OT - Atlanta loses only Classic Rock station

[JonInMiddleGA]

Various trade publications are reporting this late today, so it's either one heck of a rumor or it could be proven true by Wednesday morning.

from http://radioandrecords.com/Newsroom/2004_07_20/michelleengel.asp
The PD of Infinity Hot AC KVMX/Portland, OR transfers to the company's Classic Rock WZGC (Z93)/Atlanta to take on similar duties for what will become "Dave FM" tomorrow. Infinity VP/Rock Programming and WXRT/Chicago PD Norm Winer is overseeing the launch and assisting both Engel and GM Rick Caffey in WZGC's transition. When asked by R&R why Infinity didn't choose the "Jack FM" name in Atlanta, since it recently switched KRBV/Dallas to "Jack FM" as KJKK, a company spokesperson explained that Dave FM will offer different music than its Dallas sibling. No further information was known about Dave FM's format at press time. Atlanta Falcons play-by-play is expected to continue airing on WZGC following its change in presentation.

Probably of limited interest outside of our Atlanta-area contingent, but it makes my life pure hell for the next few hours. I'm due to deliver the upcoming Fall ad campaigns to our top client tomorrow afternoon ... and guess which station had the single largest part of the Atlanta buy? Uh-huh, the station that appears to be doomed to disappear any minute now. So what the hell am I going to do to replace that part of the campaign, it's already damned near impossible to find enough men in our demographic.

What seemed like a finish-it-up-in-the-morning situation, with very little left to do except print the finished product just became a burning-the-midnight-oil situation.

T'hell with whether I listen to the station, this sucks mightily for me right about now :mad:

[JeeberD]

I'm still pissed about Clear Channel changing KEGL "The Eagle" from Dallas' lone hard rock station into an easy listening crap factory a couple of months ago... :mad:

[JonInMiddleGA]

Incidentally, this would make Atlanta the largest radio market in the country without a classic rock station.

At least temporarily, I'd expect another chain to flip a format almost immediately.
There are at least a couple who seem likely to see immediate ratings gains by doing so.

I can't see the bulk of the existing Z-93 audience hanging around for what is typically a 1,000 song playlist that tries to blend Men At Work, Stevie Wonder, and the Cranberries into one station. Question is: unless somebody flips their format in response ASAP, where the heck are these listeners going to go? Looking at the available options in Atlanta, damned if I know.

[GrantDawg]

What the heck is the new format? That Dave/Jack FM crap is greek to me.

[JonInMiddleGA]

G-Dawg -- It's a recently imported variation on a format that has been quite successful in most of the larger Canadian markets.

In some markets it's "Dave", in other places "Jack", still others are using "Bob". Most all of them use some spin on the basic theme of "The 70's, the 80's, or whatever we want".

It sometimes gives at least the illusion of free-form radio, when it's actually pretty much just as researched & formulaic as anything else. They may play Stevie Wonder, followed by The Eagles, followed by The Smashing Pumpkins, followed by Hall & Oates.

It's a bloody f'n mess IMO, and I'd rather have my ears ripped off than have to spend more than 10 random minutes with it.

In Atlanta, they are presumably banking on an odd collection of listeners, stealing here & there from audiences culled from stations like Light (the old Peach), B-98.5, Cool 105.7, maybe even older Star 94 listeners, white WJZZ listeners, and a theoretically at least a few older 99X listeners. And they'll pray hard & often that they can retain some of their existing audience.

My own semi-educated guess? They'll keep a few of the folks who can stomach Mara & Dunham, lose virtually everybody else, and "borrow" listeners from the other stations who will sample them for a few weeks & then relegate them to "oh, is that still on?" status.

Then again, considering how poorly my prognostication went in the majority of the primaries today, the station could be #1 by next week.

[GrantDawg]

Then again, considering how poorly my prognostication went in the majority of the primaries today, the station could be #1 by next week.
With you, except it was less predictions and more "Hoping."

[JonInMiddleGA]

With you, except it was less predictions and more "Hoping."

Nah, I'm usually pretty realistic about my hopes vs my expectations, especially in primaries.

Locally, I managed to keep my personal string of 10 consecutive years without predicting a single local election outcome correct as all 4 incumbent commissioners lost in the primaries (3 Rep. and 1 Dem.).

Statewide, I'll admit to being thoroughly shocked by the Supreme Court race, not by the fact that Collins won, but by the margin. Brantley's campaign vs Isakson's campaign provide a good study in contrasts IMO of how to run for statewide office. Brantley seemed to spend all of his time & energy on just 2.5 counties (Cobb, Gwinnett, and north Fulton) & it backfired on him. Isakson on the other hand did a much better job of balancing large metro counties with the smaller counties outside the perimeter.

Brantley's performance here in itty-bitty Jasper County is a pretty good example -- In a primary that saw more than twice as many GOP ballots cast vs Dem ballots, he managed somehow to lose in the county by a more than 2-1 margin. Very few people here had the foggiest idea who the heck he was, and he did nothing to change that, which is a scenario that I believe played out strongly all over the state.

In hindsight, I should have been able to predict McKinney's primary win but I'll admit I didn't. I underestimated the effect of the split opposition of Woolard & Levitan, which created what might be called "too many choices" & prevented either of them from generating enough momentum to prevent McKinney from claiming what should IMO be called a miraculous re-birth. Sickening and stupifying to me, but genuinely impressive nonetheless, even I will say that. I also thought Thomas would pull at least twice as many votes as she did.

