Training Camp

[thealmighty]

My first ever training camp is days away and I have no idea what, if anything, to change in terms of the time allotments. I have the youngest team in the league and, consequently, one of the worst.

Rookie QB and 2 rookie WR with a middling RB (Hambrick) so offense will suck. Should I give them lots of extra time so they improve, or should I stick to more defense and just get better there (defense is not bad)?

Any ideas or strategies you have? If it was TCY, hey, I'd have it covered, but I need help with this if possible.

Or should I do the post in General since 'nobody' reads these things?

Thanks.

[yabanci]

To tell you the truth, I never really change the defaults.

[hukarez]

I switch up the defaults just a little bit. Though, I find myself having to play on the intelligence ratings of my players. Especially my QB, since he's rated low...didn't quite make sense for me to get him to study film, since he only knows 9 formations. Erg.

[wig]

I found that if you increase the study film a bit, you can get stupid QBs to learn more formations.

[QuikSand]

For some reason, this is an area where I totally lost interest between FOF 2001 and FOF 4.

Playing FOF 2001, I paid a lot of attention to the set of "sliders" and gave a lot of thought to the formations I'd use, the emphasis on special teams, and so forth. Not a huge issue, I know, but I might have dedicated 3-5 minutes to this each season. It added something to the experience for me, I think.

I just can't connect to the "time of day" system in FOF 2004 (carried over from FOF 4). I guess it amounts to largely the same thing - but I just don't feel like keying in a bunch of 10 and 20 minute changes to things as generic as "passing" and "rushing" and the like. So, like a lot of people (I'd guess) I basically leave it alone most of the time.

[hukarez]

I found that if you increase the study film a bit, you can get stupid QBs to learn more formations.
By how much time would you suggest, wig?

I've got 3 hours devoted to this field. My QB started off with 8 for the first 3 seasons, and it wasn't until the 4th season that my QB finally picked up an extra formation. :eek:

[wig]

My WigFL rookie QB is dumb as a rock. (int of 6)

He knew 6 formations going into TC. I bumped up the film study up an hour. (I think this is the formation learning one)

He went up to 7 formations in that TC.

[hukarez]

My WigFL rookie QB is dumb as a rock. (int of 6)

He knew 6 formations going into TC. I bumped up the film study up an hour. (I think this is the formation learning one)

He went up to 7 formations in that TC.
I'll see if I can bump it up to 4 hours then. I'm sure I can sacrifice time among the other groups, to see my QB can learn a few more formations.

[QuikSand]

Is another formation for a nitwitted QB worth whatever you lose in offensive, defensive, and other skills? (Genuine question, I don't know)

[hukarez]

It'd be nice if it were more formations that my QB gains, since in most of my games (despite what kind of variety I use in playmaking), the AI's defense ends up being "prepared" for my play. Solely for informational purposes only - my team's in need of a rebuild regardless at this stage.

[cthomer5000]

For some reason, this is an area where I totally lost interest between FOF 2001 and FOF 4.

Playing FOF 2001, I paid a lot of attention to the set of "sliders" and gave a lot of thought to the formations I'd use, the emphasis on special teams, and so forth. Not a huge issue, I know, but I might have dedicated 3-5 minutes to this each season. It added something to the experience for me, I think.

I just can't connect to the "time of day" system in FOF 2004 (carried over from FOF 4). I guess it amounts to largely the same thing - but I just don't feel like keying in a bunch of 10 and 20 minute changes to things as generic as "passing" and "rushing" and the like. So, like a lot of people (I'd guess) I basically leave it alone most of the time.
I never really thougt about *why* I lost interest in training camp, but I think you nailed it with going from the "amount" sliders to the clock. I pretty much leave it set to default, which is a shame really considering how closely I watch pretty much everything else.

[yabanci]

I think QuikSand is on to something here. I used to pay attention to the sliders too. Maybe Jim should consider rethinking this phase in future versions of the game.

[wig]

Is another formation for a nitwitted QB worth whatever you lose in offensive, defensive, and other skills? (Genuine question, I don't know)

If you're going from 6 to 7 I'd say yes. The new formation made a huge difference in the personel I can use.

If the change is from 10 to 11, I probably wouldn't spend the hour.

[wig]

The formation he learned in training camp was the single back 3-wide. It's now the only formation I have that uses 3 WR.

[hukarez]

wig, you brought up a good point that I overlooked - Going over the list of plays that my QB uses, I notice that they're all 2 WR sets. I'd like more receivers on the field, especially when I'm trying to make a 4Q comeback.

Probably explains why my QB only has 2 of those in his 4 years...

[cuervo72]

It would also be nice to have a "reset to default" button in there somewhere to serve as a baseline.

Is there any other way besides training camp to learn formations? I would think that it's not only "dumb as a rock" qb's who need to learn them, but youngsters as well.

[wig]

I don't think there is any other way

[cthomer5000]

Also, I thought focusing on formations (FOF2001) made a lot more sense to me than the way it's done now. If I run a conservative offense, what good is that 5 WR formation going to do me? While I might be using it in a desperate situation, there are a handful of other formations I'd rather be using in all 4 quarters of the game.

Also, I think a "return to default" button is a must-have.

[ZXTT]

Is there any other way besides training camp to learn formations? I would think that it's not only "dumb as a rock" qb's who need to learn them, but youngsters as well.

That's why coaches like players in camp! You can't learn these kind of things during the season - you're too busy getting in reps for your skills and learning that week's game plan.

And while I'm at it, one more vote for sliders! Heck, I've asked for gameplanning with a few sliders. Call it the MOO syndrome (you know, after Master of Orion, the first one), where most of the strategy is abstracted into sliders.

There's a temptation in game design to move away from abstraction because it appears to add to the strategy. Unfortunately it doesn't - it adds busy work, while obscuring where the meaningful strategic decisions are.

When we play these games, I think we know what we want to do. For example, as a GM/HC we want to say to our QB coach: "Make sure that kid learns another formation and only then have him practice his accuracy." The QB coach worries about the time management. If he sucks, the kid might not learn a new formation. If he's good then the kid does.

The strategic decision-making should go along these lines:

1. What do I want my QB to improve in?
2. What are the chances my QB coach (or OC, or whatever) can do the job*.
3. Give the QB coach instructions based on 1 and 2.

* Here I wouldn't mind if the game gives me a % chance of success - after all, players will eventually figure out the algorithms. I'd like to decide if a 60% chance of success in X is good enough. A role-playing element could be added to the game - the player picks traits for their GM/HC persona. In this case, the "Understanding assistant coaches' abilities" trait would affect the accuracy of the success estimate. For me, I'd say that kind of addition adds more to the game than 50 more boxes to fill out.

[thealmighty]

I appreciate all the responses and help. Nice discussion and great questions. eNFL training camp files are due tonight, so I guess I better decide, say, about NOW.

Thanks.