A new chapter begins (work-related)

[JonInMiddleGA]

Dunno why I'm posting this particularly, other than the simple fact that I can.

Although there are at least a few people here who know, and probably others who have figured it out over time (outnumbered greatly by those who couldn't care less), I've generally avoided specifically naming the primary client that our company served.

Well, I guess I don't have to worry about that anymore, not since Friday when our media vendors began receiving notice from us that "effective June 23rd,
{our agency} has resigned as Agency of Record for Pennington Seed Company".

What that basically means is that we just walked away from the account that has been our bread & butter since we started working under our own auspices. And before you ask, we haven't suddenly taken leave of our senses. Without going into too much detail, things had reached the point that we really didn't have much choice due to some post-merger internal politics on their end that turned them into a company that we no longer felt we could trust enough to work with. And when you work in six & seven figure increments, where you're financially responsible for the ads you placed on their behalf & rely on them to then pay you for what they instructed you to buy, well ... that requires a certain amount of trust.

Now, we'll focus our attention of the two new clients on the roster, another that should be coming on board in about 60 days, and whatever else we turn up while busting our butts working on "new business".

Anyway, I didn't bring this up to tell some sordid story of the corporate world, I just thought it'd be kind of cool to finally say outright that if you saw or heard any spots for Pennington Seed (most recently "I'm George Toma, and I've been the head turf consultant for every Super Bowl ever played") or for Rebel Seed, or any of the various products under those brand names then I'm almost certainly responsible for where you saw it or heard it.

Not only for the choice in networks/stations but in a lot of cases, also for the production of the many of the radio spots which I worked as creative director on, as well as helping with the scripts for many of the spots in the past 6 years and in a few cases even provided the voice for the radio spots
(Kansas City in Spring 04 IIRC probably the largest market that I voiced for them, as well as several other cases where both time & budget were short)

Among the other notable projects that we were involved in were the introduction of HGTV personality Paul James as a spokesman for the brand, their status as the Official Grass Seed of several NASCAR tracks, and the concept of "Team Pennington" bulls in the PBR (For the record, contrary to what was published in at least one source, the idea of putting a corporate logo on a bull's butt came from our son. Not from a cattleman, not from the sponsor, but rather from a then-four year old child. And that's the God's honest truth behind that particular idea).

Like I said, I know most of you probably don't care but after trying to be pretty careful about naming the client for so long, I figured I might as well at least take advantage of the opportunity not to worry about it any more.

[Crapshoot]

JIMGA, don't know if it will make you feel better or not (if you're like most ad men - probably not :D ), but the only "name" I recognize in that is NASCAR. Do you guys stick to the South in your advertising ?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Do you guys stick to the South in your advertising ?

Pennington is actually the largest packager of grass seed in the world, and the ads have been fully national (i.e. network) for the past year. Before that they were running market-by-market but were scattered across about 2/3rds of the country (basically the areas that are part of the "fescue belt").

We ran heavily on the ESPN family of networks in Spring 06, Fall 05, and
Spring 05, were on radio with Sean Hannity nationally for 6 weeks this spring, and were on several of the highest rated CBS college football games nationally last fall (including the first spot break of the primetime Tenn-Florida game, which stands to date as the most seen commercial in company history, not to mention in my career ;) )

The Rebel brand is still more regional than national, although distribution & ads have been as far west as Texas for the past several years, with the Carolinas, Virginia, and Maryland probably their strongest areas. That's similar to the core markets of the Pennington brand prior to their growth of the past few years.

But I'm not deterred ... every ad campaign misses somebody ... at least now I know who we missed ;)

[ISiddiqui]

Hmmm.. sorry Jon, but I don't recall Pennington or Rebel Seed companies on my ads. But maybe I just tuned out all grass seed commericals (I don't remember any to tell the truth).

