EA Lays Down the Law

[hukarez]

Good grief! :eek:

Is this the only genre of sports they plan on doing this with, or do you think attempts with other titles will come into play as well?

[Calis]

http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/041213/135991_1.html

Uhmm, wow...what a blow to Sega if this is legit which it appears to be.

Personally not a big deal to me, as it'll be easy enough to change it up, but I'm sure it'd cost Sega loads of sales.

[Danny]

It pisses me off. It is now effectively a one man competition for NFL titles. I wonder if Sega will even bother releasing another football game.

[Calis]

I'm really hoping someone tells me that my reading comprehension skills are horrible, and I've completely misunderstood this.

Somehow I doubt it though...

Not sure on other sports, Football is the biggie so they might only be concerned with it. Wonder how much cash they had to pay for this?

[cougarfreak]

EA Sports Sims suck ass. Guess I won't be buying a console football sim unless they improve their's dramatically.

[hukarez]

5 years. Looks like ESPN 2K5 is the last football title I'll have to play with for my console sports fix. Not that I was any good in the first place, but still...

[Bomber]

This sucks Madden was forced to get better because of Sega. Maybe Sega will move its franchise into the college market.

[Adamski47]

Why would SEGA stop making a game? Now they can sell it even cheaper and we can use a third party roster like we do for every other game we play.

Problem might be the stadiums and such...either way, I'm done with EA. This is a dick move IMO and they've lost me forever now.

Go SEGA! Thanks for making a better game.

[Franklinnoble]

This is a drag... I really liked the ESPN game this year... especially at the $19.95 price.

Piss on them... I won't buy Madden anyway. I'll bet Sega still does their version, and makes it more customizeable, so you can download rosters, etc... just like FOF.

[CHEMICAL SOLDIER]

So this basically means EA has all rights to fantasy/all football related things on video game market right?

[Danny]

Why would SEGA stop making a game? Now they can sell it even cheaper and we can use a third party roster like we do for every other game we play.


Because they will not make any money. Most users would not purchase a game that didn't have the NFL teams and rosters.

[Godzilla Blitz]

This sucks Madden was forced to get better because of Sega.

Agreed. Madden has basically purchased a monopoly.

It's a sad day for console football games.

[JonInMiddleGA]

My son will be disappointed to learn there won't be another edition of Backyard Football any time soon.

It sucks for the consumer, but it's a smart business move on EA's part (assuming they didn't overpay).

[Kodos]

I was thinking the same thing. This may encourage Sega to make their game the ultimate in customizabilitly. And as the resident EA Sports Whore, I have to say I don't like this move. It can only hurt the competition level.

I actually may stop buying the new football game each year. I'm slowly learning that there are always going to be aspects of the game that eventually kill it. Madden isn't customizable enough. I want to be able to rearrange divisions (including the number of teams in each division) as I see fit. The AI doesn't handle the draft well, so I've found myself running the draft for everyone, which is a pain. I think in the end, NCAA may always be the more fun game because the recruiting angle works better than the draft and free agency. AI teams recruit better than the fare as GMs in NFL games.

[Franklinnoble]

I'm waiting for SEGA to announce that they've bought out Solecismic Software.

[Ajaxab]

I agree that this is horrible news. I'm sure it will be fun to get years and years of mediocrity as EA rests on their laurels as the sole owners of the NFL license.

I do know that they purchased exclusive rights to the English Premier League a few years ago and yet have failed to match the gameplay of another soccer franchise. Konami's Winning Eleven series has always received rave reviews in spite of EA's monopolization of arguably the most famous soccer license on the planet. So if Konami's past is a picture of Sega's future, then it may not be the devastating news it seems to be. Sega, like Konami, will just need to work that much harder to put out a better product and hope that the next gen consoles will allow users to mod their games. It's till a sad day though.

[Zippo]

can we finally look forward to a CFL or AFL game? ;)

[kingnebwsu]

There was talk of this happening a few months back and it never materialized. Sad it has now. I've been EA-free for over 2 years and will continue to be that way!

[digamma]

Do we have any plaintiff's lawyers on the board? How about a class action antitrust lawsuit against EA, claiming their actions creat a virtual monopoly and a de facto vertical price fixing scheme? ;)

[Solecismic]

What EA is doing may be the best possible thing for the industry.