Most of the others statewide/district level played out about like I expected, with run-offs in the Dem Senate race (I figured Oxford would be a couple of points closer than he's been, but otherwise, as expected), the 6th District GOP race (okay, a run-off there was pretty much a no-brainer to call), and the 8th District (my district) GOP race . In the latter, I didn't have to look hard at the map to figure out that my chosen candidate (the only one with a sign in my yard at the moment) didn't have much of a chance. He didn't have the name recognition nor the home county population to compete with the other two.

I haven't seen much in the way of county by county results outside metro Atlanta yet, but probably the biggest surprises to me were the difficult times faced by some incumbents who didn't appear threatened (such as Mitchell Kaye being forced to a runoff), while others who were believed to be in a dogfight (such as Stephens vs McDonald) ended up being relatively easy.

[GrantDawg]

and the 8th District (my district) GOP race . In the latter, I didn't have to look hard at the map to figure out that my chosen candidate (the only one with a sign in my yard at the moment) didn't have much of a chance. He didn't have the name recognition nor the home county population to compete with the other two.


Ok, I'll bite. Whose sign is in your yard? I'm in the 8th district also, but I thought that Westmoreland had won without a runoff. Looking at the AJC now, I see he didn't.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Ok, I'll bite. Whose sign is in your yard? I'm in the 8th district also, but I thought that Westmoreland had won without a runoff. Looking at the AJC now, I see he didn't.

Sorry, I didn't mean to be mysterious about it, I was just kinda stream of consciousness there, didn't really think about it. I was backing former state Rep. Mike Crotts of Conyers.

The sprawl of the district, reaching into Bibb, Troup, Harris, and Muscogee Counties worked in Glynn's favor, while Fayette & Coweta went solidly for Westmoreland as expected.

Like most runoffs, this one will probably come down to which one can motivate their supporters to get to the polls a second time with little else on the ballot to push them their. There's enough Crotts/Mills voters to swing the election to Glynn if things are close, but with Westmoreland running 2nd in both Newton & Rockdale (which went to Crotts), he should have enough to hang on during the runoff ... as long as he can get them motivated.

[Peregrine]

What seemed like a finish-it-up-in-the-morning situation, with very little left to do except print the finished product just became a burning-the-midnight-oil situation.

Ugh, that sucks. Hope you can get it all done in time.

[Tekneek]

When I came upon this, I turned on 92.9...and it sounds the same so far...for the past few minutes at least. I'll have to turn this off once all the stuffed shirts roll into the office...

The only thing that might be different is the promo saying "Atlanta's Best Rock", which I think used to say "Atlanta's Best Classic Rock"... Hmmmm...

[JonInMiddleGA]

Ugh, that sucks. Hope you can get it all done in time.

Thanks Peregrine, it was ugly, but I finally put that (and me) to bed around
3 a.m. It wasn't pretty, but it got done, and that's the biggest part.

[Ksyrup]

The only thing that might be different is the promo saying "Atlanta's Best Rock", which I think used to say "Atlanta's Best Classic Rock"... Hmmmm...
So basically, no more Hotel California and Stairway to Heaven? Oh the humanity.

[JonInMiddleGA]

So basically, no more Hotel California and Stairway to Heaven? Oh the humanity.

Unfortunately for Z-93, that was what the core of their audience was looking for. As their mass mail to advertisers said this morning The music is based around the best songs of the mid 80s to mid 90s isn't exactly a ringing endorsement. The last station that tried mining that era in the market lasted roughly 2 years, rated below Z93,skewed heavily female and has seen more success with a traditional oldies format focusing on the 60's.

The big winner in all this? Likely to be CC's 96 Rock, at least until somebody else flips to the old Z93 format.

[Ksyrup]

I know. Just based on my music-listening tastes, I have absolutely no desire to hear songs I've been listening to for 25+ years, over and over again. I own some of the old stuff, and when I want to hear it - once every 5 years or so - I'll dig it out. I guess I just listen to music in such different ways than most people that I have a hard time understanding the concept behind music radio these days, and why it works.

But that's just me. The only type of radio station I'd listen to is one that played music I haven't heard. Then, I can get something useful out of it.

[Tekneek]

Z93 was good at times, when I was in the mood for it. I did not listen that often. I don't know how it usually goes on the morning show, but were they canned? During the half-hour that I had the station on it was just music and the "Atlanta's Best Rock" promo...no morning show talk or even mention of one... The website does not yet reflect any major changes...

[Tekneek]

But that's just me. The only type of radio station I'd listen to is one that played music I haven't heard. Then, I can get something useful out of it.

That's why I keep the Georgia State station programmed in... I am almost always guaranteed to hear something new to me when I push that one. Sometimes I even hear something good...

[JonInMiddleGA]

Z93 was good at times, when I was in the mood for it. I did not listen that often. I don't know how it usually goes on the morning show, but were they canned? During the half-hour that I had the station on it was just music and the "Atlanta's Best Rock" promo...no morning show talk or even mention of one... The website does not yet reflect any major changes...

This seems to have caught quite a few people off guard when it came down.

They've put up a sort of "back door" web site for advertisers, but it's nothing more than a splash screen with a canned 30 second clip of various artists & really doesn't provide anything in the way of information.I would be surprised if the current morning show remains (not a loss at all IMO), as the format doesn't seem to be personality oriented. Could be some of the same parts but with a different presentation.

