Gotta love the Dolphins

[Vinatieri for Prez]

I am pretty sure if the Dolphins just had a little better offensive line, they would be as good as the Pats. ;) And there is no way the Pats could beat the Colts 3 times in a row, could they?

I am calling you out, and you know who you are.

[pjstp20]

I haven't been to this site in over a month because, to put it simply, I can't stand it. But I knew you classless Pat fans wouldn't be able to help yourselfs and if you wanna call me out I'm not gonna act like I don't see it.

The Patriots are a very good team, and The Patriots are obviously better than the Dolphins ok? You happy? Will that end this stupid game? I didn't think so last year, I do this year.

The Patriots fans are also classless and they are so insecure that they want everyone to believe that they're the best team and until that happens they'll just think everyone is jealous of them, and continue to act like classless morons.

After Ricky Williams quit, David Boston got injured, and the Dolphins traded away half their draft picks for the next ten years, I got really bummed out, but then, I thought about something.................................THIS IS JUST A GAME.

If having a good team makes you feel so proud of yourself, all the power to you. You guys sure don't hesitate to show it. But remember, before you get up on your high horse, looking down on everyone else realize it's just a game and really nothing more.

Since you already put yourself out there, and I manned up by responding, you better hope the Dolphins don't beat the Patriots. I'm not saying I'm gonna be classless like you guys but it would make you look pretty silly.

[Tekneek]

Blah Blah Blah. Tom Brady is GOD. Patriots rule the universe... blah blah blah. Talking smack about the Dolphins this season is really impressive. Live it up...

[Noop]

Pjstp20 - You never called me out before?

[cthomer5000]

Ahhh, playing the "it's just a game" card.

[pjstp20]

Pjstp20 - You never called me out before?Maybe I did so what? Did I object to being called out? If so show me.

[pjstp20]

Ahhh, playing the "it's just a game" card.
Why do your smart ass remaks come up everywhere I post? Do you really have nothing better to do than troll me? God this board is so predictable.

[Noop]

Maybe I did so what? Did I object to being called out? If so show me.
No you were talking about classless fans well your one yourself if calling you out to talk shit makes you classless.

[pjstp20]

I dont need another FOFC member badgering me Noop. I don't really remember calling you out to talk shit, I think I called you out to correct some comments that you made.

In this instance I hadn't even commented on the Patriots or the Dolphins for many months yet I'm being called out, flamed, trolled and all that other internet board geek speak.

[Noop]

I am not trying to badger you it is just well... http://dynamic2.gamespy.com/%7Efof/forums/showthread.php?t=14975

You didn't say it in your post but I feel it is safe to assume you did it as a taunt and nothing else.

[pjstp20]

I am not trying to badger you it is just well... http://dynamic2.gamespy.com/%7Efof/forums/showthread.php?t=14975

You didn't say it in your post but I feel it is safe to assume you did it as a taunt and nothing else.You must of forgot the post in that thread where I said I shouldn't have called you out.

Your missing the whole point Noop, Im not saying calling me out is classless, I'm saying the way Pat fans are carrying themselves on this board is classless.

[Noop]

You must of forgot the post in that thread where I said I shouldn't have called you out.
No my point which I said was you called me out to do what Vinatieri for Prez is doing to you. I understand you shouldn't have called me out. As far as I am concerned your a good guy to bad some people are making you hate this site. I am done because I shouldn't have jump in this thread to begin with... but hey you should have a pretty ok week, The Irish won, Noles lost....

[pjstp20]

I think its very different than what is going on here. I wasn't a Miami fan talking shit I was just commenting on FSU's tendancy to make excuses. I dont like UM I just like FSU less. In fact I was rooting for FSU this last game because I think FSU fans are now humbled, and Patriot fans are the new target of my enmity.

[Buccaneer]

Nirvana is still the most overrated band of all time. Period. How's that for being predictable?

[pjstp20]

I can actually agree that they are overrated.

[TroyF]

Ya know, it's really not worth it to discuss things with the Pats fans at this point.

At the end of the day, they are winning football games and doing it often. They can use that hammer (and rightfully so) and make any statement they want. That's fine. They have a very good football team and if they don't want to admit they've had a ton of good fortune that they didn't earn on their run. . . so be it.

Were I a Pats fan, I'd be taunting everyone with the good luck. I'd walk away from every one of those games like the Colts last week saying "we got away with that one, I'm loving this run. . . " Instead they say "this is all our doing, we haven't had any more luck than other teams in the league and. . . . "

Ya know what? Fine. Who cares? Let them have their fun. They went through years of torture with the Sox and they are excited now. Good for them.

For the classless ones that call out other peoples teams when they are down? Don't say anything now. Just calmly remember it. If there is one thing you learn about sports at an early age, it's that it is a circular entity. No matter how high up your are at one time, you'll be down on the bottom again at some point.(and many times much quicker than you think) The only question is how long the run lasts. The Pats will eventually suck again. . . that's when you pounce on the classless fools.

[pjstp20]

Good post Troy, agree or disagree, your one of the few opinions on this board that I respect.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Whew, I didn't mean to start a firestorm. Pj's comments on the Pats/Dolphins were so out of line last year (not rude, just foolish), so he is getting his commuppance often if I can help it.

Hey, when you are on top, you have to do it (not to everybody, just those trying to tear you down). When the run ends (around 2007), I will take it my way like a man. This is what makes watching the games and cheering for a team fun, man. You got to all lighten up a bit.

[SirFozzie]

Hey, I'm just enjoying it as long as it lasts. I do take a little pleasure in Miami's downfall.. they're kinda the football version of the Yankees.. I want to hate them... and pjstp20's ranting/raving last year helped..

