and such. Wait until kids start screaming for the Jesus Christ Happy Meal and asking for Pontius Pilate action figures for Christmas. Do you think EA will do a video game?

LOL!:D

[tucker342]

dola-

There's no way in hell I'm seeing this movie. After hearing some interviews that people have had with Mel Gibson after making the film, I've lost all of my respect for him.

[k0ruptr]

this movie bothers me, and I'm non religious.

seriously I know nothing about jesus or whoever this movie is about, or whatever.

[WussGawd]

The main character(Jesus of Nazareth) dies.

Oh, man. I was hoping he'd live this time. How utterly predictable.

In all seriousness, I am so deeply concerned with what a messed up, intolerant human being Mel Gibson is (e.g. his comments that his Episcopalian wife is going to hell because she's not Catholic, his father's comments in an interview a couple of years ago where he described the Holocaust as "greatly exaggerated") that I could never in good conscience spend a dime to watch this film, however great or terrible it might be. The Passion may or may not be anti-Semitic, but Mel Gibson almost certainly is.

[WussGawd]

Dola-

How much you wanna bet this thread sends us staight to hell...

Why, that means we're all... (gulp) DOOMED!

:D

[wig]

stevew is now Wig-Approved.

that's good stuff. :)

[stevew]

Oh, man. I was hoping he'd live this time. How utterly predictable.

In all seriousness, I am so deeply concerned with what a messed up, intolerant human being Mel Gibson is (e.g. his comments that his Episcopalian wife is going to hell because she's not Catholic, his father's comments in an interview a couple of years ago where he described the Holocaust as "greatly exaggerated") that I could never in good conscience spend a dime to watch this film, however great or terrible it might be. The Passion may or may not be anti-Semitic, but Mel Gibson almost certainly is.

Mel Gibson's dad is way over the edge.
But he is right on 1 point. The Jews DID kill Jesus.

[NoMyths]

If you're a Christian, God killed Jesus. The Romans and the Jews were just the tools through which His will was done. All the assigning of blame misses the point--he was supposed to die for the sins of Man. It wasn't like, whoops, someone accidentally offed the son of God out of spite...it was all part of the plan.

[stkelly52]

Oh, man. I was hoping he'd live this time. How utterly predictable.

In all seriousness, I am so deeply concerned with what a messed up, intolerant human being Mel Gibson is (e.g. ... his father's comments in an interview a couple of years ago where he described the Holocaust as "greatly exaggerated") that I could never in good conscience spend a dime to watch this film, however great or terrible it might be. The Passion may or may not be anti-Semitic, but Mel Gibson almost certainly is.
How can you fault Gibson for what his FATHER said. Can I start holding you responsible for every action that your dad has taken? That is just a ridiculous comment to make. I have heard nothing antisemitic from Gibson.

[wig]

Who gives a crap who killed Jesus.

Are any of those people still around?

[SackAttack]

Oh, man. I was hoping he'd live this time. How utterly predictable.

In all seriousness, I am so deeply concerned with what a messed up, intolerant human being Mel Gibson is (e.g. his comments that his Episcopalian wife is going to hell because she's not Catholic, his father's comments in an interview a couple of years ago where he described the Holocaust as "greatly exaggerated") that I could never in good conscience spend a dime to watch this film, however great or terrible it might be. The Passion may or may not be anti-Semitic, but Mel Gibson almost certainly is.

I don't know what context the comment about his wife was in, so I won't comment. If it was serious, that's a fairly shitty thing to say about one's wife, but it may have been meant in jest, as well.

As far as his father goes, just...no. You have absolutely no business calling Gibson anti-Semitic simply because his father shot his mouth off. What if your father said something like, say, black people are tools of the devil, and not worthy of being considered human, and black women are just vessels for the white man's sexual needs? Would that give me license to paint you as a misogynistic racist?

Grow up.

[stevew]

If you're a Christian, God killed Jesus. The Romans and the Jews were just the tools through which His will was done. All the assigning of blame misses the point--he was supposed to die for the sins of Man. It wasn't like, whoops, someone accidentally offed the son of God out of spite...it was all part of the plan.

Well Jesus IS God. And it was all part of the plan.

[WussGawd]

How can you fault Gibson for what his FATHER said. Can I start holding you responsible for every action that your dad has taken? That is just a ridiculous comment to make. I have heard nothing antisemitic from Gibson.

