View Full Version : Let The (NBA Finals) Games Begin
korme
06-06-2004, 08:01 PM
Commentary on the Finals should go here, because I said so.
Detroit represents in 6. It's a stretch but it'd be nice.
Philliesfan980
06-06-2004, 08:07 PM
Commentary on the Finals should go here, because I said so.
Detroit represents in 6. It's a stretch but it'd be nice.
I hate the Lakers as much as the next guy, but comon, who's going to stop Shaq?
korme
06-06-2004, 08:10 PM
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Statistics</td> </tr> <tr><td class="gSGSectionTitleStatsGrid"> PPG</td><td align="center" class="gSGSectionTitleStatsGrid"> 9.6</td></tr> <tr><td class="gSGSectionTitleStatsGrid"> RPG</td><td align="center" class="gSGSectionTitleStatsGrid"> 5.90</td></tr> <tr><td class="gSGSectionTitleStatsGrid"> APG</td><td align="center" class="gSGSectionTitleStatsGrid"> 1.0</td></tr> <tr><td class="gSGSectionTitleStatsGrid"> EFF</td><td align="center" class="gSGSectionTitleStatsGrid">+ 11.72 </td></tr> </tbody></table> </td> </tr> </tbody></table> </td> </tr> <tr><td valign="top"> Position: C
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Philliesfan980
06-06-2004, 08:12 PM
Sure....
korme
06-06-2004, 08:14 PM
Ben Wallace with the airball!
But 3-2 PISTONS!
Suicane75
06-06-2004, 08:41 PM
I read an article of ESPN's page 2 that said that the Pistons have been keeping Darko under wraps just to break him out in this series and shock the world, it was all in jest of course but it's a funny idea.
Eaglesfan27
06-06-2004, 08:43 PM
I read an article of ESPN's page 2 that said that the Pistons have been keeping Darko under wraps just to break him out in this series and shock the world, it was all in jest of course but it's a funny idea.
That would be the coolest ploy ever if it was true. Darko running pick and roll and drilling the Lakers from outside :)
korme
06-06-2004, 08:44 PM
Yeah, I think Eric Neel wrote that. Funny stuff.
Lorena
06-06-2004, 08:49 PM
I posted this on another thread, but I'll post it here as well... Lakers in 6.
korme
06-06-2004, 08:50 PM
YOU FOOLISH WOMAN
mrbug would like you
Sharpieman
06-06-2004, 08:54 PM
I will shave my head if the Pistons win.
Sharpieman
06-06-2004, 08:55 PM
Smarty Jones has a better chance at winning the Triple Crown than the Pistons have of winning the series.
korme
06-06-2004, 08:57 PM
if that is true, then don't offer just shaving your head.. hmm
CUT YOUR ARM OFF THEN
Sharpieman
06-06-2004, 08:59 PM
Sure, It's not going to happen.
Suicane75
06-06-2004, 08:59 PM
Heres my take on this series, the more the Pistons play close the more Shaquile O'Bryant will play to their utmost, I can see Detroit getting game 3 or 4 at home but that's it.
Sharpieman
06-06-2004, 09:01 PM
Oh by the way, I know the Pistons still have their first round draft pick, that Darko guy from some Eastern European nation. Is the consensus now that he's a bust or is he just not prepared?
LionsFan10
06-06-2004, 09:02 PM
C'mon, how many of you Laker bums expected it to be this close right now? Nobody. The Pistons are in this series weather you guys want to admit it or not. Sure the second quarter is early, but I'm sure everyone was expecting the Piston's to be down by about 10 already.
Suicane75
06-06-2004, 09:03 PM
Oh by the way, I know the Pistons still have their first round draft pick, that Darko guy from some Eastern European nation. Is the consensus now that he's a bust or is he just not prepared?
I don't think it's set in stone either way, it'll be at least 1 or 2 more seasons before anyone really knows anything.
Who's doing the game with Micheals? Is that Doc Rivers, it doesn't sound like him.
Suicane75
06-06-2004, 09:04 PM
C'mon, how many of you Laker bums expected it to be this close right now? Nobody. The Pistons are in this series weather you guys want to admit it or not. Sure the second quarter is early, but I'm sure everyone was expecting the Piston's to be down by about 10 already.
Dude, i can appreciate you being excited, but it's only 15 minutes into this series, by that logic if the Lakers pull away and win by 20 will the whole thing be over?
LionsFan10
06-06-2004, 09:06 PM
No, I'm just going by how everyone is acting about this series. The Pistons haven't had a chance since they beat the Pacers, and I KNOW nobody expected it to be close at all (even already).
Suicane75
06-06-2004, 09:10 PM
No, I'm just going by how everyone is acting about this series. The Pistons haven't had a chance since they beat the Pacers, and I KNOW nobody expected it to be close at all (even already).
I dunno, im not shocked that it's close, actually I sort of expected this game to be close, most series like sort of have an ebb and a flow, this will be a close Lakers win, game 2 will be a Lakers blowout, Detroit will play hard in games 3,4 and 5 and win 1 or 2 of them and then go back to LA and lose in game 6, that's how I see it shaping up, alot like the last 4 NBA Finals.
MrBug708
06-06-2004, 09:24 PM
I will shave my head if the Pistons win.
You'd cut your hand off to spite your head huh?
Suicane75
06-06-2004, 09:25 PM
What ever happened to Linsdey Hunter? Wasn't he supposed to be pretty good a few years back?
DeToxRox
06-06-2004, 09:25 PM
About Darko: Jermaine O'Neal didn't do anything in the NBA until his 4th season.
So let's not talk about busts right now.
MrBug708
06-06-2004, 09:26 PM
C'mon, how many of you Laker bums expected it to be this close right now? Nobody. The Pistons are in this series weather you guys want to admit it or not. Sure the second quarter is early, but I'm sure everyone was expecting the Piston's to be down by about 10 already.
Good, you worry about Shaq scoring 20 on your great D in a half and the rest of the Laker starters not scoring. That's EXACTLY how the whole series will go. :rolleyes:
Then again, most Laker fans said Lakers in 5/6 so that would go to show that they think the Pistons will actually win a game
LionsFan10
06-06-2004, 09:26 PM
What ever happened to Linsdey Hunter? Wasn't he supposed to be pretty good a few years back?
Yeah, when he played for the Lakers. Just kidding. :)
Suicane75
06-06-2004, 09:28 PM
Yeah, when he played for the Lakers. Just kidding. :)
No for real, i'm not a huge NBA fan but i seem to remember that he an Allan Houston were a pretty good 1-2 punch for the Pistons a few years back and then it seemed like Hunter fell off the face of the earth.
korme
06-06-2004, 09:30 PM
Hunter went to a few teams after leaving Detroit and age has worn on him and he now serves as a decent roleplayer back with the Pistons, still a good 3 shooter.
MrBug708
06-06-2004, 09:31 PM
No for real, i'm not a huge NBA fan but i seem to remember that he an Allan Houston were a pretty good 1-2 punch for the Pistons a few years back and then it seemed like Hunter fell off the face of the earth.
I believe our first round pick as well as Lindsay Hunter went to (insert team) and the rights to Kareem Rush.
DeToxRox
06-06-2004, 10:15 PM
speaking of lindsey hunter
TRIFECTA
Suicane75
06-06-2004, 10:17 PM
Man, if i gotta hear that damn song all night I would appreciate a little more video of Fergie, KThnx.
MikeVic
06-06-2004, 10:35 PM
I believe our first round pick as well as Lindsay Hunter went to (insert team) and the rights to Kareem Rush.
Raptors I believe?
LionsFan10
06-06-2004, 10:39 PM
DeToxRox, I know you're watching this ... you live in Michigan too. God I haven't been this excited over a basketball game in a while.
Suicane75
06-06-2004, 10:40 PM
Congratulations guys, I admit i'm surprised.
DeToxRox
06-06-2004, 10:40 PM
Well, Lakers gotta' take all 3 in Detroit its looking to make it in 5. Not happening.
DeToxRox
06-06-2004, 10:41 PM
Lions: I am totally agreeing with you. This BBall is fun for me to watch. It can be frustrating as all hell but when we're playing this kind of D, I get pumped. People not in Michigan might not understand it, but I know you do, as well as guys like Schmidty, Gold, Ice, etc.
LionsFan10
06-06-2004, 10:43 PM
It's over, and my family is going crazy. GREAT game played by the Pistons, I'll let Shaq score all night long if we shut everyone else down. YES!
excellent game..... looking good for the Pistons.....
Fouts
06-06-2004, 10:45 PM
Give the Spur fans a call. They felt the same way.
DeToxRox
06-06-2004, 10:45 PM
I am quite happy. that was excellent. People better not compare the Pistons and 76ers though. These are two TOTALLY different teams.
DeToxRox
06-06-2004, 10:47 PM
Give the Spur fans a call. They felt the same way.
i love how cocky LA fans are. if its only one game, why be so defensive (pardon the pun)
MrBug708
06-06-2004, 10:48 PM
I was surprised. Not so much about the score as the fact that Malone and Payton did less then we had last year.
Deja Vu from the Philly-LA series?
DeToxRox
06-06-2004, 10:50 PM
I was surprised. Not so much about the score as the fact that Malone and Payton did less then we had last year.
Deja Vu from the Philly-LA series?
Seriously, why even bring it up? Detroit is so much more talented then Philly was, it's not even funny. This is a record breaking defense. Defense wins championships. You guys STILL won't believe it, but it's time to start realizing that this isn't a cakewalk. Stop living in the past. You do that a lot Bug.
