Historically pathetic Sports Cities

[RendeR]

As the titel says, what city can lay claim to being the most pathetic when it comes to proffesional sports franchises?

I post this because everywhere I read things coming from Detroit fans...Is Detroit the great wasteland? I'd say no because the Red Wings keep them afloat. So, what do you guys think?
I'm really not sure who I think is worst.

[PackerFanatic]

And plus with how well the Pistons have been the past few years...and the Red Wings, like you said, are always pretty decent. Not sure what to say about the Lions...

[ISiddiqui]

Phoenix, AZ, simply for the Cardinals.

[RendeR]

Phoenix, AZ, simply for the Cardinals.
I thought of them, but the Diamondbacks won a world series recently, can one championship for a no-nothing team save a city from this label?

[ISiddiqui]

Hmmm.. forgot about the D-Backs (see how much of an impression they've made? ;)).

What about New Orleans, which hadn't won jack? Then again, they don't have a baseball or hockey team. I wonder if all four teams (or 3 of four teams) should be a prerequisite.

[Swaggs]

Interesting idea.

Has any city, with multiple professional teams, not won a title?

[Swaggs]

Maybe Cleveland? No NBA titles in their history. No Super Bowl titles (although they won several NFL titles in the 50's and 60's). Their NFL team was moved (stolen?) by another city. And they haven't won a World Series since 1948.

[sooner333]

Interesting idea.

Has any city, with multiple professional teams, not won a title?

I'm going to go with Buffalo

[Tigercat]

Yea I am afraid the Saints alone should have us up there. I remember ESPN did a intensive analysis of all major sports teams a few years ago, and sure enough the Saints were the least successful current franchise under their formula.

And how about those Hornets! They were horrid last year, they move to Oklahoma and suddenly are playing an exciting brand of basketball and winning at the same time! And then we find out they won't be returning till 2007 at the earliest(and maybe if ever). Ugh.

[BYU 14]

Phoenix, AZ, simply for the Cardinals.

Agree, very few hardcore Sports fans here, at least for the home teams, due probably to the fact that half of the population is transplants :)

When teams are winning it becomes fashionable to attend games where the "Fashion" fans spend more time chatting then watching the game. When local teams are losing (Cardinals especially) the crowds are terrible and in alot of cases the visiting team outdraws the good guys. This is especially true in Football where the Raiders, Packers, Vikings, Cowboys, Bears etc always outnumber Cards fans by at least 3-1.

The only team that seems to go against this trend is the Coyotes, who have had large/near sellout crowds of mostly home team fans this year despite not doing so well.

[ThunderingHERD]

And how about those Hornets! They were horrid last year, they move to Oklahoma and suddenly are playing an exciting brand of basketball and winning at the same time! And then we find out they won't be returning till 2007 at the earliest(and maybe if ever). Ugh.

Yes, boohoo to New Orleans for the Hornets. :rolleyes:

When I was in grade school, I used to listen to Hornets preseason games on the radio and attempt to keep a detailed box score.

[Desnudo]

I think Seattle could make an argument. One basketball title back in the seventies. Maybe they don't have a long enough history, and the fans aren't really hardcore enough, to be truely tormented, but there's been some real bad teams playing there. Plus they had to go to the Kingdome for games for many years. That alone should count for something.

[MrBug708]

Washington won a title in the 90's...albeit the football team isnt very good

[Butter]

Maybe Cleveland? No NBA titles in their history. No Super Bowl titles (although they won several NFL titles in the 50's and 60's). Their NFL team was moved (stolen?) by another city. And they haven't won a World Series since 1948.

I think it has to be Cleveland.... 3 of the 4 "major" sports, and no titles in over 40 years. I think you have to be combine number of teams in the major sports with length of drought in a comparison like this. Seattle might have an argument too, but less so after this year.

[mrsimperless]

Indy hasn't won a championship since the Pacers were in the ABA. The Colts only championship belongs to the city of Baltimore IMO.

[sachmo71]

Yea I am afraid the Saints alone should have us up there. I remember ESPN did a intensive analysis of all major sports teams a few years ago, and sure enough the Saints were the least successful current franchise under their formula.

And how about those Hornets! They were horrid last year, they move to Oklahoma and suddenly are playing an exciting brand of basketball and winning at the same time! And then we find out they won't be returning till 2007 at the earliest(and maybe if ever). Ugh.


http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/images/icons/icon14.gif

[Honolulu_Blue]

Did ESPN also do the most cursed sports cities thing? I think Cleveland ended up number 1 on that list or good reason. This was before the Red Sox won the World Series so, of course, they had Boston ranked ridiculously high despite the recent success of the Patriots and past success of the Bruins and Celtics.

[JeeberD]

Houston used to be on the list until Hakeem turned it from Choke City to Clutch City.

[Kodos]

You gotta remember the Bengals!

Atlanta is pretty cursed too. (Who cares about baseball...)

