Ping: Wal-Mart Haters

[Franklinnoble]

Here's a little something for all you communists who think Wal-Mart is Satan's gift to labor and retail in America:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/09/05/AR2005090501598_pf.html


Wal-Mart at Forefront of Hurricane Relief
By Michael Barbaro and Justin Gillis
Washington Post Staff Writers
Tuesday, September 6, 2005; D01


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At 8 a.m. on Wednesday, as New Orleans filled with water, Wal-Mart chief executive H. Lee Scott Jr. called an emergency meeting of his top lieutenants and warned them he did not want a "measured response" to the hurricane.

"I want us to respond in a way appropriate to our size and the impact we can have," he said, according to an executive who attended the meeting. At the time, Wal-Mart had pledged $2 million to the relief efforts. "Should it be $10 million?" Scott asked.

Over the next few days, Wal-Mart's response to Katrina -- an unrivaled $20 million in cash donations, 1,500 truckloads of free merchandise, food for 100,000 meals and the promise of a job for every one of its displaced workers -- has turned the chain into an unexpected lifeline for much of the Southeast and earned it near-universal praise at a time when the company is struggling to burnish its image.

While state and federal officials have come under harsh criticism for their handling of the storm's aftermath, Wal-Mart is being held up as a model for logistical efficiency and nimble disaster planning, which have allowed it to quickly deliver staples such as water, fuel and toilet paper to thousands of evacuees.

In Brookhaven, Miss., for example, where Wal-Mart operates a vast distribution center, the company had 45 trucks full of goods loaded and ready for delivery before Katrina made landfall. To keep operating near capacity, Wal-Mart secured a special line at a nearby gas station to ensure that its employees could make it to work.

Wal-Mart has much to gain though its conspicuous largesse -- it has hundreds of stores in Gulf Coast states and an image problem across the country -- but even those who have criticized the company in the past are impressed.

"Wal-Mart has raised the ante for every company in the country," said Adam Hanft, chief executive of Hanft Unlimited Inc., a New York branding and marketing firm. "This is going to change the face of corporate giving."

Wal-Mart, in turn, has been showered with praise. Scott, Wal-Mart's folksy chief executive and its chief defender against a chorus of critics, has appeared on "Larry King Live" to discuss the chain's response to the storm and was singled out by former presidents George H.W. Bush and Bill Clinton during a joint news conference yesterday in Houston.

Clinton, who is leading a hurricane relief fundraising effort with Bush, said he hoped Wal-Mart's plan to allow relocating employees to take jobs at Wal-Marts across the country "will give some guidance to our members of Congress."

The praise comes at a time when the chain faces a series of lawsuits over allegations of wage-and-hour-law violations and gender discrimination.

But the chain's huge scale is suddenly an advantage in providing disaster relief. The same sophisticated supply chain that has turned the company into a widely feared competitor is now viewed as exactly what the waterlogged Gulf Coast needs.

The Bentonville, Ark., company is rushing to set up mini-Wal-Marts in storm-ravaged areas, handing out clothing, diapers, baby wipes, toothbrushes and food. With police escorts, it delivered two truckloads of ice and water into New Orleans. It is shipping 150 Internet-ready computers to shelters caring for evacuees.

During a tearful interview on "Meet the Press" on Sunday, Aaron F. Broussard, president of Jefferson Parish in the New Orleans suburbs, told host Tim Russert that if "the American government would have responded like Wal-Mart has responded, we wouldn't be in this crisis."

Not everything has gone perfectly for Wal-Mart. Several of its New Orleans stores were looted, and 126 of its stores in the region have been closed at some point. About 20 remain that way. "We did not try to stop the looting or take merchandise out" of the stores, company spokeswoman Mona Williams said in an e-mail.

Scott, who said he began to grasp the severity of the storm as he watched TV at home in with his wife last week, said he now participates in two daily conference calls dedicated to the hurricane, one at 7:30 a.m., the other at 5 p.m.

The challenges that arise during these calls, he said during an interview, include such matters as how to supply police officers with clean underwear and how to pay Gulf Coast Wal-Mart employees suddenly scattered across the country. "We have an infrastructure that allows us to react," Scott said last night.