Fouts
06-06-2004, 10:51 PM
I agree, Billups is no Iverson.
LionsFan10
06-06-2004, 10:51 PM
I was surprised. Not so much about the score as the fact that Malone and Payton did less then we had last year.
You're surprised that Payton/Malone did nothing? Why, they haven't done much at all throughout the playoffs. Shaq/Kobe were the only one's who came to play, I'll give Shaq fifty a night if the Pistons shut everyone else out like they did tonight.
Deja Vu from the Philly-LA series?
Hardly :D
DeToxRox
06-06-2004, 10:52 PM
I agree, Billups is no Iverson.
And Eric Snow, Derrick Coleman, Theo Ratliff, etc, etc are no Rip Hamilton, Ben Wallace and Rasheed Wallace.
MrBug708
06-06-2004, 10:56 PM
I could careless about the other matchups. We were 12-0 and cruising a few years back when we lost one to Philly out of the Blue. In game 1 of the finals, hence the comparision.
It's one game. We faced a better team down 2-0 and swept them. Lemme know when Detroit has a 3 game lead first.
MrBug708
06-06-2004, 10:57 PM
Stop living in the past. You do that a lot Bug.
Well F U too
LionsFan10
06-06-2004, 10:57 PM
Wow, testy tonight Bug? Relax everybody, let's not get this thread locked alright?
MrBug708
06-06-2004, 10:58 PM
Not at all, but I'm being called out for living in the past? Riiiiiiiiiight
Fouts
06-06-2004, 11:00 PM
Mutumbo = Ben Wallace, Iverson = Hamilton + Billups
DeToxRox
06-06-2004, 11:01 PM
Well F U too
I am not trying to start some stupid internet flame war, I am just stating that for me personally, your logic is flawed if you can only judge teams on the past, because there are a lot of good teams in the present who are turning it around but you're not seeing that.
MrBug708
06-06-2004, 11:04 PM
I am not trying to start some stupid internet flame war, I am just stating that for me personally, your logic is flawed if you can only judge teams on the past, because there are a lot of good teams in the present who are turning it around but you're not seeing that.
ok...and this is coming from?
JeeberD
06-06-2004, 11:11 PM
Tonight's game made me happy... :)
The_herd
06-06-2004, 11:15 PM
Tonight's game made me happy... :)
It made me forget how bad work actually is. :)
Honolulu_Blue
06-07-2004, 01:34 AM
Excellent! Very good to see. It's interesting, the "game recap" on ESPN doesn't once mention any Piston. Basically it just goes on to talk about how poorly the Lakers (besides Kobe and Shaq) played. Well, no reason to fret over that.
Sharpieman
06-07-2004, 02:29 AM
Hopefully the Pistons don't turn out to play like philly did. The Lakers are a great team and I wouldn't be surprised if they win 3 in a row. I doubt they could run the table on the Pistons. Detroit is a way better team than Philly was. Thr 76ers only had Iverson and Snow basically, and didn't much of a inside game. Hopefully the Pistons can pull it out and I can see all the Laker fans cry.
ice4277
06-07-2004, 04:52 AM
Good win for the Pistons. They executed very well on defense and hit the shots they needed to hit. However, they were a little sloppy, especially in the first half, and I don't think they can get away again with making some of the mistakes they made. This was the game they needed to get to make a series out of it, and they came through.
korme
06-07-2004, 01:29 PM
Sharpieman! Watch out!
rkmsuf
06-07-2004, 01:32 PM
what a shocking lack of effort last night by the Fakers. Unbeleivable. It's amazing not show up for the opening game of the finals.
Neuqua
06-07-2004, 03:53 PM
How come everytime the Lakers lose its only because they gave a lack of effort?
Give Detroit its proper due, they took care of business where a lot of people did not think they could (in LA.)
LionsFan10
06-07-2004, 07:35 PM
How come everytime the Lakers lose its only because they gave a lack of effort?
Give Detroit its proper due, they took care of business where a lot of people did not think they could (in LA.)
I completely agree with this, it seems like no matter how good the opposing team plays the "Fakers" (nice name, rkmsuf :p ) the only reason the Lakers lose is because a "lack of effort." Bullshit, the Pistons played them well, turned the ball over a billion times and the Lakers still couldn't manage to put them away. The Pistons didn't play pretty basketball by any stretch of the word last night either, turnovers were a huge problem and Rip didn't have the game he should have had, but that doesn't mean that the Pistons won simply because the Lakers decided they weren't going to try, please.
Honolulu_Blue
06-08-2004, 12:54 PM
A nice quote from the Sports Guy, a renowned Pro-NBA/Anti-NHL guy for years...
Link: http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/040608
But it could happen. If the Lakers blow the title, it would have to rank among the most curious collapses in recent sports history: An obviously superior team that fell short because they didn't want it enough. Contrast that to the emotional scene in Tampa Bay last night, as the Lightning held off the underdog Flames in seven, both teams leaving everything they had on the ice. After the game, an exhausted Martin St. Louis was interviewed by one of the sideline reporters, two fresh gashes covering his face, looking like he had just been run over by Billy Joel. It was a stark contrast from Game 1 of the NBA Finals the night before, the Lakers trying to win a title without breaking a sweat.
And as Dave Andreychuk carried the cup around, screaming with delight at the end of a 22-year odyssey, I couldn't help thinking about the difference between him and Malone and Payton -- three guys at the same point of their careers, one of them reaching the promised land on his own terms, the other two guys looking like they just want the season to end.
I still think the Lakers win in six ... but for the first time in years, I already find myself missing the NHL playoffs. At least those guys cared.
rkmsuf
06-08-2004, 01:04 PM
I completely agree with this, it seems like no matter how good the opposing team plays the "Fakers" (nice name, rkmsuf :p ) the only reason the Lakers lose is because a "lack of effort." Bullshit, the Pistons played them well, turned the ball over a billion times and the Lakers still couldn't manage to put them away. The Pistons didn't play pretty basketball by any stretch of the word last night either, turnovers were a huge problem and Rip didn't have the game he should have had, but that doesn't mean that the Pistons won simply because the Lakers decided they weren't going to try, please.
Not the only reason but it was a factor. The Lakers put zero effort into moving the ball and for a Finals game their intensity was shameful. Detroit deserves credit but by no means got a maximum effort out of LA.
MrBug708
06-08-2004, 01:19 PM
Not the only reason but it was a factor. The Lakers put zero effort into moving the ball and for a Finals game their intensity was shameful. Detroit deserves credit but by no means got a maximum effort out of LA.
I dunno, Larry Brown was quoted during the game as saying that the Lakers weren't guarding anyone, so I'd say that's a lack of effort. Of course, I'm assuming he is talking about everyone BUT Kobe.
MrBug708
06-08-2004, 09:57 PM
Where is the bump at? It's a good game
LionsFan10
06-08-2004, 10:02 PM
Good game indeed, I agree. I kept checking here looking for this thread.
MrBug708
06-08-2004, 10:03 PM
Two quick 3's and Luke Walton is playing?!?
It's always someone....
LionsFan10
06-08-2004, 10:04 PM
LoL.
LionsFan10
06-08-2004, 10:10 PM
Luke Walton is the "energy" player for the Lakers tonight, he's gotten some minutes and now Phil is turning to him to "spark" the rest of the team. Phil is known for this, he used this same strategy back in '92 when the Bulls were down about 15 to the Blazers going into the fourth qtr. An entire second team came in and pulled off an amazing comeback.
Looks like LUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUKE is the guy he's chosen for this tonight.
MrBug708
06-08-2004, 10:13 PM
Britney Spears thinks he's hot FWIW
Anthony
06-08-2004, 10:21 PM
yeesh, the NBA has to do something about these games ending so late. how are they expecting little kids to stay up for this? this is almost as bad as MNF.
LionsFan10
06-08-2004, 10:23 PM
Yeah, I don't know what ABC was thinking there either. When your 8 yr olds role model is on at midnight I guess lil' Johnny is SoL. Bad move.
MrBug708
06-08-2004, 10:28 PM
It's only 830 here.
HEre come the scrubs. Kobe, Shaq, Rush, Fisher, and Walton!
Suicane75
06-08-2004, 10:37 PM
Im happy I was wrong, this could be a great series.
DeToxRox
06-08-2004, 10:49 PM
This is insanity. Detroit keeps plugging away. I am in shock.
DeToxRox
06-08-2004, 10:51 PM
what a rebound by the best defensive player in the NBA, no matter what the voters said this year.
sooner333
06-08-2004, 10:57 PM
Cluth shot by Kobe...damn.
MikeVic
06-08-2004, 10:57 PM
Damn Kobe. heh.
DeToxRox
06-08-2004, 10:57 PM
huge shot. this is damn good bball.
LloydLungs
06-08-2004, 10:58 PM
Seriously, did anyone think there was even a SLIGHT chance that wasn't going in?
Vince
06-08-2004, 10:58 PM
Wow. That was a fantastic shot...but what was Rip doing stepping back? Not that he gave him a lot of room...
korme
06-08-2004, 11:06 PM
first of all, 89-89 at the end of regulation?? PISTONS?
LionsFan10
06-08-2004, 11:07 PM
This one's all but over, but great game by both teams. Pistons gave this one away, it should've been theirs.