[ISiddiqui]

I think it has to be Cleveland.... 3 of the 4 "major" sports, and no titles in over 40 years. I think you have to be combine number of teams in the major sports with length of drought in a comparison like this. Seattle might have an argument too, but less so after this year.
The Indians, have, however, had some recent success. They didn't win the whole thing, but came close in the mid 90s and had some scary playoff teams. Now they are building back up to having a pretty good team.

[cartman]

Chicago is another city that has not experienced, historically, not a lot of team sport success. The Bears have won one Super Bowl, the Blackhawks haven't won a cup in forever, The Sox won last year for the first time in forever, the Cubs haven't won in forever. The Bulls did win 6 in 8 years, but that was it for their existence. So if you add up all of those sporting years and divide by the number of titles, it's not a very big number.

[ice4277]

I can't really see how anybody could look past New Orleans. Phoenix maybe, but at least the Suns have had moderate success.

[Tigercat]

Yes, boohoo to New Orleans for the Hornets. :rolleyes:

When I was in grade school, I used to listen to Hornets preseason games on the radio and attempt to keep a detailed box score.

You do realize that New Orleans didn't suddenly steal a NBA franchise? Back in the day, New Orleans had one of the best NBA supporting fan bases for a team called the New Orleans Jazz, even though they were never any good. Of course they later moved to Utah where they would later build competitive teams.

Then, in the early 90s The Timberwolves tease returning the NBA to New Orleans, only to use the city to get a better deal. I still have a New Orleans Timberwolves shirt somewhere.
Later on, the Spurs do the same thing to New Orleans.
Grizzlies shop around, and New Orleans ends up playing second to Memphis.

We finally land a team in the Hornets, they decide to rebuild the team in New Orleans, suck last year while New Orleans people are still getting used to being a basketball city again. Now they are good in Oklahoma City, and OK City media and some in the Hornets organization like to push it in N.O. fans faces that a winning team is drawing better crowds there than they did here last year. With the implication that it would be better off if they didn't return.

[Apathetic Lurker]

I'm going to go with Buffalo

I seem to recall them winning some AFL titles in the sixties(64,65). Plus thier minor league team won some kind of trophy .. Then there is a Lacrosse title in there .

[sooner333]

We finally land a team in the Hornets, they decide to rebuild the team in New Orleans, suck last year while New Orleans people are still getting used to being a basketball city again. Now they are good in Oklahoma City, and OK City media and some in the Hornets organization like to push it in N.O. fans faces that a winning team is drawing better crowds there than they did here last year. With the implication that it would be better off if they didn't return.

New Orleans was just as good in the Hornet's first year, but the attendence was worse and they didn't even sell out some playoff games. I'm not sure if "it" would be better off if they didn't return, but probably for a business sense, it would be.

[Tigercat]

New Orleans was just as good in the Hornet's first year, but the attendence was worse and they didn't even sell out some playoff games. I'm not sure if "it" would be better off if they didn't return, but probably for a business sense, it would be.

Who were the two worst attended teams last year? Charlotte and New Orleans. The two cities with the newest teams that were also bad teams Two cities that have to get used to their new franchises, especially when they have other competeing pro sports franchises.

OK City doesn't have competition, so the draw is there right away. But of course the Bobcat's weren't forced away to a city that craves an immediate team, so no one questions their potential support for an NBA team(nor should anyone do so anyway).

I have no doubt whatsoever that the Hornets, without Katrina, would be drawing in the top 15 this year. (16.5k+) With the city having gotten more used to their team, with a new uptempo style, and a dedication to being better in the future. (NONE of which was there in the first and second seasons.) But of course we never got that chance to show that, and may never get the chance. To some, we were dead in the water before and will continue to be so. Hopefully we at least prove the second half wrong.

[Masked]

New Orleans was just as good in the Hornet's first year, but the attendence was worse and they didn't even sell out some playoff games. I'm not sure if "it" would be better off if they didn't return, but probably for a business sense, it would be.Ticket prices are up to 40% lower in Oklahoma City which makes it very difficult to make a direct comparison between the two cities.

[sooner333]

I have no doubt whatsoever that the Hornets, without Katrina, would be drawing in the top 15 this year. (16.5k+) With the city having gotten more used to their team, with a new uptempo style, and a dedication to being better in the future. (NONE of which was there in the first and second seasons.) But of course we never got that chance to show that, and may never get the chance. To some, we were dead in the water before and will continue to be so. Hopefully we at least prove the second half wrong.

I don't buy it, the Hornets were in the PLAYOFFS, the future was then as far as getting to the postseason. I know ticket sales were up in NO for this year, however, and the prices for OKC are the same as they were to be in New Orleans for this season. I'm not saying the Hornets are going to stay in Oklahoma City...they probably won't, and I won't be pissed or anything because nothing was expected more than just one or two seasons in OKC before moving back when the whole thing started, but I am tiring of New Orleans people making excuses for attendence in past seasons...I think we'll give a pass on last year because they were so bad, but what about the first year when a playoff game couldn't even garner a sellout.

[SnDvls]

I'd have to say Atlanta. They don't support the Hawks or Falcons and from the media reports they don't support the Braves unless they are in the WS. Not sure on the Thrashers.