Here's a pretty good column from one of the research companies about the whole Dave/Bob/Jack format. Included from that here is a playlist sample from the first station that I was familiar with to make the switch, I'd expect it to be a fairly representative sample of where Z93 will eventually end up, with the station here probably skewing a little more rock at least in the beginning in order to try to retain at least some of their existing audience.
http://www.edisonresearch.com/ross_on_radio_jackbob.htm

WPYA NORFOLK
Afternoons, March 10, 2004

Wings, “Live And Let Die”
Uncle Kracker, “Drift Away”
Melissa Etheridge, “Bring Me Some Water”
Tone-Loc, “Wild Thing”
Counting Crows, “Round Here”
Sheryl Crow, “The First Cut Is The Deepest”
Rolling Stones, “19th Nervous Breakdown”
Alanis Morissette, “Thank U”
Tom Petty & Heartbreakers, “Refugee”
Nine Days, “Absolutely (Story of a Girl)”

[wade moore]

We have a Bob station here in Norfolk...

It's interesting.. I turn to it on rare occassions when my 6 FM presets and 4 AM Talk presets do not have anything I'm interested in...

But it is definately something I would not miss if it dissapeared.

[JonInMiddleGA]

We have a Bob station here in Norfolk...

It's interesting.. I turn to it on rare occassions when my 6 FM presets and 4 AM Talk presets do not have anything I'm interested in...

But it is definately something I would not miss if it dissapeared.

With all the station switching that's been going on up there for the past year or so, I don't know how anybody keeps that presets set ;)

[Tekneek]

Uncle Kracker? Great... Nothing turns me off a station faster than hearing that guy.

[Ksyrup]

This seems to have caught quite a few people off guard when it came down.
One of the few radio stations I used to listen to was...hell, I don't even remember the name of it, but it was based in Dallas and had stations all over the US, including here in Tallahassee. It was a hard rock station, and they actually played some stuff I'd never heard. Well, I used to have my alarm clock set to the station, and when I got back from spring break one year during law school, unbeknownst to me, the station had change to a rap/R&B station (Hot or Lips something or other). Imagine my surprise on Monday morning when my alarm went off.

[Breeze]

Incidentally, this would make Atlanta the largest radio market in the country without a classic rock station.

At least temporarily, I'd expect another chain to flip a format almost immediately.
There are at least a couple who seem likely to see immediate ratings gains by doing so.

I can't see the bulk of the existing Z-93 audience hanging around for what is typically a 1,000 song playlist that tries to blend Men At Work, Stevie Wonder, and the Cranberries into one station. Question is: unless somebody flips their format in response ASAP, where the heck are these listeners going to go? Looking at the available options in Atlanta, damned if I know.


I used to work in the Atlanta Radio market, and it sucks. There are numerous reasons behind this, but regardless - the people that deal with the industry (not the companies doing the programming - but trade publication editors, artists, etc.) know the market is terrible. If your not from Atlanta, let's just sum it up by saying there are no stations that do anything unique, and the playlist on most of the stations can be divided into Urban or AC. You can't tell which Urban or AC station you are listening to because nothing separates them. Rather than risk your tiny share of the market by being different, the stations keep changing format to "cut the legs" out from under the stations with the big listeners. It's the - "if it's working for them, we can be happy doing the same thing and stealing some of their listeners" philosophy.

I also used to work in Marketing/ Advertising and I can empathise with you Jon. There will be no way to project listener numbers because this change will run off numerous listeners and since the market is so generic you can't honestly predict where they will be going.

By the way - just an opinion but I thought Z93 was starting to incorporate AC songs into their classic rock format a while back. I was really surprised by some of the songs that made their playlist recently.

[Ksyrup]

Too much Crow.

[Tekneek]

I hate how just about every station in this city has gone to the canned-format type deal, where it seems just about everything is coming in off of a satellite instead of happening in the studio... They don't even pretend to fit the local stuff into the obviously national format...they change everything to the same generic presentation made in other cities. So you can drive across the country and hear the same bland thing on a station in every market...

[miked]

I felt Z93 always had the best stage at Music Midtown, but I rarely listened to their radio station. Something about it didn't really feel "classic rock" to me. I think 96Rock passes for classic rock, so why do you feel Atlanta is the largest market without a classic rock station. If anything, 96Rock can be more classic rock than Z93.

Plus Z93 sponsored all those cool Sunday night shows at Jake's Toadhouse, formerly Jake's Roadhouse (much better).

[Ksyrup]

Back in 1996, I spent 14 hours trying to convince 4 or 5 different DJs to play a new song that I knew the station had received. The last guy, who finally played it for me, basically told me, after repeated calls, that he had a certain list of songs to play and that it was next to impossible to fit even one request in. I started at 9am and finally heard the song at around 11pm - just as Al Leiter was finishing his no-hitter for the Marlins, actually.

After that experience, I stopped listening to radio altogether. And thankfully, the internet has made relying on radio (and MTV) to hear new stuff largely unnecessary these days.

[Tekneek]

96 Rock is more of a hybrid between 'classic rock' and 'new rock' to me... They play old and new stuff, and have been doing that as long as I've listened to them (about 17 or 18 years...not consecutively of course...)