Hmm. He's already proven here (http://msnbc.msn.com/id/4224452/) that he's not very tolerant of Episcopalians, including his wife. For those who don't know, Episcopalian is about as close to Catholic as one could be and not be Catholic, so I can just imagine what his thoughts are about other Protestant sects.

As far as my admittedly thinly veiled accusation of anti-Semitism, if Mel thinks Protestants are going to hell, you can probably safely fill in the blanks on his thoughts about Buddhists, Muslims, Jews, Hindus, et al.

As for those who want to know about Hutton Gibson's interview, here's (http://www.newsday.com/entertainment/movies/ny-interview0220,0,1539836.story?coll=ny-movies-bigpix) a transcript of most of it from Newsday. If you read the rest of it, it's scarier than the Holocaust comment the media latched onto. This is pretty much standard American Nazi Party rhetoric (I know, I've had friends whose parents were involved in that crap, unfortunately).

Now, while some of you may think my comments are irresponsible, and certainly, you can't blame Mel Gibson for his father's comments, but judging by his own stated intolerance for Protestantism, it's pretty apparent, to me at least, that the apple at least fell within reach of the tree, as the saying goes.

I'll stand by my original statements. I could not, in good conscience, ever knowingly put another dime in Mel Gibson's pocket.

As for your suggestion that I grow up SackAttack, it's nice to know that my kettle and your pot are a nice matching ebony color.

[Airhog]

I believe that this "Apple never falls far from the tree" crap is pure bs. It just gives people an excuse for not liking somone because of how their parents act. Thats just like saying the kids of all rich people always grow up to be snobbish pricks, etc...

I dont excuse the comments from his dad, but I no way do I ever hold Someone responsible for their parents actions.

[ahbrady]

I have never understood how someone could have hatred for the Jews and claim to be a Christian. Jesus was a Jew, so was everyone else that wrote the New Testament. How could you hate someone just because they are Jewish and still claim that a Jew is your God? I don't get it. I realize their are many other places in the Bible that one could point to that would show that we should love all, but this is the most glaring oxymoronic thing that some that claim to be Christians do, in my opinion. If you are a Christian, which I am, then Jesus died so that we could be saved. Without that we would be lost, so I have a hard time being real hostile towards people that helped me have hope.

[Suicane75]

I believe that this "Apple never falls far from the tree" crap is pure bs. It just gives people an excuse for not liking somone because of how their parents act. Thats just like saying the kids of all rich people always grow up to be snobbish pricks, etc...

I dont excuse the comments from his dad, but I no way do I ever hold Someone responsible for their parents actions.


I don't care how much he may be supposed to love his father, I have not talked to my dad for 6 years because of his views and I once I reached the age where it could be avoided I never interacted with my Grandfather for the same reasons. "He's my father, let it be" is not enough, if he has any kind of backbone he would dissavow what his father says, unless of course he believes it himself.

[Chief Rum]

WussGawd, you are so out in left field, I don't know where to begin.

As has been said and you continue to just ignore--the actions of Mel Gibson's father are not the responsibility, nor necessarily the beliefs of Gibson himself. Not only is this logically inconsistent, it tells me a little something about you, in what kind of person you must be to attach something so horrible as pure hatred to a man because his father wasn't very enlightened.

Second, do you knwo the difference between hate and believing in the tenets of one's religion? Do you not know that in Roman Catholicism, if a person is not a spiritual person (specifically follows the Catholic religion), that person is believed to be going to Hell? This isn't a right and wrong thing, it's just pure belief. This is what the religion says. It also has nothing to do with the goodness of other religions or the inherent goodness of said person. If they don't believe in God as the Catholics put it down, they are going to Hell.

People who believe this don't hate other religions. They are simply stating what they believe, with no animosity. When Gibson says his wife is going to Hell, he is, from his perspective, merely stating a fact of his belief system.

Your leaps of logic seem to be immense. They certainly don't make any sense. Before you start targeting someone as being a hatemonger, maybe you should actually take a close look at your own biases and wonder why you would ignore these basic facts stated above when you go on your diatribes.

CR

[Suicane75]

Has Mel Gibson come out against his fathers statements?

[Chief Rum]

Does he need to? Once again, to think so is faulty logic.

Just because someone doesn't come out and set himself apart from another's statements, doesn't mean he necessarily believes them himself. Also, the elder Gibson's statements can be considered to be those of a small minority of people, wouldn't you say? If some crazy guy you know said crazy things and everyone knew the stuff he said was crazy, do you really feel you have to renounce that crazy stuff just to prove you don't believe the same thing?