[SirFozzie]

But I'm not deterred ... every ad campaign misses somebody ... at least now I know who we missed ;)

Ya know.. the way you say that makes it sound like the next line is.. "Now don't go anywhere, our staff of highly trained ninjas will be by shortly to make you watch our ads. repeatedly." :D

[cuervo72]

Well...I too have to admit to not recognizing the brand. :)

[JonInMiddleGA]

But maybe I just tuned out all grass seed commericals (I don't remember any to tell the truth).

That's actually quite possible, and not entirely uncommon.

One of the things we learned about the product category over the years was that there was only so much influence advertising could actually have.

The research on grass seed always came back the same.
#1 influencer in brand purchase decision: price point
#2 influence in brand purchase decision: past experience with a brand
and then a noticeable drop off to
#3 influence in brand purchase decision: top of mind awareness at point of sale

If your not a grass seed buyer, or if you're dominantly driven by #1 or #2, then typically you never get down to the #3 influence. The decision is basically already made & it then becomes very easy to tune out our message
(or Scott's or any of the regional brands, etc.)

[ISiddiqui]

These ads weren't on Lifetime or anything, were they? ;)

[JonInMiddleGA]

Well...I too have to admit to not recognizing the brand. :)

Now given your Maryland location, and then checking your age in your profile,
I'll admit that this kind of bothers me a little bit.

I don't recall off-hand, but if you wouldn't mind answering ... are you in the Baltimore TV market?

If so, you should have actually gotten fairly tired of seeing the Rebel TV spots this past spring, or at least you should have if you watched the local morning news shows Mon-Fri.

[sovereignstar]

These ads weren't on Lifetime or anything, were they? ;)

Maybe OLN.. I don't have OLN.

[Radii]

(most recently "I'm George Toma, and I've been the head turf consultant for every Super Bowl ever played")


That one sounds familier!

[JonInMiddleGA]

Maybe OLN.. I don't have OLN.

Oddly enough, I never used OLN except on rare occasions in a few local markets. Looked at them nationally several times but ultimately they were simply overpriced for what they delivered versus the other options.

Incidentally, lest anybody worry about feeling as though they're piling on or anything ... in research only about half of even targeted consumers (those who had made a grass seed purchase in the past year) recalled seeing/hearing any ads for any seed brand. And some of those actually "recalled" hearing ads for products that either didn't exist or hadn't been advertised. Our own recall was usually in the 20's to 30's, depending upon the market. And that's actually better than I would have probably hoped for given the budget constraints we worked under versus the spending of our primary competition. I can't get into the actual numbers but we were heavily outspent every year but the retail sales figures were several times closer than the ad spending figures. (Basically we got more out of ours than they got out of theirs)

[SirFozzie]

Never heard of it up here, Jon, But I don't watch golf or motorsports (basically watch the foreign sports and the Sox, and that's about it)

[Buccaneer]

Pennington Seed Company??? That's where you lost me.

[Craptacular]

Is Paul James as f%$ed up as he appears to be on TV?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Never heard of it up here, Jon, But I don't watch golf or motorsports (basically watch the foreign sports and the Sox, and that's about it)

Up there, most of the energy was devoted to the Lofts brand. I worked on that once, maybe Spring 2004 if memory serves, and placed some radio for them including Sox on WEEI (campaigns were radio only at that point).

[JonInMiddleGA]

Is Paul James as f%$ed up as he appears to be on TV?

Paul is a hoot. A genuinely nice guy all in all, although I will say that what you see on television is quite similar to Paul off-camera.

The funniest thing about working with him though had to be my wife's stories of being at a public appearance he made for the company & having to help him fend off would-be groupies. A lot of them had blue hair mind you, but they were intense in their, umm, desire to get his attention.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Pennington Seed Company??? That's where you lost me.

You sir are excused.

Colorado is outside the fescue belt, and fescue is grass type that received the vast majority of the dollars we worked with. I've never placed a dime in Colorado for them and standing alone (without any local spots in support) the national campaign wasn't heavy enough to have made any impression on you.