[Breeze]

Ksyrup,

What are you listening too online?

[Ksyrup]

Ksyrup,

What are you listening too online?
I don't really listen to any kind of internet radio station, per se. Mostly, I subscribe to several mailing lists and frequent a number of sites where new music in certain genres is discussed, and I search out clips of it on my own, and decide whether to buy from what I've heard. Really, the internet has made buying music so convenient. Just last night, I read a good review of an album that is being sold at CD Baby - I went to their site, listened to about half of the album being streamed, and bought it right then and there.

I'm constantly searching for new stuff to buy. I don't really have the time to sit and listen to a radio station-style format, so for me, it's easiest to just search out what I want to hear, rather than wait for one thing to hit me out of 2 hours worth of music.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I think 96Rock passes for classic rock, so why do you feel Atlanta is the largest market without a classic rock station.

Far far too much "new rock" on 'KLS for it to qualify as a classic rocker, they're at most a more traditional AOR (Album-Oriented-Rock) station.

Easiest way to figure that is the number of artists they share(d) with 99X (I use the possible past tense because I haven't looked at a 99X playist lately).

The reference to "without a classic rock" is pretty much a "how do they define themselves" thing anyway, I have no idea what the playlist looks like in, for example, Detroit (since it isn't a market I deal with).

[JonInMiddleGA]

I used to work in the Atlanta Radio market, and it sucks.
Boy did you ever just provide a spot-on summary of the Atlanta market.

You can't tell which Urban or AC station you are listening to because nothing separates them.

I will disagree with you on a part of that, specifically the Urban situation. I'm not sure when you left the market, but at this point the audiences have become quite distinct between WALR (Urban AC w/Tom Joyner), V-103 (heritage urban with everybody who hasn't left for one of the others), WPZE-FM (gospel), WHTA-FM (hip-hop), WFOX (#2 younger urban, sort of HTA-Lite), and WAMJ (urban oldies).

The urban format has been split up so many different ways that their 25%+ share of the market only manages to place one station in the top 5 anymore.



I also used to work in Marketing/ Advertising and I can empathise with you Jon. There will be no way to project listener numbers because this change will run off numerous listeners and since the market is so generic you can't honestly predict where they will be going.

I appreciate the empathy. Anybody who has been around this biz knows that this is just part of it, but damn how the timing of this sucked. Why couldn't they have waited until our campaign ended in October, y'know? Eh, still better that they did it before my presentation than after, keeps me from having to revise every order I'd just placed in the market.

By the way - just an opinion but I thought Z93 was starting to incorporate AC songs into their classic rock format a while back. I was really surprised by some of the songs that made their playlist recently.

Their playlist had undergone quite a transformation in the past 6-12 months. In a way, that makes this even more surprising to me because they seemed to be getting a good response to it (beating 'KLS in several demos in the last book).

[Breeze]

Ksyrup,

Thanks, I've been looking for an Internet station to listen to at work, because the station they pipe in at the office makes me want to blow my brains out. If I have to hear that stupid over sythasized Cher song again I'm going to scream, and oh yeah I've heard the 4 seasons "oh what a night" more in the last month then I did when the song was popular in the 70s.

If anyone has any suggestions I'm listening. For anyone interested in Americana I've got a station for you.

http://www.kcuvradio.com/

I used to work at an Americana station and I acquired a taste for this type of music (a real departure from my normal listening habits). I prefer the more Alternative Country side of Americana, which KCUV doesn't really play. I still like it, but I can't handle Americana all day.

[Ksyrup]

Ksyrup,

Thanks, I've been looking for an Internet station to listen to at work, because the station they pipe in at the office makes me want to blow my brains out. If I have to hear that stupid over sythasized Cher song again I'm going to scream, and oh yeah I've heard the 4 seasons "oh what a night" more in the last month then I did when the song was popular in the 70s.
Yikes! I work in a lawoffice, so I don't really get to play too much music (but I also don't get crap piped in, either), but today, I'm basically sitting at my desk doing a bunch of adminstrative stuff, and the boss is out of town, so I brought in 6 CDs to rotate. You can probably tell from these selections why I don't listen to radio - I Mother Earth, Atomic Opera, Pain of Salvation, AC Newman, Ed Harcourt, and Ayreon.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I used to work at an Americana station

Given your location, and that fact, I gotta ask -- was it WMLB?

If so, I'm going to have a very "small world" moment, as a former alum of the station myself.

[Breeze]

Hell Yeah. Chris Marino and I made the change to Americana.

[Breeze]

Oh my God. Can't believe you heard of WMLB.

[Breeze]

Jon,

When did you work at WMLB?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Jon,

When did you work at WMLB?

I'm starting to think you & I may very well know either other ... is your name Tracy by chance? (There are other possibilities, but that one strikes me as most likely, given our demographics around FOFC)

At the time I was there, I would have been working under the
name Jon Gresham.

I was in the meeting where the decision to hire "Marinara" was made, complete with listening to his made-at-his-kitchen-table demo tape :)

[Breeze]

Pre or Post David Stone? I got to believe you were hired by or passed David when he was PD.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Pre or Post David Stone? I got to believe you were hired by or passed David when he was PD.

He would have been after me, since I don't believe we ever met.