Now, SEGA has incentive to challenge what's likely never to hold up on court - the claimed restriction on using real player names.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Do we have any plaintiff's lawyers on the board? How about a class action antitrust lawsuit against EA, claiming their actions creat a virtual monopoly and a de facto vertical price fixing scheme? ;)

Just so happens I am an antitrust lawyer, usually do more defense work thain plaintiff's, but been involved in a few class actions. Not that I've looked into the issues all that much here, but I don't think our case has much of a chance, digs...

[Anthony]

i don't get it - since when is it financially feasible to put out an inferior game just because of a lack of competition. as if people will have no choice but to purchase that game rather than *gasp* continue playing the previous year's version or simply go without console football. you all have a weak arguement. you assume that EA purchased the exclusive license just so they could lose money by not making the best games possible. has anyone considered how good this might be, or what the benefits are? NFL Films will be incorporated into the game, i'm interested in seeing how that works out.

my point is no company as large as EA with the rep they have (mind you no one outside of FOFC cares that EA left Solecismic hanging in the wind) will willingly put out a product that they think will fail just because there are no other competitors. sure, there won't be competition for a football game, but there ARE other good games out there. no one is being forced to play only football. in the end when faced with yet another version of football or a new 5 star, genre-busting game like Halo 2 or GTA:San Andreas (i have neither game) i'll opt for the 5 star game.

i hate the tired arguement of "no one is forcing you to buy the game" but this is an instance where a lack of competition doesn't mean a weaker product is expected. believe it or not game designers don't look at the competition when it comes to improving upon their games. new game features aren't made public until production is well underway. by the time SEGA announced what they were putting in their game it wasn't like EA had time to go back to the drawing board and steal the idea. the only thing a game company can do is look at their previous work and build on that. take the $19.95 pricepoint that SEGA introduced as a surprise. i'm sure it caught EA by surprise because they didn't budget their game to be sold for that low. i think what you guys are worried about is the incentive for EA not to throw in "the kitchen sink", if you will. if there's no competition you assume EA will hold some features and save them for future releases. i'm sure that happens anyway.

[riz]

Always sad to see these exclusive deals, which kind of limits the options for customers as well as other developers :(

Interesting to see the blurb about management games in there though...separate from arcade and action games.

[DeToxRox]

the common console football fan doesn't go to FOFC.

what we like puts us in the minority.

we gotta learn to live with it.

[Franklinnoble]

There are plenty of people who aren't FOF fans who are pissed by this move. Hell, I hate it, and I love Madden. This honestly may cause me to stop buying the game.

You're risking a nasty beatdown by your pimp at EA with that sort of talk...

[Kodos]

There are plenty of people who aren't FOF fans who are pissed by this move. Hell, I hate it, and I love Madden. This honestly may cause me to stop buying the game.

[Ajaxab]

HA, I agree with you to an extent. Of course no one is forcing anyone to purchase the game. That is an entirely legitimate claim to make. You're probably right in saying that EA designers don't overhaul their existing games after hearing what Sega might have in the works. You're also right to say that EA will continue to build on what they've already done and save some features for future releases. You also may be right in seeing some potential benefits to the deal.

However, competition encourages innovation. Without viable competition, there is less of an incentive to take risks and attempt to innovate. That's not to say that EA won't take risks with Madden, but there is suddenly less motivation for them to do so with ESPN NFL 2K6-10 effectively out of commission.

[TroyF]

Not a big deal for me. I'll d/l the names from another site anyway.

I'm not sure why the NFL agreed to this. It seems the more people using your name the better. . . unless EA grossly overpaid.

So what does that leave us with? If they overpaid for the rights, the games will get even worse. Great news for gamers.

Ah well, there is always FOF. :)

[DeToxRox]

HA, I agree with you to an extent. Of course no one is forcing anyone to purchase the game. That is an entirely legitimate claim to make. You're probably right in saying that EA designers don't overhaul their existing games after hearing what Sega might have in the works. You're also right to say that EA will continue to build on what they've already done and save some features for future releases. You also may be right in seeing some potential benefits to the deal.

However, competition encourages innovation. Without viable competition, there is less of an incentive to take risks and attempt to innovate. That's not to say that EA won't take risks with Madden, but there is suddenly less motivation for them to do so with ESPN NFL 2K6-10 effectively out of commission.

Time for the XFL video game.

[Anthony]

the common console football fan doesn't go to FOFC.

what we like puts us in the minority.

we gotta learn to live with it.

exactly. sorry to say but EA isn't concerned with FOFC. hey, i'll admit i try to limit my EA purchasing out of loyalty to Jim and his company but EA isn't going to lose sleep over me not buying the Sims or whathaveyou. in any event i rather focus on the positive and see what they have planned. i still don't know why they're lumping fantasy football in that article, i'm not getting the connection.

