Kevin Smith vs. Joel Siegal [Archive] - Front Office Football Central

ISiddiqui

07-19-2006, 01:20 PM

This is Gold... apparently during a screening of "Clerks II", Joel Siegal got up after 40 minutes and walked out. But before walking out yelled out "This is the first movie I've walked out in Thirty Fucking Years" in the middle of the theater (well, so much for the silence your cell phone ads), and Smith rips him a new one:

http://silentbobspeaks.com/

The coup de grace is when Kevin Smith went on Opie and Anthony and they called up Gene Shalit, confronting him about his unprofessionalism:

http://www.viewaskew.com/kevin/joelsiegel.mp3

ThunderingHERD

07-19-2006, 01:24 PM

This is Gold... apparently during a screening of "Clerks II", Gene Shalit got up after 40 minutes and walked out. But before walking out yelled out "This is the first movie I've walked out in Thirty Fucking Years" in the middle of the theater (well, so much for the silence your cell phone ads), and Smith rips him a new one:

http://silentbobspeaks.com/

The coup de grace is when Kevin Smith went on Opie and Anthony and they called up Gene Shalit, confronting him about his unprofessionalism:

http://www.viewaskew.com/kevin/joelsiegel.mp3

This would probably be entertaining to me if Kevin Smith weren't an unfunny douchebag who makes terrible movies.

Oh, and apparently it was Joel Seigal, not Gene Shalit.

Subby

07-19-2006, 01:24 PM

Joel Siegel

this would be way funnier if it was Shalit :)

ISiddiqui

07-19-2006, 01:41 PM

Ooops... the mustache confused me :o

larrymcg421

07-19-2006, 01:44 PM

Gene Shalit is the doofus who made the idiotc comment about Brokeback Mountain.

Boith of them are terrible critics, but Siegel is probably worse.

Pyser

07-19-2006, 01:45 PM

ive gone to many critic screenings in ny, with joel there plenty of times.

what i dont think kevin smith grasps is everyone knows each other. i mean, think about it. there are only so many media critics, and so many screenings of each movie, so you get to know everyone pretty well.

in addition, some of these screenings are as small as 20 people, sitting on couches. nice couches, but thats not the point.

this is blown out of proportion. critics talk all the time during movies, pointing out mistakes and laughing at "in" jokes.

kevin smith should just accept his career is mercifully dwindling to a close.

JeeberD

07-19-2006, 01:45 PM

Gene Shalit is still alive?

Schmidty

07-19-2006, 02:39 PM

The interview was funny at first, but it went into beating a dead horse into a pulp really quick.

Mustang

07-19-2006, 02:50 PM

Movie critics are pretty much worthless for me and have no affect on what I want to see.

Honolulu_Blue

07-19-2006, 02:55 PM

I like "Clerks". I really like Mallrats. There are some very funny parts of "Chasing Amy" (though it falls apart eventually and must be somewhat condemed for the critical role it played in Ben Affleck's stardom). I liked "Dogma" well enough, though it had issues. I didn't like "Jay & Silent Bob", but there were some very funny scenes. I never saw "Jersey Girl" and have no interest in it. At all. I will likely see "Clerks II" and hope to enjoy it.

That said, I find Kevin Smith terribly annoying. On both commentary tracks and interviews he comes across like a self-obsessed, whiny little bitch. He's got a massive ego (for no real good reason) and simply cannot handle criticism of any kind while taking glee in dishing it out. He's really irritating.

He is ready to blame any of his film's failures on anyone and everything other than himself. "Dogma" bombed because Linda Fiorentino did a crappy job b/c she didn't like Kevin Smith. "Jersey Girl" bombed because of Affleck and J-Lo, etc, etc.

Schmidty

07-19-2006, 02:58 PM

Movie critics are pretty much worthless for me and have no affect on what I want to see.

I agree about this if you are only looking a single reviews, but if you look at a broad range of reviews, you can usually get a decent idea of the quality of the film. Of course, there are exceptions, but I think that the vast majority of the time looking at the average rating of a bunch of reviews gives a great sense of the quality of a film.

ISiddiqui

07-19-2006, 02:59 PM

Schmidty

07-19-2006, 03:00 PM

He's got a massive ego (for no real good reason) and simply cannot handle criticism of any kind while taking glee in dishing it out. He's really irritating.

