Downloading Music

[NYFAN]

I'm considering buying one of the music download things (like napster) for a few days (or month) just to get a lot of songs that I want that I haven't gotten since I stopped using them... Anybody have any experience in terms of which way to go is the cheapest? How do these pay ones work now? Any advice would be appreciated, thanks!

[MJ4H]

I have heard, though I do not know this for sure, that Napster's music expires when you cancel your subscription with them. Meaning you can no longer play the music after you cancel. I would look for that type of stuff when checking out a potential site.

FWIW, I love iTunes.

[Raven]

I've heard the same thing about Napster as MJ4H. Once you stop paying for the service, you can no longer play the music. And you can't burn any of the songs you get from Napster on to cd's, as I believe they are in their own format.

[amdaily]

I signed up for a trail for Napster after seeing their unlimited downloads commerical scheme. Everytime I tried to look up an album they wanted $14.95 more for it.

[VPI97]

allofmp3.com

For the majority of the albums they have, you can pick the quality you want and they'll encode the mp3 on the fly. You pay based on file size and at 192 kbps, I can typically get an album for $1.50

[SackAttack]

And don't worry, the Russian Mafia is far too ethical to use your credit card info for evil!

;)

[Young Drachma]

I'm considering buying one of the music download things (like napster) for a few days (or month) just to get a lot of songs that I want that I haven't gotten since I stopped using them... Anybody have any experience in terms of which way to go is the cheapest? How do these pay ones work now? Any advice would be appreciated, thanks!

Rhapsody is $10/mo and it works really well. I've had it for over two years now. I've had Napster, too. I like it better, for say, downloading music and burning it. But that's really all it's good for. Rhapsody is great for streaming, creating playlists and stuff and making CDs too, because it has a deep catalog. Napster has newer stuff, but often times doesn't make it all available for streaming.

Rhapsody almost always has stuff online for streaming, but it might not be available for burning.

[ShaqFu]

Yahoo's service is cheaper than Napster's, with pretty much the same terms. I believe it is $6.99/month for month-to-month service or $4.99/month if you pay for a year.

[oliegirl]

allofmp3.com

For the majority of the albums they have, you can pick the quality you want and they'll encode the mp3 on the fly. You pay based on file size and at 192 kbps, I can typically get an album for $1.50

I've been using this site and love it! I've made a number of deposits via my debit card - never more than $10 or $15 and have had no problems. They just started a bonus where once you have deposited $50 (cumulative) you start getting a percentage of your deposits as bonus...it's small, maybe 1 or 2 percent, but it's better than nothing! The songs are easy to download and easy to import into iTunes...no problems playing them on my iPod either!

[rexallllsc]

allofmp3.com

For the majority of the albums they have, you can pick the quality you want and they'll encode the mp3 on the fly. You pay based on file size and at 192 kbps, I can typically get an album for $1.50

Russian.

See if any of the artists or labels have been paid by allofmp3.com.

[Blackadar]

Russian.

See if any of the artists or labels have been paid by allofmp3.com.

Does that make it any more or less legal in Russia?


P.S. - Note I said legal and not moral. The morality of this is an entirely different issue.

[Blackadar]

I've used AllofMP3 in the past - and occasionally do so now.

The prices are nice - there's no doubt about that. But that's not the primary reason I use(d) it. I checked out many other US-based online sites and all of them restricted my ability to use the music I purchased or were outrageous in price.

For example, you lose the right to play the music you purchased with Napster. Other online systems restrict or prevent the ability to code music to the MP3 format or burn it to personal CDs. I have a built-in CD/MP3 player in my car which is where I listen to my music, so that doesn't work for me. Restricting my personal of music that I purchase isn't the solution for me. Others are so absurdly priced that it can cost you more to buy an album online than at the local Best Buy.

[panerd]

Gee I wonder if the fact that it is 10 times cheaper than any American site means anything. I can also pick up copies of any movie currently in the theater in China for a couple of bucks. Why does anyone shop at US stores?

[ShaqFu]

If you BUY a song from Napster, it's yours forever once you burn it to CD. You only lose the right to play a Napster song if you RENT a song.

As to the Russian site, while it may very well be legal in Russia, there are questions of whether an American using the site is legal. That site has stuff by the Beatles, Madonna, Garth Brooks, and others that hasn't been authorized for download here. That alone should raise eyebrows. That doesn't mean I haven't used the site, but I would be a little weary. It's probably no more/less legal than Kazaa, iMesh, LimeWire, or BitTorrent. However, it's probably much harder to track and prosecute, plus you probably have less risk for virus.

[MJ4H]

I'd like to learn more about this.

1) When obtaining a song from Napster, you actually have the option to "rent" instead of "buy?" Is it a different price? Is the legal agreement different? Different formats?

2) Does Napster make it an easy option to burn their music to CD and make it clear in their terms of service that you can burn your music to CD to get around the expiring license?