Vince
06-08-2004, 11:11 PM
Luke Walton is now officially my hero.
korme
06-08-2004, 11:11 PM
man, let it slip away
MrBug708
06-08-2004, 11:14 PM
How can anyone doubt Kobe as the best non Post player in the NBA? Sad to see him on the Suns/Clips/Bobcats next year....
MrBug708
06-08-2004, 11:14 PM
Dola
Rasheed, Deja Vu of the 2000 game, watching Shaq slam it home to seal a key game?
korme
06-08-2004, 11:14 PM
bobcats, lol
LionsFan10
06-08-2004, 11:18 PM
Bug, you really think Kobe is gone after this year? I thought he said he'd like to stay, but I might be wrong.
MrBug708
06-08-2004, 11:23 PM
It's just media speak right now, so who knows. I couldn't imagine anyone not stopping to hear the chants of love the city of LA has for a person, the way Kobe is in this town. I know he wants to be the biggest person on a franchise and he'll never be "the biggest" on the Lakers. But the Lakers is where he's been and where he'll get paid the most money to be on. We shall see I guess
I hope Neuqua is crying
Vince
06-08-2004, 11:26 PM
Shaq's getting old, right? Kobe's not all that old, right? Couldn't the Lakers EVENTUALLY be Kobe's team?
kingfc22
06-08-2004, 11:26 PM
Kobe. Kobe. Kobe. Damn that guy can play. :D
rexallllsc
06-08-2004, 11:27 PM
Where is druez? Still think McGrady > Kobe?
Heh.
MrBug708
06-08-2004, 11:27 PM
It's not so much the fact Kobe wants to be the leader of the team, I think he wants to be the name you think o when you think of a franchise. When you think Bulls, you think Jordan. I doubt Kobe will be averaging enough points to make everyone forget the likes of Kareem, Magic, Shaq, Wilt, Mikan et al
MrBug708
06-08-2004, 11:28 PM
Where is druez? Still think McGrady > Kobe?
Heh.
Fix Fix Fix!
rexallllsc
06-08-2004, 11:35 PM
It's not so much the fact Kobe wants to be the leader of the team, I think he wants to be the name you think o when you think of a franchise. When you think Bulls, you think Jordan. I doubt Kobe will be averaging enough points to make everyone forget the likes of Kareem, Magic, Shaq, Wilt, Mikan et al
Well, if he sticks around long enough, he'll have the rings to prove himself.
I think the idea of playing somewhere else sounds great, but in the end, he'll stay.
Just my $.02
MrBug708
06-08-2004, 11:39 PM
Outscored 16-2 to end the game. Do you think this will be a pretty big emotional block for the Pistons?
LionsFan10
06-08-2004, 11:48 PM
It's hard to judge right now. I think the Pistons know they can beat the Lakers, I mean you figure the game was theirs, it's just Kobe is an AMAZING player and they have never been through that kind of crushing play before, much less in the NBA Finals.
You could see it on their faces after that shot, they were quite deflated. Now, they have to come to Detroit and play three behind just as rabid a fanbase as anything out in LA so their spirits will stay in-tact I think. To me, this was just the first time having something like this happen to them, in a game they thought they had in the bag and they had NO idea how to answer it.
Neuqua
06-08-2004, 11:50 PM
Kobe made a clutch shot today, an incredible shot no doubt.
But uh, what does that have to do with him becoming the best non-post player in the league because of it?
I guarantee Kobe will be a Laker next season. If he isn't he will most likely never win another ring. He needs to have Shaq to win a title.
Neuqua
06-08-2004, 11:53 PM
By the way, if you told most fans that Detroit would take one out of two in LA, including a loss in OT in Game 2, I do not know a single fan who wouldn't have taken that.
Lets not forget that apparently the NBA Championship was won in Round 2. The Lakers were supposed to steamroll through the Finals, and Detroit is not letting that happen.
MrBug708
06-08-2004, 11:55 PM
They win one game and they "stopped" LA? La hasn't swept a series this post season.....What made you think this series would be any different? I mean, how many Laker fans do you talk to Neuq? Me?
MrBug708
06-08-2004, 11:57 PM
Kobe made a clutch shot today, an incredible shot no doubt.
But uh, what does that have to do with him becoming the best non-post player in the league because of it?
It's not the first time nor will be the last, but he had some great plays in the game and some great shots. just need to overlook that costly early shot clock 3 attempt with 1:45 to go and he was unusually cold from the charity stripe
LionsFan10
06-08-2004, 11:59 PM
By the way, if you told most fans that Detroit would take one out of two in LA, including a loss in OT in Game 2, I do not know a single fan who wouldn't have taken that.
Lets not forget that apparently the NBA Championship was won in Round 2. The Lakers were supposed to steamroll through the Finals, and Detroit is not letting that happen.
That's right, baby. The way I see it is, even though Detroit lost a heartbreaker in game two, I feel like the Pistons know that the Lakers can be beat, they know how to beat the Lakers and it's all a matter of what happens in game three.
Game three is the money game for Detroit, if they win game three they have a serious shot at taking this series and finishing them out in Detroit. If the Lakers win game three, it'll force the Pistons back to the Staples Center if they want to finish off the Lakers, and I doubt they want to do that.
The Pistons will take Game Three. They've shown everyone they are for real, something us Piston fans have known all along. The Palace will be rocking Thursday Night and the Pistons will go up 2-1.
MrBug708
06-09-2004, 12:03 AM
One thing is for sure, Larry Brown needs to find away to stop Shaq and Kobe....In game 1, he was lucky Kobe's shot wasn't up to standards as it usually was.
MrBug708
06-09-2004, 12:03 AM
Season avg.
Pistons 25.3 FTAs per game
Lakers 28.7 FTAs per game
Tonight
Pistons 31 FTAs
Lakers 25 FTAs
Neuqua
06-09-2004, 12:06 AM
The point is that contrary to what everyone west of the Mississippi river has said, it has become obvious that this is going to be a very hard fought battle between the two teams. The gap between the top teams in the East and the top teams in the West is a lot closer than anyone suspected.
As for Kobe, of course he had a great game. And there's little doubt he is one of the 5 best in the league but again, if you are going to talk him up after his performance in game 2, why not talk up his performance in game 1?
He shot 10-27, 1-6 from 3pt land, 4 turnovers (again, the big difference between him and Tracy.)
Kobe looks good doing what he does. He is so incredibly athletic that he can get away with making mistakes in the air and still come through. Games like this are a great example, no doubt of how he is going to be talked up. Again, I am not saying he's a slouch by any stretch, just do not think he's as good as Tracy.
One thing is for sure, Larry Brown needs to find away to stop Shaq and Kobe....In game 1, he was lucky Kobe's shot wasn't up to standards as it usually was.
Kobe shot quite well tonight and the Lakers still had to get lucky to pull of the win, I'd say Detroit's doing a good enough job defensively thus far. And in Game 2 the Lakers were lucky Hamilton's shot wasn't up to standards. If it was Detroit wins.
MrBug708
06-09-2004, 12:07 AM
Tmac never has bad games? News to me....
MrBug708
06-09-2004, 12:08 AM
Kobe shot quite well tonight and the Lakers still had to get lucky to pull of the win, I'd say Detroit's doing a good enough job defensively thus far. And in Game 2 the Lakers were lucky Hamilton's shot wasn't up to standards. If it was Detroit wins.
Didn't seem to matter in Game 1.
Imagine Kobe on a Larry Brown coached team?
Put T-Mac on the Lakers and you'd see he's just as good as Kobe. He has to do everything himself with the Magic. Teams can concentrate only on him, teams can't concentrate only on Kobe. If Kobe is playing for the Magic they still wouldn't be in the playoffs.
Neuqua
06-09-2004, 12:11 AM
Bug,
True or false. You have told me on many occasions via IM that if TMac and Kobe switch teams, you would think TMac is the superior player.
MrBug708
06-09-2004, 01:04 AM
Bug,
True or false. You have told me on many occasions via IM that if TMac and Kobe switch teams, you would think TMac is the superior player.
Not Superioir :p
MrBug708
06-09-2004, 01:07 AM
Put T-Mac on the Lakers and you'd see he's just as good as Kobe. He has to do everything himself with the Magic. Teams can concentrate only on him, teams can't concentrate only on Kobe. If Kobe is playing for the Magic they still wouldn't be in the playoffs.
If Jordan were playin on the T-Wolves, they wouldn't be playing in the playoffs.
Kobe's been double teamed before and hit shots. Tonight, when he took that shot, you couldn't have guarded him any better then that. Kobe is much better at slashing to the Hoop then Tmac is and that being said, Kobe also can hit more clutch shots as well. I hope Tmac can do all that in LA.
Neuqua
06-09-2004, 01:09 AM
As recently as yesterday afternoon....
MrBug708 (11:55:46 PM): If he comes ot LA and Kobe leaves, I'll agree that TMac is better
MrBug708
06-09-2004, 01:11 AM
Of course, I was in bed early last night as I had a final at 7 am.....
Neuqua
06-09-2004, 01:13 AM
lol, so i made it up?
MrBug708
06-09-2004, 01:14 AM
MrBug708: The T-Mac to LA rumors seem to be getting louder btw
MrBug708: Bastard!
KKiTTLeS21: He came out today and said he didnt want to play for the Lakers
MrBug708: Did he?
MrBug708: Well, clinton said he didnt have sex with that woman
KKiTTLeS21: yah, atleast thats what they said on tv today
MrBug708: Then again, why make a statement like that this early?