[digamma]

Just so happens I am an antitrust lawyer, usually do more defense work thain plaintiff's, but been involved in a few class actions. Not that I've looked into the issues all that much here, but I don't think our case has much of a chance, digs...
Yeah, I was kidding. I worked on one antitrust case (defense side) before I became a transactional lawyer. I think you're overstating our chances--I think we'd have no chance! ;)

[Eaglesfan27]

Gamespot has an interesting article on this:

Big Deal: EA and NFL ink exclusive licensing agreement

http://www.gamespot.com/b.gif
Five-year contract gives EA sole rights to the NFL, including teams, players, and stadiums. Take-Two reacts, calling it a "tremendous disservice to the consumers."

Electronic Arts has signed the biggest sports free-agent on the market. In a devastating blow to competitors--and in a deal sure to reshape sports gaming--the software giant signed an exclusive agreement with the National Football League and the NFL Players Inc., a subsidiary of the NFL Players Association.

The deal, one EA admits to having lobbied for over the past few years, is an exclusive five-year licensing deal granting EA the sole rights to the NFL's teams, stadiums, and players.

The arrangement encompasses action simulation, arcade style, and manager games made for PCs, consoles, and handhelds (both the DS and PSP, included), giving EA a firm hold on the football gaming market. The deal does not include titles for mobile phones or internet-based games, but does include online features of consoles. With next-generation consoles scheduled for release next holiday season, EA looks to handily dominate the professional football market for the duration of the license.

EA's current roster of NFL games includes the top-selling Madden franchise and the extreme football NFL Street franchise. Given that EA currently has no "manager games" per se, there is clear writing on the wall that the publisher will announce a new sports management lineup of products, though it refused to comment on when.

A source close to the negotiations said it was at a spring, 2004, off-site meeting attended by top NFL officials that the league determined it would take the league license exclusive. GameSpot was told the league put the license up for bid and that EA was among as many as five software publishers competing for it. An EA spokesperson said today, "Obviously, exclusives are more expensive. We are most certainly paying a premium."

In a statement, Larry Probst, Chairman and CEO of Electronic Arts said, "We are excited about the opportunity to further enhance our relationship with the NFL and PLAYERS INC. The five-year agreements will usher NFL fans through the console technology transition with new ideas and innovative game play experiences."

The deal is obviously bad news for EA's competitors, particularly ESPN Videogames, Sega, and Take-Two who stole a respectable chunk of EA's Madden football market with their NFL 2K series and it's budget price tag this year of $19.99.

Arguably, the deal will impact consumers negatively as well. With less choice, theories of competition no longer apply. Some industry insiders speculate the exclusive deal was embraced by the NFL after it saw Take-Two lower the price of its 2K5 product earlier this year. No licensor likes to see a price war being fought with its brand value at stake. At the same time, exclusive licenses in the sports world are more the norm than non-exclusive licenses. The NFL's apparel license is a Reebok exclusive, as is its beverage license with Gatorade.

This afternoon, Take-Two issued the following statement: “While sports games in general are an important part of Take-Two's product diversification strategy, the licensed NFL game we distributed on behalf of Sega this year was not a material contributor to our profitability to date, nor was it expected to be a meaningful contributor in the upcoming year. We remain committed to continued diversification of our product portfolio, including sports.

"We believe that the decisions of the National Football League and PLAYERS INC to grant an exclusive license for videogames do a tremendous disservice to the consumers and sports fans whose funds ultimately support the NFL, by limiting their choices, curbing creativity and almost certainly leading to higher game prices.”

"I really respect them, but the consumer really loses," one analyst told GameSpot. "EA is both evil and really smart."

As for such a deal affecting quality of future football products, EA's vice president of corporate communications Jeff Brown told GameSpot, "The onus is on EA to keep making a better game each year…that's the hurdle you have to clear every year."

Even before the news was released, trading of EA stock had its value spiking north. On trading nearly three times its usual amount, EA stock was up more than $3 today. The stock closed at $57.57, up $3.38, or 6.24 percent, with 16,574,606 shares trading hands on the NASDAQ. In after hours trading, the stock at press time had jumped another $2.88 to trade at $60.45.

By Tim Surette, Curt Feldman -- GameSpot (http://www.gamespot.com/)
POSTED: 12/13/04 02:53 PM PST


Particularly interesting is the thought that EA is developing a management game?