But hell, we barely won, we didn't look world beaters, I'm honestly worried about Arizona. Classic trap game.

You're only as good as your last game

[pjstp20]

Whew, I didn't mean to start a firestorm. Pj's comments on the Pats/Dolphins were so out of line last year (not rude, just foolish), so he is getting his commuppance often if I can help it.

Hey, when you are on top, you have to do it (not to everybody, just those trying to tear you down). When the run ends (around 2007), I will take it my way like a man. This is what makes watching the games and cheering for a team fun, man. You got to all lighten up a bit.Don't you think that the fact that I was very wrong, and the Pats won the Super Bowl is enough? When does it become too much? I took my medicine last year, I didnt hide, I said I was wrong.

I was pissed about the loss last December especially since the Pat fans decided to throw showballs at the Dolphin players and I vented. I know now that those type of antics are commonplace for a team and it's fans that aren't used to winning. I did believe there were teams better than the Pats last year and that the Pats got lucky a lot, I stated my opinion and it was wrong. Why the piling on?

Not only are you not satisfied with winning, you need to let me know about it, and you want to root for my team to self desruct. It has lost it's fun, can't you understand that? The Dolphins are hardly the Yankees.

[McSweeny]

Don't you think that the fact that I was very wrong, and the Pats won the Super Bowl is enough? When does it become too much? I took my medicine last year, I didnt hide, I said I was wrong.

I was pissed about the loss last December especially since the Pat fans decided to throw showballs at the Dolphin players and I vented. I know now that those type of antics are commonplace for a team and it's fans that aren't used to winning. I did believe there were teams better than the Pats last year and that the Pats got lucky a lot, I stated my opinion and it was wrong. Why the piling on?

Not only are you not satisfied with winning, you need to let me know about it, and you want to root for my team to self desruct. It has lost it's fun, can't you understand that? The Dolphins are hardly the Yankees.

you don't understand do you? We hate the Dolphins. So we root for them to lose, have misfortune, lose, play poorly, and lose some more. When they are down we kick them. Why? Because we hate them. It has not lost it's fun. We are on top of the world so we are taking advantage of it. If you don't like that... ahh well

Whining about us piling on is only going to make us laugh and pile on some more

[pjstp20]

Fine, do it if it makes you happy, it just solidifies my opinion that Pats fans don't know how to win with class. I'm sure you could care less, but if you haven't noticed a lot of people are starting to agree. Not just Dolphin fans. I just hope the Dolphins can somehow find a way to put you in your place and I'll show you how to win with dignity and class.

[SirFozzie]

pjstp20.. Dignity? Class? Hoooo HA!

[pjstp20]

Thats what I said, You can't debate that becaue you wouldn't know class if it shit on your forehead.

[SirFozzie]

and pjstp20 shows dignity and class.. let's all give him a big round of applause...

[pjstp20]

I said class when winning, not show class to trolls who want to bait and troll me like the fat kid at an elementary school. You guys must feel really good about yourselfs when your 4-5 against 1 on an internet message board. If I was smart I would ignore you guys but I guess I'm a glutton for punishment. I know damn well you wouldn't be man enough to say half the things you do to my face. I'm not saying I'd hit you or anything, I'm just saying you wouldn't act like you are. You need your little group and your audience.

[cartman]

Did Terrell Owens get traded to the Dolphins?

[duckman]

Thats what I said, You can't debate that becaue you wouldn't know class if it shit on your forehead.
and pjstp20 shows dignity and class.. let's all give him a big round of applause...
That's probably the funniest shit I've read in some time. :D
<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->
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[SirFozzie]

*bows* thanks we'll be here all week. Try the veal

[illinifan999]

I like the Dolphins, I am very saddened by this thread. :(

[illinifan999]

dola

These threads are so funny because someday maybe in 20 years the Dolphins will beat the Pats and someone will bump this and start it up all again. Teams play each other alot. Never losing to a team just doesnt really happen in pro sports. It's a vicious cycle. I know, I'm a Bulls fan. Boy those Bucks fans are mean.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Hey, are there 4 or 5 of you who want to pile on next week with me? This is just too much fun. You gotta know it's just tearing the heart out of the Phins fans, including pj? I will repeat, though, we do win with class. It is just the naysayers shooting their mouths off (and the evil Phins fans) that we pile on top of. You won't catch me saying anything bad about fans of other teams (well, maybe the Jets).

[Coffee Warlord]

You won't catch me saying anything bad about fans of other teams (well, maybe the Jets).

Oh come on, help us poor suffering Bears fans insult those dirty Cheeseheads.

[ISiddiqui]

they want everyone to believe that they're the best team and until that happens they'll just think everyone is jealous of them

Well that, at least, I agree with, at least with SOME Pats fans. I didn't hate the Pats by no means, but when I dared offer an opinion that perhaps another team is better or just as good as the Pats during last season, I got blindsided by Pats fans on another board saying I was jealous of the Pats... wha?

[Blade6119]

GO ST. LOUIS!!!! wait...crap...nm :)

[pjstp20]

Hey, are there 4 or 5 of you who want to pile on next week with me? This is just too much fun.
Don't worry about it I won't be here to entertain you.

[Apathetic Lurker]

As a diehard Bills fan, I despise the 'fins to the core of my being. Having said that, one thing to ask the pats fans:
When was the last time your team went undefeated throughout the season?

[pjstp20]

Bringing team history ito this argument would be a complete joke. I don't even know what a losing season is like. Much less a 1 or 2 win season.

[SirFozzie]

Seriously, the way the Fins are this year, you just might.