MrBug708: *shrugs*
MrBug708: If he comes ot LA and Kobe leaves, I'll agree that TMac is better
MrBug708: =)
KKiTTLeS21: of course
MrBug708
06-09-2004, 01:14 AM
I think so....
Kodos
06-09-2004, 01:24 AM
I hated the Bulls during their run, but I would love to see the Bulls of old kick the shit out of the Lakers of today. At least I could root for Jordan, even if I hated the rest of the Bulls.
MrBug708
06-09-2004, 01:26 AM
I hated the Bulls during their run, but I would love to see the Bulls of old kick the shit out of the Lakers of today. At least I could root for Jordan, even if I hated the rest of the Bulls.
Longley on Shaq?
Neuqua
06-09-2004, 01:37 AM
Kodos, just wondering, what did you hate about those Bulls? Or was it just because they kept on winning?
The Bulls were the ultimate team in the 90s. Each one of them knew their role and fulfilled it perfectly. And to top it all off, you had the best player this world has ever seen who single-handedly would not let his team lose (ask Mr. Malone.) You just think of all the greats of our generation who never got to win a championship because they were in the league the same year as MJ.
BTW, those teams had faced Shaq before and thanks to 18 fouls per game, we did just fine.
LionsFan10
06-09-2004, 01:55 AM
Kodos, just wondering, what did you hate about those Bulls? Or was it just because they kept on winning?
The Bulls were the ultimate team in the 90s. Each one of them knew their role and fulfilled it perfectly. And to top it all off, you had the best player this world has ever seen who single-handedly would not let his team lose (ask Mr. Malone.) You just think of all the greats of our generation who never got to win a championship because they were in the league the same year as MJ.
BTW, those teams had faced Shaq before and thanks to 18 fouls per game, we did just fine.
My father is from the Windy City and is a HUGE Chicago Bulls fan, I mean HUGE. For a while there, until I was about 12 yrs old I was right there along with him, wanting to be like dad and rooting for his favorite team. Because of this I watched every single Bulls championship run from '91 to '98 and I'd have to agree that if the 72-10 Bulls met up with the Lakers team of today ... Bulls, no contest.
Kodos
06-09-2004, 01:58 AM
Like many teams, I got sick of the Bulls winning all the time, and in particular, I got sick of their obnoxious fans. I was in college at IU, and fans of the Chicago teams were just insufferable. So I took to rooting against anything Chicago-related. Also, I still had a distaste for the Bears after their Super Bowl season and that idiotic Super Bowl Shuffle. So hating the Bulls came easily.
I hated Scottie Pippen. Especially after his playoff incident where he refused to go back in because the play wasn't designed for him (I think it was in one of the 2 Jordan retirement years between the three-peats).
I hated the Worm. He was (and still is) a total attention-whore piece of shit.
I hated that little blond bastard Steve Kerr who'd come off the bench and couldn't do anything but hit the damned 3s.
I hated smug Phil Jackson.
But I liked Jordan and his competitive spirit. I loved his will to win. It's too bad I hated everyone around him. But no matter. If they could magically face today's Lakers, I would be rooting for the Bulls to sweep Shaq and Kobe.
The Paxson shot that beat Barkley's Suns was one of the most horrific moments in my life as a sports fan. :mad:
Neuqua
06-09-2004, 02:01 AM
Wow.
I did not realize anybody could have such deep hatred for Steve Kerr.
:)
LionsFan10
06-09-2004, 02:07 AM
Like many teams, I got sick of the Bulls winning all the time, and in particular, I got sick of their obnoxious fans. I was in college at IU, and fans of the Chicago teams were just insufferable. So I took to rooting against anything Chicago-related. Also, I still had a distaste for the Bears after their Super Bowl season and that idiotic Super Bowl Shuffle. So hating the Bulls came easily.
I hated Scottie Pippen. Especially after his playoff incident where he refused to go back in because the play wasn't designed for him (I think it was in one of the 2 Jordan retirement years between the three-peats).
I hated the Worm. He was (and still is) a total attention-whore piece of shit.
I hated that little blond bastard Steve Kerr who'd come off the bench and couldn't do anything but hit the damned 3s.
I hated smug Phil Jackson.
But I liked Jordan and his competitive spirit. I loved his will to win. It's too bad I hated everyone around him. But no matter. If they could magically face today's Lakers, I would be rooting for the Bulls to sweep Shaq and Kobe.
The Paxson shot that beat Barkley's Suns was one of the most horrific moments in my life as a sports fan. :mad:
LOL, that's funny. My dad would SCREAM at the TV during those years, it was hard to watch games with him because he couldn't shut up or sit down when the Bulls were playing. Steve Kerr, why did you hate him, because he was dangerous? He was an unlikely hero in the '97 finals. IIRC it was him who hit the game winner in Chicago at the time.
I have to admit, though ... watching Kobe drain that triple tonight against the Pistons, I now know how everybody felt when Jordan was doing it to them :mad:
Kodos
06-09-2004, 02:22 AM
Kerr just frustrated me, because it seemed like he would always come into the game and hit a big 3. Since I was always rooting against the Bulls, you could see how I came to hate his guts.
I bear him no grudge these days, but back then, I could have throttled the guy.
I guess I feel the way about him that lots of folks felt about Danny Ainge. Personally, I loved that guy. Always hitting the big three. Loved him!
I should note that I didn't really start following the NBA until Barkley was with the Suns. I loved Barkley and coach Westphal. I didn't really like the Luke-Perry lookin' guy, but I thought Ainge was great. I probably would have hated him had I followed the NBA when he was with the Celtics. ;)
Kodos
06-09-2004, 02:24 AM
Oh, and for the record: Jordan's famous final shot with the Bulls should've been an offensive foul. He pushed off!
Neuqua
06-09-2004, 02:32 AM
There was an interesting interview that Dan Patrick had with Phil Jackson regarding his stay with the Bulls.
http://www.suntimes.com/output/jackson/cst-spt-jax08.html
The examination of the Bulls dynasty of the 1990s is constructed around a candid interview with former coach Phil Jackson, who discusses the team's premature breakup and what might have been.
'Talking to Phil Jackson I enjoyed. Phil is removed from it, being the Lakers coach, but looking back. For him to say, 'If Michael's dad is not murdered, we win eight titles,' to look at how management brought the wrecking ball to that franchise ... He may be on the verge of winning another championship with the Lakers, but in his eyes, he's always going to be the Chicago Bulls coach and I think he looks back at opportunity lost -- what could have been with maybe one or two more years.
''Phil's reflective, but I don't think he looks back and says, 'What if?' But I think he allowed himself to [in the interview] and I appreciate that because he was giving me something I didn't think he was going to give me in the first place.
''And to talk about Jordan, that he's never come across anyone like him in all the players he's played with and coached with and against. He said, 'I'll never be able to find someone with that competitive spirit.' He said, 'That's what drove him, but it drove our team and made my job easier.'''
Vince
06-09-2004, 03:02 AM
Tonight, when he took that shot, you couldn't have guarded him any better then that.
I don't want to get into the debate...I don't follow basketball closely enough to put forth an educated opinion...but tonight, Rip Hamilton DEFINITELY could have guarded him better. He took a step back right before Kobe took the shot...Kobe had separation. I'll give it to him...that's still an incredibly difficult shot. However, Rip should have known that Kobe needed a three, and should never have backed up at all.
Neuqua
06-09-2004, 03:04 AM
Rip said so himself that he should have gotten closer to Kobe on that final shot in the post game interview.
rexallllsc
06-09-2004, 03:59 AM
Rip said so himself that he should have gotten closer to Kobe on that final shot in the post game interview.
Shoulda
Woulda
Coulda
Lakers win 4 titles in 5 years
ice4277
06-09-2004, 05:05 AM
Well that was a big deflater for the Pistons, IMO would have been better to lose by about 15. Still, though, we have seen them overcome tough situations before; they lost game 5 of the second round in triple OT then went on the road to New Jersey and won to keep the series alive. I think the crowd at the Palace will really be a big boost for them as well. Should be a great last four or five games to end the series. Nonetheless, this really was one that I think Detroit had to have.
Ksyrup
06-09-2004, 06:53 AM
Forget Kobe's shot. The game was lost on the inbounds pass. How could you let Shaq catch the inbounds pass with 10 seconds left, down by 3, and NOT foul him?
Vince
06-09-2004, 08:04 AM
Personally, I think that all Pistons fans, when told at the beginning of the series, that they were going to be tied after the first two games, would have been absolutely thrilled, and rightfully so.
However, I think the manner in which they pulled off the split in LA was the worst possible formula for achieving that split. Not only will they have to play game 3 coming off of a loss, but they now have to deal with the thought that they SHOULD have won, but didn't.
Are they strong enough to overcome the star power of the Lakers and the fact that everyone believed at the beginning that they didn't have a chance?
Are they strong enough to forget the manner in which game two was lost, and to focus on the positive that is earning a split on the road to open a series?
Individually, the answer to both questions is obviously yes...but I think that the 'mystique' (really not the right word...but hey, it's 6 AM and I didn't sleep last night) of the Lakers that the Pistons wiped away with Game 1 is right back to the forefront because of the manner in which they lost game 2. I'm not saying they can't overcome it...I'm just saying it's going to be that much tougher.
MrBug708
06-09-2004, 10:41 AM
Forget Kobe's shot. The game was lost on the inbounds pass. How could you let Shaq catch the inbounds pass with 10 seconds left, down by 3, and NOT foul him?
