Cowboys to sign George?

[sachmo71]

1. Cowboys - George To Sign 1-Year Deal

Full Article: http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/072304dnspoeddiegeorge.2171643.html

Clipped From: The Dallas Morning News (Jean-Jacques Taylor)

Former Tennessee running back Eddie George is close to agreeing to a one-year, $1.5 million deal with the Cowboys that would include many incentives, two sources said Thursday.

George, who never missed a game in eight seasons with the Titans, was released by Tennessee on Wednesday as a salary cap casualty. George, who turns 31 in September, rejected the Titans' latest offer and asked for his release Monday.

George and his representative Lamont Smith will meet the Cowboys on Friday, Smith said.




I've always loved Eddie George, and think he would be a good fit for this team. Maybe he can get the ball in from 1st and goal at the 4, instead of losing 3 yards and going for the field goal. :rolleyes:

Anyway, I hope this happens.

[WSUCougar]

Good financial decision, Eddie.

What about Julius Jones?

[sachmo71]

What about Julius Jones?


If they do sign George, it's mostly because of his "mentor" tag. :)
It looks like Jones would get 5-10 carries a game while learning from Anderson and George.

I was fine with them throwing Jones into the fire, but I knew nothing about him. With George here, they have someone who can spell him if things go south.

[Tzar007]

Dallas is the most logical choice. Oakland could be one too, but the fit is better in Dallas.

Parcells, in spite of reports yesterday that he was not interested in George, could make good use of a veteran like him. I don't think this will be to the detriment of Jone's development, certainly not if the contract with George is only one year anyway. He will probably split carries with Jones, depending on Jones' performances and strengths in specific areas. I certainly hope to see George as a Cowboy next season.

It does not seem though George will get more money from Dallas than Tennessee was ready to give him.

[Senator]

I love this deal if it goes through. I still think George is a 1000 yard back.

[gstelmack]

Good financial decision, Eddie.
So he'll take $1.5mil from the Cowboys, but not from the Titans?

[FBPro]

So he'll take $1.5mil from the Cowboys, but not from the Titans?

Yikes, my thoughts too.......being a Titans fan :(

[Samdari]

So he'll take $1.5mil from the Cowboys, but not from the Titans?

The cowboys had not ever agreed to pay him 4 million for this year.

[Samdari]

DOLA: ESPN radio is announcing he has signed with Dallas. I feel sorry for the poor bastards who already took Julius Jones in a fantasy draft.

[rkmsuf]

Somehow the Cowboys managed to sign someone worse than Hambrick to replace him. Brilliant!

[JAG]

If they do sign George, it's mostly because of his "mentor" tag. :)


In all honesty, I think that's quite true. From what I've read, before last year, Julius Jones was not the most motivated individual and didn't seem to know how to handle himself properly (and last year he learned from his...brother?...RB Thomas Jones of the Bears). From all accounts, Eddie George is at least a standup individual with a great work ethic. The hope is Jones will pick up his habits...hey, who would it be better for him to learn from, Hambrick or George? :)

And for those who didn't see much of the Cowboys last year, short yardage situations were a constant problem. Even if George averages 3.0 yards this year, if he can pick up 1-2 on 3rd and 1, it'll be worth it to Dallas.

I do agree though...he claims he wanted to stay with the Titans but couldn't for financial reasons...then takes the same amount to play in Dallas? I guess the Titans didn't offer the same incentives to his salary?

[Cuckoo]

From everything I've read, Julius Jones will still get all the opportunity in the world. The only difference now is insurance for the Cowboys. They had plenty of cap room, and Eddie's a great guy to have around. For the fantasy players, Jones is still the guy to pick up.

[Arles]

A source that I trust a great deal and has a lot of NFL contacts (he's a member of AP) says that one rumor starting to pop up is the idea of Thomlinson leaving SD after this season and going to Dallas. Supposedly, he wants to return to Texas and play for Dallas. If this is the case (and it first popped up at the start of the offseason), trading out of Jackson in the draft makes sense, as does the George signing.