I was hired by Jeff Hilliard, who in turn hired Marino originally. Before the Americana flip went into full gear, the station went through a talk & semi-Americana period (that wasn't exactly what you would call a raging success ;) )

It was as a sort of "rural shock jock" morning host that CM was originally
hired for, a role that he evolved with as the station evolved into for the run
of critical success it had as a full-time Americana station.

I eventually got fired not long after Hillard left & Amy resumed control of operations. Seems that being the only guy in the building who knew just how f'd up the public file was and knowing why was important wasn't exactly a good thing for my job security :eek:

[Breeze]

OK,

Now I got it. I remember your name. Yeah, Hiilliard went with that 2 and 2 format - 2 country then 2 AC songs (I guess that is a precursor to Americana). Actually after you left I think Bill Mott (he may have been there when you were) became the News guy. Chris was the morning DJ, and a Sales guy named Jeff Bolin was the Station Manager (don't know how he got that job since he knew nothing about Radio). Amy came back in and dictated we were to go back to Country Music. True Country no Americana.

It wasn't till a couple years later Chris and I talked her into the switch. Gavin magazine then helps us out by having us as one of the reporting stations for their Americana section. I doubt you knew, but WMLB later won Gavin Magazine's Americana station of the year (in our first full year in the format) and Chris won Gavin's Americana PD of the year.

I'm pretty sure, it won the award a second time, but I wasn't working there anymore so I'm not positive.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Yep, that sounds about right.

I remember Mott, never knew Bolin.

I remember the whole evolution thing though, kinda followed it through the various trades & such. I knew about the awards, and knew that Marino later went on to work for either R&R or Gavin (I don't remember which) as their format editor for a while.
I lost track of him after that though.

While not quite the small world coincidence I thought it might be, the odds of two alums from that particular station ending up on the same forum (outside of a radio environment) are still pretty small :)

[Breeze]

That is pretty amazing running into a fellow WMLBer here.

Marino was hired as Gavin's Americana Editor. He left there (I think because Gavin dropped the format from the magazine, but that's just a guess on my part because Gavin hasn't charted Americana in years). His brother was a producer for the Bravo channel, and he moved to Colorado and worked with his brother for a short time. I think he's now a producer with Animal Planet.

[JonInMiddleGA]

His brother was a producer for the Bravo channel, and he moved to Colorado and worked with his brother for a short time. I think he's now a producer with Animal Planet.

Thanks for the update, it's far too easy to lose track of people once we part company (as we inevitably do in this business). That's probably a pretty good fit for him, an eclectic character if I ever met one.

It's a world of laughter, a world of tears
It's a world of hopes and a world of fears
There's so much that we share
That it's time we're aware
It's a small world after all

It's a small world after all
It's a small world after all
It's a small world after all
It's a small, small world

There is just one moon
and one golden sun
And a smile means friendship to everyone
Though the mountains divide
And the oceans are wide
It's a small world after all

It's a small world after all
It's a small world after all
It's a small world after all
It's a small, small world

[Breeze]

Thanks for the update, it's far too easy to lose track of people once we part company (as we inevitably do in this business). That's probably a pretty good fit for him, an eclectic character if I ever met one.

It's a world of laughter, a world of tears
It's a world of hopes and a world of fears
There's so much that we share
That it's time we're aware
It's a small world after all

It's a small world after all
It's a small world after all
It's a small world after all
It's a small, small world

There is just one moon
and one golden sun
And a smile means friendship to everyone
Though the mountains divide
And the oceans are wide
It's a small world after all

It's a small world after all
It's a small world after all
It's a small world after all
It's a small, small world


Eclectic - your being kind. I love the guy, but he's pretty much nuts. He married Rachel by the way (divorced now).

[Tekneek]

You can find a few stories about this Chris Marino guy if you search for Chris Marino and Rocket Productions... It sounds like the guy you two were talking about.

[wade moore]

With all the station switching that's been going on up there for the past year or so, I don't know how anybody keeps that presets set ;)


This reminds me of a funny story...

There was a country station I had really grown to like about 8 months ago (i think, time may be off by a bit) that played mostly up-beat, new stuff... i think 100.5 or something..

Anyway... I was listening one day, and then the next day for 48 hours it was playing "Shook me all night long" or whatever the hell it is called CONTINUOUSLY.. no commercials, no other songs, nothing.. just... "you... shook me all night looooooooooong" all day... it was VERY disturbing... then it turned into classic rock or something...

But yes, the presets definately have been shifting pretty continuously, but my 4 mainstays on FM (Two Rock Stations, a country, and a classic rock) have stayed... and AM has not shifted drastically (ESPN Radio, Conservative talk on 2 stations, and then my Don and Mike station that has terrible reception and gets me bitter)...

[vtbub]

This reminds me of a funny story...

There was a country station I had really grown to like about 8 months ago (i think, time may be off by a bit) that played mostly up-beat, new stuff... i think 100.5 or something..

Anyway... I was listening one day, and then the next day for 48 hours it was playing "Shook me all night long" or whatever the hell it is called CONTINUOUSLY.. no commercials, no other songs, nothing.. just... "you... shook me all night looooooooooong" all day... it was VERY disturbing... then it turned into classic rock or something...

But yes, the presets definately have been shifting pretty continuously, but my 4 mainstays on FM (Two Rock Stations, a country, and a classic rock) have stayed... and AM has not shifted drastically (ESPN Radio, Conservative talk on 2 stations, and then my Don and Mike station that has terrible reception and gets me bitter)...