This is one of those years so beyond anyone's comprehension (top WR injured for year, top RB leaves to go smoke weed).. that you just need to dissassociate yourself with being a rabid fan and just chill out, y'know?

[SirFozzie]

BTW.. looking at the projected path of Ivan.. looks like it's going to miss you guys, right?

[pjstp20]

BTW.. looking at the projected path of Ivan.. looks like it's going to miss you guys, right?Is this some sort of joke? I 'm asking seriously.

[SirFozzie]

I am serious.. seriously just awake, that is... :( I hit weather.com, and it looked like it was almost completely going to miss Florida.. of course, I then looked at the bigger image, and saw the location of Talahassee.. Ouch. Sorry.. bad question

[rkmsuf]

Fine, do it if it makes you happy, it just solidifies my opinion that Pats fans don't know how to win with class. I'm sure you could care less, but if you haven't noticed a lot of people are starting to agree. Not just Dolphin fans. I just hope the Dolphins can somehow find a way to put you in your place and I'll show you how to win with dignity and class.


Class is overrated when you have the Pats history pre-Kraft continually tapping you on the shoulder.

I'd love to pull out tapes during the Marino era and enjoy all the classy Dolphin fans.

It's cyclical and when your cycle is so long you have to enjoy it while you can. NE is one play away from Tom Brady being out for the year so let's live it up while we can! Viva la Dolphin misery and Pats success!

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Man, I'm almost 2 weeks late on this. Time to pile on. Dolphins are 0-3 and I am loving it. Feeley is AWESOME! The way he picks his way through a secondary is amazing.

Well, after checking their schedule, I am pretty sure the Dolphins will not win until Nov. 7 when they play the Cardinals. Woohoo, an 0-8 start!

Maybe a shot at Buffalo before the AZ game, maybe. One thing for sure though is that if the Dolphins just had a little bit better offensive line, they would be undefeated right now.

[Suicane75]

So mean.

[Alf]

The good thing with such a bad record is sthat they will get a high draft picks next season... Any QB in next year class ?

[k0ruptr]

do they even have draft picks next season, or were u being sarcastic lol

[Alf]

I didn't know they didn't have draft picks...

[DolphinFan1]

Ok, time to jump in here.

I love the Dolphins. But I realize things happened this offseason beyond their control. They are not a very good team right now. The Pats are. Even though I hate them.

This is like the Yankees - Red Sox debate. Where I live, I hear it every day from Yankees fans. It's just the way things are. Yankees fans hate the Red Sox fans and visa versa. I live with it just like I'm living with Miami 0-3. It's just a game.

[DolphinFan1]

Ok, this is funny. I love the Dolphins but here is Wanny's quote about Feeley's 4th and 1 QB sneak play he failed to get.

``It was fourth down and two inches,'' Wannstedt said. ``We can't make two inches on a quarterback sneak? You've got to be kidding me. That's embarrassing. You ought to be able to fall down and make two inches.''

[SirFozzie]

Paging Kodos to the "Fire Wannstedt phone" Paging Kodos..

(where is the Rigelian, anyway..)

[JAG]

I don't think Don Shula could win with this team. I'd rather fire the GM.

[Ksyrup]

I love the Dolphins. But I realize things happened this offseason beyond their control. Things happened this offseason that were beyond their control? Besides Ricky, what else happened? They replaced 9 out of 11 offensive starters and "upgraded" at QB with a career backup that couldn't even beat out the guy they wanted to get rid of. Teams deal with injuries and holdouts every year, so I don't count that kind of stuff. And really, all they lost was a suspect WR, and they were able to replace him with a decent guy and trade away a disgruntled, holdout defensive player they don't really need, since the D has been quite good.

To top it off, Wanny loses Ricky, then decides he can still run the same offense with a bunch of nobodies in the backfield. That's just piss-poor coaching/game planning/whatever you want to call it. It's like the guy actually meant all of that positive spin he was putting on the Ricky issue from training camp. Everyone else in the world realized that he was just saying those things to keep up the spirits of his team and their fans, but no, Wanny meant it - we've got a good team and we can run the ball. Riiiiight.

[Samdari]

Ya know, it's really not worth it to discuss things with the Pats fans at this point.

At the end of the day, they are winning football games and doing it often. They can use that hammer (and rightfully so) and make any statement they want. That's fine. They have a very good football team and if they don't want to admit they've had a ton of good fortune that they didn't earn on their run. . . so be it.

Were I a Pats fan, I'd be taunting everyone with the good luck. I'd walk away from every one of those games like the Colts last week saying "we got away with that one, I'm loving this run. . . " Instead they say "this is all our doing, we haven't had any more luck than other teams in the league and. . . . "

Ya know what? Fine. Who cares? Let them have their fun. They went through years of torture with the Sox and they are excited now. Good for them.

For the classless ones that call out other peoples teams when they are down? Don't say anything now. Just calmly remember it. If there is one thing you learn about sports at an early age, it's that it is a circular entity. No matter how high up your are at one time, you'll be down on the bottom again at some point.(and many times much quicker than you think) The only question is how long the run lasts. The Pats will eventually suck again. . . that's when you pounce on the classless fools.

Whoah Troy - don't judge Pats fans by this thread. For the ones on this board to come and taunt pjpst is totally deserved. Last year, he was absolutely, positively, the worst, most annoying fan of his team to post on this board.

[ISiddiqui]

Besides Ricky, what else happened?

That's a pretty big 'thing'. Can you imagine what would happen to, say, the Ravens if Jamal Lewis, say, went to jail for the year this offseason?

[RendeR]

Whoah Troy - don't judge Pats fans by this thread. For the ones on this board to come and taunt pjpst is totally deserved. Last year, he was absolutely, positively, the worst, most annoying fan of his team to post on this board.