You see, this idea is part of the problem for why the world is so screwed up today. People aren't accountable for what they do anymore. Instead, they're held accountable for the actions of people they know, as if they had a choice. No one wants personal responsibility to be important anymore, and everyone wants to play the blame game and paint everyone who doesn't agree with them as a bad man. It's ridiculous.

Something else to consider: it's his father. I'm sure that's an easy decision. "Hey, why don't I come out and tell the world my father is a nut, ain't that a great idea? Dad will love that..."

Gibson's silence on his father's statements (and I don't actually know that he hasn't said anything about it; we're probably making careless assumptions there, too) means absolutely nothing. They don't mean he agrees or disagrees with his father. The simple fact is we don't have enough information to know what Mel Gibson feels about his father's comments (once again, assuming he hasn't actually addressed the issue). He may, he may not. The problem is, at least one poster in this thread seems ready to "cricify" Gibson because of beliefs he may or may not have, and for which there is very little evidence he actually does have them--just this poster's logically inconsistent and even false suppositions.

I'm not saying Gibson's beliefs are right or that he doesn't agree with his father. I'm saying we don't know. And I am certain WussGawd doesn't know either. He just thinks he does.

CR

[Suicane75]

Ive seen a clip of an interview where the interviewer (either Diane Sawyer or Barbara Walters) asks him about his father, Gibsons reply is something to the effect of "it's my father, you have to leave it alone, we have to drop it". My point is simply that if your father comes out and says something as atrocious as he has, you have to distance yourself from it and call a bigot a bigot, wether he's your father or not. I know his father is a racist, I am holding accountable for his statements, I know what an idiot his father is, and if Gibson doesn't have the balls to say the same then yes, I do think less of him.

[Chief Rum]

You do what you want to.

Personally, I'm not going to hold it against a man for choosing to not rip his father to shreads on national television, no matter how crazy he is.

I'm also glad I am not your dad.

CR

[ISiddiqui]

Count me in as someone who believes that those who blame Mel for his father's statements are totally idiots. And I'm a non-believing Muslim.

[Suicane75]

You do what you want to.

Personally, I'm not going to hold it against a man for choosing to not rip his father to shreads on national television, no matter how crazy he is.

I'm also glad I am not your dad.

CR

Ya know why I make it clear that I don't talk to my dad or have anything to do with him? Cause when he walks around talking about nigger this and nigger that it does reflect on me, people heae him and know that that's my dad. I don't hang out with him and I don't see him but if I were sitting in a bar with him and he started that crap it would be perfectly logical for them to think that I thought the same way as he did, especially if I did nothing, and even more so If I half ass tried to explain it away by saying "awww shucks, thats just my dad, goin on about Niggers hangin from trees, what a coook he is."

[Chief Rum]

That's for you to decide. Personally, I don't give a damn what people think about me, or whether those impressions come from actions I have done, or actions of people I know. Obviously, you differ. That's okay, it takes all kinds.

While your father's situation certainly makes it easier to understand why you feel as you do about Gibson's non-actions regarding his father, you fail completely to understand that not everyone views their fathers the way you do, and, yes, believe it or not, it's pretty common for family to stand up for family. They know each other better than anyone else in the world, and they love each other. They know what's lovable about those people.

These hypothetical observers of your dad only hear his racist comments. But they don't know, let's say, how he might have busted his ass every day to give you a home and an education and a loving family. They don't know about what is good about him. I don't know you or your dad, so I don't know if he has any good in him. My point is just that it's a plain fact that most sons love their fathers--it's a natural human instinct.

And, once again, I don't think I can blame a guy for turning away from the opportunity to callously rip his father to threads on national TV. Do you have any idea what that woul do to a man, for his son to tear him apart in front of millions of people? If you love a person, for all his afults, even a racist father, would you willingly put that person through that?

I am sorry your father isn't so great. My dad had faults, too, and said plenty of irreverent things. Nonetheless, I know he was a good man, and I would defend him to my dying day and never say a word against him publically unless the urgency of truth in a situation far outweighed the sentimentality of keeping silent.

Not everyone is like you and your father. Best to learn that now.

CR

[Suicane75]

I realize not everyone is like my father, and I really dont need you to tell me that its best i learn that now as if i believe everyone in the world is like him. All Im saying is that id rather people KNOW where I stand on that issue than leave them wondering, and all Im saying is that Gibsons stance has left me wondering. Do I know for sure? No. Would I know for certain if he made it clear, Yes.