Asked what motivated the chain's relief efforts and how he thought critics would respond, Scott said: "We have never claimed to be flawless. But on the other hand, we have always demanded that we as a company do care. If anything, this week has shown we do care."

He said: "We can't do any more than our own part. We are not the federal government. There is a portion we can do, and we can do it darn well."

As Katrina's winds were still dying down last week, preparations at the Brookhaven distribution center ensured that goods desperately needed by ravaged sections of the Gulf Coast started appearing on Wal-Mart shelves.

At the nearby gas station that had set up a special line for Wal-Mart workers, the general manager of the distribution center, Brent Hinton, pumped gas for nearly seven hours to keep up employee morale.

Referring to his colleagues at the distribution center, Hinton said yesterday, "We have become relief workers."

Cliff Brumfield, executive vice president of the Brookhaven-Lincoln County Chamber of Commerce, said he was impressed with Wal-Mart's preparations.

"They were ready before FEMA was," he said.

Gillis reported from Brookhaven, Miss.

<!-- start the copyright for the articles --> © 2005 The Washington Post Company

[WSUCougar]

Bravo. Nice to see such a decisive corporate response.

FYI: I hate Wal-Mart because of the neanderthal clientele.

[Raiders Army]

Wal-Mart being able to react appropriately is not surprising. They have a definite power structure that enables them to work quickly and efficiently....unlike the plethora of agencies that seem to have no one directing their efforts.

[Raiders Army]

Dola, and I hate Wal-Mart for its long lines at the checkout. Sam's Club, too.

[Karlifornia]

Kudos to Wal-Mart...now stop promoting censorship.

[Crapshoot]

That's some damn good efforts on their part. Yet, it does not excuse their labor violations and what not. I'm pro Wal-Mart, but they have plently of follibes and the steps they go to stop unions have been outright illegal at times (not that I care for unions, but people do have the right to join one).

[Buzzbee]

Bravo. Nice to see such a decisive corporate response.

FYI: I hate Wal-Mart because of the neanderthal clientele.
Humph. Me think you big hole of ass. Me hit you in wallet with lawsuit.

[Subby]

Satan's gift to retailing in America is Victoria's Secret, thankyouverymuch.

Thanks, Satan!

[Ksyrup]

Dola, and I hate Wal-Mart for its long lines at the checkout. Sam's Club, too.
Long lines at Wal-Mart? Sam's Club, yes, but Wal-Mart? I've never waited behind more than one full cart and someone with a few items, but usually either walk right up or have one person in front of me. And when shopping for only a couple of items, I'm in and out through the self-checkouts.

[Raiders Army]

Long lines at Wal-Mart? Sam's Club, yes, but Wal-Mart? I've never waited behind more than one full cart and someone with a few items, but usually either walk right up or have one person in front of me. And when shopping for only a couple of items, I'm in and out through the self-checkouts.
Don't want to threadjack, but obviously you've never lived on the U.S./Mexico border. :)

And it happens in upstate NY as well.

[Ksyrup]

I've been in more Wal-Marts than I care to admit - I'm sorry to say we visited Wal-Mart on Kauai more than 5 times - but you are correct, never in either of those places.

[stevew]

Long lines at Wal-Mart? Sam's Club, yes, but Wal-Mart? I've never waited behind more than one full cart and someone with a few items, but usually either walk right up or have one person in front of me. And when shopping for only a couple of items, I'm in and out through the self-checkouts.
Id strongly disagree with you, as i expect a 20 minute wait any time i get in a line.

[Buzzbee]

Long lines at Wal-Mart? Sam's Club, yes, but Wal-Mart? I've never waited behind more than one full cart and someone with a few items, but usually either walk right up or have one person in front of me. And when shopping for only a couple of items, I'm in and out through the self-checkouts.
You must shop at 3 am, cuz that's the ONLY time I've seen that happen around here. I'm pro Wal-Mart in terms of their capitalistic nature, but choose not to shop there because of the tremendously long checkout waits. 36 registers, but only 5 of them open. Only two people in front of me, but a 20 minute wait because the cashier doesn't know how to operate the register. No thanks. I'l go to Target where I have NEVER had to wait more than 5 minutes to check out, even with 4 or 5 people in front of me.