Cardinals won't ever have a true "fan" following with the number of locals they've screwed over their 10+ years here. We have the D-Backs, Suns and Coyotes just in pro teams. Then there is the FBR Open (golf) the Rattlers (AFL) Roadrunners (AHL) Mercury (WNBA) and Sting (NLL) and spring training to take money from the Arizona State University fans as well. Not to mention the weather.

[bbor]

Maybe Cleveland? No NBA titles in their history. No Super Bowl titles (although they won several NFL titles in the 50's and 60's). Their NFL team was moved (stolen?) by another city. And they haven't won a World Series since 1948.

Don't forget that wonderfull NHL franchise they had...the Cleveland Barons


They lasted all of 2 or 3 seasons without accomplishing anything.

[Tigercat]

I don't buy it, the Hornets were in the PLAYOFFS, the future was then as far as getting to the postseason. I know ticket sales were up in NO for this year, however, and the prices for OKC are the same as they were to be in New Orleans for this season. I'm not saying the Hornets are going to stay in Oklahoma City...they probably won't, and I won't be pissed or anything because nothing was expected more than just one or two seasons in OKC before moving back when the whole thing started, but I am tiring of New Orleans people making excuses for attendence in past seasons...I think we'll give a pass on last year because they were so bad, but what about the first year when a playoff game couldn't even garner a sellout.

And what about the Bobcats? Charlotte got to HAND PICK a NEW franchise, giving it their own name and everything. And Charlotte is a hotbed of basketball. Yet they were in the bottom 2 with attendence last year. New Orleans got a franchise with someone elses name on it, that underachieved its first year because its major stars could never stay healthy. Not to mention New Orleans hadn't had high quality basketball like Charlotte has had over the years to ready the population.

New Orleans has sold out the freakin Superdome in losing seasons with the Saints when they have NEVER EVER shown promise of diddly squat. Meanwhile cities like Pheonix with 10x the econmic power and a similiar team can't sniff a sellout. New Orleans holds attendence records in college basketball regular season games. New Orleans supported the Jazz better than most NBA teams when the Jazz would play in run down old buildings.

No city will show more diehard support for a professional sports franchise with little in return than New Orleans. New Orleans hadn't had major basketball in 25 years and already had a major sports franchise in the city, unlike OK City which had nothing before the NBA came to town.

If you doubt that New Orleans would have sold out a subpar or better franchise when given time to finally make the Hornets their own like the Saints are, you are sadly, sadly mistaken. Just as Charlotte will sell out NBA basketball again when they feel the Bobcats are their own again.

Winning and having a professional team thats the town's only major sports attraction sells seats out temporarily. Sports fan loyalty sells seats forever.

[Swaggs]

Don't forget that wonderfull NHL franchise they had...the Cleveland Barons


They lasted all of 2 or 3 seasons without accomplishing anything.

I didn't forget. I just never knew. ;)

[LloydLungs]

I think we'll give a pass on last year because they were so bad, but what about the first year when a playoff game couldn't even garner a sellout.

Well, I know at least one of those Sixers playoff games were sold out in 2003, possibly more. Obviously playoff games ought to be sold out all the time, though New Orleans is certainly nowhere near the only NBA market that failed on that account.

New Orleans is not a great NBA market and I don't think it ever will be, and OKC probably is a better one, especially now. But N.O. is not the worst market either and takes more flak than it deserves. Having lived here all my life, without Katrina I am supremely confident that this year's team would be drawing the best numbers of their four-year run here. We sat through three years of Davis, Mashburn, and Magloire sulking like babies, missing months for sprained pinky fingers, pouting... as the team nosedived over three seasons to the point where Matt Freije, hands down the worst NBA player I have ever seen, started for a solid month. The reward for enduring all this was supposed to be Chris Paul, and I am certain New Orleans would be enjoying the hell out of him this year.

In terms of the overall topic of this thread, I'm unclear on how we're classifying a city as a pathetic sports town. Are we basing it on team performance or attendance/enthusiasm? If it's the latter, New Orleans shouldn't even be in the conversation, as its support and zeal for the Saints has been incredible over their history considering how terrible they've been. If it's the former, yeah, New Orleans franchises lose like NOBODY's business! We're number 1.

[BuffaloHuskey]

http://www.donovanindex.com/

This is a decent site to use as a guide for this topic

[ISiddiqui]

I'd have to say Atlanta. They don't support the Hawks or Falcons and from the media reports they don't support the Braves unless they are in the WS. Not sure on the Thrashers.
The OP wasn't talking fan support, but success of the franchises. The Braves, even though have suffered from lack of fan support, have won a whooooole lot. That in itself negates any talk of patheticness.

Oh, and FTR, the Falcons have had sellouts ever since Vick began playing full time, IIRC. As for the others, well... though the Thrashers games I've gone to have been fairly well attended.

[sterlingice]

Houston used to be on the list until Hakeem turned it from Choke City to Clutch City.And that's why they'll erect a 150' life size (;)) statue of him as a memorial upon his death. Either that or a Mt Rushmore with him, Warren Moon, Jeff Bagwell, and Craig Biggio. Now, if only there were mountains nearby...

SI