[Chief Rum]

No one is denying that, but your tone, at least to me, is one of belief in guilt on the part of Mel Gibson for having not spoken out against his father. I am just explaining why that is completely illogical and supposing the same thing you are: that we don't really know. You say now you don't really know, but before you made it seem like by not standing up to his father, Gibson must necessarily hold to the same beliefs.

As for me telling you not to view all father-son relationships the same as your own, I am sorry, but your failure to see the above logic I have played out in past posts shows that you weren't approaching this with any world view at all, but rather just your own. It is in noting that that I tell you to widen your perspective.

CR

[Suicane75]

No one is denying that, but your tone, at least to me, is one of belief in guilt on the part of Mel Gibson for having not spoken out against his father. I am just explaining why that is completely illogical and supposing the same thing you are: that we don't really know. You say now you don't really know, but before you made it seem like by not standing up to his father, Gibson must necessarily hold to the same beliefs.

As for me telling you not to view all father-son relationships the same as your own, I am sorry, but your failure to see the above logic I have played out in past posts shows that you weren't approaching this with any world view at all, but rather just your own. It is in noting that that I tell you to widen your perspective.

CR

I could say that I apporach it with a better view because I have and am famaliar with it on a personal level. I don't know for sure wether he holds his fathers beliefs and I don't think he holds them on such a grand scale but I wouldn't be shocked if he did have them to a lesser degree, that's just going on what iv'e seen and what I've read and yes, not denouncing his fathers diatribes is part of it. As we both have noted, it's just our opinions and neither of us can say for sure. As for not approaching it with a world view, im not really sure what you mean, I related my experiences and I know that If I saw someone with his father going off on a racist diatribe and not saying anything about it I would think of less of that guy, im not sure how that isn't a world view, because the father could be a great guy except for the fact that he thinks all black people are inferior? There are faults, and then there are FAULTS, and thats a big one imo.

[Chief Rum]

As for not approaching it with a world view, im not really sure what you mean, I related my experiences and I know that If I saw someone with his father going off on a racist diatribe and not saying anything about it I would think of less of that guy, im not sure how that isn't a world view, because the father could be a great guy except for the fact that he thinks all black people are inferior? There are faults, and then there are FAULTS, and thats a big one imo.

Your reaction in that hypothetical exactly displays what I am talking about in your lack of perspective. You think less of that guy who doesn't speak up to hi sfather, because you have a father that is like that, and you feel that others make assumptions about you if you don't tell him to shut up or in some way distance yourself from his comments.

I am merely pointing out to you that if others actually judged your nonaction thusly, they would not be approaching it fairly or logically. You and others have derided Gibson for his father's views. We have noted, though, that on an evidentiary and logical level, Gibson's father's views have absolutely nothing to do with the beliefs of Gibson himself. You are ignoring that basic fact by thinking less of Gibson for not speaking out against his father. You may be mistaking Gibson's love and respect for his father for approval of his father's racist beliefs.

To you, Gibson's silence on the issue of his father's beliefs is damning. I am telling you there is very little evidence, from what I know, to support that opinion. And I am also telling you it is far more logically liekly that Gibson is holding his tongue out of respect for his father-- a perspective you seem to lack, at least on a personal level. It is in ignoring that perspective, I think, that you are failing to go beyond your personal level to consider all angles of why Gibson would choose not to speak against his father.

In fact, his statement that you quoted above from the interview sounds exactly like a man making the choice to not say disrespectful things about his father on air. That is why he doesn't want to discuss the subject.

Tell me something. Does the New Testament support racism and bigotry? I admit I am no Biblical scholar, but I am pretty sure it does not. Here is a guy who has just spent millions of his own money making a faith movie based on the most critical part of the New Testament. He so fervently believes that he admits he believes his wife will go to Hell for being Episcopalian, and by reports from others here and what I have read, the movie version is very exacting to the words of the scripture. This is a guy who obviously doesn't believe in shades of gray, but takes everything in that book quite literally. Remember, this is a book that doesn't support racism or bigotry, to my knowledge. Does someone who believes in that so fervently sound like someone who must consciously be a racist and a bigot?

CR

[wig]

I always thought you were supposed to support your family, no matter what they do, or if you agree with them.

Maybe I have a different definition of "family".