Also, I found it interesting that the NFL may have been persuaded to enter this deal due to the impending price wars between the two companies. Perhaps their licensing gives them a percentage of every sale and they didn't want to lose money if EA had to keep lowering their prices in response to Take Two?

[Honolulu_Blue]

Yeah, I was kidding. I worked on one antitrust case (defense side) before I became a transactional lawyer. I think you're overstating our chances--I think we'd have no chance! ;)

Well, never say never! Then again, we could get laughed out of the court room and a Rule 11 sanction with some fines to boot!

[Calis]

exactly. sorry to say but EA isn't concerned with FOFC. hey, i'll admit i try to limit my EA purchasing out of loyalty to Jim and his company but EA isn't going to lose sleep over me not buying the Sims or whathaveyou. in any event i rather focus on the positive and see what they have planned. i still don't know why they're lumping fantasy football in that article, i'm not getting the connection.

I'm not following this, I don't think people are speaking out against EA because of the ordeal with Jim, but because of the thought process in general...and that's definitely not something only seen here..seen complaints quite a few places.

Does EA care though? Of course not, they'll still get their sales.

I don't see a way that one football game being made is better than two, and I see nothing that EA gains from this deal other than pushing Sega sails further down, so I fail to see how this helps out the genre. It does help out EA though, that's for sure.

Personally though, I enjoyed Sega's game much more last year, and will be purchasing it again this year unless more than likely. Just hope they can keep things going without a license, they'll definitely be forced to up their game quite a bit.

[LastWhiteSoxFanStanding]

I think this is a great thing personally.

Career modes in console games have sucked.

If sega stays in the market, this will force them to come up with a cutting edge career mode. Think about all the text games (FBCB, FOF, OOTP) We all use fictional players in those, so i think this could work if sega stays in the game

[CamEdwards]

sounds like the NFL is really the one to blame here. Either way, though... I'm not interested in buying Madden.

Lets hope the NCAA doesn't decide to do the same thing.

[ISiddiqui]

I just saw this on ESPN.com and almost spit out my soda! What a horrid decision! Man, I really liked NFL 2k5. The price point was definetly right, since paying $50 every year for a roster update and some minor fixes gets old fast.

[Bomber]

So we shouldn't expect anything more than a roster update for Madden for the next 5 years.

[Dave66]

EA also has the PGA Tour and FIFA exclusively!

[MizzouRah]

This sucks! Damn you EA!!

I really don't understand how they can do this. Isn't this like Dell purchasing exclusive rights to Windows or something like that?


Todd

[ISiddiqui]

EA also has the PGA Tour and FIFA exclusively!

They must only have FIFA exclusively for video games and not text simulations, though. Because FM05 has all the FIFA players, for one.

[Ajaxab]

I'm also interested in hearing more about Jim's comment. Care to elaborate?

[Calis]

I dunno how that works since as mentioned before they've been doing it for a while now on a couple different things, believe Nascar as well.

I know nothing of the legal side of it though, and kinda curious about Jim's comment earlier. What's the reason to believe it wouldn't hold up? I actually have no idea, curious.

[Crapshoot]

Aye- Im not going to be buying Madden ever - this just stinks.

[Ajaxab]

If anyone is interested in signing a petition (albeit a poorly worded one), here's a link:

hxxp://www.petitiononline.com/nfleacon/petition.html

[jbmagic]

I dunno how that works since as mentioned before they've been doing it for a while now on a couple different things, believe Nascar as well.

I know nothing of the legal side of it though, and kinda curious about Jim's comment earlier. What's the reason to believe it wouldn't hold up? I actually have no idea, curious.


i wish EA never got the rights to Nascar.....

Nascar Racing 2003 season is still the best game for Nascar...most of the real drivers use that game to play..very realistic

and you can find the game for like 10 bucks

[SunDancer]

I think this is a great thing personally.

Career modes in console games have sucked.

If sega stays in the market, this will force them to come up with a cutting edge career mode. Think about all the text games (FBCB, FOF, OOTP) We all use fictional players in those, so i think this could work if sega stays in the game


See, people in the minority want career modes to be the top goal. Also, they want to do it with real teams. The focus on the autheticism and the on-the-field graphics, gameplay, ect. People would buy FOF if they wanted a career-GM/focus game first.

[sabotai]

So we shouldn't expect anything more than a roster update for Madden for the next 5 years.