Although considering how many dollars we dropped on weekday morning Sportscenters, it would have been nice if it at least rang a bell

[CraigSca]

To make you feel better, I have definitely heard of Pennington. Now...the last time I bought seed - are they the ones that cover their seed in the blue stuff to make it less palatable to birds? That's the one I bought.

[JonInMiddleGA]

To make you feel better, I have definitely heard of Pennington. Now...the last time I bought seed - are they the ones that cover their seed in the blue stuff to make it less palatable to birds? That's the one I bought.

:) :) :cool: :) :)

"Penkoting makes the difference"

[Franklinnoble]

I've never heard of them, either. I've lived for the last four years in the Sacramento market, and the last ten prior to that in Phoenix, so that might explain it.

[Mac Howard]

:) :) :cool: :) :)

"Penkoting makes the difference"

Good to know you're making a difference, eh Jon? :)

Incidentally what happened with your youngster's school choice?

[Franklinnoble]

I've never heard of them, either. I've lived for the last four years in the Sacramento market, and the last ten prior to that in Phoenix, so that might explain it.

Although... my wife tells me she watches that Paul James dude on TV all the time.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I've never heard of them, either. I've lived for the last four years in the Sacramento market, and the last ten prior to that in Phoenix, so that might explain it.

You, likewise, are excused. Pennington operates in a lot of the west under the name Seeds West, with product/brand names including Princess 77, Cheyenne, Sahara, and about a half dozen other bermuda grass blends, as well as Zenith (zoysia), and Cody (buffalograss).

[JonInMiddleGA]

Good to know you're making a difference, eh Jon? :)

Incidentally what happened with your youngster's school choice?

Our first choice (Athens Academy, the best & only secular private school in the area, other than the Montessori school) was filled beyond capacity in his grade (3rd) and the next grade ahead as well. We're almost certain to remain on the waiting list there for two years and then his prospects for receiving an invitation become very good. He absolutely aced their entrance exam and the school adds another class (23 students) at the 5th grade level, so

In the meantime, he'll be attending St. Joseph's, the Catholic school I mentioned in the earlier thread. At his grade level they actually have slightly higher test scores than our original choice and we've gotten good vibes from our meetings with them & from his "shadowing" day at the school, so we're pretty optimistic that this will be at worst a good place to "park" him for a couple of years & at best somewhere that he'll really end up thriving & happy, maybe even to the extent that he could stay there through 7th grade.

Thanks for remembering, and for asking.

[Franklinnoble]

You, likewise, are excused. Pennington operates in a lot of the west under the name Seeds West, with product/brand names including Princess 77, Cheyenne, Sahara, and about a half dozen other bermuda grass blends, as well as Zenith (zoysia), and Cody (buffalograss).

I remember a big deal being made of the zoysia grass they were trying to grow inside Bank One Ballpark years ago... other than that, nothing rings a bell.

Then again, I have ten acres of horse pasture for a yard here... I'm not really in the market for grass seed. Anything my horses don't eat I'd rather not deal with - I can't even stand having to mow it.

[wade moore]

FWIW Jon, I'm very familiar with the Rebel brand name, although not the Pennington seed company... I can't remember specific ads, but when I go to Lowe's or wherever I always gravitate to the Rebel brand over others because I "recognize the name"...

So yeah, I KNOW I've seen ads, I just can't picture them specifically... and, it has definately had an impact on my decision making - when trying to recover the lawn on this house, my first house, I bought Rebel ;)...

[wade moore]

Dola: And based on location, age, etc. I am probably pretty squarely in your target audience.

[Passacaglia]

JIMGA, don't know if it will make you feel better or not (if you're like most ad men - probably not :D ), but the only "name" I recognize in that is NASCAR. Do you guys stick to the South in your advertising ?

CBS Football games are usually SEC, right? While the broadcast may be national, I bet the viewership is definitely more weighted to the South.