Actually Samdari, I live in new England, and frankly, the majority of Pats fans I see regularly are a bunch of classless asshats. boston fans in most sports also fall into this category. When the highlite of a fans evening is searching out the nearest fan of the other team to throw beer at them, you gotta wonder.

I have no respect for any fans who act the way New England fans have been over the last three years. you would think a team with such a shitty history and lack of any real superstars in their past would have a little humility when they finally do learn how to win regularly, but do they? no, they take on the mantle of "we are god, bow down and kiss our feet"

I am NOT exagerating.

I admit, the pats have a quality team, I also believe they are one of the luckiest teams in history. One referee's call could have eliminated the pats from this entire path of glory. one call. You'd think they'd remember that.

When they fall, stand clear, because they'll fall hard and loud.

And no-one will care, due to the assinine behaviour of their fans.

[flere-imsaho]

Even with Ricky, I'd say the Dolphins were in trouble this year. The problem (as with last year), is a complete and utter lack of an offensive line. Let's face it, we'll never know if Feeley could be a good QB because he's got about 1 second to throw before getting sacked.

[Ksyrup]

Even with Ricky, I'd say the Dolphins were in trouble this year. The problem (as with last year), is a complete and utter lack of an offensive line. Let's face it, we'll never know if Feeley could be a good QB because he's got about 1 second to throw before getting sacked.
Agreed.

[ISiddiqui]

Perhaps so, but with Ricky, Miami would at least be a 7-9 team, instead of what they are now.

[Samdari]

Actually Samdari, I live in new England, and frankly, the majority of Pats fans I see regularly are a bunch of classless asshats. boston fans in most sports also fall into this category. When the highlite of a fans evening is searching out the nearest fan of the other team to throw beer at them, you gotta wonder.

I have no respect for any fans who act the way New England fans have been over the last three years. you would think a team with such a shitty history and lack of any real superstars in their past would have a little humility when they finally do learn how to win regularly, but do they? no, they take on the mantle of "we are god, bow down and kiss our feet"

I am NOT exagerating.

I admit, the pats have a quality team, I also believe they are one of the luckiest teams in history. One referee's call could have eliminated the pats from this entire path of glory. one call. You'd think they'd remember that.

When they fall, stand clear, because they'll fall hard and loud.

And no-one will care, due to the assinine behaviour of their fans.

How most fans of the Pats act I cannot say. I intended no comment on that front. I was merely saying that you cannot judge that from them coming to here to taunt pjpst20. He deserves everything he gets - as much as he taunted them (despite the Phins missing the playoffs and the Pats winning all those games in a row on the way to the title).

[Ksyrup]

Perhaps so, but with Ricky, Miami would at least be a 7-9 team, instead of what they are now.
I don't know. They completely replaced their O-line, so it's hard to say. Sure, they would be able to move the ball a little better with Ricky, but they probably wouldn't be all that effective just simply because Ricky was the RB.

[rkmsuf]

Actually Samdari, I live in new England, and frankly, the majority of Pats fans I see regularly are a bunch of classless asshats. boston fans in most sports also fall into this category. When the highlite of a fans evening is searching out the nearest fan of the other team to throw beer at them, you gotta wonder.

I have no respect for any fans who act the way New England fans have been over the last three years. you would think a team with such a shitty history and lack of any real superstars in their past would have a little humility when they finally do learn how to win regularly, but do they? no, they take on the mantle of "we are god, bow down and kiss our feet"

I am NOT exagerating.

I admit, the pats have a quality team, I also believe they are one of the luckiest teams in history. One referee's call could have eliminated the pats from this entire path of glory. one call. You'd think they'd remember that.

When they fall, stand clear, because they'll fall hard and loud.

And no-one will care, due to the assinine behaviour of their fans.

No I think you are exagerrating. Everywhere has asshat fans. There are no more no less here than 90% of NFL markets.

Maybe in Arizona there aren't any because nobody cares.

[Ksyrup]

Arizona may have few fans, but what they lack in fans, they make up for in Denny Greens at FOFC.

[jaygr]

No I think you are exagerrating. Everywhere has asshat fans. There are no more no less here than 90% of NFL markets.

Maybe in Arizona there aren't any because nobody cares.


I too live in New England and I can say without any doubt what so ever that he is not exagerrating, not one bit. I hate the Patriots because of their fans. Plain and simple. And whether or not you can say that the guy here deserved it or whatever, most of the Pats fans went over board and in the end look like the bigger A-holes. Never in my life have I ever ran into such arrogant pain in the ass fans as Pats fans here in New England over the last 3 years. Yes, everywhere is going to have bad fans but it seems the large majority of Pats fans that I run into are horrible. Pats fans hate everybody. For most other teams you just run into the fans giving crap to fans of their rivals- Pats fans seem to hate everyone.

And those people were right who said that if you try to make any remark on the Pats, their fans will jump all over you saying that you are just jealous. Their fans will scream of no respect. What more do you guys want? Seriously. I know it's been a while since your team was good so you are living it up, but you know, no one cares any more. You guys would have earned some respect if you had class but you have just ended up making people respect you and your team less.

Please note this rant is directed at the Pats fans in general that I have run into and not anyone here specifically. Also, I think most of the a-hole fans here in NE are more of the fair-weather variety and that breeds their behavior-- I will give you guys that much. :)

[Johnny93g]

extremly tough bring a dolphins fan right now...cheered for them my whole life, and I cant remember ever being 3 games under .500......oh well, i suppose every team has down times, and this is the 1st time i can remember the Dolphins ever being down.....13 games left, so ill be cheering for tem 13 more times, and hoping for 13 more wins, now if only the o-line can block :mad:

[bhlloy]

I thought a lot of people on this board read football outsiders? Ricky Williams was a below average back last year. A running back with a YPC under 4 is not a good running back, no matter how many yards he gets. Ricky Williams was basically Eddie George with more carries.