The process of 48 hours of one song is called stunting, it's done to "clense" the old listeners before jumping into a new format.

[Tekneek]

Yay, the new webpage...

http://www.929dave.fm/

Here you are, Atlanta! Generic Rock radio station "Dave"!!!

[Tekneek]

"We're building a station that will have a personal connection with its audience," said Dave FM General Manager Rick Caffey. "Why not use a person's name? Why not Dave?"

Hahah. That's a funny one. We're building a generic mass-marketed radio station, that we claim will be more personal than what you had before...funny stuff!

The news leaked prematurely Tuesday, when an employee from parent company Infinity Broadcasting accidentally sent a mass email to the media meant for internal use, mentioning Z93's new name and program director.

When reached for comment late Tuesday afternoon, Z93's program director Frank Jaxon said he wasn't aware about the impending change. He was terminated soon after, Caffey confirmed, replaced by Michelle Engel, a North Springs High School grad who had been helming a Portland '80s station.

By 7 p.m., Z93 pulled its jocks off the air, including evening deejay MaKenzie Taylor, morning show Mara & Dunham and mid-day host Willard.

Davis and co-host Jeff Dunham remain under contract at Dave FM, but veteran deejay Kaedy Kiely, Taylor and Willard will not be back, said Scott Woodside, a former Z93 morning host who still knows people at the station. (Caffey refused to confirm this.)

"Any cool image that separates us from 96rock and 99X is a good thing," said Davis, a witty, sardonic mainstay at Z93 for nearly a decade.

"Keeping Mara is smart," said Alex DeMers, a radio consultant who worked with Z93 four years ago and is now working with rival 99X's morning show. "I can see her fitting in nicely with the new imaging."

That's the part I dislike the most about this kind of thing. People get fired over it...

[JonInMiddleGA]

from http://www.accessatlanta.com/news/content/entertainment/tv/0704/22radio.html?urac=%60LcQXMTKbXWR\XXX\XYV_XZXUXYX]XVX\YXYTT%60XcY%60YTSUTYT%60TWTWTbTTT\SaW]V]VWYZT_RWX[STY%60SVWaRTW_Y\Y]SWY]VbX\S[V[VcYUVXVaYTX_R&urvf=10904550414810.3491877079608222

Based on Dave FM's first 30 minutes, the music appears to have skewed more heavily the '80s and '90s: "Orange Crush," by R.E.M. ; "Stay (Wasting Time)," by the Dave Matthews Band; "It's Only Rock 'n Roll," by Rolling Stones ; "Found Out About You," by the Gin Blossoms; "Come As You Are," by Nirvana; "Clocks," by Coldplay, "Big Time" by Peter Gabriel and "Wrong Way" by Sublime.

One other tidbit in the article that I'm glad was revealed to the public (I wasn't sure whether they'd admit this publically or just privately):
"The news leaked prematurely Tuesday, when an employee from parent company Infinity Broadcasting accidentally sent a mass email to the media meant for internal use, mentioning Z93's new name and program director.

[Tekneek]

I just barely beat you to that...

[JonInMiddleGA]

Hahah. That's a funny one. We're building a generic mass-marketed radio station, that we claim will be more personal than what you had before...funny stuff!

As someone pointed out to me today, it seems kinda tough to claim the "more personal" thing on one hand & be running without an airstaff at the same time.

That's the part I dislike the most about this kind of thing. People get fired over it...

As much as I hate to see a couple of the market's most endearing & enduring talents become unexpectedly unemployed, I have to say that it's something that pretty much goes with the territory. It doesn't take long in the business to figure out that you're pretty much in the same position as baseball managers -- you're hired in order to be fired at some future date.

[GrantDawg]

Where did they come up with the stupid "dave" crap? Couldn't they find a better name?

[Tekneek]

I turned it on to hear a little bit on the way in this morning...since I was almost three hours late... ;) They played a promo that said, "Your rock is finally back. Ninety-two-nine FM." Then they played a Barenaked Ladies song... After that it was another promo, which played snippets of various bands/artists, including Sheryl Crow and Depeche Mode, and then a woman said, "This isn't radio, this is Dave."

It's like a parody...

[JonInMiddleGA]

It's like a parody...

Here is a list of what they describe as "artists we can't do without"
(What most stations typically refer to as "core artists)

U2
R.E.M.
Dave Matthews Band
Tom Petty
Red Hot Chili Peppers
Nirvana
Sheryl Crow
Led Zeppelin
Counting Crows
David Bowie
The Clash
Sting
Peter Gabriel
Coldplay
Pearl Jam
Smashing Pumpkins
Talking Heads

Other than the fact that I really don't care if I ever hear any of them again, the one thing that all of these artists seem to have in common is that they're already getting airplay on 1 or more other stations in the market; that they, effectively "belong" to other stations.

One of the things I asked specifically was "why on earth does anyone believe Atlanta needs another station playing The Smashing Pumpkins? That niche is already filled"

It appears that Infinity believes that the audience for this group, and some of the others listed, is underserved. I happen to disagree. Time will tell who is right and who is wrong.

Another of their selling points is the following statement:
"Do you have friends who listen mostly to their CDs because they can't stand the radio? Well, we hope to attract a good number of those people."