To be fair, that describes a huge amount of normal people, including a majority of people on this messagebaord. ;)

Butter

07-19-2006, 03:01 PM

I think it's humorous that Kevin Smith is calling anybody out anywhere for unprofessionalism. Good one, Kev.

sachmo71

07-19-2006, 03:01 PM

Kevin Smith is being quite a bitch about this. This is not good schtick, Kevin. Think of something more clever, if you can.

Chas in Cinti

07-19-2006, 03:21 PM

I like and own all of Kevin Smith's movies. As a matter of fact, J&SBSB is on a semi-permanent rotation. Although I didn't like it until the 3rd or 4th screening. I loved Jersey Girl, and can easily say Chasing Amy is one of my all-time favorites. Of course, I don't try to be cool and talk crap about Affleck and Smith like most bandwagon jumpers... (present company excepted of course...)...

Just my 2 cents...

Chas

Franklinnoble

07-19-2006, 03:25 PM

Kevin Smith is the most overrated "artist" this side of Dave Matthews.

Crapshoot

07-19-2006, 03:35 PM

Somewhere, hating Smith became the equivalent of liking Smith in the late 90's.

dervack

07-19-2006, 03:36 PM

Somewhere, hating Smith became the equivalent of liking Smith in the late 90's.
I agree.

I'm really loking forward to seeing Clerks II. Hopefully tonight. Probably tomorrow night though.

Schmidty

07-19-2006, 03:39 PM

Somewhere, hating Smith became the equivalent of liking Smith in the late 90's.

It's because his fanbase back then hated the mainstream and the popular, and loved the underdog and the unknown. Now those same people have seen Smith become the two things they hate, which forces them to hate him. It's a compulsion the truly hip cannot overcome.

Franklinnoble

07-19-2006, 03:45 PM

Kevin Smith is the most overrated "artist" this side of Dave Matthews.

Somewhere, hating Smith became the equivalent of liking Smith in the late 90's.

The parallels are a little eerie here...

Honolulu_Blue

07-19-2006, 03:48 PM

Somewhere, hating Smith became the equivalent of liking Smith in the late 90's.

In the 90s, I had never heard Kevin Smith talk (outside of his handful of lines as Silent Bob). I liked his movies at the time. In fact, I still like those movies. I started "hating" Kevin Smith (the director, not his films) when I sat down and listened to the commentary track on "Dogma." This annoyance with the man continued to grow with each self-obssessed, whiny interview I heard the man give.

This isn't some trend I've decided to follow, it just happens to be based on actual evidence.

I still loves me some "Clerks" and "Mallrats", most of "Chasing Amy", some of "Dogma", and some of "Jay & Silent Bob".

I reckon that had I heard Kevin Smith give interviews back in the 90s, I wouldn't have liked him then either.

Fidatelo

07-19-2006, 03:54 PM

Clerks II will be glorious, just as the first one and Mallrats are. Then hopefully K-Smith will do another run on a comic book, his DD and Green Arrow runs were fantastic.

Mustang

07-19-2006, 03:57 PM

I agree about this if you are only looking a single reviews, but if you look at a broad range of reviews, you can usually get a decent idea of the quality of the film. Of course, there are exceptions, but I think that the vast majority of the time looking at the average rating of a bunch of reviews gives a great sense of the quality of a film.

I've usually made up my mind about movies that I want or don't want to see just based on the genre, actor or actress or director. Example... Kung Pow. I could have read 1,000 reviews and all would have lead me down the same path - That it was a vile piece of shit. I saw it because I knew it was the type of humor that was right up my alley and I found it funny. (No accounting for taste I know) That is why word of mouth usually doesn't work with me either.

Schmidty

07-19-2006, 04:09 PM

I've usually made up my mind about movies that I want or don't want to see just based on the genre, actor or actress or director. Example... Kung Pow. I could have read 1,000 reviews and all would have lead me down the same path - That it was a vile piece of shit. I saw it because I knew it was the type of humor that was right up my alley and I found it funny. (No accounting for taste I know) That is why word of mouth usually doesn't work with me either.

Like I said there are some exceptions to the rule. For example, I remember the concensus was that "The Skulls" was a pretty good movie, but after seeing it, it's still on my top 10 worst list.

