OT: Texas Hold 'Em Board Reading Exercise

[primelord]

I saw this posted elsewhere and thought you guys might find it interesting. From the below list of hands you are behind in every hand and need to improve on the river to win. Can you tell me in each hand how many outs you have to outright win and how many outs you have to chop?

If you have seen this before please give the people who haven't a chance to answer.

<table x:str="" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="306" style="border-collapse: collapse; width: 230pt;"> <col width="72" span="3" style="width: 54pt;"> <col width="90" style="width: 68pt;"> <tbody><tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" width="72" style="height: 15.75pt; width: 54pt;">You</td> <td width="72" style="width: 54pt;">Opponent</td> <td width="72" style="width: 54pt;">
</td> <td width="90" style="width: 68pt;">Board</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ah 2h</td> <td>Ad 8d</td> <td>
</td> <td>Ac Kc 7s 4h</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ah 2h</td> <td>Ad 8d</td> <td>
</td> <td>Ac Kc 9s 4h</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ah Kh</td> <td>Kc 3c</td> <td>
</td> <td>Kd Th 7c 3s</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ah Ad</td> <td>Kc 3c</td> <td>
</td> <td>Kd Th 7c 3s</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ad Qc</td> <td>3s 3h</td> <td>
</td> <td>Jc Jh 8d 4s</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">As 2s</td> <td>Ad Tc</td> <td>
</td> <td>Ah Ac Qh 6d</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ac 2c</td> <td>Ah Td</td> <td>
</td> <td>As 8d 8h 3c</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ad 2d</td> <td>As 3s</td> <td>
</td> <td>Ac 8d 8h 2h</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Qs Qc</td> <td>3s 3c</td> <td>
</td> <td>Ad Ah 7h 3d</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ac Kc</td> <td>3s 3c</td> <td>
</td> <td>8c 2s 2d 2h</td> </tr></tbody> </table>

This was more difficult than I thought it would be. Especially the chop outs. Then again maybe I am just bad at Hold 'Em. :)

[sabotai]

Um, what's a 'chop'? (A tie?)

[sabotai]

For the first one, I'm going to say 3 outs, the other 2's. No stright or flush possible, if you get a 3rd Ace, he still out kicks you and if a card higher than 8 falls, he still out kicks you because of the 7 (the 8 will be his 5th card, the 7 will be yours). So 3 outs for the 1st one.

EDIT: After looking at it more...I'm sure I'm wrong. I think it's 3 outs to win, but for a chop, not sure.

If the 4 or 7 pairs, you both use the K as a kicker, so that leaves 6 outs to chop. If the K pairs, he out kicks you.

[primelord]

Yes a chop is a tie.

Edit: A chop is a tie not time. I'm an idiot. :)

[sabotai]

I was going to say...A time? I still don't know what it means! Stop using lingo and just use english!!

Ok. :)

[primelord]

sabotai's answer for #1 is correct.

[sabotai]

The second one:

The other 3 2's are outs to win. Now if you get the other K, the 9 is used as a kicker, so the 3 K's are outs for the chop, as is the 3 other 9's and 3 other 4's. Also, if another A comes, the K and 9 will be used as outs to chop, so that gives 3 outs to win, 11 outs to chop.

[RPI-Fan]

my answers without reading anything posted so far, for the first four (rest coming later)











1) 3 outs to win, none to tie - three twos give you two pair
2) 3 outs to win, 19 outs to tie - three twos give two pair, any queen and jack kills his kicker - one ace can trip to kill his kicker, three kings pair to kill his kicker
3) 9 outs to win, none to tie - 3 aces give you better two pair, three tens to pair for better kicker, three sevens for better kicker
4) 8 outs to win, none to tie - two aces, three tens, three esvens

[dixieflatline]

Some interesting hands. Hope this is close.


You Opponent Board outs chop notes
Ah 2h Ad 8d Ac Kc 7s 4h 3 6 3 twos win 7 or 4 tie
Ah 2h Ad 8d Ac Kc 9s 4h 3 23 3 twos win A K Q J T 9 tie
Ah Kh Kc 3c Kd Th 7c 3s 9 0 A T 3 win no chops
Ah Ad Kc 3c Kd Th 7c 3s 8 0 same with one less ace
Ad Qc 3s 3h Jc Jh 8d 4s 12 0 A Q 8 4 win no ties
As 2s Ad Tc Ah Ac Qh 6d 3 11 2 wins K Q J ties
Ac 2c Ah Td As 8d 8h 3c 0 15 drawing dead A K Q J 8 tie
Ad 2d As 3s Ac 8d 8h 2h 2 39 2 wins it a 3 losses it
Qs Qc 3s 3c Ad Ah 7h 3d 4 0 A Q wins it not ties
Ac Kc 3s 3c 8c 2s 2d 2h 7 3 A K 2 wins it 8 ties

[sabotai]

My answer for #3 is the same as RPI's...he pwned my answer for #2. :)

[cthomer5000]

#2 - 3 outs to win, 6 outs to tie. Only a 2 gives you the pot, but if the King or 9 pairs on the river, you'd split the pot.

edit: Duh, or the 4 pairing (+3 = 9 outs) or the last ace falling, so 10 outs to chop.