[rexallllsc]

Does that make it any more or less legal in Russia?


P.S. - Note I said legal and not moral. The morality of this is an entirely different issue.

It's definitely legal in Russia.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Okay, somewhere in all the info, I think I got lost.

Here's what might interest me, somebody highlight the best option or two.
1) Legal ...
2)Buy & d'load in format easily burned to CD (no Ipod, no interest in one)
3) Minimal software to install. I just want the files available, not looking for a 24/7 program that tries to run constantly or spyware or anything other than access to the files
4) Reasonably priced

Basically, I want to end up with CD's of artists-with-one-song-I-like or perhaps the occasional inconvienient to find album, listened to 99.9% of the time in the car, virtually no other use of them.

Does anything actually fit those requirements?

[Blackadar]

If you BUY a song from Napster, it's yours forever once you burn it to CD. You only lose the right to play a Napster song if you RENT a song.

As to the Russian site, while it may very well be legal in Russia, there are questions of whether an American using the site is legal. That site has stuff by the Beatles, Madonna, Garth Brooks, and others that hasn't been authorized for download here. That alone should raise eyebrows. That doesn't mean I haven't used the site, but I would be a little weary. It's probably no more/less legal than Kazaa, iMesh, LimeWire, or BitTorrent. However, it's probably much harder to track and prosecute, plus you probably have less risk for virus.

No, AllofMP3 is significantly different than Kazaa and the rest. The difference is that this site has been ruled legal in Russia. I also pay for my music (unlike it being free with Kazaa).

So there's little difference in going to Russia and buying the CD or downloading it from AllofMP3. And last time I checked, it's not illegal to bring non-bootleg imports back into the USA.

[TheOhioStateUniversity]

Why does anyone use pay services, there are some great free programs that will allow you to get double the selection of the pay services for FREE. Im sure you all already know this, I just dont understand why people are so uptight about using p2p services. When I lived at home my mother banned me from downloading music as she said it was stealing and illegal. I just dont care its music with existing programs to obtain it, its not me breaking into a car and taking it.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I just dont care its music with existing programs to obtain it, its not me breaking into a car and taking it.

It's actually no different at all, and you're nothing more than a damned pathetic thief.

Nice to see what wonderful material our universities have to work with these days.

[stevew]

Why does anyone use pay services, there are some great free programs that will allow you to get double the selection of the pay services for FREE. Im sure you all already know this, I just dont understand why people are so uptight about using p2p services. When I lived at home my mother banned me from downloading music as she said it was stealing and illegal. I just dont care its music with existing programs to obtain it, its not me breaking into a car and taking it.

Tool.

[TheOhioStateUniversity]

Ok JohninMiddleGa play the holier than thou role.... You dont know me or how I operate other than I use P2p programs to get music. There is a difference between law and morality, and although I know what I do is against the law I dont feel its immoral for me to obtain music, movies, etc... thats shared with me. I just dont feel like Im going to go to hell for downloading the latest Jay-Z album on Mirc....

[rexallllsc]

Ok JohninMiddleGa play the holier than thou role.... You dont know me or how I operate other than I use P2p programs to get music. There is a difference between law and morality, and although I know what I do is against the law I dont feel its immoral for me to obtain music, movies, etc... thats shared with me. I just dont feel liek Im going to go to hell for downloading the latest Jay-Z album on Mirc....

What about music downloaded from indie labels? It's the principle.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I just dont feel liek Im going to go to hell for downloading the latest Jay-Z album on Mirc....

Didn't say anything about Hell ... prison is where you belong.

And if there's one dime of government money being used in your pursuit of education, and one moment of government provided bandwidth used in your criminal pursuits, then perhaps Federal prison at that.

[TheOhioStateUniversity]

Yes I need to be in federal prison for using a p2p program to get music.....pfffttt... and I admitted Im breaking the law but jail...come on man you do know there are murderers and rapists running around? I dont give a f*ck about the law as it concerns p2p sharing.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Yes I need to be in federal prison for using a p2p program to get music.....pfffttt... and I admitted Im breaking the law but jail...come on man you do know there are murderers and rapists running around? I dont give a f*ck about the law as it concerns p2p sharing.

Please then, do us a favor -- share your real name & student ID with us -- there are a few people who might be interested to have it.

[MJ4H]

Let's try not to threadjack. Downloading copyrighted music without proper permission is against the law. For a reason. So there's the answer to your question why people are so uptight about downloading music using p2p software.

JimGA:

iTunes allows you to make CDs directly from the same software which you browse, sample, purchase, and download music (usually 99c per song). It is extremely easy to burn CDs of downloaded music immediately. iTunes is also a very good music organizational tool. This is one of the things that makes the iPod so attractive (its interface with iTunes). But even not regarding the iPod in the equation, iTunes is an extremely attractive package. That's my recommendation for you.