It may very well be that both guys are placeholders for LT in 2005.

[rkmsuf]

A source that I trust a great deal and has a lot of NFL contacts (he's a member of AP) says that one rumor starting to pop up is the idea of Thomlinson leaving SD after this season and going to Dallas. Supposedly, he wants to return to Texas and play for Dallas. If this is the case (and it first popped up at the start of the offseason), trading out of Jackson in the draft makes sense, as does the George signing.

It may very well be that both guys are placeholders for LT in 2005.

How LT can just leave escapes me but it's a good grassy knoll theory.

[sachmo71]

Somehow the Cowboys managed to sign someone worse than Hambrick to replace him. Brilliant!

I disagree. George is better.

[Hammer755]

How disappointing. I grew up in Ohio, and have been an Eddie George fan since his days as a Buckeye, but I'm not sure if I have enough goodwill for him to counteract my blinding hate for the Boys.

[rkmsuf]

I disagree. George is better.

Not by the numbers. Very debateable.

[JAG]

Not by the numbers. Very debateable.

Numbers never tell the full story. Lots of Cowboys fans were ready to annoint Hambrick as starter when he averaged 5.1 ypc as a backup the year before last.

[Arles]

How LT can just leave escapes me but it's a good grassy knoll theory.

I guess that's true. Does anyone know if 2006 is voidable in his deal?

[rkmsuf]

Numbers never tell the full story. Lots of Cowboys fans were ready to annoint Hambrick as starter when he averaged 5.1 ypc as a backup the year before last.

So what. Hambrick in the next three years is absolutely capable of 3.0, 3.4 and 3.3 yards per carry.

[WSUCougar]

Maybe he's been adopted and he's now LaDainlian Manning, so Archie can profess what a crappy organization the Chargers have, and he can boo-hoo his way to Dallas.

Just kidding, by the way (I like Tomlinson).

[Samdari]

I guess that's true. Does anyone know if 2006 is voidable in his deal?

Doesn't matter. If anyone was a lock to be franchised, its LT.

EDIT: That might even mean he could void years, and lose money in the deal.

[JAG]

So what. Hambrick in the next three years is absolutely capable of 3.0, 3.4 and 3.3 yards per carry.

Come on, did you see Hambrick play last year? He routinely avoided contact with defenders instead of picking up extra yards. For a big back, he played like he was scared. He got his release from Dallas when he decided to stop showing up for offseason training, then stated he wanted to catch on with aonther team because Bill Parcells ran too hard a training camp (enjoy Norv). So tell me, in choosing between the two based on things other than numbers since we agree they both were unimpressive there, would you take the guy with the good work ethic and pedigree as your backup, or the guy who's afraid of contact and hard work?

[sachmo71]

Come on, did you see Hambrick play last year? He routinely avoided contact with defenders instead of picking up extra yards. For a big back, he played like he was scared. He got his release from Dallas when he decided to stop showing up for offseason training, then stated he wanted to catch on with aonther team because Bill Parcells ran too hard a training camp (enjoy Norv). So tell me, in choosing between the two based on things other than numbers since we agree they both were unimpressive there, would you take the guy with the good work ethic and pedigree as your backup, or the guy who's afraid of contact and hard work?

Not worth it, JAG.

[rkmsuf]

Come on, did you see Hambrick play last year? He routinely avoided contact with defenders instead of picking up extra yards. For a big back, he played like he was scared. He got his release from Dallas when he decided to stop showing up for offseason training, then stated he wanted to catch on with aonther team because Bill Parcells ran too hard a training camp (enjoy Norv). So tell me, in choosing between the two based on things other than numbers since we agree they both were unimpressive there, would you take the guy with the good work ethic and pedigree as your backup, or the guy who's afraid of contact and hard work?

You take the hardworker but get the same results. Neither option is great though and just because George is percieved as some warrior doesn't mean he can play. It's phenomenal Ten stuck with him this long. It will be interesting how this plays out and if George is content in a back up role where he belongs.