Another way of using reviews, is to find a reviewer that generally shares the same tastes as you, although that might take too much time to make it worthwhile.

SirFozzie

07-19-2006, 04:10 PM

Both folks are at fault:

Is Clerks 2 a piece of shit movie? Very Likely.

Is Kevin Smith thin-skinned? Uh huh.

Is it proper for a "respected" movie critic to stand up in the middle of the movie, announce to everyone present that he hasn't left a movie theater in thirty years, then make a scene on his way out? Oh HEYYYULL NO.

ageofquarrel

07-19-2006, 04:29 PM

sounds like Smith is just building hype to me.

Mustang

07-19-2006, 04:40 PM

Another way of using reviews, is to find a reviewer that generally shares the same tastes as you, although that might take too much time to make it worthwhile.

If you find a reviewer that liked Kung Pow and didn't mind 'Dude, Where's My Car'.. send him my way. :D

ISiddiqui

07-19-2006, 04:46 PM

I've usually made up my mind about movies that I want or don't want to see just based on the genre, actor or actress or director. Example... Kung Pow. I could have read 1,000 reviews and all would have lead me down the same path - That it was a vile piece of shit. I saw it because I knew it was the type of humor that was right up my alley and I found it funny. (No accounting for taste I know) That is why word of mouth usually doesn't work with me either.

Admit it, you found it funny BECAUSE it was a vile piece of shit ;). I enjoyed it as well, many because of that.

I remember the concensus was that "The Skulls" was a pretty good movie

Hmmm...

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/skulls/

Yes, that's 7%.

ISiddiqui

07-19-2006, 04:49 PM

If you find a reviewer that liked Kung Pow and didn't mind 'Dude, Where's My Car'.. send him my way. :D

According a perusal of RottenTomatoes... JoBlo. Who? This guy:

http://www.joblo.com/reviews.php?mode=joblo_movies&id=160

http://www.joblo.com/reviews.php?mode=joblo_movies&id=784

I'd imagine a 6/10 is good enough for "liked"?

JeffR

07-19-2006, 04:52 PM

sounds like Smith is just building hype to me.

Yup. He hasn't had an opportunity like this since the Catholic League called for a boycott of Dogma.

rexallllsc

07-19-2006, 04:58 PM

Ok. Clerks? Love it. Mallrats? Good. Dogma? Good.

In a day in age where Hollywood has nearly perfected the art of the trailer, Clerks II looks HORRIBLE.

Kevin Smith got lucky, or lost his touch. One or the other. Either way, it's gone.

Schmidty

07-19-2006, 05:00 PM

Admit it, you found it funny BECAUSE it was a vile piece of shit ;). I enjoyed it as well, many because of that.

Hmmm...

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/skulls/

Yes, that's 7%.

Well, it was a long time ago, and I didn't know of rottentomatoes.com, so the reviews I read were probably local, and word-of-mouth.

At least my taste in movies was vindicated a little. :)

ISiddiqui

07-19-2006, 05:26 PM

Uh oh... I shouldn't encourage you ;)

Easy Mac

07-19-2006, 06:59 PM

Weird, my girlfriend and i just finished watching clerks. she wanted to see it before i dragged her to clerks 2. her words (paraphrase):

so what was so good about the movie?

sabotai

07-19-2006, 07:00 PM

Weird, my girlfriend and i just finished watching clerks. she wanted to see it before i dragged her to clerks 2. her words (paraphrase):

so what was so good about the movie?

Kill her.

Easy Mac

07-19-2006, 07:03 PM

well, she liked jay and silent bob, so i'll give her a pass. of course, she didn't like swingers and office space either... nor does she like the office... what am i doing?

sabotai

07-19-2006, 07:04 PM

well, she liked jay and silent bob, so i'll give her a pass. of course, she didn't like swingers and office space either... nor does she like the office... what am i doing?

Just out of curiosity, what exactly does she find funny?

Franklinnoble

07-19-2006, 07:07 PM

well, she liked jay and silent bob, so i'll give her a pass. of course, she didn't like swingers and office space either... nor does she like the office... what am i doing?