[JeeberD]

Long lines at Wal-Mart? Sam's Club, yes, but Wal-Mart? I've never waited behind more than one full cart and someone with a few items, but usually either walk right up or have one person in front of me. And when shopping for only a couple of items, I'm in and out through the self-checkouts.

I need to move to Tallahassee...

[Ksyrup]

Huh. Our main Wal-Mart here has at least 10 registers (usually more) open at any time, and usually you can't see any lines until you get near the actual register. Do you guys have the self checkout registers? That usually cuts the lines down pretty well.

[Raiders Army]

Huh. Our main Wal-Mart here has at least 10 registers (usually more) open at any time, and usually you can't see any lines until you get near the actual register. Do you guys have the self checkout registers? That usually cuts the lines down pretty well.
They had em in El Paso, but not here.

[JeeberD]

Yup, have and use the self check-out most of the time, but there's still usually some moron ahead of me who can't figure out how to scan his Wheaties.

[stevew]

Huh. Our main Wal-Mart here has at least 10 registers (usually more) open at any time, and usually you can't see any lines until you get near the actual register. Do you guys have the self checkout registers? That usually cuts the lines down pretty well.
Where i used to live, the self checkouts got shut down due to excessive fraud. The WalMart I currently frequent is not up to 21st century standards yet.

[HomerJSimpson]

You must shop at 3 am, cuz that's the ONLY time I've seen that happen around here. I'm pro Wal-Mart in terms of their capitalistic nature, but choose not to shop there because of the tremendously long checkout waits. 36 registers, but only 5 of them open. Only two people in front of me, but a 20 minute wait because the cashier doesn't know how to operate the register. No thanks. I'l go to Target where I have NEVER had to wait more than 5 minutes to check out, even with 4 or 5 people in front of me.


With you on all points. Don't hate Walmart, but I never go because of the lines.

[Ksyrup]

Maybe ours is not so crowded because at the time it was built (about 18 months ago?), it was the largest Wal-Mart in Florida. I don't think I've ever been in there and thought the place looked overly crowded or excessively busy.

[Ksyrup]

Wal-Mart has put a lot of effort into Tallahassee, I can tell you that. So much so, that Target just opened its second Tallahassee store within 2 miles of our Wal-Mart and didn't make it a SuperCenter (or Greatland, whatever they call it). They only have a small grocery section. I guess they figured they couldn't compete with Wal-Mart on the grocery side in this town.

[Flasch186]

kudos to Walmart

I hate Walmart because they strong arm their suppliers and lower the standards of the merchandise that pervades our homes while supporting the squallid conditions of many of the laborers in China (where over 80% of their products come from) and also pay many of their employess wages that are below the "living wage".

kudos to Walmart for their response, I think that that is wonderful.

[Buzzbee]

Yup, have and use the self check-out most of the time, but there's still usually some moron ahead of me who can't figure out how to scan his Wheaties.
Hey, I scanned it and it said to put it in the bagging area. I did, but the damn scale must be broken cuz it tells me there is an error and to wait for help from the assistant. Of course the assistant is helping the other moron who can't find where their cashback is dispensed, and won't help me next because after that she has to check the ID of grandma who is buying a six-pack of Coors Light.

So, just shut up and wait like the rest of us.

[sterlingice]

Nice move by WalMart. 1500 trucks worth of stuff. Wow.

Humph. Me think you big hole of ass. Me hit you in wallet with lawsuit.
Awesome! :D

SI

[Bubba Wheels]

kudos to Walmart

I hate Walmart because they strong arm their suppliers and lower the standards of the merchandise that pervades our homes while supporting the squallid conditions of many of the laborers in China (where over 80% of their products come from) and also pay many of their employess wages that are below the "living wage".

kudos to Walmart for their response, I think that that is wonderful.

Classic. Slams Walmart for a paragraph before giving them a pat on the back. So, do you hate them or praise them? Are they good or evil?