[rkmsuf]

Not worth it, JAG.

nice

[Franklinnoble]

So he'll take $1.5mil from the Cowboys, but not from the Titans?
This is what drives me insane with these sort of deals. Aging veteran is "too proud" to take a pay cut... so he ends up signing elsewhere for the same pay he would have made staying with his old team.

It's just damned stupid.

[cthomer5000]

This is what drives me insane with these sort of deals. Aging veteran is "too proud" to take a pay cut... so he ends up signing elsewhere for the same pay he would have made staying with his old team.

It's just damned stupid.
Agreed. I think it probably also has a lot to do with the agent not being completely honest in his assesment of the situation.

He pretty much should have said "We might be able to squeeze a few more dollars out elsewhere, but it's not going to be anything significant. So if staying in Tennessee means anything, I suggest we renegotiate."

I think leaving the Titans will have a pretty negative impact on his leagacy. If he finished out his career there we're probably talking jersey retirment and eternal reverance from the fans.

[gstelmack]

Apparently he did get more. $1.5 mil bonus, $660K salary, incentives that could bring it as high as $3 mil. Sounds more reasonable now.

[Daimyo]

Doesn't matter. If anyone was a lock to be franchised, its LT.

EDIT: That might even mean he could void years, and lose money in the deal.

So? If a team believes he's the missing peice of a super bowl winner he'd surely be worth giving up the two 1sts or whatever it would take to sign him away at that point.

[Franklinnoble]

Apparently he did get more. $1.5 mil bonus, $660K salary, incentives that could bring it as high as $3 mil. Sounds more reasonable now.
Yeah, but what are the incentives? It still sounds like this is a deal that he could have gotten very close to in Tennessee, but he's decided to let his pride make stupid decisions for him.

And I don't want to hear the "agent misdirection" excuse. Any idiot could have looked around the league and determined that there was no market for a guy like Eddie George to make more than $2 million a year, tops.

[rkmsuf]

So? If a team believes he's the missing peice of a super bowl winner he'd surely be worth giving up the two 1sts or whatever it would take to sign him away at that point.

Sure but if you are SD do you do that? Two years from now would be presumably when they begin to make a run with Rivers maturing. If LT continues the current pace it would be difficult to expain trading him away.

[duckman]

So? If a team believes he's the missing peice of a super bowl winner he'd surely be worth giving up the two 1sts or whatever it would take to sign him away at that point.
Also Dallas has two first rounders in next year's draft.

[Daimyo]

Sure but if you are SD do you do that? Two years from now would be presumably when they begin to make a run with Rivers maturing. If LT continues the current pace it would be difficult to expain trading him away.
Obviously SD wouldn't trade him for two picks. But if LT's contract is voidable or expires and he wanted to go to Dallas all he'd have to do is force SD to franchise him and then let Dallas sign him. They'd pay a penalty (I think two 1sts), but get LT. Its the same thing WAS did with Coles.

[Daimyo]

DOLA, Also why I was very, very concerned when the Colts were talking about having to franchise Manning this year before hsi extension.... used to be no one ever thought about signing a franchised player, but now it seems like a valid strategy in many cases.

[rkmsuf]

Obviously SD wouldn't trade him for two picks. But if LT's contract is voidable or expires and he wanted to go to Dallas all he'd have to do is force SD to franchise him and then let Dallas sign him. They'd pay a penalty (I think two 1sts), but get LT. Its the same thing WAS did with Coles.

I don't believe the franchise tag works like this where SD has no recourse.

[cthomer5000]

I don't believe the franchise tag works like this where SD has no recourse.
I'm with you, I think it's like an RFA situation where if San Diego doesn't match they receive 2 1st rounders.

[duckman]

I'm with you, I think it's like an RFA situation where if San Diego doesn't match they receive 2 1st rounders.
That is right, CT. San Diego has the right to match any offer or receive 2 first rounders (or some other agreement between teams).