So, uhh, what do you like about her again?

sabotai

07-19-2006, 07:10 PM

In the interest of full disclosure, I went out with someone who thought Golden Girls was the funniest show ever, and she watched Lifetime movies constantly.....so I am in no position to judge. :)

Easy Mac

07-19-2006, 07:12 PM

Just out of curiosity, what exactly does she find funny?

She liked failure to launch...

Easy Mac

07-19-2006, 07:13 PM

So, uhh, what do you like about her again?

the sex... :p
but seriously, we're both braves fans... that's all you really need in this world.

cthomer5000

07-19-2006, 07:16 PM

In the interest of full disclosure, I went out with someone who thought Golden Girls was the funniest show ever, and she watched Lifetime movies constantly.....so I am in no position to judge. :)

After glancing over at your location, I'm seriously wondering if we dated the same girl.

:confused:

BrianD

07-19-2006, 07:20 PM

well, she liked jay and silent bob, so i'll give her a pass. of course, she didn't like swingers and office space either... nor does she like the office... what am i doing?

Sounds like you've found someone with taste...except for not liking Office Space. She may need to spend a little more time in Corporate America to get it.

sabotai

07-19-2006, 07:31 PM

After glancing over at your location, I'm seriously wondering if we dated the same girl.

:confused:

I doubt it. We went out for quite a long time and I (had the misfortune of having have) met all her ex's. Unless she cheated on me with you, in which case I'LL KILL YOU!!!

cthomer5000

07-19-2006, 07:32 PM

I doubt it. We went out for quite a long time and I (had the misfortune of having have) met all her ex's. Unless she cheated on me with you, in which case I'LL KILL YOU!!!

Hey, you never know. This girl also displayed an unusually large interest in the interstate highway system (not nearly as exciting as it seems).

Butter

07-20-2006, 07:56 AM

sachmo71

07-20-2006, 08:42 AM

I like how people are insisting that people just dislike Kevin Smith because it's the cool thing to do now, instead of there being actual legitimate reasons to dislike him... like the fact that maybe at the beginning I enjoyed his style and storytelling angle... but now, after this SIXTH movie in the series with the same characters popping up, that maybe I'm realizing that Smith just isn't actually all that talented, and that he just likes keeping his name in the spotlight and acting all hurt when he gets even the slightest shred of criticism.

I think he has talent. He tells a great story, and is a passing director. I might like him more because he used to seem like a regular guy and he likes comic books. I thought Jersey Girl was pretty bad, but I blame most of that of Afleck because he's a bad actor. I thought Jay and Silent Bob was fun, and I still like Chasing Amy, Mallrats, Dogma, and love Clerks.

I feel like the bottom line here is that Kevin could have used this to his advantage. A witty qwip or two, or a fake tirade would have sufficed. Listening to the Opie and Andrew show or whatever it was, if he was trying to fake it, he failed. He came across sounding like a whiny twat. And his blog...just a bitchfest. He comes across as genuinely angry about this one situation. In my mind, that's a bad thing for him.

And eventually, I'm still going to see the damn movie.

Also...Kung Pow is NOT a vile piece of crap. It is genius.

Pyser

07-20-2006, 11:47 AM

I thought Jersey Girl was pretty bad, but I blame most of that of Afleck because he's a bad actor. I thought Jay and Silent Bob was fun, and I still like Chasing Amy, Mallrats, Dogma, and love Clerks.

i dont get it. affleck was in almost all of those, and starred in one that you liked....yet jersey girl was his fault for bad acting?

Honolulu_Blue

07-20-2006, 11:54 AM

i dont get it. affleck was in almost all of those, and starred in one that you liked....yet jersey girl was his fault for bad acting?

Well, Affleck was great as the asshole from "Fashionable Male." That was a role he was born to play. His suckitude as a lead actor in "Chasing Amy" was off-set by the greatness of Jason Lee. Jason Lee was the "spoonful or sugar" to Affleck's medicine, if you will.

There was no such force at work in "Jersey Girl." Affleck is like a black hole of screen presence. He has none at all and is painful to watch in leading roles. He's fine as the asshole from "Fashionable Male" or as the jerky Irish gumbah guy in "Good Will Hunting". It's when he's that romantic lead guy (or worse yet, the action lead guy) that his lack of presence and skill come to to forefront.