[TheOhioStateUniversity]

Ok johnInMiddleGA saving the world from those damn music thiefs...I laugh at you because you take youself and this situation a little too seriously. Sure Ill give you my student id and full name, that would be smart.

[Blackadar]

Ok johnInMiddleGA saving the world from those damn music thiefs...I laugh at you because you take youself and this situation a little too seriously. Sure Ill give you my student id and full name, that would be smart.

Ignore John. He's not happy unless the USA becomes a facist dictatorship.

[JonInMiddleGA]

But even not regarding the iPod in the equation, iTunes is an extremely attractive package. That's my recommendation for you.

Thanks Matt, I was (once again) genuinely getting lost in all the options, and wanted somebody to just match my priorities against them (I've looked at the various sites several times each since they started appearing, never really developed any feeling I really understood them for sure).

[albionmoonlight]

Jon--I second the rec. of iTunes. It's big (should not go away any time soon) and very easy to use. It works great with iPod, but I used it for a while even before I got my iPod.

[MJ4H]

No problem. I use iTunes extensively these days, if you need any guidance with it or have more questions about what it can do and do easily before you decide to try it (which is free, of course) just shoot me a PM or here in this thread.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Ignore John. He's not happy unless the USA becomes a facist dictatorship.

Just ignore Blackie, he's just upset because he can't find a socialist paradise that survives.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Sure Ill give you my student id and full name, that would be smart.

Well, it was worth a try, I figured it was about a 50/50 shot.

Failing that, I think we can still probably arrange to have OSU decide this particular site should be blocked from access, since it's being apparently being used by a student to advocate criminal activity.

[TheOhioStateUniversity]

Firstly Im on summer break, secondly what is your problem? Do you have anything better to do with your life?

[NYFAN]

With iTunes you have to buy the service, and then buy each song individually?

[JonInMiddleGA]

No problem. I use iTunes extensively these days, if you need any guidance with it or have more questions about what it can do and do easily before you decide to try it (which is free, of course) just shoot me a PM or here in this thread.

So, here's what I've figured out so far ...
1) I would d'load their software
2) The software lets me browse their catalog, see their titles, pricing, etc.

Q1 -- if I install the software, it's inactive unless I choose to open the program (or can easily reset any autorun/autoload settings)?
Q2 -- It appears that iTunes is strictly pay-as-you-go -- No monthly or subscription fees, no deposit to make, just pay for what you want & pay for it at the time you want it. Right?
Q3 -- Basically, if I install the software & then decide for some reason that it isn't for me, I'm out nothing but a little time?

[Crapshoot]

Okay, somewhere in all the info, I think I got lost.

Here's what might interest me, somebody highlight the best option or two.
1) Legal ...
2)Buy & d'load in format easily burned to CD (no Ipod, no interest in one)
3) Minimal software to install. I just want the files available, not looking for a 24/7 program that tries to run constantly or spyware or anything other than access to the files
4) Reasonably priced

Basically, I want to end up with CD's of artists-with-one-song-I-like or perhaps the occasional inconvienient to find album, listened to 99.9% of the time in the car, virtually no other use of them.

Does anything actually fit those requirements?

Hmm - would you listen to music at home, at all ? I realize its not what you mentioned, but I love Rhapsody, because it streams the music onto your music at a high bitrate(no downloading of it - you pay a $10 monthly charge), and charges only 79 cents per song if you wish to download and burn to a CD. Also, if you're a subscriber, I believe you can download 25 free songs a month to your hard drive (As opposed to having it streaming) and then burn those- but i'm not certain on that.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Firstly Im on summer break, secondly what is your problem? Do you have anything better to do with your life?

Anything I can do to disrupt an admitted criminal is time well spent AFAIC.
You're the one who came into this thread shooting off their mouth like some sort of juvenile delinquent, it might be worthwhile that you learn a lesson or two from it. And if not, it'd still be quite fun.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Hmm - would you listen to music at home, at all ? I realize its not what you mentioned, but I love Rhapsody, because it streams the music onto your music at a high bitrate(no downloading of it - you pay a $10 monthly charge), and charges only 79 cents per song if you wish to download and burn to a CD. Also, if you're a subscriber, I believe you can download 25 free songs a month to your hard drive (As opposed to having it streaming) and then burn those- but i'm not certain on that.

It'd be fairly rare -- among other things, I tend to like my music loud, and that's not real conducive to domestic harmony (i.e. my wife would go insane at a fairly rapid pace).

[MJ4H]

With iTunes you have to buy the service, and then buy each song individually?
You don't have to buy the service. But you can buy songs invividually or by albums.

[TheOhioStateUniversity]

Get JohninMiddleGa a life Stat!!!

[MJ4H]

So, here's what I've figured out so far ...
1) I would d'load their software
2) The software lets me browse their catalog, see their titles, pricing, etc.