[sterlingice]

Classic. Slams Walmart for a paragraph before giving them a pat on the back. So, do you hate them or praise them? Are they good or evil?
Like most things, they tend to be a little from column A and a little from column B. Judging by his response, it's a bad company that did one good action.

SI

[Buzzbee]

Like most things, they tend to be a little from column A and a little from column B. Judging by his response, it's a bad company that did one good action.

SIYup. Flasch doesn't like Wal-Mart, but can recognize when they get something right.

[Bubba Wheels]

Well, from what I've heard Walmart came up biggest in donating by $23 million to next-highest Texaco who ponied up $7 million and going down from there. So the obvious thing to me is that if it were not for all the evil business practices by Walmart in the first place that $23 million would be maybe $0.

[Franklinnoble]

Like most things, they tend to be a little from column A and a little from column B. Judging by his response, it's a bad company that did one good action.

SI
I suppose he prefers the "good" companies that have done nothing. http://dynamic.gamespy.com/%7Efof/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

[sterlingice]

I'm not trying to get into a drawn out debate over it mainly because I'm not that well educated on the topic and, by that token, I think they are a little of both. But I was just playing translator since that's what you (BW) asked.

SI

[Tekneek]

My problem with Walmart is how they wrap themselves with the flag while inflating the trade deficit with China and urging the use of eminent domain to give them new "supercenters" on the cheap.

[Franklinnoble]

1. We all buy cheap goods from China. Wal Mart isn't the only place that sells the stuff - they're just the biggest.
2. Nearly every major retailer and business that needs large space uses the eminent domain "exploit." Better stay away from shopping malls and professional sporting events if this really bugs you.

[Tekneek]

1. We all buy cheap goods from China. Wal Mart isn't the only place that sells the stuff - they're just the biggest.
2. Nearly every major retailer and business that needs large space uses the eminent domain "exploit." Better stay away from shopping malls and professional sporting events if this really bugs you.

1. Oh, cool. They have over 10% of the trade deficit all to themselves and it is ok because everybody else is getting in on it. You are saying that we all buy cheap goods from China? How can you be so certain of this?
2. How many dress themselves up in red, white, and blue while they do it?

[Franklinnoble]

2. How many dress themselves up in red, white, and blue while they do it?
The last time I checked, they still play the national anthem before every professional sporting event in America.

[Subby]

Most companies trade on national pride. They would be stupid to do otherwise...

[Senator]

I love Wal-Mart due to the enormous amount of stocks I have bought.

[Raiders Army]

Wal-Mart is better than Amway.

[Galaxy]

This thread is de-reailing....:)

[Flasch186]

you had it right, i see the big picture but am not so blinded, like some on some topics, that I cant see whent hey also do something good. Being bad and doing something good is not mutually exclusive.

[Tekneek]

The last time I checked, they still play the national anthem before every professional sporting event in America.

How many sports teams own their arenas? What else could they have that comes through eminent domain? Only football teams have elaborate 'practice facilities', at least that I have seen.

Besides, that may be more out of tradition and league rules. There is no tradition in business that requires you to act "All American" while being a huge importer of communist goods and stealing land from others. If you want to be "All American", let's pay whatever the owner wants to sell for.

[Tekneek]

Most companies trade on national pride. They would be stupid to do otherwise...

Walmart would be more accurate if they marketed on the billions of dollars of goods they import from China and the money they saved by bribing local governments into stealing land through eminent domain. Walmart lies. That's all there is to it. You can say everybody in business lies, but it doesn't somehow erase the fact that Walmart lies. I don't think this $23 million was just for PR, but it wouldn't be too much money for Walmart to try and salvage their reputation. Their stock has been trading at a discount and is considered undervalued, and the reason appears to be their bad reputation.

[mauchow]

Walmart is up to over $40 million donated. Not too shabby.

[st.cronin]

My feelings on walmart have changed 180 degrees in the last year or so. I still don't like to shop there, as it's usually an unpleasant experience, but I have really changed the way I think about the company.

[Ragone]

God.. That money was earmarked for the Royals Payroll next year! is 0-162 possible next season? we'll certainly find out

[Galaxy]

Blah...
Wal-Mart donating has nothing to do with the company itself. It's great that they are donating, but it's also great PR for them.