I doubt it. They'll continue to add things and innovate. I think they realize that if all they did was add a roster update, people wouldn't buy it in the numbers that they do. However, this will most likely slow it to a crawl. Except in the graphics department. They need to make those better since that's what most console players seem to care about (honest general observation, not a cheap shot).

[Francis_Cole]

Interesting to note they will hopefully introduce a mangment branding of games as well to presumly go with their other managment games (like total club football)

[Fonzie]

sounds like the NFL is really the one to blame here. Either way, though... I'm not interested in buying Madden.

Bingo.

The NFL is the guilty party here - they're the ones who decided to go exclusive and put their licensing up for bids. Between this and the Sunday Ticket I'm seeing a disturbing pattern of NFL behavior - maximize $$$, and to hell with consumer options.

Of course, with such a popular product they don't have to worry about the bad PR that comes with this decision - most customers will 1) keep coming back to the NFL, no matter what and 2) probably blame EA anyway (as we've seen here).

[sterlingice]

Say what you will, but you know at least half of you suckers who have bought Madden for $50 every year when it came out will be doing it again next year and it's not like they're going to be losing their base since a majority of their purchasers won't even know it. C'mon, this time next year, there will be a few extra people in the store going "Hm.. where did Sega's games go?" But in the end, few will actually know or care and will just buy Madden.

It's a horrible thing for the industry but they're getting away with it because, well, they can.

What EA is doing may be the best possible thing for the industry.

Now, SEGA has incentive to challenge what's likely never to hold up on court - the claimed restriction on using real player names.
At least there's hope here. But I'm not overly optimistic.

Then again, I haven't bought a football game in a couple of years. I would have bought NFL2K5 if it would have come out for Nintendo at that attractive price point ($20 for a new football game/roster updates that's pretty good; that's significantly better than $50 per year for roster updates).

The sad thing is that SEGA's willingness to price it that low this year probably pushed the discussion from "Well, maybe we'll do it" like 6 months ago to "We have to do it, otherwise SEGA is a threat". Because, better to buy up the exclusive rights so another company can't develop than to lower the fucking price, EA.

SI

[Draft Dodger]

I seem to recall this coming up several months ago when EA's "exclusive" contract was signed with the NFL (for a HUGE number, IIRC). At that point, after a brief scare, it all came out that this was NOT going to be any sort of exclusive deal, and that it was some other sort of deal.

Guess that was all wrong.

[Calis]

IGN is reporting "rumors" about EA contacting the NBA and MLB as well, although when they asked EA they just declined to comment.

So who knows on that one? I'm sure they'd be at least looking into it.

[SackAttack]

Yeah, why not? If you can freeze the competition by buying exclusive licenses - and EA has the resources to do that - why not? Beats having to actually, y'know, compete for business.

[Anthony]

if it worked for MS...

[SackAttack]

http://students.uat.edu/ryamccab/images/madden2006.jpg

Gold.

[sterlingice]

http://students.uat.edu/ryamccab/images/madden2006.jpg

Gold.
Beeeautiful.

SI

[LionsFan10]

Disgusting, this is just the sort of shit that I can't stand. Terrible news, indeed. I will not be buying any EA Sports games next year, that's for sure.

[bob]

My son will be disappointed to learn there won't be another edition of Backyard Football any time soon.

It sucks for the consumer, but it's a smart business move on EA's part (assuming they didn't overpay).

From the IGN article:

"The reason that you're noticing a certain vagueness to the language in the press release is because the license deals do not include smaller games such as Atari's Backyard Football; it's not subject to this agreement due to their numbers. And any wireless game or cell phone game is not part of the deal either."

So at least Backyard Football is safe.

[Ben E Lou]

Good ol' EA. (http://dynamic2.gamespy.com/%7Efof/forums/showthread.php?t=169)

[JonInMiddleGA]

From the IGN article:

"The reason that you're noticing a certain vagueness to the language in the press release is because the license deals do not include smaller games such as Atari's Backyard Football; it's not subject to this agreement due to their numbers. And any wireless game or cell phone game is not part of the deal either."

So at least Backyard Football is safe.

Good catch Bob, I missed that when reading the article. Thanks for the heads-up.

[Samdari]

Lets hope the NCAA doesn't decide to do the same thing.

Well, as Jim showed us with TCY, this is not as big a deal. With so many Universities named after their location, and the NCAA not licensing player names anyway, you can generate a universe which approximates the NCAA lanscape only changing about 7-10 University names to their locations (Durham, Nashville, etc.) and having players with the numbers and attributes of current players and fake (or no) names.