I too, have never heard of Pennington seed, though my age and location probably put me outside the fescue belt or whatever.

Does anyone else really want to know what products that never existed people claim to have seen advertised?

[flere-imsaho]

Except for Scott's, I'm not sure if I've ever seen a seed advertisement. I'm 33, live in suburban Chicago, and actually just planted some fescue too!

[cuervo72]

Now given your Maryland location, and then checking your age in your profile,
I'll admit that this kind of bothers me a little bit.

I don't recall off-hand, but if you wouldn't mind answering ... are you in the Baltimore TV market?

If so, you should have actually gotten fairly tired of seeing the Rebel TV spots this past spring, or at least you should have if you watched the local morning news shows Mon-Fri.

You'll be happy to hear then than I don't really associate with the Baltimore market, but the DC market (our cable carries both markets, but satellite just DC...and I only watch satellite these days). I don't watch morning news shows either - get up, shower, drive 40 minutes to Gettysburg. So probably not a surprise that these missed me.

[wade moore]

You'll be happy to hear then than I don't really associate with the Baltimore market, but the DC market (our cable carries both markets, but satellite just DC...and I only watch satellite these days). I don't watch morning news shows either - get up, shower, drive 40 minutes to Gettysburg. So probably not a surprise that these missed me.

I've always thought of Gettysburg as a town to visit, not to work in ;)...

[Subby]

Did you guys place ads on SportsTalk 980 in DC? I have definitely heard of Rebel, but have tivo and fast forward through tv commercials - so it would have been on the radio...

[JonInMiddleGA]

FWIW Jon, I'm very familiar with the Rebel brand name, although not the Pennington seed company... I can't remember specific ads, but when I go to Lowe's or wherever I always gravitate to the Rebel brand over others because I "recognize the name"...

Rebel was an unrelated company for years, owned by the Budd Seed Group in Winston-Salem, NC. A few years back the two companies formed a joint marketing agreement (basically Penn. helped Budd with distribution & the two shared marketing expenses for the products) and that ultimately led to Penn. buying out Budd altogether. The decision was made not to re-brand Rebel, but instead to leave its identity pretty much just like it had always been & not try to make any connection between it & Pennington ... which obviously worked pretty well in your case ;)

The most recent ad, btw, was a spot called "When the Cat's Away". The storyline for the TV spot (and the radio was very similar) involved people using their neighbors lawn for a wedding ... while the unsuspecting neighbors were away from home. There's a little kid serving as lookout up in a tree, he yells "They're coming" and a mad scramble ensues as the wedding party tries to hide before the homeowners pull into their driveway. Voiceover and cutaway shot of the grass talks about the lush, green lawn being so beautiful that everyone enjoys it, etc. etc. Last shot is of the bride & groom hiding in the bushes trying to avoid detection.

[KevinNU7]

Except for Scott's, I'm not sure if I've ever seen a seed advertisement. I'm 33, live in suburban Chicago, and actually just planted some fescue too!
I jsut bought Scotts and can only remember Scotts commercials. In fact last week in the store I was choosing between Scotts, Ortho and a Home Depot brand of seed. I can't recall seeing any others on the shelf

[wade moore]

Rebel was an unrelated company for years, owned by the Budd Seed Group in Winston-Salem, NC. A few years back the two companies formed a joint marketing agreement (basically Penn. helped Budd with distribution & the two shared marketing expenses for the products) and that ultimately led to Penn. buying out Budd altogether. The decision was made not to re-brand Rebel, but instead to leave its identity pretty much just like it had always been & not try to make any connection between it & Pennington ... which obviously worked pretty well in your case ;)

The most recent ad, btw, was a spot called "When the Cat's Away". The storyline for the TV spot (and the radio was very similar) involved people using their neighbors lawn for a wedding ... while the unsuspecting neighbors were away from home. There's a little kid serving as lookout up in a tree, he yells "They're coming" and a mad scramble ensues as the wedding party tries to hide before the homeowners pull into their driveway. Voiceover and cutaway shot of the grass talks about the lush, green lawn being so beautiful that everyone enjoys it, etc. etc. Last shot is of the bride & groom hiding in the bushes trying to avoid detection.