The Dolphins would be just as bad with Ricky in there this year. He might be averaging an extra .3 or .4 YPC, and might be a little better in the red zone, but let's not make Ricky the world beater he was supposed to be coming out of college. A workhorse, straight ahead runner who was fed the ball so much he couldn't fail to get a load of yards each year.

[JAG]

"They ought to boo us the whole time. Why would you pay for a ticket to see us?''

-- Miami linebacker Zach Thomas. The Dolphins have lost 17-7, 16-13 and 13-3 in the first three weeks.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Alas, pj has left the building.

[pjstp20]

Nope I'm still here. What do you want me to say? The Dolphins are really bad this season, at least on offense. It's not worth getting mad over anymore. You win. I'm sure I'll see a few more of these this season. Oh well.

[Honolulu_Blue]

extremly tough bring a dolphins fan right now...cheered for them my whole life, and I cant remember ever being 3 games under .500......oh well, i suppose every team has down times, and this is the 1st time i can remember the Dolphins ever being down.....13 games left, so ill be cheering for tem 13 more times, and hoping for 13 more wins, now if only the o-line can block :mad:

Welcome to the club. We Lions fans have been here for years!

[Kodos]

I have a dream.

0-16.


:D

[SirFozzie]

Ah.. there you are.

[Jets80]

Im glad the Jets are getting the Dolphins this upcomming weekend.

[rkmsuf]

Im glad the Jets are getting the Dolphins this upcomming weekend.

Statements like that usually translate into a loss for your team.

[Kodos]

Maybe. But probably not in this case. ;)

[Kodos]

"They ought to boo us the whole time. Why would you pay for a ticket to see us?''

-- Miami linebacker Zach Thomas. The Dolphins have lost 17-7, 16-13 and 13-3 in the first three weeks.

I feel bad for Thomas and some of the other guys on the defense. That have to feel like they've pissed off the Football Gods with all of the smiting they have received this season. :(

It's tough for me to root against guys like him, but then the cameraman pans over to Dave on the sideline, and I refocus myself on the greater good. Dave. Must. Go.

[pjstp20]

I thought a lot of people on this board read football outsiders? Ricky Williams was a below average back last year. A running back with a YPC under 4 is not a good running back, no matter how many yards he gets. Ricky Williams was basically Eddie George with more carries.

The Dolphins would be just as bad with Ricky in there this year. He might be averaging an extra .3 or .4 YPC, and might be a little better in the red zone, but let's not make Ricky the world beater he was supposed to be coming out of college. A workhorse, straight ahead runner who was fed the ball so much he couldn't fail to get a load of yards each year.
Rickey's numbers, more specifically his YPC, may be below average but I don't think he was a below average back. You gotta realize how bad his O-line was. The fact that he put together such a good year in 2002 shows how good he could have been. I have no doubt that if Rickey were on this team now we wouldn't be much better than we are. The problems on this team are far beyond one position.

[BishopMVP]

Actually Samdari, I live in new England, and frankly, the majority of Pats fans I see regularly are a bunch of classless asshats. boston fans in most sports also fall into this category. When the highlite of a fans evening is searching out the nearest fan of the other team to throw beer at them, you gotta wonder.

I have no respect for any fans who act the way New England fans have been over the last three years. you would think a team with such a shitty history and lack of any real superstars in their past would have a little humility when they finally do learn how to win regularly, but do they? no, they take on the mantle of "we are god, bow down and kiss our feet"

I am NOT exagerating.

I admit, the pats have a quality team, I also believe they are one of the luckiest teams in history. One referee's call could have eliminated the pats from this entire path of glory. one call. You'd think they'd remember that.I'm sure there are the fair share of asshat fans...but seriously, searching out opposing fans and throwing beer in their faces? I go to UMass, so outside of downtown Boston there probably isn't a higher concentration of Patriots fans anywhere. Most of the real fans I know/meet, who have been fans since before the Super Bowl win, are fairly classy and respectful (albeit with a bit of a chip on the shoulder, for reasons I'll get to in a minute*) while a larger amount of fair-weather fans are jackasses, but generally ignorant jackasses. At the celebration last year, the one team people chanted against...not the Dolphins, Jets, Colts, Panthers, but the Yankees, which just shows that they really aren't Patriots fans but desperate Red Sox fans who grasp onto whatever they can.

*Notice how most people who aren't fans of the Pats - even ones like TroyF who are defending the team/fans - always give the "Yeah, they've won, but there was a lot of luck involved." Sure, to win the 17 straight we've had to get a lucky bounce here and there, but not only have the Patriots been in the game but also capitalized on those breaks. And they've been the best team in the NFL last year and this year, so to hear people constantly saying they aren't (i.e. Colts are better despite us beating them every time, or that they're 'one call away from this entire path of glory') it gets annoying.

PS - As for superstars, how could you forget John Hannah? ;)

[TroyF]

Whoah Troy - don't judge Pats fans by this thread. For the ones on this board to come and taunt pjpst is totally deserved. Last year, he was absolutely, positively, the worst, most annoying fan of his team to post on this board.


Maybe so, maybe so. I don't pay much attention to the Pats/Fins hatred, so I missed the threads from last year.

I never judge ALL people of anything. Still, there isn't enough ribbing in the world to make me start a post like the one that started this thread.