[mckerney]

Well, as Jim showed us with TCY, this is not as big a deal. With so many Universities named after their location, and the NCAA not licensing player names anyway, you can generate a universe which approximates the NCAA lanscape only changing about 7-10 University names to their locations (Durham, Nashville, etc.) and having players with the numbers and attributes of current players and fake (or no) names.

It would be more of an issue with a console game, with team nicknames, logos, and uniforms.

[Arles]

This certainly appears to be a blow to the consumer. But I think I'm with Jim on this one. The end result of what Sega does here to keep a foothold in the market should help pave the way for independents to stay competitive. Now, SEGA is in the same boat as Jim, Clay, Brian or us at Grey Dog from a licensing standpoint and they have to funds to really push this issue (something none of us ever had). I would not be surprised if the end result of all this is a more specific definition in what can be licensed (ie, redefining what a "likeness" is) - which may exclude the names of players.

[Crapshoot]

This certainly appears to be a blow to the consumer. But I think I'm with Jim on this one. The end result of what Sega does here to keep a foothold in the market should help pave the way for independents to stay competitive. Now, SEGA is in the same boat as Jim, Clay, Brian or us at Grey Dog from a licensing standpoint and they have to funds to really push this issue (something none of us ever had). I would not be surprised if the end result of all this is a more specific definition in what can be licensed (ie, redefining what a "likeness" is) - which may exclude the names of players.

Arlie/Jim, since you've both probably explored the option before- is there any potential legitimacy to a case akin to what you're proposing ? Can you claim the usage of names based on the "public use" idea ?

[Solecismic]

Yes. Based on the federal Lanham Act. It's really a slam dunk, and there have been similar cases that have gone against the sports figure. But as any business owner would tell you, what's important legally is not being right under the law. It's staying out of court, period.

Big businesses like EA and the NFLPA can afford lawyers and protracted court battles. That's why it's so interesting that another big company, SEGA, now has financial incentive to challenge this particular scheme. If SEGA were to challenge and win, I doubt EA and the NFLPA would bother us.

Now the logos and NFL team names are another story entirely. I think that restriction would hold up in court.

[mckerney]

Arlie/Jim, since you've both probably explored the option before- is there any potential legitimacy to a case akin to what you're proposing ? Can you claim the usage of names based on the "public use" idea ?

I remember there was a lawsuit about this involving Hardball 5, where some former players sued over being included as historical players, Accolade's defense was that they simply used players names and stats, something that is available in many historical records. I don't remember how this case turned out though.

[Solecismic]

The companies involved realized that there was a danger in challenging licensing schemes in that if they won, it would remove the barrier to entry that the schemes impose on the little guys.

So they paid the veterans off. It never went to court.

[Raiders Army]

A little late to post, but the NFL makes an exclusive deal with DirecTV and now EA Sports? This sucks.

[cwilloughby]

http://students.uat.edu/ryamccab/images/madden2006.jpg

Gold.

HAHA. Here is another from the ESPN NFL forums.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v238/ngxhayabusa/Hitler-Madden-06-Cover.jpg

[mightyshoe]

Is there a console version of Bloodbowl?

[SirFozzie]

Is there a console version of Bloodbowl?


Yes, it's called Mutant League Football ;)

I sincerely hope that the scuttlebutt (that Visual Concepts, creator of the ESPN NFL series, is planning to do a Monster Football or Cyberball game) is true... because EA Sports can bite my Jade Turtle.. I ain't buyin their crap any more.

[SackAttack]

HAHA. Here is another from the ESPN NFL forums.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v238/ngxhayabusa/Hitler-Madden-06-Cover.jpg

I think I like this one better.

[MizzouRah]

HAHA. Here is another from the ESPN NFL forums.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v238/ngxhayabusa/Hitler-Madden-06-Cover.jpg

Classic.


Todd

[sterlingice]

According to the NY Times, the amount paid was $300M for the 5 year contract.

SI

[SackAttack]

It's just too bad Sega couldn't trump that.

[sterlingice]

So, let's do the math. $60M per year = 1.2 million copies * $50 a game. So, they were expecting Sega to at least cut that much into their bottom line. Man, they badly viewed Sega as a big threat over the next 5 years.

Even odder, considering Madden does ~3.5M in sales per year, that's cutting a lot into the bottom line. Which tells me they don't have much in the way of development costs each year (go figure).

SI

[Franklinnoble]

HAHA. Here is another from the ESPN NFL forums.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v238/ngxhayabusa/Hitler-Madden-06-Cover.jpg

Somebody replaced SkyDog's head with Adolph Hitler!