Except the Pistons were up by 3
MrBug708
06-09-2004, 10:42 AM
My father is from the Windy City and is a HUGE Chicago Bulls fan, I mean HUGE. For a while there, until I was about 12 yrs old I was right there along with him, wanting to be like dad and rooting for his favorite team. Because of this I watched every single Bulls championship run from '91 to '98 and I'd have to agree that if the 72-10 Bulls met up with the Lakers team of today ... Bulls, no contest.
Well, I think some of the 1980's Laker teams would kick the ass out of these 2004 Lakers. I guess I'm sarcastically saying, way to go out on a limb.
rkmsuf
06-09-2004, 10:54 AM
Forget Kobe's shot. The game was lost on the inbounds pass. How could you let Shaq catch the inbounds pass with 10 seconds left, down by 3, and NOT foul him?
Kobe did hit a miraculous shot. They played good D and were all over him and he just made it. I don't have much of an issue with the way the Pistons played the last 10 seconds.
You could easily have the reverse arguement had Shaq made the first, bricked the second and it was tipped in.
MrBug708
06-09-2004, 11:11 AM
Rip said so himself that he should have gotten closer to Kobe on that final shot in the post game interview.
LOL
Did you think he was going to say "I guarded him as best as I could, but he's Kobe?"
Ksyrup
06-09-2004, 11:15 AM
Kobe did hit a miraculous shot. They played good D and were all over him and he just made it. I don't have much of an issue with the way the Pistons played the last 10 seconds.
You could easily have the reverse arguement had Shaq made the first, bricked the second and it was tipped in.
Comparing the chances of that happening, versus Kobe at least getting a look at a 3...I would have gone with the foul. That requires a couple of things to occur for them to tie, Kobe only needed one shot.
rkmsuf
06-09-2004, 11:17 AM
Comparing the chances of that happening, versus Kobe at least getting a look at a 3...I would have gone with the foul. That requires a couple of things to occur for them to tie, Kobe only needed one shot.
That's true but I've always regarded the foul strategy up 3 a bush league move. Of course I have zero stake in the game so I can hold that opinion and be proud.
Ksyrup
06-09-2004, 11:19 AM
Except the Pistons were up by 3
I'm not sure I follow you. That's what I said.
Or at least, what I meant was (if this is your confusion), Shaq caught the inbounds pass and the LAKERS were down by 3. Foul him and let them figure out how to score 3 points off of 2 free throws with 9 seconds left, as opposed to letting someone, especially Kobe, get a shot at a 3-pointer.
I would have made Shaq beat me by forcing him to hit a free throw and hope for a rebound to get the other points.
Ksyrup
06-09-2004, 11:21 AM
That's true but I've always regarded the foul strategy up 3 a bush league move. Of course I have zero stake in the game so I can hold that opinion and be proud.
If bush league move = greater chance at victory, don't you take it?
I didn't hear anyone calling Bellicheck bush league when he took the safety against the Broncos last year. That was good strategy. Same thing applies here. You use the opponents weaknesses against them.
rkmsuf
06-09-2004, 11:24 AM
If bush league move = greater chance at victory, don't you take it?
I didn't hear anyone calling Bellicheck bush league when he took the safety against the Broncos last year. That was good strategy. Same thing applies here. You use the opponents weaknesses against them.
Like I said, my thinking may be different if I'm on the Pistons bench. As a fan I like to see it played out the way it was. I'm glad he had the chance to hit the dramatic shot...
Ksyrup
06-09-2004, 11:31 AM
Be proud!
rkmsuf
06-09-2004, 11:32 AM
Rock on
korme
06-09-2004, 12:11 PM
Like many teams, I got sick of the Bulls winning all the time, and in particular, I got sick of their obnoxious fans. I was in college at IU, and fans of the Chicago teams were just insufferable. So I took to rooting against anything Chicago-related. Also, I still had a distaste for the Bears after their Super Bowl season and that idiotic Super Bowl Shuffle. So hating the Bulls came easily.
I hated Scottie Pippen. Especially after his playoff incident where he refused to go back in because the play wasn't designed for him (I think it was in one of the 2 Jordan retirement years between the three-peats).
I hated the Worm. He was (and still is) a total attention-whore piece of shit.
I hated that little blond bastard Steve Kerr who'd come off the bench and couldn't do anything but hit the damned 3s.
I hated smug Phil Jackson.
But I liked Jordan and his competitive spirit. I loved his will to win. It's too bad I hated everyone around him. But no matter. If they could magically face today's Lakers, I would be rooting for the Bulls to sweep Shaq and Kobe.
The Paxson shot that beat Barkley's Suns was one of the most horrific moments in my life as a sports fan. :mad:
how can you hate ho grant, he was a player
Radii
06-09-2004, 12:19 PM
Detroit really shoulda fouled Shaq, I agree with that sentiment. That's a bad strategic error that many coaches make i think. don't even allow a 3 point opportunity, espicially if a horrible free throw shooter touches the ball.
The loss is definitely demoralizing for Detroit, and if there were 2 more games in LA immediately after this one, or if this was game 1 and game 2 was in LA, I'd be worried, but with 3 games in a row in Detroit, I doubt that will be as big a factor.
A detroit sweep in Detroit to win it all at home seems unreasonable, but taking 2 of 3 and going back to LA with 2 chances to win it should be expected. I will be very suprised if this series isn't 3-2 Pistons heading back to LA. A game 7 could be awesome.
Ksyrup
06-09-2004, 12:22 PM
If Detroit is up 3-2 going back to LA, that would be about all you could ask. And they've shown they can win in LA, so it's not like they would feel overwhelmed at needing to win there.
MrBug708
06-09-2004, 12:29 PM
Well, Shaq did hit that FT to make that 3 point play with 40 seconds to go
Radii
06-09-2004, 12:56 PM
A couple of interesting comments in this wiley/simmons chat on ESPN:
Ralph Wiley: (1:50 PM ET ) [weird stuff cut]... It's a seven game series. Kobe has to be Jordan and Luke has to play for the Lakers to win.
Bill Simmons: (1:53 PM ET ) I agree with Ralph - Detroit has a better team than LA. This much is clear. Payton and Malone are BELOW-AVERAGE PLAYERS at this point. They actually take stuff off the table. To win the series, Kobe has to become MJ for ten more days. That's the bottom line.
And I do agree with Simmons' sentiment. Every minute Malone spends on the floor is taking away from someone else who can actually contribute, and not detract from the Lakers chances. He looks horrible on the court.
rexallllsc
06-09-2004, 08:25 PM
I think Malone is fine/adequate. It's Payton who is a problem, IMO
korme
06-10-2004, 08:19 PM
Game 3, Pistons early up 6-0.
This is a great series.
MrBug708
06-10-2004, 08:31 PM
Thanks for jinxing it Shorty
korme
06-10-2004, 08:52 PM
29-17 bugglecakes
korme
06-10-2004, 08:55 PM
Watching the FInals makes me want to play the next version of FBB.
LionsFan10
06-10-2004, 08:59 PM
I just HATE when "Scoreless" Corliss Williamson is playing, God that guy is terrible.
korme
06-10-2004, 09:00 PM
sweet behind the back!
korme
06-10-2004, 09:03 PM
sweet hook mehmet!
ooh, before i can hit post, sweet dunk fisher!
LionsFan10
06-10-2004, 09:03 PM
Good job, Fisher!
korme
06-10-2004, 09:03 PM
BTW, after 6 minutes LA has scored 3 points this quarter.
LionsFan10
06-10-2004, 09:04 PM
Dola
Mehmet is just a great post player lol.
LionsFan10
06-10-2004, 09:09 PM
Man, if you didn't know any better you'd think LA lost Game 2. Terrible play by everyone there.
Philliesfan980
06-10-2004, 09:15 PM
Man, if you didn't know any better you'd think LA lost Game 2. Terrible play by everyone there.
They should have. Brown tells them to foul anyone and they *Probably* win game 2.
ice4277
06-10-2004, 09:32 PM
Man, if you didn't know any better you'd think LA lost Game 2. Terrible play by everyone there.
This is the type of game that I really can't imagine the Pistons losing. Not because it is bad, but because of the tempo and flow.
Driftwood
06-10-2004, 09:34 PM
Why can`t Payton do anything out there? I mean, hes not a TERRIBLE point-guard....hes an ass, but quite talented. Even in the triangle youd think he could go off for at least 10-12 a night....
VPI97
06-10-2004, 10:18 PM
The Lakers shouldn't even be on the same court as the Pistons. The series won't go back to LA.
Ksyrup
06-10-2004, 10:23 PM
This is beyond my wildest dreams. One amazing shot by Kobe, or this would be heading toward 3-0. The next game is crucial - if LA gets it to 2-2, they've got a shot. 3-1 and they're done.
VPI97
06-10-2004, 10:26 PM
The only suspense left in this mismatch is whether Shaq is going to get frustrated and punch someone.
Fouts
06-10-2004, 10:26 PM
Up by 19 and Rasheed is still crying. How can you root for that guy?
VPI97
06-10-2004, 10:27 PM
Up by 19 and Rasheed is still crying. How can you root for that guy?He's not a Laker.
Fouts
06-10-2004, 10:29 PM
I can understand where you're coming from, being a hawks fan.
LionsFan10
06-10-2004, 10:35 PM
Up by 19 and Rasheed is still crying. How can you root for that guy?