[Raiders Army]

Blah...
Wal-Mart donating has nothing to do with the company itself. It's great that they are donating, but it's also great PR for them.
Donating a couple million is great PR...donating what they gave is more than good PR.

[albionmoonlight]

I have not read all this thread, so forgive me if someone mentioned it, but CNBC has a two hour documentary on Wal Mart that they have been showing. It's pretty balanced--showing the good and the bad. No matter how you feel about Wal-Mart, it is interesting to see how much of an effect they have on American life.

[Galaxy]

I have not read all this thread, so forgive me if someone mentioned it, but CNBC has a two hour documentary on Wal Mart that they have been showing. It's pretty balanced--showing the good and the bad. No matter how you feel about Wal-Mart, it is interesting to see how much of an effect they have on American life.

I saw that too. I really don't have a problem with Wal-Mart, hell I shop there (not that I like it, just more of it's only place I can afford). I just don't like that they are repressive in employees in terms of forming unions, the harrasment and discrimination suits they are getting that sound legit and going to trial, ect. I personally, don't think Wal-Mart will ride the "wave" forever.

[Klinglerware]

To echo the sentiments of some of the responses--I think it is great that Wal-Mart is donating it's money and leveraging its infrastructure to help in the relief effort.

With all of this being said, why the orgasmic cheerleading over the $23 million donation? I heard that the Yankees donated $1 million last night, and that is probably a greater percentage of the Yankee's revenue than Wal-Mart's donation. Hell, an alum donated $5 million to bankroll my alma mater's hurricane response efforts (free tuition, housing, etc.)--and he's a private citizen.

It's not a freakin' contest, every little bit helps no matter the source...

[timmynausea]

I read somewhere that the ammount that Wal-Mart donated compared to how much they make in a year is the equivalent of a family with $10,000 donating $1.70.
I still think it's great that they're helping and all, I just thought that was an interesting fact.

[HomerJSimpson]

I read somewhere that the ammount that Wal-Mart donated compared to how much they make in a year is the equivalent of a family with $10,000 donating $1.70.
I still think it's great that they're helping and all, I just thought that was an interesting fact.


More affective as a family with $100,000 donating $17.10. If a family is only making $10,000, then a buck-seventy is something.

[timmynausea]

More affective as a family with $100,000 donating $17.10. If a family is only making $10,000, then a buck-seventy is something.

The average Wal-Mart employee certainly makes a lot closer to $10,000 than $100,000 but that's a different discussion, I guess.

[Klinglerware]

I read somewhere that the ammount that Wal-Mart donated compared to how much they make in a year is the equivalent of a family with $10,000 donating $1.70.
I still think it's great that they're helping and all, I just thought that was an interesting fact.

I'm not trying to belittle the donation since it is a lot of money in one shot and Wal-Mart is also leveraging their infrastructure, but it does put the donation in perspective. It is the equivalent of an average family donating 5 bucks or so, so let us not make it out to be anything more than it is...

But again, every little bit contributes...

[Galaxy]

I saw on TV today that Qatar and UAE each donated $100 million.

[Jesse_Ewiak]

According to FN, that makes the fact they treat their women like shite perfectly OK because they did one good thing.

[Galaxy]

According to FN, that makes the fact they treat their women like shite perfectly OK because they did one good thing.

Qatar and UAE are pretty good in terms of treating it citzens, likely the only two "progressive" Islamic Middle Eastern countries. Saudi Arabia's royal rulers are scum thought.

[Bubba Wheels]

Problem with those that hate Walmart is that I could make pretty much the same argument regarding those that buy non-American automobiles. You support non-Union workers/companies when you do that and then on top of it all that money is funneled out of the U.S. back to those countries of origin.

The non-American companies build their new factories in southern right-to-work states that can keep unions out and the vast majority of the auto parts come from the home countries further eroding the U.S. industrial base trying to compete.

Now I'm not telling you that you should buy American, that's completely your choice. Just noting the irony that many of those same Walmart bashers wouldn't consider giving up their own prized Honda or Toyota.