[Arles]

I don't believe the franchise tag works like this where SD has no recourse.
You are right. The more I think about this, the harder it is to believe. If SD slaps the franchise tag on LT, they would get right of first refusal to match any other team's offer.

The only way this would happen is if LT held out for some sort of trade or the Chargers didn't want to pay him.

[rkmsuf]

That is right, CT. San Diego has the right to match any offer or receive 2 first rounders (or some other agreement between teams).

That's only for RFA. Franchise players are not eligible to receive contract offers from other teams. That's why they get so pissed off. It's a one year deal only at the average of the top 5 salaries at the players position from their current team.

[rkmsuf]

dola, a transition or non-exclusive player is the type that can be offered a contract but the existing team has the right of first refusal and can match.

"There are two types of franchise players. Clubs retain exclusive negotiating rights to an "exclusive" franchise player by committing to a minimum offer of the average of the top five salaries at the player's position as of the end of the restricted free agent signing period on April 18, or a 20 percent increase over his previous salary, whichever is greater. No other clubs can negotiate with exclusive franchise players. The second type of franchise player is offered a minimum of the average of the top five salaries at his position in the previous season, or a 20 percent salary increase, whichever is greater. This latter type of franchise player may negotiate with other clubs. The original club may match the offer and retain the player, or receive two first-round draft choices as compensation if the original club elects not to match."

[scooper]

That's only for RFA. Franchise players are not eligible to receive contract offers from other teams. That's why they get so pissed off. It's a one year deal only at the average of the top 5 salaries at the players position from their current team.
Wrong. They are eligible to receive offers from other teams. They get pissed because most teams aren't willing to offer up the two first rounders neccessary to sign away a franchised player.

[duckman]

That's only for RFA. Franchise players are not eligible to receive contract offers from other teams. That's why they get so pissed off. It's a one year deal only at the average of the top 5 salaries at the players position from their current team.
http://www.nfl.com/freeagency/franchise

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR vAlign=top><TD height=30>http://images.nfl.com/images/pagetitles/news.gif</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD height=10></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Franchise players



Six players with three or more accrued seasons have been designated as franchise players. Their old club has a right of first refusal to the players listed below and compensation of two No. 1 draft choices. In order to submit an offer sheet, a new club must have available the required choices, defined as its own or better choices in the first round in the 2004 and 2005 NFL Drafts (or 2005 and 2006 NFL Drafts, if applicable.) Offer sheets may be submitted to an old club until 4 p.m. ET on the Tuesday following the 10th regular-season weekend.

A new club can submit an offer sheet to the old club? Sounds like a contract offer to me.

[rkmsuf]

Wrong. They are eligible to receive offers from other teams. They get pissed because most teams aren't willing to offer up the two first rounders neccessary to sign away a franchised player.

Sorry, "exclusive rights" franchise players cannot receive offers. Non-exclusive rights or transition players can receive offers but SD can match.

There are three different tags that can be applied.

[scooper]

dola, a transition or non-exclusive player is the type that can be offered a contract but the existing team has the right of first refusal and can match.

"There are two types of franchise players. Clubs retain exclusive negotiating rights to an "exclusive" franchise player by committing to a minimum offer of the average of the top five salaries at the player's position as of the end of the restricted free agent signing period on April 18, or a 20 percent increase over his previous salary, whichever is greater. No other clubs can negotiate with exclusive franchise players. The second type of franchise player is offered a minimum of the average of the top five salaries at his position in the previous season, or a 20 percent salary increase, whichever is greater. This latter type of franchise player may negotiate with other clubs. The original club may match the offer and retain the player, or receive two first-round draft choices as compensation if the original club elects not to match."OK so we're both right. In most instances, I believe teams have opted for the second option as far as franchise players are concerned. I guess if a player wants out anyway, they may as well try to get two first rounders out of him rather than piss him off by making him an exclusive rights FP.

[Galaril]

Not by the numbers. Very debateable.

Jesus christ you are trying to tell me a future hall famer certainly not in his prime but still is less of a gain than a young still to be tested guy?Thanks for the opinion but I will take Eddie G.. The guy has got the heart of a lion.Period.