It's not crying, he's an emotional player he always has been no other way to put it. And, like VPI I can say I root for him because he's not a Laker.
Driftwood
06-10-2004, 10:35 PM
this reminds me EXACTLY of the DiamondBacks vs the Yankees in the World Series.
Anyone else want to 2nd that?
ice4277
06-10-2004, 10:35 PM
Up by 19 and Rasheed is still crying. How can you root for that guy?
stop being bitter
Ksyrup
06-10-2004, 10:40 PM
this reminds me EXACTLY of the DiamondBacks vs the Yankees in the World Series.
Anyone else want to 2nd that?
Is Larry Brown playing the part of Kim for not fouling Shaq and letting Kobe hit one with 2 outs in the bottom of the 9th?
Driftwood
06-10-2004, 10:44 PM
I just mean that one team is dominating the supposedly superior team...and if it werent few a heroic shot, it would be REALLY lopsided...
I just hope the Pistons can keep it going. I really hate the Lakers because theyre so arrogant and Payton and Malone are trying to get a free ring.
edit: removed Bush Joke
MrBug708
06-10-2004, 10:44 PM
Boy, I go to my sisters award show and the Lakers fall apart.
Anyone wanna bet me the series goes back to LA?
Driftwood
06-10-2004, 10:45 PM
Boy, I go to my sisters award show and the Lakers fall apart.
edit: wasnt meant to be a personal attack...just an off-color joke
Fouts
06-10-2004, 10:47 PM
WTF is with the personal attacks.
LionsFan10
06-10-2004, 10:51 PM
edit: wasnt meant to be a personal attack...just an off-color joke
Driftwood, I know you said you were kidding but expect to be suspended if not worse for this type of joke. That was a bit too far.
Fouts
06-10-2004, 10:51 PM
I just mean that one team is dominating the supposedly superior team...and if it werent few a heroic shot, it would be REALLY lopsided...
I just hope the Pistons can keep it going. I really hate the Lakers because theyre so arrogant and Payton and Malone are trying to get a free ring.
edit: removed Bush Joke
Its not arrogance, its professionalism.
Ksyrup
06-10-2004, 10:54 PM
Driftwood, I know you said you were kidding but expect to be suspended if not worse for this type of joke. That was a bit too far.
What could be worse than suspension? Will he lose posts?!
Schmidty
06-10-2004, 10:54 PM
Its not arrogance, its professionalism.
Wrong. It's arrogance. The Pistons are the ones that have shown professionalism.
thesloppy
06-10-2004, 10:58 PM
Man, the Lakers boxscore is just heinous looking....leading scorers with 14 and 11 and a FG% of 36.5. Obvious, but interesting to note that no other laker besides Kobe and Shaq has put double digits in the scoring column since the start of this series.
Stuck watching gamecast at work, and I was just happy to see Stanislav Medvedenko's name scroll across the screen several times.
Ksyrup
06-10-2004, 11:04 PM
The Lakers have that classic look of a dynasty-type team that expects all opponents to respect them, back down to them, and take a beating because their past success says they should. They have that bewildered look of a team realizing that their past means jack squat in the here and now.
They kinda look like the Rams from the Super Bowl of a few years ago. "This can't be happening to us. We're miles better than them. Everyone on ESPN says so!"
kingfc22
06-10-2004, 11:09 PM
Can Phil please just bench Payton and start Fisher.
Driftwood
06-10-2004, 11:09 PM
As much as I hate the Lakers, a small part of me almost wants Payton and Malone to get their ring, and then spend the rest of their lives trying to explain why they deserve it.
But then I realize how much I hate them, and then instead of wishing they get ring, I start wishing they get a disease.
The_herd
06-10-2004, 11:10 PM
I really hope this ends this crap that the Eastern conference is so inferior to the West. The top 2-3 teams in each conference are on the same level. While the East may not have the depth (as in quality teams) that the West has, the East's top teams are improveing, while the top teams in the West are really starting to look old.
LionsFan10
06-10-2004, 11:11 PM
The Lakers have that classic look of a dynasty-type team that expects all opponents to respect them, back down to them, and take a beating because their past success says they should. They have that bewildered look of a team realizing that their past means jack squat in the here and now.
They kinda look like the Rams from the Super Bowl of a few years ago. "This can't be happening to us. We're miles better than them. Everyone on ESPN says so!"
I agree with this, that and the fact that we held the "Lakers" (I mean Shaq & Kobe) to what like 14 & 11 pts? They didn't get to the foul line at all and we took Shaq out of the low post a lot, Shaq had plenty of opportunitys to dunk the ball and the Pistons just would NOT let Shaq dunk the ball, no easy shots for anybody out there. GREAT game by the Pistons. :D :D
The_herd
06-10-2004, 11:11 PM
As much as I hate the Lakers, a small part of me almost wants Payton and Malone to get their ring, and then spend the rest of their lives trying to explain why they deserve it.
But then I realize how much I hate them, and then instead of wishing they get ring, I start wishing they get a disease.
I would much rather them have to explain how a team predicted to win 70+ games and stroll their way to an NBA title could look so bad at times.
JeffNights
06-10-2004, 11:14 PM
i'm waiting agian to hear a player from the Lakers again say "Oh its nothing they did, it was us"
LionsFan10
06-10-2004, 11:15 PM
Shaq just got done rambling about it right now.
Driftwood
06-10-2004, 11:16 PM
What really makes me sad is that until the Pistons actually have the ring on their fingers, Im going to suspect the Lakers will pull it out.
I really hate them. And Rush Limbaugh too, but for slightly different reasons.
Fouts
06-10-2004, 11:19 PM
You gotta win 4. Spurs were all posting haha I hate the Lakers after game 2 of that series, but they aren't posting anymore.
Driftwood
06-10-2004, 11:21 PM
Im sure they still hate the Lakers
Driftwood
06-10-2004, 11:22 PM
Would I be considered a bandwagon fan if I never cared for the Pistons before, but now I really like them and buy some of their old-school jerseys and stuff, roll them in mud a lot, wash them a hundred times, and let people think Ive been with them all the way?
I just watched the game in a bar that is 90+ miles from Detroit and the place was going crazy..... folks just want to see LA fall.... and it's happening....
I feel the series will go back to LA but that will be it..... LA looked flat and I can't wait to see them lose... It's been far too long since I've been to a Pistons championship parade.....
bigdawg2003
06-10-2004, 11:30 PM
this reminds me EXACTLY of the DiamondBacks vs the Yankees in the World Series.
Anyone else want to 2nd that?
I have to disagree with that..........
Detroit will win the series in less than seven games
Fouts
06-10-2004, 11:31 PM
I just watched the game in a bar that is 90+ miles from Detroit and the place was going crazy..... folks just want to see LA fall.... and it's happening....
I feel the series will go back to LA but that will be it..... LA looked flat and I can't wait to see them lose... It's been far too long since I've been to a Pistons championship parade.....
I'm curious to why you think it will go back to LA after a blowout like that.
JeffNights
06-10-2004, 11:34 PM
Hmmm....i really cant say i expect our team to pull out three in a row...even if they are at the palace...but then agian, if not for Kobes miracle in game two...the series would be 3-0.....
Ok ....PISTONS IN FIVE>
I'm curious to why you think it will go back to LA after a blowout like that.They're the Lakers.... they will pull one of the next two off (or the ref's will give them one...:)) ........ but the Pistons have proved they can win in LA.... I see six, but if it goes to seven, I guarantee a Piston victory in game seven.... anyway it goes, the Pistons win... :)
LloydLungs
06-11-2004, 12:13 AM
If the Pistons are gonna win the series they better do it in less than 7. Road teams don't win game 7s in the NBA (unless they have Kobe on their side).
I hate the Lakers, and the Pistons are the better team, but... Kobe. Y'know? The "team with the best player wins the finals" theory is a tried-and-true theory.
MrBug708
06-11-2004, 12:22 AM
Since when is 2-1 so bad?
Since when is 2-1 so bad?
You spin me right round, baby
right round like a record, baby
Right round round round
You spin me right round, baby
Right round like a record, baby
Right round round round
:D
LionsFan10
06-11-2004, 12:38 AM
Steven A. Smith is a jackass, has anyone seen him on SportsCenter yet? What an idiot, he makes the same excuses for the Lakers that the LA players make. He's probably on the Lakers pay-roll. Him and Greg Anthony got heated this time, you can tell Anthony is sick of Smith, and so am I to be honest.
MrBug708
06-11-2004, 12:52 AM
Steven A. Smith is a jackass, has anyone seen him on SportsCenter yet? What an idiot, he makes the same excuses for the Lakers that the LA players make. He's probably on the Lakers pay-roll. Him and Greg Anthony got heated this time, you can tell Anthony is sick of Smith, and so am I to be honest.
Just curious, but what makes you think he's on the Laker payroll?
Fouts
06-11-2004, 01:06 AM
If its pro-Lakers, they must have been paid off. It's the new fad I guess. Try this - if my team wins, they played better, if your team wins, they played better. The refs are paid off is a bunch of horseshit.
LionsFan10
06-11-2004, 01:29 AM
Blah blah blah ... The refs are paid off is a bunch of horseshit.