Hmm, don't remember that one specifically ;)... but, I know I've seen/heard their commercials...


BTW .. forgot to say... good luck in future endeavors. Obviously you must be comfortable with the standing of your company after this, or you would have made some of the life decisions that you have recently.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Did you guys place ads on SportsTalk 980 in DC?

Yep, ran on WTEM several times for both brands in 03 & 04, as well as.
The Arrow, DC-101, WGMS, WMAL, WBIG, WJFK-AM, and WMZQ.

DC was always presented one of the hardest nuts to crack for us, because while it's actually a very good grass seed market (the surrounding suburbs are very into their lawns apparently) it's also an extremely expensive proposition. We called it a "budget-buster" because the cost of a 4-6 week flight there was the same as the cost of 4-6 weeks in a half dozen smaller markets that actually had a larger population when combined. Without a doubt, Washington was the market that went in & out & in & out of more campaigns more often than any other. I bought it, I think, 3 times total but actually planned campaigns there 8 or 9 times.

[Subby]

I guess because the area is so ridiculously affluent that the media buys are just going to be that much more expensive.

And yes, the suburbs are insane for their yards. Especially the new construction where hundreds of thousands of homes have one-sixth of an acre that needs to be Ireland green in the dead of summer.

[JonInMiddleGA]

BTW .. forgot to say... good luck in future endeavors. Obviously you must be comfortable with the standing of your company after this, or you would have made some of the life decisions that you have recently.

Thanks. I won't say it isn't making us (cue understatement) sort of nervous but we still some business on the books (albeit not nearly what we've had before) and there's more on the way so it really should be fine in the end. Basically, we expect that we're going to put a major dent in our savings before we have our revenue stream back up to normal but not so much so that we sink the ship or anything.

[wade moore]

I guess because the area is so ridiculously affluent that the media buys are just going to be that much more expensive.

And yes, the suburbs are insane for their yards. Especially the new construction where hundreds of thousands of homes have one-sixth of an acre that needs to be Ireland green in the dead of summer.

This is something that I REALLY realized when I bought my home here. At first I panicked and freaked out about how "crappy" my lawn was. I went out and got an aerotor, got my Rebel seed, went crazy... then finally realized that as long as it wasn't total mud, who cares about some weeds?! So, That's how I live now and how 99% of my neighborhood is.. then i go visit the future in-laws, see their lawn, see their neighbors' lawns (They live in Fairfax)... it's just insane... you could get out your irons and play through...

[cuervo72]

I've always thought of Gettysburg as a town to visit, not to work in ;)...

So did I, until I applied on a lark.

[sachmo71]

Congrats on booting the bad client! Sometimes, it feel great to cut ties. I remember when we chucked Schlotzy's when I was working tech support...I did a dance of happiness that day! Yes, it could affect the company, but I didn't have to deal with individual franchisees anymore!

[wade moore]

So did I, until I applied on a lark.

Do you actual work at the battle site?!

[SnDvls]

The most recent ad, btw, was a spot called "When the Cat's Away". The storyline for the TV spot (and the radio was very similar) involved people using their neighbors lawn for a wedding ... while the unsuspecting neighbors were away from home. There's a little kid serving as lookout up in a tree, he yells "They're coming" and a mad scramble ensues as the wedding party tries to hide before the homeowners pull into their driveway. Voiceover and cutaway shot of the grass talks about the lush, green lawn being so beautiful that everyone enjoys it, etc. etc. Last shot is of the bride & groom hiding in the bushes trying to avoid detection.

I saw this commercial just the other day on HGTV I believe here in Phoenix. Sorry couldn't tell you the name, but I know it was for grass. I'm out of your traget market anyhow so it's okay..right?