Okay FOFC'ers, since that general subject has been discussed here numerous times & in various threads, I ask you:

Do you see anything in that list of artists above that will accomplish that goal, driving those who have been driven away from radio back to the dial?

I just don't see it myself, not even in a market where pablum tends to work better than any shread of creativity. No sir, I just don't see it at all.

But as I made clear earlier in this post, this "ain't my thang", so your opinions are welcome.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Where did they come up with the stupid "dave" crap? Couldn't they find a better name?


"Jack" and "Bob" were already taken ;)

Incidentally, the "Jack" monicker has led to the obvious ad campaign in a couple of markets -- billboards reading "You Don't Know Jack".

And yes, just like my client asked yesterday, there has indeed been at least one station who used "Dick" as there on-air identity. And yes, they did indeed use the obvious billboard as part of their promotion for it.

[JonInMiddleGA]

from http://fmqb.com/Article.asp?id=31639

In an email to the WZGC listener database, Sr. VP/Market Mgr. Rick Caffey said the new format "will play rock music that is based around the best songs of the mid 80s to mid 90s but will include a lot of older classic artists as well as many of today's newer artists. Our presentation will be unique and our sensibilities will be intelligent. We think that you'll develop a close bond with 92.9 dave fm because you've never been treated this way by a radio station...at least not in Atlanta...Change for change sake? Never. Change because a need is going unfulfilled."

While the format's name had market watchers expecting a cousin to "Jack" and "Bob," at first blush, Dave looks more like a hybrid of Classic Alternative and a younger-skewing Triple A. That appears to be be borne out by some of its slogans, such as "Rock without the rules," "Move someplace cooler," "Think for yourself," and "Change the rules."

The station's new place-marker website proclaims, "Atlanta finally has a home for your rock... All of the greatest rock, in one place. Think of it as an iPod, without all the work.. You really can find all of your favorite stuff in one place."

Here's about 75 minutes of Dave FM, beginning at 9:00 am Thursday:

The Pretenders "Message Of Love"
Sublime "Santeria"
Simple Minds "(Don’t You) Forget About Me"
Blues Traveler "But Anyway"
David Gray "Babylon"
Tom Petty "American Girl"
Edie Brickell "What I Am"
Green Day "When I Come Around"
Jesus Jones "Right Here, Right Now"
John Mayer "No Such Thing"
Primitive Radio Gods "Standing Outside A Broken…"
Depeche Mode "Enjoy The Silence"
Red Hot Chili Peppers "Soul To Squeeze"
Led Zeppelin "Ramble On"
Stone Temple Pilots "Interstate Love Song"
Matchbox 20 "Bent"
R.E.M. "The One I Love"
Lenny Kravitz "Fly Away"
Moby/Gwen Stefani "Southside"
Tears For Fears "Shout"
Pearl Jam "Jeremy"

Yep, that sure sounds like a playlist that'll hold on to their current core demo of M45-54. NOT !

[cuervo72]

Gee, could they find a list of songs that could be any more stereotypical or predictable?

It's no wonder I don't listen to music on the radio any longer.

[JonInMiddleGA]

http://www.accessatlanta.com/news/content/entertainment/tv/26davefm.html;COXnetJSessionID=BEH72Jm4r2gBbnc2OuTNPTAyCRImaEdg1agTQIOlDBm3dIWdD9X1!-1759833846?urac=%60LcQXMTKbXWR\XXX\XYV_XZXUXYX]XVX\YXYTT%60XcY%60YTSUTYT%60TWTWTbTTT\SaW]V]VWYZT_RWX[STY%60SVWaRTW_Y\Y]SWY]VbX\S[V[VcYUVXVaYTX_R&urvf=10908159316020.37833525289080905

Dave FM, which replaced Z93 last week, is chasing after Gen X'ers, not the baby boomers anymore, based on its new mix of music.

Z93's playlist was dominated by rock acts of the 1970s and '80s, with the average song about 25 years old, based on an Atlanta Journal-Constitution study of what the radio station played before the format switch Wednesday.

Dave FM (WZGC-FM) is skewing much younger, with most of its playlist from the past 15 years. Of a sampled 100 songs played on the station late last week, just two were from the 1960s and 15 were from the '70s; 26 were from the '80s, 43 from the '90s and 14 from this decade.

Dave FM so far blends '80s new wave (New Order, Depeche Mode), old standbys (Tom Petty, Led Zeppelin, Jimi Hendrix), grunge staples (Nirvana, Pearl Jam), rock currents (Modest Mouse, Jet), female-friendly flavorings (Sarah McLachlan, Norah Jones) and forgotten '90s bands (Crash Test Dummies, Lemonheads). The station is also throwing in deeper cuts, such as "Galileo" by Indigo Girls, as well as their much bigger hit "Closer to Fine."

These former Z93 core acts have proven scarce on Dave FM: Fleetwood Mac, Billy Joel, Queen, Van Halen, the Eagles, Lynyrd Skynyrd and part-time Atlantan Elton John.

[Bad-example]

I'm still pissed about Clear Channel changing KEGL "The Eagle" from Dallas' lone hard rock station into an easy listening crap factory a couple of months ago... :mad:

I can't believe those call letters lol...

"This is the mighty Kegel, flexing its muscle and pumping out the jam!"

[JonInMiddleGA]

On an oddly related note that I thought was worth mentioning but not worthy of a thread of its own ...