The refs, who said anything about the refs? I'm talking about a SportsCenter analyst :confused: . And I don't really think he's on the Lakers payroll Bug, it was just a sarcastic remark, it just seems like he has the SAME excuse the Lakers do everytime they lose, it gets a little annoying to hear. Just watch SportsCenter, you'll see him and Greg Anthony get into it about that.
ice4277
06-11-2004, 05:46 AM
Great game by the Pistons again, I never really expected they would perform to the level they have in Games 1 and 3. Another off-night for the Lakers, for sure, but hmm, I wonder why? Its funny how a team suddenly can't hit their shots when they come up against the Pistons.
Looking ahead, it seems like Shaq and Kobe would almost have to have better games the rest of the way out. But, again, we see no likely third option from L.A. They need a third option if they want to stay in this series, but they aren't close to finding one. However, I think Game 4 will be their best game of the series, and could turn out to be a classic.
Neuqua
06-11-2004, 06:21 AM
Love the followup game Kobe had as well. Is there a single doubt that he is not the best non-post player in the league?
BTW, did anyone catch Malone confronting that fan and putting his hand on his face?
Neuqua
06-11-2004, 06:40 AM
LA may very well come back and win this series, but as I have been saying for the past few months now, I hope that this atleast proves to fans that the Eastern Conference is not as bad as people want you to think. I have held a steadfast belief that either of the big 3 in the East could win the Finals and I had been trying to say that all year long and I am so happy that Detroit is more than proving itself to be a challenge for the mighty Lakers.
And hell, I am a Chicago Bulls fan so it certainly isn't easy to root for them. But I really do love the way they play, how they all are so selfless and team oriented and I am rooting like heck that they can pull through.
Ksyrup
06-11-2004, 06:59 AM
Steven A. Smith is a jackass, has anyone seen him on SportsCenter yet? What an idiot, he makes the same excuses for the Lakers that the LA players make. He's probably on the Lakers pay-roll. Him and Greg Anthony got heated this time, you can tell Anthony is sick of Smith, and so am I to be honest.
He's not on the Lakers' payroll, this is just another example of how ESPN has decided to innundate Sportscenter with PTI-style "commentary." Sometimes it's scripted just like PTI, with two people taking clear opposing viewpoints just for the sake of it, other times they just do it.
rkmsuf
06-11-2004, 08:07 AM
I didn't realize how bad the Lakers supporting cast is. Beyond Shaq and Kobe I'm not sure any team would want any of them. It's amazing they've made it this far.
MrBug708
06-11-2004, 08:12 AM
I didn't realize how bad the Lakers supporting cast is. Beyond Shaq and Kobe I'm not sure any team would want any of them. It's amazing they've made it this far.
*nods*
Payton is worthless and Malone hurt does us no good. Can't believe I'm gonna say this, but we need Horace Grant. We have Shaq as our lone post player.
I'll stand by my Kobe comments Neuq. He'll still go down as better then Jordan.
korme
06-11-2004, 10:00 AM
Ho Grant is great. He is responsible for their first 3 titles. Without him, the Pistons win in 5/6. :)
LionsFan10
06-11-2004, 12:42 PM
Payton is worthless and Malone hurt does us no good. Can't believe I'm gonna say this, but we need Horace Grant. We have Shaq as our lone post player.
I'll stand by my Kobe comments Neuq. He'll still go down as better then Jordan.
If Kobe goes to another team (who lacks a center) and dominates the game, like Jordan did then yes he will be better than Jordan when his career ends, however as long as he has someone that is MORE dominant than him underneath the rim he will never get that credit from writers or fans alike (unless you live in CA).
The word is Kobe is going to accept talks from the Knicks when free agency hits. If he goes the Knicks and brings championships to New York, who lacks a dominat big man, then he will achieve Jordan like status and the writers and fans will agree that he is above and beyond Jordan's level. I think there was a poll the other night on ESPN.com that asked which player would you rather have on your team at 25 yrs old, Jordan or Kobe and 80% (or close, can't remember exact number) choose Michael Jordan so it's clear that he's still no where close to earning Jordan like status.
I agree, however that at 25 Kobe is a MUCH better shooter than Jordan was at 25 yrs old and, like I said if he keeps his production up and brings championships to a team that lacks such a dominant big man like O'Neal (even if it's the Lakers when Shaq retires) then he will go down as the best player to play this game.
Kodos
06-11-2004, 12:50 PM
I'll take Jordan over Bryant any day of the week.
MrBug708
06-11-2004, 02:08 PM
Kobe doesn't need to win an NBA championship anymore. He can do what Jordan did and score at will, it's not like he hasnt been at the top of his game. Now, if he ends up a Tmac and just scores a lot of points on a team that does very little, then we'll see....
Besides, the age of the dominant bigman is over...
MrBug708
06-11-2004, 02:10 PM
I think there was a poll the other night on ESPN.com that asked which player would you rather have on your team at 25 yrs old, Jordan or Kobe and 80% (or close, can't remember exact number) choose Michael Jordan so it's clear that he's still no where close to earning Jordan like status.
The poll is flawed however. People think that Jordan, at 25, is still Jordan. Remember, if Jordan was 25 at this point in his career, he'd have 3 years under his belt while Kobe has 7 down and it would be no comparision even.
VPI97
06-11-2004, 02:13 PM
Kobe is more Pippen than he is Jordan.
TroyF
06-11-2004, 02:15 PM
I'd take Jordan over Bryant as well, but I woud take Kobe over TMac. (an earlier debate in this thread) For one, Bryant is a superior defensive player. For another, people are putting too much into McGrady's year.
Look at three sets of numbers:
Player A: 45.1% FG, 38.3% 3PT, 30 PPG, 5.9 APG, 6.9 RPG, 2.2 Steals per game
Player B: 41.7% FG, 33.9% 3PT, 28 PPG, 5.5 APG, 6.0 RPG, 1.32 Steals per game
Player C: 43.8% FG, 32.7% 3PT, 24 PPG, 5.1 APG, 5.5 RPG, 1.72 Steals per game
Best player on the board, by far is player A. Players B and C are nearly interchangable, with B getting a slight nod in the numbers. Players A and C are Kobe Bryant. Player A is last year's version. B is McGrady this year.
You can say Shaq helped make Kobe's life easier, which is certainly true. Still, I think Kobe is a superior defensive player and will never be far behind (if he isn't BETTER) than McGrady on the offensive end.
But Jordan? No way.
The_herd
06-11-2004, 02:25 PM
LA may very well come back and win this series, but as I have been saying for the past few months now, I hope that this atleast proves to fans that the Eastern Conference is not as bad as people want you to think. I have held a steadfast belief that either of the big 3 in the East could win the Finals and I had been trying to say that all year long and I am so happy that Detroit is more than proving itself to be a challenge for the mighty Lakers.
And hell, I am a Chicago Bulls fan so it certainly isn't easy to root for them. But I really do love the way they play, how they all are so selfless and team oriented and I am rooting like heck that they can pull through.
I posted the same general idea on the previous page. I do love how the Sportscenter analysts aren't mentioning the fact that a week ago they were joking that the Lakers would beat any Eastern Conference team in 3. As I said earlier, the East is improving while the West is starting to look really old.
vtbub
06-11-2004, 02:27 PM
I think Detroit plays much better as a team than the Lakers, which is why Detroit will win.
MrBug708
06-11-2004, 02:33 PM
I think Detroit plays much better as a team than the Lakers, which is why Detroit will win.
*nods* Not to mention our Post situation is Shaq and 2 white guys....
The_herd
06-11-2004, 02:43 PM
*nods* Not to mention our Post situation is Shaq and 2 white guys....
Just following Larry Birds advice.
LionsFan10
06-11-2004, 03:39 PM
I think Detroit plays much better as a team than the Lakers, which is why Detroit will win.
I think this is a great point. And it's a big reason why the Pistons own the Lakers so far this series, it's a matter of five individuals playing basketball agasint a team. You have to look at it like this, every one of L.A's five starters were superstars and "go to" players on other teams or could be that guy in the case of Kobe Bryant (who's always had to share with Shaq), so really even though it's a "dream team" of sorts in L.A nobody really knows how to give it up when it comes to scoring and what not.
Payton is way out of place in the triangle offense and it's shown not only through out the playoffs but in general. Karl Malone, besides being old just hasn't fit in to the "strictly defensive" role that he's now expected to play, where in Utah he was their leading scorer every year. Kobe & Shaq have never gotten along all that great when it comes to being "the man" in the Lakers offense. Shaq even commented on it at the post game press conference afterward he said "I can dominate, I just have to get the ball more." And did anyone see the clips of Kobe when he was trying to get the ball while matched up with Lindsey Hunter? He looked like he wanted to cry, nobody was passing to him even though he had a super mis-match in a 6'1" PG like Lindsey Hunter on him.
Bottom line is, until LA learns to play like a team better ... Detroit is going to continue to dominate. That, plus Detroit just wants it way more than LA and it's obvious.
MrBug708
06-11-2004, 03:50 PM
I think this is a great point. And it's a big reason why the Pistons own the Lakers so far this series, it's a matter of five individuals playing basketball agasint a team. You have to look at it like this, every one of L.A's five starters were superstars and "go to" players on other teams or could be that guy in the case of Kobe Bryant (who's always had to share with Shaq), so really even though it's a "dream team" of sorts in L.A nobody really knows how to give it up when it comes to scoring and what not.