[rkmsuf]

Jesus christ you are trying to tell me a future hall famer certainly not in his prime but still is less of a gain than a young still to be tested guy?Thanks for the opinion but I will take Eddie G.. The guy has got the heart of a lion.Period.

Don't worry, you got him. Now go find someone to fill in for D.Woodson.

[sachmo71]

Don't worry, you got him. Now go find someone to fill in for D.Woodson.

What happened to Woodson?

[rkmsuf]

What happened to Woodson?

you are the expert

[sachmo71]

you are the expert

Hmmm...not sure how to respond to that. Do you have some information, or not? Otherwise I'll avoid a conflict and move on.

[JAG]

Hmmm...not sure how to respond to that. Do you have some information, or not? Otherwise I'll avoid a conflict and move on.

Surgery to relieve a bulging disc in his back. He's out all of training camp and possibly Week 1.

[ISiddiqui]

Wait did someone call Eddie George a future Hall of Famer? What?

[sachmo71]

Surgery to relieve a bulging disc in his back. He's out all of training camp and possibly Week 1.

I see. Thanks JAG.

Not many people who can replace Woodson, but maybe Roy Williams can step up and assume a leadership role. Seems like he has the personality.

[HornedFrog Purple]

errr Roy switched and played Darren's position last time he was out. I think Roy is good enough to take Darren's place thank you very much. In fact that is his natural position anyways.

Brilliant move by Tuna. Eddie George is an NFC East back and unlike Hambrick who couldn't pass protect his shadow, Eddie still brings it.

[Samdari]

Wait did someone call Eddie George a future Hall of Famer? What?

I was thinking the same thing. He has been, during his peak, an above average back. The only sure fire HoF'er at RB right now is Faulk, followed by Bettis in the pecking order, then probably Curtis Martin, and then perhaps George. Although I think the cutoff line will be Bettis, whether he makes it or not, i.e. noone below him will make it.

Oops, forgot E Smith is still in the league. He has an outside shot at the hall.

[Daimyo]

Calling him an above average back does him a discredit. There was a season or two before McNair becamse awesome where he was pretty much single handedly carrying the offense. He didn't always have the best YPC numbers, but he was a work horse. I remember in 1999 as a Colts fan he was the one player I feared the most in the league.

EDIT: I'm not saying he is necessarily a HoF based on that... just that he was much more than an above average back.

[Samdari]

Calling him an above average back does him a discredit. There was a season or two before McNair becamse awesome where he was pretty much single handedly carrying the offense. He didn't always have the best YPC numbers, but he was a work horse. I remember in 1999 as a Colts fan he was the one player I feared the most in the league.

EDIT: I'm not saying he is necessarily a HoF based on that... just that he was much more than an above average back.

Well, I think even during that time, he was more durable than most backs, and he certainly lasted more years, but IMO there were always at least 6-7 backs who were better than him in the league. Does being the 8th best back in the league mean you were better than 'above average'? Perhaps others would say yes, but I don't, and thus the above average label.

[HornedFrog Purple]

I hesitate to call someone who piled up 10009 (17th all time) rushing yards in 8 seasons and in the meanwhile never missing a game at the most injury prone position in football just an above average back.

Maybe he doesn't have it left in the tank from him being the offense for the Titans for a 4 year stretch. But it's worth the minimal financial risk to find out, and Parcells has a knack for getting a lot out of guys who "didn't have it left" aka Otis Anderson.

[Daimyo]

I don't know how you can say he was the 8th best back. In 1999 he was third in rushing + recieving yards behind Edge and Faulk who were clearing #1 and #1a. You could maybe make a case for Stephen Davis being #3 that year, but I don't see how you can drop George past 4th.

In 2000 again Faulk and Edge were pretty far above the rest of the pack but George looks like a pretty clear #3 to me. So again, I would say he was much better than merely "above average" at his peak.