Today's R&R reports that "ST hears that WKLS/Atlanta afternoon duo Dick & Justice have left the building. Their bios have been taken off the station's website, which lists Southside Steve and Tim Rhodes in afternoons."

That would seem quite possible, on the heels of yesterday's article from the AJC
http://www.accessatlanta.com/news/content/entertainment/tv/0704/30radio.html;COXnetJSessionID=BKN4qsuNimMzhGl0P0Exz0UdSZfFGTAsgU0LfjSwtas6jVUjc9Mc!-1960222907?urac=%60LcQXMTKbXWR\XXX\XYV_XZXUXYX]XVX\YXYTT%60XcY%60YTSUTYT%60TWTWTbTTT\SaW]V]VWYZT_RWX[STY%60SVWaRTW_Y\Y]SWY]VbX\S[V[VcYUVXVaYTX_R&urvf=10911943601670.6253871223070077

Stripped of its franchise Regular Guys show, 96rock lost more than half its targeted audience in the mornings this spring, according to Arbitron ratings.

Among men ages 25 to 54, the rock station plummeted from first to ninth place.

You may remember a conversation about this when it happened, the local show was replaced by syndicated Bob & Tom (which any veteran observer in Atlanta could have told you wouldn't work here).

And while we're on the subject ... Listeners turned off Real Radio 105.3 (WMAX-FM), the new Clear Channel talk station that switched from '80s music this year. The first FM talk station in Atlanta was ranked near the bottom of the list at 29th, tied with a country station in Rome and a new Hispanic station near Lake Lanier.

Bob & Tom were originally on 105.3 before being switched to 96 Rock. Among their regular hosts is former nationally syndicated sportstalker Scott Ferrell.

[Buzzbee]

So basically, the Atlanta radio market is eventually going to consist of V-103 on FM, and WSB on AM.

[Cringer]

I'm still pissed about Clear Channel changing KEGL "The Eagle" from Dallas' lone hard rock station into an easy listening crap factory a couple of months ago... :mad:

I agree with this Jeeber. I listened to the Eagle sometimes as one fo the stations I would flip between when in/going through Dallas every week. Clear Channel
:mad:

[JonInMiddleGA]

Yeah Buzzbee, that's not a bad snyopsis. But then again, that's been the state of Atlanta radio for years, it's actually better (in terms of dividing the ratings) than it used to be.

For 18-34's in the morning (when radio listening is by far the highest)
It's V-103, Q-100, Hot 107.9, 99X, and Kicks 101.5

For 25-54's in the morning
It's AM 750, V-103, Kiss 104, Star 94, and Kicks 101.5

Now, worth noting is that these ratings basically cover April, May, and June. With the kiddies out of school, listening patterns do take a seasonal bump. Basically, it tends to help the younger stations (kids have more time spent listening) and hurt the older stations (fewer parents in the car/less time in the car). With that in mind, if I were 99X, I'd be a little disappointed with 4th place in the younger demos, if I were V-103 I'd be happy that I appear to have regained some of my previously lost strength with younger demos, and if I were an awful lot of stations, I'd be darned near suicidal.

If Dick & Justice are indeed gone, I'd say it's a safe bet that they won't be the only ones in town looking for work shortly.

And if I'm Clear Channel, the ratings for 105.3 would have me scurrying to gather up Willard, Kaedy, and maybe even talking to Christoper Rude's agent. If there's an obvious candidate for a format switch to classic rock, this is probably the one. The problem is, classic rock is strongest on the north side of town, while the 105.3 signal is strongest on the south side.

[Buzzbee]

Yeah, with the recognition that Willard, Kaedy and Rude have it seems like a reunion would be in order. Seems like it be a chance to get an instant ratings bump. Also, since the Regular Guys are off the air in the ATL, why not go after them too and basically create a "new" 96 rock.

Speaking of Rude, how have the sports talk stations been doing recently? I figured after Max Howell left, 680 would soon be changing formats. Then I hear they snagged the Thrashers and it made me wonder if they were doing better than I thought they would.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Speaking of Rude, how have the sports talk stations been doing recently? I figured after Max Howell left, 680 would soon be changing formats. Then I hear they snagged the Thrashers and it made me wonder if they were doing better than I thought they would.

I haven't had a chance to look at the detailed numbers yet, but the AJC article on the public release stuff includes this blurb "Surprisingly, sports station 790/The Zone's "Mayhem in the AM" showed no growth."

My expectation is that, if 790 was flat, then 680 was flat to slightly down.

I went & looked at the 12+ share numbers, they show
680 with the exact same 0.8% share for the past 4 books (i.e. 12 months)
790 was down from a 1.2 share to an identical 0.8 this time.

That, combined with the blurb about them showing no growth in M25-54, probably indicates that they lost quite a few listeners outside their core demo.
Possibly lost younger listeners who weren't "captive audience" while being dropped off at school and/or were college age listeners who had different listening patterns over late spring/early summer.

[GrantDawg]

Yeah, with the recognition that Willard, Kaedy and Rude have it seems like a reunion would be in order. Seems like it be a chance to get an instant ratings bump. Also, since the Regular Guys are off the air in the ATL, why not go after them too and basically create a "new" 96 rock.
From what I have heard, the Regular Guys will no longer work together. One of them is doing/planning on doing a talk radio and is not interested in getting back together.

Having listened to Rude on 680 the last few months, I'm surprised that he would have any kind of following.