As for poor Feely, I refuse to judge anything he's doing now. They are doing the exact thing you can't do to a young QB right now: "Don't lose us the game" "Don't try to do too much"

BS. If he's your future, you turn him loose and let him play the game. Asking a young QB to not make mistakes is the equivilant of asking Emmitt Smith to turn play like he did in '95 this year. You are asking the impossible while at the sametime handcuffing this kid's future. Idiotic. That's the type of thing that helped ruin Trent Dilfer's career.

[TroyF]

*Notice how most people who aren't fans of the Pats - even ones like TroyF who are defending the team/fans - always give the "Yeah, they've won, but there was a lot of luck involved." Sure, to win the 17 straight we've had to get a lucky bounce here and there, but not only have the Patriots been in the game but also capitalized on those breaks. And they've been the best team in the NFL last year and this year, so to hear people constantly saying they aren't (i.e. Colts are better despite us beating them every time, or that they're 'one call away from this entire path of glory') it gets annoying.

PS - As for superstars, how could you forget John Hannah? ;)

That's just it, I'm not a fan of the Pats. I can respect the 17 wins in a row. I can respect the fact that some of it is attributed to breaks the Pats have earned. On the other hand, to say they haven't had a lot of help is living in some sort of dreamland. The Colts were the better team on opening night. Sometimes the better team loses. It's reality, not bitterness. Hell, I stated in that game thread that the Pats would win 12 games and get home field in the AFC, yet somehow I'm disrespecting them because I think they've gotten a ton of breaks over the past few years.

As for Pats superstars, I didn't read who has been mentioned, my favorite Pats have always been: (in no particular order)

Andre Tippett
John Hannah
Steve Grogan
Stanley Morgan
Mosi Tatupu

Then, more recently:

Ty Law
Tom Brady
Willie McGinnest
Lawyer Milloy

[BishopMVP]

That's just it, I'm not a fan of the Pats. I can respect the 17 wins in a row. I can respect the fact that some of it is attributed to breaks the Pats have earned. On the other hand, to say they haven't had a lot of help is living in some sort of dreamland.I know we've had breaks fall our way here and there. I acknowledge it. But every time a non-NE fan talks about them they seem compelled to mention luck. Maybe I just didn't pay as much attention, but I don't recall people constantly talking about how Denver/STL/TB/Baltimore were on their way to the Super Bowl.The Colts were the better team on opening night.They felt so too, and also felt it about last year's AFC Championship game. The fact that twice now, the Colts offense has looked completely unstoppable, and been slowed down by NE's defense combined with their atrocious defense and special teams that don't perform in the clutch (way to go Mike Vanderjagt. taunt the NE bench and then miss the FG to tie the game) would seem to indicate otherwise. At this point, if NE and Indy meet up again in the playoffs, I'm not sure what it would take to convince most fans and Colts players that NE was better. If it was a 73-0 victory, I'm sure some blister on Manning's hand would be found, or a new interpretation of thr rule book on how to ask during the coin toss. IMO, Indy wasn't even the 2nd-best team in the AFC last year (Tennessee was) and is in the 2nd-tier of teams this year (NE/PHI/SEA have been playing much better than anyone else.)

[Kodos]

So you believe Peyton's 5-TD first half was "lucky"?

[BishopMVP]

So you believe Peyton's 5-TD first half was "lucky"?No, the Colts offense is great, the best in the NFL and it was going against a GB defense missing its 2 best CB's and Grady Jackson. But he's not going to throw for 5 TD's in the 1st half against a defense like New England or Philadelphia. Also, if you watched that game, despite Manning's amazing 1st half, in the 4th quarter Green Bay started 2 seperate drives that could have tied the score. If you score 35 points in the 1st half, it shouldn't be a close game late. This Indy team reminds me of the old Oiler Run N Shoot days. Great offense, but look at recent Super Bowl champions. Since STL, it's gone Baltimore, NE, TB, NE. All defensive oriented teams. Indy won't win a Super Bowl until its defense is at least Top-15.

[BigJohn&TheLions]

Things happened this offseason that were beyond their control? Besides Ricky, what else happened? They replaced 9 out of 11 offensive starters and "upgraded" at QB with a career backup that couldn't even beat out the guy they wanted to get rid of. Teams deal with injuries and holdouts every year, so I don't count that kind of stuff. And really, all they lost was a suspect WR, and they were able to replace him with a decent guy and trade away a disgruntled, holdout defensive player they don't really need, since the D has been quite good.

To top it off, Wanny loses Ricky, then decides he can still run the same offense with a bunch of nobodies in the backfield. That's just piss-poor coaching/game planning/whatever you want to call it. It's like the guy actually meant all of that positive spin he was putting on the Ricky issue from training camp. Everyone else in the world realized that he was just saying those things to keep up the spirits of his team and their fans, but no, Wanny meant it - we've got a good team and we can run the ball. Riiiiight.

Well, they did replace Ricky, and now Gordon is on IR. Feely did replace Fiedler, and now he's been benched for Fiedler. Gordon would have been worth a conditional 3rd rounder, but now they have thrown away a #2 on a QB that was no better than a 3rd stringer in \philly behind that awsome passer Koy Detmer. And a #3 on Gordon, who got injured in a flash (sorry.) Nice job Miami. Hell, why not call Scott Mitchell. He can't be mutch worse than Feely. Or you could always offer San Diego a #1 pick for Drew Brees...

[TroyF]

I know we've had breaks fall our way here and there. I acknowledge it. But every time a non-NE fan talks about them they seem compelled to mention luck. Maybe I just didn't pay as much attention, but I don't recall people constantly talking about how Denver/STL/TB/Baltimore were on their way to the Super Bowl.