[Zippo]

So, let's do the math. $60M per year = 1.2 million copies * $50 a game. So, they were expecting Sega to at least cut that much into their bottom line. Man, they badly viewed Sega as a big threat over the next 5 years.

Even odder, considering Madden does ~3.5M in sales per year, that's cutting a lot into the bottom line. Which tells me they don't have much in the way of development costs each year (go figure).

SI
I think you have to take away how much their old license would have cost as well.

[SackAttack]

So, let's do the math. $60M per year = 1.2 million copies * $50 a game. So, they were expecting Sega to at least cut that much into their bottom line. Man, they badly viewed Sega as a big threat over the next 5 years.

Possibly more, depending on how long Sega stayed at $20. If the game stayed at $20 for the next two years (end of the current console's life cycle) and then $50 thereafter, in order for the deal with the NFL to make financial sense, Sega would have had to sell 9.6 million copies the next five years (two years of 3 million each @ $20/game, the 1.2 million you cited for the following three years).

[sterlingice]

I think you have to take away how much their old license would have cost as well.
True, true. Forgot about that.

SI

[sterlingice]

Possibly more, depending on how long Sega stayed at $20. If the game stayed at $20 for the next two years (end of the current console's life cycle) and then $50 thereafter, in order for the deal with the NFL to make financial sense, Sega would have had to sell 9.6 million copies the next five years (two years of 3 million each @ $20/game, the 1.2 million you cited for the following three years).
Well, actually it's different than that. Because, we're not talking about the money Sega would make (unless you're talking about them and an exclusive contract). We're talking about the money EA would lose. Which means they have to lose those 1.2M customers per year. This year, a lot of people didn't switch from Madden to NFL2K5 because of Sega's low price point. They bought both. Madden didn't see a big hit in sales, they just saw a big bump from the other side of the aisle.

SI

[SackAttack]

Well, actually it's different than that. Because, we're not talking about the money Sega would make (unless you're talking about them and an exclusive contract). We're talking about the money EA would lose. Which means they have to lose those 1.2M customers per year. This year, a lot of people didn't switch from Madden to NFL2K5 because of Sega's low price point. They bought both. Madden didn't see a big hit in sales, they just saw a big bump from the other side of the aisle.

SI

Well, I have the feeling that if Sega had the exclusive contract, they wouldn't stay at $20/game for the two years I insinuated they might (if you've got a 5 year window, why waste 40% of that?).

But I was saying that from the pool of sales Madden might be expected to have, for that contract to make sense, the figures I quoted above would have to be sales away from the Madden franchise, as opposed to this year's dual-sales occurrences.

[MacroGuru]

I haven't bought a Madden game for 3 years....It looks like I will stay that way.

[SunDevil]

Guys,

Sega was planning on raising the price of their sports games next year anyways.

http://www.gamespot.com/xbox/sports/espnnhl2005/news_6114690.html

So its not like you would have been saving any money next year, just would have had a choice.

[sterlingice]

On the consoles, a fair chunk of that $50 goes to the console maker and for manufacturing costs (the amount varies per console). So it's more than 1.2 million for them to just break even on the licensing deal.
Well, yeah, but that's not how I was dividing it up. I was thinking X copies pays for licensing, X copies pays for manufacturing, X copies pays for advertising, etc.

SI

[gstelmack]

So, let's do the math. $60M per year = 1.2 million copies * $50 a game.
On the consoles, a fair chunk of that $50 goes to the console maker and for manufacturing costs (the amount varies per console). So it's more than 1.2 million for them to just break even on the licensing deal.

[SackAttack]

Guys,

Sega was planning on raising the price of their sports games next year anyways.

http://www.gamespot.com/xbox/sports/espnnhl2005/news_6114690.html

So its not like you would have been saving any money next year, just would have had a choice.

Nothing I've seen has indicated that it would be next year for sure. Only that premium pricing would've returned with the next generation of consoles.

[gstelmack]

Well, yeah, but that's not how I was dividing it up. I was thinking X copies pays for licensing, X copies pays for manufacturing, X copies pays for advertising, etc.

SI
That works for fixed cost items (like licensing and advertising), but not for manufacturing which is a cost per item. So you have to cut out the cost to actually manufacture the item (and the retailer's cut, again a cost per item) to determine how much money EA gets, then you can figure out how many copies pays for licensing, how many for advertising, etc.