Q1 -- if I install the software, it's inactive unless I choose to open the program (or can easily reset any autorun/autoload settings)?
Q2 -- It appears that iTunes is strictly pay-as-you-go -- No monthly or subscription fees, no deposit to make, just pay for what you want & pay for it at the time you want it. Right?
Q3 -- Basically, if I install the software & then decide for some reason that it isn't for me, I'm out nothing but a little time?
all correct.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Get JohninMiddleGa a life Stat!!!

I'm doing okay, thanks. I'm making enough to pay for your "education", that ought to be enough to satisfy you. Maybe we should see if your Mom knows the sort of things you post online, maybe it's time for another home-based banning.

And btw, did you clean your room yet?

[TheOhioStateUniversity]

I dont remember saying anything about how much money you make. I said you need to get a life, as you seem to be overly concerned with hunting down vicious internet music sharing thiefs. Im thinking if you had a life maybe you could use that time to take a lady out or talk to some friends.

[MJ4H]

You can't be serious.

[LastWhiteSoxFanStanding]

You can't be serious.

I actually think he is

[NYFAN]

ok... hopefully the last question... i went with iTunes... now I have a song in an M4P format, how do I convert that to something I can play in a cd player?

[Ksyrup]

ok... hopefully the last question... i went with iTunes... now I have a song in an M4P format, how do I convert that to something I can play in a cd player?
If you mean burning it to disc, itunes has a built-in burner. AFAIK, the only way to convert an itunes file to an MP3 is to burn it to disc in itunes, then rip it back as an MP3.

[NYFAN]

ok, but the built in burner will convert it to a file that i can play in a regular player, or my car etc...? thanks again for all of your help.

[Ksyrup]

No, the burner will burn it onto a disc, not convert the file. I don't think there's an M4P-to-MP3 converter, but I don't work with itunes files all that often. I only have a few, and those I've just burned to a regular audio disc. The burner will burn an audio disc. Then you take the audio disc and rip the songs back to your hard drive as MP3s. Then you've got the same songs as MP3s instead of the unusable (except in itunes) M4P files.

[JonInMiddleGA]

ok, but the built in burner will convert it to a file that i can play in a regular player, or my car etc...? thanks again for all of your help.

Okay, I haven't tried this yet, but ...
from the help file
You can use iTunes to create a data CD with the music stored in MP3 format. MP3 is a high-quality, Internet-standard encoding method. You can listen to the MP3 CDs you create on special consumer CD players or on your computer.

Looks like they've got a built-in converter or something.
Just go:
iTunes and MusicStore Help ---> Burning CDs and DVDs -->Creating your own mp3 CDS

Alternately, it looks like they've got some format (just calling them "standard audio files") that should work on a CD player or PC.

[Ksyrup]

Well there you go. I wonder if that's relatively new? I don't use it enough - or have the need for MP3s - to know anyway. When I buy downloads, which is rare, I just burn to disc anyway. The only stuff I buy is stuff I can't buy on CD.

[MJ4H]

EDIT: I hate thinking Im replying to the last post in a thread when there is actually more on the second page.

[MJ4H]

Yeah that's called CD-audio format. Playable by any CD player.

FWIW there is a way to convert directly from m4p to mp3, though I actually never got it to work. Do a little net search and you'll come across some tutorials. I was just curious about the process, but I shouldn't really need this since I do all my listening on PC or iPod these days (I only have about 25 songs I've bought from iTunes anyway).

[NYFAN]

beautiful... thanks for all of your help guys

[HerRealName]

If you like indie music, emusic.com is outstanding. It is $9.99 a month for 40 downloads and the songs aren't copy protected so you don't have to deal with that issue. It is only independent labels, though, so I also use ITunes for big label artists. As you have discovered, the m4p file format is the worst thing about Itunes.

[rexallllsc]

I dont remember saying anything about how much money you make. I said you need to get a life, as you seem to be overly concerned with hunting down vicious internet music sharing thiefs. Im thinking if you had a life maybe you could use that time to take a lady out or talk to some friends.

I don't know what kind of music you DL, but I'm guessing you DL some indie artists as well.

I would just like to rethink your position on this stuff. Most indie artists and labels offer a few free mp3s on the net. You can check em out and see if you like the band or not.

[Ksyrup]

I would just like to rethink your position on this stuff.
This would make most arguments go away...

[Ksyrup]

www.weedshare.com (http://www.weedshare.com). Free music for 3 plays, then you pay. You get to hear every song in full before you buy. Mostly obscure, but some relatively well-known artists.

[panerd]

This would make most arguments go away...

Doesn't everyone know the first law of arguments?

"Persons disagreeing with you are always emotional and employ faulty reasoning. So each side must continue stating the same facts over and over and calling the other side stupid."

[JeeberD]

allofmp3.com

For the majority of the albums they have, you can pick the quality you want and they'll encode the mp3 on the fly. You pay based on file size and at 192 kbps, I can typically get an album for $1.50

Quick question, there aren't any other fees besides the cost of the songs you download, right? I don't see anything on their site about no sign-up fee but I also don't see anything saying that it's free...