Regular Season Average Score:

31-19
33-15
22-12
21-10
22-15

Post Season Average Score:

32-11
28-20
35-12
24-6
24-19

The reason you haven't heard it talked about with other teams, is because they had more blowout wins than the Pats and they "dominated" thier competition. That's the '98 Broncos, '99 Rams, 02' Bucs, 00' Ravens and last years Pats in order.

You'll note that NE had the lowest margain of victory in both the regular season and playoffs. To do that once is an incredible feat. To pull it off twice in three years defies logic. They are a great coached team and that counts for some of it. They have incredible heart and that counts for some of it. They have an incredible leader at QB and a clutch kicker and that counts for some of it.

But there IS the element of luck involved here too. The fact is if we showed any "single" individual Pats game over the last few seasons to someone who didn't already know who they were, they'd say they got away with one and should have lost. When you realize they've strung out two very similar long winning streaks and Super Bowl runs in the last three years, you can't help but think of how those breaks have played a part. It shows incredible grit and determination by that team. It also shows that from the Brady tuck rule call on forward, they've had more good luck fall upon them than most teams do in a decade of play.

Kudos to them for taking advantage of it. They DESERVE their titles and their fans DESERVE to be proud of them. Just understand that if the luck starts going the other way, they could fall down in a hurry. It wouldn't stun me to see them lose 4 of 7 at some point this year. Eventually it catches up with you.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

TroyF is still living in dream land. You defeat your own argument. A team cannot possibly win 17 games in a row because of luck. That's all I have got to say on the subject.

And because you didn't read the threads from last year, you have no idea why I started this thread the way I did.

And once again, everybody lighten up. If you can't cheer your team and rub it into your arch-enemy, what the hell is the point?

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Nope I'm still here. What do you want me to say? The Dolphins are really bad this season, at least on offense. It's not worth getting mad over anymore. You win. I'm sure I'll see a few more of these this season. Oh well.


Godda#&$#it! Pj, if you keep that up, I am gonna stary feeling bad for you and will want to give you a hug. Can't you at least tell us how bad the Pats' gunners on special teams are?

[Crapshoot]

TroyF is still living in dream land. You defeat your own argument. A team cannot possibly win 17 games in a row because of luck. That's all I have got to say on the subject.

And because you didn't read the threads from last year, you have no idea why I started this thread the way I did.

And once again, everybody lighten up. If you can't cheer your team and rub it into your arch-enemy, what the hell is the point?

this sounds suspiciously like the genius in oakland who argued that hecking someone was the American way- brilliant.

[Kodos]

Obviously, if they win 17 in a row, it's not all luck. They're clearly a talented team. But luck was certainly involved in the streak continuing in a few instances. You can at least concede that?

[TroyF]

Obviously, if they win 17 in a row, it's not all luck. They're clearly a talented team. But luck was certainly involved in the streak continuing in a few instances. You can at least concede that?

No, they can't. They have an incredibly difficult time reading too. I'm not sure what part of "they DESERVED their titles" they didn't get. Anyone interpreting what I wrote as saying it was ALL luck is not worth anymore of my time.

And rubbing it in peoples faces gives you a kick? Congrats. No, I'm not one of you. Friendly bantering, yes, calling out someone in a thread, no. And I don't give a damn at this point what he did last year. Are you saying you want to stoop to his level? Nevermind, you've already answered that question.

[Blackadar]

Well, now with Fiedler coming in to replace Feeley, I don't think there's any doubt...

Dave Wannstedt is the worst coach in the league. You can't be wishy-washy with your QBs.

[JAG]

The phrase 'rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic' comes to mind...

[Ksyrup]

He should start Feely at QB and Fiedler at RB, or switch them up. Give the D something to think about. I bet Feidler can average 1.8 yards per carry, so they'd maintain status quo with the running game. And they can run a new wrinkle on the play-action pass, since either the QB or RB could run or pass at any time.

I mean, they've got to try SOMETHING other than simply running the same offense they had with Ricky, don't they?

[TroyF]

He should start Feely at QB and Fiedler at RB, or switch them up. Give the D something to think about. I bet Feidler can average 1.8 yards per carry, so they'd maintain status quo with the running game. And they can run a new wrinkle on the play-action pass, since either the QB or RB could run or pass at any time.

I mean, they've got to try SOMETHING other than simply running the same offense they had with Ricky, don't they?


Not a fully bad idea. :)

[Leonidas]

I'm a Dolphins fan, but I think the Pats busting is unjustified. They are a team that figured out how to build a team and play the game properly. Also, Belichick may be kind of an asshat as a person, but I love the way he coaches. He takes no sh*t and manages to get the most out of his players, regardless of injuries or personality issues.

Meanwhile Miami's woes go back 4-5 years. Aside from Chris Chambers, who has been a meaningful draft pick during that time? They (Wannstedt/Spielman) mistakenly believed they were much closer to Super Bowl than they really were and have spent the last 5 seasons mortaging the future on stop gap measrues for overrated or over the hill players that merely maintained the status quo. Now the talent bank is nearly bankrupt with few assets for future investment. Sure, they will probably get a top 10 pick next year, but they traded what would have been a high second round pick for Jay "touchy" Feeley. So they may get a Matt Leinart, but it seems to me this will not be an especially good draft for QBs. Maybe they'll get a RB, but that will still leave them with no viable solution at QB. The cupboard is fairly bare and I fear Miami is looking at 2-3 years similar to this season unless they start trading off some of the dinosaurs on defense for draft picks (which Wanny and Spiel show no sign of even considering).

[korme]

I'm a Dolphins fan, but I think the Pats busting is unjustified. They are a team that figured out how to build a team and play the game properly. Also, Belichick may be kind of an asshat as a person, but I love the way he coaches. He takes no sh*t and manages to get the most out of his players, regardless of injuries or personality issues.