[rkmsuf]

There has to be a Texas Hold Me version...

[primelord]

No one has given a correct answer on the chops to #2 yet. Although one is close.

[cthomer5000]

#10
<TABLE style="MARGIN: 0px; WIDTH: 230pt; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=306 border=0 x:str=""><TBODY><TR style="HEIGHT: 15.75pt" height=21><TD style="HEIGHT: 15.75pt" height=21>Ac Kc</TD><TD>3s 3c</TD><TD>
</TD><TD>8c 2s 2d 2h</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>The only chop I see is an 8 falling - 3 outs for a chop.

You can win with the last 2 falling (1)
An ace (3)
A king (3)
7 outs to win.

[primelord]

RPI and dixie have #3 and #4 correct.

dixie has #5, #7, #9, and #10 correct

[dixieflatline]

whoops. a 4 will also tie so 20 outs to chop for #2?

[primelord]

whoops. a 4 will also tie so 20 outs to chop for #2?
Not quite.

[dixieflatline]

ok let's try this again for number 2

1 ace
3 Ks
4 Qs
4 Js
4 Ts
3 9s
3 4s

give 22 outs to chop

[primelord]

ok let's try this again for number 2

1 ace
3 Ks
4 Qs
4 Js
4 Ts
3 9s
3 4s

give 22 outs to chop
Now ya got it. :)

[dixieflatline]

and 14 outs for number 6 as the three 6s left will also chop

[RPI-Fan]

And the rest........



























5) 12 to win, none to tie - three aces, three queens, and three eights and fours give you a kicker
6) 3 to win, 14 to tie - four kings, four jacks kill his kicker, three queens and three sixes full up to tie, three twos win you the hand
7) 0 to win, 15 to tie - four of each face card kill his kicker, three eights fill up
8) 3 to win, 37 to tie - one ace fills to win, two twos fill to win, any non-two,three, or ace ties (two eights included)
9) 4 to win, 0 to tie - two aces to give you a bigger boat, two queens give a bigger boat
10) 6 to win, 3 to tie - three eights fill for a tie, three aces win, three kings win

[Celeval]

#8:
Ad 2d / As 3s / Ac 8d 8h 2h

Win: 2 (2c, 2s - you win with 222AA)
Chop: 42 (Both hands have AA88k - the new draw can be an A (AAA88), an 8 (888AA), a 2 (covered above), or anything else - which is the same kicker for each)
Loss: 0

You're technically behind, but you're ahead; if I read this one right.

[primelord]

Very good. Celeval's answer means they have all been answered correctly.

[primelord]

<table x:str="" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="522" style="border-collapse: collapse; width: 392pt;"> <col width="72" span="3" style="width: 54pt;"> <col width="90" style="width: 68pt;"> <col width="72" style="width: 54pt;"> <col width="72" span="2" style="width: 54pt;"> <tbody><tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" width="72" style="height: 15.75pt; width: 54pt;">You</td> <td width="72" style="width: 54pt;">Opponent</td> <td width="72" style="width: 54pt;">
</td> <td width="90" style="width: 68pt;">Board</td> <td width="72" style="width: 54pt;">
</td> <td class="xl24" width="72" style="width: 54pt;">Win</td> <td class="xl24" width="72" style="width: 54pt;">Chop</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ah 2h</td> <td>Ad 8d</td> <td>
</td> <td>Ac Kc 7s 4h</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">3</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">6</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ah 2h</td> <td>Ad 8d</td> <td>
</td> <td>Ac Kc 9s 4h</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">3</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">22</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ah Kh</td> <td>Kc 3c</td> <td>
</td> <td>Kd Th 7c 3s</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">9</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ah Ad</td> <td>Kc 3c</td> <td>
</td> <td>Kd Th 7c 3s</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">8</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ad Qc</td> <td>3s 3h</td> <td>
</td> <td>Jc Jh 8d 4s</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">12</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">As 2s</td> <td>Ad Tc</td> <td>
</td> <td>Ah Ac Qh 6d</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">3</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">14</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ac 2c</td> <td>Ah Td</td> <td>
</td> <td>As 8d 8h 3c</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">15</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ad 2d</td> <td>As 3s</td> <td>
</td> <td>Ac 8d 8h 2h</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">2</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">42</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Qs Qc</td> <td>3s 3c</td> <td>
</td> <td>Ad Ah 7h 3d</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">4</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0</td> </tr> <tr height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;"> <td height="21" style="height: 15.75pt;">Ac Kc</td> <td>3s 3c</td> <td>
</td> <td>8c 2s 2d 2h</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">7</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">3</td> </tr></tbody> </table>

[dixieflatline]

Nice stuff. It's nice to try to keep the math skills sharp.

[Alf]

so basically, you are saying that Poker is Math ?