[oliegirl]

Quick question, there aren't any other fees besides the cost of the songs you download, right? I don't see anything on their site about no sign-up fee but I also don't see anything saying that it's free...


Nope - I've been using this site for months and there are no hidden fees or anything. Just the cost of the music you download.

[JeeberD]

Cool. Future Mrs JeeerD thanks you for the info... :)

[Grammaticus]

Why does anyone use pay services, there are some great free programs that will allow you to get double the selection of the pay services for FREE. Im sure you all already know this, I just dont understand why people are so uptight about using p2p services. When I lived at home my mother banned me from downloading music as she said it was stealing and illegal. I just dont care its music with existing programs to obtain it, its not me breaking into a car and taking it.
Listen to your mother

[korme]

So anyone who uses free P2P software is a tool for downloading music?

Damn, I'm so ashamed. http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

[korme]

Please then, do us a favor -- share your real name & student ID with us -- there are a few people who might be interested to have it.
Wow...............

[Desmond]

I download music, but I do it because I was robbed by the RIA. Ya see when i was too young to know better I was sold Tiffany records, Brian Adams records, hell I even bought a Frankie Goes To Hollywood record when I was 9, think of the damage that could of done. Anyway, I figured out sometimes around 1998 that the Record Industry owed me about $2,345 simply for the costs of the albums they force fed me thru their coke ads, mtv and radio payolla. I tacked on another $5000 for the sheer emotional damage of thinking it was cool to dance around the schoolyard and sing Debbie Gibson songs. So I figure the RIA owes me about $7,500. Everytime I download an album I take $10 of the big number. I've still got about $4,000 grand to go but If I can find that rare RATM live disc it'll be down to $3,900. Im fighting the power.

[Passacaglia]

Relax.

[JeeberD]

Don't do it.

[Hurst2112]

I download music, but I do it because I was robbed by the RIA. Ya see when i was too young to know better I was sold Tiffany records, Brian Adams records, hell I even bought a Frankie Goes To Hollywood record when I was 9, think of the damage that could of done. Anyway, I figured out sometimes around 1998 that the Record Industry owed me about $2,345 simply for the costs of the albums they force fed me thru their coke ads, mtv and radio payolla. I tacked on another $5000 for the sheer emotional damage of thinking it was cool to dance around the schoolyard and sing Debbie Gibson songs. So I figure the RIA owes me about $7,500. Everytime I download an album I take $10 of the big number. I've still got about $4,000 grand to go but If I can find that rare RATM live disc it'll be down to $3,900. Im fighting the power.

Funny...

I was buying AC/DC, Sabbath, Zappa and Rush albums when I was the age you say. Perhaps you should blame your parents and ask them for money.

By the way, the Bad Taste Police called...they have a warrent for your arrest.

[Dutch]

allofmp3.com, it's cheap, it's fair, it's not getting anybody thrown in jail by the RIAA. :)

[Grammaticus]

allofmp3.com, it's cheap, it's fair, it's not getting anybody thrown in jail by the RIAA. :)
Does anyone know if the RIAA, etc. supports allofmp3.com? Just curious, I have not heard anything about it either way. Being a Russian site and so cheap, it looks suspicious.

[Hurst2112]

Does anyone know if the RIAA, etc. supports allofmp3.com? Just curious, I have not heard anything about it either way. Being a Russian site and so cheap, it looks suspicious.

no.

From my limited understanding, Russia was not part of the Berne Convention of 97 which formed to regulate world copyrights. Similarly to the Indonesian countries, Russia is exempt from the long arm of the copyright law.

The reason it's 'legal' for you and I to use it in the states is similar to off shore gambling.

I would assume that as the years go by, sites like this will fade away. Yet, it is apparent that copyright laws are WAAAAYYYY to ancient to be changed and regulated as fast as technology changes.

[Icy]

If you guys are worried about getting in jail, using that russian site will keep you protected probably because the hole in internet regulations betwen countries. If moral is the issue, it's the same to use p2p software than to pay that russian site as they don't pay the artists anyway. If you feel better expending money, pay that russians, but have on mind you're just making them rich and not the authors. Wonder yoursef why most of the ilegal porn (kids etc), hacking, cracks, warez websites etc are hosted in russian servers. They don't care about their own laws, and of course even less about other countries laws. Have the FBI to go there to get a russian guy in jail and they will laught in their face.

Again legal and moral is not the same, but to pay just to avoid jail is not the same than to support the artists. I would use p2p before that russian site. And in another matter, it could be a new discussion who is really lossing with the p2p, the artist or the bussines men behind him (sadly probably the artist too as if the bussines men don't make money, they won't bring new artists).

Of course that just my opinion as little music artist, who has seen the music bussines contracts, who expend thousands on buying discs every year and who uses also p2p from time to time.