Meanwhile Miami's woes go back 4-5 years. Aside from Chris Chambers, who has been a meaningful draft pick during that time? They (Wannstedt/Spielman) mistakenly believed they were much closer to Super Bowl than they really were and have spent the last 5 seasons mortaging the future on stop gap measrues for overrated or over the hill players that merely maintained the status quo. Now the talent bank is nearly bankrupt with few assets for future investment. Sure, they will probably get a top 10 pick next year, but they traded what would have been a high second round pick for Jay "touchy" Feeley. So they may get a Matt Leinart, but it seems to me this will not be an especially good draft for QBs. Maybe they'll get a RB, but that will still leave them with no viable solution at QB. The cupboard is fairly bare and I fear Miami is looking at 2-3 years similar to this season unless they start trading off some of the dinosaurs on defense for draft picks (which Wanny and Spiel show no sign of even considering).
Lamar Godron out for the year.

[Ksyrup]

Not a fully bad idea. :)How about putting them both in the shotgun? Then, you can hike it to either of them, and the one who gets it is in ready position to hand off to the other one (or maybe even the RB/FB on his other side ) or throw a pass? Or pitch it back to the other guy, who can pass?

Even if it doesn't work, it would improve the TV value of the Dolphins immeasurably.

[rkmsuf]

So you believe Peyton's 5-TD first half was "lucky"?

Yeah, lucky he was playing that joke of a Green Bay defensive scheme.

[TroyF]

How about putting them both in the shotgun? Then, you can hike it to either of them, and the one who gets it is in ready position to hand off to the other one (or maybe even the RB/FB on his other side ) or throw a pass? Or pitch it back to the other guy, who can pass?

Even if it doesn't work, it would improve the TV value of the Dolphins immeasurably.


I couldn't agree more. Another idea while we're at it:

Sign Eric Crouch to be the third guy in the backfield. Shotgun, split backs every play.

Not only would I watch the Dolphins on the Sunday Ticket, I'd pay EXTRA to watch just for the comedy value alone.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Obviously, if they win 17 in a row, it's not all luck. They're clearly a talented team. But luck was certainly involved in the streak continuing in a few instances. You can at least concede that?

No, they can't. They have an incredibly difficult time reading too. I'm not sure what part of "they DESERVED their titles" they didn't get. Anyone interpreting what I wrote as saying it was ALL luck is not worth anymore of my time.

And rubbing it in peoples faces gives you a kick? Congrats. No, I'm not one of you. Friendly bantering, yes, calling out someone in a thread, no. And I don't give a damn at this point what he did last year. Are you saying you want to stoop to his level? Nevermind, you've already answered that question.

Your comment was a compliment of the backhanded variety.

I would admit the Patriots had luck, but no more than KC had in winning 13 games or the Titans in winning 12, or the Rams in winning 12, and so on and so on.

If I was calling out pj only, why can I not stoop to his level? I didn't call anyone else out. And the level I was stooping to was still fairly high, as once again it was not personal but based on his prior comments, which in earlier threads (if you had ever read them) I told him outright were simply fun and games, and nothing more.

See: http://dynamic2.gamespy.com/%7Efof/forums/showthread.php?t=18216&page=4&pp=30 [POST #110]

[rkmsuf]

This is just getting out of hand. No team deserves this kind of run.

Dolphins | Chambers Sits, Questionable for Week 4 - from www.KFFL.com
Wed, 29 Sep 2004 17:56:18 -0700

Miami Dolphins WR Chris Chambers (knee) appears to have suffered a previously undisclosed injury in the Sunday, Sept. 26, game against the Pittsburgh Steelers, although it was unconfirmed by team officials. Chambers did not practice Wednesday, Sept. 29, and is listed as questionable for the Sunday, Oct. 3, game against the New York Jets.

[McSweeny]

This is just getting out of hand. No team deserves this kind of run.

the yankees come to mind :)

[TLK]

from Pro Football Talk Rumor Mill....

POSTED 9:05 a.m. EDT, September 30, 2004


RICKY RUNNING BACK TO THE NFL?



Based on our discussions with league sources, there's still a possibility that Dolphins running back Ricky Williams will try to return to the team as soon as this season.



Although Williams supposedly has retired, we've heard that the retirement papers weren't submitted by him directly, but through an attorney. Since Williams apparently didn't personally sign off on the papers, there's a chance (some believe) that he could rescind the retirement without having to sit out the entire season.



(This theory ignores the concept of ratification, given that Ricky has since acted like someone who has retired from the game. But what the hell -- it's intriguing nevertheless.)



Another issue is the drug program. No one knows what level he would've reached if he hadn't retired. If, however, he unretires, he'll ultimately head to the next level of the program.



So if he were already at the 4-game suspension level, coming back would cause him to miss an entire season. But if he isn't at the 4-game suspension level (and an unretirement gets him there), it's possible that the NFL would give him credit for the time he already has missed.



Indeed, in a year where NFL players are dropping like sh-t from a St. Bernard, the league would be smart to do anything it can to get one of its superstars back onto the field.



Though no one is talking yet in these terms, the rash of season-ending injuries necessarily is diluting the on-field product. And at a time when the NFL is trying to posture for another multi-billion-dollar haul from the networks, the last thing they need is a season that eventually devolves into a bunch of second-stringers trying to grope their way to Jacksonville.



We're not officially reported that Ricky will try to return this season, but we're confident based on our discussions with folks in the know that it remains an option. And the $8.6 million arbitration award hanging over his head might, in the end, be the straw that pushes the camel back into the game.