This is where I was getting the data... its for fantasy football it seems, but its the first place google came up with that had the stats I was looking for.
1999 (http://www.redeyesports.com/99RB.htm)
2000 (http://www.redeyesports.com/00RB.htm)

[Daimyo]

DOLA, and that's just for stats... you have to remember the offenses he played on in those two years didn't have much for passing games. Everyone knew he was getting the ball and he still made plays. I'm sure you put him on Indy and he would have put up Edge-like numbers. (I say this as a Colts fan who hates the Titans).

[Franklinnoble]

George is a stud, but he really needs 2, maybe 3 more good years before he's a lock for the HOF. Either that, or he needs to have a superb performance on a winning super bowl team.

[Daimyo]

For him to be a HoF threat I think he would either need to 1) have had one season you could point to and say he was the best RB in the league without argument or 2) have several more 1000+ yard seasons.

He's got the longevity and the career numbers that come with it, but his string as a top tier back just wasn't long enough and without that one awe-inspiring season his career just isn't good enough right now to merit it. I think his only shot right now is to go for the extreme longevity/career numbers angle if he can be productive for several more seasons...

[JeeberD]

From what I've been hearing Jones is still going to be getting a good number of carries for the 'Boys with George getting around ten carries a game. I guess it really comes down to how the two backs look in camp and the preseason and who impresses Parcells...

[Arles]

DOLA, and that's just for stats... you have to remember the offenses he played on in those two years didn't have much for passing games. Everyone knew he was getting the ball and he still made plays. I'm sure you put him on Indy and he would have put up Edge-like numbers. (I say this as a Colts fan who hates the Titans).
I don't know, maybe in 1999. But that 2000 Titans team had McNair, Mason, Pickens, Thigpen and Wycheck. That's not all that bad of an offense to go with George.

George was a nice "workman-like" back for his first 5 seasons. He got about 1300 yards a year with 7 TDs. Not bad, but his last three seasons have been average to below average. Plus, his ypc is 3.7 and he only broke 4 twice in his career. And, with all his carries, he only had one year over 1400 yards. I would put 6-7 backs over George that played in his era. But, if he reaches 12000 yards, he may have a shot at the Hall. Still, given his low ypc, it's hard to make a case for him to be even a top 7 back when he played.

[cthomer5000]

He's not a HOF runner, but I don't understand why some people won't admit he was even very good for a few years. I would the say the year before, during, and after the super bowl run he was an incredibly good player.

[SFL Cat]

Parcells has been known to get a lot out of supposedly "over-the-hill" players. If I were running the Cowboys, I probably wouldn't have signed him, but I can't argue with the results Tuna got out of the Cowboys last season.

[cthomer5000]

Parcells has been known to get a lot out of supposedly "over-the-hill" players. If I were running the Cowboys, I probably wouldn't have signed him, but I can't argue with the results Tuna got out of the Cowboys last season.I like the signing a lot. If they make the playoffs, Eddie George is a guy I trust to get a 1st down on 4th and 1.

The heavy veteran presence should really help guide the younger Cowboys through the next year or two.

This was also likely cap space the Cowboys wouldn't have used otherwise, so I think it's a solid move. (reminiscent of my signing of TE Robert Cox in IHOF, ;) )

[JAG]

So he'll take $1.5mil from the Cowboys, but not from the Titans?

Just to add to this:

Q. Was there an opportunity for you to play with Tennessee for something around the contract that you just signed here?

GEORGE: No, because the way it was structured there, it was $1.5 million for the year, whereas I see that today plus a base salary (JAG's note: base salary of 660k). So it's a little bit more money here, but that's not the issue. I think the issue with the situation back there was more of a principal issue (JAG's note: uh, sure Eddie. But glad to have you aboard anyway). It's a little disappointing the way it ended, but we both have to move on.


So he's going to make $1.5 million guaranteed, which will essentially guarantee his $660k base salary, plus with incentives he could push it to $4.5 million (granted, he'd have to rush for 1300 yards and 10 TDs to pick up that much). Of course, we'll never know what kind of incentives the Titans were offering.