[Icy]

Info about it, sorry for being offtopic:

<TABLE class=normal height=901 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=10 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top width="15%" bgColor=#eaffff height=86>Is Allofmp3 legal?

</TD><TD vAlign=top width="70%" bgColor=#ffffff height=86>The most frequently asked question. We have thoroughly investigated this. You will not find Allofmp3 in the list of legal music services supported by the IFPI at www.pro-music.org (http://www.pro-music.org/).

Organizations like IFPI and the RIAA are doing their best to avoid any publicity when it comes to the legal services in Russia. There is a loophole in the Russian copyright legislation that makes services like Allofmp3 possible. Apparently this loophole cannot be closed easily. Read more >> (http://www.museekster.com/allofmp3faq.htm#Will the RIAA or the IFPI have Allofnp3 closed down in the near future?)


The legal status of Allofmp3

Russian copyright legislation allows phonograms to be performed publicly without the authorization of the copyright owner for broadcasting and cable transmission. (Article 39) The Internet could be deemed to fall under this exemption. The copyrights involved have to be paid to a collecting society. This is the 'loophole' that is referred to in several articles on Allofmp3.

An English translation of the Russian copyright legislation can be found at www.copyrighter.ru (http://www.copyrighter.ru/full/eng/apisp3.htm)

Allofmp3 has signed agreements for this with Russian Organization for Multimedia & Digital Systems (ROMS (http://www.roms.ru/)). According to license № ЛС-ЗМ-02-36 the Internet-project www.allofmp3.com (http://www.allofmp3.com/index2.shtml), has the right to use musical compositions by providing downloads. Under the license agreement Allofmp3 pays out fees to ROMS for downloaded materials that are subject to the Russian Federation Copyright And Related Rights Law.

ROMS manages intellectual rights in the Russian Federation. All third party distributors licensed by ROMS are required to pay a portion of the revenue to the ROMS. ROMS in turn, is obligated to pay most of that money (aside from small portion it needs for operating expenses) to artists. Both Russian and foreign.

We have received this confirmation from ROMS:

I can confirm the legality of allofmp3.com You can legally buy/download mp3-songs from this site if it does not breaks the law the national legislation of the country in which you will be during that moment Sorry for my english.
Yours faithfully, the assistant to the lawyer of the Russian society on multimedia and to digital networks (ROMS) www.roms.ru (http://www.roms.ru/).

Bahanets Roman Igorevich

Interview with Allofmp3

We have interviewed the content manager of Allofmp3, Vadim Medved'ev. He provided us with some useful information. Read the interview (http://www.museekster.com/allofmp3interview.htm).

Interview with ROMS

Roman Bahanets of ROMS has answered our questions with regard to ROMS and the Russian Legal Music Services. He clearly states that Allofmp3 is a fully legal operation. Read our interview. (http://www.museekster.com/romsinterview.htm)

Press release

We recently received this press release (http://www.museekster.com/files/press-release%20ROMS.doc) from ROMS that's explains more on how ROMS operates.

The Music Industry's point of view

The Music Industry claims that Allofmp3 is illegal. Their opinion is that recorded music has three sets of rights. The songwriter has the copyright to the song, the artist his own rights in it, and the record label and producers a third set. Allofmp3 is paying the songwriters, via the collection agency ROMS, but they are acting without the permission of the other copyright holders.

Alan Dixon, general counsel of the IFPI explains their position in an article on Guardian.co.uk (http://www.guardian.co.uk/online/story/0,3605,1171203,00.html)

We have asked Andy Mincov, a Russian lawyer and webmaster of www.copyrighter.ru (http://www.copyrighter.ru/), to comment on Alan Dixon's statement. This is what he replied:

"As for the comment on Alan Dixon, I'm not sure what he meant my a Copyright Code during the Soviet era, because there has not been any such document". The Music Industry has not taken any legal action against Allofmp3 or ROMS. IFPI Russia's legal adviser, Vladimir Dragunov, has admitted that legal actions don't have much chance of succeeding. read more (http://www.museekster.com/allofmp3faq.htm#Will the RIAA or the IFPI have Allofnp3 closed down in the near future?) </TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width="15%" bgColor=#eaffff height=78> </TD><TD vAlign=top width="70%" bgColor=#ffffff height=78> </TD><TD width="15%" bgColor=#eaffff height=78> </TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width="15%" bgColor=#eaffff height=78>Is using Allofmp3 legal?

</TD><TD vAlign=top width="70%" bgColor=#ffffff height=78>In the User Agreement Allofmp3 states that you may not use the service if it is in conflict with the legislation of your country. Allofmp3 has added this as a kind of disclaimer of course.

Every country has its own rules. There is no such thing as a set minimum of international intellectual property standards. That makes it impossible to answer this question in general.

Let's take a closer look at the law in a country with very liberal copyright legislation and a country with strict copyright laws.