Oh yeah, and I forgot, he was the bomb in Phantoms, yo.

rkmsuf

07-20-2006, 11:57 AM

Well, Affleck was great as the asshole from "Fashionable Male." That was a role he was born to play. His suckitude as a lead actor in "Chasing Amy" was off-set by the greatness of Jason Lee. Jason Lee was the "spoonful or sugar" to Affleck's medicine, if you will.

There was no such force at work in "Jersey Girl." Affleck is like a black hole of screen presence. He has none at all and is painful to watch in leading roles. He's fine as the asshole from "Fashionable Male" or as the jerky Irish gumbah guy in "Good Will Hunting". It's when he's that romantic lead guy (or worse yet, the action lead guy) that his lack of presence and skill come to to forefront.

Oh yeah, and I forgot, he was the bomb in Phantoms, yo.

He was fantastic in Boiler Room.

Honolulu_Blue

07-20-2006, 11:59 AM

He was fantastic in Boiler Room.

That role too fits his range nicely. He places an asshole in a nice, short and sweet scene. That's really where he excels.

rexallllsc

07-20-2006, 12:05 PM

He was fantastic in Boiler Room.

Great Alec Baldwin ripoff ;)

sachmo71

07-20-2006, 12:51 PM

i dont get it. affleck was in almost all of those, and starred in one that you liked....yet jersey girl was his fault for bad acting?

because in Jersey Girl, the rest of the cast didn't save his ass. And that wasn't the only reason Jersey Girl sucked; it was the first to jump out at me. Smith's cinematography in Jersey Girl was annoying at best.

sachmo71

07-20-2006, 12:52 PM

Hammer755

07-20-2006, 01:02 PM

I'm not a fan of any of his movies, but if you don't find An Evening with Kevin Smith entertaining, then you have no soul.

M GO BLUE!!!

07-20-2006, 07:10 PM

I'm not a fan of any of his movies, but if you don't find An Evening with Kevin Smith entertaining, then you have no soul.
I agree... somewhat.

I only saw half of the original Clerks, but liked what I saw. Everything else I have seen of his was pretty much a waste of my time until I saw one scene from the Evening... DVD.

The half hour of him talking about Prince is hilarious! It is essentailly confirmation of every rumor about Prince that you have ever heard, plus more fun! The only parts I didn't like were his extremely unfunny side comments like "He didn't play Batdance once." I tried to watch more of the set, but was bored out of my skull...

dervack

07-20-2006, 08:08 PM

Man, Affleck was the bomb in phantoms, yo.

Crapshoot

07-20-2006, 09:45 PM

Man, Affleck was the bomb in phantoms, yo.

Brilliant.

Not as good as Morris Day and the motherfucking Time, but still. :D

Honolulu_Blue

07-20-2006, 11:29 PM

Oh yeah, and I forgot, he was the bomb in Phantoms, yo.

Man, Affleck was the bomb in phantoms, yo.

Nobody listens...

ISiddiqui

07-20-2006, 11:33 PM

... to YOU, to you ;).

dervack

07-21-2006, 02:43 AM

Nobody listens...
This user is on your ignore list, if you'd like to read this post click here :D

Anyway, just got back from seeing it and I liked it. If you don't like Kevin Smith movies, don't bother, because you'll hate it.

Honolulu_Blue

07-21-2006, 05:10 AM

This user is on your ignore list, if you'd like to read this post click here :D

Anyway, just got back from seeing it and I liked it. If you don't like Kevin Smith movies, don't bother, because you'll hate it.

Heh!

I'm looking forward to it. I hope he can re-kindle the magic from his earlier movies.

In any event, given that my wife grew up in Jersey (Edison/Metuchen) we are sort of obligated to see his films. The outside shots of the mall in Mallrats was walking distance from the house she grew up in and she actually worked in the "dirt mall" when she was 12.

sabotai

07-21-2006, 02:06 PM

In any event, given that my wife grew up in Jersey (Edison/Metuchen) we are sort of obligated to see his films. The outside shots of the mall in Mallrats was walking distance from the house she grew up in and she actually worked in the "dirt mall" when she was 12.

The mall they they shot at was actually in Minnesota (Eden Prairie Center). They mention Menlo Park Mall in the movie, which is in Edison.

But US 1 (the dirt mall) is near Edison, too. Well, was. There's a Lowe's Megaplex there now.