A bit of advice needed

[jetpunk2000]

I have a friend who was thinking of applying to a teacher ed program in a local university. His GPA was mid 2's at the time and the minimum GPA requirement for admittance is 2.75. He had apparently spoken to the director of the program earlier in the semester and she told him to schedule an appointment after he had received his grades for the current term. Well, he set up the appointment, and his grades were pretty good, 3.25 or so for the semester. After he finished the interview, he called and told me the woman said he was an embarassment and the fact that he had the audacity to schedule an appointment with her was insulting. She said that this was a respected program and admitting someone with such a low GPA would bring the quality of the program down. Now, I am in a teacher ed program in a different school, and I have seen plenty of smart people who probably have very high GPA's in the program, but they don't have the people or social skills to make a good teacher. I have also seen people who have struggled somewhat at the academics, but are great when it comes to breaking something down and explaining it. It just kills me when you have these haughty people in these high positions who preach that you have to build a child's confidence and be a social role model to kids, but don't practice it themselves.

Anyway, I went a bit off topic. My advice to him was to speak with someone in academic affairs and complain. If the woman was really as degrading to him as he says, I'm sure this isn't the first time it's happened. Anyone else have any similar experience or advice on who to speak to?

[Dutch]

It just kills me when you have these haughty people in these high positions who preach that you have to build a child's confidence and be a social role model to kids, but don't practice it themselves.

But if your friend gets a position he will tell kids, don't strive for a good GPA, just bust your ass the last semester and sue your way into a job like I did!

[kcchief19]

In the first meeting I ever had with my advisor in journalism school, he told me nothing but about how hard it was, how I was going to have to go through several low-paying jobs in bassackward towns before I was every happy. Others told me that he told them they shouldn't go into journalism or they weren't good enough. We all thought he was a jerk.

This guy is revered by almost everyone graduate who had him. Why? He made us want it. He pushed us. He knows that journalism is a tough business and we have to be tough to succeed. Much of what he tried to do was designed to make us tougher. And if we couldn't cut dealing with him, we probably wouldn't cut professional journalism. I have had other teachers and bosses since that were the same way -- they were rude, degrading and made you feel like crap. And almost everyone of them made me better at what I do.

I immediately thought of this after reading your thread. Could be thatthe director is just a haughty jerk, but something tells me that when she sees someone who doesn't have the grades to qualify for the program, she instantly questions their committment. If you want to teach kids, you need to work hard. She probably sees the GPA and thinks this is a person who isn't serious about teaching or otherwise they would be working harder. If she browbeats the applicant and the person gives up, then her suspicions are correct -- if you shrink away from a challenge like that, she probably thinks you'll shrink away from tough challenges in the classroom.

My guess is that if your friend is serious about teaching, he'll go back in there and tell her that this is what he wants to do, he's working hard for this goal and he's willing to do whatever it takes, then ask what he has to do to get in to the program. If that doesn't work, keep pestering her. If he wants to teach, giving up isn't an option.

[jetpunk2000]

In the first meeting I ever had with my advisor in journalism school, he told me nothing but about how hard it was, how I was going to have to go through several low-paying jobs in bassackward towns before I was every happy. Others told me that he told them they shouldn't go into journalism or they weren't good enough. We all thought he was a jerk.

This guy is revered by almost everyone graduate who had him. Why? He made us want it. He pushed us. He knows that journalism is a tough business and we have to be tough to succeed. Much of what he tried to do was designed to make us tougher. And if we couldn't cut dealing with him, we probably wouldn't cut professional journalism. I have had other teachers and bosses since that were the same way -- they were rude, degrading and made you feel like crap. And almost everyone of them made me better at what I do.

I immediately thought of this after reading your thread. Could be thatthe director is just a haughty jerk, but something tells me that when she sees someone who doesn't have the grades to qualify for the program, she instantly questions their committment. If you want to teach kids, you need to work hard. She probably sees the GPA and thinks this is a person who isn't serious about teaching or otherwise they would be working harder. If she browbeats the applicant and the person gives up, then her suspicions are correct -- if you shrink away from a challenge like that, she probably thinks you'll shrink away from tough challenges in the classroom.

My guess is that if your friend is serious about teaching, he'll go back in there and tell her that this is what he wants to do, he's working hard for this goal and he's willing to do whatever it takes, then ask what he has to do to get in to the program. If that doesn't work, keep pestering her. If he wants to teach, giving up isn't an option.

It's one thing to overemphasize the toughness of a field or program in order to motivate someone. However, in a field where the first thing they teach you nowadays is constructive, positive feedback, and focusing on what a child CAN do as opposed to can't, I find it odd that a director would blatently put someone down this way. You don't motivate somebody by knocking them down...especially if you don't know them. Different people are motivated differently, but in order to figure out how, you have to get to know the person. Knowing the reputation of the school, the area that it's in, and a few people who have graduated from the program, this woman was not being a motivator, she was being a haughty, nasty, b**ch.

And in response to Dutch, the real issue has nothing to do with grades, but to go off on a bit of a tangent, grades are not everything. If the kid had a 1.75 GPA, fine, I can see him being laughed at. But when you have a 2.6 GPA and the requirement is a 2.75, there is no reason to be treated that way. This was someone who was serious about committing to the program. He focused and worked hard in order to impress this woman. She had seen his file prior to making the appointment, so if the GPA had been a real issue, it should have been brought up then. One of the biggest things I have learned over the past few years is that the brightest people aren't necessarily the ones with the best grades.

I was in class with a woman this past semester who I would say was a low A, high B student. She's older, in her min 40's, and is back in school for a second career. Her father got real sick this past semester, and her grades dropped. She stuck it out, though. Does that make her less qualified than it did a year ago? I respect this woman for sticking it out through the tough times when it would've been much easier to give up.

Another person I'm in class with is in his late 30's. He struggles at times, but is a mid-level B student. His demeanor in front of the class, however, is something to see. He can explain something like the back of his hand, and break it down for an idiot to understand. This, in my opinion, is the essence of teaching.

A counterexample to that is a woman who is a straight A student. She get's the upper level math instantly. Put her in front of a room though and she's lost. She knows her stuff, sure. Her grades are great, sure. Doesn't mean she's going to be a successful teacher. Point is, you need to see the whole package before making a determination, and to dismiss someone due to a number alone is just dumb really.

Anyway, the real issue was the attitude of this woman. If she didn't want to accept the kid into the program there were a million other ways for her to do it. Ways that could have made him more confident that he could do something. A good educator does that. They instill confidence in their students, not doubt.