Liberal copyright legislation
A country that has very liberal copyright rules is The Netherlands.

Downloading copyrighted material for personal use is legal in this country. Even when the downloader knows the supplier is acting against the law (like uploading with P2Pprograms), this does not make him a copyright infringer. In this perspective it seems highly unlikely that downloading from a licensed supplier like Allofmp3 will be declared illegal.

It is safe to say that Dutch citizens can legally use the Russian music services.

Strict copyright legislation

Now for the country that may well have the strictest rules on copyrights, the USA. A thread in the Fatwallet forums (http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/messageview.php?start=100&catid=18&threadid=259565) brings some light in his confusing subject. We will not bother you with all the details. Here is a concise version of the interesting parts: </SPAN>


“MP3's, OGG's, etc are not illegal in the USA and therefore can be imported. There is also no law against importing music from other countries (including Russia). Because you are buying this legally in Russia and then importing to the USA, this should be 100% legit. For example, assuming that Russian Vodka is illegal to buy in the USA on Sunday, but you buy the Russian Vodka in Moscow on Sunday, then you import it into the USA, you have done nothing wrong. Again, this assumes that 1) it is illegal to buy Russian Vodka on Sunday in the USA 2) it is legal in Moscow and 3) it is legal to import Russian Vodka.”

Title 17 Chapter 6 Sec. 602 of the U.S. Code covers “Infringing importation of copies or phonorecords”. You can find this title here (http://assembler.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode17/usc_sec_17_00000602----000-.html)

Subsection (a) tells us:


“Importation into the United States, without the authority of the owner of copyright under this title, of copies or phonorecords of a work that have been acquired outside the United States is an infringement of the exclusive right to distribute copies or phonorecords under section 106, actionable under section 501.”

So it's illegal you may think. But take a close look at sub (a)(2):


“This subsection does not apply to importation, for the private use of the importer and not for distribution, by any person with respect to no more than one copy or phonorecord of any one work at any one time, or by any person arriving from outside the United States with respect to copies or phonorecords forming part of such person's personal baggage;”

If MP3’s, OGG’s etc are in fact considered phonorecords, U.S. citizens can legally buy these as long if they are for private use and not for distribution. If MP3s, OGG’s etc. are not considered phonorecords, no import laws apply. The sections of digital audio recording and sound recording have no mention of importation.

So in layman's terms the bottom line of this discussion is:


Downloading from Allofmp3 is legal for U.S. Citizens, as long as the files are for private use and not for distribution.

Please note – This is in no way a legal advice. -- please see our disclaimer (http://www.museekster.com/disclaimer.htm).

This is what a more law educated person like the Tech Law Advisor (http://techlawadvisor.com/blog/2004/04/is-allofmp3com-legal.html) has published regarding this issue:


Additionally, assuming they have legitimate licenses to distribute the music, they probably are restricted to a certain geographic are via their distribution license. The end user wouldn't be violating any laws but the distributor would. If they don't have legitimate distribution licenses then they obviously have no right to distribute at any price. If they claim to have the licenses the end user might be seen as an innocent infringer if not on notice.
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[Dutch]

Allofmp3 is paying the songwriters, via the collection agency ROMS, but they are acting without the permission of the other copyright holders

This makes me like allofmp3 even more. The actual songwriter gets paid? And nothing for Ashlee Simpson or Milli Vanilli or the RIAA? Sounds too good to pass up.

[Deattribution]

This makes me like allofmp3 even more. The actual songwriter gets paid? And nothing for Ashlee Simpson or Milli Vanilli or the RIAA? Sounds too good to pass up.

Yeah, you know when youre paying 75 cent for a whole album those artist/song writers are racking up.

They get what? 2 dollars (maybe) off a regular album priced at 14 bucks - so they get about 2 cent now.

They could be the highest selling artist on allofmp3.com and be lucky to make a payment on a used car with the proceeds.

[Icy]

I doubt also that the songwritters are getting the money as at least 30% of the singers/groups don't write the songs themselves and the guy behind them is never known so i find hard to believe that the russian guys are locating him to send him his money. I think that is another loophole to avoid the laws.

[Jesse_Ewiak]

Remember, boys and girls.

Bush illegally using he NSA to spy on citizens = AOK according to Jon.
If I download the U2's new album = I should be drawn and quartered.

[SirFozzie]

Jesse: Jon's tirade was seven months ago.

as much as I might disagree with some of his viewpoints..

The statue of limitations has well since expired to make a smartass remark based on them, if he came back in and said em now.. maybe.

In the immortal words of the Beatles.. "let it Be"

[Jesse_Ewiak]

My Bad. When people bump eighty-seven year old threads, these things happen.

[SirFozzie]

well.. now you know. And Knowing's half the battle.

(GI JOEEEEEEEE) :D

[Grammaticus]

Icy,

Thanks for all the info!

[JeeberD]

My Bad. When people bump eighty-seven year old threads, these things happen.