[Tekneek]

Now I'm not telling you that you should buy American, that's completely your choice. Just noting the irony that many of those same Walmart bashers wouldn't consider giving up their own prized Honda or Toyota.

That may be the case with some, but I doubt it is as many as you think. Even if it is a lot of people, how many do you think have models that the US manufacturers refuse to even compete with? It's hard to "buy American" if you want a 4-door hybrid car. They have simply chose not to compete in that market.

[Flasch186]

Problem with those that hate Walmart is that I could make pretty much the same argument regarding those that buy non-American automobiles. You support non-Union workers/companies when you do that and then on top of it all that money is funneled out of the U.S. back to those countries of origin.

The non-American companies build their new factories in southern right-to-work states that can keep unions out and the vast majority of the auto parts come from the home countries further eroding the U.S. industrial base trying to compete.

Now I'm not telling you that you should buy American, that's completely your choice. Just noting the irony that many of those same Walmart bashers wouldn't consider giving up their own prized Honda or Toyota.

Jeep for me baby!! but it is making some strange noises lately near the 100k mark. Taking it in next thursday and hoping its a cheap fix.

[CraigSca]

This whole buying Toyota/Honda while hating Walmart is garbage. By the same token, I could criticize Flasch for getting poor gas mileage on his Jeep and therefore supplying the damn oil companies.

Just try to do what's right at home. Take care of your own backyard. And, like Flasch, admit when someone on the other side actually does good. Partisanship makes my hair fall out.

[Flasch186]

This whole buying Toyota/Honda while hating Walmart is garbage. By the same token, I could criticize Flasch for getting poor gas mileage on his Jeep and therefore supplying the damn oil companies.

Just try to do what's right at home. Take care of your own backyard. And, like Flasch, admit when someone on the other side actually does good. Partisanship makes my hair fall out.

keep in mind, the Jeep was a hand me down from my parents...so not much choice there, im just hoping it drives forever OHHHHH also keep in mind I work 4 doors down from my house so gas rarely plays a role.
:D

[Galaxy]

This whole buying Toyota/Honda while hating Walmart is garbage. By the same token, I could criticize Flasch for getting poor gas mileage on his Jeep and therefore supplying the damn oil companies.

Just try to do what's right at home. Take care of your own backyard. And, like Flasch, admit when someone on the other side actually does good. Partisanship makes my hair fall out.

I don't understand the Toyota/Honda argument. Aren't they more "American-made" (not brand, but made) then US-based brands?

[Bubba Wheels]

I don't understand the Toyota/Honda argument. Aren't they more "American-made" (not brand, but made) then US-based brands?

I stand by my statements. The point of the comparision is in regards to the union pay scale and the affiliated suppliers. Non-union plants in the south pay decent wages at present to keep the unions out. But if the unions get broken in the north then expect those wages to go down as a result. Just talking in broad generalities here, not going to cover every exception.

The bigger problem is the affiliated auto suppliers. U.S. based suppliers tend to be union (the bigger ones, anyways, like Visteon, ect.) The non-U.S. brands tend to get many or most parts from overseas even when being built in the U.S. And then the profits from the car sales get funneled back to the home country.

Again, not saying you should only buy American, just that when you drive your Toyota to the non-Walmart store to buy your goods your not being as 'alturistic' or friendly to the U.S. worker as you think you are. Also, with the Japanese getting record profits at the expense of U.S. auto companies Japan's 'gift' of $1 million for the Katrina victims is really 'quaint." I don't think that would even cover fuel costs for a week of flying protection for them from our aircraft carriers. :rolleyes:

[Joe Canadian]

Good for Wal-Mart... but this wonderfull gesture doesn't instantly forgive them for the bad things they've done and are still doing for labour, competition, small business, trade, etc.

[Galaxy]

Good for Wal-Mart... but this wonderfull gesture doesn't instantly forgive them for the bad things they've done and are still doing for labour, competition, small business, trade, etc.

It's a mix bag. I agree some of the tatics are terrible, but I believe what comes around will come around. As for small business argument, they don't provide better compensation (and less, in regards of promotions) then Wal-Mart does.