Shuttle grounded again - indefinitely

[WrongWay]

No, this is not a repeat. The Nasa shuttles have all been grounded, and "Nasa says it will not fly again....We're just in the beginning of this process" Many now speculate that with a retirement date set for 2010 the Shuttle program is officially over.

Also, With damage now to its heat tiles the return trip might be very interesting. Unless they really do have a way to repair those damaged tiles in outer space.

Unbelievable, I thought I was first reading a recap of the columbia mission.

Can anyone be sued for this? " a flaw NASA claimed was fixed after spending more than $1 billion." Is it me or did NASA spend a Billion Dollars to fixe everything, but the "foam" problem? I am hearing that this is a design flaw that has always been there and short of scrapping the entire fleet there is basically nothing they can do. The foam is located on the outside of the fuel tank and there is nothing they can do to prevent it from comming off. Short of redesigning the entire setup.

In other words, NASA just through away a Billion Dollars for nothing. This is a problem that can't be fixed. I feel another Fleecing America segment comming on?


hxxp://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/07/28/nasa_grounds_shuttle/
hxxp://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/news/12241366.htm

[Samdari]

NASA just through away a Billion Dollars for nothing.

Did he really just right that?

[WrongWay]

Did he really just right that?
Yes! The foam problem has been there since day one and will never ever go away. As long as the insulation foam is located on the outside of the fuel tank; It is impossible to fix. You would have to completely redesign the entire shuttle.

Nasa took that Billion dollars and spent it on everything but the problem. Rather than admitting that this is just something that can not be fixed , they took the money and kept their mouths shut.

They have new toolboxes, new computers, new cameras, new space suits, new this, and new that. But, at the beginning of every mission foam is going to come crashing off that fuel tank at over a thousand miles per hour.

If my car has an engine problem I don't try to fix the problem by having a new radio installed and painting flames down the side of it.


Edited Again: There is an old, ancient and wise saying "you can't polish a turd".

[Ben E Lou]

Did he really just right that?Gold!

[terpkristin]

FWIW, I posted this (and some analysis) in the Shuttle Discovery thread...

http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~fof/forums/showthread.php?t=41031

/tk

[Bee]

Gold!

Goaled!

[Castlerock]

Did he really just right that?Yes!
It just keeps getting better.

[gstelmack]

* Woosh *

[mhass]

Ignore them WrongWay. There just being spiteful.

[Samdari]

Ignore them WrongWay. There just being spiteful.

The sad part is, this being the internet, I did not even notice this at first.

[WrongWay]

The thing that makes me the maddest is that there was no reason to ground the remaining shuttles. To my knowledge there has never been a shuttle mission where not a single tile was lost. There has never been a shuttle mission where foam did not come flying off. This is why Nasa claimed that the foam probably had nothing to do with the dissaster. It happens everytime the Shuttle goes up.

Why not just admit to the risk, tiles get cracked, foam flies off, they have known about this problem since the first Shuttle lift-off. Put a number to the risk factor and get back in the drivers seat and start dominating the space race again.

Hell, it would probably put buts in the seat, an increase TV rating if you thought there was a chance that the Shuttle could explode with every takeoof; Look at NASCAR. Food for thought, take that how the hell ever you want too.

[mhass]

If that's what makes you maddest, then this thread is better than I thought.

[HomerJSimpson]

They shoulded have been grounded 5 years ago. They are obsolete and too dangerous to continue. We should already have cheaper, more affective alternatives on the pads instead of spending huge amounts of money continuing to use a much outdated system.

[hukarez]

After all these years, I'm still waiting for us to colonize the moon.

The moon!

[Glengoyne]

The thing that makes me the maddest is that there was no reason to ground the remaining shuttles. To my knowledge there has never been a shuttle mission where not a single tile was lost. There has never been a shuttle mission where foam did not come flying off....

It is my understanding that the foam wasn't a problem, or maybe it just wasn't as much of a problem, until the mid nineties when they changed the formula for the foam. Prior to that Freon or maybe Halon gas was used in the creation of the foam, and that was changed because of environmental concerns/laws. That change in composition, as I understand it, made the foam more brittle than before.

I was surprised by the grounding announcement. I thought the foam breaking off at separation was a wholly different problem than the one that doomed Columbia. I know Nasa made attempts to rectify it, but I didn't realize that they had hoped/planned to completely eliminate the phenomenon.

I don't see this as a Government agency pissing money into the wind to solve an unsolveable problem.

[terpkristin]

A friend sent me these today. Now that Discovery has landed, I feel okay laughing at these... :)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v641/kpilotte/ShuttleCartoon1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v641/kpilotte/ShuttleCartoon2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v641/kpilotte/ShuttleCartoon3.jpg

/tk

[WrongWay]

I was surprised by the grounding announcement. I thought the foam breaking off at separation was a wholly different problem than the one that doomed Columbia. I know Nasa made attempts to rectify it, but I didn't realize that they had hoped/planned to completely eliminate the phenomenon.

I don't see this as a Government agency pissing money into the wind to solve an unsolveable problem.
I don't understand. Foam comming off and damaging the shuttle is what brought down Columbia and damn near did the same with Discovery. Both events happened at the same time. Discovery was just lucky the foam didn't hit any key tiles.

Etiher it is an impossible problem that will never be fixed or NASA just decided to put there heads in the sand and not address it. If it is a problem that can't be fixed I hope the fleet stays grounded forever.

Foam damaged Columbia and now Discovery. Now that everyone is safe it may be time to find out why in all this time no one attempted to correct the very problem that cost the Columbia their lives and almost repeated the actions with Discovery. Boys, it is firing time at NASA.



You know the old joke...
Patient: Doc every time the shuttle lifts off foam damages some of the heat tiles.
Doc: Then don't lift off.

[Qwikshot]

You know the old joke...
Patient: Doc every time the shuttle lifts off foam damages some of the heat tiles.
Doc: Then don't lift off.

Then the terrorists have won :p

[mhass]

Now I'm absolutely the furthest thing in the world from a conspiracy nut, but this whole thing reeks of inflated drama to me. That saw-from-duct-tape-and-junk-on-board stunt in orbit was so Apollo 13 that I really had to laugh. I'm certainly glad this crew is safely home and I'm sure that all involved were nervous about the damage done on takeoff. But is it really logical to believe that NASA put the first flight after Columbia in space without a fix for the insulation debris issue? Is it realistic to think that an organization teetering on the edge of irrelevancy and utter inconsequence would risk it all with THE SAME problem that hung them last time? I'm sorry, but I think they saw an opportunity to draw the American citizen into an edge-of-seat drama on this flight and took it. Shame on them for being so base or shame on them for not fixing the problem.

[rexallllsc]

No need for a reusable shuttle.

[Samdari]

No need for a reusable shuttle.

Aye. That proved more expensive than disposable craft.

[Qwikshot]

Aye. That proved more expensive than disposable craft.

Wasn't this also supposed to be a precursor to using space planes for travel? Wear and tear like that makes it less viable that we could use space planes to get to destinations faster like NYC to Sydney.