Better than starting a new thread that covers old territory...

[JonInMiddleGA]

Jesse: Jon's tirade was seven months ago.

See, if only you had said "That tirade was ..." instead of "Jon's tirade was ...", I could have missed out on this entirely.

Instead ... nah, the one-liners I've got to choose from are all too damned easy. Instead, I'll just go straight to the point.

Yo, Jesse

You ought to be drawn & quartered for being a braindead piece of shit fucking candyass moron ... not because you're a thief. Well, at least not only because you're a thief.

Fozzie, I blame you for this.
(The post, not for him being a b.p.o.s.f.c.m)

[SirFozzie]

Do you have a filter or something on your name that automatically brings it to your attention, Jon? :)

Me and my big mouth. ;)

Fire away Jessie, I guess you can consider Jon's post the ringing of the bell for Round 1 ;)

[JonInMiddleGA]

Do you have a filter or something on your name that automatically brings it to your attention, Jon? :)

Nah, I just clicked the thread (like I do with most first page threads) to get rid of the bold font that comes with anything with new posts. As it happened, your post was top of the page & so the first thing I see, without even trying, is Jesse: Jon's tirade was seven months ago.

Three posts sooner or later in the thread & I wouldn't have had the slightest idea, just bad luck on my part. But I still blame you ;)

[SirFozzie]

Three posts sooner or later in the thread & I wouldn't have had the slightest idea, just bad luck on my part. But I still blame you ;)

That's ok. To make it up for you, I will copy you a joke that a friend of mine sent me ;)

MY NEW LEXUS


I just got my new Lexus RX400h, and returned to the dealer the next day,
complaining that I couldn't figure out how the radio worked.

The salesman explained that the radio was voice activated. "Watch this!" he
said..."Nelson!"

The radio replied, "Ricky or Willie?"

"Willie!" he continued . . and "On The Road Again" came from the speakers.

I drove away happy, and for the next few days, every time I'd say,
"Beethoven" I'd get beautiful classical music, and if I said, "Beatles" I'd
get one of their awesome songs.

One day, a couple ran a red light and nearly creamed my new car, but I
swerved in time to avoid them. "ASSHOLES!" I yelled.

The French National Anthem began to play, sung by Jane Fonda and Michael
Moore, backed up by John Kerry on guitar, Al Gore on drums and Bill Clinton
on sax....

I LOVE this car!!!!!!!!!

[JonInMiddleGA]

That's ok. To make it up for you, I will copy you a joke that a friend of mine sent me ;)

You're forgiven ... barely, but forgiven.

I liked the joke so much in fact that I'll give you one back (although you probably already have it).

Donald Rumsfeld is giving the president his daily briefing.

He concludes by saying: "Yesterday, 3 Brazilian soldiers were killed."

"OH NO!" the President exclaims. "That's terrible!"

His staff sits stunned at this display of emotion, nervously watching as the President sits, head in hands.

Finally, the President looks up and asks, "How many is a brazillion?"

Y'know, it kinda makes me wonder about our "friends" if someone thought it wise to send us our respective jokes ;)

[SirFozzie]

remember Jon.. I may live in a Blue State, but my mind is neither blue nor red. I admit to disliking the current administration, but hell, it's not like the other guy would have done any better... :)

[Jesse_Ewiak]

Anytime a proto-fascist who thinks we should turn the Middle East into glass thinks I'm a moron, then I know I'm in the right. :-)

[moriarty]

OK, back on topic ... I have an Itunes question:

If I already have a playlist synched with my Ipod via another music play software and I download say 5 songs via Itunes, can I add those 5 songs to my Ipod without losing my existing playlists? I.e. can I synch with iTunes without losing what's on my Ipod already. Or do I have to somehow get all my music into either itunes or my existing software tool first and do a massive synch?

[samifan24]

OK, back on topic ... I have an Itunes question:

If I already have a playlist synched with my Ipod via another music play software and I download say 5 songs via Itunes, can I add those 5 songs to my Ipod without losing my existing playlists? I.e. can I synch with iTunes without losing what's on my Ipod already. Or do I have to somehow get all my music into either itunes or my existing software tool first and do a massive synch?

Yes. Just turn off the iTunes option to auto update your iPod's content based on your iTunes library and you should be all set.

[Dutch]

You're forgiven ... barely, but forgiven.

I liked the joke so much in fact that I'll give you one back (although you probably already have it).

Donald Rumsfeld is giving the president his daily briefing.

He concludes by saying: "Yesterday, 3 Brazilian soldiers were killed."

"OH NO!" the President exclaims. "That's terrible!"

His staff sits stunned at this display of emotion, nervously watching as the President sits, head in hands.

Finally, the President looks up and asks, "How many is a brazillion?"

Y'know, it kinda makes me wonder about our "friends" if someone thought it wise to send us our respective jokes ;)

Now that's a good joke. :)