Payton is way out of place in the triangle offense and it's shown not only through out the playoffs but in general. Karl Malone, besides being old just hasn't fit in to the "strictly defensive" role that he's now expected to play, where in Utah he was their leading scorer every year. Kobe & Shaq have never gotten along all that great when it comes to being "the man" in the Lakers offense. Shaq even commented on it at the post game press conference afterward he said "I can dominate, I just have to get the ball more." And did anyone see the clips of Kobe when he was trying to get the ball while matched up with Lindsey Hunter? He looked like he wanted to cry, nobody was passing to him even though he had a super mis-match in a 6'1" PG like Lindsey Hunter on him.
Bottom line is, until LA learns to play like a team better ... Detroit is going to continue to dominate. That, plus Detroit just wants it way more than LA and it's obvious.
While I dont disagree with what you say, your analysis WAS correct back in December, not in June. Gary Payton couldn't stop a cold. i dont think he cares that much about how much he scores, he just wants this season to end with a Ring at the end. he had that outburst 4 weeks ago when everyone was blaming him, when it's everyone else putting their expectations of him. As for Malone, he wasn't brought in so much as a defensive player as much as someone to knock down an open shot. When the Lakers win, he's hit early shots in the game, which frees Shaq because for the rest of the game, people are leery of Malone hitting a wide open shot, which he does have the ability to do. These playoffs have killed Malone though as he has had to face numerous top notch PF's that he hasnt had to face in the past. Duncan, Garnett, and the Wallaces are togh cookies for a 40 year old whose hurting to begin with. When you look at the Lakers depth, as I have said before, they are getting killed at the post spot. Detroit goes 5 men in, while the Lakers have Shaq, an hurt Karl Malone, a rookie undersized Luke Walton, and Slava "can't pass up a shot" Medvedenko. Grant being out is hurting us a lot, to the point where Samaki Walker, AC Green, or even Mark Madsen would be helping us out. There just isn't any depth there.
Neuqua
06-11-2004, 05:58 PM
Of course its easier for you to say that Bug because you live in LA and were 4 years old when Jordan was 25 years old and never got to watch him play. Lets take a quick look see and how Jordan fared at 25 years old shall we?
Jordan's stats as a 25 year old in the NBA:
81 GP .538 FG% .850 FT% 32.5 PPG 8.0 RPG 8.0 APG 2.9 SPG 4.40 (!) PPS (One of the highest totals in NBA history)
33 points, 8 rebounds and 8 assists every game? When was the last time we saw a line like that? You can bring in the title argument as many times as you want, but Jordan's best teammate before Pippen and Grant arrived was Orlando Woolridge. And I'd love to bring the question up to you. How do you think this 25 year old Jordan would do if he were placed into the Lakers lineup during all the championship runs? Keep in mind that this is the Jordan who almost single-handedly took down one of the greatest teams ever assembled (Bird and McHale's Celtics) in the first round of the playoffs.
Kobe will go down as one of the all time greats, but lay off the Jordan talk. By constantly bringing him up you take away from the great player that Kobe is. Also keep in mind Kobe may not even end up being the best player of this generation (with James in Cleveland.)
LionsFan10
06-11-2004, 06:30 PM
Of course its easier for you to say that Bug because you live in LA and were 4 years old when Jordan was 25 years old and never got to watch him play. Lets take a quick look see and how Jordan fared at 25 years old shall we?
Jordan's stats as a 25 year old in the NBA:
81 GP .538 FG% .850 FT% 32.5 PPG 8.0 RPG 8.0 APG 2.9 SPG 4.40 (!) PPS (One of the highest totals in NBA history)
33 points, 8 rebounds and 8 assists every game? When was the last time we saw a line like that? You can bring in the title argument as many times as you want, but Jordan's best teammate before Pippen and Grant arrived was Orlando Woolridge. And I'd love to bring the question up to you. How do you think this 25 year old Jordan would do if he were placed into the Lakers lineup during all the championship runs? Keep in mind that this is the Jordan who almost single-handedly took down one of the greatest teams ever assembled (Bird and McHale's Celtics) in the first round of the playoffs.
Kobe will go down as one of the all time greats, but lay off the Jordan talk. By constantly bringing him up you take away from the great player that Kobe is. Also keep in mind Kobe may not even end up being the best player of this generation (with James in Cleveland.)
Point well taken, nice write-up Neuq. I know you were't talking to me directly but I was one who did say that if Kobe left L.A and went and dominated in another city (New York for an example) who lacks a big man like Shaq then I thought he could be better than Michael Jordan. But I see where you are coming from, and I had a die-hard Chicago Bulls fan in my house growing up while the Bulls were winning 72 game a season :eek: , So I've heard all the Jordan arguments.
LastWhiteSoxFanStanding
06-11-2004, 07:33 PM
I won't disagree that Kobe Bryant has a flair for the dramatic like Michael Jordan, but he lacks the consistency Michael Jordan had.
For his playoff Career Jordan averaged 33 points. During the 1993 finals he averaged over 40 points a game.
Kobe struggled yesterday because Detroit has made it a priority to shut him down. He struggled offensively and he struggled defensively giving up a lot of the 31 points that Hamilton scored. Usually, Shaq is the priority and Kobe is able to get open looks because of that and play better defense as well. If Kobe leaves , sure his points per game will go up, but at what cost? I would bet his field goal percentage would go down and his defense would suffer.
Jordan was the focal point for every defense for every game of his career for over 15 years. And if it wasn't for his years in Washington he would be a career 50 percent shooter and he always played lights out defense. Simply put, Bryant is very good and extremely clutch. But is he Jordan? Not even close.
MrBug708
06-11-2004, 07:38 PM
I won't disagree that Kobe Bryant has a flair for the dramatic like Michael Jordan, but he lacks the consistency Michael Jordan had.
For his playoff Career Jordan averaged 33 points. During the 1993 finals he averaged over 40 points a game.
Kobe struggled yesterday because Detroit has made it a priority to shut him down. He struggled offensively and he struggled defensively giving up a lot of the 31 points that Hamilton scored. Usually, Shaq is the priority and Kobe is able to get open looks because of that and play better defense as well. If Kobe leaves , sure his points per game will go up, but at what cost? I would bet his field goal percentage would go down and his defense would suffer.
Jordan was the focal point for every defense for every game of his career for over 15 years. And if it wasn't for his years in Washington he would be a career 50 percent shooter and he always played lights out defense. Simply put, Bryant is very good and extremely clutch. But is he Jordan? Not even close.
Kobe needs to start pushing off :D
LastWhiteSoxFanStanding
06-11-2004, 07:40 PM
Kobe needs to start pushing off :D
The 25 year old Michael Jordan wouldn't have needed to push off! :)
MrBug708
06-11-2004, 07:44 PM
The 25 year old Michael Jordan wouldn't have needed to push off! :)
Touche. How far has Bryon Russell fallen? He's not even seeing the floor on THIS Lakers team...
bigdawg2003
06-13-2004, 08:10 PM
Detroit's PA guy has to be the worst, most annoying PA guy i've ever heard. How does he still have a job?
MikeVic
06-13-2004, 08:11 PM
Detroit's PA guy has to be the worst, most annoying PA guy i've ever heard. How does he still have a job?
:( I like him.. brings energy to the lineup announcement.
Eaglesfan27
06-13-2004, 08:11 PM
Did anyone else find it funny when Larry Brown jumped at the loud boom during the announcer calling his name?
LionsFan10
06-13-2004, 11:02 PM
Wow, it does NOT look good for the Lakers now. Down 3-1, lets see what kind of dis-credit the Lakers could give the Pistons now.
EDIT: By the way, if it weren't for Kobe Bryant comin' through on a miracle in game 2, we'd be celebrating right now :( .
Eaglesfan27
06-13-2004, 11:08 PM
Yeah, as they have mentioned many times: No team has ever come back from 3-1 in the finals. It doesn't look like the Lakers will be the 1st :)
DeToxRox
06-13-2004, 11:09 PM
All I can say is Jimmy Kimmels show Tuesday night (Well its taped I think, so Wednesday) ought to be fun
LionsFan10
06-13-2004, 11:10 PM
All I can say is Jimmy Kimmels show Tuesday night (Well its taped I think, so Wednesday) ought to be fun
DeTox, haven't seen you in this thread how you feelin' right now? :D
JeffNights
06-13-2004, 11:11 PM
Hey is Mr. Bug still taking bets on the series going back to L.A. i'll bet ya 100 posts it isn't......
LionsFan10
06-13-2004, 11:12 PM
I'd take that bet, but I don't think it will either.
mckerney
06-13-2004, 11:16 PM
All I can say is Jimmy Kimmels show Tuesday night (Well its taped I think, so Wednesday) ought to be fun
I'm pretty sure Kimmel is done at night, though unless they adjust for network times around the game it may be taped while the game is in progress.
Driftwood
06-13-2004, 11:19 PM
It should be 4-0 sweep....
Until the Lakers actually LOSE the 4th game, I`m sadly assuming they`ll win it all. I really hate them.
kingfc22
06-13-2004, 11:20 PM
Detroit's PA guy has to be the worst, most annoying PA guy i've ever heard. How does he still have a job?
Glad to hear this. I thought I was the only one.
JeffNights
06-13-2004, 11:30 PM
Mason pumps up the Palace baby!
So now Laker fans are complaining about the PA annoucer too? damn whats next, the hotel food???
Warhammer
06-13-2004, 11:57 PM
I hope we will finally stop hearing about how great of a coach Phil Jackson is.
All he has done is take two teams that had the best talent in the NBA at the time, and did exactly what was expected. Now in the situation where he actually has to coach, he has failed miserably. This team should not be one miracle away from being swept out of the playoffs.
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