[GrantDawg]

Yes. Based on the federal Lanham Act. It's really a slam dunk, and there have been similar cases that have gone against the sports figure. But as any business owner would tell you, what's important legally is not being right under the law. It's staying out of court, period.

Big businesses like EA and the NFLPA can afford lawyers and protracted court battles. That's why it's so interesting that another big company, SEGA, now has financial incentive to challenge this particular scheme. If SEGA were to challenge and win, I doubt EA and the NFLPA would bother us.

Now the logos and NFL team names are another story entirely. I think that restriction would hold up in court.What about problems the other way, ie. will EA now use this exclusiveness to challenge even the small game makers that even use the suggestion of a NFL set-up? Couldn't they (along with the NFL) put everyone in court to supress the smaller companies?

[robbgmaier]

Maybe this will bring about a revival of Tournament Cyberball. God I miss that game. If any of you have the 4 player arcade version in your basement, I'll bring as much beer as my card can hold and will order pizzas until they stop accepting my credit cards.

[Eaglesfan27]

What about problems the other way, ie. will EA now use this exclusiveness to challenge even the small game makers that even use the suggestion of a NFL set-up? Couldn't they (along with the NFL) put everyone in court to supress the smaller companies?
I was wondering that too.. especially with the language about football management games.. perhaps EA wants to get into that arena again. Would they try to suppress the little guy?

[CHEMICAL SOLDIER]

I was wondering that too.. especially with the language about football management games.. perhaps EA wants to get into that arena again. Would they try to suppress the little guy?

Look for this in the next 2-3 years. :(

[Its Vanilla]

2005 was the first year I didn't buy Madden. I didn't by Sega either, but I did like the gameplay when I rented it.

I hope that Sega uses their game engine for a college football game. I hope they make the greatest college football game ever, totally blowing out NCAA 2006. In fact, if Sega were to make a college game, I'd buy it instead of EA's, simply because of this.

[CHEMICAL SOLDIER]

I just hope that Sega changes the horrile player model. I hate the stretched out players.

[Ragone]

I got to thinking about this at work tonight (before they let me go home early)

This wasn't a good move for ea.. and let me tell you how espn responds..

they make their next game with editable team names.. and easy to edit rosters that take advantage of usb keyboards.. With roster hounds out today making rosters in under a week.. and the ease of use of a usb memory card.. If espn's product is superior.. it'll sell.. This also allows espn to spend more money developing new features

Now on to ea, they obviously had to overpay for exclusive rights.. considering i believe 3 other companies had rights (ea,midway,espn.. maybe microsoft still?) now to entice the league to do this kinda deal.. they had to at least come close to what all of them were paying combined, which really cannot be that good of a deal for ea at all.

[MizzouRah]

This is the scariest quote of all:

On a scarier note for these same publishers, rumors are already circulating that EA is attempting to negotiate similar deals with the NBA and Major League Baseball. When IGN contacted Trudy Muller, spokesperson for Electronic Arts about these rumors, she told us: "We cannot speculate at this time about any further plans these other leagues may have."


Todd

[Calis]

It looks as if EA has now bought the rights to the AFL as well.

These cats ain't messing around.

[CHEMICAL SOLDIER]

It looks as if EA has now bought the rights to the AFL as well.

These cats ain't messing around.

Now the question is : Will EA combine both games into one or sell them seperately? :confused:

[TazFTW]

Reading the press release would make it sound like EA will be releasing a seperate AFL game starting in 2006.

[Kodos]

Time for Sega to grab the XFL rights!


I have to say this whole episode has really lowered my opinion of EA. Nevermind trying to beat your opponents by creating a superior game. Just buy the license so that you'll have the only NFL game on the market... :rolleyes:

[CHEMICAL SOLDIER]

Yet I wonder what new features will be on Madden 2006?
New multi colored arm bands for QB's.
Fans can now have masks.
New and improved Tony Bruno Hour
all for a low price of $ 75.99

[Anthony]

there isn;t much more to improve on. roster updates and "AI improvements" for the most part are what we should be looking forward to now.

[Kodos]

There's plenty of room for improvement. Better draft and roster management AI. More customizability. Better imported drafts from NCAA where the league doesn't get filled with super stars. Better commentary. Different broadcast teams for different games. There are too many teams with unrealistically low attendance. Online mode that doesn't have a new severe bug/exploit each year. Online franchise. The list goes on and on.

[Travis]

Hey, being able to make a created playbook your default playbook for your profile (at least for PC) would be quite nice.